darktable ep 058 - The Tone Equalizer module

One thing I forgot to mention in my video, regarding the interactive cursor : - scrolling on the picture will affect exposure corrections by ± 0.25 EV increments (medium-tuning), - scrolling while holding Shift will increment by ± 1.0 EV (coarse-tuning), - scrolling while holding Ctrl will increment by ± 0.1 EV (fine-tuning)

[@audio2u]

I'm fairly certain I mentioned that in my video. I know I mentioned it in ONE of the takes I recorded! 😃 Just not sure if that bit made it into the released version of the video.

[@alphabeta448]

Sorry for being so direct, but all the effort you have put into this module makes no sense to me... instead of making the software overall more user-friendly (which is currently a missing value in darktable) you are working to make it even harder and more complex. It took 25 minutes to Bruce to explain all the prerequisites someone has to know before actually using the main sliders! The most successful pieces of software allow you to just hover the mouse over an item in a list to temporarily apply a preset to your image, and immediately see what is going to be the overall effect, without having to know anything about color science or mask quantization. Darktable, as well as many other free softwares, suffers already for being too much developer-centric. These new kind of features make the situation even worse. I was planning to (freely) give a course about darktable to aspiring photographers but if this is the direction the development is going to take I will give up. Why would they choose darktable if they can simply get a cracked version of lightroom and have a much easier life? The shadows and highlights module alone is already almost too complex for a beginner if you don't tell him to leave default all what he does not understand. Why isn't darktable hiding all those extra sliders behind an "advanced options" panel? You guys are doing an excellent job at maintaining darktable but you really need to take into consideration common users, not just improving the software for yourselves. Get in touch with some designers,... we all really need it.

[@audio2u]

I guess it's the age-old thing of "you can't please all the people, all of the time". I'm neither defending, nor condemning, the approach taken with the development of darktable. At the risk of being accused of putting words in Aurelien's mouth, I would say that the approach HE is trying to take is to make a product which is not just dumbed-down for the masses, but something which has the potential for accurate colour-management etc, for those who WANT to dig deep into the science of image manipulation. Something I didn't realise until someone mentioned it here yesterday, is that you can create presets out of visible/hidden modules. I haven't explored it on my machine yet, but if that does actually exist, maybe that's the way forward for you? As in, hide the modules which are overly technical, and just show the modules you are comfortable with? Dunno, just a thought. At the end of the day, my vote IS for software which allows me to dig deep if I choose to. When I first discovered dt, my initial reaction was "wow, there's a lot to learn here", but that very quickly morphed into "gee, LR really is dumbed-down, isn't it?":)

@@alphabeta448 When I was sent to the music conservatory, I knew that I had 12 years of teaching to go through (piano, choir and solfeggio) before becoming a musician. So I shut the fuck up, bit the bullet and attended classes. I don't get why photographers expect software to work magically for them with no background. Photography is goddam difficult, if your software is simple, it means something got lost between actual image operations and the graphical interface. darktable is not developer-oriented, it is photographer-oriented. And by photographer, I don't mean lazy button pushers expecting the soft to think for them. darktable allows you to control the pixels. The core of my work is to allow better control, with differentiated colour and luminance adjustments that behave robustly no matter the picture (HDR or SDR) you feed it. Just because it takes 25 min to explain doesn't mean it's inefficient to use. I mean, it probably took you a year to learn how to walk on 2 feets, and I hope you don't have to think about it anymore while crossing a street. Hoping to get a grasp at photography without some colour science is just asking for an iPhone to do AI for you. Stick to iPhones if this UX is what you think photography should be. But I will never let a software do my pictures while kicking me out of the proces s. Photography IS difficult, photo software should embrace that difficulty and give you tools to manage it, not hide it to please the crowd. Adobe is already covering that market. Also, the tone equalizer is only the first design iteration resulting from a full research and development process. There is nothing else like that, it's new (and peple seem quite happy with the interactive cursor, I wonder what Adobe has for you on that regard). Even "getting in touch with some designers" won't ever make the first try the best. My approach is to make things right first, then make the right thing easier later. But beginning with easiness, then trying to pile up patches and fixes to make it right is the way to screw your entire soft. Maybe some things will be automated in the masking options in the future, we will see. But first, I need to test a lot more, and that won't happen overnight. Meanwhile, you get access to all the parameters. Sorry not sorry.

[@toewsrus]

@@alphabeta448 I recently started using Darktable, as a mater of fact, I'm a beginner photographer too. I've found there are numerous modules to work with, easy ones that beginners can easily manipulate and gain experience on. And then there's these advanced ones that allow advanced users to masterfully manipulate their art. There's a lot of people out there with a lot of different requirements, that's why there's a lot of different modules. We're not static beings, we learn new things, grow into new areas, and strive to make ourselves better. Learn and use the ones you need, teach the ones that your viewers can understand, then teach them them to grow into the next module.

[@mickr007]

Hats off to you on this one Bruce, a massively helpful video on a module that was creating a mask in my brain! I'd started watching Auréliens' video but decided I'd have to commit a couple of hours of intense focused concentration on it, and I think it will probably be easier to follow now having watched yours first. On a more general note I really like the way DT is going, and all credit to Aurélien for his approach on this. Yes it's complex, but it gives the user so much power and control when many other applications are taking the more contemporary route of one click simplicity at the cost of flexibility. Plus he's putting the thinking behind it out there for anyone who's interested in the concepts and execution. DT is a learning curve, but no pain = no gain, and it's a great tool for those who choose to use it.

[@audio2u]

Exactly! I'm a bit of a nerd, and I suspect, a huge percentage of the dt user base would identify similarly. I don't like dumbed-down software. Give me all the control, and I'll take responsibility for the outcome.

[@nigvs310]

"Give me all the control, and I'll take responsibility for the outcome."@@audio2u damn think I will tattoo that!

[@bigb2602]

Thank you Bruce, again a very educational video. Every time I don't know what to do in Darktable, I look for the corresponding video of you. That helps a lot better than all the things you can find.

[@audio2u]

Thanks! 😃

[@bernym4047]

Thank you!. This module has been driving me to the funny farm. I've seen several videos of it being used by experts and been mightily impressed by the very fast and effective results. However, none of them gave much help in understanding such as the mask contrast and exposure adjustments. I was not aware that it is still a little buggy and assumed when it leaped off a cliff to one side that it was the driver's fault and not the bloody jalopy. I found right-click and type seems a better way to make adjustments to this. I also discovered that an initial, more careful setting of the exposure, paying attention to shadow and highlight clipping using the indicator gives a more representative mask and makes the values stay closer to the zero datum line especially the white and black points. I think the word valiant is not too strong a word to describe your superb work on the production of this very technical video. Thank you very much. Some of the comments I have seen are critical of the complexity of the dt modules and claim they are off putting for beginners. My response is that modern digital cameras are massively more complex than a few years ago and give a bewildering number of user settings and options, especially in the jpeg menus. Like cameras, dt can be reduced to a few simple to use modules and give acceptable results but those photographers who aspire to excellence will appreciate the efforts of the developers even if (like myself for example) they are still learning to understand them fully.

[@audio2u]

Yep, it takes a bit of getting used to, this one! 😃 Glad you found the video helpful.

[@bbawt1]

Excellent video Bruce. Your videos and Aurélien's videos compliment each other very well. Yes, the new modules in darktable may seem complex at first, but with a bit of perseverance it becomes quite easy and quite fast, and the results are great. Thanks for your efforts putting together your darktable video series - great work!

[@audio2u]

Thanks Brian!

[@julianessam6243]

Greetings from the UK. Well done Bruce for working through that module, I played with it as you were talking and it all made sense...... at the end ! The cursor scrolling is brilliant.

[@audio2u]

Thanks!

[@archiebrown692003]

Thank You for your patience in making this tutorial, I learnt so much about this module, that before had me completely baffled. Your tutorials are so easy to understand and follow, mostly because you use everyday language which the layman, like me, can understand.

[@audio2u]

Thanks Archie! Glad it was helpful!

[@AntonioPiazza_NTN]

Thank you Bruce. Fantastic video. Thank you Aurélien: great piece of software.

[@audio2u]

No dramas! 😃

[@stephanbol]

Fantastic video - thumbs up.... I had a rough idea of what I was doing with this beast - results were good but now they are even better..... thanks again

[@audio2u]

Glad I could be of assistance!

[@alwinvrm5801]

Darktable doesn't cease to impress; what a great module and good, to the point explanation, thanks!

[@audio2u]

Glad you liked it!

[@charleshacker765]

Bruce, you are so awesome! What an important niche you fill! You are the link between us and the Darktable gods! You are their prophet! Without this it would just be some obscure tool that us commoners would not understand! We would know it's there for a purpose, but would have no idea about it. Thank you so much!

[@audio2u]

Haha, don't know about prophet, but thank you for the kind words! 😃

[@climentclerch]

I had a special interest in this module, and I have to say that is was been the best video I have ever seen about it. Thank you!

[@audio2u]

No dramas! 😃

[@olivierparlephoto]

Hi Bruce, Thanks you for this presentation ! I can assure you that the 8th times you recorded it was worth ! I understand how this module work thanks to you. Tbh, I figured out how the mask works ! But I agree it needs some twisted neurons to fully understand it :) In short I understand the graphe represents more or less a parametric mask, but with some unknown parameters (like luminance for example). And to make it in practice, I did a video where one edit uses what you showed, and it works as intended.

[@audio2u]

Glad someone made sense of my ramblings! 😃

[@folmonty]

Hello Bruce - glad I viewed Aurelien's video first. This module is amazing! Thanks for taking so much time and effort to explain it in laymen terms. Aurelien is over and beyond my pay grade but always gain insight into the how and why. Loved the comparison used in the dark room (dodging and burning) to illustrate. You've done a masterful job of helping me get an understanding of how to apply this module. darktable is quite an amazing bit of software! Thank You for the tutorial!

[@audio2u]

No dramas!

[@spidrespidre]

Hi Bruce. You might remember I had the problem of buying an EOS M50, which generates .cr3 files that (I think is still the case) darktable can't open. The only choices open to me if I am to work with raw were Canon DPP4 (on Windows) or paying for something that begins with the letter A. It's taken a while to build it but now I have a new desktop PC that will sport Linux Mint (on a 3rd hard drive) when I've moved the oversized graphics card to somewhere sensible but it's mostly back to Windows and DPP4. It's a really good piece of software. Much more powerful than I thought. I'll be sticking with that until darktable catches up. Oh, and it's nice to be able to update the M50 firmware too

[@audio2u]

Fair enough. Ya gotta do what ya gotta do! 😃

[@mickehog76]

Canon m50 is a very good camera :). If you want you can download the free tool dng converter from Adobe(yes I know what you are thinking ;).). It works in Linux with wine. It can convert cr3 to dng. And then open dng files in darktable. It works very well and quickly. You can use that until darktable can open cr3.

[@malteplath]

Thank you very much, Bruce! I recently dabbled with the tone equalizer, but this has opened my eyes to how to use it properly. Excellent teaching! (As always 🙂)

[@audio2u]

Glad it was helpful!

[@jorgglande8290]

Best best best videos about DT I've ever seen (and I've seen a lot :) Thanks for that Bruce!!!

[@audio2u]

No problem! 😃

[@davedrake7253]

A great explanation Bruce on a very powerful - and complicated module. I kept looking at it and backing away. Many thanks - it's starting to sink in a little. Well done.

[@ma3xiu1]

Don’t back away! :-) At the very simplest level, you can just leave the mask tab at default and just use the mousse wheel on the image to tweak the highlights and shadows. As you get more confidence, you can start experimenting with the mask to get a more nuanced result. Note that if you do want to play with the mask, you should do it first before starting to adjust the equaliser settings.

[@audio2u]

No worries, Dave!

[@kenphused]

Well done Bruce! Thank you for all your hard work and the effort you put into this series. You've accelerated my image editing abilities by months. I recommend Darktable and your channel to anyone who asks about photo editing software. - Ken

[@audio2u]

Thanks Ken!

[@DerMartin01]

Huge Shoutout to you Bruce. Although I also watched through Auréliens' videos, your qay of getting things nailed down really helped a lot to get further understanding on how to work with the module. Keep up the great work of education. Thank you very much!

[@audio2u]

No dramas! :)

[@anupamdash1102]

Aurelien did a fantastic mini-series on the technicalities of the Tone Equalizer. Any folks who have that knack for geeking out on the specs of this module should surely check that out. Definitely ingenious to combine the works of the Zone System, Exposure AND the Shadows/Higlights into one set of tabs. Bruce, I wonder why you did not refer to the masking feature of this equalizer with the chracteristics of the Zone System module. It does pretty much the same thing too, doesn't it? Anyways and as always, explanation well done!

[@audio2u]

If I didn't cover something, it's because I didn't understand it. I try not to "make it up as I go along" as some youtubers are prone to do (not pointing fingers at anyone in particular!)... And if I do present information that I'm not 100% sure about, I tend to make that clear at the time. 😃

[@JulesMoyaert_photo]

I don't pretend I will use it properly just after having watched your video only once but I understand the power of this module. Thanks again!

[@audio2u]

Fair enough!

[@JulesMoyaert_photo]

@@audio2u My comment does not reflect on the quality of your video. It's just a lack of total assimilation of all the concepts at once. 😊

[@JulesMoyaert_photo]

@@audio2u -: My comment does not reflect on the quality of your tutorial. Just my lack of total assimilation of all the concepts at once. 😊

[@MrsJaydot]

Thank you much for persevering and making this explanation. I'm really making an effort to get my head around the new workflow, but goodness! it's complicated :).

[@audio2u]

Isn't it? 😃 Glad my videos are helping.

[@enjoycast]

Bruce, this is really awesome video! Many, many thanks for spending your time for creating this great explanation !

[@audio2u]

Glad you enjoyed it! :)

[@nickgrunseit3684]

Tricky module. Thank you very much for the explanation as always. Very helpful

[@audio2u]

Cheers!

[@nicolasmareau4008]

Thanks for your help to understand how to use this new module of DT3.0 ! it's very clear ! And thanks for your patience to record this video, it seems it was painful... ;-) I really appreciate your videos, i like your "user" and pragmatic point of view. Greetings from France

[@audio2u]

Thanks Nicholas!

[@bruhitsme2601]

The people who wrote these modules, amazing. Sounds like it adjusts luminosity.

[@audio2u]

Yes, that is the idea. Finer control over luminosity.

[@NilsNormann]

Good job getting to the bottom of this module. I can see it being useful in some circumstances. I wonder if stretching the mask across the nodes could be automated with the click of a button. That would make the module much easier to use.

[@audio2u]

True! Maybe that'll be in the next version.

you have colour pickers around the mask contrast/exposure compensation sliders, they center and rescale automatically the mask histogram for you.

[@emrg777]

@ I was going to mention that Aurelien....does it matter what order you do them in I was trying to sort that out as they seem to jump back to zero if you click them a second time but then you can do them in a different order and there is a bit of jumping around with the mask I just wondered if you would recommend exposure first then contrast...additionally I had good success with your formula that you presented in your video to use exposure module first to globally make midtones as you want then filmic at 18.45 gray with white and black points adjusted and then correcting the tone equalizer for the exposure setting applied in the exposure module and then re visiting filmic...that seems like a nice consistent workflow and it give nice results

[@rebelwriteruk]

Thanks Bruce watched Aureliens' Video a few days ago was struggling to get my head around it first time, thought to myself adobe never made editing this easy lol. Watched your tutorial and things began to click into place. So took the bull by the horns and went for it with an image of mine that was badly exposed, at the 4th attempt managed to produce a reasonably exposed image using just three modules, Fimic, Tone equaliser, and Contrast equalizer. Noticed in the masking tab of the tone equalizer 2 eye droppers next to exposure and contrast sliders clicked on them and mask histogram widened automatically and the sliders could now be used to fine tune it further, (think Aurelien mentioned this earlier in the comments). But thanks to Aurelien for the module, and yourself for your explanation, Ive got a good grip of things. Btw with a reference to earlier comments, I always export my edits as tiffs then denoise and and sharpen on the re-imported tiffs, because my laptop would probably implode under the stress of trying to do it all in one hit. Thanks again for all your efforts, I really appreciate them.

[@audio2u]

Re: exporting tiffs and re-importing. This is not the first time I've heard of this... I think it was one of the other guys doing videos (Harry Durgin perhaps?) did that as well, and I sat there going "What tha?". If it's a horsepower issue, that's fair enough, I guess.

[@audio2u]

Ian, yeah, I absolutely understand that concept, about working with higher bitrates to retain as much info as possible. I just don't get why you'd export, then import the TIFF, and keep working on it. Why not just do everything you want to do in one session (read: xmp file)? Unless of course it's a case of an underpowered machine just getting bogged down with too many edits. That would be the only reason I could see for following this workflow.

[@rebelwriteruk]

@@audio2u Youve hit the nail on the head there Bruce, because I edit on a laptop which is a bit underpowered for the task, i needed a workflow that would allow me to edit efficiently, without experiencing the lagginess of certain modules and slow to respond sliders as the history stack builds up. My workaround consists of doing global edits to my raws, crop, perspective, contrast, exposure, white balance, colour etc,etc, then export to 16bit tiff, re-import, then do any local adjustments, denoise, sharpen, etc. That way I suffer far less from processing power performance. I then copy the history stack from the tiff and append the history stack of the original raw file and check usually all is no different from the tiff. I can then delete the tiff and keep the raw and updated xmp. It may seem a little convoluted but sometimes you have to work with what you have. to be fair I probably exaggerated a little in my original post, I only use this method if I'm heavily editing an image, not all images need extensive editing as i'm sure you'll agree. I've even exported to a tiff a couple of times on one edit using the method above and the image looks fine on our lounge wall. It may not be everyone's cup of tea, but it works for me if I start to run out of processing power. Btw Bruce keep up the great work I'm sure I speak for a lot of people who appreciate your efforts.

[@audio2u]

Ian, everything you said was spot on, except the bit about choosing a jpeg to edit. If you have the raw file, you edit from that. A jpeg is an 8 bit file, which means it only has 256 shades of grey between pure black and pure white. Exporting the jpeg to a tiff does nothing expect give you a bloated file size with the same limited information.

[@drgaubi]

Super great video to a super great module! Thanks very much

[@audio2u]

No worries!

[@Flingwing24]

Cheers Bruce (and Aurelien) for that one. What an amazing concept. I cleared a few grey areas watching it the second time round so I will have another bash in the morning. Be good (or don't get caught) CBA UK

[@audio2u]

Cheers!

[@Flingwing24]

It's interesting how the mask interacts with the image, particularly the contrast. I had an image with a lot of grass in it which clearly had tiny shadows. Raised the tone in one area and the grass looked terrible, almost liberated. Turns out the mask looked really sharp. Made some changes and sorted. Very useful. It may come in really handy for ground/air to air shots where you may not quite get the compensation right.

[@dennispeterson1434]

Thank you so much for all of your hard work. Lucky 7 was totally worth it!

[@audio2u]

Thanks Dennis!

[@englander55]

VERY helpful lecture, Bruce, thank you so much! Good job!

[@audio2u]

Thanks! 😃

[@qwertyasdf66]

36:50 I've been having that since I started using it. I'm currently on 3.8.0. Are there any known tricks to making it work properly on windows? Every time I do a search for the problem I draw blanks so I got the impression nobody else has the issue.

[@audio2u]

To be honest, I have no idea, because I never use the tone equalizer module! I find it far less intuitive than a tone curve. But the tone curve module is display-referred, so we are advised to avoid that as much as possible. Sorry, not very helpful, I realise.

[@qwertyasdf66]

@@audio2u Sorry, I was referring to the issue of the UI taking seconds to respond to anything/everything.

[@audio2u]

Right. So, this is still an issue for you?

[@qwertyasdf66]

Yes. Maybe there's existing info about it that is just hidden from google or my search terms weren't specific enough. (It's hard to elaborate on "darktable slow ui" lol).

[@audio2u]

I recommend that you jump on either a) darktable unofficial group on facebook, b) discuss.pixls.us or c) darktable group on telegram and ask if anyone else has any input.

[@BillWohler]

What an ordeal. I'm glad you were finally able to push through. I'd presume that the darktable team will work out your laggy performance before the final release of the next version. You piqued my interest. Explaining how filmic RGB and the tone equalizer modules work together sounds like a good topic for a future video. Thanks, as always!

[@audio2u]

No worries, Bill!

[@petera1033]

Fantastic job distilling A's video which I watched this morning - I dont even have a copy of the program yet - but you two have convinced me that this is the way to go forward after decades of Adobe and Capture One. Can't tell you how much I appreciate your translation services -:) I'll buy you a beer anytime you are in Sydney. Pete

[@audio2u]

Mate, I WORK in Sydney every day!! 😃 Glad you're finding the videos helpful.

[@petera1033]

@@audio2u :) Give me a few weeks to tool up on the programme and I'll be glad to shout you a beer/coffee /lunch as a thank you. Pete

[@audio2u]

Any time (workload permitting, of course).

[@VieuxBat]

A good complementary explanation to Aurelien Pierre's explanation of his module.

[@audio2u]

Cheers!

[@im_nithe]

Amazing explanation, thank you very much!

[@audio2u]

Cheers!

[@stephanbol]

One other thing: in your video you mentioned you might get into more details on filmic + tone equalizer.... this would be reaaaalllyyyy appreciated. Thx again for the great video.

[@Bizon-q2u]

Hi, I see that you are using a logarithmic histogram. I noticed that linear is very different from logarithmic. Which graph shows the correct exposure? Which one should I use when I'm working on masks in tonal corrector?

[@audio2u]

Both views show correct exposure! It's simply a case of which view makes more sense to you. My suggestion would be that if you are aiming for really nuanced contrast in the shadow regions of an image, switch to logarithmic view, but for general use, the linear view is probably more useful. But each to their own.

[@marciomendonca2423]

Great! Thank you so much!

[@audio2u]

No problem!

[@gustavojmata]

Superb video!

[@audio2u]

Thanks!

[@ma3xiu1]

Very nice treatment - I liked the way you tried to relate it back to something people are already familiar with (ie. parametric masks). Not sure if you were using this together with filmic in this video? You ended up with a very saturated sky, and I think the filmic module would have helped to rein that in a bit.

[@audio2u]

No, I didn't have filmic rgb active. Probably should have, but didn't want to complicate the video. It caused me enough grief as it was! 😃

[@ma3xiu1]

Bruce Williams Photography yeah, you’re probably right :-) Could be a topic for a future video how to bring these new modules together, something like the “dummies” series in the pixels.us forum,

[@leona_devon]

OMG mind blown! I'm going to have to watch this several times! Oh on the A7 Mk3 shutdown issues, there is a custom firmware patch to fix that, my friend has one and has done this.

[@audio2u]

I haven't noticed any shutdown issues on mine, but I am fairly certain I already have the latest firmware. I remember updating it, and haven't heard of any other firmware updates since, so I'm guessing I'm current!

[@Bizon-q2u]

In the latest version, the default filter is EIGF. Should it be used instead of a guide filter?

[@audio2u]

Sadly, on a mobile device, KZbin doesn't tell me which video you are commenting on. What was the video talking about?

[@Bizon-q2u]

@@audio2u The tone equalizer module

[@audio2u]

Right. Thanks. I guess if EIGF is the default now, then that is the preferred algorithm as far as the devs are concerned. To be honest, the tone equalizer is not a module I often use.

[@Bizon-q2u]

@@audio2u Thank you for your reply. A tonal equalizer replaces the tone curve and I always use a tonal equalizer because without it the photo lacks dynamic range. If you don't use a tonal equalizer often, what do you replace it with?

[@audio2u]

A combination of filmic RGB and the contrast slider in the colour calibration module.

[@fotografie-joerglang]

hats off for this great video. a lot of stuff. Thank you for the time you give us. Greetings from Germany.

[@audio2u]

Cheers!

[@abhishes]

Hi Bruce, I follow this tutorial on a MacBook Pro and I don't have a mouse I just use a trackpad. what is the equivalent of the scrolling of mouse?

[@audio2u]

On a Windows or Linux laptop, it would be a two-finger swipe. Hopefully, it's the same on a Mac.

[@abhishes]

Yes two finger swipe works!!! thanks!!!

[@JST500]

Many thanks Bruce... almost sure you will enter the heaven after this lesson, cheers

[@audio2u]

Bwahaha! Thanks! 😃

[@emrg777]

Nice video Bruce. Good condensed summary of the mechanics of the module. I think a good video followup if you do one would still focus on the mask....So maybe pick 3 images and present your goal with the image ie improve the shadows on the rocks and modify the sky yada yada and then work through making the mask to achieve what you would like to do with the image. Then maybe another example and then if you can find one where maybe it doesn't work that well or maybe you would go a different route as you mentioned might be nice....I guess what i am saying is one style of video is an exploration of the tool demonstrating the how and why parts of the module and sliders and the other would be a targeted application of the tools bringing it all together. Just my thoughts....Maybe that would be part of a workflow video some where down the line.....thanks for your perseverance.....

[@audio2u]

Good thoughts, Todd! I'll keep those in mind. Cheers.

[@pearcem66]

Thanks Bruce. I'm a newb and really appreciate the time and effort you put into all your videos. Without your guidance I would have given up months ago. I see some say darktable needs to be simpler but I enjoy knowing the reasons behind the process. A bit like turning the key on a car. Yes it starts and drives.....but why? Thanks again.

[@audio2u]

Thanks Mark. Glad you're finding them helpful.

[@davidknowles5519]

Cheers Bruce really helpful I now understand how to use it I have been experimenting and getting strange results now I know why BW

[@audio2u]

Excellent!

[@jonasmadsen930]

Hallo from Denmark - awesome tutorial ...you are a very good to explain 👍

[@audio2u]

Thanks Jonas!

[@Bizon-q2u]

Good morning. Unfortunately I don't know English well and translate subtitles for myself, but I have to write that your tutorials are great. However, for my knowledge and poor skills, scenocentric processing is too complicated. Can I use the old processing pipeline? Is this method so bad that I should switch to scenocentric processing?

[@audio2u]

Scene-referred is now the default in darktable. When you move your mouse over a processing module, you will get a tooltip that pops up and tells whether that module uses display-referred or scene-referred processing. You should try to minimize the number of display-referred modules you use, or be very subtle with your use of those modules (as extreme parameter changes in display-referred modules will cause horrible artefacts).

[@autoauto2000]

i am from Germany but i dont know David. Do i have go through this before i can use darktable without hickups

[@audio2u]

Sorry, not sure what this means.

[@autoauto2000]

@@audio2u u have to compile the App before ist works without any Error s

[@audio2u]

There must be something not working on your machine... To the best of my knowledge, most people have been able to install the packaged version and run it without issue. I'm not sure why you're having problems with it. How you are able to get it sorted soon.

[@macrain2691]

Merci beaucoup from Toulouse

[@audio2u]

Cheers.

[@musasoyyo]

Hey there Bruce, I'be been learning Darktable the past few weeks trying to break free of the Adobe prison, I'm an advanced Lightroom user (been using it since version 1.4) but lately I hate the "subscription" based payments and also I have seen that darktable is incredibly powerful and versatile. I know that maybe You don't have the answer for this, but I haven't found a word in any forum: I run Darktable in MacOS, and while I was watching your video on (this video) I saw that the cursor in your workflow is very precise and presents no lag, I started looking at other videos and for all users running Darktable in Linux or Windows it seems to work just perfect, but for me in MacOS it does not work the same the interactive cursor in modules such as Tone Equalizer is very laggy and this happens also with drawn masks, specially the brush masks, the cursor is very laggy. Do you know how can I correct this or where can I find information about it. Thank you very much.

[@audio2u]

Sorry to say that no, I have no clues as to why you might be experiencing this behaviour. I know there are plenty of people running darktable on MacOS, and I've not heard anyone else Kenton this, so I have to think it is something specific to your system.

[@niazkarim4916]

Great explanation. Thank you.

[@audio2u]

My pleasure!

[@candidonthestreetanupamgos5283]

I have a decently configured PC. But my Darktable 3.0 starts to slow down horribly once I start denoising by bilateral means and profiled denoising. Also exporting files in any format takes ages. Is there any settings I can tweak to make it right. By the way great video. Very nice explanation of time equaliser module.

[@audio2u]

I think I read somewhere that one of the denoising modules in 3.0 got a rewrite, and is noticeably slower. Don't recall which module that was, off the top of my head.

[@emrg777]

@@audio2u Your are correct I think they added a tool tip ...the combination of the tone eq and denoise profiled is noted as slow but some current builds for windows are quite slow...there have been numerous commits to the database and history over the last few days so maybe that will help. I have noticed after my last update that hitting the spacebar to go to the next image in darkroom view takes forever....may try to delete my database or run a dummy config directory to see if it is part of that or its in the code....

[@Chris-St-DE]

Hi, did you check the OpenCL setting? On my computer DT is faster with OpenCL turned OFF. And yes, profiled denoise is the slowest module. 😃

[@candidonthestreetanupamgos5283]

@@audio2u ok. Will keep an eye on the things to come.

[@candidonthestreetanupamgos5283]

@@Chris-St-DE thanks. Will give it a go. Let's see what happens.

[@robertmccutchan5450]

I know I am probably in the minority, but I have really been struggling with the dt 3.0. I have to say that right now, I'm not a big fan of it, and I have reverted to 2.6 (please don't flame me.....I'm just sharing my experience, and maybe there are others out there that feel like I do). I was just starting to get a grasp on 2.6...I felt like I was developing a good workflow and achieving great results without spending hours on a photography to make it look good. I know masking is a powerful part of dt, but I spend a little time as possible masking. Now, everybody says that Filmic and equilizer are the way to go, but I think I'm missing something....I just can't seem to get anything good and I REALLY don't understand all the explanations about linear vs rgb workflow. I did read the information that is out there, but it is over my head and makes no sense to me. Having said that, I really do appreciate the efforts of the developers for creating the program, and people like Bruce who are doing their best to help some of us who are struggling make sense of it all.

[@audio2u]

Robert don't stress mate! At the end of the day, what's important is that you are comfortable with whatever software you're using and whatever workflow you have in place. If 2.6 does the job, go with it! 😃

[@lukaszk2117]

The same here. I loved darktable but I'm starting to miss the point now. DT seems to work really slower and I'm not seeing those magnificient advantages of new modules which are quite complicated for me while the effects of their work are not so satisfactory. I found one very irritatitng bug (github.com/darktable-org/darktable/issues/4087), guys from github were able to solve it, but I don't know how to use their work, I'm not so smart to change the sourcecode and compile the DT on my own, think I have to wait for the next version. I'm using Windows, and can't change to Linux due to other software I extensively use for work on my machine, which has no substitutes working on Linux (some molecular biology stuff, used in my lab). I feel quite depressed since I thought I was doing much progress in editing my photos and now I feel I'm stuck.

[@neutrinissimo5118]

"Adobe refugees", I like that :P

[@audio2u]

I couldn't be the only one! 😃

[@umdbest001]

Subscribed Amazing

[@audio2u]

Cheers!

[@jesse6327]

I don't hear the fan at all

[@Flingwing24]

P.S.. Can't see why folk are getting they skiddies in a twist over this one. How many times have you tried to use a piece of software, only to find it does what it "thinks" you want? If phots was easy we would all do it....jeez, a year ago I thought RAW was something the French insisted on doing to a Barbie😆 but you aspire, you learn, you accept progress takes effort so you work at it. It doesn't help that photography is so bloody subjective. One man's masterpiece is another man's abomination, but with the right tool's and flexibility (which DT gives in spades) anything is possible. My bag is sharing what I see in some pretty unique situations so my battle is with the environment rather than artistic considerations, but DT has also shown me so many new possibilities....Genius.

[@audio2u]

Yeah, dt certainly doesn't deprive anyone of options!

[@buridanrila7654]

Hi Bruce, I use darktable for almost 3 years now. I started to learn darktable with a series of videos by Harry Durgin, who did weekly darktable edits on youtube. Unfortunately, for almost two years now there aren't any new videos from Harry. When I watched your video on the tone equalizer, the mask of this module reminded me of a mask which Harry used to create with a low pass filter (this is explained in his video on kzbin.info/www/bejne/qWHOm4asjJ5mgpI). As in the tone equalizer he used this mask to deal with HDR photos. I don't know if you are aware of Harry's videos, but I have the impression that he had the same basic ideas as Aurelien on how to handle high dynamic range. Perhaps you can have a look at Harry's video and use some of his findings in your future videos. And thank you for all the videos you have done up to now. I really enjoyed them,

[@BJ-gt9ls]

I find the new possibilities of Darktable exciting. I tried to install the latest version of Darktable, but on Linux Mint 19.1 I don't find this version, not even as a flatpack. Is there this version somewhere as an app image? That would be the best solution for me. I have already tried to generate the latest version from the sources, but although I hopefully followed all the instructions, I only received error messages regarding missing modules. Can anyone give me a hint how to solve the problem? By the way, this is the best channel to understand darktable! I love this channel and I download all the episodes so that if I have problems I can solve them. This text is translated automatically since I am not that good in English. I hope you can forgive me. Greetings Jacques

[@mickr007]

Hello Jacques, I'm running LM 19.3 (Ubuntu 18.04) and I think LM 19.1 runs on the same base. I installed Darktable 3.0 using the instructions from the following link and it's working fine: ubuntuhandbook.org/index.php/2019/12/install-darktable-3-0-0-ubuntu-18-04-19-10/ Hope helpful.

[@BJ-gt9ls]

@@mickr007 Worked great!!! Thanks

[@mickr007]

@@BJ-gt9ls Hi Jacques, good to hear. Just to let you know I subsequently found an error on my install where drawn masks were not working properly - showing the mask would make all of the window turn yellow rather than just the area designated by the selected shape (eg a circle). Reading other forums there were suggestions that DT3.0 should be installed from scratch, rather than updating from 2.6, so I completely uninstalled the package and purged any previous DT dependencies. I then reinstalled using the ubuntu 18.04 base deb from here: software.opensuse.org/download.html?project=graphics:darktable&package=darktable It gave me a 'warning' about a later release being available on 'software channels', which might be some pending new updates from the devs? Anyway I ignored the warning and carried on. Having done this drawn masks are now working correctly. You might be OK anyway but thought it worth mentioning. May be best if you check that drawn masks are working for you. It's a pain if you go too far down the line and then find there's a problem and end up reinstalling as well.

[@yjawhar]

Where do you live where it’s 40 in February?

[@audio2u]

New South Wales! This state has been burning (literally) non-stop since September!

[@yjawhar]

Bruce Williams Photography oh, so the wrong hemisphere of the world!? I knew something was off!

[@yaqxs]

@@yjawhar wrong? you mean "other", I hope.

[@autoauto2000]

ansel adams. i have three books signed

[@audio2u]

Woah! Nice one!

[@autoauto2000]

fun fact...adobe prison !!!

[@audio2u]

Was that something I said? I don't recall, but it sounds like me! :)

[@autoauto2000]

@@audio2u Yep ;-)

[@thomaswirtl4446]

Thanks for this good job. For me it's a very complex module, so I think I've to watch this video much more than once.

[@audio2u]

Well, it took me seven goes to record it, so maybe you need to watch it seven times! 😃

[@autoauto2000]

Sony Prison ;-)

[@audio2u]

I don't mind Sony.... other than the price of their lenses.

[@lordoftheflings]

What a shitty design. This is one of the main problems with darktable. They expose too much of the algorithm, when really they should be hiding the underlying algorithm from the user and make it easy to understand with easy terms and easy sliders. Nothing in darktable is intuitive.

[@audio2u]

Well, Aurelien would disagree with you there. I'm kinda struggling myself. One half of me likes being able to have that much control, the other side of me (like you) says "make it simple"! :)