Autism Thinking - It Goes Like This

This is an example of autism thinking. People on the autism spectrum often process things through concrete thinking, or black and white thinking. This can lead to some surprising revelations when as a parent you assume they know something, only to find out that you didn't know what they didn't know!
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[@delilahhart4398]

I wasn't diagnosed with autism until I was an adult. There's something I said when I was a kid that I'm really ashamed of now. When I was 11, my aunt had a baby who only lived for a few hours after he was born. I had an interest in decomposing bodies back then, and one day I told my aunt my little cousin was decomposing in the ground! All of the adults were horrified! I didn't say it out of spite, though. I was merely making an observation that I found interesting. And before anyone calls me a psychopath, I want to mention that I cried when my cousin died! I really was sad, so I'm not some unfeeling monster.

[@autismsomeassemblyrequired5657]

There's no need to be ashamed of something your 11 year old self said. We've all said and done things that we look back on with regret.

[@SnappyWasHere]

Same thing here. All through childhood I said all sorts of totally socially inappropriate things like that. At my own dad’s funeral I poked at his body like it was a science experiment when I was 9 and I never cried. I had no supportive family so it was just punishment. My life was just a mental book of behaviors that was acceptable in situations. Never once did anyone say I was autistic, found out on my own at 46.

[@victoryamartin9773]

I'm Autistic, and I have no problem with what you said. Your observation was truth. Nothing wrong with that.

[@constancematthews3834]

I once ate an entire loaf of bread because I wasn't allowed to leave my seat till I finished my homework while I was left home alone. I was awful at math, so couldn't finish without help at 11 or 12 y/o. NO ONE thought to look into why anyone would do that. Over 30 years later, I've only recently been able to self-identify my autism. I still don't think my family fully believes my assessment. I'm just glad I used the bathroom before sitting down!

[@Taoscape]

"No if-then thinking". That sheds some light on things, thanks!

[@drachnae]

This video does a lot of things right, namely by not pathologizing autistic ways of thinking. However, this video repeatedly frames these differences as a lack of understanding in autistic folks of neurotypical ways of thinking and communicating. Such framing is an example of neuronormativity, i.e., the centering and normalization of neurotypical ways of being. For this reason, it would have been better to frame these differences as, well, exactly that: differences. The misunderstandings that result from communication and thinking differences between autistic and neurotypical folks is a problem that cuts equally in both directions, and should be represented as such. Thank you for your commitment to spreading awareness about autism. I hope my feedback provides insight that you will find helpful in continuing this important work.

[@mjolnir3309]

I agree and i would add that i don't like the idea that autistic people don't or can't think in the abstract or that our thinkingis black and white. It may be true for some, but i feel it's a gross oversimplification. The way i try to describe my "black and white" mentality is that i understand and am well aware that everything is a shade of grey. However, we can break that into two groups, dark grey and light grey. I label these categories by their most extreme examples for simplicity : black and white. This does not mean we miss the nuance or abstractness of the subject matter. In fact, I'd say we are hyper aware of it. Most of the time, I'm trying to find a reasonable and logical place to draw that line of demarcation while people are telling me that I'm just thinking in terms of black and white. In my experience and belief, we don't really have issues with abstract or concrete thoughts or concepts, we like to categorize. If you tell me there is a grey area all i hear is that there needs to be a third category. I'm fine with that, but to just tell me it's a spectrum without explaning how that is a better viewpoint for purposes of our discussion is meaningless to me.

[@drachnae]

@@mjolnir3309 Excellent addition! In my exploration of autism research, I’ve often found that “abstract thinking” functions as a messy catch-all category referring to things like metaphorical thinking, top-down thinking, social cognition, etc. Of course, for many autistic people, these are not strengths. However, there are many other things that could be called “abstract thinking” - logical analysis, mathematics, pattern recognition, etc. - which many autistic people excel at. It’s problematic, to say the least, to claim that autistic people are lacking in abstract thought.

[@mjolnir3309]

@drachnae yeah, it's a broad category, and often, there isn't a good sense of what is meant. I don't think it's fair to say autistic people have issues, in general, with even the more common aspects. I think the issue is more communicating these thoughts and understanding that we are expected to see things in a certain way. For instance, with metaphors, maybe it's not the case that we can't think that way, but that we also think of the literal interpretation as well. Most metaphors are poor analogies for the subject and have many possible meanings. I know i often get lost in this, especially when metaphors are used incorrectly. E.g. it's only a few bad apples. Are you talking about actual apples? If so, where are they, and why are they bad, and how is this relevant? If not, what are you referring to as the apples? How is that bad? Do you mean literally rotten, or is that also metaphorical rot? Is the situation bad? Are the things bad? Is this sarcasm or satire? Most importantly, did they intentionally leave off "spoil the bunch" or did they not know that's part of the phrase and are misusing it? Easy to get overwhelmed by this and just pick one, probably the literal one since it has the advantage of being what was actually said. Thus, we look like we can't think that way, but perhaps it's just a case of not understanding wth people are trying to say. Sorry, rough day. Hope this isn't harsh or something.

[@drachnae]

@@mjolnir3309 Not harsh at all! I find it thought-provoking and engaging. I think you might be gesturing at a fundamental issue here: autism research has generally failed to define symptoms of autism in ways that are coherent and in alignment with reality, largely because said research does not generally do a good job of incorporating autistic people’s first-person descriptions of their own perspectives. As an autistic person myself, this is immensely frustrating to me too. I greatly appreciate you taking the time to share your own perspective. Hope your day gets better.

[@theeguy9022]

even as someone with autism this is pretty informative and useful only thing id change about this is the volume of music at the end its a pretty big change from the rest of the video

[@autismsomeassemblyrequired5657]

I appreciate the feedback! I'm still not very good at filming and editing, but I'm working on it. Great tip!

[@theeguy9022]

@@autismsomeassemblyrequired5657 nah your style is great and it's very well explained with alot of relatable parts

[@beethechange257]

Words mean things.

[@CarlosRodriguez-cj8oo]

But things don't mean words, necessarily.

[@jn1211]

neurotypicals aren't aware of this in the same way.

[@Papiliodani]

Interesting...someone who is undiagnosed autistic in my life who was adopted has believed his parents lied to him his entire life, not informing him he was adopted until he found out on his own as a teen but i feel something exactly like this scenario is the likely truth...he didnt understand the concept of adoption

[@adolfohernandez5970]

I was exactly like that as a kid. Im high masking now but it took a brutal process of trial and error.

[@fluffyunicorn1515]

I am 32 female and I was diagnosed with dyspraxia and adhd several years ago. I was being assessed for autism before lockdown but I moved away for a while and did not end up finishing the assessment. I am going to be seeing my psychiatrist soon and I need to speak to him about why I think I'm autistic. It is so complex because I have these other conditions. I spoke to student services and they said it sounds like I'm taking things literally and struggling with metaphors but that I'm able to think things through. I did not understand Steven Pinker's Book Is the Mind a Blank Slate? It took me some time to understand that he was talking about the nature vs nurture debate. For years I have puzzled over this concept and the term 'is the mind a blank slate' does not make any sense to me. So the mind is like a blank piece of paper? In another class the lecturer asked if any of us would fight for anything. I asked what do you mean fight like physically? After thinking about it and asking ai I figured out he means would you stand up for something. I am still confused by this and I'm not sure if I would fight for something or not. I feel so stupid sometimes. I ask my lecturers questions then get embarrassed, thinking I should probably already know this and it is a stupid question. I struggle with dichotomous thinking. I don't understand how it's possible for me to get a degree in social sciences if I am neurodiverse and have dichotomous thinking, but that in itself is an example of dichotomous thinking. I have social issues, struggle to make friends and maintain friendships, struggle with eye contact and worry about my own body language and what is appropriate. Sometimes I say things that don't make sense. I am not sure what my special interest would be as I have lots of interests but I have adhd and that is quite common I think in adhd. I love animals, ballet, roller coasters, and social science and philosophy. I struggle to read things that don't interest me. I am reading a book about animals and I can do that no problem. If I have to read one chapter on something that's not relevant to my interests and 'read aloud' is not an option it can be a very long and tedious process and sometimes I'm simply not able to finish reading it. I read some theories recently that questions the existence of adhd and the less extreme view, that it is over diagnosed. This concept makes no sense to me. Either is exists or it doesn't. How can people question this? Or do they just mean it is not a disorder but instead a variation? I worry as well that people will think 'another woman diagnosing herself with autism' like I am jumping on a band wagon. I am frustrated because I can't figure out if I have autism or not. I have spent lots of time with many different autistic and neurodiverse people and usually I get along really well with them. I am also very emotionally reactive and I experience a lot of empathy and I get upset about things like I feel like sometimes I asked my lecturers stupid questions and they will think I'm dumb or not following instructions but I have tried to follow the instructions and I have got confused. Or a concept can completely confuse me and it might not even be important. I am so confused. I don't know if anyone can help me.

[@A.Hanaais]

I find this video very interesting and actually very accurate. Thank you 👍

[@markdeffebach8112]

The idea of autistics using black and white thinking is flawed. I am nearly always perplexed by all the possible meanings a neurotypical person may mean when they say something. Some how other neurotypicals see only one possible meaning. I feel like most neurotypicals are grossly ambiguous in their speech. How do I pick the particular shade of gray that a neurotypical intends when speaking as if they were speaking plainly in black and white language? I feel like neurotypicals wear blinders that prevent them from seeing all the shades of gray in what they say, then they ridicule those who point out their imprecise speach by asking for clarification. 😢

[@siyashilla6885]

Females move the same way . They keep it vague because they want to insult you without it being obvious

[@SuperAwesomeReasons]

I pulled this shit on the Temptations when I was a child. I met one of their (fantastically talented) guitar players that they were accompanied by at the time, and because I understood the Temptations to be the four singers and no one else, I didn't count the guitarist as one of the Temptations, and I offered him my left hand instead of my right hand to shake while saying to his face that I did it because the right hand is for the real temptations. I wonder if I can find that guy and clear up the misunderstanding.

[@queerantine69]

I enjoyed this but the end music was really loud

[@gotobassmsn]

I did know I had High Functioning Autism till I was in my early 40's. And I never knew how to properly respond to people, for I didn't understand the non verbal social ques.

[@readyrock3242]

This is literally how I think

[@victoryamartin9773]

So literally true!

[@rohanking12able]

So like npc prompt scripts. Filed and have to be manually edited

[@bumblebaa2327]

I'm a 50 yo engineer and just got diagnosed. I got into problems when the society in 2020 did not fit my theory of the world (and life and everything). Rigid and logical thinking on my part, oops. But I'm a scientist and have lots of if/when exceptions in my thinking and knowing that I don't know a lot. Plus decades of training in the NT world. Do you have an example for how older autistics think, so I might understand how I differ? I know I don't think in abstract concepts of concrete things, when you for example say "cat" I think of a specific cat called Poem. I rolodex through a lot of specific cats I knew and then I can follow/mount a thought train about cats in abstraction. I can about total abstract things too, things like "absolution" or "the industrial complex". Had some problems understanding "sublimation" though. Do I differ from other intellectuals in this? And, as an aside, I attach strong judgements to behaviour I see in society. Think politics, ingrained racism and court cases. I suspect that judging that hard is an autistic trait. While in personal contact I always assume I'm in the wrong.

[@loverainthunder]

NT's have fuzzy logic and a sense of reality that is in part determined by the assumed perception of those around them. So their sense of self and reality changes automatically as they see someone observing them. They rely heavily on the perception of others in order to "feel out" reality. This is what is meant by mind blindness. Autistics aren't as driven to imagine the world through others perception, so we expect reality to be wholly formed and physical. So it can be impossible for me to feel how special and valuable gold is, for example. But because other's value gold, the nt fuzzily feels how important gold is. I may only see it as a metal that has uses, and may be pretty, and that people have decided has value. My point is, NTs are doing something extra. They aquire and create culture through shared fuzzy perception. So you could look at yourself as rigid, but you could also look at it as being reality based, not subject to the whims of culture as much as NTs. I suffered because I thought NTs were more knowledgeable than I was, when they just are better at feeling the value of cultural behaviors without requiring logic to explain why the behavior is important. They're interdependent when it comes to their perception. Autistics may be dependent more if disabled by sensory trouble and being unable to integrate with others. I believe your mind is able, but you probably just aren't doing fuzzy logic mind reading that satisfies NTs. An autistic mind is an independent thinking mind, a NT mind relies on a shared and felt sense of reality. They aren't able to easily perceive how dependent their minds are, just as I never realized they intentionally copy off each other, and don't independently come to similar conclusions.

[@loverainthunder]

If my child was the autistic child described in the vid, I would have clearly explained to him the concept of exceptions, when they should be used and why. And that they can be a surprise. But maybe the child was overwhelmed by the commotion and not in a place where they could cope with what feels like a shocking change. My point is, I believe autistics can think abstractly but are driven by different sensory and emotional needs.

[@bumblebaa2327]

@@loverainthunder letting you know your answer helped me so much when you wrote it 10 months ago. And ever since. I often reread it. You explain things in a language I understand and you do it to educate me, not to shame me. And it's so very interesting too! Thank you for all of that :) I hope you have many good days :)

[@wintermatherne2524]

No wonder I always assumed nts are stupid.

[@yesbruvsistrasnonbinary]

​@@loverainthundergold has value because it is rare, does not degrade and is pure. It is a physical element that represents spiritual beauty. That's abstract eh? Lol.

[@CasMcAss]

as an autistic person the audio in this video is hard for me to listen to. The construction noises were painful and the constant pitch shifted voice is extremely distracting and hard to understand

[@autismsomeassemblyrequired5657]

I'm sorry. I'm not the best at editing videos. Especially audio.

[@jessaustin1122]

Oh waah

[@The_Vanished]

I love how i obviously thought in the autistic fashion my entire life, and was constantly picked on for not understanding when someone was messing with me. "Haha you stupid idiot!". "Why eo you talk like that?" "That" is not an understandable way of speaking. Then around 30 i went to see doctor after doctor and theyre like oh youre catastrophizing, flat affect is due to depression, theres no diagnosis with speech issues, youre lazy it you eont understand people's emotions. You just have every cluster b personality disorder, thats the least common denominator because im a doctor, i have the control and it makes the most sense to diagnose the most possible conditions with the most profoundly negative and discrimintory connotation possible. Then they give me pike ten years of weekly therapy to convince me i have sero empathy and that i should embrace being a psychopath and they have me qll figured out and its because my personality that I had meltdowns even 5hough i didn't understand why i was doing that while being completely embarrassed. That i couldn't control how emotions affected my demeanor, etc. "oh, its because you dont care or respect people around you"

[@laurabeigh283]

My ex partner is ASD. He sees no utilitarianism in being particularly nice to anyone. so he’s not. Hence, my ex.

[@Koalarix]

Hi I went to a general practitioner, I was told not to pursue it because there is no benefit to being labelled. Outside of that, they said because I can make eye contact and not take idioms literally, there's a low chance that I have mild autism. Is it true because of these 2 factors there's no need to pursue a diagnosis.

[@miraid06]

No. Most people do not understand autism unless they study it, which is a specialty. I lived with a therapist for most of my childhood and had about 7 years of therapy. It was a therapist that I wasn’t even seeing, that suspected it. I also have ADHD, which masks some ASD symptoms. I can make eye contact (it’s often a conscious effort), I understand certain types of jokes and am actually quite sarcastic, myself. I’m officially diagnosed. I shall add…ASD looks very different in women and in POC. It’s called high masking. Your GP doesn’t know what they’re talking about. The DX is more for you, but it does have one major drawback: some countries won’t let you immigrate if you’re on the spectrum.

[@HiIAmGabe]

Psychologists with check boxes are so frustrating! neuro typical people have a hard time grasping the neuro diverse mind. There are so many misconceptions displayed in this video. I assume you are good at logical thinking? To my knowledge autistic people often prefer logical thinking. So, if a person can logically think, they should also be able to logically analyze situations or humor. Some people might have a lower motivation, capacity or tendency to logically analyze communications which could result in always taking things literal. Others on the other hand can be very good at analyzing communications and especially humor.

[@HiIAmGabe]

Let me give some further examples: ​I think black and white thinking could relate to the need for order. Probably NT peope blindly follow the implicit social rules around crossing the street and therefore lack the ability to explain how they (the rules) are constructed and can't help replacing a simple rule with a logical explanation and underlying logical reasoning. I am not saying this will work for every autistic person (note: not people with autism, since it is simply a different way of thinking and not a disease), especially if the set of literal rules could give a sense of structure and comfort in an unstructured world. This is especially the case for autistic people who might have other intellectual challenges and find it hard to understand the complex logical alternative to the literal rule. Furthermore, the end of the video displays another possible misconception about the autistic person as they could indeed have the ability to follow the abstract thought process of understanding that the situation has changed but it is simply hard to deal with change as it brings disorder. In addition, autistic people often can have a higher need for mental preparations as executive functions, sensory sensations and social situations can be more draining for them. In conclusion, there are many dimensions to neurodiverse thinking that might be hard to grasp for a neuro typical mind.

[@Koalarix]

@@miraid06 Thanks for the response, what's this DX you mentioned?

[@HiIAmGabe]

@@Koalarix Dx is short for (medical) diagnosis. As I understand the "x" in "Dx" is a crossbar and just indicates that "D" is an abbreviation.

[@annemariemiguel2541]

literal thinking, and fixed thinking. Same thing?.

[@Bs4Christ]

exactly the same as our experience. how can we help them understand abstract ideas?

[@autismsomeassemblyrequired5657]

Never stop teaching, and remember that you never know what your kiddo DOESN'T know.

[@johannesroeder274]

Disclaimer: I don't know, if I really have autism, yet, but I'm definitely not neuro typical. So maybe it helps? Maybe start by talking with your kid about the concept of abstract ideas. That there are words with sometimes very fuzzy definitions, that people came up with so they can talk faster with each other. Its like, if you show people pictures of chairs and tables, they usually will know and have the same understanding, what is a chair and what is a table, but if you ask them for a definition of a chair or a table and what is the difference between them, most people start to struggle, even if you tell people to go and grab a chair, they usually won't grab a thing, you think is a table. So its ok to say grab a chair instead of describing every single chair. It is similar with other words as well. People have given things and groups of things and feelings names to talk faster about them, like with chairs and tables a lot of people have slightly different definitions of words like: love, justice, equality. Most of the time it works fine, but sometimes there is misunderstanding based on different definitions of this concepts. That is why it is sometimes very confusing, when people use this words.

[@faiora]

I can only speak from my own experience as someone diagnosed: I think it’s not precise enough to say autistics “lack abstract thinking.” There are autistic people who are great at advanced math and are seen as lacking abstract thinking. And yet, math beyond an elementary school level is almost the definition of abstract thinking. But non-autistic people (who may not have pursued advanced mathematics themselves, or don’t feel capable of it) will notice other areas where that person doesn’t seem to employ abstract thought. Same for “black and white” thinking. Autistic people may well seem this way in some areas, but non-autistic people have some very black and white views about how people should move and act and think. They notice the areas where autistic people are using hard rules in their approach. They don’t notice where they do the same thing. I think there’s a difference in priorities, more than anything else. I do think it’s worth adding: I (like many autistic people) do not have an intellectual disability, and I can’t speak for anyone who does. I wonder if B&W thinking might be a helpful strategy for someone with an intellectual disability? It seems like it could be a good way of overcoming certain challenges. But I don’t know.

[@HiIAmGabe]

​@@faiora I found this video incredibly hard to watch. I think black and white thinking relates to the need for order. Probably NT peope blindly follow the implicit social rules around crossing the street and therefore lack the ability to explain how they are constructed and replace a simple rule with a logical explanation and underlying logical reasoning. I am not saying this will work for every autistic person (note: not people with autism, since it is simply a different way of thinking and not a disease), especially if the set of literal rules could give a sense of structure and comfort in an unstructured world. This is especially the case for autistic people who might have other intellectual challenges and find it hard to understand the complex logical alternative to the literal rule. Furthermore, the end of the video displays another possible misconception about the autistic person as they could indeed have the ability to follow the abstract thought process of understanding that the situation has changed but it is simply hard to deal with change as it brings disorder. In addition, autistic people often can have a higher need for mental preparations as executive functions, sensory sensations and social situations can be more draining for them. In conclusion, there are many dimensions to neurodiverse thinking that might be hard to grasp for a neurotypical mind.

[@Repentforthekindomogiah]

Nice drawing

[@autismsomeassemblyrequired5657]

Thank you!

[@commonwisdom5333]

Thanks Flanders can't say I like Baumhauers though.

[@davehud2552]

It feels like am watching animation 😄

[@kendsi6523]

please don't use the puzzle piece sign, the rainbow infinity symbol is preferred

[@montymontgomery7464]

THIS IS IMPORTANT ☝️

[@ryona5476]

Why?

[@bumblebaa2327]

@@ryona5476 it has to do with an American autism organisation that uses the puzzle piece and claims to speak for autistics but is also judgemental about autism and autistics. I hear they think its a fault that should be mended. And that they don't have autistics in their review or feedback groups. Over here in Europe the puzzle piece does not carry these connotations. But the infinity symbol is great.

[@loverainthunder]

Hint. NTs fit together like puzzle pieces, and will literally change their sense of self and reality to fit together. Realizing the puzzle peice describes their needs can help it feel more reasonable. They want to conform to our edges and have us conform to theirs so we all can be together. It's a tender thought really. 💗😂 The rainbow infinity makes more sense when you consider the possibilities that an autistic perspective may hold, but the puzzle peice accurately describes a NTs needs. This dad is surely puzzled.

[@Personwhoexists123]

@@ryona5476 basically it’s associated with an organization called autism speaks that has some really bad/ableist views (not getting into it but you can look it up) and it’s basically saying that there’s a “piece missing in autistic people”. As an autistic person myself, it’s just really eh, I don’t have a piece missing or anything I’m just a regular person who just happens to have autism

[@zzdogger]

I'm 29 and I think I've been masking my whole life, I think I'm now learning to stop masking, and that outro was SO LOUD I panicked to turn down, lol

[@Serena-yn4pg]

why do we draw the sameee! I think I have autism tho

[@monoeye64]

i had to use a volume boost extension and put it at 500% to hear this.

[@imnotbeluga007]

Earrape edition. That may be fun for a while, but not all the time.

[@DarkSentinel52]

LOL

[@ZzedZed]

on behalf of the electromagnetic/colour spectrum i an offended. ! :)

[@Cat_theft_auto]

The moment i heard “they” i stopped watching, it makes sense you have it so rigidly wrong and disconnected from what its like to be a person also, i don’t wanna hear someone speak about someone else’s experience, and get it wrong.

[@alizaatta2201]

I am subscribing because this is cute....

[@turtleanton6539]

😊😊😊

[@neogoats8738]

Okey so why dont we have a similar video about neurotypicals?

[@artisticautistic9664]

Meh... I don't think you know what abstract thinking is.

[@internetcancer1672]

The autistic community has gone too far. Constantly feeling like it's okay to ask strangers for accommodation. 😂 Sure, maybe the music's too loud, maybe they shouldn't use puzzle pieces, but like, why do you have a right to like, complain about that stuff? This is a video you get access to for free, it's ridiculous. I get coming from a place of not feeling understood. It feels good to be able to be autistic and not have to mask, but at the same time, if you want other people to accommodate you, you have to accommodate them. 😮

[@AutodidactEngineer]

If my kids turn autistic I'm gonna get milk

[@bumblebaa2327]

wahaha! I'm a freshly diagnosed 50 yo and I don't understand this at all. I get rapid associations that you want to milk the situation for money and will start a youtube channel but also that you'll become Santaclaus and will hunt for milk and cookies. I trust what you do mean is just as funny :D or that otherwise we'll laugh together about my reading.

[@beasmarty]

@@bumblebaa2327 it seems we share the same brain, buddy xD Yesterday there was a brushfire on the news, and within 25 seconds...immediate association with and flashing recall of the scene from Mrs. Doubtfire, where he accidentally sets his fake bazooms on fire hahaha It's now been on loop every time I blink after seeing a reference to fire or the color red 😅

[@wiley6359]

"turn autistic" go to school and get an education higher than the sixth grade + autism is often hereditary, if your child is born with it then that means that you might've married an autistic person OR you yourself are autistic + go outside bozo

[@wiley6359]

@@bumblebaa2327 hello, unfortunately "gonna get milk" is a meme that younger generations use. it's not good, it means that they are planning to actually leave the child because they don't like the kid for whatever reason :( they're saying that they'd abandon their child if the child was diagnosed with autism. :(

[@bumblebaa2327]

@@wiley6359 oooh thank you. Like "just getting some cigarettes" for older folks. Mr Freeman is blind to the richness of the world that regular folks get to know when they take an interest how an autistic person experiences life. :)

[@PaPaWizdom]

A very annoying video coupled with a very annoying comment section.