Avoid Being This Type of Player | Reading D&D Stories

[@micky8542]

This video should be titled "Duke being proud of his wife for 20 minutes" 😂

[@SsilentShadow]

That's adorable

[@lost8320]

I like the devil’s advocate aspect of these horror stories. Cause a lot of times you only hear one side and hearing two is a lot more interesting

[@Shade01982]

Yeah. Like in some here, the question "but did you try actually addressing it?" really makes sense.

[@PlayPodOG]

sometimes one side is the correct side though

[@lost8320]

@@PlayPodOG yea but every time in this video, the devils advocate part made fair points

[@bezerkoid]

​@PlayPodOG I do agree with the general sentiment of "both sides aren't always right", but in these stories you occasionally get some (understandable) anger bleeding in, or omissions.

[@Arnveld]

@@PlayPodOG It's almost never that simple.

[@Evoker23-lx8mb]

The second story was just bad dming, no way of defending it. The DM wanted a TPK, no two ways about it. OP didn’t seem necessarily too attached to his character, more frustrated at the horribly unbalanced encounter.

[@ShepardCommander]

Sometimes DM's follow sources to closely and end up killing everyone, like CoS assassins.

[@Aredel]

@@ShepardCommanderthat’s not following sources too closely. That DM was bending and twisting the rules like they owed him money so he could kill those two characters.

[@jackwriter1908]

If he wanted a TPK he would have went after the Healer first, I say he wanted the Wizard dead, because he thought wizards were too powerful for his settings and Counterspell annoyed him.

[@Evoker23-lx8mb]

@@jackwriter1908 if he was willing to nuke one player, he’d surely be willing to nuke the others

[@jackwriter1908]

@@Evoker23-lx8mb but the DM didn't. Since other characters survived, so him planning a TPK, sounds rather unlikely if he neither killed all of them nor went after the person who could revive other characters.

[@charrleschervanik3632]

As a dm I've seen targeted Dming, Dming in bad faith, Lawful Evil Dming, and Meta game dming. Fireballing a party 5 times, and intentionally upcasting one of those fireballs to counter a counterspell is a perfect example of what I call Butcher play. It's where you combine meta-game level strategies like the intentional up-cast fireball with a messy reasoning. (Oh tHeY aReNt PlaYiNg arOunD). They are intentionally butchering the party. This was definitely targeted. For reference, a single Mage is a CR 6 encounter. Assuming they didn't use the optional Time-stop spell for mages, they have up to 5th level spell slots. Meaning there were 5 cr 6 casters on the battle-field that went full Nova on a party of 4. Inputting this into a CR calculator and assuming a level 10 party as that is towards the end of most campaigns. It's a CR Deadly encounter. The DM knew what they were doing.

[@Schilani]

I once used a single mage against my level 4 players. Bodyguard of a Nobel abusive to his horses, completely expecting somebody of my party to raise their weapons against his behaviour. After rolling damage for Cone of Cold decided to fudge it to 2 HP below the maximum my players had at that time (because of course I rolled a high 40 there). They actually pushed through after the initial scare, because players are dumb and can't take a hint, but got lucky enough with attacks against the mage to knock him out. After that I decided to play mages not with lethality in mind, but fun. Now I like them a lot more as teaching tools for what magic can actually do, especially for newer players. Having enemies take control of the battlefield is so much more fun than have all of them spam fireball, lightning or cone of cold.

[@Schilani]

@@dndbasement2370 Well, the mages also had cone of cold. So cerainly not level 5 spellcasters, but at least level 9. And I am really not sure where you got Archmages from. Nobody here said anything about archmages really, except maybe for the time stop, but that was already accompanied by "assuming they -didn't- use...". The CR6 mages fit perfectly with fireball and cone of cold. And going from the purely official entries, the lowest CR creature with Cone of Cold and Fireball is the mage. Also let's be honest here, the targeting was completely ridiculous to begin with. The DM targeted a wizard, the lowest health enemy, which is fair enough to knock them out quickly. But then continued to throw fireballs at the downed wizard and the... tiefling? With the chance to resist the fireball damage completely and so only further hitting the downed wizard? You really can't say this wasn't targeted.

[@mslabo102s2]

Don't try bringing up CRs at face value, there will be crowd that goes CR IS BROKEN.

[@Schilani]

@@dndbasement2370 Wait, where are archmages CR6? They are CR12, so already way above normal mages. And sure, the mathed out CR calculation for an encounter is only a very loose guide, but still, even thinking about throwing out mages, all equiped with fireballs and cone of cold, against a party that is probably only level 7 or 8 is just ludicrous. Especially if you actually have them all throw around these fireballs and cone of colds. There is "They don't play around" and then there is "I want players to die"

[@aaronwright485]

@@dndbasement2370 How would the players prepare for the fight when it was described as a fight that broke out in the moment

[@somebody4952]

Story 2: I think it's less a matter of being attached to the character, and more a matter of there being no conceivable way of avoiding that death, especially for a character played for that long

[@PurpleCyanideTube]

Yea how about the fact that they kept using a aoe spell on one threat for 2 spells and then one spell on no threat when there was another target option with two threats. This was blatant targeting. Those mages WERE NOT acting as those npcs should have been acting

[@vilukisu]

​@@PurpleCyanideTube also falls under the "rule" that a good DM shouldn't typically be trying to beat their players. They are not the enemy, the DM is not an opponent to the players but the person running and judging the game.

[@WhereAmITheBook]

They definitely had it out for the players, and after a two year campaign and there being no way to survive, its just a complete dick move

[@thevozhd8688]

I think you should be attached to your characters but also that death should eventually be a issue. Yes you are the hero and you should go on many great adventures but no one can live forever

[@kmacgregor6361]

Yeah, the encounter design putting all the enemies at a single initiative roll sets up the possibility for this problem. Had they all had different initiatives there would have been opportunities for others to heal, retreat, or take out one or two enemies.

[@azazelreeds]

There's nothing wrong with enemies getting serious and trying to kill the party, but the DM themself should never try to kill the party. EDIT: Apparently I need to clarify. Your job as a Dungeon Master is not to explicitly go out of your way to kill the party. Killing the party should not be your goal. If you want to play a game where killing the party is the Dungeon Master's goal go play something like Call of Cthulhu, Stormbringer, or Cyberpunk Red. I'm not saying don't kill players, I'm not saying don't set up unwinnable situations for story purposes or because it's reasonable. I'm saying your job isn't to just kill everyone because you want to

[@azazelreeds]

@@dndbasement2370 If you think I'm contradicting myself then you don't know how to separate yourself from the monsters you're running.

[@azazelreeds]

@@dndbasement2370 Okay, I'm going to explain something that really should already be obvious to you as a DM: You are not the monsters. Five wizards focusing fire is the wizards strategizing. That is the monsters trying to kill the party, not the Dungeon Master. Now throwing five wizards at a party who isn't powerful enough to handle it for no damn reason is the DM trying to kill the party. Better yet, why not five liches or five dragons? The DM is all knowing and all powerful. If they want the party dead it's super easy to do. If you really can't tell the difference you shouldn't be DMing

[@robertnett9793]

@@dndbasement2370 No... that's not contradicting. See the DM does manage the world and is basically the law of nature, fate and all of that. But other than that D&D is a game played by a group of people. So yes. It's the responsibility of the DM to play the world in a consistent way, which can lead to the characters demise in a multitude of ways. The keyword is 'can' and that's important. Even if the odds are stacked agains the characters, they should have a chance - if they don't - what's the point in playing? So it's also the responsibility of the DM to deliver a worthwhile story for everyone. Which can including characters dying. Or as Gary Gygax put it: Your job is it, to make encounters feel like 70/30 against the characters, while in reality they are more 30/70. It is a game after all. The situation presented here isn't the DM 'depicting the world in a realistic way' It's the DM using their abilities to set up a trap for the players (not the characters), with no way to escape it. It's the DM saying: Your character is dead - with a little bit of decorative dice throws around this. That situation wasn't an encounter but a firing squad. And face it: Comparing D&D to 'real life' in any way shape or form is moot. In 'real life' from 100 characters setting out to become adventurers, two would live to see lvl 3. The rest would die from gangrenes or food poisoning. Lastly: There is a difference between 'the DM not saving you' and the DM actively killing your character off. edit: word added for clarification

[@bretginn1419]

Honestly, I try to kill the party I DM. Doesn't mean I'm just going to bullshit something up, let alone minmax a weapon to destroy them, but that's because I want them to succeed against the challenge.

[@azazelreeds]

@@bretginn1419 That was basically a fancy way to say "I don't actually try to kill the party but I want to sound cool"

[@peterpoulsen1210]

Got a stroy to share to all who want to read it. - I am a fairly new DnD DM, did a few one shorts before I made my own homebrew long DnD campaign. - I have used DnD to relax form the real problem, stress, anxiety and grief I still struggle with after losing my girlfriend in 2020 to cancer...💔 Our last session how ever made me want to stop and quite DnD for good. Sell my minis and what not. - The problem was a new player who have join us (did't knew any of us but we allowed him to join, becuase why not) - He was allowed change his hero from a male to female hero. No problem with that. But in every interaction both with the other players and my NPCs did he over sexualization got so far that he touch himself between his legs and chest. (I had to stop and the campaign and say that stop now. But he did not our last session had so many stops or breaks where I had to either slam the table or stare him in his eyes to him to stop.) - The same player keept auto correcting me and talk over me even as I tryied to redo my saying. ( Keep in mind I am dyslexic and I told him and the others thatvI may say something that may sound stupid) he keept going all session he was in, becuase he was studying so could not stop arto correcting. - He keept testning me as a DM by railroading the adventure and got the other players in problems way over their and my head. - After the session and he and I was alone I told him this was it. I won't have him in this DnD party with that kind of behaviour. He did not listen and hot super defensiv and angry calling me names and talk down me as DM. - Told him he was no longer welcome in my DnD party or home. The groupe or DnD party I am DMing are playing session for around 7-8 hours each becuase we live so far away and don't see each other a lot. That means session in our party takes so many hours to get ready both painting, write the story and my dyslexia dont help either. So after last session with the problem player did I not want anything with DnD anymore. My friends and also the other players in our DnD party want to go keep playing even with-out that new guy. They told me they enjoyed my campaign even with our last session even as it became pure chaos. We will start up again but I need a good break before I am ready to play DnD or DMing anything soon. - Thank you, to all you who read this mess. Kind regards from Denmark 🇩🇰

[@dirkbaldorad3634]

Hope you are able to continue your game soon and without the problem player. I often have cross gender characters in my games and even had se(ns/x)ual scenes but never has anyone felt the need to touch themselves at the table. 😶 I would be ok with this if the group agreed to this kind of "erotic role play" beforehand but it's nothing for the usual groups. 😮

[@irenewijman4742]

I've had a similar situation with a 'problem' player, not quite as serious as this though. The only reason it didn't get too bad was because I kicked him as soon as I saw his major flaw as a person. I can speak from experience, if the rest of your players still like your campaign, get back into it and you will start to like the campaign again as well.

[@tress4726]

Please don't let one bad player ruin the game for you and your friends. By all means, take a short rest and regain your composure, but if you quit something that your table enjoys, then he wins. You've done everything right. You set clear boundaries, gave multiple warnings, and ultimately removed the problem from the game. That's EXACTLY what a good DM's job is. Don't give up!

[@lewisbarclay9113]

"I cast fireball on you." "Alright, my wizard counterspells." "I didn't say your character." Holds up a lighter.

[@nightlordnorris4446]

That book analogy was a great one! Thats a great way to put it. George R.R. Martin's favorite character in all of his books is Daemond Targaryen who dies a horrible death. In our favorite animes, the greatest side characters almost always die. We as fans get attached, but the writers had to actually build those characters up just to kill them. That's years of writing on that character just for them to be gone, but sometimes it opens up something new like a character better fitted to the setting or situation

[@nyxnightmare3542]

Story 1 sounds like the entire nearly 10 years of playing D&D, but as a player. In every single group I have ever played in, I would be talked over, have my character forcefully controlled where my spells/race/abilities would be chosen for me and I'd have zero say in the matter, and then completely ignored whenever I would get the chance to speak. So I understand the DM's frustration at having even just 1 player act this way, especially to the literal person running it for that player. This is why I do Duo only games now with my fiance. While I still think group play is amazing, it just doesn't work for everyone, and I fully support any DM who chooses to kick out any players who try to control them or other player choices. Never be scared to kick someone out when they're causing controlling drama

[@Silverfur]

The fireball story reminds me of a session where my character "died". Our level 15 characters found ourselves facing what appeared to be the avatar of a god level character (DM won't share the CR, which is fair). In one round, before I got to take my turn, my character went from 156 HP to dead. Enemy had a multi-attack action that allowed 3 attacks, 2 of which could be spells (I remind you this is an avatar of a god level character so this does make some sense). First two attacks brought me to 75 HP at which point the enemy cast Power Word: Kill (a spell which the DM assures us only 3 characters in the campaign have as they feel it is an unfair spell since there is no save). Almost immediately the DM shoots me a Discord message letting me know that this fight is an illusion that is feeding off the fears of our characters. They let me know my character is fine and will wake up once everyone else learns of the illusion. While it isn't the same, my character was fine, right when the NPC cast PWK I was devastated because I had had no chance to act or react. And since the combat ended up being the entire session I did nothing but roll initiative.

[@bezerkoid]

At least it wasn't for real, but eesh.

[@Destroyer_V0]

At that point, you would check out of the session almost certainly.

[@Terracrete]

Your breakdown of the psychology of a micro manager is so spot on. I have had to self-evaluate that behavior myself and yes, it is those issues.

[@QuirkyView]

It's never a guarantee to be too late to have a conversation until after you actually try, unless you believe it's too late going into it.

[@joshlewis8860]

The dm in the first story was kind of being a coward. And I’m the same way, I don’t like confrontation and I wouldn’t want to be the person to bring it up. But I think they had the courage to step into the DM role, they should take the chance to attempt to make amends rather than running away from the issue. It’s a big example of how setting boundaries early on can prevent problems in the future. It was their first time DMing and it sounds like other than this issue they were doing a good job, so I hope they learn and bring that experience into another future campaign.

[@Iso-Chef]

I didn’t notice that my best friend was right in front of me this whole time… Also, love this kind of content, I feel it helps me sort of find my problems. I wasn’t ‘that guy’ in any of these stories, but these definitely get me thinking about where I might be heading in the wrong direction. I like this for its effect and how it reminds me to stop, and think about what I can do to prevent my own horror stories.

[@CharlesChaldea]

You're a real one brother, keep it up

[@Monk9619]

really liked the format please more of it I did not know your wife was a psychologist but this makes the entire thing more "educational" in sense and having duke playing devils advocate also helps to balance the situation so basically you have one person assessing the story level headed with no judgment and the other one tries to look at it from a different perspective

[@PleaseElaborate]

"Talk to them. Even if it's the littlest thing. Don't let it build up. TALK TO THEM." Bro, that advice could save marriages.

[@WantedVisual]

I like that this goes more in depth than the usual "just burn the entire campaign to the ground" reactions you have to wade through to find some nuance that makes you think.

[@stevencross8937]

duke with no expression when she says "some people look at it as it is their life" lol. bringing in the therapist to reason with people on this was a genius move.

[@Elchansan]

Love it. Great way to hear stories from the community and also comes with ways to remind people that even these stories are just one side of the event. It's good to be able to remind the audience/commenters "You do not know what this person was going through prior to the events of the story"

[@thefrank2364]

The second story man, this is why you gotta take the time to balance out your encounters

[@darkscot1338]

Except it wasn't really a planned encounter the PC's turned on their allies.

[@Aredel]

Oh it was planned alright. As Duke said, the DM went well out of his way to murder those characters.

[@gramfero]

​@@darkscot1338they turned on their allies? What allies? The ones that cast 5 fireballs on a single characters? The DM just wanted an excuse to kill the party

[@minionofgruumsh]

@@gramfero Listen to the set up again. They started out allied with the mages. There was movement going on. The players then decided, for their own reasons, that they didn't think the mages were doing enough to help them and then "turned" on them and started a fight. At some point, you have to accept that everyone can share blame in a catastrophe at the table. The players *chose* to initiate hostilities with a force of greater numbers than them. Did they know how powerful the individual units comprising that force were? Did they take time to scout it out or scheme and plan while the alliance was still being observed? Or did they just arrogantly go in, cocky and sure of their invincibility? We will never know, but the fact that the complaining player included that setup implies there's more going on than "DM was mean to us!" (That's not to say that I disagree about the initiative clumping thing. Either roll and do separately if you've got a group, or roll them all and use the mean average of all the rolls if you insist on combining turns.)

[@ryangentry2003]

I just last night asked my players “How evil do I want to be” because there was 3 wizard enemies with fireball. I ended up just one of them casting fireball and the other two magic missile. Ironically the fireball rolled super low and only did 22 damage, but I still didn’t want to knock them down at the beginning of the fight.

[@terencemcquillan5750]

I have a policy when GM-ing that I will not deliberately kill a PC. Having said that, if one of them insists on doing the metaphorical equivalent of standing in an open field during a thunderstorm while wearing plate armour and holding their sword in the air, all the time screaming "ALL GODS ARE BA@%#&DS!"... well, they deserve everything that comes their way.

[@dragonfan8647]

​@@terencemcquillan5750I understood that reference 😄

[@bezerkoid]

​@@terencemcquillan5750ah, the Discworld atheist way of choosing to meet your maker.

[@socialistrepublicofvietnam1500]

Truly one of the moments of all time

[@antonycharalampous5454]

How come I see you everywhere, comrade?

[@Crocogator]

I think this would be a great format, especially with the two different perspectives.

[@cookiedudegaming]

I liked this kind of D&D Therapy video. Lot's of useful stuff!

[@shimasclan]

More please. I like seeing Wife. I like hearing you guys talk and discuss.

[@OriginalJDB]

I just like seeing the husband/wife dynamic. I love it! Keep up the good work!

[@scottdean2199]

I really liked this. The interplay with the two of you makes it so much better than just one person giving their opinion. If this were a regular thing I would mark my schedule try to catch each premier.

[@morganarndt3219]

I like how when Amy brought up Mario Kart Duke sat up straight with a smile on his face. He knew exactly what she was about to say.

[@devonmcdaniel1176]

Actually, I genuinely enjoy this. Hearing your take on certain stories, as well as advise on how to prevent and/or mitigate future problems is super helpful and really refreshing

[@KirstenBayes]

We have had that guy in our group (story 1). Perfectly decent human being, real issues in D&D. In the end we were all like, "get rid of him".

[@IronLordEXO]

I'm in a similar issue, except in my case, it's the DM's best friend and is enabled 💀 they also like to steamroll and completely take over the roleplay in sessions to the point where a couple weeks back, I spent 90% of the session multitasking and messing around in Skyrim because they somehow got 3 hours of it centered around their character

[@KirstenBayes]

@@IronLordEXO that kind of spotlight grabbing is the worst!

[@beetleb.1418]

DMs have it ROUGH. I knew that but didn't realize how rough until that first ask. YIKES! I LOVED this video--you're both so charming and funny, and down to Earth. Plus, this was informative without being a dense infodump. MORE!

[@Halt938]

Definitely do more of these! It was super fun! Also I'm surprised nobody is talking about the "That's rough buddy" comment by Wife 😅

[@1Metalshadow]

I would love more of these! Hearing your wisdom and how you each view the two sides to the stories is really fun!

[@killer_rabbit42]

I think you should do more of these in the future. Like others have said, having multiple perspectives on these stories is great. For the first story, if the person is a game design major, they might be in college & can't move rooms at this time. I completely agree with the importance of communication. I am the general manager at a local game store & I have seen a lot of RPG groups play at the store over the past 8 years. Some GMs don't talk to their players about problem behavior because they are too nervous or have anxiety issues, sometimes they're just so new at running that they don't have the skills to reign players in, sometimes they're just non-confrontational & don't want to be the person who tells others no because the player might get mad & leave the group. The groups I have seen stay together the longest are ones where there is open communication between the players & the GM. I've seen groups with good communication last for upwards of 5 years or so & games with poor communication last for maybe a month. Communication is key if you want the group to last. For the second story, I don't entirely agree with the petty revenge of bringing in a joke character but I understand where it's coming from. If it was me, I would have brought in a cleric with the sole purpose of getting to the point where they could raise the wizard character. The DM having all the spellcasters cast fireball seems like bad DM'ing at face value of the post. 1. Those actions would all go off at the same time, so there shouldn't be time to notice a spell was countered & then upcast 2. I'm all for enemies being played intelligently, if they have the intelligence or wisdom score, but the DM should challenge & entertain their players, not nuke them 3. I usually have all of my bad guys go on the same initiative because it's easier for me to run combat that way. I make fights difficult for my players but not impossible if they work together & don't do anything really dumb. I know it took me a little while to learn how to upscale a fight to challenge players without making it deadly for them. I've cut HP down for some monsters if I saw an encounter going poorly that I thought the players could handle or made critical hits into regular hits if the players' dice just didn't like them that night.

[@alexi4829]

strange for CritCrab to reveal his face on a different channel, but I guess it makes sense given how he looks exactly like Duke! jokes aside, this is a good watch. oh and as a wee thing relating to story 2; as a general rule I don't upcast spells as a DM, unless the creature I'm running has run out of slots of the spell's level, then I upcast to the lowest possible level, I also have a general rule of never casting the same spell twice within the same round, and the same creature won't cast the same spell 2 turns in a row. It makes each round a bit more interesting and stops me nuking my players before they can do anything.

[@joshuapierce3085]

I'm subscribed to numerous D&D horror story channels as well as Reddit narrated videos, but these are the only ones I've seen with multiple narrators/commentators. I love it!

[@Swift202008]

As someone who is extremely nervous about starting as a GM in another D20 system, this content format really helps me think and learn. Please continue with it.

[@Schilani]

I would say a lot of stuff is easy to transfer between different systems. Because most of the non-rule related things for a DM/GM is simply "You are mastering FOR your players, not against them." And "Don't be a dick to your players." The most complicated thing is probably "Even tho you can hear what the party is talking about, the NPCs have no idea what they are thinking", also known as "Don't metagame the NPCs."

[@nyxnightmare3542]

@@Schilani The most complicated thing would honestly be the math more than metagaming, though metagaming is hard to deal with too. The best rule for D&D is to try to skip the math as much as possible. Let RP take over for most things, instead of relying on a die roll. Dice rolling should try to be used mainly for combat only purpose, and be a little looser for RP things like social encounters. DMs should think more along the lines of "Would this NPC be convinced to do this at all, no matter what the dice roll?" Definitely helps build NPC personality to be more natural instead of just numbers based. For example, that 20 stat Charisma Bard would still be more likely to persuade someone with a Nat 1 than that 8 Charisma Barbarian with a Nat 20. So less rolling for social situations makes it a bit more fun for most players

[@Schilani]

@@nyxnightmare3542 I am even going a bit further with that one. Because while I certainly like to throw some fun combat encounters around, I certainly don't shy away from having an encounter be resolved even -after- initiative was rolled. I am not paying too much attention with that 6 second rule for combat rounds. So if somebody uses Calm Emotions in combat and tries to reason with the enemy why it is a bad idea... more power to them. Also I barely use Inspiration at all (mainly because I figured out my players just simply don't remember it), so whenever I think "I like how they are acting right now", then they pretty much get a guaranteed success. They still like to do roles for a lot of weird stuff, including doing insight checks against other party members. Or even more ridiculous, just randomly rolling if they can make it down the set of 200 stairs without falling. And the answer to the last one is usually: Somebody will fall. My players are just weird like that.

[@ericement6568]

Great content: the back and forth between different views is really nice and a great way to elevate your audience with those RPG moments

[@HeartlandHunny]

Y’all should do more of these; this was a lot of fun! I especially appreciate y’all trying to look at a situation from all sides. The internet could do with more of that. 😂

[@catward9417]

Before I played in my last campaign, the DM apparently joked “you walk into a room and there are 5 liches.” And months later, we get into the top of the archwizards tower for a magical city being seized by undead. And we find 4 liches in the room, one of which the arch wizard herself, an arch wizard for the capital city that had already fallen and the dead party mentor. After the rest of the party finished freaking out, we escaped by running down to the next level of the tower and disintegrated a wall to GTFO cause the last liche had caught us on his way upstairs. They were sorcerer liches that followed Tiamat. They let us escape and we were able to eventually defeat them. It was great!

[@Maninawig]

7:30 "My therapist suggested I become a passport bro so that I can play D&D" 9:01 Finally, I always wanted to become Duke's friend.

[@PhilosophicallyAmerican]

I liked it. You two have a nice dynamic and you actually try to dig beneath the surface layer and see what is actually happening. Most people who do this on KZbin just read the article and blindly agree with the poster.

[@dposcuro]

I got all excited for "They all cast FIREBALL!" because I thought it was going to be something I am hoping happens in my current campaign. And it...did....just in the wrong direction. Having all of the mages on the same initiative count? As Duke said, dude went in knowing he was aiming to kill PCs. In my campaign, we have a sorceror and my artillerist with fireball...plus one of our NPC companions is an Evoker Wizard....with fireball. We've been looking for a time to pull out the triple Kamehameha...

[@Schilani]

As a DM I can just say: Best of luck to you! Having the party cast multiple fireballs on the same spot is always fun, or seeing them just blow up half the battlefield because some enemy turned invisible and they just want to make sure to hit it. Using fireball against the party on the other hand is just... lame. It's really lame and loses flavor real fast, if every enemy with spellslots is just pulling out the nukes.

[@michaelstowe2167]

Your skits are fantastic, but I love that you've also expanded to make tips and advice videos. Keep it up!

[@metalhed2]

I liked this kind of content. I liked how you tried to show two sides of the story. Your wife had some good points. Too many times these stories are only one sided when usually the truth is somewhere in between.

[@RaethFennec]

This is great! The back and forth and different perspectives are refreshing. Most of the time when multiple people talk about D&D issues together for content, they're very similar in opinion and so while they might play devil's advocate to spice things up, they end up being just a couple people sharing the same thoughts they already agree on.

[@ceilinh6004]

This makes me appreciate my DM (who happens also to be my brother. He is a very experienced DM, but I and the rest of my family had either never played or had 40+ year hiatus (perents) since their last game. When we roll for initiative, DM rolls for every individual NPC, even if there are a dozen of them, and when he's going after a particular character, he will explain why he's doing it (x sees y as the biggest threat at the moment, because z.) This is particularly helpful, given that two of our party members are my 9 and 11 year old children. It would be very easy for an 11 year old to take it personally that everyone's out to kill their cleric character. LOL Another thing DM did that helped, was that before we started the game "for real" he did a practice session in which he pitted us against a Beholder, to put the strength (weakness. LOL) of our characters in to perspective, while letting us try a few things. It was, of course, a TPK, but since we all knew it was practice, it was fine, and it was a great way to give us a little taste of what it's like to play TTRPGs.

[@shard_the_sage1320]

I always like banter stuff like this, it was great seeing you guys discuss scenarios and give advice. The best one being "Good luck"

[@MrZonehawk]

I saw your video about burnout. I really enjoy this format. You could do this forever and i could watch it all.

[@squeethemog213]

This was really interesting. I really enjoy the discussion aspect to this and hope you guys do it again 😃

[@gmjjjones]

Also love the DM perspective. I always say i build the world, and the players write the story. If they go far off from the plot i anticipated, there's a new plot coming soon and improv happening immediately

[@Schilani]

Depending on the plot it's also fair to have a bit of outside discussion when the party just finds the "wrong" direction the most appealing. Or just switch the location for the plot around, if the party is just too dense to figure out obvious hints. But if you are up for the complete sandbox experience, then that's fine as well.

[@gmjjjones]

@Schilani I try to avoid that as long as the group has a shared goal, but I've definitely done session re-zero and such to help establish those discrepancies and if we need to adjust. Locations definitely 🤣🤣 the number of games that stalled because I couldn't get them to some specific building when all I really had to do was bring the plot their location.

[@Schilani]

@@gmjjjones Just recently I had a fun little discussion about something like that with my group. They talked about how it would be a shame to ignore a dungeon after I put several hours into setting everything up. I simply said "You are free to ignore the dungeon. But that doesn't mean the dungeon is ignoring you as well." That kinda led to some fun comments and now I am on the side designing a dungeon that actually moves around. It certainly won't come into play for at least 6 more months, but I like to keep things in my back pocket :D

[@gmjjjones]

@Schilani excellent use of the DM toolkit 🤣 I'm gonna use that line when it's relevant next

[@redeyefroggie1968]

Loved this! It's definitely going to help me see spits where I'm weak as a DM as well as what to avoid in other areas. The two sides shown also helps!

[@QuadalupeThe3rd]

Once wile me and my friend (let's just call him Dave) were talking I brought up dnd and that I had been playing for a long time. He got interested in the game and asked if we could play. Of course, I said yes, it was my favorite game after all. I tagged my DnD party and said we were starting a new campaign. But there was a problem, the Dm was on a vacation, and I had hyped this campaign at the point that it had to happen. As the most experienced player, I had to Dm. I was nervous because I had never Dm'd any campaign, so I was nervous. The first session was just me and Dave leaning both. It didn't take a long time for me to realize that he had watched alot of anime, so he expected to be the super overpowered main caracter and always complained about the enemies being to strong and him being to weak. The next session he complained even more when the most skilled member of the group (let's call him Sam) a warlock, did a tactical combo that caused alot of dmg, Dave said that he was cheating and demanded a buff. This continued for 3 sessions when the druid (let's call her Sarah) had the idea to make Dave the party leader on the condition that he stopped complaining, everyone agreed. The rest of the session went great and everyone lived happily ever after. Until the next session when he forgot the promise and started taxing the party 25% of all money they get. I decided to paralyze him so "he can't move it move it anymore" for the rest of the campaign. Everyone except him was happy.

[@altanaschattentanz]

I reallyl ove that kind of format :) Makes me thinking about my own actions. Not just in a RPG-setting, but also in friendships etc. That first story hit hard, thinking how that "controlling" might have felt. Trying to help (because graphic etc is his turf) and trying to help out his friend but that's maybe just misunderstood (maybe wrong wording, maybe wronge tone whatever, maybe it really is just ill intent, maybe it's just his way of trying to participate and make everyone happy but fails horribly). What could have prevented ALL of that (or maybe not, but most likely prevented it as Amy said) if they would have talked so much sooner, maybe at the beginning. They are both at fault for not adressing it sooner, making it go sour and at the brink of destroying their friendship. It's sad that we only see one side of the story and not both but it still makes you think about yourself and others. So thank for doing this

[@angiep2229]

I really love seeing the therapist side of these horror stories. It adds something that the other horror story channels (which I greatly enjoy) don't have.

[@ArchieNox]

I know the feeling of the first one for sure. I have a good friend of mine in my current campaign, we've been family friends since elementary school. Great guy, I love him and everything but something about the way he plays rubs me the wrong way. He has this... apparatus he's created in multiple campaigns that I said "no" to and he kept fighting it. It's essentially a bag of healing potions and a straw kept under his armour where when he gets knocked unconscious he "purposefully falls on his stomach" so that it squeezes the potion into his mouth. I tried to explain that while unconscious you dont have the wherewithal to consciously drink the potion and swallow it. His argument was "but it would still be on my skin so it would heal me" which is not how potions work.

[@thatbloxguy5432]

Lancer! I really want to play it so much. It is a fun mech sci-fi ttrpg!

[@derrickhaggard]

I want to play it as well.

[@thatbloxguy5432]

What mech would you run? I can't decide between Caliban or Zheng.

[@TigerStyleFanMIZ]

I enjoyed this! Many times it's one person giving their thoughts, but I find it more interesting when there's 2 or more.

[@DaTimmeh]

Green isn’t a good color for outside?!?!? EXCUSE ME

[@RabblesTheBinx]

I feel like this is the guy who coded Ultima 8...

[@gaelofariandel6747]

I'm first time DMing with a toxic player. Hate it, but I want to see this campaign through.

[@MrHarshverdhan]

Toxic as in how exactly?

[@gaelofariandel6747]

@@MrHarshverdhan In short, he's an a$$hole, doesn't like things aren't going the way he wants even when it's entirely RAW (I love thematic changes & reflavoring but rules stay the same) & talks ALLLLL the time. 50% of the interactions we have are talking past him. He's my brother so I can ignore 90% of it but it builds up. He ran up to a miniboss, used all of his uses of Dragonbreath, got hit twice by the boss & by 2 of the mooks, flew away on his once per day wings, all in 2 turns then fussed that he neded a long rest after one fight & nearly died (89 HP to 55 BTW & complained that he nearly died while ignoring our healer & Death Saves).

[@tatersalad76]

How are they being toxic? You may be able to help them curb their worse traits as a player

[@gaelofariandel6747]

@@tatersalad76 He's my brother. I've known him 31 years & I guarantee you that won't happen. The only reason I keep him around is if I kick him, only 1 more person has to leave to make it a 2 person party. Not sure it would still go on after that.

[@tatersalad76]

​@@gaelofariandel6747 Okay, so how are they being toxic in-game?

[@bronsonneill2944]

Im super happy to hear the first story in this vid involved my favorate ttrpg LANCER:an rpg about mechs! I think it was cleaver of OP to use the names of the players mechs(or classes for non lancer players) as there names in the stroy.

[@andrewpeterson3302]

The problem with a lot of ttrpg players is that they are shy, passive, not confrontational. Its ok to pull someone aside to explain that they are hurting the experience for yourself and others. Be up front, be bold, and put your foot down. Its good life experience that can benefit you later on in life.

[@kumonoameai]

This was a really good video. I think it's really nice to see two people discussing these types of situations, as well as how to avoid them/what causes them beyond the game. I'd love to see more videos like these of the two of you ^.^

[@antonelagioscio7454]

I really enjoyed this video and all your insights in it. I hope you do some more like this 💕

[@Lillyluri]

I was really intrigued by the professional perspective in the first one! That's actually setting this video apart from other channels doing reflections on the topic.

[@mikeesplace]

It's really interesting you've started discussing TTRPG horror stories, as I've been a longtime fan of OSQ and just got into some other TTRPG horror story channels

[@MMX17]

I have an online group of friends that I play DnD with. Our first time playing it was back in 2021. I think at the time we only had 2 players that were DnD veterans or at least experienced in DnD. Over time one of the experienced players, lets call him "Jay", expressed how he was not enjoying the campaign. The rest of the party including the DM tried to make slight changes to make sure everyone would have fun. Two years later, we have several campaigns running rotating weekly. "Jay" still nitpicks things every now and then, hates that we break character, dislikes fights that build character and pose no risk to us actually getting killed in game, and purposefully creates outbursts that disrupts the game to express an issue he has instead of talking to the DM directly either before or after a session. The funniest thing is he seems very eager to "help" point out what someone is doing wrong in a DnD game, but has no intention in running a campaign or being a DM. We currently have 3 rotating DMs as well. Recently he tried to force a lvl up since its been some time since we last had major story progression when the DM has been focusing on world building, keep in mind everyone else is ok with this and happy with their characters.

[@GamesProject]

I remember a campaign I got on Anima Beyond Fantasy. So our DM, I'll call him Alex, was part of group of friends where he's also a player in another campaign. He added me to the team, found a way for me to meet the group and go with them. Basically, I was an elf disguised as a human (Access to Destruction, Creation and Illusion Book which was allegedly stupidly op for my level) working for an organization that turned against her at the moment of their meeting. My character was pretty social based and not combat based but had an interesting twist to it : She's a psychopath wanting to eradicate humanity and had mastered an outlandish amount of spells made for torture (ranging from sense removal to memory wiping to literally removing from existence). Here's the problem : I didn't do her background. The WHOLE character was forced onto me and half the time, I couldn't even control it because the DM forced me into actions I didn't want to do. Alex is also a master of lore and DUMPED lore as if we were reading an encyclopedia which made the whole sessions unbearable. After only 2 sessions I called quit because I wasn't interesting to spectate. However, the character idea will be kept for other campaigns... not run by Alex.

[@clonedelta22]

"Can I clap?" "Can the oath of throwing it back paladin?"

[@legendsonpaper]

A little long on repetitive discussion, but over all an enjoyable format as the two of you debate the pros and cons of each issue. Give us more! Also, I have to comment on the whole fireball thing. I get the combat economy of stacking the party's adversaries into a single initiative if they are fighting a bunch of kobolds or zombies, still, any group of creatures capable of taking out the party so quickly need to each have their own initiative. Is the party all on the same initiative as well? Imagine how THAT would change the dynamic of any encounter . . .

[@SprinkleBunn]

They do end up going in circles, i end up skipping a lot tbh

[@g-owl]

I do think it would be fun to see you reading these horror stories and then doing a skit for them. Kind of a good way to combine the casual chill demeanor of the video with the skit based humor you are known for. And i mean, I think you could have had fun with the 5 fireballs (in a skit, not in a game).

[@dajemu9155]

This story I am about to share is the reason I took up being the forever DM. We were playing pathfinder and approached a weapon shop. Special NPC that everyone but my character knew. I saw a +2 dagger on the wall and I decided to ask the DM if the dagger was special beyond the +2. I could use detect magic due to a race benefit and roled a nat 20. The DM said there was nothing special beyond the +2. So I asked to steal it. First the NPC was distracted by the party and doing special interactions with them. Secondly I rolled a nat 20 to steal it without being caught. Thirdly I told the DM I would likely return it as a joke later. Dm decided the NPC noticed me turned around broke my arms (yes both) and then we left town we were ambushed by 20 zombies (party of 4) everyone else got 2 zombies each. I got 14 (mind you I was in the center of the group because they all said they would protect me.) The zombies walked past everyone else to get to me. I was mauled to death turn 2 and told I had to sit out for a hour and a half. It was so bad to the entire party decided to leave the DMs house. That was my first exspierence with pathfinder and it took me 2 years to try the game again and now I made a entire world and am actively leading 3 campaign.

[@robindom.2186]

We had some seasons where the dm brought his brother as a player. One season the brother was smoking... green leafed stuff before the season, fell asleep for most of the campaign and when he woke up he did stuff like stealing a chair and a bucket, in a chase scene a while after that he just decided to sit on his chair, put his bucket on his head and sing in the middle of the street... needless to say he was never invited him to another season again.

[@angelaoneal5169]

My very first campaign (MANY moons ago), we played for a couple of years at least once a week sometimes for entire weekends. My best friend played a character we will call Prince Marco. My character we will call Violet. We decided before the campaign even started that Prince Marco and Violet would be engaged to be married. During the course of the campaign, it became obvious that Violet and Marco should break up. My friend, in real life, got so mad at me for my character breaking up with her character. The rest of the party and I just looked at each other and silently agreed it was time to end the campaign. You need to be very careful with riding that line between fantasy and reality.

[@ryanhunter2042]

I love this format. Please do more. 😁

[@dainbramage781]

I love this dynamic. Would love to see more episodes.

[@clairerose9322]

Definitely want to see more of these!!!

[@mordin5590]

This is a great video! I like the idea of even watching a series of different conflict resolution videos like this one.

[@abdelrahmanayman1356]

TL;DR: Communication between DM and Players post game is cruicial, in my opinion. Hey man, love your content. I'd like to add to the conversation a little bit on the first story. I am a new DM myself for a group of new players (we're like best friends at work and outside of it), and I have this guy that got the game and rules very quickly, and soon enough he was a very good rules lawyer at the table to the point it sometimes grinds combat to a screeching halt. First time I picked up on it I immediately talked to him 1 on 1 after the session to reduce the behaviour. Thankfully he's an understanding guy, but he tends to repeat that every couple of sessions, so I kind of have to do "the talk" every now and then. He doesn't seem to mind, and his intentions are good, I believe. So I agree with your points, it is crucial to pick up these things early and communicate with your table clearly and often. I have a lot of time on my hands outside work, so I follow up every session with 1on1 calls/texts/etc to gague the players and gather feedback before starting prep for next session

[@Grimlocksmith]

Just found this channel. I will watch however many of discussions like this that you produce.

[@robertwilliams1095]

we need more of you two together

[@Shironite]

I relate to the problem player from the first one so much. I've since had it voiced to me that the behaviour I show is ruining it for others, so I'm trying to fix it. But I get it, I get excited and jump in, I'm a rules lawyer because the mechanics are what I love. Again, I'm trying to be better for others sake, but it does suck that I have to give up the part I like the most for the others sake. Also, slight pet peeve on when rule is being misunderstood or isn't known about (DM hasn't stated they're home-brewing the rule), I'm trying to be helpful when I point it out but my help is often not welcome, and sometimes they won't even correct it afterwards, simply stating "it's how we play this campaign" (again, there had been no previous mention of it, and I wasn't the only new member of the group). Just feels like I'm being shit on, yunno. Anyway, I try to just keep quiet at the table nowadays, because I don't wanna ruin it for the others.

[@kileyhanson1203]

This was fun to hear and to also talk through and get your guys opinions. Also I feel it could be fun to open up and get viewer horror stories because boy-oh-boy I know I've got some juicy ones that you guys could have fun with talking over. I also agree that having an overly-helpful and overstepping player can put a damper on the game for the rest of the group. I know a guy that he just loves to argue with whoever is DM/GM-ing over rules and logistics to the point of dude, just drop it because it's only fun for you at this point.

[@emogirl71187]

hi, yes, more pls. TY u two are doing a great job together in front of the camera. like ur clips a lot. TY for brithen up my days everytime i come to ur channel! 🤗 greez JD

[@Person-bo7ol]

11:21 as a player who loves making spellcasters 10/10 tactics there

[@h.s.6269]

I enjoy the casual chats like this mixed in with the regular stuff. Skits are fun but so id just hanging out, lol.

[@Giggles0805]

I loved this, would love to see more

[@felisleo101]

Loved this. The two of you are very insightful, and I love DM Horror stories. Please do more.

[@SilverTune]

I love just sit down and chat type videos so I would totally watch more of these

[@Barthenn]

Love this content. It was fun to see you guys read horror stories and then talk about your perspective. I hope you guys do it again.

[@srumorhasit]

loved it especially the hubby/wifey energy it was awesome you don't see enough paired gamers! :) love you both and congrats on the little one! I wish you a safe and happy delivery! :)

[@Tempest7053]

Now we need a one shot questers and critcrab callab

[@hiro4344]

I'd love to see more content like this. It's always interesting to learn from other people's DnD experiences. I might tell my own horror story of how my old group's campaign died. I feel kind'a like the DM also just had enough of being a DM to a bunch of somewhat chaotic stupid people, because it was through his own actions that he nuked things kind of as punishment, only later he *did* try to figure a way to salvage it. At the same time I moved away and I've always been the voice of reason. Drowned out as I often was because of my quiet voice.

[@denmoore92]

Yeah more of this would be awesome. I liked the real insights from you both

[@DarklyYours]

Aww, nerdy couples are so cute.

[@seanferris4507]

I can relate a bit to the dm in story 2 when it comes to how I run combat, but in my game I also have a dozen loopholes to bring a character back to life, whether it paying a cleric at a church or resurrecting the player then and there

[@seanferris4507]

To clarify, my players were made aware that I was going to make the game difficult to survive, but in turn I wouldn't run perma-death

[@Schilani]

@@seanferris4507 That's probably the best to do anyway. Make death a threat, but unless the player is okay with it, don't make it permanent. Hurting their wallet for a few hundred gold can do wonders already.

[@seanferris4507]

@@Schilani I agree and since it's my first campaign as a dm I want to enjoy it as much as they do, so far my only issue has been underestimating a party of 6

[@Schilani]

@@seanferris4507 It's far better to underestimate your party, than to overestimate them. Giving them a challenge that in hindsight was way too high of a bar and caused you to fudge roles, health and other stuff a lot feels a lot worse, than giving your party a shooting gallery, because they just stomp the dungeon without any issue. I tend to underestimate how efficient my group can be quite a bit, but that also comes from my complete openness towards homebrew classes. Although I reign in overpowered or underpowered stuff from their homebrews a lot, when it just gets too chaotic.

[@seanferris4507]

@@Schilani I embrace homebrew and since I'm running a bit of a power trip fantasy I try not to reign things in too much. One of my players is running a Dragon Knight fighter subclass they found for their fighter and another is running the Guardian Domain cleric from the Steinhart book MonkeyDM put out It has taken a lot of patience, but I'm having fun and so are they. I haven't run too many actual dungeons since I don't have resources for making maps but they seem to be having a blast despite it. They cleared out a small keep with their most recent quest and get to turn it into their base

[@rickandmortyplaysvideogame4580]

Man my last session started and there was just an immediate in character argument about the last boss fight they had and somehow after an hour of that they still managed to do everything I had planned that session just not in the expected order which is fine. To any DMs out there just use this story as an example of "Hey just because they didn't immeadiately do the plot doesn't mean they won't do it when they wish to"

[@JMD031]

New rocks fall. Wizards show up, fireball everything.

[@ZapStrideGaming]

That first one upset me cuz like you said, if you wanna play, you do anything you can to do so, even if it doesnt look the greatest. A perfect example of my experiences with D&D is a couple times i played it strictly online with people, and it was entirely text based. We used screenshots of our stats and dice rolls to have vidible proof for players that we aren't lying about what rolls and stats we got. We did it all text only, and just played whenever one of us had time for our turn or our dialogue in the campaign, rarely did we have scheduled days of all of us being there. Even when we did, one or two players were late here and there, which we were fine with. All this craziness and random times we contributed were just so we could all play this campaign. And that was my first ever time doing a campaign. Point is, if we did that and still had fun, that guy had no reason to nitpick everything about the GM's map and campaign. That guy either wanted to GM the whole time and was trying to do so via little things in hopes GM quit and he could take the reins for himself (which he did try to do onceGM had enough clearly), or he just was super serious about the game and cared so much he decided to be a perfectionist, even at the cost of everyone's ability to enjoy the campaign. Edit:i would love to see more of this

[@monroerobbins7551]

I had a similar problem with my current group: they are chaotic murder hobos, and one week while I was gone, they burned down a whole village and Eldritch blasted a child, point blank. This was against everything my character stood for, and it made me question if I wanted to play. After talking with my group, they agreed to be better. I made a new character to swap out, one that fit the campaign better, and honestly fit my play style better. Recently there was an argument that led me to get off the call, just to catch my breath and calm down, and when I came back, everyone was apologizing profusely. We’ve gotten a lot better as a group, and I’m planning on trolling them next time we play together (with the DM’s consent, obvs) by giving them magical gag gifts. We’ve gotten a lot better by communicating, including my employing my anger management skills, cause while I don’t get angry per say, I do get animated.