Axe FX 2 Engl Savage Model vs Engl e530 Tube Preamp

[@tomcootemusic]

UPDATE: Having now bought a Two Notes Torpedo Captor load box, I have started to experiment with recording directly from my Engl 840 valve power amp, rather than just from my Engl e530 valve preamp. I found that the Tube Pre model in the Axe FX definitely improved the sound of just the e530 preamp going directly to IRs (according to Cliff, the founder of Fractal Audio : "If you only need power amp modeling, for example when using an external pre-amp through the Axe-Fx, use the Tube Pre model"). But although the guitar sounded fine on it's own, it really didn't sound as good as it should, in this video, when in a full mix with bass and drums. Using the Torpedo load box with the real Engl 840 power amp resulted in a very noticeable improvement. Something else that I have been experimenting with, is using just the preamp part of Axe FX models with the real Engl tube power amp. The most common way to do this, is to go to the Power Supply page in the Amp block and set Supply Sag to 0, with an FX loop send after the amp block going to the power amp (via the bypassed Engl preamp in my case). This worked well but the Engl power amp made all the preamp models sound a bit too Engl-ish! To counter this, I actually left the Supply Sag on the Axe FX on, so that it sounded more like the original amp model while still adding the clarity, definition and tube compression, that you can from a good quality valve power amp. Let me know if you would like me to make another video to show off my improved attempts at bedroom recording. At the moment I'm a little wary of doing anything on social media that might be seen as a criticism of Fractal Audio - I actually ended up taking down my 8 string Axe FX vs Engl video because of this - but hopefully some people will be open minded enough to realise that other tools are available!

[@khalilhabib9607]

Both sound awesome. The engl sounded thicker and fuller. But both are great

[@ShaunNelson]

The E530 by a long way.

[@kimblez]

axe fx sounded like a bit reduced MP3 -- the real Engl sounded like butter

[@Bushprowler]

Kinda prefer the E530.

[@ChrisCCastro]

E530 wins... Axe FX is a digital toy, you can't compare it to real gear.

[@tomcootemusic]

I found that real amps tend to sit better in a dense mix and you don't need loads of volume automation for solos, like you do with the Axe FX. But I can get some excellent clean sounds from the Axe FX and I suspect that modellers might come into their own with the increased range from 8 string guitars. Would be interested to know if you thought the e530 still worked better for heavy 8 string than the Axe FX: kzbin.info/www/bejne/iaWYaKOMpNqerJI

[@thisiscrap34]

Digital A** is what the Axe-FX sounded like!

[@tomcootemusic]

Here is a video from Leon Todd showing how to use the (neutral and digital) 'Tube Preamp' model in the Axe FX as a power amp sim for a Tube Preamp, as intended: kzbin.info/www/bejne/j5fVYWSVp8ykj5I (as well as his own Channel, Leon also does instructional videos for G66, the European distributor for Fractal Audio)

[@lushkordz6643]

The Real 1M$ Question would be IMHO = how it feels when playing the guitar 4 the playa ? coz in the mix both R oK even if the E530 has a thicker tone but i guess you can tweak the AxeFX so as you can get that kind of tone as well .....then comes the never ending debate of the AxeFX going into a Tube PA with a St.Cab or an FRFR Amp.System 3>3>3> I prefer to have one good tone (or just a few anyway the true art is to learn to use EQs) than having a thousand of fake ones

[@tomcootemusic]

I don't think there's much difference in feel when playing high gain styles but tube amps seem more responsive when playing cleaner styles with more volume dynamics. The main difference for me is that in some recordings in particular, the real tube/valve amps often seem to fit better in the mix. I have tried to compensate for this with various mixing techniques but there is a reason why most serious recordings are still done with real tube/valve amps. Having said that I tend to just use my Axe FX for making a racket in my bedroom!

[@tomcootemusic]

If anyone wants to see more of an actual playing example, rather than a sounds comparison demo, of using the Engl e530 with the Axe FX 2 as a power amp sim... kzbin.info/www/bejne/eZTdZ3qip9popZo

[@fractalaudiosystems]

Why did you not just perform a tone match? Also, TUBE PRE is NOT a power amp. It's a preamp (thus the name).

[@tomcootemusic]

Because a tone match doesn't sound the same as a real tube preamp. And I know the Tube Pre isn't a power amp but it is supposedly neutral so if you go from the FX loop into this, you can then access the power amp section to use it as a power amp sim (I copied over the settings from the the Savage model). This is something that quite a lot of Fractal users do for recording real preamps at home as it makes the preamp sound maybe 5% to 10% than if you just went straight to the IRs.

[@tomcootemusic]

This approach is a common alternative to using a load box from a power amp, if you don't have a load box, and it isn't practical to mic up a cab at home. Although if you don't have an Axe FX you could also use the free Ignite power amp sim!

[@mikehawke2172]

Potato camera, revolutionary gear

[@iloveitall]

Awful!

[@tomcootemusic]

Thanks.