AXIS 1300 flight record attempt & product review for lake foil surfing

FAVORITE FOILS
1 | Wake Thief Edition ($2,200)
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2 | Slingshot Budget ($1,000)
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3 | Waydoo Budget Electric ($5,400)
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4 | Flite Performance Electric ($13,700)
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5 | Foil Drive Gen 2 ($8,400)
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6 | Beta Freefoil ($4,600)
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Affiliate Disclosure:
We’ve tried 300+ foils & have shared our experience in 100+ videos. Our recommendations are based on our desire to promote the best products. When viewers use our links and coupon code, we earn a commission. We have established a long list of affiliate partners. This allow us to earn a commission from the sale of nearly every brand. We believe this helps to eliminate any bias from our reviews and recommendations. We want to be transparent with our viewers, so we disclose our financial interests. Wake Thief has affiliate / financial arrangements with AXIS Foils, Takuma, Fliteboard, Beta Foils, Foil Drive, MACKiteboarding, REAL Watersports, Green Hat Kiteboarding, Bbtalkin, and Vibram. The above links are affiliate links, which mean we earn a commission if you purchase through our links. We thank you for your support of our channel and mission.
Safety Warning:
This sport is dangerous. Please be safe. We’d encourage you to thoroughly review all product safety material prior to trying. If you don’t feel safe, do not proceed. This sport is not as easy as it looks. It took us many hours of practice, but we enjoyed the journey. Please use a CGA life vest. Please wear a helmet to protect your head. Please wear a wetsuit to protect from cuts from any sharp edges. Please proceed at your own risk. We review products and share our own personal experience. If you rely on the information in this video, you assume responsibility for results. Wake Thief, LLC.

[@D1uwant]

Wow, I really appreciate how consistent your tests are, and the results are so revealing. Thank you for your informative videos!

[@WakeThief]

Thanks, Dave. To be honest, I start testing a wing and am always surprised. I'm attracted to how complex it is ... and I'm still learning so much. Appreciate the comment. Thank you.

[@D1uwant]

@@WakeThief It's great to be learning along with you, there's still so much to learn about these foils - you are our test pilot.

[@HunterGie]

Im just starting to contemplate getting into hydrofoil lake surfing up here in Colorado and your videos have made it a lot easier for me to decide on getting a foil set up. Great content, great analysis and amazing comparisons. Great work bro! Keep it up

[@WakeThief]

Thanks Hunter! Your comment made my day. I love learning and love that sharing it helps so many folks. If I can ever be helpful pls reach out [e-mail]

[@robbrown8234]

really cool what you are doing! i love that foil testing! great man!!

[@WakeThief]

Thanks, Rob. I’m having a blast. Appreciate the comment

[@ryanwolf7252]

Great Video! nice work on the ghosting for glide tests. Super impressed by the video. thanks fot the information

[@WakeThief]

Thank you! I’m enjoying learning, making the vids and sharing my learnings as much as foiling! I hope it continues. Appreciate the comment!

[@JeanMichelTrivi]

OMG over 2mn of pumping!!! You're a beast! Great videos, I love your methodology.

[@WakeThief]

Thanks Jean-Michel. It’s a lot less impressive if you’ve tried the AXIS 1150. Thanks so much for the comment!

[@drlv3250]

You mean the 1150 works better?

[@clayisland]

I appreciate you doing apples to apples tests, helps further my understanding and deciding what wing might be perfect for whatever conditions come up.

[@WakeThief]

Thank you! If you have any other foils you think I should test I’d love to know. Appreciate the comment

[@PronatorTendon]

The scientific approach to this is very gratifying, you explain your data points and really leave little room for doubt, despite caveats for environmental factors

[@WakeThief]

Thank you, Ρrσηατσr. Unfortunately, I am struggling to figure out the science behind why this didn't work better, and I still can't find a reason other than foil section, but I can't explain it with foil section alone. I love the complexity of this sport. If the answer came quickly, and easily, I'd probably find another healthy distraction from life :)

[@RojoF150]

I really appreciate the time you put in to make this review! Coming from a fellow east coast lake foiler, I love seeing how wings do with no swells or winds!

[@WakeThief]

Thanks Thomas! I appreciate the comment. We gotta make the most of our east coast lakes. I still see so few folks on foils and scratch my head as to why ... I assume it's complexity (hard to know what to buy), price ($1500+ is a lot), and challenge (it took me many hours to learn how pump!). Thanks again.

[@RojoF150]

@@WakeThief Absolutely! I have a 2019 AK Foil Kit, but I am looking to upgrade my foil so I can maximize my pumping efficiency

[@armadillock1320]

Excellent video again! So helpful! Well done!

[@WakeThief]

Thank you! Still learning, so the search goes on. Appreciate you taking the time to send your thanks!

[@vladislavkuba5837]

again and again, you are the best!

[@WakeThief]

Thanks Vlad. I’m still enjoying the search so the search goes on!

[@jonathankerner2094]

Really terrific video! As a viewer I can see everything your camera work camera angles camera distances etc. very effective. The tone overall the music where there is some is nice and the information is presented logically and completely. Really well done.

[@WakeThief]

Thank you, Jonathan. I look back at my first video last June in shock. I’ve never edited a video before but like anything in life (including foiling), the more hours you clock the better ones gets! I so appreciate the comment.

[@jonathankerner2094]

@@WakeThiefThanks, my pleasure. I am receiving shipment of my Armstrong 2400 today. I'll eventually be able to let you know how that goes!

[@WakeThief]

@@jonathankerner2094 please let me know. I’ve always wanted to try the Armstrong 2400

[@kalmanb]

Fantastic review, very informative, thanks!

[@WakeThief]

Thank you, Kalman! Good to hear from you. Glad it could help.

[@rullywk9746]

Your review always informative and inspiring me Dev...👍👍

[@WakeThief]

Rully! Great to hear from you. I'm looking forward to hearing how your first run goes on your foil!

[@rullywk9746]

@@WakeThief bad weather here Dev. After the fisherman boat accident, yesterday air plane crash in Indonesia. Monsoon wind...., I'm very happy just to see you ride on the foil from this channel..make me imagine i ride same foil like you before i make it real 🤗😊

[@WakeThief]

Good luck Rully. Lots of tragedies in Indonesia. I am sorry to hear it. I look forward to seeing your foil in action once you get back in the water.

[@TheLifeofRich]

I wish I had found your videos before I had purchased my MFC hydros 1250. I see myself purchasing an axis high aspect foil now. LOL. Great info

[@WakeThief]

Thank you. Please don’t hesitate to reach out if I can help. [e-mail]

[@Justin-bw8zi]

Fascinating! As always, so well done and objective lens. Such a great learning relative to import of low speed lift (the AC75s are learning this same light wind lesson in the America’s Cup right now :). Such a great video

[@WakeThief]

Interesting! So great to hear from you, Justin. Happy new year! I'm still loving my search for the pumping machine ... I feel like it's just beginning. I'm enthused about the progress made in our industry ... high aspect, tailored foil cross sections, and even the Kujira wing with the tubercles on the leading edge ... so much still to learn & put into practice. Great to hear from you.

[@Justin-bw8zi]

@@WakeThief Amazing what you have learned, shared, and put into practice in just one year on the lake! Yes, watching the AC75s is so amazing as it really demonstrates the power and future potential for foils. New for the 36th cup - the foils have flaps/ailerons on the that expedites lift off the water and allows the 7 ton boats to turn on a dime. It's hard to imagine - a 7 ton sailboat, the size of a tennis court, with a main sale the length of a 737 wing, going 3x the wind speed (nearly breaking 50 mph), with a crew of 11 that can turn on a dime.

[@WakeThief]

We've all learned a lot for sure and the equipment has come a very long way. I don't know much about sailing, but will dig in ... lots of good lessons learned here. Flexible front wings and rear wings would have a lot of potential here. Good to hear from you, Justin. Happy new year!

[@Justin-bw8zi]

@@WakeThief Happy New Year to you!!

[@dengordo]

I didn't expect that conclusion but it proves that your opinion is unbiased. It seems like 1300 might work very well for Wing Foiling. Well done for making this test and for a huge amount of work. Keep ripping 🤙

[@WakeThief]

Thank you, Den Go Windsurf! I appreciate you taking the time to leave a comment. I've heard from a few others that it's a great wind winging foil, but unfortunately my lake doesn't get great wind, so wasn't able to try it. Best wishes.

[@freddy82]

Great review!

[@WakeThief]

Thanks, Fred. If you have any foils you'd like me try, please let me know.

[@agrelon]

Very interesting end result!

[@WakeThief]

Thanks, agrelon. Like most of my review / tests, I didn't expect the result. Thanks for the comment.

[@lazylaserlars]

Thanks for this great review! I just started foiling last summer and I learned a lot from your comparisons. I used to fly sailplanes and am fascinated by wings, shapes and profiles. Love the evolution in this sport. Maybe one day we can even pump on flexible wings and use them to push forward like manta rays...😊

[@WakeThief]

That would be amazing. Any insights from your sailplane experience you can share? That's a field that's been around a long time. I'm certain there's lessons learned. Thanks for the comment.

[@lazylaserlars]

Nothing that you wouldn‘t know already. High aspect shapes have good glide, thinner profiles need more speed to fly. Basics seem to be the same in the air and water. The industry seems to have progressed a lot with shapes lately. There might be some development in winglet and rear wing design in the future..?

[@lazylaserlars]

One interesting aspect of sailplane wing design are the tons of different profiles being used. Not sure how much of this transfers into the water. But for flying, profiles play a huge role.

[@WakeThief]

Thanks Lars. It is the case with foils too, and for the same reason.

[@WakeThief]

Yes. HA seems relatively new to foiling. There are many rear wing types being explored. Anhedral. Winglets. Lots of potential

[@bigtone667]

I am only using my AXIS foils (1020, 1150) for winging and picked up a 1300 during the week. I did not notice a significant difference in the low end start speed between the 1150 and 1300 under constant wing power, but I certainly was getting much better glide on the 1300 with both surf swell and lake swell. Definitely agree about the 1300 being faster than the 1150. I was quite surprised.

[@WakeThief]

Hey Tony. Thanks for sharing! The glide was truly amazing! Pls keep me posted on your experience. You have a nice quiver!

[@toranaga22]

couldn't tell which way the wind was blowing, but it looked like you were going up wind during the 1300 test. I've noticed even a slight breeze with or against you makes a huge difference when pumping! Great videos! i've watched almost all of em!!

[@WakeThief]

Thanks Toranga. You're right, and it makes sense. And when I'm doing this test, I will try to do it with my wind at my back. If the wind is blowing strongly it can make a difference. I find I only need 10-15lb of pull force to keep a foil in the area (once it's flying) and wind can help or hurt that. If there's a noticeable wind I usually won't do the test.

[@robinebbing2319]

Hi there I love youre videos and Im always hyped for the next one. The reviews are Perfect. i wanted to ask if you could get hands on a Foil from Gong Galaxy it seems to have a simmilar ratio to the axis 1150 and its way cheaper for me as a beginner of foiling i have no idea how it would react to pumpfoiling and id really love to see a review first. Keep posting this content

[@WakeThief]

Thanks, Robin. I so appreciate you telling me what to try next. I only want to try wings people recommend to me. I'll add it to my list, and will try it once my lake turns back into water ... from ice.

[@jonathanreinke9392]

I second a Gong Galaxy XXL test too! I hear great things about the Moses W1100 for Windsurf and Wing Foiling. Not sure for foot pumping. Would be sweet to see how the W1100 performs to your thorough tests. "When no more ice of course" Happy Winter!

[@s2oooo]

I ride Gong in the UK. Absolutely love the standard m for light wind kitesurfing. Pro m for faster fun. Standard XL is super easy behind the boat im sure my pumping will improve with skill. Video on my page. Only downside is cheap means heavy.

[@Piros181]

Great video and thank you so much for your time to put all this together very valuable information. So 1.5 years on has your pump technique changed to maybe ride further on the HA wings . You obviously have great pump skills and be interesting to hear your opinions again. I often watch people push so hard pumping they kill the foil pump, I call it choking the foil ( just need a micro pause between pumps , let the foil do the work ) but you don't do this at all in the video your technique is great . Really interested to see where you are at now.

[@WakeThief]

Thanks Rob! I love what you do for the sport too! I have pumped the 1310 for 4min 30s. I do find there’s two types of technique. A pump technique that is shallow in amplitude that doesn’t pitch board much up and down. This tends to be for HA wings >10 with gliding foil sections that don’t sweep a very wide range of angle of attack before stalling. As HA goes down, there’s more amplitude and more pitching to try to find the max angle of attack so that you can slow down a lot … most people play it safe and pump at a speed much faster than they need to and that tires them out way to quickly … and yes, many are pumping too aggressively. I find the best way to learn is just to do it a lot!

[@fjmeza3110]

New subscriber here! Love your videos! Keep it up! 😄

[@WakeThief]

Thanks Francisco. I’m a foiling nut. What can I say. If I can ever help, don’t hesitate to ask. There aren’t many of us and the community is as fun as the learning.

[@PalmStaff]

it would be awsome to see you try the new Gong Sirius foil and hear your thoughts.

[@diegogorrieri4153]

Very interesting video. The less is drag less is lift. That's why you need higher speed and more effort to keep going.

[@WakeThief]

Yes. Exactly!

[@claudiobertadeazevedo4669]

There is a LOT of information to digest, amazingly the take off speeds are so different, as it seems the average rider is above 60-70kg plus a 3kg wet wetsuit, so the 1300 will be for feather light riders, unless there is a specific stabilizer for that. AWESOME review down to earth You pointed the sweet spot between size and aspect ratio, there is a limit and it seems the 1150 is very clos to ideal if not so.

[@WakeThief]

Thanks, as always, Claudio, for your thoughtful comments. I think 1150 is a good fit for me and what I want to do. And I think 1300 will be a fit for other applications and rider weights.

[@jonathanreinke9392]

Awesome review! Sence you posted your teaser video I have been looking forward to this video. Thanks for making. :) Sence your Axis 1150 is still your favorite for foot foil pumping. Do you have a prediction on which sport ... Wing / Surf / Sup / Kite / Windsurf / Wake the Axis 1300 would be best suited for?

[@WakeThief]

Thanks, Jonathan! I think the 1300 would be good at SUP down winding & winging. I've heard folks who are experienced in those disciplines say the 1300 has been performing well there.

[@jonathanreinke9392]

Awesome, Thanks!

[@mikemularczyk1574]

Amazing review! Which one of the Moses wings do you think meets your 1050's performance in glide time? I love how you do those siper smooth 360's 👌😎

[@WakeThief]

Thanks Mike. I would expect similar but not exact performance if you compare area and wingspan and volume (a good proxy for thickness) of any two wings. It’s hard to measure the foil section but you should be able to get close here but of course the devils in the details. Thanks for the comment.

[@EpicGust]

amazing. you got a sub! :)

[@WakeThief]

Thank you. If you have any ideas of foils you’d like me to try, please let me know.

[@Mrkitesurfdude]

Nice reviews looking forward to some new ones. Maby you could try a base plate shim, when you are pumping the nose is quite upwards the whole time, in this way i lose some forward momentum a base plate shim would solve this.

[@WakeThief]

Yes! You’re so right. We completed this review quite awhile ago and since learned that we could do this. And you’re spot on about it. kzbin.info245B6SfsPY0?feature=share

[@JeffreyJDavis]

Very detailed and objective analysis. I love the groms' analysis of expected performance. So if a wing like this isn't a lake pump world record setter and it's understandablly difficult to roll and yaw, what to you think the expected use case is? Downwind pump SUP? Disclamer: I ride Moses 1100 for wingfoiling and Moses 633 for kiting.

[@WakeThief]

Thanks, Jeffrey. The funny thing is that my groms had isolated exactly what I would learn with no prior knowledge ... LOL. I've heard this is a good wind wing (fast, low drag). I suspect it would be good at downwind provided you could pop up on it (its doesn't lift as well as the AXIS 1150). I continue to hear about Moses. I need to try some. Based on what I'm doing, do you have a recommended front wing I should secure and try / review?

[@JeffreyJDavis]

@@WakeThief you are kind of an uberniche rider with prolly a fiddlercrab like oversized right quad ;-> Moses isn't really catering to the lake crowd as far as I know but probably the closest to your fave 1150 would be the 1100. 2100cm^2, 5.7AR, 246mm root chord. It's my wing foil front wing and it glides and pumps like a champ. The 1000 (987cm^2 , 10.1 AR, 135mm root chord) is like a scaled down 1300 maybe and probably has the same shortcomings, even exaggerated for your use case. I've ridden AXIS, Armstrong, Moses, all are very knowedgeable. Moses has arguably been in the business the longest of the 3 and you should consider them in your "quest for the perfect jetski wake thievery". I'm just messin wit you, I think what you do is awesome. The 633 is my go to kite foil wing, getting ready to go out for a sesh, pumps like a boss, but not for your needs most likely.

[@WakeThief]

Fiddlercrab oversized right quad. Love it. Thanks for the comment. I’ll take a closer look at Moses. Thanks for the thoughtful response. #happyfoiling

[@jonathanreinke9392]

I have watched this video multiple times now, awesome! I just saw a video by Dominic saying how good the 1300 is for a longboard style of wing and swell / surf foiling. Not much energy needed to keep going. It is cool that you two agree about the 1150 for foot pumping and I am strongly thinking about that one too. 🙂 With me using Starboard right now the Type-E 1700 is tempting as I can use my current carbon mast. Other than manuvarability that foil does not seem to be at the level of other foils. I was wondering if you had to choose only the Type-E 1700 or the Axis 1300 for foot foiling, which would you choose? Thanks!

[@WakeThief]

I’d go with the 1300 or the 1150 ahead of the starboard. Please check out by E-1700 review. I thought it was rather hard to pump. kzbin.info/www/bejne/b53JhWdplKybr5Y

[@ironphil62]

Awesome thanks Legend 👀👍🍺🍺🍺 I love the 1150 & I'm a kook just working out the pump.

[@WakeThief]

Good luck, Phil! Practice will make perfect, I promise.

[@Phil_Seu_Photography]

Great video as usual. You touched on it but when can we get more on the 1050?

[@WakeThief]

Yes! Have you seen my 1050 review? It's at this link: kzbin.info/www/bejne/joS4l5-Kd9JmpM0

[@maca5645]

Great review!. Maybe you could add a tip breach test? ,some foils can breach and ride on like nothing and others fully ventilate and dump you instantly.

[@WakeThief]

Awesome idea! Will include!

[@maca5645]

@@WakeThief Here is a cool clip of the Takuma Kujira breaching and recovering, i think the humpback fin like tubercles act like fences and prevent total ventilation of upper surface. instagram.com/tv/CHEYYrLDKXe/?igshid=uef7mzs9rb2c

[@WakeThief]

How interesting to see the shape of the water off the leading edge. I will dig into this. Thanks for sharing.

[@gcammar]

after spending the whole day testing two different foils (made for exactly the opposite goal of a pumping/gliding foil, i.e. carving/maneuverability on a breaking wave), this video feels refreshing for two reasons: 1) I'm not the only crazy guy who likes these kind of shit :) 2) we're coming to many common conclusions. Cheers!

[@WakeThief]

gcammer! Where have you been all my life! Thanks for this. Sometimes I feel crazy until I meet someone else who appreciates it. Please email me @[e-mail] or connect on facebook. Would love any insights you have on other videos, or to hear what you're learning. There's still so much to learn!

[@gcammar]

@@WakeThief looks like we are actually friends on facebook, my name is giampaolo cammarota. I don't post much there though, as I focus on my blog where I post a daily analysis of the wave/wind conditions for Maui: mauisurfreport.blogspot.com/ Here's a couple of reviews I posted on my youtube channel: kzbin.info/www/bejne/iWnFhYqlha15pLc kzbin.info/www/bejne/g3e9kqWZl8d4idk Another one you might like is this: kzbin.info/www/bejne/pXbVYYx-fq5-pLs If you come to Maui in summer time, make sure you do some downwinders. After the initial take off (which is not an easy thing), a "master pumper" like you would be flying all the way to the harbor with minimal effort... I just bought a Armstrong 1050 with 50 cm fuselage and I'm comparing it to my usual wave setup: gofoil GL120 with 12.5 tail on a short pedestal on a 24.5 mast with tuttle to tuttle extension. Those are foils that are pretty much useless for pumping on your lake, but, as I said, there's still many common findings. For example, the thickness of the profiles counts a lot! Mast and everything else included. One thing I'm pretty sure of by now is: the thicker the profile of the wing, the more lift at low speed but the less overall top speed. And vice versa. So much fun figuring it all out... let's hope this game never ends, as I enjoy it as much as the feeling of foiling! Yes, you're not alone. :)

[@dekzan]

Thanks for the videos. Any comments about motorized foils ?

[@WakeThief]

I’ve never tried one! They looks pretty amazing though.

[@Lakehouseobust]

Axis needs to make you a pumping signature set up that we can all buy "AXIS 1150 Wake Thief"

[@WakeThief]

Ha! We have a current favorite: axisfoils.com/r?id=4ob1e6. If I can help you, please feel free to email me. [e-mail]

[@llamadude7437]

the amount of wave transitions

[@foilsurf_uk]

Great review - so best at high speeds so therefore a wingwing foil over to you @DominicHoskyns

[@WakeThief]

I've heard great things about the AXIS 1300 in wing winging! I just was exchanging texts with Dominic last week and he told me he's going to give it a try! I just recommended your shop to someone in the UK looking for foils. Thanks for your comment.

[@kromerdude7]

Have you ever played around with coatings for the foils? Eg. Wax, hydrophobic (like never wet)? Or differential coatings? Like coating everything except the bottom surface to increase lift? I'm no expert, just a ChemE student who's curious. Cool vids btw! I'd love to get a foil once I graduate and have some cash lol

[@WakeThief]

I believe at these lower reynolds number, with mostly laminar flow it might not make a huge difference, but yes, I'm trying something that a friend of mine on facebook sent me and I'll report back. I also heard that sanding might help somewhat too, so will give that a try. Thanks for the suggestion!

[@pump-foil]

Looking again at this video and your conclusion on the importance of the cross section made me wonder if it is possible to define mathematical formula that can predict the stall speed of a wing when you know : surface area, average cross section and weight of the rider. I do not know how to factor in the shape of the front wing though as everybody knows high aspect has more lift than Low AR....Have you ever tried to work on this ?

[@WakeThief]

Yes you can do this! But you need to know the lift and drag coefficient of the foil section which can be found from a database, but a match needs to be made between the foil section of the wing first.

[@WakeThief]

We dove into it here and shared everything you need. I hope This helps. kzbin.info/www/bejne/i5m2pnyZp953d68

[@brentfrank7012]

I’m an avid wakeboarder and surfer, I’d really like to try this sport. I’m going to attempt to find someone local who might rent one of these.

[@timhossfeld7260]

Very cool. And very interesting. Induced drag is not your friend for sure ! Especially in water (compared to air) since it is so dense. I have one curiosity question: the video shows water coming off the back of the mast, above the water line by a few inches. Looks like a flattened rooster tail. It is hard to tell exactly what is happening, but I'd think that is a loss of efficiency? Water appears to be going turbulent down the chord of the mast. Ideally the mast would cut cleanly through the water and leave no trace it was there. Curious if you know what this effect is from? I think m perhaps the mast profile is to short and the flow is non-laminar? Could be a source of drag, perhaps a mast with a longer chord would be better? If the rooster tail is caused by flow separation turbulence, it is happening along the entire length of the mast but you are only seeing it above the water surface.....this would be a LOT of drag ! The length of the rooster tail changes with your velocity as you pump up and down too, which points to flow separation?

[@WakeThief]

Where have you been all my life, Tim?!?!?! Thank you. I think you're spot on. The shape of the AXIS mast also has a point about 3/4 of the chord length from the leading edge, where it might just trip the boundary layer. Perhaps that's triggering the rooster tail. No doubt it's an energy loss. I've always said that pumping with the wing near surface is way easier but physics says the surface drag should be higher. It leads us to think that this mast drag is bigger than it appears. Thanks for the super thoughtful comment and please stay in touch.

[@stevesantagati2264]

We emailed but never ended up speaking but I would still like to ask you a couple questions. I tried the bungee today (117’ from dock to anchor point). It didn’t work for some reason. Bungee is roughly 30’ long and stretch to over 60’. Board is 54 L. Axis 1010 and 420. I would be great to talk for a couple of minutes to see what I’m doing wrong with the set up. Thanks.

[@WakeThief]

Sounds good, Steve. I'll send you my phone number.

[@daviderwin2808]

Cant wait to build my foil kit made out of wood and fiberglass! Hope the performance can rival carbon fiber.

[@jhgrc]

Interesting video and videos on your channel and you got another subscriber. Just wondering if "Hobie MirageDrive" type of elastic flipper as stabilizator would help pumping power for more propelling forwards. Those flippers are very effective on that kayak. Because I believe power transfer to water is more from stabilizator and main foil is carrying your weight and tilting very little. The stab moves much like fish tail. With elastic fin I believe you should get much better grip to water. I even don't know if on hard pump you could cavitate the stabilizator due to very high AoA. Those Hobie fins can be purchased as spare parts but sure they would need efficient attachment to your fuselage.

[@WakeThief]

Jorge! It's a wonderful idea. We have been playing around with a "garage-style" approach to a rear wing that is spring loaded and can flap. I'll share it in an upcoming video! Not to give away the ending, but it worked much better than I expected! Great suggestion. And thanks for the sub. Pls keep the ideas coming!

[@jhgrc]

@@WakeThief staying tuned for next one.. And to correct my earlier post, not fish tail but a whale/dolphin tail.

[@WakeThief]

You bet Jorge! Thanks for the comment

[@penguinista]

I don't know if this will help but, this is like a snowboarding 'ollie'. Works better if the spine stays upright and the shoulders stay over the hips. When the butt goes sideways instead of up and down, it shoots energy backwards that could be going into the pumping motion. That also turns the board and you have to counteract somehow in order to keep going straight, where you could be saving that energy. Try bending knees and ankles to let the butt move up and down between two panes of glass parallel with the board. Shift your hips and center of mass forward and backward over the leg that is pushing instead of bending at the hips. This will use your center of mass to push instead of your head and chest. If that doesn't help, ignore me. 😁

[@WakeThief]

Great description

[@vladislavkuba5837]

very good job, how are cross section in compare, is the 1300 fatter ?

[@WakeThief]

Yes, the volume of the 1300 is larger than the 1150, but they have roughly the same area, so yes, it's thicker.

[@vladislavkuba5837]

thanks!

[@Hdip]

Wow. You had to sit on that video for a long time. In some of those tests were you going up wind? Or were you always going down wind? A wetsuit makes a huge difference. Also have you heard the people describe the difference in pumping cadence as a gallop on a horse versus a trot? The high aspect wings you can just tap tap tap with your ankles like a trot to maintain speed. as opposed to the pumping with your quads super hard like a gallop? Because what’s easier doing a bunch of deep knee bends? Or jumping rope and just little jumps off your ankles

[@WakeThief]

Thanks Head Dip! Yes, I completed the test in October. Wind direction and wetsuit matters. Had I been able to pump this wing for 2min, I wouldn't have said the 1150 was still my favorite. I would've needed a more precise comparison (same day, same direction, etc). You're exactly right. I have found pumping cadence is a function of area, aspect ratio and cross section. I haven't found a right or wrong pumping cadence based on any factor. Each wing is unique. It takes me awhile to find it. I found the AXIS 1300 needed a different cadence than 1150, and I probably needed more hours on it before I could really conclude it's not a better pumping wing than 1150. It didn't feel like it had it in it. Thanks for the comment.

[@svenpr9183]

Pretty cool when the wing span is greater than your board length. I do not think we have seen the biggest wing span one yet either. As an aerospace engineer this reminds me of aircraft wing design experiments in the 60's and 70's. No perfect design, just a bunch of compromises depending on what you want it to do. The 1300 looks to be equivalent of a mid-tier drag race car, just meant for the straight and narrow. What would that make the Axis 1150? A 2020 V6 Dodge Challenger? Would also be interesting to see how a slightly heavier person and lighter person (-20lbs/+20lbs) compared on the 1150 and 1300, and whether they could achieve faster speeds on the 1300 than yourself. Based on a visual comparison at 2:30 one could speculate if they pushed the design too far with the thinness in profile (volume) and chord length and overall profile, when used for strictly pumping purpose. Maybe does not optimally "catch" the water to create max velocity, due to general characteristics of water like viscosity and pressure. It also seems to sacrifice a whole lot for both handling and stall speed. I expected more top speed, but it seems they hit a liimit. Overall, it looks like they really hit a sweet spot with the 1150 design, at least for your weight class. Would love to see a test of Naish S25 Ha 1800 HA or the new S26 2140, but my guess is it would compare evenly to the Armstrong HS1800.

[@WakeThief]

Great thoughts. I have reviewed the HS1850 from Armstrong. I think you're right re: the 1300 and 1150 comparison. I suspect you'd find this interesting, and I'd love to get your feedback: kzbin.info/www/bejne/i5m2pnyZp953d68

[@matthewcosta3343]

Awesome video like always. I blame the wind chop. I believe with smooth conditions you would have easily broken two minutes. Thats how it is in the ocean for me, once the chop comes up in the session I can hardly pump in comparison. Also, how about the total distance traveled vice total time of travel ?

[@WakeThief]

You might be right. Thanks for the comment. I believe I'm traveling 600-700m in the 2.5min AXIS 1150 pump. You might be right. I only need 10-15lb of pull force to keep the 1150 flying behind my waverunner, so some tail or headwind can make a difference. Add in the wetsuit, and we might have a wing that could break 2min. I still believe the 1150 has a longer pumping duration, but the gap would be closed somewhat. Thanks for the comment!

[@matthewcosta3343]

@@WakeThief This is the same person from a different account.First things first... Thats a long distance! Yes i agree completely. I am just trying to think if time is the best metric to judge a pump because sometimes distance is more important. Obviously d=rt so if you travel faster the time doesnt need to be as long.... but... infinite pump in time is your pursuit... Overall, I completly can see how the 1150 has a longer pump duration w.r.t time. I think for the best flat water "autonomous" pump we need to focus on thinner everything from fuselages, to wings and masts. I believe the reason the 1300 did not last as long is because it has more drag. Drag in my understanding is a negative horizontal force while lift is a positive vertical force, you need to focus on decreasing the negative horizontal force. Therefore, a higher aspect ratio a.k.a lift/drag is not whats most important because you want to decrease the drag... Increasing this ratio means (more lift) yo u will have to push down harder, therefore exerting more energy. You need a rocket ship that has little drag. Something soooo fast that you only have to put short bursts of power into the system at long intervals so you can save your energy and therefore travel long intervals of time and distance. Anyway, your reviews are incredible and thanks for what you do!!!

[@RMRJMG]

O yaaa... and i recognize it’s easier said than done to create this wing that I describe.

[@WakeThief]

Thanks for this thoughtful response. I appreciate it! I still have a lot to learn.

[@TheTomocrew]

Hello my name is tomo nakano from Japan. I really enjoyed your movie. Thank you. I really interested in pumping hydro foil from two or three years ago. But I don’t any idea what kind of hydro foil should I buy and good for pumping. I really glad to find this movie. I am living near Lake Biwa which is biggest lake in Japan. I have own small sk8 and snowboard shop and private snowboard team. So I want to my team mate to try pumping hydrofoil for training and fun. I want to try too. So please tell me which hydrofoil should I get and where can I get those. I want to be popular in Japan

[@WakeThief]

Dear Nagano-San, Thank you for taking the time to write to me. I appreciate your comment very much. I would welcome the chance to help you find a foil that works well for you and your team. Please email me at [e-mail]. I would like to know the mass of the riders, the riding level (beginner, intermediate, advanced), and how you plan to use the foil (you mentioned starting from the docks, but would you also like to take off from the water behind a boat?). Thank you again for your comment.

[@lisandronicoletti8567]

Just add on your comment at 14:12, theses are actually just keys for the perfect foil for pumping, lift coefficient ( Cl ) to drag coefficient ratio ( Cd ), and low speed performance. Formula for lift L = pAclV^2 Lift = fluid density time by the aree times by Cl time by velocity square. The drag equation just change cl to cd. And knowing this formula, you can say that the lift necessary for you is around 900 N, so 900(1050•4.5)^-1 = 0.042 ( L/pv^2=aCl ) there for try to find a foil where it has the best Cl/Cd and Cl times by the area ( in square meter ) equal to 0.042.

[@WakeThief]

Where have you been all my life, Lisandro! I have learned from the team at AXIS that I happen to be pumping at the minimum Cd of the AXIS 1150 section! Do you agree that I should seek to pump slower (power is a function of cube of velocity) so I can pump for longer, thus need to increase area and aspect ratio so that I find min Cd at a lower speed? I have actually found Cl is less important than Cd as you only need a high Cl for the moment you are high AoA to get to full elevation on the mast. Would you agree?

[@WakeThief]

Note I pump at about 4-4.5m/s. Seeking to get below 4m/s should help increase pumping duration, no?

[@greg.ocallaghan]

Longer pumping duration on the 1150, but what about distance covered? Do you think you'd be able to cover more distance (due to higher pump speed) on the 1300?

[@WakeThief]

Dude! Another brilliant question. I love it. Honest answer is that I don't know, but I think the 1150 could be pumped longer and farther than the 1300, just because the 1300 duration was so much less. There is most definitely a cross over point where a foil that wants to pumped faster can actually travel farther, but I don't think that was the case here. Love the question.

[@philipdunn7408]

It’s Humongous!!?? Hahaha nice one for us larger foilers I’ll have to get one

[@WakeThief]

ha! Yes, I'm 190lb/86kg and have liked the >1700sqcm high aspect wings, but there aren't that many out there. If you're winging, this might be a good one for you. If you're doing a number of different things (dock starting, pumping, surfing), I'd recommend the AXIS 1150.

[@philipdunn7408]

I’m about 92kg and still looking at a larger front wing for winging and windsurf foiling on light winds got the 1010 a 1020 still and along the 1150 great wing for me but even with the 1020 and a 500 rear or the 460 high aspect this may be be better with the 1300 just for the light wind days see when we get some here in the Uk

[@WakeThief]

I think you're right, and that makes sense to me.

[@michelcote]

You should check the polar of the wing. Maybe this high aspect requires more speed to be at it's most efficient L/D ratio. But could require more power to do so. I am sure there is an optimum aspect ratio for a given speed and load. It would be a matter of matching it to you power output and the speed at which you want to go.

[@WakeThief]

I think you're exactly right ... I have a feeling that this foil needs more speed, the 1150 needs less speed, but the power draw from both is probably quite similar once you master the propulsive efficiency of both! Great comment. Love it. Pure genius.

[@michelcote]

@@WakeThief Thanks

[@Salgi007]

it looks like you're hitting the griddy

[@koejoe]

Beautiful! Curious how your ride would be with a paddle ?

[@WakeThief]

I've seen people do it. I'm not very good a SUP, but I've seen many videos of people pumping and taking a stroke every second pump

[@koejoe]

@@WakeThief great video and much appreciated. I’m in search for a foil that will suit my wing foil needs but also something I can play around pumping with a paddle stroke on some down wind ocean days . Would love to see if any energy could be conserved if at all with a paddle stroke. Your video on the net will help a lot of people. Thanks

[@WakeThief]

@@koejoe thank you. I’ve seen videos of people paddle starting a foil. I tried it and realized I didn’t have the paddle skills or strength to do it!

[@ddegn]

How many times in a day to you "pump 'till exhaustion"? Does the amount you can pump become less with each attempt (in the same day)? Do you need to take a day off in between foil surfing? I'd think pumping a foil would get your legs burning as well as any, weight lifting type, leg strengthening exercises. Thanks for another fun video. It's very interesting to learn about the trade offs between aspect ratio and performance at various speeds. It's always fun to see you flying across the lake.

[@WakeThief]

Great questions! I do need to be fresh for this test to keep it fair. I can't do more than 2 in one day. I don't do this that often, so tend to be fresh for the test. So glad you're enjoying it. Any closer to getting one yourself? :) Happy new year, Duane!

[@ddegn]

@@WakeThief "Any closer to getting one yourself?" No. Multiple reasons. Probably the main one is health. Riding an electric skateboard is as about as physically demanding of an activity I'm able to muster right now. I think hydro surfing is one activity I'm fine with being a spectator only. Maybe not just spectator, I like to think I'm also part of the of cheer section. Again, it's always fun to see your videos. Thanks for sharing your videos and happy new year to you.

[@WakeThief]

@@ddegn Thanks, Duane. If you ever get the itch to try foiling, please let me know. Where are you located? I might be able to find a connection for you not far from where you're located.

[@ddegn]

@@WakeThief I'm in Chubbuck Idaho. If I ever get an itch to try foiling, I'll certainly let you know. Thanks for your kind offer. It's more likely I'll try to build some sort of hydrofoil robot before I try riding a hydrofoil board myself. I can't stop myself from trying to figure out what sort of oscillating weight could reproduce the pumping action you use to propel your board. I make robots of varying types including flying ones. I'd think some of the control principles used to control a quadcopter or airplane could be adapted to control a foil. It would likely behave like a very unstable airplane. I get way more crazy robot ideas than I have time or skill to build but the oscillating weight hydrofoil robot takes up a lot of my daydreaming time. Have you seen the crazy hydrofoil boats they race in The American Cup? It had been years since I'd paid any attention to this race but a KZbinr *blancolirio* made a video about one of the boats capsizing today. I immediately thought of your videos when I saw the hydrofoils on the boat ("boat" is probably the wrong term for something that sophisticated). Those things are more like aircraft than watercraft. kzbin.info/www/bejne/jnvOn4ObjMR9jck Again thanks for your kind offer of assistance. And thanks for taking time to give detailed answers to my questions.

[@WakeThief]

@@ddegn so cool! A pumping robot would be amazing.

[@vitsalava1251]

Heck, give it some ailerons, rudder, elevator and you could frickin do dynamic slope soaring with it...

[@scottseale]

Is the foil profile section thickness as % of max chord the same for the 1300 and 1150? I think from your 1150 review it had about 11.8% profile. Thanks

[@WakeThief]

I will have to measure. The 1300 is noticeably thinner because it’s area is quite similar to 1150 but it’s volume is much less, so it must be thinner.

[@scottseale]

@@WakeThief Thanks.

[@smytharmstrong8543]

Since the 1300 pumped faster than the 1150 did you check distance covered by the two minutes of pumping compared to distance covered by 2 minutes 28 seconds covered by the 1150. If the distance covered is comparable then the 1300 may be closer to the 1150 for the purposes of catching passing wakes than your video indicated -- just a thought.

[@WakeThief]

Great thought and question, Smyth. Thanks! The 1300 had a much higher max pumping speed, and only a slightly faster min pumping speed (which is likely closest to lowest power output). I would guess that the 1150 could pump further, but I didn't measure it. In my experience, the 1300 could cover more ground in 2min, if it were side by side with the 1150, but I'm now seeing some, like Dominic Hoskyns, pump the 1300 a really long time at a very low speed. I'm starting to wonder if there's an ideal pumping technique for each wing, and it's necessarily how I pump the 1150! Thanks.

[@smytharmstrong8543]

@@WakeThief Maybe Dominic is using a different length of mast and/or fuselage and a different size of stabilizer -- these things seems to make a big difference, especially for someone who is an expert, such as yourself -- why not contact him and find out what his setup is for pumping? Also, if you get the chance could you try the big Takuma Kijura wing that's getting a lot of hype (1410 or 1440 - not sure of its exact projected size).

[@WakeThief]

Yes, Dominic is a good friend. I believe he's using ultra short and a KD maui stabilizer. I completely agree with you, tuning the fuse length, rear wing, speed and cadence are key. Takuma 1440 is on my list! I have the 1210 in my basement, but really want to try the 1440 first (as I need more area for the lake and my 190lb/86kg). Nice chatting. Thanks for this!

[@patricksmyth3438]

I’m shor you won’t see this but Im a fellow foiler I have Armstrong and my mates have axses I used to have axes but what I have found out is short fuse and smaller tail wing can pump better so then you can basically jump up and down

[@WakeThief]

I have found longer fuse works better for the AXIS 1150, but I believe each wing is different. I just advised an HS1850 owner (and friend) to try a longer fuse and he didn't like it all. I'll dig into this. Thank you

[@samskelton9908]

Hi amazing vid would you be able to dock start an Moses t40? Or are the wings to small

[@WakeThief]

Which foil are you using with the moses T40 board?

[@samskelton9908]

@@WakeThief would a feather tech foil be any good for it?

[@WakeThief]

I had to look up that company. I have never heard of them. I think 150lb folks need 1200sqcm or bigger and 200lb folks need 1700sqcm or bigger. You’re making it really hard on yourself if you go to the low end of this area range.

[@samskelton9908]

@@WakeThief ah well better not get that then thanks for going out of your way.

[@WakeThief]

You’re welcome. If I can help you spec one let me know. [e-mail]

[@anthonycraig274]

I was wondering, where do you get a bungee from? How does it work? I think this will be my entry system into the sport. Can you do an episode one this?

[@WakeThief]

I purchased the bungee from Horue. I also expect that bungee cord (1/2"or 5/8" would work). Here's the video describing the setup: kzbin.info/www/bejne/nIbagIyCfMuaa80

[@anthonycraig274]

@@WakeThief many thanks

[@WakeThief]

You’re welcome!

[@nathanshields9665]

Should I go with the standard or short fuselage with this setup: axis 1150 dwarfcraft board 460mm tail 76cm mast

[@WakeThief]

Short is more versatile and only a bit less efficient for pumping. I’d go short.

[@mariotrifonov8078]

i think if you try that wing in salty water, you can extract the maximum of the wing because the difference of densities

[@WakeThief]

Salt water definitely helps … the viscosity of sale water is much lower so the drag is a lot lower. Makes a big difference!

[@julialachowiczj]

How long did it take for your legs to get familiar with the motion? Weeks months?

[@WakeThief]

I skateboarded when I was young. It took me a couple of outings to pump well (tens of seconds). It took me weeks to pump very well (one month) and it took me months to pump extremely well (minutes)

[@julialachowiczj]

@@WakeThief I was on the axis website last night and wanted to get the setup that’s best for pumping.. I was so confused can you share what exact setup I should get. I think you liked the 1150 wing .. but what size keel, fuse solage and rear wing is smart? I weight 155. Gotta save up for beta foil

[@WakeThief]

@@julialachowiczjif you need a board too, here’s a good deal. mackite.idevaffiliate.com/idevaffiliate.php?id=102&url=3

[@joshjones9878]

if you were 90kg plus, would you say the 1300 is a better choice than the 1150?

[@WakeThief]

Not necessarily. I find the 1150 has better low speed lift / early takeoff / stall saving during mistakes, while the 1300 has more glide and more roll resistance. Most people can pump the 1150 longer / farther, though some claim they can pump the 1300 longer / farther, I haven't found that to be the case. If I were winging or wanting to glide further with less energy, I'd choose 1300. If I'm pumping / wake thieving I choose the 1150.

[@bubbahottep8644]

Have you compared surfing ability and distance travel able comparisons? Thanks.

[@WakeThief]

We haven’t directly compared those, but we do compete foils ability to surf second wake of my waverunner and the glide distance / pumping speed. Here’s the results of last years’ test

[@WakeThief]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/eKnIfJh5Z6-KnK8

[@CarkeekW]

Does it ride the 3rd wake or did we just see you riding a 4th wake with it ?

[@WakeThief]

It could surf the 10th wake of the boat that I was thieving. This wing could surf the second wake of my jet ski, though I didn't officially test it

[@patricksmyth3438]

Try the o ultra short fuse

[@WakeThief]

I think that's a very good idea. I've heard this from another reputable source. Fuselage tuning is quite important and not discussed very often, but I know it does matter. I need to get this wing back and try that. Thanks for the comment, Patrick.

[@andremeier3291]

Whats the down side on foils that you could start without something dragging you? And are the foils you are riding here able to dock start?

[@WakeThief]

Hi Andre - do you mean an efoil, one that is propelled with a battery? I will be sharing my first efoil experience in a couple of weeks. Please let me know if I understood you correctly.

[@andremeier3291]

@@WakeThief Hei there no its about a pump foil. If you go for "easy dockstart" what other aspects of foiling would be worse. Whats the setup you've felt Dockstarting was the easiest with. And is it somehow possible to get a board that has the properties you are searching for and in addition is easy to dockstart.

[@WakeThief]

I understand now. Sorry about that. Not really. Large area is conducive to good low speed lift but it also means more drag. There’s a balance to be found and the 1150, in my opinion, is the right balance.

[@Dwiviott425]

Can you give some info about that bungee setup?

[@WakeThief]

You bet. Here’s a summary: kzbin.info/www/bejne/nIbagIyCfMuaa80. Please respond if you have more questions.

[@bry8636]

Is the aspect ratio width relative to length? As in an aspect ratio of 10 would be for instance 1 cm of width to 10 cm in length?

[@WakeThief]

Bingo!

[@WakeThief]

This video explains the nitty gritty: kzbin.info/www/bejne/i5m2pnyZp953d68

[@bry8636]

@@WakeThief thanks!

[@michaelkihn1305]

In order to get to 2.5 minutes "flying time", could you break down in percentage how you believe the following three (or four with the "current") parameters impacted? 1. Gear, 2. Technique, 3. Endurance/Physical Fitness, (4. Current: against? with?). Certainly all the parameters 1.- 3. changed throughout the last years of your development... I am asking because of being stuck at around 50s of "flying time" and don't know how to attack the issue first: being more patience, working on my technique, replacing the gear (currently on the 1060mm Frontwing, 440 Rearwing, 68cm Fuselage, 76cm Foil and a Dwarfcraft 110cm normal version) or doing some additional physical exercising outside the water? 🤔🤔🙋‍♂️🙋‍♂️☺️

[@WakeThief]

The best question I’ve been asked in a long time! Let me start by saying 1060 and 440 combo is killer. I like the 1060. Quite similar to 1150. #1 - I believe gear is foundational and thus most important. #2 - pumping technique is critical. You get 1 and 2 right and that matters most. Technique varies wing to wing. There isn’t a right way to pump there’s a right way for each wing. So fitness is third. Someone in decent shape should be able to pump the 1150 for 90s. I’d love to find a better pumping wing but I haven’t … I still haven’t found what I’m looking for (think U2).

[@michaelkihn1305]

​@@WakeThief Thanks for the answers! Well, and additionally I should take into consideration that my dock rests on over 2200m altitude over sea level 😬😂 .. Let's target those 1.5 minutes of flying time here instead of 2.5 minutes for 2021 .. 🙋‍♂️

[@widmarkeloo6812]

How do u start with the ski and such a small board? I have the same board I use for kite foiling and would like try starting behind a ski. Thanks

[@WakeThief]

Start similar to a wakeboard just with less pressure on back foot. If you check out my review of the go foil wings you can see how I get out of the water. I really should make a video on how to do this. Based on your question I will make this video in the spring. Thank you

[@widmarkeloo6812]

@@WakeThief Thanks for your reply!!

[@WakeThief]

@@widmarkeloo6812 if I can help you in any way pls don’t hesitate to reach out to me. [e-mail]

[@dumbdumber1885]

I have a lake with a beach, no dock, no boat, no jet ski, no tow vehicle of any kind. Can I get going on this thing or should i stick with my kite?

[@WakeThief]

Beach starts are possible, but very hard. I am not able to do it, but I do know people who have learned. Do you have access to a public launch / dock? Dock starter from those is certainly possible and can be learned with some time. Let me know if I can help.

[@dumbdumber1885]

@@WakeThief Thank you sir. So it's VERY difficult to water start these wings is what I'm learning and that means a long swim if you go down in deep water in the middle of the lake for whatever reason. Also the pumping action is a quad muscle burner outer and your cruises are limited to a few minutes depending on your conditioning. It looks cool but I have a feeling I should stick to wind/kite surfing as I can get back on those contraptions :) Your videos are fascinating to watch and for those into it I'm guessing they're learning a lot. Great work :)

[@WakeThief]

Thank you so much! If I can ever help, please don't hesitate to reach out.

[@bencl8788]

Is the axis windsurfing fuselage good for pumping ?

[@WakeThief]

In my experience, no. I tried it because I wanted to see if an even longer fuse helped pumping more .. I suspect that's why you're asking! And it's an awesomely good question. I believe there are two reasons why it didn't work well: (1) The distance from where the mast meets the fuselage to center of lift of the front wing is too big, so you need to move the mast plate back and I'm not sure I could move it back enough, so I had to move my feet very far forward, which didn't feel right, and (2) The increased distance from where mast meets fuse to the center of lift of front wing makes the rotation of the front wing in roll direction possible due to torsion on the fuse when wingtips were loaded differently. I'm not entirely sure that's what it was, but I believe that's what I was feeling. I could feel like the rigidity just wasn't there.

[@WakeThief]

Love the question. Thank you, Ben.

[@bencl8788]

@@WakeThief thank you 🙏

[@rafaelpadilha4585]

Paint them on superhydrophobic paint, should reduce alot of skin drag. Cheers!

[@WakeThief]

Thanks, Rafael. I’ve tried this with other foils. I couldn’t really feel the difference but it doesn’t mean there isn’t a difference … I just couldn’t isolate it.

[@jean-pierredesiebenthal5325]

Wahouuu, it’s not a foil… it’s a plane… thanks for your testing

[@WakeThief]

You’re welcome. This one was kinda insane!

[@supaflip87]

Can you have high aspect and better low speed lift?

[@WakeThief]

Yes. Bigger area and modified foil section can accomplish that on a high aspect ratio wing. It’s what I will seek to find next. Thanks for the comment, Andrew.

[@maca5645]

Yes, with a thicker,curvier foil section.It will add drag though.

[@WakeThief]

@@maca5645 Yes, thank you, Ma Ca! I so appreciate your input / expertise! Thanks

[@maca5645]

@@WakeThief You can foil rings around me :) i pretty much suck.But i fly for a living and foils are kind of little underwater airplanes.

[@WakeThief]

Cool! What planes do you fly?

[@get-out-there2]

Remake the skateboard deck version, just reinforce it, and the strongest and lightest skateboard deck made of carbon fiber. Your board is 5.5lbs now, get it down below 2.5lbs and see if that helps. Also, make a DISCORD. So we can all talk to each other and help each other.

[@lackiviolin8914]

Why nut make a main wing with a thicker cord and hollow like a construction of I beam main spar, D cell ribs lead edge, just look at the way wings made in olden days from balsa wood and moncote covering. Make the volume equal to your weight so you don't have to be concerned about lift..only forward speed.

[@WakeThief]

No doubt a thicker wing would have more buoyancy, but it would also have more drag. The vast majority of lift is coming from the wing flying not the buoyancy, however, so it's important we have a great lift to drag ratio for the wing, because once you're flying, drag becomes the focus. Thanks for the comment.

[@patrickradcliffe3837]

You need a foil with good reynolds numbers and lift at low speeds.

[@WakeThief]

Yes! I’ve since discovered this and you’re exactly right. Pls check out today’s video on the topic which launches at 8am eastern. Would love your feedback.

[@WakeThief]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/i5m2pnyZp953d68

[@claudiobertadeazevedo4669]

Now people are puzzled whether you need help to build the tail or professional help to check if you were telepathically abducted by a mermaid who may eventually be right, I am curious. Theoretically the flex tail will follow more the water flow thus having less overall angle of attack compared to fixed tail, therefore less drag. Lured by the mermaid’s tail hypnotic moves we cannot forget the fuselage does not have muscles. The least possible drag is the removal of the tail, but at what cost? Divers use flex fins, we can assume the flex fins consume less oxygen and give them the best glide. Keep us posted.

[@WakeThief]

lol. The goal will be to use the spring force, after being recoiled to unwind and generate thrust with a tail. I'm revisiting the footage now, and see there's more potential here, and we still need to go deeper. Thanks for the comment, Claudio. Good to hear from you.

[@poopagore]

I rememebr watching a documentary thing where this gun could run for a long long time bc he didn't have the build up of acid that happens, the burn effect basically from birth somehow so I bet he would be great at this lol

[@WakeThief]

That person would kill it foiling! It is pretty darn exhausting.

[@trihuynh4377]

Ok ok

[@xophere]

Wetsuit maybe?

[@WakeThief]

Maybe, but I don't think so. If I could've pumped this beyond 2min, I would've thought the wind direction and wetsuit might be a factor, but this was a lot less than my 1150 pumping duration.

[@kanedewilde]

Pumping time isn’t everything, in the surf pumping distance matters way more! I bet even though you didn’t break your time record, you might’ve smashed your distance record!

[@WakeThief]

You’re right! In fact, pumping distance is what I’m seeking too, just harder to measure. I want to pump between distant wakes on my lake. I might have gone further but I don’t think so. I will measure this with my watch in future tests. I’m not sure that going slower doesn’t mean you can’t go further. Power increases by the cube of velocity and more power means more exhaustion. If we can slow down a little bit, power can go way down and distance can go up. This is my next journey. I’m seeking a wing that will let me slow from 4.5 m/s to 4 m/s. Thank you for all that you do for the sport. I follow you closely. If you think there are any other products I should try, please let me know! [e-mail]

[@1JOHNHEARN]

mahalo

[@WakeThief]

Thank you, John. If I can ever help you, please don't hesitate to reach out. Or if you have any ideas of foils I can review, please let me know. Thank again!

[@mikefas5406]

Nice tests. The problem with these are the price. No one has a real affordable way to get into this. It's a little out of hand. Especially the full carbon setups. 5k? Come on... 😕

[@WakeThief]

Hi Mike, you’re right some can be quite expensive. My favorite setup is $2000 including taxes. If you want to get the exact same setup, I can share more details. Pls contact me at [e-mail]

[@anthonycraig274]

That’s an albatross of a wing.

[@WakeThief]

It sure is!

[@MatsBohlinsson]

Very good review!

[@WakeThief]

Thanks Mats