B-1B Leadership Failures - Fighter Pilots Take

[@johnhill7429]

After reading the report, watching both videos, in my opinion, what I got out of the situation, is that the writer was the lack of leadership from the top down. A failure of the commander of the squadron to make sure his (her) subordinates to dot all the eyes, cross the T's, perform a true CRM brief, to notice that a crew person was over weight, verify/emphasize personnel integrity (seeing medical personnel outside of the USAF and not reporting it). Again, in my opinion, this unit had a cancer in it and it did not appear until this mishap. The reports author is the doctor now saying; we've got to operate, and change your lifestyle. Kudos to the author for having the moral spine to say "enough is enough".

[@SITST6]

The crew force at large has been glove saving Big Blue and the MAJCOMs mistakes for years now. ACC hard broke the Bone community due to an unrelenting combat ops tempo, but then expected a bunch of O-6s and squadrons to fix the problem without any tangible support or tools to get things back to where they needed to be. Same thing happening now in the UPT enterprise with broke T-6 and T-38 fleets holding up the house of cards until the T-7 arrives in 6-9 years.

[@chrisbrackin9678]

I have actually begun to wonder if the focus had shifted to the T-7 yet. The pipeline of student pilots hasn't changed and they are getting distracted by a shiny, new object which jeopardizes the community. I see similar situations in corporate aviation all the time.

[@deantait8326]

Maybe Vote and then Admin would focus assets and budget expense to the USA 🇺🇸 military and not so much to Europe and handouts. JUST PLEASE VOTE !!!

[@stevewhite3424]

​@deantait8326 Yes, because this is all happening under the administration that got the most voted ever in history which then resulted in things like the Afghanistan retreat and the current state of military material and personnel. We also have senior military leadership at the highest levels that rather than throwing their stars onto the table and saying.I quit meekly bend the knee to the progressives in this administration. The problem is not 05-07 level. For Chrissakes the CJCS Is quoted as saying the biggest threat facing our military and country is white supremacy, not readiness not the chinese not the russians but our own citizens.

[@Thunder_6278]

Had to shock the system. He was frustrated. He may have ended his career, but his conscience is clear.

[@Thumpalumpacus]

Former USAF firefighter here. When we screwed up, the investigation drilled deep, and when I was in, late 80s-early 90s, the rule of thumb was one gig will get you two and two will get you eight. When they find an issue they dig deeper. So it doesn't surprise me that this accident report drilled down into whether or not the guy had gloves on or not. Relevancy of the gloves aside, if the author's basing his thesis on a culture of airmanship, those little things may not matter much in the accident, but they may well be evidence to support his larger idea that the unit simply wasn't practicing established SOP. The idea that the author of the report drilled that deep because he'd tried calling this out before to a brick wall makes sense too.

[@jcn115]

@ 20:50 “there is a culture within the Air Force to do more with less”. “Doing more with less” has been the USMC motto since the beginning.

[@spawntez]

and with old ass equipment and platforms. The Air Force needs to be bitch slapped into modern day military operations, stop acting like shit don't matter. Major failures it's across the board, from Andersen to Minot to Aviano, etc.

[@sprocket5526]

Jarheads don't fly 500million dollar irreplaceable bombers🤷‍♀️

[@couespursuit7350]

@@sprocket5526 Marines fly F18's and C130 in all sorts of conditions and circumstances. Its not the cost of the bird its the headwork and skill of the organization. Marines are adept at staying sharp despite conditions.

[@robmorgan1214]

​@couespursuit7350 true but the chair force has never been a dedicated spartan organization except for the BRUTAL AND COMPLETELY INSANE and ironically ineffective era of SAC under Lemay and Powell... despite zero tollerance for officers who made minor mundane mistakes, the geniuses opposition to sensible policy at the 3 star level, still nearly managed to wipe out the entire eastern seaboard including DC with a B52 over North Carolina and a 4MT nuke that managed to fully arm itself except for 1 redundant 3volt switch that randomly armed itself in about 50% of fliguts due to static electricity buildup in its instrument panel... the buff went down because of a LIGHTNING STRIKE the marks banks charged the ground radar fused the piezo in the nose cone crushed and fused on impact and a 3V switch in a lightning strike that took out the plane stood between the loss of the plutonium core (never been recovered) and the loss of the US government and 1/10th of her population at the hands of an incompetent military that ignored the people who designed their weapons in a decades long fight to put real 1point detonation security systems into the devices. Thank God for Bob Purefoy who cataloged all the dozens of "CLASSIFIED" nuclear weapons accidents and finally won the decade long fight to get the permissive activation links and one point safety retrofitted into the nuclear stockpile and a design requirement of all future warheads... the geniuses in the chair force had their revenge and set the code of the pals links to 00000... the dumbest marine eating crayons at the bottom of the company latrine because he got lost on the way to his foxhole isn't stupid enough to make these kinds of strategic blunders... mlostly cause he can't spell strategeererey... thanks for being squared away. Lincoln and Roosevelt changed flag officers more than the average infantry man changes his socks. Bush couldn't spell socks and Clinton kept his on the door handle. Obama was feckless and sociopathic probably felt powerful ordering all those illegal unconstitutional drone strikes 90% of which hit civilians... the fish has rotted from the head and this fish is only good at one thing...killing people on the TV screen whose only crime was to live on land coveted by Epsteinites. The USMC unlike the other branches has resisted incompetentce and bureaucratic empire building largely because it doesn't play a strategic role via toys or power projection. It's strategic significance is purely rooted in competence and discipline. The cactus airforce is a good example of this ethos at work and how easy the navy can integrate into a well managed USMC operation. The automation of drone warfare and electronic warfare as demonstrated by RUSSIA in Ukraine changes the shape of future combat and puts the ethos of the marine who can think and not fuck up revealing his thermal or RF signature to inhuman eyes in the sky at the center of future SUCCESSFUL combat. This is not a survivable environment for people prone to minor but frequent mistakes or inattention to detail. Nukes and the sac mission are similar but with consequences that transcend the personal... a military obsessed with force multipliers can't control land and can't even control the chaos created by a successful application of its doctrine as we proved year after year in both Vietnam and GWoT.

[@warfarenotwarfair5655]

The USN and USMC are expeditionary forces, they can't win wars and are becoming less important. The USAF and Army are set up to win wars.

[@duckaneer1]

I'm a cop in a "Special Operations Unit", we have K-9's, SWAT, Aviation and boats. When you say "Do more with less" leads to bad things, you nailed it. We haven't crashed yet only because we're a group who doesn't fail and finds a way to get it done, but it coming.

[@cdyjv118]

LASD SEB?

[@avrolancaster6987]

try not to crash a ship into a dog, copper!

[@Raist474]

Correction Gonky, it takes 3 to launch one. If the flying squadrons are this bad, I guarantee the MXG has the same problem and is far, far worse. Maintainers don't have the safety nets like mandated crew rest of actually follow "knock it off" like aircrew does. MX leadership is much more stat and metric obsessed than flyers, there's a culture of eating your own to advance, and rolling over for bad schedules put out by the Ops groups to appease the Wing King. Working 6x12-14 for weeks on end burns our your best troops and increases the chance of mishap. Back when the Tinker Exercise fiasco happened there was a quiet purge in the MXG that was swept under the rug, and there was another in Yakota. "More with less" is killing the air force. As of now they've already fired one of the Ops Squadron Commanders.

[@shawn2443]

Well done Mover! Hammer away sir …. Maybe one day somebody “deeohdee” will start looking into these leadership and morale issues. 🇺🇸

[@richardjohnson2884]

Not an aviator here, but I was a security forces member activated after 9/11 and sent to Ellsworth. On Thanksgiving Day, 2001, the only people in the control tower were me and another security cop. We an a C-5A carrying a top secret cargo declare an inflight emergency and divert to Ellsworth. We kept hearing the mayday, mayday, mayday calls to Ellsworth tower and we didn't know what to do. We contacted our CP, panicking ourselves, and someone from ATC came up on the net from somewhere after more than 5 minutes delay. The C-5 landed just moments later. I was also there for the B-1 going nose-up when the fuel shifted to the rear. (Find the pics online.) Looks like this culture has existed at Ellsworth for quite some time. Bring back SAC.

[@mgoblue0970]

In today's climate, SAC is never coming back. The troops wouldn't serve under that kind of discipline and accountability.

[@michaelnewell9662]

B1's, B2's, & B52's all fall under Global Strike Command. it's the modern equivalent of SAC, but ghost of Curtis LeMay has left the building

[@PBAR_B1B]

Been there, done. Delaying 3-4 hours to get a B-1 to fly and like you all said, it does mess with your motivation/focus/attitude to go fly that day. Besides being so complex, the B-1 has always suffered from the Air Force never buying the requisite set of spares and support equipment for the Bone from the offset as well as persistent maintenance under-manning. However, IMO, the B-1 community culture has always been too laid back. I was surprised when I showed up to a B-1 squadron and saw how few people spent time in the vault (prior to nav school I was an intel puke in a F-16 squadron in Korea so had some basis for comparison). The not wearing helmets, gloves, etc. was an issue when I flew Bones 20 years ago.

[@shannonfracisco4074]

Happy Birthday "Mombat" 🥳

[@Shimmerscale]

30:33 This is 99% it. He just got pissed, and he was right. "I tried, i really tried, and they do not listen, right now people were hurt, but if i don't write it, it will be on my conscious, because next time somebody will die, and hell if I let them continue like that" And hell i did the same thing 2 months ago, the frustration and the inability to change in those organizations even if pointed out is just....something else. And You know it just wears you down, inch by inch every time something like this happens. But then the organization just shows that pilots, people were at fault only..no CRM, no SA....and nobody says that we didn't give them tool to actually solve the problems to begin with. How the hell can we expect people to fly if we push the airmanship to the background, and at the same time expect them excel in those fields.

[@FS2K4Pilot]

This sounds like the guy who wrote the report is screaming “DAMMIT, STOP!!!” in the manner that Gene Krantz described in his famous speech to his flight controllers after Apollo 1.

[@PaulLoveless-Cincinnati]

Im not military - howver i found the three perspectives here to be absolutely fascinating and well balanced. Wombat kept getting shutdown in the beginning (lol!) be he ultimately offered the most interesting perspectives. Everyone on the stream provised very good feedback.

[@drmassey1]

By Far, this conversation is one that highlights the complexity and nuances in the Military- when it comes to high profile mishaps. I'm glad Mover pointed out the similarity to writing a police investigative report. You have to draw a distinction between presenting the facts, highlight exigent factors and those that exceed the norm to paint an accurate picture of the totality of the event. Very rarely are there times where the investigator is given latitude to smuggle their personal views into the matter as their way of "making a point." Very difficult position to be in all the way around! Again, very informative and thought provoking discussion.

[@bicboi1930]

Im sure it would feel personal when you're the one taking the unjust career hit for blowing the whistle when nobody listened. Might as well lay it all out. You can't tell me calling out being overweight is petty either. It does matter as seen by the injury.

[@johnmorrison8942]

Thanks!

[@themoverandgonkyshow]

Thank you Sir!

[@neilelsewhere9473]

An English/British measure of weight that fell out of use in the North American Colonies is the "stone" - a measure of 14 lbs, commonly used in the weight of people rather than goods. So when you mention that one of the crew was 20 lbs heavier than expected and that they "left no stone unturned" that was funnier for a British audience than you may have realised!

[@DJSoundspectrum]

HAPPY BIRTHDAY Wombats mummy!!!

[@reedestrada3611]

This is the third B-1 accident where aircrew discipline was the main factor. Hell yes it matters when the crew didn’t have gloves or helmet or was overweight and flew a destabilized approach. This speaks to attention to detail and following regulations and tech orders that are mostly written in blood because of prior accidents or incidents. Bombers are national assets because of their strategic importance and their cost especially when you look at replacement cost. These assets are controlled by treaty. Also for the bomber crew force there is no appreciable difference in ability between an FTU instructor versus a squadron IP. A great deal of upgrade and currency training occurs at the squadron level. Squadron IPs are the main muscle and bone of the crew force tasked with training and safety. They are tasked by the OG to insure safety of flight and given full authority to insist on proper procedures and adherence to regulations. Bottom line the IP is held responsible for the safety of the flight.

[@RickActual]

❤ “I mean this is like, ‘Fox-3, Fox-3, Fox-3…’ Well, not for a bomber guy. ‘JDAM, JDAM, JDAM…’ 15:07

[@rwhunt99]

I agree with what Gonky says about flying hours. THAT is what makes our Military great and others not so good, and you have to fly aircraft, they have to work. As Wombat and Gonky were saying, once the man got a head of steam going, he could not let up because it had built up over many situations. I agree with Mover, you had enough to burn people, be succinct and crisp in you report. I do hope Congress sees these reports and let Mover explain it to them clearly so they can make the required recommendations to fix the situation.

[@billsprague7094]

From a civilian’s perspective, I am delighted to see the thoroughness of this report. The pilots, crew, and management dropped a $450 million national asset onto the runway in flames. A thorough report, even if a flamethrower, should get everyone’s attention.

[@Jamez3l]

OPS group commander was relieved of their command

[@hosslover01]

My hubby was a flight rated B-52 crew chief in Nam. I've loved listening to all his stories and it makes me sad that the AF has come to this. None of this would've "flown" during his service.

[@rwhunt99]

As far as scathing goes - it's only my opinion, but it might seem like whoever wrote the report knows how things work, they see discrepancies slip through the cracks and things slowly get slacker and slacker and this guy has had enough and sees this as a result of that long slow slide. So; IMO, he's saying we need to tighten up the ship - seriously or we will continue to see these things happen. It's like people pencil whipping reports just to get through the day and ignore the little things that ultimately can get people killed.

[@dudehuh5491]

im an 00 but thank you sir as always Mover,WOMBAT ,and GONKY Sirs thank you for servin when ya DID stay safe people

[@timothy____1989]

Ref the Col’s report, Google “Cassandra complex”. Kudos to a senior officer finally standing up and saying, I’m ok retiring at my current rank, I’m going to do and say the right thing rather than the politically correct thing. The Col may have been on a rant, may have been frustrated, but we need more like him.

[@edjarrett3164]

What is overlooked is this was an AC upgrade flight. The candidate had flown twice in 30 days had 275 hrs. Asking him to shoot the approach under marginal weather was an instructor fault. There are three conditions where the most experienced pilot should always fly, night, IMC, terrain.

[@couespursuit7350]

275 hours total??? or 275 hours in type ???

[@edjarrett3164]

@@couespursuit7350 275 in type.

[@boblynch2802]

Happy birthday mombat!

[@pf6797]

“Nice. I like that” famous last words, Wombat the Wise.

[@boblynch2802]

Once investigators start finding issues and patterns, they dig even further to look for deeper patterns and attitudes.

[@gregpow236]

I lay this at the feet of sequestration a decade ago. Two theater wars coupled with tax cuts and sudden pearl clutching about the budget deficit.

[@_lime.]

People are commenting on how the other aircraft landed therefore this is purely a crew issue, but that's just not the case. Just because it worked doesn't mean it's done right, both landings were a gamble, one worked, one didn't. This is a half billion dollar jet, treating it like a beater Honda is going to result in problems. The AF just has not been providing the funding for the fleet to be maintained, nor for the aircrews to keep current. This culture of "making it work" then transcended beyond just the physical upkeep of the jets to encompass all aspects of the squadrons. It was a matter of time until this happened, and thankfully everyone made it out. This report is fully justified it pointing out every single flaw, because if it's not scathing, then their won't be the cultural change necessary to make B-1 ops safe.

[@avrolancaster6987]

Fighter pilots seeing a stack of papers regards a bomber mishap.. leaf through and are "I'm so over this" and presumably goes off on a superbike somewhere more fun.

[@tooitchy]

The thing that really worries me is what Mover said..... Our military fleet is aging, bad, old aircraft are fine if you're an air show museum squadron flying relics for the crowds, but this is our active duty combat fleet. We got the F35, but we cut the knees out from the F22 almost immediately into production and now that's our #2 fighter, and primary close engagement fighter, and the numbers of them are shockingly low, and that's it, that number will only shrink, and going off previous fighters, these planes gotta make it 50 years of use. Our bombers are in abysmal shape, I'm convinced there's so much secrecy around the b2 because we don't want anyone finding out how old those things really are. It's cool that they still make us go "woooow" 30 years into their deployment, but that's because we hide em and nobodies seen more than a picture during that time. I heard the USAF was in talks to bring the T7 into combat duty, and not just as a trainer, which tells you how bad the flying situation is....I keep getting told we're offloading all our old gear to ukraine, but I sure hope we got new replacing it, because all I see in our military now is doing more with whatever the hell they can find. This stagnation, and feeling of entropy within the military leads to the cultural, systemic problems within squadrons, and flight crews. If it looks like the very top don't give a shit (reflected in the equipment you're provided), it's far more difficult to maintain the rigorous standards that are expected of you. I think everyone can see this kind of thing all over the country, not just the military, and people are looking for ways to explain it, and find blame for it, since the reality, that everything is just falling apart, and aging (leading to loss of trust, like every other institution). I am worried for my country.

[@FS2K4Pilot]

Random note: when I was at HMT/HMHT-302, we were flying something like 2000 hours a month.

[@section8usmc53]

It was just "HMT" when I went through at Tustin. I was stationed at New River and we were doing our deployment work up and they just started moving in and getting everything together. Came back and everything was in full swing.

[@FS2K4Pilot]

@@section8usmc53 Yup. It was HMT when I got there, then a couple years later was turned into HMHT. Five-turn-fives were common, and we once did a five-turn-five-turn-three. That was a LONG fucking night!

[@section8usmc53]

@@FS2K4Pilot I'm not familiar with that terminology. Is that just a training squadron thing? Like how many training ops? Like if they are hot seating for practicing externals or something?

[@FS2K4Pilot]

@@section8usmc53 It meant we were safing and launching five birds plus backups, then usually hot-seating them (sometimes there’d be gripes that needed tinkering with), and then sending them back out, for a total of ten flights in one day. Most times the last birds wouldn’t be back until after dark. That extra turn-three meant that three birds got-seated and went out AGAIN. I was Night Crew, and I believe we slapped hands with day crew that morning (day crew had established hours, but night crew secured only once the schedule was complete and the next day’s birds were ready).

[@dallasbraham4377]

Great review! I'm with Mover... but I see Wombat's point, too...

[@kenh7181]

A) Difference between an RTU IP and Sq IP: nailed it. B) Why didn’t the IP coach more or just fly it himself? C) There has been a 60 yr sine wave on the importance of the USAF Advanced Instrument School; I see them making a comeback. D) NOTAM system; decades of pure unsat. E) The most disturbing thing was a comment on video #1 by a UPT IP who essentially said, “No surprise, the breakdown is starting here”. Dumbfounding if true.

[@geddyboom]

Keep in mind that each board member writes a portion of the report. The board president is ultimately responsible for its content but that was a team effort.

[@12what34the]

Wombat's lightin it up in this clip 😂

This is super interesting!

[@gernblansten684]

Inranks inspections may solve all of that.

[@crazypetec-130fe7]

Careful, you're gonna break the sarcasm-ometer.

[@crazypetec-130fe7]

In my head, Colonel Lord looks just like Jack Lord from old Hawaii 5-0. "Book 'em, Dan-o."

[@ecossearthur]

Getting it done...

[@chrisbrackin9678]

I firmly believe that in addition to getting the X's like Gonky said, the MAJCOM leadership and the units themselves are like "well the B-1 will be gone in a few years and we'll have the shiny new stealth bird. So who cares?" As long as everything checks out on paper, the leadership moves on and are focused on when they will get their hands on the new thing. I think the bomber community has had a huge dip in their focus since the B-21 was unveiled. Just my thoughts.

[@stuartjobling9360]

B-1B Lancer Fleet isn't going anywhere, retirement 2036 possibly longer, especially with the ongoing upgrades its had and having.

[@avrolancaster6987]

Is it a bit of taking an old complicated, reliable enough, but tough to fly jet a bit for granted, at the final 5 years or so if it in Squadrons? (F15Es are doing their job with tanker support... and Young crew will really find the analogue systems a mission to get on with.

[@BenjaminGSlade]

Really interesting analysis. For us non-military aviation types, it would be great if you could add the subtitles with the translation for an abbreviation the first few times it's used (although that would be a lot of work)

[@_Oz_]

17:35 - Shack 30:06 - Shack 2

[@CMDRSweeper]

Well regarding keeping it "In house", as it was mentioned... I think it has been in house and the sweeping under the rug have been going on for years. You know, you can only sweep stuff under the rug for so long until that rug seems to start growing legs and starts moving around and even leaving the building, and that is what happened here. Love it or hate it, when they don't listen, you got to take it higher up to correct it, culture be damned. Just like in IT security, you let the company know what you have found quietly and give them time to fix it, if they stone wall you, that is when you go public and air the dirty laundry in public so they HAVE to fix it. It isn't the report, the laundry or the security report you should be worried about, that is just the symptom, be worried when the bill for the security breach or the next time one of your aircraft smashes into an apartment block...

[@codyw1258]

I was going through a lot of mental health issues as an f16 crew chief and was away from my duties at an off base facility for 30 days and i had to watch other peoples command visit them while mine never did or cared. They tried to force me back onto the flightline prematurely and i didnt really have a choice. I was a SrA and the first day back i had to replace both stab ISAs by myself. Thank God it came back code 1 but its just an example of this culture problem. I got put shortly after that and it seems its getting worse

[@JarheadPJ]

Wombat hit the nail on the head…the AIB President was trying to make a statement. You can’t just comment on the Mishap Crew’s performance, because another crew landed safely; that shows a crew problem, not a community problem. It doesn’t matter what community you’re from in the Air Force, SORTS/DRRS runs promotions. If Sq/CC’s aren’t going to report the truth, then their people are going to “make the mission happen.” Then everyone gets promoted, because we are all “suddenly” GREEN on currencies, especially right before a deployment. Hence, Gonky’s comment about, “Eight X’s on one sortie.”

[@larryburdett6191]

Will Fini Flight ever be made into an audiobook?

[@Mike_Greentea]

Those crew members are currently peeling potatoes and cleaning bathrooms

[@terraoftime]

This report reads quite similarly to a few incident reports i have read during my time as a Nuclear operator on Subs.

[@couespursuit7350]

Flying a multi crew AC in the Navy in the 80's our instructors in the active duty SQD were as sharp as any military IP. Slow and low on final to the degree you describe is totally unsatisfactory and shows lack of awareness and/or judgement. this looks to be all low flight time experience and lack of situational awareness.

[@hallj00033]

What baffles me is that only the OG got fired. Everyone else as far as I tell is still is place. That's nuts! A report like that should have the WG/CC down to the Sq/CC gone.

[@SVSky]

It could still happen. Some senior enlisted will prob catch some heat too.

[@berniebinns3129]

I was an engine troop on c130's stationed at Dyess 96,05. I'm sure age is not helping the aircraft but it has always been a maintenance hog. 2 flights in 60 days seems like an extremely low ops tempo even for peace time. Wonder if they are flying the sim in the downtime to keep current.

[@PaulLoveless-Cincinnati]

Great question. I am imagining playing my two favorite video games twice in 60 days. It's far less complex than executing a complicated bomber mission however I know that I would turn into an anchor for my team instead of an asset.

[@crazypetec-130fe7]

4 fans of freedom 4ever, bro!

[@user-he5me9td1t]

60 days, hunting Xs...yup, it's real and I am guilty of be caught up in that when I was in uniform. It's what happens when you don't fly. The text makes me think this was written by a "Good O6" who was frustrated that his warnings were ignored. Sadly the "Good O6s" rarely, if ever, make O7...

[@richardthomson4693]

The recently released one of the V-22 down off darwin is not as bad but is still pretty brutal

[@afwaller]

Disaster. They kept ignoring the warnings, had plenty of chances to divert or land safely but didn’t until it was too late.

[@MrJibjab01]

i once got kicked off of the line for preventing a spot clean up quality assurance failure, went back out to retrieve my bag and foud out our leadership had my guys working on top of the jet with no harnesses. hope the whole chain burned, base Ellsworth has had the worst leadership out of any base ive ever been stationed at.

[@my-yt-inputs2580]

I kinda wonder why they didn't have a spare tail # ready as a backup for that mission. Not sure if that is something common within the B-1 community or not.

[@crazypetec-130fe7]

Bones are known for being hangar queens. At NCO academy in 2004, one of my classmates was a B-1 crew chief who said to launch one plane they would prep 4 and hope one of them would make it. So, they probably just didn't have enough backup planes to have another one ready.

[@my-yt-inputs2580]

@@crazypetec-130fe7 Retired Herk FE myself.

[@baybee8345]

22:38 The lack of airmanship has to be starting at UPT. The air force is "innovating" new ways to get the students through the program to get qualified with substantially less cost. I think AETC provides a lot of explanations as to why they are making these changes, but it's obvious that none of the changes are to increase pilot proficiency, they are to decrease cost. There are plenty of examples of this, the UPT 2.5 fiasco, overall decreased flight hours in the UPT program being replaced by simulator time, even a new for 2024 program that only routes studs to the T-1, with the caveat of a greatly shortened class length. The basic airmanship that was the cause of this mishap (getting low and slow on final without recognizing it) isn't something that should be taught and refined in the B-1 flight lead upgrade, it's something you should have mastered in the T-6.

[@dougstitt1652]

Two thumbs up for the O-6 but like guys said he might have whacked his carrier . Sad politics of upper management . Be safe all

[@Tillersweep]

1971 Kunsan Korea. Exactly the same. Fill the training boxes every 6 months. 8 hours after a 4 ship brief, to taking off in a different tail numbered single aircraft to fly around the flagpole. If you can't check the training boxes you MUST get the hours. Nothing has changed. Beating this drum...are you kidding? 1971 is 50 years ago. It is what happens in the peacetime Air Force. I never saw this happening even once in 1972 in Udorn Thailand. Maintainers always had the right Aircraft ready on time. Of course that wasn't peacetime.

[@AG-un7dz]

Sounds like great candidates for Southwest Airlines.

[@timmiller4875]

AIB pez is hand-picked O-6 in the cue for star. His 4-star needs hard facts if he is going to fix the problem. Sure wish someone had the stones in 2007 before a similar circus at Minot when they flew 6 nukes across the US

[@avrolancaster6987]

Colonel Lord omg.... some people are destined to reach Colonel.... isn't there a Colonel Colonel... or is it Major Major in.... Catch 22?

[@johnbryant2527]

Having been on a few Accident Boards, this report and verbal brief at HQ is how they get promoted. I also wonder if the Board President wanted to be the Wing CC and got something else .

[@Ryanboy2020]

If you are in the military and you weigh 265 pounds you better be 7 foot 5 inches tall. We know this guy wasnt that tall or he wouldn't have fit in the bomber, therefore, its totally unsat.

[@DavidR-f6z]

Body fat percentage matters.

[@Ryanboy2020]

@@DavidR-f6z Yah the fattys usually do use that as their justification for being out of shape. Good point.

[@Gilbertmk2]

When you have an egregious leadership failure like this, I think the dirty laundry needs to be aired out. If you don't want everybody to see your dirty laundry, don't let your organization get this bad.

[@MrBarbuster]

sounds the same as only 3 aircraft carriers operating right now. and none in the pacific

[@robmorgan1214]

Some general has screwed the pooch with this command. If you can't staff the squadron it doesn't fly... if you can't afford the parts or gas to run a skeleton crew squadron it doesn't fly. If the general says do it anyways then tries blaming the kids who weren't properly trained equipped supplied supervised etc. the buck stops with the guy who got congressional approval and decided to always bet on black even though the maintenence guys found motberf--king snakes on the motherf--kin plane!

[@stargazer2504]

I have to agree with WOMBAT at the end- It's a $450M loss report, of taxpayer dollars. Fortunately the injuries were relatively minor. But EVERY ASPECT should be documented. Whether the guy was 265# and didn't report it, if the guy didn't wear gloves, etc., It should be IN the report. Now, If the Air Force goes after the crew for such anomalies is a different thing, but it being documented SHOULD be in the report. If the finder of fact knows something, and leaves it out, that is wrong and misleading.

[@erniemccracken8131]

Damn Wombat!

[@subatomicparticle6535]

The military sounds like Boeing.

[@MarkD-pl4fu]

With all of that, no one will spend one day in confinement nor reduction of rank. Back to business as usual. The officers protect each other. The US Military is a joke.

[@timmiller4875]

Too bad they weren’t in the Secret Service… they’d all be home free.

[@TeemarkConvair]

"where's the rest of it"''... Lawn care

[@peewee102100]

They should have left them with the KSANG. They had the highest FMC rate and lowest cost per flying hour. Of course they lost them.

[@marktisdale7935]

Wombat was in here trying to be nice to everyone.

[@TheRetiredtech]

What is that guy at the bottom 14:21 of screen even doing in this discussion. He seems about as prepared for being here as the crew was to fly.

[@germb747]

Why do we have to wait for accidents to happen to identify poor leadership climate in Air Force organizations?

[@bullhornzz]

Ukrane is looking for retired F15 pilots, you or Gonky looking for a job?

[@williamdykes2750]

Hang on a sec. How is it possible that military aviators go to civ docs in the ville? Is that a real thing these days? 26 years of activity duty flying in the Marines; I never saw a civilian doctor until after I retired in 2000.

[@dolly22215]

What’s the relevance of someone not wearing gloves? Lack of helmet I get, just not the issue re gloves.

[@36w3s.talbot4]

Well, in report writing in LE and in the courts. If you don't document your findings it never happened. Better to document facts than opinions.

[@bluehornet6752]

Don't these squadrons have simulators these guys can fly? It might cost a million bucks or so, but it seems a LOT cheaper than buying (or repairing) a B-1. If you can't afford to fly a real as much, then why not at least fly a simulator?

[@jamestamu83]

The bottom commentator should have read the report before appearing on this program. He provided no insight and kept asking redundant questions. Detracted from the discussion.

[@stevewhite3424]

Jeesh, bitching about run on sentences and nitpicking. Its a complete mystery how things are this bad. /s

[@ed0c]

they are accepting lower quality to fill quotas

[@FLAC2023]

I highly doubt that it really was as bad as they say... Lots of lies and backstabbing going on here...

[@CentralStateMower]

Wow! pretty scathing report about systemic problems at Ellsworth AFB... Sounds like there was plenty of blame to go around.

[@indy500tabasco8]

👽👽👽👽🤡👽👽👽👽

[@warfarenotwarfair5655]

Democrats cutting thousands of experienced airmen from 2005-2015 and the introduction of DEI which introduced low standards has lead to a lot of mishaps. I entered the USAF as a Crew Chief in 1999 and nearly all of the guys I worked with were simply cut by Democrats and or retired. They all told me the experience cut was never regained and the Democrat politics has made sure the wrong people were promoted. It's going to take years to get back that sharp edge.

[@bryanbishop2377]

The current Sec of Trans is the driving force behind "sticking it to the man."

[@allenseeallendo5844]

Bro right off the rip WHO CARES! Dude could have Chlamydia for all we know. He might have a swollen knee and been on naproxen. Thats such a cheap cop out for the military it’s laughable. I get it strategic aircraft US military bomber command worth 500 million plus bombs. If this is really that important the military needs to be taking care of these guys better and taking the pressure off them that they NEED TO FLY.

[@paulrun111]

I'm glad they went ham on the woke leadership

[@VexaliaRose]

What part of this has to do with being "woke" ? It was complacency and lack of airmanship.

[@paulrun111]

​@@VexaliaRoseI thought that when referring to incompetent leadership and poor command... They even reference "dei"

[@crash8926]

@@VexaliaRoseAs much as some do not like the term woke, we must acknowledge that everything matters, especially during and after a mishap. This country has dropped so many standards in the name of…the military is not the place to drop standards. We now have more corner cutting and lax attitudes. When you say something small like fingernails and hair doesn’t matter, or the fact that someone is overweight is not an issue, it is only a matter of time when all other standards start to follow. This is why woke and DEI need to go away! It all connects at the end of the day! Whether we like it or not! I’m retired military and I’ve seen it since 2011. We are in some scary times.

[@crash8926]

You have a point that may fall on deaf ears!

[@dmac7128]

@@crash8926 The implication that "woke" and "dei" is the underlying cause for the decline in standards is BS. Standards have gotten worse long before "woke" or "dei" became fashionable terms. I can tell you that when you have senior leadership at the national level that expects its military to do more with less, that instills a strong incentive to cut corners, defer maintenance, grant waivers, and sweep things under the rug. And you have equipment that is being pushed beyond their service lives. That's because if one goes by the book, unit may not be able to deploy and that CO doesn't get promoted.

[@oldftrpilot2593]

They crashed one on a non precision approach in the early 90s, very similar, same runway, same dumb things occurred.