Ballistics gel hunting vs match bullets episode 3 Berger hybrids

#BergerHybrids #hunting #ballistics #longrange #bullets
Testing 30 cal 215 gr Berger hybrids at 2550 fps impact velocity and 1800 fps impact velocity for hunting. Thanks Jon Faubion for the bullets for this test.

[@biggs8729]

Shot an elk with this bullet (215 Berger Hybrid) last winter at 300 yards, 2545 fps, left side quartering about 15-20 degrees away. Bullet entered about 6 inches further back than I planned and cut the liver. Full penetration thru the elk with massive internal damage and shed all the lead out of the jacket. She went about 30 yards and stiffened up until she fell over. The base of the jacket was presses against the ribs on the opposite side and cracked a rib without exiting. I thought it performed well. To get to your low velocity load, I would have to shoot 1150 yards. That's a little farther than I like to shoot. Totally happy with this bullet, but due to availability, will be switching to 225 ELDM this winter. Thanks for the good reviews and good advice.

[@lynncoleman576]

Good job 👍

[@jowhi9296]

Almost fit a basketball inside when the slow motion is played. So cool how faster speed it appears expansion occurred more towards the front while the slower the basketball was more towards the exit side

[@longrangehuntinggroup7223]

That's where we preach knowledge of your bullet and shot placement. The higher velocity impact the faster it will expand and start the temporary wound cavity. The lower velocity it won't open as fast and starting the temporary wound cavity a little farther in. This is where some people get confused and think the bullet "blew up" because it caused a large entry hole just under the hide. What has happened is they hit with such a high velocity with that bullet that it started the temporary wound cavity right under the skin and hydraulic shock ripped a big entrance hole. The bullet can be in tact with the big entrance hole and have a smaller exit hole. People don't what they are looking at and they just think it blew up and the exit is a just a piece. Or no exit but they don't look for the bullet and it's expanded in the body

[@WhiskeyTangoFoxtraught]

The Army’s sniper rounds use Berger's .30-cal., 215-grain hybrid bullets in Lapua brass. Not what you were talking about in the beginning, maybe it was the FMJ 556? Remember, the Army has a million things to take into account when selecting ammo, laws, logistics, cost, pHit, pKill, etc etc. keep up these videos, good info!

[@longrangehuntinggroup7223]

The army uses the M118 sniper rounds which is lake city brass and Sierra match kings.

[@jowhi9296]

First shot was impact of 2550 if I recall. What range is that actually for that setup?

[@longrangehuntinggroup7223]

It depends on environment conditions attitude etc but it's around 475 yards at 2550 for the setup

[@henryhenry5897]

I wonder does that count for all Berger hybrid target ? I can’t find 215 but 230 I’m very tempted to try them ... I’m still playing with eldx 220 to get tighter groups but if they don’t I’m thinking to try Berger

[@longrangehuntinggroup7223]

Yes it's going to be the same with the different grs 168, 215, 230, etc. I'm not personally a fan of the eld x. It's the same jacket, core, at tip but there's differences in the shape, jacket thickness, tapered jacket, etc that makes it not perform as well as the eld match. The x also because of that has a higher minimum impact velocity limiting your range. Lots of people have trouble getting the eld x to shoot well. That's one reason why most people run the match.

[@henryhenry5897]

@@longrangehuntinggroup7223 yes i understand, here in Canada I only have acces to 195eldm or 185vld hunting or 230hybrid or 220sierra match king but only the hollow point not tipped once ... not sure wich to pick us like to get 300-500 so I have so to shoot ... I get single as and es with the eldx but hard to sub moa at a 100 I haven’t tested if it performes better at 500 for groups ... but my lapua scenar shoot same hole but garbage for hunting

[@longrangehuntinggroup7223]

195 eld match and 230 hybrids

[@henryhenry5897]

@@longrangehuntinggroup7223 I’m about to order I’ll get some 195eldm and I just seen the 230 are hybrid OTM they don’t have regular hybrids anymore ... and it seems OTM behave differently than hybrid they have 200 grain hybrid target I think I’m gonna try them as their close too as far as bc and same bullet what u tester but I hole eldm will be good as they cheaper than Berger. Thanks again I’ll let u know how it’s going

[@longrangehuntinggroup7223]

The Berger hybrids target is what I tested. Good luck keep me updated and if you have any questions don't hesitate to ask

[@legallimitoutdoors9917]

Okay you're BAD ASS 🤜🤛 bro Finley someone that's really showing the rell life shot a animal hide and showing the real penetration of a bullet through hair skin and meat and muscle. Instead of this b******* shot placements in paper and cardboard thank you so much for the video I'm really impressed in your show. 🇺🇸 2A 🇺🇸 👌

[@stevenroberts9212]

Which hybrids are they the hunting or target ?

[@longrangehuntinggroup7223]

Hybrid target

[@HarvestAlaska]

What do u think about the hornady black for hunting

[@longrangehuntinggroup7223]

The Hornady black with the amax or eld match is great. I don’t recommend the Hornady black with the bthp.

[@davidmatthews4692]

What is the difference between the Berger hybrid target and the Berger long range hybrid? Is there a difference in terminal performance?

[@longrangehuntinggroup7223]

There is very small differences for external ballistics (BC) but the terminal performance is the same. Basically it has a little bit better center of gravity and bc for better external ballistics performance down range. It still has the same terminal performance and minimum impact velocity for expansion of 1600 fps.

[@davidmatthews4692]

@@longrangehuntinggroup7223 Thank you sir!

[@paulmeek7964]

Thinking about using ATips in my 6.5 PRC 135 grain. Get mixed results but going to give it a try

[@longrangehuntinggroup7223]

I’ve had great results with the a tips dropped two deer at 513 yards and 516 yards last year. 6mm creedmoor 110 a tips did quite the job. The A tips are just a improved version of the eld match. I have multiple gel test videos here with a tips and the hunting video from Oklahoma last year

[@paulmeek7964]

Thanks

[@longrangehuntinggroup7223]

@@paulmeek7964 no problem if you have any questions don’t hesitate to ask

[@paulmeek7964]

Gel test with A tips 13t grain in 6.5

[@longrangehuntinggroup7223]

@@paulmeek7964 I’ve done them in 6mm and 30 caliber. They will have the same type of results the only difference will be the scale of the performance. So going smaller it’s like shrinking the scale and going large it’s like growing the scale. If you watch the episode 22 with the tmk’s I give a good example of this.

[@jeremymitchell1241]

I have loaded up some 140 elite hunters for my 6.5 prc. Haven't hunted with them yet. Any experience with using these? Be for whitetail and hogs.

[@longrangehuntinggroup7223]

Good bullet you will have very similar results to the hybrid in the video. Good luck on you hunting season and happy hunting.

[@jeremymitchell1241]

@@longrangehuntinggroup7223 Thank you sir for your information. Love the videos.

[@longrangehuntinggroup7223]

@@jeremymitchell1241no problem always happy to help.

[@zoidelux]

Is that a PM2 on that rifle? 🤪, would that be your top preferred optic?

[@longrangehuntinggroup7223]

Yes Schmidt and bender PM2 5-25x56mm with a Horus H59 reticle. I have two of these scopes one on the 300 wm and one on my 6 creedmoor. Hands down one of my favorite scopes of all time.

[@zoidelux]

@@longrangehuntinggroup7223 man i really want a tier 1 scope like that, have for years, im going to get one soon and would love a pm2, but i just noticed the MOA version has much less elevation total adjustments than the mil pm2.. do you use the mil version? I had one mil scope in the past but i just wanna stick to moa

[@longrangehuntinggroup7223]

I have them in mils. Honestly both mil and moa are the same thing. They are both angular systems the only difference is how much of a angle. If you need 12 moa for your shot dial 12 moa. If you need 5.6 mils for your shot dial 5.6 mils and send it. People tend to try and over complicate it when there's no reason to. You will get to a point where you will think in mils or moa not inches or feet. If I'm doing truing and load development and miss 1.2 mils off. I don't think how many inches is that I think 1.2 mils. You will automatically think of that and adjust quickly. The other thing especially with Horus reticles I can use the reticle to see my adjustment. If I hit steel low left of center. I can hold my reticle on target center then see where I impacted in relation to the marks in the reticle. I take that spot and move it center and send it. This allows you quick accurate corrections without having to try and do math

[@simonsmith9363]

The Hague Convention of 1899, Declaration III, prohibited the use in international warfare of bullets that easily expand or flatten in the body. It is a common misapprehension that hollow-point ammunition is prohibited by the Geneva Conventions.

[@russellfleet7636]

Have you tested the .338 berger elite hunter 300 gr .I have and lost both animals I shot .I had made sure that the tips were open only a couple drops of blood and watched the trace go in the crease behind the shoulder. I gage pined the hp frome .031 to .040 .I'm thinking the hp needs to be a little bit bigger. What are your thoughts. I'm going to do some testing on ballistics jell to confirm my thoughts.

[@longrangehuntinggroup7223]

Hey what’s your muzzle velocity, impact velocity, and distance? It’s important for troubleshooting.

[@russellfleet7636]

Mz vel 3010 impact #1 was 1750 vel 1240 yards on a black bear ran after impact a small amount of 🫁 blood froth for 100 yards . Brought blood dog in lost it after a hour #2 was 2470 vel 485 yards on a wolf it went down and laid there took 40 min to get to it hiking and it was gone when I got there 1 drop of blood. Did not use dog to try to find. Sorry I was at work and didn't make any sense on my answer. Earlier

[@longrangehuntinggroup7223]

@@russellfleet7636 okay so first addressing the bullet itself. Generally with 338’s and larger you get a thicker jacket. A good example is the eld match. 22-30 cal are all the same jacket thickness etc. the 285 gr eld match in 338 has a thicker jacket more like a sst or eld x. This on top of a high sectional density is counter productive to expansion. A great video I’ll link showing this is my video showing you can out perform a 50 bmg with a 223. The 50 bmg 750 gr amax isn’t like the other Amax’s. It’s got a thicker jacket and really high sectional density. The result it will pencil through as it doesn’t have the necessary impact resistance and depth of penetration to expand. So you will see it zip straight through the ballistics gel without really doing anything. In the video I link to another test with the same bullet by jerry mclick. Due to those factors you won’t get as good of performance out of your 338. Also due to this you will have a higher minimum impact velocity requirement. The Bergers generally has a 1600 fps minimum impact velocity except the vld line and the 338 and up. Those will be between 1800-2000 fps minimum impact velocity. That will depend on the animal and shot placement. Now on to your hunting shots starting with the bear. Contrary to popular belief bears though dangerous are very low impact resistant animals. That’s where lots of people get into trouble hunting them. They use bullets that have thick jackets thinking they need it and it just pencils through. The size is very deceptive due to the fur. It makes them appear much larger than they are. Skinned they are very similar to humans. They have thin skin under the fur and the fatty greasy meat especially in the fall acts like lubricant. So you don’t experience a lot of impact resistance to cause the bullet to expand. Your shot was just under the minimum impact velocity I would recommend for a higher impact resistant animal like a moose at 1800 fps. For something like a bear you would require at least 2000 fps minimum impact velocity. So the combination of the bears body being low impact resistant. The bullets high sectional density and thicker jacket. Finally hitting it under the minimum impact velocity. The bullet didn’t have what it required to perform and simply penciled through. Going with a 30 cal or smaller with the same type of match bullet will actually give you better results and that would have turned out different with better performance. Now with your wolf that’s not a high impact resistant animal either and doesn’t have a lot of penetration required. The bullet again required more resistance to expand compared to the 22-30 cals. When you hit it by the time it started to expand where you would start to see performance it was exiting the body. If you do gel testing or watch the video I provide with the linked video with the 50 bmg. With jerry it didn’t start expanding until the second block. Animals you really have the hide, ribs, and meat for penetration and expansion. Once in the chest cavity there’s a lot of dead space in the lungs full of air. So with a wolf you’re looking around 8”-10” total. Hitting the opposite side would aid in the expansion however by that time it’s already through the vitals. So it’s not doing you any good. Honestly with any bullet going 338 and up isn’t going to give people the extra performance they think it will. Unless you’re dealing with high impact resistance animals with lots of depth of penetration it will be counterproductive. When you watch the video when I’m doing the 6 creedmoor you will see it penetrates quite a bit before expanding. The high sectional density and speed by the time it starts to open it’s halfway in. The 338 with the heavy for caliber 300 gr is going to be more for penetration before expansion. The hp hole really doesn’t matter as that’s a hybrid design. It’s got a massive cavity inside the nose of the bullet. So upon impact the nose collapses in forcing expansion. The 338 though is thicker and requires more force by impact. Couple things you can do is either go with a lighter bullet to reduce the sectional density and velocity. Or you can simply go with 30 cal or smaller where you have bullets that will expand at lower velocities and will less required impact resistance. You could also still run your 300 gr and just do high shoulder that will drop them and increase impact resistance. However if you’re off your could potentially be in the same situation. Hope this helps if you have any more questions or clarification just let me know. Happy hunting

[@longrangehuntinggroup7223]

@@russellfleet7636 here’s the video links kzbin.info/www/bejne/qWjQoJqad7iIabs

[@longrangehuntinggroup7223]

@@russellfleet7636 here’s the link to Jerry’s video kzbin.info/www/bejne/a3ucmXZ6p5dko9E

[@TheHybridHunter307]

These absolutely work on elk.

[@longrangehuntinggroup7223]

They are very good bullets on anything in North America and animals around the world. The testing and hunting results are incredible

[@ozark_trapper]

I just started watching your video's great job. I have a question. I have a browning x bolt 280 Ackley Improved ordered. It has a 26 inch 1@8 twist barrel. I started looking at hornady 166 gr A Tip. The hornady 162 gr eld m. Berger in 180 gr hybrid 184gr hybrid 190gr hybrid. The Bergers will work with a 1@9 twist. But the hornady 166 gr is the heaviest i can shoot out of the 1@9. The 175gr or 180 gr eld m takes a 1@8 twist. I am having a hard time finding Bergers in stock. But the hornadys are in stock. I didnt know about the berger 150gr classic hunter. 175gr elite hunter, 195gr elite hunter bullets. I have several boxes of berger 168 gr vld bullets. I am going to use nosler 280AI brass. I live in Arkansas. My longest shot would be 550 yards. Which bullet would you try first out of the hornadys?

[@longrangehuntinggroup7223]

Hey bud welcome to the channel glad you’re enjoying the videos. So all Bergers except for the vld line are good bullets. All except the vld’s are a hybrid design and amazing bullets for external ballistics and terminal ballistics. Hornady eld match is a amazing bullet so is the a tips. The a tips are just a improved version of the eld match. Any of those listed except the vld’s will do everything you want and more. I personally prefer a tip polymer or aluminum but the Bergers I still run too. My guns all like eld match and a tips best. I’d recommend going with heavier bullets 160 gr and up for best results. Berger has a great stability calculator that you can play with and see how each bullet weight will stabilize. Here’s the link bergerbullets.com/twist-rate-calculator/ Play with that and then you can see what the best options are. You have a few good options there to pick from. Find what it shoots best and master it. Hope this helps if you have any more questions don’t hesitate to ask. Happy hunting

[@ozark_trapper]

@@longrangehuntinggroup7223 i told you wrong on the browning x bolt. Its a 26 inch barrel 1@8 twist NOT a 1@9. The bullets i can get to try. Berger 7mm 150gr classic hunter 180gr hybrid 190gr hybrid. Hornady 7mm 162 gr x or m 175gr x or m 180gr x or m. I was going to try a box in Berger and a box in Hornady. Which bullets would u suggest me trying? In your testing would u get the Hornady x or m bullet?

[@longrangehuntinggroup7223]

@@ozark_trapper get the 180 or 190 gr hybrid and the 180 eld match. Those are the best choice’s.

[@ozark_trapper]

@@longrangehuntinggroup7223 i live in Arkansas. Our deer about size ones in Tn. Would u still go with the 180 gr bullets?

[@longrangehuntinggroup7223]

@@ozark_trapper yup those I recommended will work on deer or anything else you want to hunt in North America.

[@jowhi9296]

Have any of these fragmented yet

[@longrangehuntinggroup7223]

All have had some of the lead and jacket fragment inside the wound cavity. The bullet has still gone through though no full fragmenting

[@jameshagerman7681]

Do I think animal weight matters all that much, no. Especially not for someone like myself who isn't interested in shooting game past 200 yards. These videos still hold value for me as I tend to use somewhat milder cartridges or loads so my impact velocity may be the same at 200 yards that yours is it 350 yards or a bit further.

[@biggs8729]

To save meat, just Use a bullet that doesn't do a lot of damage and shoot the elk 3 or 4 times, Duhh :)

[@matthewkyle6939]

Corelokts aren't terrible depending on what you use them for. For those who aren't shooting at animals at long ranges they work great. My dad has killed more animals with them than probably anyone on your channel have killed. But he doesn't really shoot long range. Not that he can't. He just chooses not too. I don't think he's ever shot at an animal past 500 yards. That being said. Are there better bullets yeah. But that doesn't mean they are junk. Just not a good choice for your intended purpose. They are reliable and cheap for the guy trying to shoot animals at 250 yards.

[@Ezerhoden950]

When the core-lokt bullet was introduced in 1939 i don’t think many hunters even considered 500 yard shots. It’s a decent inexpensive bullet for under 250 yards. Definitely not a long range bullet, interesting that they destabilize and hit sideways so consistently in your test.

[@matthewkyle6939]

@@Ezerhoden950 they are good to longer than than 250 yards. I wouldn't think twice about using them out to 400.