Battle of the Ports - Hexen: Beyond Heretic (ヘクセン) Show 433 - 60fps

[@Swordslinger-hb1ns]

Fun fact: the N64 port of Hexen was the first Nintendo 64 game to have 4 player split screen multiplayer 3 months ahead of Rare’s Goldeneye 007 on the same console. #moreyouknow

[@RetroCore]

Nice, I didn't know that.

[@the757general2]

Wrong. That would be Mario Kart 64. N64 Hexen was the first console FPS to have 4 player split screen.

[@dougr.8653]

A classic game from the golden era of FPS. Doom, Hexen, Duke Nukem and Dark forces pushed the limits of my 486 DX4 100Mhz. I enjoyed the N64 version as well. Great video. 👍

[@RetroCore]

The N64 version is surprisingly good.

[@RolanTheBrave]

I had a 486 dx4 100! - an upgrade compared to the 486 sx 20 i had before!

[@JorgeAraujo97]

Had a DX4-100 as well. Bought in January 1996 after suffering three years with a 286. Too bad it was so outdated by early 1997. xD

[@MrNightshade2010]

@@RetroCore you need to do dark forces tho

[@matttheshadowman2790]

Man this era of FPS. Was a real wild time full of experimentation.

[@RetroCore]

It sure was!

[@shaggymcdaniel3216]

I played the hell out of Heretic back when it was new. Never knew there was a sequel until about 10 years ago. It runs great on the Saturn. I just wish there was mouse support.

[@lordmaximus780]

Bit of justice for the Saturn with this port, which is nice to see. Doom on the Saturn was just a plain, out and out wrong-un.

[@topofbones]

Amazing port for the N64! Nothing to envy the PC DOS one Thanks for this BotP!

[@RetroCore]

You're welcome.

[@orderofmagnitude-TPATP]

What a way to finish the week. Driving back from London to Wiltshire where I live and this popped up...listening while driving now

[@RetroCore]

Make sure to only listen while driving :)

[@Midekai]

I remember I would always watch dad play the PC version because I would get stuck very easy at certain parts. It was a fun and unique game at the time

[@atomiswave2]

I don't understand why Retro Core doesn't have like millions of subscribers.

[@RetroCore]

Me too! Help spread the word 😁😉

[@slashrose3287]

Saturn version is the only SS game which uses VDP2 to create full 3D background, instead of the "usual" infinity plane for floor and/or ceiling, game programmers should be very proud of this achivement.

[@RetroCore]

Really? Wow, I would have thought a few others would have also used it. Nice use of the hardware.

[@ANG4TW]

@@slashrose3287 Hexen (Sat, PS1) is like Doom (Sat) completely Software rendered e.g CPU rendered, no VDP1 usage at all.

[@thrillington2008]

PC is a great sprite scaling FPS (pre-polygonal). PS1 is a streamlined experience. Saturn is an improvement. N64 is a beautiful game within limitations.

[@KISSbestfan]

A classic one! Imo the darker vibe even adds more into the game, especially when played late night with lights turned off :P At least thats how I used to play it!

[@flink1231]

Battle of the ports always motivates me to play the game, even when it is a game I previously ignored like hexen. Great episode!

[@RetroCore]

Glad to hear that.

[@WeskerSega]

One of the few games of that generation where a comparison can be made between the Sega Saturn, PlayStation and Nintendo 64. Unfortunately it wasn't the case with that many.

[@RetroCore]

Indeed. The N64 never got many multiplatform titles.

[@davistoa]

Don't forget to include PC. Literally every platform of the time had a comparable version.

[@erickhauser2322]

One of the most downloaded DOS games from a BBS I ran back in the day.

[@solarflare9078]

Then BBS got destroyed because of Vinesauce Joel

[@sebastiann.8088]

​@@solarflare9078I swear I see you everywhere

[@testuser5071]

such a classic game, love the graphics

[@edumafra82]

Love the Heretic/Hexen franchise!

[@puertoricanguy999]

Why this game, and the rest of the series, still haven't gotten any modern console ports or remasters is beyond me.

[@raypuiaascii4653]

Blame Activision for that. They should allow the source code of Heretic II to be released, it's a shame this masterpiece never got ports to other systems

[@JudgmentStorm]

@@raypuiaascii4653 Agreed. When id Software opened the source code for Doom, we got some nice ports. Doomsday, GZDoom, you name it. I'd like to see a 64-bit Heretic II port done similarly to Quake II's RTX version.

[@NoExplosionsMcgee]

@@raypuiaascii4653 Well now that Microsoft owns them, maybe a Serpent Rider collection on all modern platforms can happen?

[@ats2099]

So many games have gone on to take what Hexen did and expand upon it so much. I watch this and wonder if there had ever been a Skyrim without this. TBH, I didn't play this because I was only on a console at the time and didn't like the console versions of most FPS games until much later when the tech caught up and there were analog controllers.

[@JorgeAraujo97]

The N64 version is mighty impressive for what it is. The textures are really good, especially taking account it's a cartridge. I really would love to see those Doom clones remastered with ray tracing and touched up textures, without messing with the great atmosphere from the mid-90's.

[@DarkLink1996.]

Is it really a clone if it's built from the same engine and framework?

[@realfamiliarfez]

my dream has finally come true a battle of the ports episode on hexen

[@SomeOrangeCat]

Hexen running on the Saturn as well as it does, is proof that the problem with that Saturn port of Doom was the developer, not the hardware.

[@RetroCore]

Absolutely right.

[@thefurthestmanfromhome1148]

@@RetroCore John Carmack was the problem with Saturn Doom, as coder Jim Bagley explained: initially, I wanted to use the Saturn’s hardware to its max potential, and wrote a render engine to display the PC levels drawing the walls with the GPU, the problem I came across, was apparently John Carmack wasn’t happy about this, he wanted it to look exactly the same as the PC version, but it looked a lot nicer, and was running full screen at 60fps, he said it had to be drawn using the CPU, and not the GPU, he even suggested I used the two DSPs on the Saturn to render the screen, but as they only have 4KB, and if I remember correctly, as it’s been a very long time since I used one, 2KB code space and 2KB data space, doing it this way to render a complete screen full of game, would have been a huge memory bandwidth bottleneck, so I ignored that, and did it using the two SH2s to render the screen, each of the two CPUs splitting the draw time, doing a line each of the walls or floors, and to save time having to reduce the PC levels to fit into the Saturn’s memory, we decided to use the Playstation levels as they had a smaller memory footprint than the PC ones, so it made sense to convert the PlayStation levels, I was quite happy with the end result, as the SH2s ran at 33Mhz and 28Mhz respectively, and I remember playing doom on a 33Mhz PC and it having to play in a stamp sized display to play at a reasonable rate, where as the Saturn was pretty much full screen but this isn’t dissing John Carmack, he’s a very talented coder and clever bloke all round, it’s more me being proud of what speed I got out of two relatively slow cpus.

[@SomeOrangeCat]

@@RetroCore No. The problem was the coder of the Saturn port of Doom. Because here we have a different game running the Doom engine just fine.

[@juststatedtheobvious9633]

@@SomeOrangeCat Who didn't need to deal with John Carmack's bullshit. So quit spreading yours.

[@SomeOrangeCat]

@@juststatedtheobvious9633 We have one guy's account of an engine nobody has even seen vs one of the greatest coders who ever lived. Come at me with your real account next time.

[@freddiejohnson6137]

I always wonder how close to the original the N64 version could have been if it had a larger cartridge capacity and utilised the expansion pak as for what it was it was a pretty solid port and like many N64 games really surfers from such limited storage for games.

[@lyrand6408]

I still remember how my cousin (with whom I played a lot of games on various platforms in the 90s) never liked this game much, but I always bothered him to play it when I rented it (especially for the Nintendo 64 version). I'd sometimes go to his place for a week-end sleepover and didn't tell him I brought my rented copy and took it out of the bag and he reacted with disgust, like "You seriously rented this game AGAIN..." haha. I still play it from time to time, although I play the Steam version on PC (without any mods, as original as I can run it). I especially think that the game's general atmosphere / ambience and soundscape is what "does it" for me, beyond its actual gameplay. It's a gritty, moody game. And as I type this right now we're approaching Halloween... I think I'll have another go at it in a few days for the occasion. Great video, thank you.

[@raydenedge4569]

La versión de Saturn tiene opción de pantalla completa

[@RetroCore]

That's right but the framerate is poor.

[@RGT85]

I liked Hexen 64. My eyes didn't though. lol

[@Myako]

Great video, as usual. 👏🏻👏🏻💪🏻💪🏻 The PC version also has one of the most amazing upscale packs available for use on source ports, by the way.

[@RetroCore]

That's right. I was tempted to feature that but it's not right as it isn't original. But great for playing Hexen with though.

[@WeskerSega]

The multiplayer cooperative and deathmatch game modes of the Sega Saturn version are hidden because they are unfortunately unfinished. It seems this was in their initial plans and was worked on, but for some reason (probably either budget or time constraints, or maybe the fact that the link cable was never available outside Japan) they were discarded and left unfinished. The game is even oficially referenced as a 1 player game so this is actually a leftover left as a curiosity for people wanting to try it, which is unusual as these unfinished things are usually removed completely, or remain unaccessed, but here they thought it would be a good idea to have everyone try them on the secret cheat menu. It's a shame, because there are few link cable multiplayer games on the console and this would have been a nice addition (even the shoddy Sega Saturn version of Doom features them), even with the odd fact that the other human player is always facing you (no matter if he is moving towards you or not) because of the one sided animations limitation. I have tested this several times with the appropiate two TVs, two consoles, two games and link cable setup, but neither game is able to last much because of connecting interruptions and you are not able to advance to different levels either. Now I wonder if this was being worked on the PlayStation version too, which doesn't have any remnant of it at all. By the way, and speaking about multiplayer modes, IIRC the cooperative game mode of the Nintendo 64 version is restricted to 2 players, while the deathmatch mode is the one which is possible to play up to 4 players.

[@RetroCore]

Does the PSX even have a link cable? I can't recall ever reading about linkable PSX games.

[@WeskerSega]

@@RetroCore It does. And it has way more link cable compatible games than the Sega Saturn ever did, partly because the PlayStation link cable was released outside Japan, unlike the Sega Saturn taisen cable. The PlayStation has about 55 games compatible with the link cable (the Sega Saturn has 7 games, including the buggy hidden mode in Hexen), and while on the PlayStation definitely Hexen is not one of them (Doom on the other hand is compatible, that's the only link compatible game both consoles share, you also have Duke Nukem 3D even though that's not a link compatible mode on the Sega Saturn, it's a Netlink compatible game), there are several games which have the link cable functionality in the PlayStation but it's absent on the Sega Saturn counterpart, for example Andretti Racing, Independence Day (even though the Sega Saturn version of this one references it on the instruction manual, so it was probably planned for that version as well) and The Need for Speed, but it is especially the case of several Psygnosis games shared by both consoles: Assault Rigs, Destruction Derby, Krazy Ivan, Wipeout and Wipeout 2097, all of them are link cable compatible on the PlayStation but not on the Sega Saturn. All of the Psygnosis Sega Saturn games are exclusively 1 player because of that particular reason, while the other Eletronic Arts games (including Independence Day) I mentioned earlier at least can still be played in multiplayer in their respective Sega Saturn versions because of their split screen modes. Lastly, Reverthion and Steeldom are the only games shared by both consoles which have link cable functionality on the Sega Saturn but not on the PlayStation.

[@the757general2]

@@WeskerSega That's not all true. N64 Hexen does indeed have 4 player co-op. I would know because my friends played the game with me back in the day.

[@jesuszamora6949]

Amazing game all around, and I can't imagine anyone being unhappy with any of the versions. However, if you were going for a console port, the N64 is definitely the nicest one. Shame about that controller.... I'm impressed that the game supports JUMPING as well as looking up and down. Must have been quite a bit of work back in the day to get that working so well on a DOS machine.

[@shattered-reflection8045]

Love the content. I would like to make a suggestion to add chapters for people that want to see a specific version

[@RetroCore]

There are chapters using the time codes. They work on Windows PC's and mobile devices. Not sure about consoles though.

[@shattered-reflection8045]

@@RetroCore Sorry I'm so used to the others now haha. Thanks!

[@shotgunl]

I loved Hexen and Heretic, though I didn't play Heretic until after Hexen. The first time I played Hexen, my friend lent me his floppy copy, and I played through that on our 25Mhz 486SX PC...and it was pretty slow, with any screen size above about 1/2 or 2/3 being Perfect Dark in hi-res with explosions or tranqs/n-bomb level of unplayable. DooM ran better on that PC, especially in low-detail mode. Still managed to have a lot of fun, but didn't really get to play it well until getting a new PC in '97 (and, I borrowed the disks again instead of buying Hexen). I never did actually buy the PC version of Hexen until on Steam, but I did buy the Heretic CD release in '97/'98. And, though I have the Saturn Hexen port, I didn't get that until randomly online in the early 00s. However, though it's not amazingly smooth, I think it definitely runs better than it did on our 486 and is a nice step up from DooM on the Saturn. I've never played the PS1 port at all; however, a friend had the N64 port, and we had a lot of fun it it in split screen. I'd say that I probably had the most fun with the N64 version because of that couch split-screen. I don't remember ever playing the PC version in multiplayer even though I played a fair bit of DooM II via modem-to-modem with the friend I borrowed Hexen from. I do wish Heretic had got ported over to a console as well, since it's a very fun game as well. As for the sequels: I liked Hexen 2 as well, but I know I didn't care too much for Heretic 2...couldn't tell you why though because I'm sure it's been more than 20 years since I played that last. It's one of the biggest shames in game development that Raven got funneled into just being nothing but a Call of Duty studio, when their original products were compelling and ranged from average to a lot of fun.

[@zanegandini5350]

Huh, this is a game I've never seen before. I can definitely recognize assets from Doom here! It's unfortunate that Probe was in charge of handling the PS and Saturn ports, because they certainly could have been better. Software Creations really did put a lot of effort into the Nintendo 64 port, though, and this is the rare case where it's better than its competitors. Still not quite up to the original DOS version, but it's very close.

[@gargonovich]

I think this is also a case of a game really playing more to the N64's strengths than the other two. The Saturn and PS1 are let down by their smaller pools of RAM compared to the N64 resulting in lots of cut animation, and since the game was made fit onto floppy disks anyway, the N64's usual challenge with its lack of storage doesn't really impact the game.

[@solarflare9078]

LOL Bingo. Rayman 2 and Mortal Kombat 4 on N64 are more comparable to the Dreamcast ports as well

[@matttheshadowman2790]

I feel Probe did a good job with the Saturn port here actually. I think Probe over time have a worse reputation than they deserve. I think my opinion of them is one of inconsistency rather than of outright terribleness.

[@the757general2]

There were a lot of N64 multiplats that were superior to its PS1 counterparts. Off the top of my head there's Rayman 2, Space Station Silicon Valley, Mortal Kombat 4, Hydro Thunder, NBA Hangtime, NBA Showtime: NBA on NBC, Wayne Gretzky's 3D Hockey '98, NFL Blitz (99-2001), Shadow Man, Army Men: Air Combat, and Tom Clancy's Rainbow Six. If a game was in development for the N64 first it was almost always superior on the N64. The opposite was true for multiplats that were designed for the PS1 such as Mega Man Legends, Gex 2-3, and the Tony Hawk's Pro Skater series.. However, the N64 was also better at handling most arcade and PC ports as seen with Hexen in this video along with the Mortal Kombat 4 and the other arcade sports and racers I mentioned. Rainbow Six and Shadow Man on the PS1 were awful.

[@GetLostGames1]

I had this game in 95’ for dos and I loved it.

[@JolliAllGenGamer]

I played this game on DOS right after I had played Doom. What a game. Too bad Hexen II was only on PC and never on consoles.

[@thefurthestmanfromhome1148]

Activision acquired the rights to publish versions of the game for the PlayStation and Sega Saturn, but seemed to do little or nothing with it.

[@CrustyDingus]

The music on the N64 version reminds me of Ultima: The Stygian Abyss

[@Nolasco.]

Are they not doing a remake of this game now? Or maybe it's powerslave/exhumed? Thanks for the video Mark 😁👍

[@thefurthestmanfromhome1148]

Exhumed is getting a modern remake Powerslave Exhumed is a full remaster of the ’90s FPS classic being done by Nightdive Studios

[@MRSAUltraviolet]

Sweet, new video.

[@MaidenHell1977]

Early show today!! Have a super weekend Mark! It's a statutory holiday on Monday here in Canada (Canadian Thanksgiving). Cheers buddy, loving the channel as always.

[@RetroCore]

Cheers Kevin! Yep, I'm off out this morning so I got the show out early 👍. It's "sports day" this coming Monday in Japan, so yeah, a nice national holiday. Enjoy your Canadian Thanksgiving🍗

[@csikocska]

It's a Doom-Engine game I love and hate at the same time. I love it because I can choose from 3 characters with different attributes and unique weapons and all 3 character classes represent a completely different play style. Also, I liked the music of the levels and the various items that can be activated from inventory. I hate it because the map makers of the game focused mostly on solving puzzles and searching for keys/switches. Also, no matter how many times I return to the Hub map, the monsters respawn, using up quite a bit of mana points used for weapons. And on the add-on available on PC (Deathkings of the Dark Citadel), they went even further into this kind of maps. What a fortune I can play Hexen in GzDoom source port anytime, I can even use high-quality music and graphics mods.

[@RetroCore]

I know what you mean in regards to the puzzles and respawning enemies. These are the main points that don't make Hexen as classic as Doom in my opinion.

[@emmettturner9452]

I had it on PC CD-ROM and N64 back then. Lost everything to a tornado last year but still have the 7-disk floppy version right next to me. :)

[@RetroCore]

Man, that's sad you lost everything in a tornado. But still nice the floppy version survived 👍

[@GlenLehane]

I got this for Christmas 95, although it's a bit flawed, I still have a soft spot for it. Although I did complete it with all 3 characters, the Cleric is definitely the best, just a lot more balanced than the other characters, with the Mage being my least favourite. But the best thing about this game is the eerie Gothic atmosphere, with the soundtrack really standing out. Most sound cards played Adlib quality music (the most basic quality- I had both a Fusion CD16 and an ESS T688 on my 486 (not at the same time) while I don't actually know what my Pentium had), though the best quality was with a Roland- even better than the CD audio! The midi soundtrack also has more songs than the CD Audio. I never got to play the add-on, Deathkings Of The Dark Citadel

[@rob4222]

Thanks for the comparison, but the N64 looks to good to be true. Better use native resolution and disable anisotropic filtering next time 😉 Are there Ports of Hexen 2 and Heretic 2 or are they PC only?

[@RetroCore]

Agreed. I thought I had done that but seems not.

[@billcook4768]

Come on Nintendo. We don’t need three Mario Party games and two Pokémon Stadium games for NSO. Give us Hexen, clean it up a bit, and you’ve got a winner.

[@solarflare9078]

Watch out. The Nintendo fanboys will destroy you for that

[@billcook4768]

@@solarflare9078 The worst thing about the Nintendo fanboys is their unwillingness to consider multiplatform games. You’ll never see them talk about great N64 games like Hexen, TWINE or THPS 1/2/3.

[@the757general2]

@@billcook4768 Those games are from extremely popular Nintendo IPs. Hexen was overshadowed by other popular FPS on the system. It's also an M rated game which the NSO has not yet had before and might not ever.

[@mleolv426]

N64 version is pretty impressive.

[@Imgema]

Unfortunately, the footage is not from a real N64. It's upscaled emulation footage.

[@the757general2]

@@Imgema I have the N64 version on actual hardware and it still looks impressive even if the visuals are a bit blurry.

[@geoserenity]

I didn't know hexen had 3 ports. I wonder if hexen 2 had any ports

[@thefurthestmanfromhome1148]

Activision acquired the rights to publish versions of the game for the PlayStation and Sega Saturn, but nothing seemed to come of either version.

[@WeskerSega]

@@thefurthestmanfromhome1148 That was a shame. I would have loved Lobotomy Software give a take to that, or at least to the Sega Saturn version. I'm sure it would have given good results to what I consider the best game of the series.

[@david-spliso1928]

Quick question: why is the frame rate on PC here so low? It should run at 35fps on a decent enough system but it's clearly not here. Unless it's due to the capture. If you look at other gameplay videos (not the source port versions, the original) you'll see them captured at the maximum frame rate. Anyway just wondering, thanks for your comparison video 👍

[@RetroCore]

Hmm, could be due to the video being a 60fps capture while the game is not 60fps. Then again, that would also effect the console versions but doesn't. I was running this through Dos box so maybe that messed it up.

[@david-spliso1928]

@@RetroCore Ah right, maybe then it's down to Dosbox not being given enough CPU cycles. You can adjust that from the default (either in the .ini or manually during use) to emulate the equivalent of a 386 or 486 spec + clockspeed, etc, basically you can throw more and more cycles at it for whatever game needs enough. You could try upping the CPU cycles and see. Might work 👍

[@TexasHollowEarth]

So weird we got all these timely console ports of Hexen while both Heretic games stayed on PC and oddly enough, Macintosh! That 2nd Heretic was a strange beast tho. I always thought it closely resembled Legacy of Kain: Blood Omen 2.

[@billcook4768]

According to the Intertubes, it was also ported to the Acorn Archimedes. Which may be a system too obscure even for Mark.

[@RetroCore]

Nah, I've covered games on the Archimedes a few times. I think the last time I covered it was on Alone in the Dark video. I also remember Lemmings getting an Archimedes port.

[@WeskerSega]

Hexen is the only game of this series that got ported to consoles. The rest of games remained computer (not just PC) exclusive. It's not just the case of both Heretic games like you mentioned, it's also the case with Hexen II (my favourite game of the series, it's so great). I believe the first Heretic game was going to make to the Atari Jaguar back on its day (funnily enough, now it exists as a homebrew conversion), and years later, Activision announced Sega Saturn and PlayStation conversions of Hexen II. It would have been interesting what would have been the approach with these two, I guess Lobotomy Software would have been a perfect developer for these and maybe it would have saved them from their doomed fate after doing the Sega Saturn conversions of Duke Nukem 3D and Quake. Sadly, all these console conversions were cancelled.

[@jps6704]

Sir, you should play the MSDos version with mouse and keyboard. Thank you for the video :)

[@RetroCore]

I did try that but couldn't get in to it. I ended up just using the keyboard. Mind you, it didn't help that I wasn't sitting at a desk 😅

[@DragonSlayerKyo]

I love the original game lots- it was great for it's time and it's still fun to play these days. Though the N64 port is the best out of the three console releases, hands down.

[@SimianScience]

hexen is one of those fps i never got around to playing like duke nukem, heretic, hexen 2 despite being a giant 90's FPS fan

[@RetroCore]

It's well worth giving it a try. It does look a bit rough these days but still worth a play.

[@franciscor390]

It's never too late they're still crazy fun and exciting to explore. Games made on the "build engine" or similar have in several cases aged better than many early 3d games.

[@SimianScience]

@@RetroCore i really want to play hexen 2 since it was a early quake 2 engine game

[@SimianScience]

@@franciscor390 speaking of that i saw a sequel to ion fury coming out and it looks like its powered by the unreal 1 engine or something. i love it

[@franciscor390]

@@SimianScience Yeah i find it a breath of fresh air to see new games honoring the different graphic styles of the eras.

[@fulgenzio1973]

The golden age of PC Gaming.

[@SomeOrangeCat]

It was an awesome time to be PC gamer. I fell in love with this genre after first playing Wolfenstein 3-D, and the following years kept me very busy, because everyone and their brother were cranking these out.

[@kaikiske7436]

Never really played this. Could really use a “remaster” from the same guys that did the Powerslave and other recent releases.

[@RetroCore]

I wouldn't be surprised if its on the cards.

[@exitplanetduster]

Is N64 version played on real hardware?

[@RetroCore]

Sadly not. Emulation. The other versions are all played on real hardware though.

[@exitplanetduster]

@@RetroCore it looked too good to be real 😀

[@UenoLocker54]

Such a cool game.

[@JustPeasant]

Opa! A game that does not originate from an arcade cabinet nor a console, but a straight from MS DOS and well known a FPS no less! Definitely "... and now for something completely different" moment✌ Addendum: and the console port(s) are not a stinker, given the Probe's, less then stellar (to say the least) pedigree🗑

[@RetroCore]

For Probe they could have been a lot worse for sure 😊

[@SomeOrangeCat]

@@RetroCore Probe seemed to do alright with this type of game. They even made the excellent Alien Trilogy, and it was great across all three platforms they released it to.

[@CasperEgas]

The Saturn version's link up is too buggy to really play... I don't like Hexen much. I prefer Heretic, but both can't hold a candle to Doom.

[@bryandavidasuncion9515]

n64 version seems to have more than just the front facing animations of the enemy. I wonder if its a ram issue with the Ps1 and Saturn not having enough to store all those animations

[@RetroCore]

I think that is exactly the issue.

[@sebastiann.8088]

Saturn has more ram than the PlayStation though, and this is before you add the RAM cartridge into the equation. I think it was just unfamiliarity with the Saturn hardware

[@Imgema]

One thing that doesn't make sense to me with this comparison is that you are obviously using emulation and upscaling on the N64 version footage. The real version doesn't look as high res. And that completely defeats the purpose of comparing these ports.

[@brianmartinez5453]

Can you do Doom port

[@amerigocosta7452]

The N64 can look a bit too smeary at times. Hexen is a dark game with plenty of brown in the first place and then you have all those tricks the N64 does to "improve" the image that make things even blurrier. Thankfully, in the configure menu (not the option menu, mind you) you can remove some of the blurriness switching from smooth to zoom in the filter option. That way you get some of the good old chunky pixels back.

[@RetroCore]

Yes, that is very true. I'm also in the camp of not enjoying most visuals on the N64.

[@thefurthestmanfromhome1148]

Probe were behind the PlayStation version? That will explain an awful lot, cheapest possible tender syndrome. How they could screw up the PlayStation version so badly, when they did such a solid job on the Saturn version, is beyond me.

[@juststatedtheobvious9633]

The Saturn was designed to handle 2d graphics. As long as you know what you're doing, this is where it excels. The PSone is a bit more demanding. And Probe were the kind of developers who only gave you what you paid for.

[@solarflare9078]

The Saturn is actually quite powerful. The PS1 was the most efficient console of the 5th gen, but the Saturn can definitely compute more. The weaknesses lie into the multi core, complex hardware that requires optimal and through use to get the most out of it (though according to Treasure, the N64 was even more complex)

[@thefurthestmanfromhome1148]

@@juststatedtheobvious9633 Probe were like Tiertex and Imagitec Design, lowest bidder s, handling game conversions to multiple platforms and we're able to hit commercial deadlines and those were the factors publishers looked for. Lobotomy, Hammerhead, Pysgnosis and many more got much better results out of the PlayStation hardware for FPS titles than Probe ever did. Alien Trilogy on PlayStation was incredibly overhyped as well, blocky sprites, terrible A. I etc and they failed to use the Saturn hardware properly when converting it, they were a horrendous development team at times.

[@juststatedtheobvious9633]

@@thefurthestmanfromhome1148 Be fair. By quick and dirty contract work standards, Probe's work was a welcome surprise. Compare their PS1 work to South Park or Hidden and Dangerous. As for early Satun games, I can't recommend Pandemonium's coverage of Virtua Racing enough, as the developer really paints a vivid picture of how Sega of Japan intentionally sabotaged 3rd parties. Poor documentation and a debugging tool that limited you to one core were just a few of the great reasons to back another platform. By the time Sega realized they were destroying their system's reputation, they'd already lost the American market.

[@thefurthestmanfromhome1148]

@@juststatedtheobvious9633 I would like to feel i am being fair, I bought an awful lot of Probe Software coded titles on the C64, Atari ST, Sega MD, Sony PlayStation and Sega Saturn, have spoken with a good few of the people who worked for them and read interviews from others. They were often greatly over stretched, facing very real commercial deadlines and in cases of systems like the Saturn, facing the risk of there simply no longer being a viable commercial platform to release a conversion onto. Alien Trilogy was originally conceived as a Sega Mega CD project, then moved onto the 32X,then the PlayStation and PC. The Saturn version does make great use of the systems sound hip, has faster loading times, but it can't be ignored they only used one of the SH2 chips and after waiting so long for the conversion, Saturn owners did get a rather raw deal, just as PlayStation owners did with Hexen. Sega were simply far too arrogant with the handling of the Saturn, keeping the newest development libraries for themselves really p*ssed of Capcom, thinking they were so big they didn't need the support of E. A.. Also the use of Quads when the industry was using polygon 3D,ok,less warping, but way to alienate your third party dev teams. If you were the market leafer, teams would invest the time to write custom code, but when you were in Sega's position, they wouldn't and promising conversions of things like Dungeon Keeper, were killed early on 😭

[@GamayObera]

And once again, N64 proving 2D graphics to look strange at the sprites looking been ripped from a sprite sheet downloaded from the Internet as *JPG.*

[@solarflare9078]

N64 versions of games really do get the best multplats often for Gen 5 consoles, huh? Mortal Kombat 4, Glover, Rayman 2, Ms Pac Man Maze Madness, Ridge Racer, the list is huge. Such a powerful console held back by cartridges, unfortunately.

[@nattila7713]

mk4 rayman2 ridgeracer werent best ports.... probably you are also delusional about the rest :)

[@solarflare9078]

@@nattila7713 Best for *GEN 5* consoles. Read the fine print :) (And MK4 sure as hell wasn't better on PS1)

[@nattila7713]

@@solarflare9078 hm :) you got me!! I just hate image qual of n64, more than anything :(

[@nattila7713]

@@solarflare9078 ok tried rr64. crap. rest for gen5, yeah... can be.

[@the757general2]

@@nattila7713 MK4 was the best on the N64. If you're referring to MK Gold on the Dreamcast the visuals and audio were better but it was a broken mess of a game filled with glitches and severely unbalanced characters.

[@josephfrye7342]

I guess there are few console ports besides the pc version of that game :/

[@josephfrye7342]

But the sega Saturn is an excellent port than the PlayStation’s port which it is interesting and awesome.

[@pancracio3188]

Really, you talk about the game but seeing you playing its like your first time. Thanks for the video, but...

[@ninjapants7688]

Man, the thing that really lets the PS1 version down is the perspective warped texturing, it's just awful on this port.

[@plewlonehitknown4812]

Played through the playstation version. It looked like vomit, but was gnarly fun until I reached the end. Had a blast with the worst port, I guess😅

[@MistaMaddog247]

Ok, now you have to do DOOM and all it's console ports... :) Seriously I've come to appricate the improved differences the id games are in consoles like DOOM II on PSX and Quake II for the N64. They feel like different games from the PC originals. Glad NightDive Studios are bringing some of the console ports back and putting them on the PC, I really regret the "PCs Only" attitude I had back then which made me miss out on unique versions of the FPS games I enjoy.

[@RetroCore]

I guess I'll have to finally do doom 😉

[@SomeOrangeCat]

@@RetroCore A lot of the ports have some very interesting stories behind them. The ports for the SNES and 3DO ports were both one person jobs, but the circumstances were completely different. In the case of SNES Doom, a coder recreated everything using a new engine of his own design on the Super FX2 chip and then showed it off to Nintendo, who were like "Uh, yes please!!!" With the 3DO port, a dodgy fly-by-night publisher tricked legendary coder Rebecca Hyneman into "optimizing" their "mostly complete" port of Doom. She agreed only to find out by "optimizing" they meant "make from scratch" and by "mostly complete" they meant "Haha! You already signed on the dotted line! We want it ready in three months!".

[@nattila7713]

the ps1 version's savegame use the whole ps1 memcard :( terrible. learnt the hard way when I bought it 2 weeks ago :( n64 filtered gfx looks awful, imagine that and the unbearable image quality the n64 provided..... uh.

[@RetroCore]

The N64 has two graphics modes but yeah, neither are sharp.

[@WeskerSega]

The Sega Saturn version also creates save files of absurd size, you can only save by using a memory cartridge. Together with Alone in the Dark 2 and Crusader: No Remorse, I believe these three must be the games which have bigger save files on the console. No wonder why, the three games are of PC origin.

[@nattila7713]

@@RetroCore one day I will do the rgb mod but until then I am on svideo. that also does not help :D

[@diskyboy86]

Let's go Nintendo 64 and Software Creations for that matter, showing you're not worthless, but no Tim Follin soundtrack, an FPS game with his tunes would be sick! I'm honestly impressed at the quality of the port though, it's not far behind Doom 64. Surprisingly clear graphics, though not sure how well they'd hold up on real hardware, the brightest of all the console ports with the most animation intact, and the multiplayer death match mode. Just a shame that it's lacking any of the CD features. Maybe if Nintendo wasn't so unconfident in their CD add-on and released in more than one region, instead of just Japan which is where the N64 was selling its worst and if that wasnt bad enough lock it behind a subscription service, like my god they wanted it to fail. I'm sure some people will like the darkness of the PS1 and Saturn ports dark muddy graphics, porbably the same fools defending the Mega Drive's dirty checkerboard graphics over the more colorful SNES ones with transparencies. Overall though it's seem like poeple enjoy not being able to see their media. As a dark mode user myself on just about everything, including KZbin, I'd just prefer to see the game clearly. also don't come pissing on me Mega drive fans, I love your system to death, it's still an easy top 10 console of all time for me but you can't deny the SNES superior graphical capabilities.

[@mrkocsa]

n64 like have a 3d hardware support, but a little slowly, nice-)

[@dmer-zy3rb]

if you play it on a source port the sprites make it one of the most gorgeous retro shooters ever, but the original version looks rather meh - consoles even more so.

[@RetroCore]

Agreed but for the sakes of this video I had to go with the original.

[@104d_3rr0r_vince]

I played the Amiga version back then. PSX seems smoother than Saturn.

[@RetroCore]

Amiga version?

[@104d_3rr0r_vince]

@@RetroCore Yes, many 3D games of that era were ported to the Amiga. You just needed the wad file to play them on 68K or PPC native or RTG.

[@panvrek8952]

+1

[@MrNightshade2010]

this is the era of when the PC finally surpassed the arcades and consoles ....

[@apollosungod2819]

It never did , you're just choosing to ignore the arcade hardware that existed in the late 1980s and during the 1990s as well as bad management staff at Sega of America during the 90s... You're also choosing to ignore that Hexen is a PC-DOS game... PC -DOS was intended to be killed by Microsoft who wanted to control PC game devs and prevent them from using proprietary to the metal level dev tools on the rising 3d cards as well as prevent them from using OpenGL which is funny cause Id Software is now owned by Microsoft so OpenGL and arguably Vulkan are dead unless an independent PC game dev supports those APIs and make games that can run on Linux, Windows and MacOS based personal computers... instead these days plebs preach that "PC" only means Microsoft Windows. As such PCs never surpassed the home videogame system hardware... note that PS1, Sega Saturn and Nintendo 64 all feature custom CPUs and 3d chipsets where IF a game developer team takes the time to use the hardware, they can make some either accurate ports or amazing original games... The only thing you could brag about with PCs was that you paid $300 a piece for the 3DFX Voodoo 2 kool-aid and you still needed to buy a 2d card, a sound card, a motherboard, a CPU, etc and the games looked pretty but were not really revolutionary at all and were not pushing better graphics than SEGA's and Konami's custom 3d based arcade hardware games.

[@apollosungod2819]

After all it has been confirmed that the "don't buy a console" diatribe was being preached by PC game magazines fearing the rise of successful sales of consoles because they had a bias to PC in the 90s

[@rufnek3124]

this game aged badly

[@JimmyCall]

The MS DOS looked awful.

[@RetroCore]

I'm sure these days there's alsorts of HD texture packs and so on but yeah, the original is looking a bit rough these days.

[@thebeardofpepe]

Please do MDK 2! So many ports of that guy

[@RetroCore]

It's one of the games I do intend on covering at some point.

[@TheDemoniusX]

while I do like this game and my favorite port was the N64 I gave up on it because I kept going in circles and could never find the way to progress -_-.

[@crakrjakful]

real life bro...

[@flaps805]

Playstation? More like gaystation

[@orderofmagnitude-TPATP]

Ha!!