BATTLETECH: The Wolf Trap

[@theomnissiah-9120]

I do like that there are mechs that are objective piles of shit. It adds realism to the setting not every war machine is going to work.

[@alyssinwilliams4570]

I think calling it a pile of shit is a bit of an overstatement. Its fragility makes it much less than good, but its speed and firepower can be quite useful. I wont lie, I'd take a phoenix hawk over this, but Id take this over a lot of other designs

[@robrib2682]

I mean there's a reason why I LARP as a Vulcan pilot in his streams :p

[@KuK137]

Not really - because it makes the designers look like idiots. No one caught the issues on drawing board? In trials? In first battle? Who the hell makes something so bad for so long without fixing it? In real life, when tank or plane was bad improved variant was rolled out in months, not got produced mindlessly without pause...

[@megaoptamas759]

@@KuK137 Uhhh, buddy. Hate to tell you, but this is false. German space magic would like a word

[@michaelkeha]

@@KuK137 haha the British LA80 rifle would like a word

[@TehSquare]

I’ll take “Mech names you might not want to google” for $500 Alex.

[@NemFX]

Man, I could make a whole list of names that should probably never be used. They'd be perfect for a faction that everyone would hate.

[@thomasgiles2876]

Wow, looks like someone isn't a fan of Beaststars

[@44R0Ndin]

@@NemFX Or a whole faction that's hated for literally no reason other than "we don't like things that are different".

[@decepticonpecock]

if you're a coward maybe.

[@iananderson6530]

You gotta talk about the Wolfhound now. No other options, the people need to know how great it is.

[@BigRed40TECH]

The Wolfhound will be covered within the next few weeks.

[@allanhanson6616]

Been looking for his video on the Wolfhound. No can find. Here is the mevh that hunts wolves. Yet I look in the video history and I cant find the Wolf.

[@Nostroman_Praetor]

Came here after the wolfhound video. Was genuinely suprised by its legacy since my perception of it was shaped by the battletech cartoon and its appearance every now and again in Mechwarrior 5. I may need to give it a second chance lol.

[@adventwolfbane]

The Wolf Trap is a glorious display of the Combine's "Pride and Honor". They were too proud and their Honor too important that even when they got their hands on the Wolfhound they refused to make use of a clearly superior mech to their current Panther. So they made a monument to death instead and called it a success until the Clans came and showed how bad it was. Then the WoB made it even worse.

[@yoloman3607]

The panther would have been good with any modernization as long as they didn’t mount ER weaponry on them, guess what they did

[@adventwolfbane]

@@yoloman3607 That upgrade works when you remember to upgrade the heat sinks. ER PPC, Streak SRM-2, same tons of FF armor. That also allows for only 11 DHS, uprated engine, and an extra JJ. All comes under normal heat manageable for a competent pilot.

[@yoloman3607]

@@adventwolfbane yet the flavor text for the era is they had basically no double heatsinks for a few years.

[@adventwolfbane]

@@yoloman3607 and yet plenty of other designs and upgrades had DHS. They had them and were making DHS for everything. They just didn't add them.

[@rueceless7580]

With that head design the Wolf Trap looks like it wants to be a Zaku II really badly. XD

[@yoloman3607]

I low key thought this video was a battle armor review from the thumbnail

[@ExeErdna]

A Zaku 2 would have been a blessing compared to this

[@RyeFields]

If speed is it's ally because of an XL engine, it needs armor to compensate and protect. Sadly it chose more ammo for a coffin design.

[@Firestorm2900]

Honestly, I wonder just how well it would have done with a normal engine and downgrade the LRM-10 to a 5, and try to armor up even alittle more.

[@tullyDT]

@@Firestorm2900 run a centurion and find out

[@GnarledStaff]

"Coffin Design" Nice.

[@Demolitiondude]

IS: WOLF SEASON! Clans: FALCON SEASON! IS: WOLF SEASON! Clans: FALCON SEASON! NACC: CRUSADE! **Worried coordinator noises**

[@Chris_Sizemore]

Just too lightly armored for an XL engine. The ammo in the torso is just icing on the cake.

[@anoninunen]

Engineer 1: "We packed all of our explosives in the center of all the structural and mechanical parts to save space. Sounds good?" Engineer 2: "I'm beginning to wonder if there is some lost historical example we could take lessons from..."

[@44R0Ndin]

If you're thinking of the Leopard tank, you're not entirely wrong.

[@iller3]

oh the humanity!

[@ambientlight3876]

Hmm. A poor man's Centurion that doesn't satisfy anyone...

[@paladinslash4721]

Imagine making a mech that’s both outgunned and more fragile than the mech it’s supposed to counter.

[@alyssinwilliams4570]

When using solid slugs ammunition for the AC not really outgunned, unless it rolls low on the cluster hits table. That said, it outranges the Wolfhound and has the same speed/maneuverability so it should be able to keep that range advantage.

[@allanhanson6616]

Video on Wolftrap... But im not finding 1 on Wolfhound. Am I lost in the vudeo list or stupid that I can't find the mech he's mentioning in his video history?

[@Reverb154]

@@allanhanson6616Big Red hasn't made one (yet).

[@allanhanson6616]

Oh. 😒

[@allanhanson6616]

Well, intetesting syrategy to get jype fir the Wolfhound. 😒

[@madcat789]

Another fantastic video. The poor wolf trap ended up trapped and fed to the wolves.

[@ScanManP13]

Jaguars*

[@GliderBane]

On its own it is not that scary, but if you put it in a lance of scarier mechs it can be effective. It has speed and enough ranged firepower to harass at range. This things biggest problem is the ballistic weapon. At this weight bracket, if you want speed and armor you need to stick to energy and missile weapons. The Combine had no issues making PPCs (see all the annoying Panthers), they should have stuck one on this to save weight.

[@Somewhat-Evil]

The Combine lost its factory to produce the Phoenix Hawk-K to the newly created FRR. The Wolf Trap needed to fill the void that left in the DCMS roster. The P-Hawk K would've been a better choice, being in all but name a 45-ton Wolfhound with better armor protection.

[@joshuamidgette4846]

The Wolftrap needs to be 55 tons. A bigger brother to the Centurion with much more armor than the stock Wolftrap.

[@44R0Ndin]

Don't even need that, just move the fucking ammo somewhere where it can't kill the engine and the job's done. Basically, get that LRM-10 out of the CT (instead, put it in the RA), and put the LBX-10 ammo in the LA along with the autocannon iself. And that's it "fixed". Still could use another ton or 2 of armor, you can get "some" of that if you swap the armor to ferro fibrous. But really it's the LBX-10 that's killing this design, as AC-10's tend to do. At 9 tons, and a lot of crit slots, it's just too big and too heavy for a 45-ton mech. As was shown with the Panther, A PPC is a much better choice. If you want to keep the short-range punch, you can also drop another ton and switch to a snub-nose ppc. Heat? "Easy", bite the bullet and get those dang DHS in that engine. DHS solves all your heat problems, usually. Even without the DHS, firing just the PPC won't overheat it. PPC + anything else will tho, that's why I say switch to DHS. This overall frees up 4 tons. Use that 4 tons to reinforce the torso's armor, and then the armor on the arms. If you have tons left over, use them to add more medium lasers, this time in the right torso, because crit padding is a good thing and people should do it more often. Better to lose a laser than to suffer an engine crit, especially with an XL.

[@iller3]

...and Reinvent the Griffon?

[@tsiefhtes]

Another Mech whose effectiveness could have been saved through the use of Fibroferris armor rather than standard. There seems to be a tipping point on mixing lost tech with standard tech, especially when utilizing Xl engines. If you go too far you introduce too many weaknesses into the design that are inherent with the new technology, weaknesses that would be offset by going all in with the lost tech or avoided by not using it. The art of Good design is in the balance.

[@faithmcclosky4528]

Great video as always Red. I couldn't help but laugh at the "Shameful Display" graphic that pretty much sums up the Wolf Trap. Well done!

[@BigRed40TECH]

I was going to use the normal combine one I put together... but no, this thing really deserves this. lol

[@gregdomenico1891]

I get why they choose Cluster rounds(even though they could have gone with a ton of each). It was designed to kill light mechs. Because of their speed, cluster rounds are more effective. You also have to take recoil into consideration. Also have to take into account that it's pretty hard to aim an AC at 97Kph. Just as a side note, as a Davion player, I'm glad this thing was such a failure.

[@SulliMike23]

This mech could’ve been a bane for Wolfhound pilots like myself, but it became a joke.

[@erikbjelke4411]

Nice. I'd heard a lot about the the Wolf Trap was an utter, embarrassing failure, but no thorough analysis as to why. Thanks, now I know.

[@mikhielthorsson6033]

They would have been better off upgrading the Panther to better deal with the Wolfhound. But we all know that the DCMS suffers horribly from hubris.

[@SerenissimaRepublica]

I would love to see a Bushwacker video sometime, one of my favourites ever since being the hero starter mech in Mechwarrior 3 and having to fight a guerilla campaign in one!

[@BigRed40TECH]

Sorry mate, Bushwacker's not getting covered for a while. TRO:3058 is a long, long way away.

[@SerenissimaRepublica]

@@BigRed40TECH Then I'll just have to stick around and keep watching the great content until then, won't I?

[@iller3]

100% this. Bushy is my favorite Ton-for-Ton sniping platform in the franchise

[@baker90338]

Good news, ITS NOW HERE

[@SerenissimaRepublica]

@@baker90338 I saw and it was great!

[@anexistanthuman2435]

This mech proves that despite all the excitement of a mech that's got amazing firepower and excellent tactical mobility, if you sacrifice protection, you're not making a battlemech, you're making a fun box of loot for the first person to breach its torso. Especially with the case: even more likelihood of harvesting that nice LB-10X.

[@Reverb154]

I checked, and the WFT-1 Wolf Trap would most likely get owned by the Wolfhound, ESPECIALY the WLF-2, which came out just after Tukayyid.

[@leroyottersberg7151]

A good example of where pride and honor can backfire in a very bad way in combat.

[@Giltonn]

I love the wolf trap just for the looks alone

[@sethharpenger607]

In my own house rules there would be a way to twin lighter engines together to save weight and cost while consuming either half the critical slots in both side torsos or all slots in the center torso. Thus the loadout would change to a ct twin engine and an xl gyro with only 1 ton of ammo and a swap between a large laser, ppc or large puse laser depending on the intended total armor. The lrm would have to move to the side and maybe twin machine guns could replace the lb 10 for critseeking

[@jackmccrary2614]

While I generally agree there are a few points you missed. 1. Arming the WT with cluster ammo makes sense in its designated role since the increased accuracy (a to-hit bonus in game) helps offset the difficulty of hitting a light mech moving at speed. 2. The the combination of speed, long range, cluster ammo and how LRM hits work also make the WT pretty good at mission-killing ground vees and erasing helos. 3. You missed the Daitama variant which is a pretty capable C3i spotter (but I may be biased). It is not perfect, but that's because it was rebuilt from whatever advanced tech refit kits the Neo-SLDF had on-hand at Tukkayid. I think it was built with parts of two refit kits, IIRC. I know one was a 500-D Hussar refit kit which provided the Engine, ER PPC and C3i computer. but I don't remember what the other one was as it has been about 20 years since I designed it.

[@BigRed40TECH]

I opted not to cover many of the variants just because the mech was broadly discontinued after 3061, despite several variants. There are almost no variants as well, so it's just not worth covering those in-depth as I've done with others. The script was long enough, and I generally don't like to just dog on mechs that weren't particularly good tbh.

[@lexington476]

I never understood really how the weapons mix on the Wolf Trap was supposed to take down a Wolfhound. It just seems like a completely randomized design. I've never played with it or against it, so I have no opinion on how it performs on the table top, and feel the same way on the paper stats, it just doesn't really seem to have a groove or style.

[@KageRyuu6]

A Shameful Display indeed.

[@Reverb154]

Personally, I would have given the Wolf Trap an Ultra AC-5 in the right arm, an SRM-6 in the center torso, and a third medium laser in the right torso, with the SRM and AC ammo located in the right arm as well, in order to save the mech from an ammo explosion, and to save tonnage for ARMOR. (God, this mech needs it!)

[@osogitzgraymane72]

The universe: Here's another shotgun mech Me: *_* .... wait ... this sucks.... The universe: GOTCHYA BITCH! Keep em rollin, Ill keep watching em

[@michaelkimberling7307]

Seems to me to be something meant to hang out behind cover and crit seek other units. Which would be OK if it wasn’t for the fact that it would likely explode before that came into play a few rounds into play.

[@BigRed40TECH]

One clean Gauss Hit and its all over -.-

[@jonbezeau3124]

You're not "hanging out in cover" hard enough if your 'mech gets shot out from under you in a couple turns. This is a scary mech to have hovering around the battlefield in company with Hunchbacks or mechs with Gauss rifles.

[@Eulemunin]

Always remember that the Combine is the darker gray hat of the setting. So yup that got screwed again.

[@fluffernaut9905]

Mhhh yes....I feel like the designers who put a Case into a mech are absent the day someone else decides to drop and XL into the same mech.

[@mattikuokkanen]

I have to say, Wolf Trap is an improvement over Panther. I could even take it over Hatchetman too, though I haven't memorized TRO3050 variants to the same extent as TRO3039 ones. Wolfhound with ER Large Laser though... Wolf Trap packs more bang at range. I should play with it sometime.

[@BigRed40TECH]

Just doesn't have the DHS for lasers, because the Combine when it was designed, had such a poor number of them. Cannons were picked for a reason.

[@andrewwelham8633]

So I can see firing the AC 10 and the LRM 10 together if they both have good shots - walking would be 7 heat and running would be 8 heat. I can also see firing the AC 10 and the medium lasers at the same time if the shots are good. Walking would be 9 heat and Running would be 10. I can't seem to think of an optimal firing solution that works for both the medium lasers and the LRMs. So, when - outside of utter desperation - am I alpha striking? Also, said alpha strike only generates 14 heat, 16 when running. Not the most unmanageable spike of heat. You know, the 1V Locust can alpha strike all day with no problem. My only other question is, aren't all mechs vulnerable to a single critical hit? Let's say my Blackjack shoots the Daishi with an AC 2. I roll snake eyes for hit location and a 12 on the number of critical hits. I then roll 3 engine hits, or 2 gyro and 1 engine hit. That 100 ton mech just went down to a 2 point shot at at max long range of 24. 1st round of fire kill at max range. It's not likely, by I've seen it happen. I had an Atlas lose 40 out of 41 points of armor in a single round of indirect LRM fire. The player was referred to as 'Center Torso Lad' after that because he rolled so many 7's.

[@murgel2006]

Well, another great video and another tremendous in-universe analysis. Personally, I love the Wolf Trap. Mostly because I thought it was one of the few good-looking new mechs in TR 3050. I was not too fond of the idea of the clans and the inflation of weapons tech they brought to the game. I thought that TR 2750 was already enough of a step in that direction. How much I disliked it? Well, to me the year is 3045 and then time jumps back to 3024 in an endless loop. There is no such thing as "the Clans", they do not exist. 😀 Anyway, in a book full of art I did not like very much I liked the art of the design and even liked the vulnerabilities it has. Made me think of an infantryman's work. Those men are just as vulnerable on the battlefield and must apply training, tactics, speed and luck to survive. Sadly, the mini was not as well sculpted, it lacked the dynamics of the art. I am still fond of the mech and love fielding it in games, however, mainly as a recon or support mech. It performs quite well in the support role.

[@wheturangi]

As a Kuritan, the good thing I can say is that it looks ok. I tend to prefer non-XL mechs for safety and cost reasons. Mediums should be energy rather than AC based. Played it once, never again. Nice to have the lore feature such a dud.

[@ChaosTicket]

The Wolf Trap is a model I know more by its unusual name than anything else. Its funny that it originated from the Draconis Combine because its designed more like a Federated Commonwealth/Federated Suns unit. Its a decent mech, and with its equipment its like a Centurion Mk II. Maybe the Draconis Combine was jealous and wish they had Centurions? I find it interesting that after using an highly expensive Extralight Engine the designers use a petty cost-saving measure by only using Single Heat SInks. Of the different models the WFT-1 Wolf Trap Daitama is the only one that feels like a Draconis Combine unit. Its uses a DC-signature weapon, an Extended Range Particle Projection Cannon instead of an LB-X Autocannon. It also uses a Beagle Active Probe, and an Improved C3 Network unit. The Draconis Combine love PPCs of all types and they originally invented the C3 Computer Networks.

[@theapostatejack8648]

If the Jaguars had a sense of humour, they would have called it the "Popper". But they did not which is both a pity, and a relief (imagine those bloodthirsty psychos with a sense of humour, yikes).

[@lukedudley5030]

Just give me a wolfhound :-) great overview of a tractor sent after a beast :-)

[@randomnetsurfer]

Me: Cool i like this mech! *clicks* Intro: FAIL! Me: *sad*

[@peteraloisio6842]

DCMS: I want a medium mech specifically to kill the Wolfhound. It needs an AC10, LRMs, and at least 2 medium lasers LAW: so....a Centurion? DCMS: that's not what I said!!

[@TheArchaos]

It is a poor craftsmen that blames his tools, yet in this instance, like with the 'Maus' of the real world, this (con)traption should never have left the drawingboard.

[@depth386]

I don’t understand how you can have an XL engine, Endo Steel, and low armor all at the same time

[@donhansen5677]

A Centurion by any other name is still a Centurion.

[@TheStraycat74]

WFT-5A Full Clan Tech 3050 rebuild 45 tons, 6/9/6 movement, clan XL+DHS, clan endosteel, maxed out clanner fero-fiberous armor (8tons), Jump Jets, standard cockpit and gyro. PRIME config - LB-10X with two tons of ammo (pilot selected), 2 ERML, LRM-10 with two tons ammo. Alt-config - LPL, two MPL, 3 SSRM-4 with two tons of ammo (24 shots total), and a flamer because lighting things on fire and be fun for canister-born and freebirths alike.

[@son0fgrim]

i've seen alotta these as terrain peices.

[@Reverb154]

Behold, Luthien Armor Works very own Centurion Lite! (Coffin not included.)

[@Spartaner251]

i hope you ripp the Cent 9-D apart in the same way. because it has the same armor value over the RT and even more ammo in there together with the XL engine.

[@BigRed40TECH]

I only cover it briefly in my Centurion video, but I don't describe it as a war winner, let's put it that way.

[@datrux]

Instead of making the Wolf trap, they should have upgraded the Panther to be more competitive with the Wolfhound. Really all the Panther ever needed was double heatsinks.

[@BigRed40TECH]

Combine had almost no DHS during this period :(

[@jerimedickey7655]

I ears hear you... but it's still one of my favorite mechs. The 2X, and 2B are solid showings for the mech... notably they have better armor but logistically they're not wonderful.

[@DIEGhostfish]

This might be the first truly BAD 45 tonnner. By publishing order.

[@nathanielgrey4091]

What is the purpose of the scatter shot lbx ammo? It seems so niche

[@BigRed40TECH]

It's fantastic for crit-seeking tbh. But if you've not got something to punch holes, you're dependent on others to do it.

[@Arron-S]

Which tro was this released in?

[@BigRed40TECH]

Originally Technical Readout 3050, from the early 90's. Later, it comes out Catalyst's Technical Readout: Clan Invasion

[@Tallus_ap_Mordren]

Easiest fix I can see would be to downgrade the engine to a 225 standard, remove the LRM , and add MASC. You can get a better speed profile i short bursts, and even add an additional medium laser and some extra armor.

[@DevilPogoStick]

I admit, looking at the design does make my head tilt, mostly at the right...Uh, gun arm thingy. Like it doesn't even look like an arm with a gun barrel like most mechs like the Marauder. Just literally a fixed gun bolted on where the arm should be. The other artwork does strongly suggest that's totally the case. ...Then my mind goes but why though? Then again, Battletech always got a tale or two of mechs that sounds good on paper but execution leaves a lot to be desired.

[@Timberjac]

Design Team Engineer: "Let's see pilot, what do you complain about?, do you drown when you get into the water? No. Does your cabin freeze at 0 kelvin levels when you trade in space? No. Is the mech a target that does not move? No. Are the parts disassembled?... No. Then he stops acting as a destabilizing agent of the Federated Commonwealth and gets on the machine, which I have been told that the invaders go in underdeveloped machines painted with symbols of totenized animals worthy of barbarian cultures. Only the Dragon is a worthy mythological being."

[@Gigas0101]

Wait, have you covered the Wolfhound already? I could've sworn you hadn't and I'd be quite ashamed with myself if you had and I missed it. Granted, covering the failed attempt to counter it might be a great lead-in to the beam doggo itself, probably the first mech I played in a mechwarrior game and one of my all time favourites.

[@BigRed40TECH]

No, it'll be covered within a few weeks. This got covered first because there are less mediums left to cover before I hit clan Mechs, than there are Lights.

[@Gigas0101]

@@BigRed40TECH Ah, that clears that up. Thanks!

[@alyssinwilliams4570]

When driving this guy, ya just gotta be smart. Use a lot of cover and your speed to flank your foes. If you end up alone, run away. also, just cause the TRO says somethingh about ammunition load, it doesnt mean the player is required to follow that :P I won't deny that its fragile as hell. It would have been smarter to arm it with a PPC, and not use an XL engine. Given how the Combine loves their PPCs I'm surprised this isnt the case

[@BigRed40TECH]

That's why I kept mentioning when using solid projectile ammunition, it's better.

[@alyssinwilliams4570]

@@BigRed40TECH Which I appreciate! Id stil replace that AC with a PPC though

[@51DEMONIC]

You know your Combine handler is not pleased with your work if they pay you with a Wolf Trap, I saw one used once part of pirate force wasn't impressed with it. Positive side easy to fix, though you'll be fixing it a lot. If you get one unless you have no choice gut it for parts, or keep it on garrison or bodyguard duty.

[@ero9841]

I see the potential . But in the end it shares the same problem as the xl centurionions. To squishy for the price.

[@BigRed40TECH]

It's even sadder, because the XL centurion has more armour than this -.- Though yes, it too is squishy.

[@hunterx0736]

XL Centurions also have a better reputation, as they continued making them and new Variants.

[@ero9841]

@@hunterx0736 I really wish davion pay others to design and refit there mechs. They ruin everything they touch.

[@Prich319]

Sadly, the mech isn't even a completely lost cause. Just swap the AC for a PPC, switch the heat sinks to doubles, and then use the weight savings for additional armor. It''ll still go up if the LRM ammo is hit, but at least the odds of ammo explosion are a possibility, and not a certainty.

[@theyellowjesters]

It could have been good! Drop the lrm, add a 3rd ml and a gest sink or two, then throw the rest into armour while always having one tonne of ammo solid shot, and the other cluster. Alas.

[@JosephKano]

IS XL engines were a disastrous design choice for the inner sphere. Endosteel Internal brilliant great idea, but XL engines, nope.

[@observationsfromthebunker9639]

This unfortunate mech is the speed plus firepower doctrine of the Draconis Combine embodied. In this case it is an excellent re-casting of the IJA and IJN aircraft programs. (Give Battletech credit, they go all in on their factions' quirks.) Sometimes the idea works, sometimes not. The Wolf Trap isn't bad, it's specifically designed and outside its specs it becomes vulnerable. As for me I don't mind at all that the Wobbies got many of them.

[@WolfHreda]

"I'm so tired of the Lyrans and their damned Wolfhound murdering our Panther pilots. Let's make a battlemech meant to kill it right back." "So, a decently fast, well armed and armored light 'mech capable of running down and killing Wolfhounds quickly? While also not being able to be easily killed by a Wolfhound in return?" ... "You're fired."

[@Raist474]

Watching this channel makes me load up BattleTech/MechWarrior for a few battles and makes me wish for an Invasion-Era game. Pretty bored with the Succession war era.

[@BigRed40TECH]

Unfortunately, I don't think we'll get an invasion era product for a decade. If we're lucky maybe 6-7 years.

[@jacobrancourt2508]

Make enough mechs and some of 'em will eventually be a pile of crap.

[@Koniving]

So the main weapon system and I mean model having cluster is not as bad as it sounds. Through armor crits with the cluster ammo is absolutely devastating.

[@BigRed40TECH]

Sure can be. But I'd not want to rely on it without any hole-punching weapons onboard tbh.

[@Koniving]

@@BigRed40TECH by itself no but this is a cannon fodder mech in a larger battle, a pawn in a greater scheme of things. A glass cannon if the cannon were an RNG pepper gun with opportunities to do amazing things; and equally just as screwed by a wayward machine gun.

[@Irascibanality]

damn, i love it when you use the MW2:Mercenaries soundtrack 😍 As for this dud, it's a faster, softer Centurion that costs twice as much. And given the choice i'd rather have 2 Centurions, speed and the lack of LB-X guns be damned. Or just two Wolfhounds 🤷‍♂️ 😏

[@BigRed40TECH]

Centurion D, which is from the same TRO, moves the same speed... and has an LBX... and has more armour...

[@krieg4017]

Good.

[@iller3]

Deus Ex Machina via author sabotage.... Especially since one of the later Wolfhound variants ALSO switches to XL engine yet is dubbed its strongest final form _(essentially)_ . I wish there were more releases of stable and balanced Mechwarrior games I could do some "Labbing" of this Chassis in and prove that it can't possibly be **that bad** EDIT: Just did some testing in Mw2 where Autocannons are complete TRASH. This chassis is lackluster for sure, but 50% of the enemies I fought all died to Cockpit annihilation from the LBX 10 and the overall speed made it real easy to line those shots up (doesn't hurt that I main shotguns in PvP games when I'm not _"clicking on heads"_ with a sniper rifle)

[@MrDmitriRavenoff]

I don't really see the problem with this thing. It's just a lighter Centurion with a much higher speed. Yes it can be knocked out, but it's an all around decent machine if used correctly. Maybe the armor layout could be redistributed, but they even gave a Centurion an XL in later models. It could be a lot worse.

[@MechanicalFrog]

LBXs are fun, but not on a medium.

[@BigRed40TECH]

You mean investing 1/4 of a medium mech's weight into one weapon may have drawbacks? ;)

[@yecnay25]

Seems like the original could have bee ideal if it got rid of the LB-X for a PPC and the LRM downgraded to a LRM5 and put everything into armor and heatsinks.

[@BigRed40TECH]

Without DHS's its just hard using energy on medium mechs.

[@yecnay25]

@@BigRed40TECH base Vindicator is a good trooper an its the same weight and no advanced tech. The problem for the Wolf trap seems to be the heavy ammo dependence coupled with the armor thinness and the perils of Extralight engines. (honestly I don't see the point in extralights unless you have max torso armor or are too fast to care.) Of course at that point with my modification it is just a crappier Vindicator so I guess the idea was flawed from the go.

[@tullyDT]

I actually like the fact that there are bad mechs in the game it gives more depth and realism to setting and makes campaigns more interesting. XL engines really shouldn't be used on anything less than a heavy that's sitting on the threshold of being an assault. But with that being said, losing a torso or getting a crit on a standard engine is going to ruin your day and is most likely going to be a death sentence regardless. More often than not you will have lost the torso because of damage migration from a lost limb. The lore is hazy and doesn't really confirm that it was designed to hunt wolfhounds, but it certainly holds its own against most light and medium mechs of the period in the inner sphere. Now with all this said the design really does not live up to its bad reputation when you put things into practice on the board. It's essentially a centurion that the only significant difference in armour is on the arms. But it can act as a heavy hitter in a light lance. plus it is an excellent crit seeker. Yes it gets torn up by clan mechs, but clan mechs make a mockery of most IS light and medium designs that's the point of the clans you're supposed to be relying on weight of numbers to bring them down.

[@BigRed40TECH]

I've not been too impressed with it on the table personally. While I do think its speed helps it out, it just becomes a firecracker way too quickly, especially against other competent mediums and lights.

[@tullyDT]

@@BigRed40TECH Most of its contemporaries have ammo in both side torsos. The way I see it, in that weight class even if a side torso it is not lost due to ammo explosion it is as good as dead anyway. There's a good chance that it has lost a primary weapons system and there are two additional hit location allocating damage to the centre torso

[@BigRed40TECH]

@@tullyDT 2 ER Medium Lasers taking it down is really pitiful, tbh. Which I made reference to, because I've seen it happen more than once.

[@tullyDT]

@@BigRed40TECH clan tech will make a joke of most IS mechs of that era in that weight class that's basically 2 IS large laser shots I think it's best to agree to disagree. I run it as a fast long range striker and have gotten pretty good result using its speed to get into cover to set up shots and having it's lance mates get up close and personal its not great but it is serviceable. But it does not work for your play style s from that point of view it is a completely bad mech

[@BigRed40TECH]

@@tullyDT 2 medium laser hits being a KO is a bad showing for a 45-ton mech imo. And my playstyle is typically to use fast-mediums. Even for me, I view the Wolf Trap as being vastly too unreliable.

[@NemFX]

I just find it weird that this thing was designed to counter the Wolfhound, which isn't exactly amazing either. But I do have a bias against the Wolfhound cause of the cartoon. That mech didn't even scratch Jade Falcons paint.

[@BigRed40TECH]

Wolfhound is ironically pretty good against Clan mechs when used correctly. :\

[@frankb3347]

It's a trap!

[@BigRed40TECH]

For the pilot!

[@robrib2682]

Well with that introduction I am glad for one that this thing looks like a bulked up charger because that is exactly what I was afraid it would be. Honestly it's probably arms that make it look like that more than anything else Edit: you know with how what little I know of the blakies in universe with how they have a mixture of battlefield bureaucracy and religious fervor I'm surprised I haven't heard of more mechs like this being deployed to the battlefield for them. Because on paper it looks like a good war machine and the people in the field would probably push it to it it's extreme limits because they are religious zealots fighting in a crusade

[@riptide1ful]

More like Death Trap.

[@Jaeger_Bishop]

Why don't they put the ammunition in the arm, then put more armor in the center torso for better pilot and engine protection? The weapon is gone either way, at the very least they can better protect the pilot. I can't help but think designs like this are purposefully made with the author's thought process of "Ok, this should help sabotage the faction, easy enough"

[@BigRed40TECH]

Nah, when it was first published in like, 91/92, they weren't all that critical in its TRO entry. FASA was just mediocre at designing mechs.

[@TheStraycat74]

@@BigRed40TECH which is why I've been "redesigning" them with full clan tech... either that or it's because I have no life, or friends, or reason...

[@captaingeneralconch]

Swap wolf with dearh and you have the true name of this mech

[@lukasz.adamski]

I agree it's a trap. But not for wolves.

[@chaosknight9131]

It's basically a faster Centurion-

[@BigRed40TECH]

There is a faster Centurion, the CN9-D, it's in the same TRO even. lol

[@ShadrackMeduson]

well lets not be unfair with this guy, i mean, it has the firepower of a centurion and weights 5 tons less....wait...its almost 2 times more expensive than the centurion and far less armored? oh forget i said anything.

[@abaddonblack1294]

Sadly, this mech is nothing more than an attempt to design a lighter faster Centurion.

[@krissteel4074]

So for 6 times the cost, you can get something that's roughly 3x faster, slightly more heavily armed, about as armoured, 10t heavier and vastly more complicated than an Urbanmech! No? No want urbie? Ok, just buy a Clint and spend the other 3.5mil on whiskey and fun

[@Arvyn992]

It's a mech of a decent idea or concept but poor or terrible execution on the idea and concept

[@anthonywalker6268]

Clan Wolf would use it anyway.

[@iller3]

yah but they'd also have all its flaws worked out in 2 weeks (by contracting SeaFox to fix it for them)

[@AGS363]

The Mech beside, I do not really understand why so many blakist Designs get a "Bad Reputation". Even the most servile and ignorant slave of the house lords must admit that the Word of Blake maybe was "evil", but never "bad". Their Tech killed enough nominally superior enemies to prove this point.

[@sohmingjian]

Its a trap

[@Taurox220]

This just shows how bad autocannons are.