BD5 vs B40 Lyre: My Ongoing Saga

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[@christophg4789]

I played long time on 5RV Lyre, but after i had corona, i felt exactly the same so i tested several mouthpices. BD5 and B40 were my favourites, but then i had the chance to test a Licostini F5 which i am playing now since a few weeks. It really feels much more comfortable. I really like the sound and makes a lot of fun to play

[@ALopez-es7hs]

That’s a hard setup…probably works in your location. Nice sound

[@billducker7404]

They both sound good. Please stay with what you feel comfortable playing. God bless you. Love your videos. Bill UK

[@juliemulie1805]

Appreciate this evaluation. Tried the BD5 this year and nicknamed it the aneurysm mouthpiece. It sounds, for me, like a formal corseted dress, appropriate when you want to go there. When I want to polka or jazz it up, I can with another mouthpiece. Sometimes I wonder if clarinets are being pushed back into the background.

[@nica1639]

I moved away from BD5 for the exact things you said - stuffy, hard work. BD4 solved so many things. I haven't stuck with a mouthpiece this long before.

[@mmccauley7710]

Hi! I have been subscribed to your channel for perhaps two years. I meant to comment on your video regarding your Buffet/Yamaha dilemma. So you know my experience level: I started clarinet at age 10 in the 1970s. I played in middle school, high school, university and in both professional and community organizations...still practice daily and play in two groups. I played on a pair of R13s through most of my career using a Charles Bay custom MP. Unfortunately, one of my students dropped and broke my Bay when I let her experiment with it about 8 years ago. After that, I switched between a B45, 2RV and a Selmer C85 120. Two years ago, I wanted a change. I switched to my mint condition Selmer Centered Tone Bb and bought several new mouthpieces including Addarios MPs and the BD5. I also sampled the full catalog of VanDoren reeds as well as Addario reeds. My sound concept is "apple ripe." None of these changes delivered what I used to get from my Bay on the R13s. For the pure heck of it, I bought a Ridenour Homage MP. That mouthpiece "woke up" both my R13s and the Selmer CT. But...I realized that the old clarinets could not keep up with what the Homage offered. I realized I needed to do a paradigm shift. To that end I decided to find one of Ridenour's less expensive hard rubber clarinets for experimentation. After talking to Ted Ridenour, I bought one of the last of the genuine Ridenour Ariosos for my experiment . The humble 2005 Arioso blew me away. I contacted the Ridenours again and bought a Libertas II. With that Homage plugged into the LII, the paradigm shift reinvigorated my clarinet life. I feel like a college kid again. I practice 3 and 4 hours a day with absolute joy. Like Ridenour, I have always played with a double lip traditional French embouchure. I use various 3.5 reeds including VanDoren Traditional and Addario 3.5 Reserve on the Homage. I use a Rovner Dark ligature. The Libertas II does not require anything extra like barrels, bells and the like. Its scale is consistently in tune across the compass with little to no adjustments. It also does not need a low F tuning key. Playing is effortless in areas that required a fight with the old clarinets. The sound is rich and full. It feels like a new way to speak. My colleagues including my cellist wife love the purity of my new sound. Your struggles sound familiar to me. You should not have to compromise with equipment to get at your ideal sound, so my suggestion is give the Ridenours a try. It's a paradigm shift from wood technology, but worth it. My best to you.

[@durvalsantos7789]

I like BD5 , clamp optimum and canha 3 in this moment ,thanks Cally ❤

[@brekedekdang39]

I am a sax player who doubles on clarinet. I have been using a Hite Model D for the past 20 years. To me, this mouthpiece has worked quite well. I have tried a couple vandoren mouthpieces from time to time, but I always go back to the Hite, with a Mitchell Lurie or Bonade ligature.

[@billducker7404]

Looking forward to this video. I am early Bill. UK

[@jeffreyprice453]

Thank you for sharing. I have a protech 10 mouthpiece case with a variety of a Vandoren mouthpieces and ligatures I use. I really like Vandoren for affordability and that they have so many models for every player and preference. I have them for folks to sample. I also have the three newer Selmer mouthpieces( echo, focus, concept as choices for folks to try. They were more expensive than a typical Vandoren mouthpiece. No one has liked them better …yet) I eventually want to try the D’addario but hard to purchase new ones when Vandoren has so many good ones and I keep restocking things folks like. You really sound nice on both, but it is striking when you play the BD 5 second. The 40 is instantly better to my ear. As the old story goes, I think Pepsi was better in old taste tests as it hit better faster with folks and Coke had a better long term taste…but in the end you just sound like Cally. 😂 My only criticism of the BD5 is that when I play it, I also have the tendency for me to be flat. I was talking another Vandoren artist and they mentioned this to Vandoren and secret source had told her it was not tuned at 440 but just a hair lower. How about that for a nice second hand conspiracy theory! Anyway, I enjoy the thick luscious BD5 but get frustrated with the pitch, so I always seem to go back to my M13 lyre or recently I like a traditional M15 for clarity and focus. Again, thanks for all of your tips and videos. Getting a patreon andKZbin member notification that a video is on the way gets me hyped. You are always an encouragement and make every Saturday extra special with your videos.

[@super06141996]

I'm thinking about switching to an buffet crampon icon 2 from a stock mouthpiece on a student model horn.

[@kexu3087]

is your mouthpiece refaced? On my BD5 blue box 3 and v12 3.5 feel about right between clarity and stability.

[@medusa210562]

I play the B40 lyre. I experimented with just about all the vandoren mouthpieces and played the BD5 a lot. But ended up with the B40 lyre.

[@Resgerr]

I found I liked the sound more from the BD5 but I noticed you were struggling more to play it. So the Lyra was better for you, what a difference a mouthpiece can make 😮

[@barryfleischer6553]

Have you ever asked your young students why they chose the clarinet? I always do, the two answers I hear most often are because of Squidward (from Spongebob Squarepants) and "it looked easy to carry."

[@callyclarinet]

Hahahahahahahaha yep those are two big ones!

[@user-yp1pd4zj5y]

hi. What is the gap size on these two mouthpieces?

[@jimis3167]

I suggest you get old engraved Vandorens If you find in good condition. They play much better than the newer yellow logo ones. I believe their material is better.

[@michaelcorner3861]

Fellow pro and teacher here. I'm fortunate enough to have a really GREAT Kaspar Chicago, so that's my direction soundwise. For me there's no question, the BD5 is much MUCH closer to my sound concept that the B40 Lyre, which feels like there isn't enough to blow against for me regardless of how hard a reed I would put onto it.

[@callyclarinet]

Really? Dang, I find the BD5 much less resistant than the B40L! Just goes to show how differently everyone plays. Thanks for sharing!

[@davideichler5105]

@@callyclarinet , however, don't discount variations between copies of the same model mouthpiece, even ones made by hand by experts, and also differences in climate (when using cane reeds) and instruments.

[@michaelcorner3861]

Hi! Just found this again Several weeks ago a student brought in a new HD BD 5 for an opinion. In 2 words; I'm blown away. Sounds nearly identical to my Chicago Kaspar but with a lower throat, allowing me to be more relaxed. I always liked BD 5s and 4s for my students and felt they played great but the sound went nowhere. No longer the case with the HD. I'm completely sold. Will be interesting to see when/if Vandoren introduces other models in HD. Thanks!

[@patrickmaples1147]

Is the b40 lyre a 13 series? I do agree with the comments above that the bd5 non 13 series is the way to go.

[@thomasshuffield837]

Hey Cally! Enjoy your channel! I'm in my 70s, and played professionally (ocassionally) years ago. I own/play a couple of the BD5 MP in both regular and 13 series. I love them and have owned or tried almost everything else. The 13 series BD5 is darker and more free blowing. The non-13 series MP is compact and more uniform in it's blowing resistance. I prefer the non-13 series. Also, If you want to free up the sound (but not usually brighter), try a Bonade non-inverted. The heavier ligature with the dual screws add mass and stabilizes the reed. If you want to deaden the sound, a Lyben or something lightweight that holds the reed with a small contact area might be the solution. (BTW, I have newer R13s, Backun Alpha, several Vitos, Bundys, Old Selmer Signets, Lyrique Libertas, etc ... but the clarinet I enjoy the most and has the best tuning and timbre is the hard rubber Ridenour RC576, hands down. Try one, they are under $1k and after 30 days, you won't go back to your Yamaha) Take care. Tommy

[@callyclarinet]

Thanks for the tips! I want to like the Ridenours, and would agree the sound is nice, but I have not been impressed with the keywork or tuning once the instruments are fully warmed up. I have had multiple students whose instruments are always in for repair and one where the hard rubber expanded so much the keys stopped working. Plus the instrument went from in tune (not warmed up) to so sharp and out of tune while warmed up that there was no amount of adjustment that would get that clarinet to stay in tune. The hard rubber (to me) just seems like a material that is overly sensitive to temperature changes. That being said, there are newer models being produced that I don't know much about, so perhaps those issues have been resolved.

[@thomasshuffield837]

@@callyclarinet well, that's really weird, and I have heard that before, but also the opposite. Maybe difference in climate? I'll admit that due to the price of the instruments, the key finish is not the best, but not had pitch issues with temperature ... The hard rubber measures a lower temperature coefficient than blackwood ... And my 576 tuning spread is lar less than my Buffets or others. The twelve's are right on, the low F is not flat and the Clarion D is not sharp. The blowing resistance is more than most clarinets, but is also more uniform. If they are using some of Tom's cheaper models, maybe they have issues. I've nothing but high praise for the RC576 ... I own his Libertas, as well, which is basically a Leblanc Concerto in rubber ... As far as maintenance, not had one problem in the 4 years I've owned his instruments. Contrast that with about 5 trips to the shop for my R13s in 2 years ... Bizarre. Well, anyway I don't know if you were using the 13 series or regular BD5, but they play and tune totally different. I played old Yamaha clarinets in the Symphony for 9 years ... models YCL 62/65. Bright, but fantastic. I purchased a 650 about 6 years ago ... wish I had kept it. Love what you are doing ... I'll try to launch a few dollars in your direction.he opposite.. I'll admit that due to the price of the instruments, the key finish is not the best, but not had pitch issues with temperature ... The hard rubber measures a lower temperature coefficient than blackwood ... And my 576 tuning spread is lar less than my Buffets or others. The twelve's are right on, the low F is not flat and the Clarion D is not sharp. The blowing resistance is more than most clarinets, but is also more uniform. If they are using some of Tom's cheaper models, maybe they have issues. I've nothing but high praise for the RC576 ... I own his Libertas, as well, which is basically a Leblanc Concerto in rubber ... As far as maintenance, not had one problem in the 4 years I've owned his instruments. Contrast that with about 5 trips to the shop for my R13s in 2 years ... Bizarre. Well, anyway I don't know if you were using the 13 series or regular BD5, but they play and tune totally different. I played old Yamaha clarinets in the Symphony for 9 years ... models YCL 62/65. Bright, but fantastic. I purchased a 650 about 6 years ago ... wish I had kept it. Love what you are doing ... I'll try to launch a few dollars in your direction.

[@thomasshuffield837]

Well, my android phone is doing crazy things ...

[@callyclarinet]

Yeah who knows. The tough thing about newer ideas is that if one little thing is wrong people judge the whole brand on a couple bad experiences and then it is tough to get into the market. Glad to hear that the higher end models are working out! I complain about my Yamaha CSVR keywork but that was only because of the wood breaking in.... After about 2 years I stopped having issues with the pinky keys and the wood is very stable now. The traditional pitch is better for me than 13 series. I have used both. The 13 series is better on my buffet which plays very sharp, the traditional is better on my Yamaha CSVR. Thanks for checking out my channel and sharing your thoughts here!

[@orlandopimentel4459]

Nice video, Cally. Have you tried the bd5 with rue le pic or v21? In my opinion the bd5 doesn’t work well with V12. Of course it is personal with mpcs and reeds 😅

[@callyclarinet]

Hi Orlando!!!! I’m not a fan of the V21… they sound nice at first but seem to die pretty fast for me. Maybe I’m just used to the V12 and know what to expect!

[@callyclarinet]

What’s your setup now?

[@michaelcorner3861]

Agreed. Rue Lepics are better on some mpcs. and V.12s better on (most) others. V21s aren't much good on anything. Best reeds I've found depending on your setup are either Leuthner French cut professionals (NOT American cut) or Ishimori Woodstone. My 2 cents.

[@davideichler5105]

With the B40 Lyre, do you find the throat E and F more in tune because they tend to fall that way naturally, or is that this mouthpiece offers more flexibility for lipping up flat notes into tune?

[@callyclarinet]

Oooo that's a great question. I do feel like I have a little more flexibility, so you might be right!

[@TheTabwinner]

Did you try the B40 non Lyre ? If so what made you go with the Lyre.

[@callyclarinet]

A looooong time ago. Felt stuffy and that time but who knows what I would think now lol

[@jimis3167]

Your chosen strength of reeds aren't too heavy for B40 Lyre? Ok, saw the video, you get more projection and focus but isn't too hard of a reed?

[@vincenttoraille1453]

You should tests the BD4, id does not have the BD5 tone issues

[@callyclarinet]

I want to soon!!! Last year I told myself I'm not allowed to change mouthpieces for a year and then I can try some new ones... BD4 HD has my eye 👀

[@emjay2045]

The non-13 series BD5 is a bit better for intonation & articulation (IMO) if BD’s are your shtick. If that means anything But of course certain adjustments will be needed.

[@callyclarinet]

I agree!! Non-13 is the way to go.

[@Cornodebassetto]

How would the internal dimensions improve articulation? Articulation is predominantly down to the rail thickness. The 13 series has a wider chamber to bring the pitch down to play at 440.

[@uspallata738]

Hi! After having put my old ligature, Vandoren, on a BD5 mouthpiece, originally silver, the ligature began to turn color to blue and black. Anyone had the same experience. What does the BD5 mouthpiece bring ?

[@callyclarinet]

Hard rubber mouthpieces emit a gas that can tarnish silver. I recommend covering the mouthpiece with a small microfiber cloth when storing it to prevent it from tarnishing silver keys and ligature. I also have started keeping a tarnish strip in my case and I keep a silver polishing cloth handy to remove tarnish when I see it

[@uspallata738]

@@callyclarinet isnt that gas bad for health? Mouth health especially...

[@callyclarinet]

It’s from the sulfur used in the process to make hard rubber, which I would hope is safe considering it’s the 3rd most abundant mineral in our body (thanks WebMD!) and we need sulfur in our diets. So in other words, in theory it should be safe :-)

[@uspallata738]

Gracias Caily for your answer! @@callyclarinet

[@mocatz1963]

I'm sorry but my computer speakers aren't even close to being able to allow me to hear this. I would need to run this through 100+ watts to be able to hear this. I can hear the Clarinet fine but the commentary, not hardly at all. This is the only channel on KZbin I can't hear.

[@fabiourr]

I play BD5 with Vandoren 3 Taditional, I think you sound very stuffy with both mouthpieces. My advice: you should try using easier reeds (3-3.5) and find the sound you want by working on chin pressure (relax and create more softness to round off the sharp edges of the sound), air pressure and voicing. It may help to use leather ligatures, I am happy with the Rovner Versa-X. The BD5 and B40 Lyra are designed for medium hard reeds. Good luck!

[@rafclarinete]

The b40 lyra is much freer and clearer but in my experience the tuning is very high, doesn’t it happen to you? I think the bd5 may be a little darker but it projects less and it sounds less free as a little content is my appreciation

[@callyclarinet]

I agree with everything you say except I think th BD5 tuning is a lot higher than B40 Lyre for me

[@user-ux9jq8ic8y]

I can hear what you’re describing about these mouthpieces when you play them. I liked the BD5 the best, but I think you can get the sound you’re looking for on both mouthpieces if you try some different reeds. I found about 10 well known clarinet players on the internet who play the B40 lyre with V12 # 3 1/2 reeds. I’ve also found that blue box 3 1/2 reeds work great on the BD5. John Bruce Yeh was successful with that setup. Those two options might feel a little more free blowing than what you’re used to, but after awhile you might get used to the freedom they offer.

[@steennordberg-nielsen3012]

Do you play in 440 or 442?

[@callyclarinet]

Depends on the ensemble

[@michaelcorner3861]

Interesting. I'd rather change barrels than mpcs.

[@T.H.W.O.T.H]

Personally I found the BD5 played a little flat, and tuning wasn't really aided by adding a short barrel. These things are more art than science.

[@barryfleischer6553]

You could play on a pea shooter and sound beautiful.

[@vicente1049]

B40 mejor

[@pablodevadderclarinete]

They both sound very stuffy, hard, unfocused and dull

[@pablodevadderclarinete]

Wrong reed selection may be the problem here

[@Cornodebassetto]

Informative video but I think your reed strength is too heavy for both is these mouthpieces. As both are generally open tipped you should really consider a 3 or 3.5 for the thicker reeds such as V12 and V21. Also Yamaha clarinets generally tend to be “dark” sounding due to Yamaha drawing inspiration from the german bore. It is a minefield for sure so good luck in your search

[@callyclarinet]

Yeah I agree with the darker sound at least of the csvr bore. You'd be surprised to know many players (at least here in Chicago) play on BD5's with strength 5 reeds! I can't do it.

[@Cornodebassetto]

@@callyclarinet that really surprises me. I’d rather not have an aneurism trying to blow on that set up. I suspect many shave down their reeds so that they become like 3s but with the thicker heart of the 5 🤷‍♂️