Should We Still Buy Diesels? [S6, E32]

[@BollocksToThat]

Yes, yes we should. Heavy SUVs should use diesel. New 3.0 diesels are so clean compared to the past

[@KarmaticEvolution]

How are they compared to ICE and BEV? Genuinely asking.

[@Tjescoo]

​@@KarmaticEvolution Isn't diesel a possible energy source for an ICE?

[@KarmaticEvolution]

@@Tjescoo Yes

[@CarsofGlasgow]

that is so true, I was still surprised they offered the 3.0d in the 2024 VW Touraeg

[@exploremore2871]

I’ve got a diesel 3 series (2015) with over 250k miles and I don’t think I will be replacing it for a petrol any time soon

[@rickpruim4458]

The best part of my thursday!

[@TBATTIECYCLING]

Definitely

[@ckmurphy1]

Tony and Sam thank you this podcast has become my favorite KZbin weekly event…

[@rsssmeaton4260]

Sam and Tony, firstly I love the work you do keep it up. As a pervious owner of a 987.2 Cayman S I feel I must defend its honour, the picture you shared was of a .2 so 2009/2010 era which don’t suffer bore scoring at all, same 3.4 engine they used in the 981 pretty much and the first of the PDK boxes. Cheers Richard

[@AM_9924]

My dad recently bought an Audi A6 diesel in black edition spec. Drives effortlessly. All around stunning car 👌

[@paddleshift3602]

Listening to you guys while I’m at work makes my week. Please keep the shows coming! 🔥

[@gordonsimpson3235]

You are a petrolhead Sam, but your knowledge pretty much starts at the start of the millennium! 😄

[@michaelwalsh3581]

I get this question quite often as well as a car salesman that deals with more of the joe average cars rather than anything prestige. I always say that it depends on what the car's going to be used for. Long or short journeys per day, towing, ULEZ consideration etc. Purely customers preference when they take into account DPFs, economy etc.

[@gordonsimpson3235]

There was a VX (147 bhp)and a VX Turbo (197 bhp later 217 bhp) Vauxhall engines (more reliable) but an Elise with a slightly different skin...wider rear track and longer wheelbase. I think the 220 naming referred to the 2.2 engine.

[@beatles4sale2007]

I run a 2021 SQ5 Diesel and for a daily 80 mile commute it’s great. 40ish MPG and plenty of grunt. Dragging a battery around with the hybrid put me off and the 2.0 litre versions (derv or petrol) were a bit asthmatic, having run a diesel one for 3 years.

[@rejoicerone3176]

320i vs 320d is a good example because i see more new 320i on the road nowadays and its great because them B48 2L petrols get 45 MPG on the motorway and 50MPG is ur careful compared to the B47 20d which gets close to 60mpg. With the B48 you dont need to fill it with adblue and doesnt have dpf issues as well and with petrol being cheaper than diesel nowadays, the cost to run is near the same because you dont need to pay to fill it with adblue and you dont need to take it on a run and waste fuel just to clear the dpf if you dont do long journeys.

[@rejoicerone3176]

@Sugandese Nuts yaa that's true too, it probably comes down to preference too, the B48 quieter and smoother than the B47 altho modern 2L diesels r really refined! I'd say if the person does mostly town journey and only the occasional motorway long journey, the B48 would be ideal

[@rejoicerone3176]

@Sugandese Nuts yaa I remember Mat from high peak auto saying his 5L V8 L405 gets like 19mpg in town and 27mpg on the motorway he says, which is like what 10mpg less than what the diesel would do. The 5L as u said is much more reliable than the 3L diesel's that r known for snapping crankshafts and DPF problems if not maintained properly and also the 4.4 V8 has turbo issues and if they let go it's an engine out job costing thousands

[@CHRIS1SYD2]

Ad blue goes in about once every 2k miles.. at 15 quid a go... 15mpg extra by far offsets the cost of that.. even the price difference on fuel is cheaper to use diesel still ...

[@rejoicerone3176]

@@CHRIS1SYD2 would it not depend on the amount of miles a person does?

[@CHRIS1SYD2]

@@rejoicerone3176 Not unless im missing something?... miles are variable and is fuel.. so 10 miles or 100 miles its cheaper if mpg is better??

[@markspark7347]

Here in The Netherlands, diesels are more expensive to buy, and road tax is literally double as for the same petrol car. For a Range Rover it’s around 300 a month for diesel compared to 150 for a petrol. Is it the same in the UK? Diesel at the pump is allotted cheaper though than gasoline

[@gordonsimpson3235]

The GTC/4 (4 relating to number of cams differentiating it from the really pretty 330 & 365 GTC from the 60's) is the cheap Daytona (365 GTB/4) - a sleeper. Plus better ride and power steering. It is a two seater. I had one in the late 70;s - lovely car. It has always been seen as the poorer cousin to the Daytona - mostly by those who haven't driven one. Same engine as the Daytona (slightly less power - 10 bhp) with six side draught carbs to keep the bonnet line low. The 365 GTC/4 2+2 has the same carb set-up and low bonnet line, but like its later iterations (400/400i/412) hasn't appreciated in the same way....very complex to fault find and therefore expensive to run.

[@andrewhurstcars]

Five days later this argument is already out of date, as the 2024 Range Rover is now going hybrid only!

[@gothychris]

37:09 mgf had the 1.6 the tf had the 1.8. The front boot was for the spare wheel it was tiny. Great fun to drive even as a worrysome engine.

[@ric355]

MGF came with a 1.8 as well. Back in the day I had a 1.8VVC version, 1997.

[@michaelmignogna2394]

Over in the US, driving a vw Jetta sportwagon tdi. Uncommon type of car but I like a small diesel that is great on the highway and gets great mpg while doing it.

[@anthonyfarnan5935]

They can be great things when not hamstrung by over zealous emissions tech

[@beavertechuk]

I recently sold a '09' Lotus Elise S2, it was an immaculate car for its age and only had 19,000 miles. I owned it two years trouble free, and sold it for 'trade' for £2,000 more then what I paid. Great car, however, it did sound like a food blender, so certinally needed an after market exhaust!

[@robbiehutchin679]

Same. Had an esprit turbo, Elise, 2 X S2 exiges and sold all for profit and trouble free. Bought an exige 350 because I agree about the 4cly noise.

[@MrRoyck10]

The Porsche Cayman that you showed was the 987.2 does not suffer bore scoring or IMS bearing issue, Porsche had rectified the issues with the 987.2 upwards and onwards, however the 987 Cayman/ Boxster and 997.1 are all prone to engine failure due IMS/scoring.

[@JAXm135i]

Favourite podcast, always listen while working from home 👌

[@mjrowden]

How does the Giulia Quadrifoglio look old? I saw one the other day and it looked incredible in metallic green

[@007knick]

I guess they haven’t refreshed it majorly since it was launched in 2016. Whereas there have been a couple of new 3 series models since then.

[@Liam.......]

Been using a Q5 40TFSI for the last few weeks, it's fine. Plenty of power for the size of the thing. The 35TFSI isn't bad either. Been getting about 28MPG which isn't brilliant but not awful

[@richboy900]

I had a Golf GTD. Great car if you're in the market for a diesel. Effortless and you'll see 60mpg often enough

[@ShanePleasance]

The infrequent start up of my ‘91 manual turbo diesel Disco and it’s cloud of black fumes is 🎉 a thing to behold.

[@michaelkey1124]

As a US listener, the diesel conversation fascinated me. I think VW's Dieselgate put the nail in the coffin for American buyers, but we weren't terribly keen on diesels before. To me, the travel times to get anywhere seem to make diesel powertrains make more sense than gas in some parts of the US as DPFs wouldn't get clogged. That said, in my area of the country (Southeast), many of the good ol' boys who can afford a $100k 3/4-ton or 1-ton diesel pickup will get them "deleted" (remove DPF) since emissions equipment strangles modern diesels and no one tests for it down here. Say what you will about the tailpipe emissions, those new motors run much better and WAY longer deleted, eliminating the need for buying an entirely new truck every 10 years. Not that I advocate, but interesting topic!

[@Kemfii]

The JLR decision is stupid. It's like Mercedes saying they won't use the name Mercedes any more and just use the 3 Pointed Star since everyone says the model names. After all everyone says E Class and S Class and G Wagon. Or BMW doing the same. Or even companies like Toyota dropping the Toyota name and just saying Land Cruiser or Hilux or Corolla. Absolutely Stupid

[@Rocky-hh3yg]

An ex had a Mk2 MR2 and I can 100% tell you that you notice it’s mid engine especially in the wet. Have any sort of turn on the wheel and boot it out of a junction and it’s so snappy. Loved it, but yes very slow. And as for the VX220 there was a black one that used to go Windsor cruise back in the day and it was mental quick. Another lad died in one on the Uxbridge road around then.

[@mlguy8376]

Switched from Audi A6 diesel to X4M comp petrol - because I was worried about the clean air zones. I could not drive into Birmingham (probably a good thing as a brummie) but London to even go to the boundaries to the in-laws and work I was worried it was going to be a toll just to go.

[@MrEMan-ex3uv]

Live in California USA, and have owned two BMW X5 35d and have talked my 2 sisters into them. Main reason, is performance and fuel economy. But diesel prices at the pump have gone crazy high here and I have started to wonder about hybrids, but have not driven one. The main issue is cost of ownership and fuel economy. Also, started running into the DPF issue. I now telework since pandemic and my wife now drives the X5 35d but her commute is short. Already had one DPF issue and my concern is much higher about potential future issues regarding this issue. However, I love it and don't want to change it unless I have too.

[@matthewnicholson9372]

I have changed my diesel 2020 520d estate for a Cayenne Coupe E-Hybrid, and currently loving it. However as it is my first entry into the electric (ish) car market, and as I do about 14k mileage per year, I am interested to see how it all plays out.

[@mikewallace1723]

Just replaced my ehybrid. Loved driving on electric. But my range was too low for my driving. In most cases I was travelling with empty batteries and lugging the weight around. The cost of charging wasn’t much cheaper than petrol either. Loved the engineering of the Porsche. But no hiding it’s weight. Gone down a size and petrol. Would consider the new Cayenne ehybrid with better range etc. enjoy. Great car.

[@benpenagonzales6014]

We had a lovely Passat wagon sport tdi with dsg - great combo - but got rid for a petrol hot hatch as close enough to London was a headache for a 2007 diesel

[@chooki101]

I did the change from diesel to petrol. I went from a c220d Mercedes to a Hyundai I30N. Realistically there was marginal efficiency benefits between the two and now the prices of the fuels are hugely different. I do miss the low down diesel torque but the petrol turbo certainly does not lack in power.

[@lucas04211995]

I’m in Ontario Canada and I didn’t even know they sold new diesel pedestrian level vehicles. I wouldn’t doubt it, but it’s not something that seems very common

[@Paul-D]

I recently swapped the family run about to a petrol. Just makes more sense with what your paying at the pumps

[@MrDead1975]

Just bought a new Land Rover Defender 3.0 diesel (see what I did there ;) )about 2 weeks ago. Showing 540 mile range on a tank, much better than the 150 range on the wife's e208 combined or 110 motorway

[@jameslewis1197]

Mid Engine Cars - in my 3rd year of ownership of 987 Cayman Gen 2 - 2.9 litre manual box. It has been the perfect budget Porsche. No bore score on the Gen 2’s as the engines were completely new. It’s cost a bit to run ( it’s 13 this year) but nothing drastic. My advice would be buy the best you can and then service though a recommended specialist. Now hankering for an upgrade to a 981 3.4 S 😂 - great show.

[@RichardRatner.1972]

Love the weekly guys. Kindest regards, Richard U.K

[@larsandroid]

These podcast episodes are the highlight of my week. Always.

[@Wooooosaaaaaa]

So weird hearing this from LA where no one even knows the word Diesel or what stations to get it from lol Merica

[@drivingprophet]

My girlfriend bought a pre-owned 2012 diesel BMW X5 back in 2020 and it's been one of the best cars she's every owned. I also LOVE driving it. Like Tony said, the torque is immense compared to the standard inline 6 gasoline versions of the X5 here in the States, and the fuel economy it provides is just fantastic. Only downside is diesel has been far more expensive than the highest grade gasoline here in Denver for the past few years. That's made fuel stops difficult on the wallet, but you can't discount the number of miles you can manage to a tank in this thing. It's just the best all round package. I wish diesel cars were more popular here in the U.S.

[@grenphelps7455]

Well I will still buy diesel, case in point, I've just bought a new diesel SUV 👍👍 there's no other option for me, petrol isn't as good MPG and don't get me started on EVs 😂🤦

[@hughmcneillie1032]

Shocking the way the UK government pushed us towards diesels then they bumped the fuel price up at the pumps. Don't be surprised if this switch to EV ends the same way. A Jaguar XJ Rsport or FPace S with the 3.0 diesel engine are still on my shopping list.

[@henryhealy]

It depends on what sort of driving you're doing really but in Ireland, they make it very difficult to choose a diesel over a hybrid sometimes. The pre-LCI BMW X5 45e was roughly €97k while the 40d was around €23k more expensive which no matter what sort of driving you are doing makes it a very easy choice.

[@mikeybee6061]

Audi SQ5 only available as a diesel in UK?

[@seanwilson43]

In Australia we had really lazy straight 6petrol from ford the Barra which I get about 9.2l per 100ks really good long lasting motors and relatively fuel efficient if you didn’t thrash it . But they all got thrown out the window (another convo) but diesel seems to be for the bigger vehicles and petrol is for the smaller vehicles. Bigger cars under more stress need a diesel aka a truck a smaller car like a hatchback just needs a petrol just to pep around

[@alekspen]

One of the coolest cars I ever drove as a diesel was a 2008 Audi A6 Quattro, it suited the car so well and it had so much performance and it got like 1,200km of range

[@kierantilley2590]

Hey Alex, what’s happening with the megane?

[@georgesj9536]

Think the diesel convo depends on the country: in NL diesels are really heavily taxed compared to (mostly hybrid) petrol cars. Looking online, only 1/7 of the ICE cars available since 2018 is diesel. Going more premium, its 1/10 or worse.

[@kimi88cz]

How are those cars for 2k?

[@ric355]

To help all those people confused by which Ferrari that Sam is on about, the correct picture is the red one with the kind of curved bonnet (hood), not the blue or gold ones that followed. The red one is a 365 GTC/4 and has the V12 engine in it that was also in the Daytona. The 400 (and 412) was an 80's car that also had a V12 but most were supplied as auto.

[@b71071]

Sam please don't go near an IX, the styling is a crime against humanity

[@t_dubois]

Tony's vocab ,hello!? absolute class

[@samuelgillard2196]

My mate had a Lotus Elise S1. He loved it, but he always said the Vauxhall was a better car, but he didn't buy one because he just couldn't face living with the badge 😂

[@ric355]

Just a heads up - the MGF and the S1 Elise actually used the same engine.... 🙂

[@robbiehutchin679]

And both head gaskets are fine with proper warm up and good maintenance

[@gordonsimpson3235]

Never liked diesels, and never had one as a result. Filth, smelly, noisy things + the added benefit of paying more for a cheaper fuel and standing in a pool of shit at the fuel station whilst filling the car wearing plastic gloves.....lovely. And all to save a few quid - what does that say about you?After taking all the invisible costs (fuel premium, DPF replacements, extra servicing costs, Urine injection to buy and fill - lovely!), it makes a nonsense of any perceived savings....especially now that diesels residuals are falling off a cliff.

[@malvinjnrn7784]

I’m looking at getting a 420d gran coupe f36 any thoughts ?

[@ChrisDorgan]

Your “it’s not a real Supercar”impression of Tony had me absolutely howling 🤣🤣🤣 the R8 is a great sports car a lot of bang for buck and they did the manual. I get it. Especially when older Vantages are about the same money and probably even higher maintenance

[@CarsofGlasgow]

Watching a year later, the Luxury name thing I dont think being shorter is more Luxurious. If you look at brands such as Chanel or Louis Vuitton with their long names for their products.

[@BakersTaste]

Tony wasn’t as on edge as usual. I enjoyed this episode quite a bit

[@chrisgreenwood7884]

Father in law has a late model espirt, I can tell you it’s mega cool, great fun to drive in terrifying 90’s way. It’s also a bag of shit. Spends most of the drives it goes out on going back to lotus

[@Lou-f]

308 gt4 are a real grower. Get a black one and put the larger wheels off the 400 on 👌🏻

[@benzinapaul7416]

Always loved the 308 GT4 and my mates think I'm odd but I love the Mondial t and even the Mondial QV appeals to me now. They have to be dark or metallic colours though, they look awful in Rosso Corsa

[@mikemitch1041]

I had a Cayenne S V8 4.2 diesel what a engine , surprisingly quick for the cars size

[@FamousJames]

I bought my first ever diesel last year after 21 years of driving and only ever having petrol cars. I found diesel is best for fuel economy and for road tax savings as the road tax on petrol keeps going up every gear and you don't get as many miles with petrol unless you go with a brand new car of which we all can't buy new cars. I'm abit worried about the ULEZ as my diesel is only allowed in some cities without charge not all but when will my car be worthless because the gov don't want you to buy them, is it safer to go petrol in the long run?

[@macsays2834]

I think it depend on whether you’re buying new or not, yes new petrols fantastic, but older with a decent performance level, are horrendous on fuel, I went from an Audi TFSI back to TDI recently and never looked back. There are soo many used diesels on the used market, ULEZ compliant (which isn’t just London anymore guys ;) I can’t see them going anywhere anytime soon..

[@GazMoby]

Very enjoyable as usual 👍

[@888mattd]

The Land Rover stuff doesn’t make sense to me. What is the “LR” part of “JLR” meant to represent if they’re trying to remove Land Rover from their branding? Also, don’t we refer to most cars by their model name only?

[@larsandroid]

Highlight of my week!

[@Nord_Mann]

I wouldn’t, not as a personal car anyway. My Cayenne is petrol non-hybrid. What’s wrong with petrol? I HATE being stuck behind pre EU6 diesels. They smell awful.

[@johnbutterworth8389]

Mazda are just launching a newly developed diesel straight 6 in the CX60 and to me seems a better bet than PHEV. Still, unsure which powertrain is ‘best’….what works or the supposed future-proofing!

[@andrewsimckes5748]

My neighbor used to have Lotus Espirit Turbo that car was awesome

[@MechatronCNC-HVM]

Electric cars don't excite me 🤷‍♂️ They seem bland, fast for afew mins but no character. Keep up the good work 👍

[@photographywithalex]

Cayman 981S I had for nearly 2 years. Amazing car and great sounding. can pick one up for 35K-40K.

[@photographywithalex]

also was very reliable, just get a Porsche warranty put on it just in case something big goes wrong.

[@KevTee]

I needed this today, such a good listen. Personal car is diesel but for channel project i prefer petrol.

[@guerinsgarage1183]

I think you should have a subscriber guest on the show so they can help with anything pre 2005

[@richardjohntierney5434]

Great video, funny and enjoyable.

[@andygtv]

Never had a problem with my Lotus Excel, drove it everywhere

[@Chrissy-H]

I’d still happily buy one - all the petrol cars I’ve owned, especially SUV’s and even hybrids etc, get absolutely appalling MPG in comparison. Also there’s a level of grunt available from a remapped tdi engine which is only matched by huge capacity v8 petrols, which can genuinely make them quite enjoyable to waft about and overtake in.

[@nickw1322]

Had an mgf, a bargain, head gasket not an issue once fixed. Prefer the drive to an mx5. Also had a mk3 mr2, even better, and facelift cars will never go wrong, 6 speed and lsd also, bargain for sub 3k. Wish I never sold mine.

[@ScottZ370]

Please have a go in the VX220 Turbo Sam, would be a great video!

[@AhmedNaas]

He won't fit in it though 😅

[@tomtaylor314]

I have had a MGF from 1997 no problems still goes great lol also have a new GT4. MGF part off family lol. Now now Tony 🤣

[@andreimadalinneagu]

Lads, I’m from Bucharest, Romania, and over here diesels are around 50% market share, 30% is made of EV and small hybrids, remaining 20% represents the petrol side of users. My case: I’ve been a petrol car user for a long time but now I’m driving an i3 120ah (largest battery) and a diesel X5 for long trips and towing…rest of the time my SUV sits.

[@simonwillgress]

Gone from petrol to diesel, I do 25000miles a year but to get a car that does 50mpg that’s petrol it has to be light. I’m feed up without have a comfortable ride and good mileage so switched to diesel Maserati Ghibli and I get 50mpg and it’s comfortable.

[@Wout0rNL]

In The Netherlands diesel cars are basically taxed to death. No one is buying a diesel anymore. The higher tax rate for diesels was always a thing, but the difference in cost at the gas station and better fuel economy was making up for that. Now with the efficient petrol (and hybrid) engines it's just not worth getting a diesel anymore. There is also a tax on every form of combustion engine, so most of the time getting the hybrid version of a model is cheaper(!) than getting the lower level petrol or diesel version.

[@platypushatstand]

That red 308 GT4 Dino looks like a sleeper

[@grooveseeker2883]

Thanks Sam,Tony

[@marklamb67]

Gone from X3 30D to X5 40i loved the diesel lovely wave of torque but to be honest b58 engine is fabulous in x5 so no regrets the wife had 4 members of public tap on the window whilst parked up in diesel and asked to turn engine off !!! Needless to say that’s why she made the change …..’the big bad diesel head rears itself!’

[@cowanscott9047]

Interesting stuff guys! I have to admit, I do tire of the endless Lotus jibes though.. It was the case way back when, but since the Elise got fitted with Toyota engines it's been the complete opposite in terms of reliability (paintwork issues were common though). I've had a mk1 Elise ('97) for 7 years, Exige S mk2, Elise Mk3 1.6 (2 years) and currently have a Mk3 220 Sport (8 months) as part of my collection. They've all been bullet proof, apart from regular wear & tear (as long as you don't fiddle with them too much).. in fact to date, the Exige is still the most reliable car I've ever owned.. 30k miles in less than three years, nothing fell off it, no electrical problems and no mechanical issues. Just wish I hadn't sold my S1.. financially i'd be sitting pretty.. Hindsight is a wonderful thing..

[@franciscoalvesporto9570]

Before 2019 I had one petrol car (a smart). Since then we only bought petrol cars. ☺️ The only diesel remaining is a E350d (from 2017). (Country: Portugal)

[@shankervasudev]

I am from India and a similar trend has emerged, since past 5 years people have started switching to petrol from diesel and there is less option nowadays as well.

[@jamesskudder9009]

Sam and Tony, did you see The Stradman's spec and price of his Revuleto? $723,000 plus delivery and local taxes. He thinks nearly $800,000. What!

[@robgreen13]

Have 320d ... want to stay with diesel and get 330d or M340d.

[@williammillard687]

The Land Rover name can be used for a more basic, easily repaired vehicle (a bit like the original?)

[@benzinapaul7416]

Wishful thinking

[@benpenagonzales6014]

I’m convinced you should be collecting, in essence, engines. Eg, a cosworth turbo, a mezger and that Ferrari needs to have a V12 Columbo engine in it to be worth money in the future.

[@thespicepatel]

Currently have a diesel and I’m definitely leaning towards petrol especially. The issues with ulez and all other cities implementing “clean air zones” mean I just don’t want to faff when it comes to a diesel

[@anthonyfarnan5935]

“All other cities”… huge exaggeration

[@thespicepatel]

@@anthonyfarnan5935 fair hahaha! Not all but the major cities. Enough to be annoying though.

[@MATB1278]

Try to do the opposite of what the government say. Bought a BMW 530d about a month ago and it is amazing. Electric cars will be a nightmare in a few years!

[@leeg131313]

xf s diesel owner here , 38mpg wheras a petrol with similar power would be 28mpg, no brainer really and suits the car more i think

[@jamespugh]

Hard say diesel is way go for big trucks in USA every person got one put see lot young guys with jacked up with mods on them turbos turned up. Though about one a small suv or truck for mpg but price fuel know is crazy for diesel. But small 4cly turbo gas engine defently rough fule 1.5L turbo chevy malibu get 19-25mpg mix driving depending on 87 rg or 93 Octain .

[@bringer666]

I live in Canada and we sell very few diesels here. I would never think of buying a diesel especially since "Dieselgate". Only gas (petrol) for me.

[@stuartanderson89]

You know what my Astra h vxr with ps4s tyres good suspension it don’t understeer like people always say or rarely torque steer it’s people who put cheap tyres on and don’t look after them that gives them a bad name

[@maedimalebana7495]

As I was typing my application comment, Sam says "don't apply if you're from South Africa". I am South African, and I was willing to move