Belgian Coticules 101

Here's a glimpse at some different types of Coticules, and some honing on a nice natural combo Bout too.
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[@w3zz3]

Great walktrough. I went to the quarry to pick up mine 8 years ago. Maurice is a lovely passionate guy indeed.

[@Corw1n1]

Finally learned enough to get a workable edge on a dovo 5/8 that I've never gotten great shaves with unless it was crazy sharp ...and then it was not fun to shave with. I was using way too much slurry and pressure to start with. I've even gotten a couple of nice edges on pocket knives and a small kitchen knife. The statement of needing to learn the stone and it's language always bothered me, but it turned out to be right on. That and comparing the amount of slurry you were using here to my technique finally turned on the light. Thanks for another good video and the great input and way you have of presenting the info.

[@KeithVJohnson1]

Awesome comment, I love hearing success stories like yours! Great job in persevering to the other side, well done! And it's always good to hear about the listening and learning stuff too, thank you!

[@whetstonemistery]

I love my coticule stones aswell. I only have 2 but they were picked out by Mr cellis at the Ardennes quarry when my Belgian friend visited there for me. I can go from bevel set on a ferrule hoses to shave ready by adjusting the slurry on the coticule. I have a Japanese sushi chef friend who will be trying one soon when I get round to sending it. As always great video. Keep these videos coming Kieth as you have been a big influence on my attitude towards honing and pert of the reason I enjoy it so much. Thanks. P.

[@KeithVJohnson1]

Thank you for watching, commenting and the kind words too! Happy Honing!

[@whetstonemistery]

Ferulle hoses lol should've been chosera. Fkin predictive text eh.

[@marty5627]

So I just bought my first coticule and I thought “What has Keith got to say about coticules?” Another great, informative video.

[@KeithVJohnson1]

Good luck with your new Coticule, I'm sure you'll have a lot of fun working with it, they're great stones. Happy Honing!

[@dcaddo2]

“ Psycho maniac”. Hey! I resemble that remark! Haha. Great video, Keith! Coticules have always been my favorite stones. They’re not the sharpest, and definitely not the easiest to hone on, but there’s just something special about them that lures you in. And by the way, I kick myself in the ass daily for selling you that Bout back. That is one very special stone.

[@KeithVJohnson1]

Thanks for watching & commenting David! Yep - Coticules are intoxicating, thats for sure, and you’re right about that bout too.

[@henrys3138]

I like your description of the scientific method. I appreciate you talking in depth about these methods, I recently acquired some soak stones and am budding my honing skills so I'm a ways off from jumping to stuff like cotis and JNATs but I appreciate learning from your input in the meantime. Edit: poobah is one of my favorite words, subscribed.

[@KeithVJohnson1]

Sounds good, thank you for watching and commenting Henry! Happy Honing!

[@joeorapellojr6417]

Keith the sound of that stone is amazing. Thanks for sharing but now I want one. 🐧

[@KeithVJohnson1]

Everyone should have at least one!

[@litcoin8951]

Every video I watch of yours, I desire to learn technique. I don’t have the money to continue wanting to learn new techniques!!! Lol. Thanks for the educational materials, you’ve got an abundance. 👍🏻

[@KeithVJohnson1]

Thank you very much for watching and commenting!

[@DanielWorkshop]

I was trying to find some more information on coticules and I had a good laugh when you lashed out a little. :)

[@knifetothebass1642]

I’m craving a coticule shave now. I’m gonna have to break out my 8x3. Thanks.

[@KeithVJohnson1]

YES - Go for it! Thank you for watching!

[@syf13]

Excellent video, as always Keith! Thank you for sharing your honing knowledge. Hearing hones in action is often just as good as seeing them during the videos.

[@KeithVJohnson1]

Thank you for watching and commenting, I agree, those sounds are super important... just listening is enough sometimes. Happy Honing!

[@2wheelz4567]

lol @ idk if its cause i'm an obsessive lunatic. I can feel when i get small pieces of dust under my razor it drives me crazy i dont use a microscope though.

[@e.c.knivesandrazors2840]

Just received my slurry stone from you for my new vintage belgian coticule and it is great! They may not be an exact match but hey its like you said it's shaving not rocket science.

[@KeithVJohnson1]

If it works, then it is a perfect match! And - it's gonna work! Thank you for watching and commenting - Happy Honing!

[@StompingRabbits]

I'm wondering if Belgium blue corticule can cut CPM M4 steel and harder steels in general.

[@KeithVJohnson1]

Someone in one of the knife forums might have hands-on experience with that.

[@e.c.knivesandrazors2840]

Hello again! Have you ever had a coticule load with steel? After honing the surface of my coticule has reflective spots that to my best assumption is small voids filling with steel similar to how a ark loads but far less uniform.

[@KeithVJohnson1]

Typically,, no - I don't see loading on Coticules.

[@aljones9684]

Great job. Bought some vintage Williams soap from you a while back but did not realize your expertise on stones (also your nice cut to the chase attitude and delivery). Heading to your site to pick up a coticule.

[@KeithVJohnson1]

Thank you Al - happy honing!

[@honemeisterbcs2932]

Thank you for sharing your knowledge. I can already get a razor from absolutely dull to shave-ready. Nonetheless, I'd like to know if you can give any piece of advice concerning blue belgian whetstones? Or, do you have a video about them? Kind regards. -Mike

[@KeithVJohnson1]

Ok for cutlery, pointless with razors if you have a yellow Coticule. There is nothing a blue can do that a Coticule can't and yellow Cotis will, invariably, make better edges.

[@honemeisterbcs2932]

@@KeithVJohnson1 Thanks a lot. Kind regards.

[@johnnyboydianno]

Lots of great examples of these marvellous stones ty Keith for the vid

[@KeithVJohnson1]

Thanks Johnny!

[@morehn]

Are these also good for carbon steel knives or just razors?

[@KeithVJohnson1]

Steel is steel. The rock doesn't know or care what the tool is. If you search KZbin I am sure you will find many videos about using Coticules to sharpen all sorts of things.

[@jaysolomon4156]

How do you cut a coti I chipped a corner off a 8x3 and losing an inch won’t hurt anything. It’s slate backed and I wasn’t sure how hard the slate would be to cut.

[@KeithVJohnson1]

It's very easy to shatter a stone, or make the existing problem worse, so I don't recommend cutting them. Better to just lap that corner with a diamond plate until it's flat and evened off.

[@hosseinordoubadian5439]

Thanks for the coticule tutorial.Timely, as I have recently received a coticule and have been able to produce a good edge. I am still figuring out my JNAT, but I think my time on the JNAT (after spending a lot of time (re)watching your videos) helped me with the coticule. I have found the coticule edge an easier shave, gentler shave, but I still like that JNAT edge. I am sure I will continue to use both.

[@KeithVJohnson1]

Very cool - you're welcome - and thank you for the great comment!

[@thetoneknob4493]

as to old stones or new stones...a good stone is a good stone regardless of wen it was cut! im finding a good tell as to overall quality is price! lol..the only good cheap stones ive found wer either in the rough or oddly shaped.i dont mind facing off a rough stone especially wen its very good quality, and i dont mind an odd shape wen it means i can afford to get my hands on quality, this is in reference to jnat mostly. ive ben enjoying your videos alot and learning alot of useful information! thank you

[@KeithVJohnson1]

Totally agreed, 100% Joe - they're all 25 or so million years old, when there were taken out of the ground MIGHT mean something but as you so eloquently wrote - "a good stone is a good stone regardless...." .... truer words have never been spoken.

[@OGianmarcO]

Just out of curiosity, was that shading natural combo that you used to hone marked as standard or selected? I have a very similar looking stone and the gradient between the blu and yellow side is just awesome

[@KeithVJohnson1]

I don't recall.

[@brunobolanti3675]

I was going to purchase my first coticule this week, so this piece couldn't have been more timely. Thanks for sharing your thoughts Keith, and for running such an informative channel.

[@KeithVJohnson1]

Very cool! Thank you for watching and commenting!

[@blade4vor905]

You got a lot a stones, man! lol Your videos are always educational and entertaining. Thanks, Keith! Cheers! -Rob

[@KeithVJohnson1]

Lol, thank you for watching and commenting too!

[@johnmcculloch7550]

Hello Keith! I recently purchased a coticule from you and I am enjoying using it. I am learning on a 'pre-owned' ~1/4 wedge razor made from US steel (Boston). I hear people talking about how the razor will start to stick when its getting close to finishing. Do 'wedgee' razors stick less than more hollow razors when using coticules? I can get my razor to briefly grab several times per stroke, but never holds fast and stops. I am getting better edges with each attempt, though; I can get to an uncomfortable edge thus far. Its been a fun process.

[@KeithVJohnson1]

I've been honing for a long while, never had a razor stick/stop. Go by the numbers, start at the beginning, learn to set the bevel well enough so you can shave with it, and then proceed.

[@johnmcculloch7550]

@@KeithVJohnson1 Thanks for the advice!

[@donsegundo5012]

Hi mate, what stone do you prefer for polishing and finishing sharpening a razor? jnats, coti or anoher?

[@donsegundo5012]

Thanks for your like mate and please, if you can, give to me an answer please 👍

[@KeithVJohnson1]

Based on my mood, I'll choose from several different stones to hone and finish razors. Really depends on how I feel that day, or in that moment.

[@donsegundo5012]

What are the stones you choose in this case ? Thanks mate !

[@KeithVJohnson1]

@@donsegundo5012 I buy and sell a lot of stones. some I keep for while and others I don't. The list is endless and not something worth writing out. If you have heard of it, I have probably used it, and some of those stones might be here now, or were here recently, and may show back up here again at some point in the future.

[@donsegundo5012]

👍

[@peterharrison8756]

Loved it Educational and very entertaining. Ps loved the humour.

[@KeithVJohnson1]

Very cool, thank you for watching and commenting Peter.

[@duster413]

I love the clarification of it all...So much BS surrounding which Coti is what. How about a complete rundown of the different Eschers? We all "know" that they are great and pricey, please explain why. ???

[@KeithVJohnson1]

Eschers are the 'auto' hone - you can be blindfolded, hands taped up, braindead tired and delerious from lack of sleep - and you can still hone well on an Escher. Plus, they're old, haven't been manufactured since the 40s, and some have labels and boxes. As for which Escher is best...the one you own is the best one, lol.

[@duster413]

@@KeithVJohnson1 Thanks, but I was really hoping for a vid rundown of the colors, history, etc.

[@KeithVJohnson1]

If I did a 'rundown' on Eschers, it would be identical to what I wrote above - the best one is the one you own. But I usually only keep one Escher on hand, can't do a comparison video with one stone. FWIW, I don't subscribe to one color Escher being better than a different color Escher. Most of the Eschers I have owned had no color label, and all have performed so similarly that the colors are of no consequence to me. As for the Escher company history, there is a storyline written by Peter on the web somewhere. Google this... Escher Hone History ... it will usually locate the PDF.

[@duster413]

@@KeithVJohnson1 Gotcha. I appreciate the response. Now if I can only find one at a yard sale for 10$...

[@mikeslayer5926]

very interesting , I appreciate the time you took for this video, ...sorry im a few years late !,...penguins huh ! ? !

[@KeithVJohnson1]

Thank you for watching and commenting. Yep, penguins, they've been my 'mascots' for 6-7 years now.

[@mikeslayer5926]

@@KeithVJohnson1 yeah I kinda adopted them as a personal icon when an old girlfriend sent me a meme with a innocent looking cartoon penguin with the statement "I may look harmless , but , if I get you alone I WILL EAT YOU ",...She sent me that and said it reinded me of you...HA ,...HAVE A GOOD DAY, MIKE

[@agaralpha1842]

yea coticule are great razor finisher btw what the name of intro song? i like it!

[@KeithVJohnson1]

Hi, thank you for watching and commenting. Unfortunately, I lost the name of the song/artist.

[@Sproutt]

(Knock Knock Knock, answer front door) Officer Smith - Hello Mr. Johnson I'm Officer Smith with the Honing Police. We had a complaint on a Coticule Video you made. Were gonna have to take you in for questioning. Mr. Johnson- Not Again... What did I do this time. (Get in the car) (Arriving at HPD Honing Police department) Officer Smith- Walking into Interigation room slams the stone without breaking! (Boom!) Mr. Johnson- What do you want from me? Officer Smith- can you Please hone my razor Please?

[@KeithVJohnson1]

happy honing!

[@niftytubeman]

Bad old stones got tossed or used on an ax So the remaining razor hones are razor hones not just rocks

[@KeithVJohnson1]

Thank you for watching and commenting!

[@whetstonemistery]

How do you cut them Kieth? I have to cut my big stone as its 275mm x 75mm. I want a slurry stone off it but am shit scared about cutting it.

[@KeithVJohnson1]

I would leave it alone, and just buy a slurry stone.

[@whetstonemistery]

@@KeithVJohnson1 thanks Kieth I'll do that mate. If you would ever change your policy on sending your stuff abroad let me know as there are some items in your Etsy shop I'm interested in. Or if you'd do just a one off post to Thailand let me know. Thanks for your no bs approach to all you convey and I'll look forward to your next posting.

[@COMB0RICO]

Thanks from Texas.

[@KeithVJohnson1]

And thank you from Brooklyn NYC!

[@Sproutt]

the guy at the local knife shop was kind of talking crap about arkansas stones... saying oh thats just a piece of quarts ( i think he wanted me to buy only sythetic whetstones if you know what k mean. but i have had nice results on a hard arkansas just be ready to sharpen for a while.

[@KeithVJohnson1]

Vendors usually only like what they sell. If he had Arkansas stones to sell, he'd probably be singing a different tune. They're composed of microcrystalline quartz, they work very well. Some synthetics work well too though.

[@remlok2655]

Interesting video Keith, thanks. How do coticules compare to hard black arks as a finisher & is it necessary to have both. Is one better than the other in other words?

[@KeithVJohnson1]

Better is a subjective term. A hard black Arks can be almost soft or almost as hard as a SB/trans/true hard, and Coticules are also known to vary is personality, type, etc. Best way to approach this is to judge each edge and stone on its own merits.

[@muezlerspeedy821]

Great video as usual, I like your "no bullshit" approach. I have a question on Nagura stones for my shaptons. Which one should I get? Some with a higher grain sizes as my stones, lower, or does it matter at all? Thx and keep up the good work.

[@KeithVJohnson1]

You don’t need or want to use nagura on a synthetic stone. Maybe on a 1k to boost cutting speed but its really not neccessary.

[@aljacobson9525]

Just discovered your channel this week. I’ve been into sharpening for some time for knives and woodworking tools. My highest level of stone work would be using Arkansas stones. Not a straight razor guy..but love the sharpening process...looks great. Love the passion you’re willing to share with us. I knew about Japanese natural stones and a bit about the Belgium stones. I had no idea thar slurry stones could be/are used on any kind of natural stones. I’m aware of slurry stones on Japanese water stones. Is there any similar slurry applications used on Arkansas stones?

[@KeithVJohnson1]

I have not found using slurry on Arkansas stones to be of much use, and sometimes it's detrimental.

[@Sproutt]

they say to use oil but i prefer to finish my knives on a hard white Arkansas Dry no lube water. Oil for me didnt work to well used Nortons Honing oil it clogged the stone way to quickly little dish soap and a scrub will clean metal residue and oil. but i found best results just taking my time on the edge with no lube . that way i can see the edge

[@HeyYoMikey]

Like your videos as always. You mention finishing on little water. Does too much make a big difference or not really? Just curious.

[@KeithVJohnson1]

You have to find what works for you. Sometimes I finish under running water - there are not rules, just go with the flow.

[@HeyYoMikey]

Roger, experimenting is key. Those les Lats are cool looking stones as well.

[@Sproutt]

thats a cool little slurries

[@nickfanzo]

My favorite hones.

[@KeithVJohnson1]

Much love for the coticule!

[@american1911]

Keith, did you or would you post 60x photos of the bevel at various stages through the process, 2K, 4K, 8K etc.? That would give us a general guide to follow.

[@KeithVJohnson1]

Hi, I don't subscribe the the "microscope method" . 60x mag isn't that high really but it's in the ballpark - thing is, what I see in my scope at any level of magnification isn't always, or ever, going to be what someone else sees even if using the 'same' magnification. I have microscope pix showing on my website, and I have a video with a clip of it also - where moving the light changes the view of what looks to be a good bevel into something else entirely. And I can't teach people how to discern the differences, use magnification correctly, or keep a continuously consistent light source. The best anyone can come up with is to set their own standard and try to be as repeatable as possible. Honestly, trying to match someone else's striations is a fools game; there are different steels, different pressures, different stones, and so on. Just having a different size monitor changes everything. Also, Finished Coticule edges are ugly as sin, finished 12k Nani edges are highly polished near-mirror and 'look great'. But I finish on Coticules after a 12k. So, the whole magnification game is a data-collection tool to be used wisely more than it should be relied upon for setting a visual benchmark for others to compare to.

[@american1911]

@@KeithVJohnson1 excellent answer, thank you.

[@fishmanfish1525]

awesome video! now I will go broke hunting these gems! boom!

[@fishmanfish1525]

flashing the badd assss at the end!

[@KeithVJohnson1]

Lol - thank you for watching!

[@Sproutt]

Btw what's is the difference between standard and selects stone? Ther seller had select before , but seemed to run out . So I got a standard with a Tomo. Lol Convex or , not to convex ? That is the 🤔that is the question.

[@KeithVJohnson1]

You'll have to ask the seller you got the stone from, I don't comment on stones other people are selling.

[@Sproutt]

but whats you experience with a convex stone? I think its good for the smiling blades. when you do trail end strokes toe to heel. I made a snall arkansas hard convex and i kind pf like the idea but. ot aure on a full bench stone. btw whats your etsy store url i have been. stone crazy and thinking of getting another stone here soon. i have forgot you mentioned you had am etsy. im just the old school ebay freak.

[@DanielWorkshop]

Melted car bumper. :)))))

[@Sproutt]

lolz 11:36 looks at pile of rocks... bingo.