Best AR-15 caliber: 6.8 SPC vs. 6.5 Grendel

ammoseek.com/ammo/6.8mm-remin...
The most important question to ask when choosing between the 6.8 SPC (or SPC-II) or the 6.5 Grendel is, "WHAT IS YOUR APPLICATION & NEED?"
Are you hunting from short range (sub-300 yards) or using the gun for self defense?
Would a light weight platform (16" or less barrel length) be more beneficial?
Are you shooting bench rest and seek a longer barrel gun (20-24") to maximize paper punching performance at 500-1000 yards?
Do you need terminal ballistics at the desired point of impact in order to harvest game ethically, or are you just punching paper and steel?
If you willing to carry a 20-24" barrel gun and deal with those heavier platforms, are there other calibers with better ballistics and performance?
The purpose of this video is to provide objective scientific information about these two cartridges. The comparisons below are with standard 6.8 SPC loads, not the more optimized SPC-II. Using the optimized SPC-II chambering offer even more advantages over the standard 6.8 SPC, and it should be noted that SPC-II loads can be loaded or purchased from Druid Hill Armory for the improved SPC-II chamber.
www.druidhillarmory.com/home/...
For reloading either of these calibers, check out Cavity Back Bullets for great brass and bullets.
www.cavitybackbullets.com/
Using Hornady's published data for their SST round for both the 6.5 Grendel & the 6.8 SPC. I selected this round because it is only 3 grains of bullet weight difference, which makes comparison rather easy to illustrate a point.
6.5 Grendel w/ 123 gr Hornady SST fired from a 24" barrel is 2580 fps at the muzzle. Very few people actually use a 24" barrel when hunting, yet if someone does choose to do so, well, they could also use a 24" barrel with the 6.8, and again have more energy. When using a 16" barrel, there is a ~230 fps drop right at the muzzle.
The same 123 grain Hornady SST 6.5 Grendel round out of the 6.5 Grendel out of a 16" barrel.
At the muzzle - 2350 fps / 1508 ft-lbs
100 Yards - 2189 fps / 1308 ft-lbs
200 Yards - 2034 fps / 1129 ft-lbs
300 Yards - 1885 fps / 971 ft-lbs
By the time you are at 300 yards, the Gendel out of a 16" barrel drops below the desired 1000 ft-lbs for hunting white tail deer or other mid-sized game.
Now let's look at Hornady's data for the 120 grain SST out of the 6.8 SPC from a 16" barrel
At the muzzle - 2460 fps / 1612 ft-lbs
100 Yards - 2250 fps / 1349 ft-lbs
200 Yards - 2050 fps / 1120 ft-lbs
300 Yards - 1862 fps / 923 ft-lbs
The 6.8 is also below the 1000 ft-lbs of energy at 300 yards. Point being, the hunting application of these calibers need to be limited to 300 yards.
Even with the older SPC standard loads, the 6.8 has more energy at the muzzle and at 100 yards...which is important to the person selecting either of these firearms for close quarters combat or for hunting at shorter ranges. Out to 200 yards the two firearms are essentially tied, and at 300 the Grendel begins to show are more significant, but still slight lead...yet, we should recall this is the older SAMMI 6.8 spc factory loads. When loaded to SPC-II specs, something that is now available, the SPC-II's strengths over the 6.5 Grendel become more significant.
Now, drop down to a 12-14.7" barrel, and the data becomes even less favorable for the 6.5 Grendel...while the 6.8 begins to really shine. Here is the data for 12" barrels. Note: when using a 12.5" barrel, keep your whitetail hunting shots under 250 yards.
6.5 Grendel w/ 12.5" barrel using 123 gr Hornady SST
At the muzzle - 2280 fps / 1407 ft-lbs
100 Yards - 2119 fps / 1216 ft-lbs
200 Yards - 1963 fps / 1043 ft-lbs
6.8 SPC w/ 12.5" barrel using the 120 gr Hornady SST
At the muzzle - 2389 fps / 1508 ft-lbs.
100 Yards - 2181 fps / 1257 ft-lbs.
200 Yards - 1991 fps / 1047 ft-lbs
Here we see the 6.8 in the shorter barrel, which one might opt for in a self defense application, the 6.8 outperforms the 6.5 out to 200 yards when it comes to delivering energy into the target, but then again both rounds will drop below the "1000 ft-lb minimum" by the time they reach 250 yards.
The main point being here...if you want to reach out beyond 300 yards for hunting, get a round with not only long range trajectory, but also long range performance energy...meaning, a more powerful round than either of these platforms. Ballistic charts are of little importance if there is not sufficient energy transfer to ethically and humanely harvest the game...however, if you are seeking a light weight platform that delivers efficient performance at less than 300 yards, both of these platforms work, however, the 6.8 SPC shows not only some performance advantages over the 6.5 Grendel, but also has a few reliability and strength advantages as well.
To get the full potential of the 6.8, select the more common SPC-II spec chamber, and get ammo loaded to the SPC-II specs...and you will be even better off.

[@mac7977]

If you get into either caliber, also learn to reload if you want ammo available on demand. I built a 6.5, but ammo wasn’t available, so started reloading with single stage press. That was the best advice I received.

[@sms9106]

Finally, a review that gives the 6.8SPC is't just due! thanks

[@grantdonley4014]

Two separate purposes. 6.5 Grendel was for punching paper at longer ranges. 6.8spc was created to make the M4 carbine more lethal. 6.8spc is also viable in a 10.5” barrel. Basically 6.8spc was created to kill more efficiently. 6.5 Grendel is a target round.

[@stevenkuznar9165]

Actually the 6.5 was created to give closer to 308 lethality in a M16 platform, the 6.8 was designed to give closer to 308 performance in the M4 platform. Similar cartridges different purpose, in a compromise gun, I'd pick 6.5 all day . I have a faxon 20" gunner and AA factory 10.5" MK18 style.. both are phenomenal shooting.

[@grantdonley4014]

@@stevenkuznar91656.5 will not get a full powder burn from barrels any shorter than 18”. It then suffers extreme loss in Ballistics from a 16” barrel, forget anything shorter than 14”. 6.8 thrives from barrels as short as 10.5”. I prefer a smaller weapons package much more than a full size rifle. It’s all a matter, as you said, of application.

[@stevenkuznar9165]

@@grantdonley4014 All I need is the 20" & factory AA 6.5 Gr 10.5". for anything else 0- 200 yd, I'd choose my 14.5" sopmod block2 in 7.62x39 , it runs like a sewing machine. Not super accurate but consistent 2 moa all day. Having 7.62x39R & 6.5Grndl, I never bought in to the 6.8 SPC. But to each his own, that's why they sell them.

[@Dfleuryoutdoors]

Good video, I rarely ever see anyone mention barrel length when comparing the 2. Even brownells did a video and used velocity numbers from a 24" barrel for the 6.5 and a 16" barrel for the 6.8. People seem to be obsessed with BC's these days and don't realize that regular hunting ranges the bc's don't really mean much. By the time the higher BC of the 6.5 gives it a real advantage over the 6.8 your out of it's effective range. It's the same thing with 6.5 creedmoor and 308. If your shooting targets at a 1000 yards the 6.5's have a real advantage but the average hunter wont see the benefits of high BC bullets. I personally don't think it's ethical to hunt past 500 yards and a 308 will do just fine at 500 yards.

[@miker258]

If you’re arguing the 6.8 is better than a 6.5 then you’re delusional and my guess would be that you own a 6.8 because that’s the only people that try making this ridiculous argument. Listen Both round will do what you want them to do the 6.5 just does it at a longer range but inside that there’s nothing that one does, in terms of hunting, that the other couldn’t but be honest the 6.5 Grendel is unquestionably the superior round. GOD BLESS YOU ALL

[@ryanfirst9761]

@@miker258 I don’t see taking a shot on a deer at 500 yds. even out of my Creedmoor. I’d hate to wound a deer because wind picking up between me and my target. 14+” wind drift difference between 300-500 yds with a 10 mph wind could give you a gut shot or no recovery of the wounded deer at all.

[@hawkstable8889]

​6.8 SPC actually slightly outperforms .300 Blackout out of barrels as short as 8.5 inches, and the longer it gets the wider the performance gap becomes. Basically if you want power and accuracy at range and don't mid having a longer gun, go for 6.5. If you want power out of a smaller package at shorter ranges, go for 6.8. If you want to go subsonic for whatever reason go for .300 BLK. The 6.8 SPC actually slightly outperforms .300 Blackout out of barrels as short as 8.5 inches, and the longer it gets the wider the performance gap becomes. Basically if you want power and accuracy at range and don't mid having a longer gun, go for 6.5. If you want power out of a smaller package at shorter ranges, go for 6.8. If you want to go subsonic for whatever reason go for .300 BLK. In conclusion every caliber has its niche and none of them are strictly better than the others. I used to be a bit of a 6.5 Grendel fanboy at one point, but at some point I realized it doesn't really fit my preference for a shorter gun so I shifted my attention to 6.8.

[@CaptShocker]

6.8spc2 seems to be my new favorite.

[@NachalYahu]

Nice breakdown. I think what your saying makes a lot of sense. Both calibers are improvement over 556 but not what some would hype them up to be. Thank u sir.

[@tofan2622]

I subscribed because you are actually smart my friend. 6.8 SPC II for the win for almost anything that normal people will be doing. If I am going to shoot long range, I am going to pick a purpose built long range caliber. Great video!

[@douglaslee2892]

Great information! Thanks

[@richardmcdonald4190]

Years ago, I passed on the 6.8 having a few AR15's and a AR10. I had hunting rifles like 308, 243, 25-06. I punch a lot of paper and I like long range accuracy potential. I finally got into the 6.5 Grendel after a buddy tried selling me on the merits of the 6.5 CM. The truth set in as I saw how far I'd have to be shooting to see the advantage of the 6.5 CM over the 7.62 NATO. One of those AR's in .223 became a Grendel with a barrel, handguard, and bolt change. For my purposes the Grendel works fine, but for finding ammo. Even Grendel brass is hard to find. My Grendel is SPR format with 18-inch match barrel. For AR15 hunting in the SE USA, the 16-inch 300 Blackout (150-yards max) is good to go hog and deer. 6.8 vs 6.5, just pick your poison.

[@rpsmith]

Great video! Thanks!

[@donaldhawkins-if2no]

You have made the same points that I use to convince others to buy the 6.8 spc over the 6.5 g. The 6.5 needs a longer barrel and has weak a bolt face and if you’re going to shoot an AR 15 long range you’re missing the point of the guns design. I hunt deer and pig in the southeast and very rarely take shots past 300 yards. My 6.8 has never let me down. I hand load for my 6.8’s and can push a 95 grain X bullet to over 2900 fps from a 16” barrel, and it shoots sub-MOA. I’ve built over a dozen AR’s in 6.8 and even built a few bolt guns in the caliber for personal use and for paying customers. I’ve let friends and family borrow my 6.8’s for hunting and they were always impressed with it’s performance. I’ve also built and owned a 6.5 grendel with a 24” barrel. It takes a long barrel to reach the velocity and energy levels I believe to be acceptable for taking game out to 300 yards ethically. I also hunt with a suppressor so that made for a very cumbersome weapon with a barrel that long. I also hand loaded for the 6.5 and still couldn’t match the performance you get from a 6.8 out of a 16” barrel without pushing the limits of the cartridge and it’s inferior bolt. For real world hunting and defense applications the 6.8 is a superior cartridge. I only wish they didn’t rush it’s inception into SAAMI resulting in poor initial chamber design. This issue resulted in making over the counter ammo weak. But if you hand load the 6.8 is a true gem of a caliber especially for the AR-15’s. Just make sure you get the 6.8 in a spec II chamber or better(there are other chamber designs). The biggest and possibly only difference between the 6.8 chambers is the free bore from what I’ve read, and the longer free bore on the better spec II chamber keeps pressure down allowing for more powder which equates to more velocity. Great video backed by facts.

[@UncleWayne5104]

I went with the 6.8, but in a long gun. Rem 700P with a 26" barrel. It's fantastic for most things we have here in Australia. I rarely shoot beyond 350 metres and it hasn't missed yet.

[@ryaniam22]

I like this guy a lot and also happen to agree. All these guys pretending 6.5 grendel or 6 arc is in the same category as 308 or 6.5 creedmore are crazy. Within 300 there is a huge difference although it might not matter. Past that the difference in energy is so big only people shooting paper could possibly think they are close.

[@bcjdwbiernfjherwfbowfib]

Great video. I love the logical explanation.

[@CBRpaul]

Nice breakdown

[@pickledcottoncandy]

I absolutely love the 6.8 i built. 12.5 inch barrel make s maneuvering I the thick fl woods easy. Never had an issue with any harvest. However, fl doesn't have the largest deer so I can't speak to how it performs on big bodied deer.

[@adolfosalasiii1306]

Ok … this was a damn great video. Shame took me so long to find it. Well done sir.

[@Lanzerath1244]

Great video

[@brianshall6100]

When these two rounds were developed, I originally wanted the 6.5 Grendel. After doing a lot of research, I bought the 6.8 SPC. I wish your video was available several years ago, it would have made it easier for me. However, my research led me to the same conclusion you have on your white board. I'm sold on the 6.8 SPC, it is by far my favorite round. On a side note, where I live 6.8 SPC and 6.5 Grendel are both hard to find. Good job on the video.

[@tofan2622]

Sgammo man. They have a nice selection, fast shipping and Sam has been super reliable for the past 10 years. I love my 6.8 SPC II as well, I sold everything else.

[@Severris]

I agree, I'm in the same boat right now. The big thing about 6.5 Grendel that turned me off was the high failure to feed rate with the various available mags.

[@nicsu2128]

From what I’ve seen. All the factory 6.8 SPC ammo is limited by the false SAAMI specs. In order to get 6.8 SPC II ammo, you need to reload. At that point, I’d be curious how the anemic 6.8 SPC store bought ammo stacks up against 6.5 grendel. That would have been an interesting topic for the video.

[@skookapalooza2016]

I've seen 6.8 SPC, years back, at the local Wally World. I think it was Federal Fusion. I'm sure you'll NEVER find EITHER round as cheap as 5.56x45. However, you get what you pay for. If I needed 1 cartridge, to do EVERYTHING...it would be 6.5 Grendel. With a good build you can really reach out there with high BC bullets. However, if ammo availability is plentiful for the 6.8 SPC, you can get high BC ELD Berger bullets. I'm not sure if you have to roll your own on the ELD or not. OAL may be a problem for all but steel mags or the LWRC/Magpul "Black Widow" SIX8 mags. However, if you choose the SIX8, AFAIK, you'll be limited to the Magpul...which, is probably a good thing, unless, you want a multi-caliber lower.

[@kraftzion]

@@nicsu2128 the 6.8 store bought is 50 to 100 fpe more than the 6.5 generally speaking when shot out of the same length barrel.

[@frobbit30]

Thank you VERY MUCH for this as I've been wondering what is up with the 2 calibers and this answered my questions wonderfully.

[@Bladedancer13]

Excellent information

[@robertjackson1407]

Thank you 😊

[@chrisdjernaes9658]

Best review and comparison of the middle weights … 🍻

[@dewaynesablan5646]

Great video Sir... Got two rifles myself

[@philclodfelter5994]

I was wanting something different and more punch than 5.56. Found the 6.8 and watched some videos ( small arms solutions ) & a few others. Built both guns with Wilson Combat Barrels a 16” & 11.3”. Really like this round and the performance

[@jerrywiese9722]

I like the perspective you apply in your thought process. This cartridge interests me too. What brands and weight bullets are you loading for it?

[@estranho]

Excellent!

[@jamespollard1670]

Good stuff .

[@petermartin7371]

Basically the 6.5 Grendal will do everything the 6.8 will do but at 500yards!! 😆👍 6.5 Rocks!!

[@rpsmith]

Well said Fanboy! You completely changed my way of thinking on this subject!

[@coreymerrill3257]

Lol yes with one major difference. The grendel is designed to be as high pressure as can be safely chambered in an AR with a large 5.45 or 7.62x39 bolt face . This means parts failure is going to happen faster in situations we're high volumes of fire are required. The grendel is a hunting round by design. Volume of fire was not considered as it was with the 6.8 . The 6.8 is better suited to short barrels and being suppressed. A grendel would shine In a precision manually operated rifle with a strong lock up ,with a bolt not constraned to the ar 15 dimensions . An r30 type ar would also do better with it's AR-10 sized bolt for the 6.5 grendel. The 6.8 spc was made as a combat cartridge , meaning things like parts failure rates were considered in design . It benefits In a longer action , but bolt strength is better with the 6.8 spc from the smaller case head diameter. The lwrci Six8 for example takes a longer oal . there are tradeoffs either way you go,but the 6.8 is a definitively better utility cartridge and is far less likely to make the gun catastrophically fail ( just means parts breakage causing failure to function ,most commonly assumed to be an explosion from a squib load or bore obstruction. But any breakage that prevents function is catosteophic failure) when used hard.

[@mylesharvey6488]

6mm ARC does everything that 6.5 Grendel does twice as far. I am not opposed to the A5 configuration of 20 inch barrels. The Marines took Falusa with M-16 A-2 as did the Army use them for decades even in CQCB situations!

[@toejam7606]

Great conversation

[@gabrielf1911]

I went with 6.5 because I can buy it locally. I haven't seen 6.8 locally. I might build a upper and give it a try on some hogs.

[@jimedick9496]

I’m on the opposite end of what you’ve done. I picked up the 6.8 due to the same reasons this video claims. I love that cartridge, but I also reload to maximize its potential… I find ammo locally on occasion, but most has been through ordering it. I now just reload the used brass. I’d like my next build to be the 6.5 Grendel in a 22” barrel. My buddy has one and I love it. He wants the 6.8 now as well, but with a 10” or 12” barrel. Personally, I think they’re both terrific rounds. Enjoy your new build if you go that route.

[@ryanfirst9761]

I actually don’t buy any ammo locally. I go to ammoseek, and let them find where it’s cheapest.

[@r.w.199]

Outstanding..

[@ravissary79]

Bc matters at range. SD matters all if the time if you're hunting. BC also matters for energy retention.

[@WorthDoingRight]

Both rounds are anemic beyond 400 yards unless you are punching paper or dinging steel. If one wishes to hunt deer or hogs, they need to be within 300 yards with either...beyond that, step up to a more powerful round. If you want a light weight platform...barrel 11.5-16," the 6.8 has better performance than the 6.5 in the hunting ranges for deer or hogs. If you want a longer barrel and are shooting small game like rabbits or ground hogs long range, then 6.5 is a good option.

[@ravissary79]

@@WorthDoingRight again, SD doesn't need range to matter. SD isn't merely a contributor to energy retention down range, but how a bullet performs in game or on a hard target, at any range. It drives a bullet deeper into tough game. A 110 gr 6.8 isn't just less efficient in the air than a 123 gr 6.5, it's less efficient at retaining energy through a target. Initially that means phenomenal terminal performance... maximum upset. That's great to anchor a deer or kill a person who is attacking you, but it means potentially it runs out of gas sooner. Bullet construction can mitigate this, but in doing so, the initial terminal dump advantages are also reduced. No free lunch. The door can swing the other way with lighter Grendel bullets too. If they expand reliably they can make up for the skinnier shank, and post expansion it's just an apples to apple matter of mass and colicky vs expanded diameter acting as a brake. If they're the same on both counts once they get there, it's a wash. But typically they're not. Most 6.8 loads are faster with lighter bullets and low sectional density. Most 6.5 Grendel loads are slower, with heavier bullets with high sectional density, dumping a touch later but momentum vs comparable or less drag will mean better penetration if bullet designs are comparable. I agree with most if your facts, except that the actual differences in efficiency vs barrel length as a function of energy not just pure velocity, while real, aren't really that dramatic, while the efficiency gains mean the advantage past point blank shrinks with every yard. Being lower pressure as a case really reduces its SBR efficiency. Very true.

[@WorthDoingRight]

​@@ravissary79 I am not saying BS or SD don't matter. I am saying regardless of "good" they are, both rounds are anemic for deer or hogs beyond 400 rounds, and should really be kept within 300...because the ENERGY just isn't there for deer or hogs at that range.

[@WorthDoingRight]

@@ravissary79 Are you aware of the 120 gr CBB for the 6.8? www.cavitybackbullets.com/product-p/cb-mkz-6.8-120-ammo.htm

[@issstari954]

@@WorthDoingRight Thats not really the case for combat effectiveness which is the actual purpose of wanting the energy retention at those ranges you can make hits at those ranges with the calibers with skill even beyond the 500 yard point something totally impossible with 223 beyond blind luck

[@LonestarROB]

Finally a video on the 6.8 SPC. They are few and far between. I built an AR15 and chambered it in 6.8 SPC II . Mostly because it does what I wanted it to do, and it's something different than the norm. But I'd be lying if I didn't say I regret going with the 6.8. Not because I don't like it but because of how hard it is to find and the price. I'm still holding out hope that the round will because more popular, but honestly considering converting to something like a .223 to pink around with, and getting a second bolt action for hunting.

[@WorthDoingRight]

Anytime you go with "something different" you should expect it to be less available...as that is what makes it something different. But that said, I chose it because of what it offers me for hunting. In your case, I would just build another upper...and just use the same lower.

[@1776_Reasons]

I stocked up on thousands of components to reload 6.8 when I purchased my 16" upper. For midwest whitetail hunting, mine is fine with the now expensive hornady SST factory ammo but I handload hornady, nosler, Sierra and barnes 110-120gr and they all keep the freezer full.

[@Jesus-iz2my]

I dont know about numbers but I have both a 6.8 spc and an 6.5 grendel and what I can tell you that the 6.8 spc at 100 yard hits and sounds louder when hitting the steel wong at 100 yards than the 6.5 grendel

[@northernoutdooradventures3883]

While every thing you list technical true, if you were to give each cartridge a 1-10 score they would be VERY close. 6.8 might squeeze out a win. The category that you didn't list was ammunition availability and cost. The 6.5 grendel wins price and availability by a wide margin.

[@ashadow315]

Not on the shelves of stores in Texas it doesn’t. Just picked up a few boxes of 120 grain SSTs for $24 each. They didn’t even have 6.5 Grendel. I see 6.8 fast more often here, but maybe it’s the hog gunners pulling the sales here. The 6.8 is alive in well in hog control here and it does an outstanding job.

[@northernoutdooradventures3883]

@ashadow315 interesting 🤔. I guess it's regional. Up here on Michigan, I can't tell you when I saw 6.8 last.

[@basketofdeplorables4253]

24 inch barrel AR15 is great for home protection. Just not for your home. It’s for protecting your neighbors 2 blocks over home.

[@thepalerider]

With the military moving to 6.8 should we ,as civs, consider moving from the 556 to 6.8 as well?

[@tophat8190]

The wife and I use the 6.8 spc exclusively for deer hunting and is an absolute thumper. I made a poor shot on an Axis buck quartering away around 100 yardish through the rear ham and the 90 gr Gold dot made it to the chest cavity. found the buck 40rds away. I made a large purchase when SSA discontinued the 110 gr Prohunters and have shot many deer between the two us with them and have always had great results. I use a 20" and the wifes is a 18" AR Performance barrel. Grendel wins on paper and the 6.8 wins in the field. Military should have absolutely picked this round.

[@Grasshopper-hj9lr]

I do agree that the 6.8 is a better performer at 400 yds and in. Harvested plenty of deer and hogs with this round and have no complaints. Druid Hill Armory loads up some very good 6.8 ammo that pushes the cartridge a little faster than the factory ammo leveling the playing field even more.

[@Just_a_Tool]

Id like to see another video like this again but comparing and contrasting with 6mm ARC.

[@troythompson1621]

I like the .243, but the .260 more so. Do you own an AR 10? Even a short AR 10 is heavier than a longer AR 15 in my experience, and below 18 inches. The longer bullets performance starts do drop off pretty quick. I see the two as pretty close. I have occasional shots between 3 and 400 yards, so I went with the Grendel. 1000 ft lbs at 400 yards with an 18 inch barrel is exactly what I need. 500 and up I would switch to the AR 10 in whatever caliber. On category I would've like to seen is inherent accuracy, but that might be hard to pinpoint. Probably not unbiased, but good video 👍 thanks.

[@Threegunmaster]

I like both but I don't hand load anymore so just using factory ammo the choice was very easy for me because I can find alot more 6.5 grendel ammo available

[@darrellfilyaw7255]

I will stick with my 7.62×39 rounds are cheap plentiful right now and I’ll still do what it needs to be done good video

[@justa3v619]

I go with the Grendel for ammo options. There’s several big ammo manufacturers making 6.5 Grendel ammo Hornady, Remington, federal, Barnes, nosler, ppu, wolf, defender, and a few more all make several loadings for the 6.5 Grendel. Only 6.8 ammo I ever see is Hornady and ppu. Really that’s the only reason I haven’t built a 6.8 I like the cartridge just wish it woulda caught on better like the Grendel. Same with the 6arc although it’s still relatively new at least compared to the Grendel and spc I’d like to build one but Hornady is the only company loading the ammo and it’s usually $1.20+ per round. I agree with the feeding issues from the Grendel. I had a little trouble when I first started with the Grendel about a decade ago but found the asc mags are very reliable especially with the 15rd mags the 25rd mags are reliable but you have to down load them to 20rd a ive learned, but just a few years ago I found an even better solution that’s absolutely 100% fixes the feeding issues I went with a psa ks47 receiver set that feeds from ak47 mags. I’ve never had one malfunction since switching to the ak mags. And to your other point about the bolt breaking. They fixed that issue when they swapped from the Grendel 1/ 7.62x39 bolt face to the Grendel 2 bolt face. I have a bolt that has over 2000rds on and it’s still chugging along. Over the years I’ve built 5 6.5 Grendel’s and have never had a bolt break. The biggest downfall I believe with the Grendel is muzzle velocity just gotta accept it’s going to be low. From my 18” faxon barrel I’m lucky to get 2500fps with bullets over 120gn but I’ve noticed there’s not much loss going down to a 16” and even a 12”. I usually only shoot the lighter bullets from my 12” like 90gn American eagle jhp, 90gn nosler bt, 110gn controlled chaos, and several hand loads in the 90-110 weight range. The 18” was my go to deer rifle for a long time until I seen I’m only losing 20-40fps if that dropping to a 16”. Now I mostly use the 16” for hunting but I’ve taken several with the 12” too

[@collinator68]

If im shooting out to 400 yards or more, I think I would rather have a 7mm-08 AR10. Other than that, I would say the 6.8spc is perfec for deer hunting from 50 to 350 yards.

[@czgunner]

Great video with correct, accurate information.

[@ashadow315]

This is the most informative 6.8 SPC video I’ve seen. Great job. I’ve been preaching the same thing since I picked this round up. Both are not meant for shooting game at long range, and at hunting ranges the 6.8 is superior. Too often people are touting ballistics for the 6.5 Grendel from much longer barrels than the ballistics printed for the 6.8 SPC. That combined with Remington botching the chamber and downloading ammo to make that chamber safe for release hamstrung the 6.8 SPC. The Spec ll chamber fixed that and allows high velocity and fixed the chamber pressure issue. The 6.8 also comes factory loaded in many more high quality hunting rounds from 85 grain to 120 grains. TSX, TTSX, Accubond, Sierra Pro Hunter, SST, VMAX, TREX, ETIP, Gold Dot, come to mind pretty fast and I’m sure I left some out, but all of those can be found commercially loaded for the 6.8 SPC. Great video.

[@joejas22]

Just splitting hairs. They both do the same thing. 6.8 spc is going and 6.5 grendel has a ton of support. Sometimes the good (favorite)ones just get away, like that high school sweetheart. When it comes to guns and ammo……just go with the flow…..it’s what the gun stores will stock.

[@momo-hm5ru]

watched a video where a guy was shooting his 6.5 grendal out to 700 acting like it was the cats meow. Of course it was out of a bolt gun. Why? There are way better cartridges you can shoot out of a bolt gun.. Like you said its a 300 yard gun. I have a 6.8. Built it for my son. He killed his first deer with it when he was 10 years old. I prefer the 6.8 since my barrel is 16 inches. WOuld have gone shorter if not for the NFA. Short barrels rule over the grendal

[@jimleffler7976]

Well, I love my 6.8 SPC, hard to find ammo though. I was starting to think maybe it's been discontinued

[@valqueenofValhalla]

very good video rather informative

[@shanescatsandcannabisfarm2965]

6.8 SPC is the ultimate C.Q.B / defense AR 15 round. A short barrel 10" - 16" is best for C.Q.B. / defense AR rifles. So obviously the 2 go together.... 6.8 was literally designed for short barrel AR's. That's why the M6 is better than the M4

[@timl8302]

CQB-SBR, I'd go with the 300BO/Whisper. It was designed for subsonic.

[@alkalk8938]

Neck either one of those to 6mm and go coyote hunting. I'm waiting on a 22" ar15 6dti which is the 6.8spc necked to 6mm and shoulder blown slightly forward. The goal is for it to be a 400yd coyote rifle.

[@tominva4121]

You should also include Ammo Cost, Ease of Reloading, and Probability of Cartridge Not Going Out of Production. I am presently trying to decide between these two cartridges and the .300 Hamr.

[@WorthDoingRight]

reloading isn't really any different IMO, and ammo availability for these rounds are about the same being specialty rounds. This is one good reason to use AmmoSeek.com to find anything you want.

[@jimedick9496]

I have both, and they are easy to find and reload. I’ve been able to order everything I need on line. I was able to purchase most of my supplies during the ammo crunch two years ago. You can’t go wrong with either cartridge. If you want to shoot long range, you need a 22””-24” barrel to get the Grendel to shine. If you prefer a carbine length barrel, or shorter, then the 6.8 spc is definitely the better option.

[@Mark-jc1qj]

Thank you Sir, I think I might have found the caliber for me. But I keep thinking about 308 lol.

[@scrub_lord]

i have heard 6.5 grendel does pretty good out of a short barrel like 12". not 100% sure on this but I want to say the 12" 6.5 grendel is similar in lb/ft of energy at the same distances to 7.63x39 in a 16" ak. once again dont quote me on that but Im pretty sure.

[@bobparvin9773]

I've got a 6.8 spc. It's a very accurate ar. Done bagged a couple of Axis does and neither one of them knew what hit em.

[@nicsu2128]

Missing a key metric. Ammo availability. Not only does the grendel win that, but the ammo you will find at stores will primarily be SPC. Which does not beat grendel in most of those categories. It would need to be SPC 2 in order to get all of the benefits that come with the chamber. Meaning it’s a round for reloaders only. That being said, I’m still on the fence about which round to build an upper around.

[@momo-hm5ru]

you do have a point about the anemic factory rounds for 6.8

[@jimedick9496]

I’m finding more ammo manufactures coming out with SPC II “only” ammo. I also reload, so I load my hunting rounds pretty damn hot, which I can’t do with my Grendel. Still, I see both Wilson, Druidhill, and CBB that loads their 6.8 to the SPC II specs. Fact is, they are both easy to order online, and even find at my local gun store. Also, they are both excellent cartridges. If you don’t mind a longer barrel on an AR-15, the Grendel offers a lot. If you prefer a carbine size rifle, the SPC is the better option. I love them both

[@nozrep]

i want one of them 30-06 ar 10s.

[@bryantitus6634]

In an AR platform, I'd probably have to agree that the 6.8 is superior if you have local ammo designed for hunting. They are both medium game rounds and are excessive in varmint round use, but as a one gun for all route, they are good options sure. Now, I'm currently on the market for a lightweight compact bolt gun for woods hunting but want something with a little reach for trying to get the wife into the stand and use it when my kids come to age for deer hunting. They both exceed a 30-30 and .243 in killing power on deer, and both recoil less. The .243 rarely reaches within 200 fps of stated box velocities in 20" barrel guns, and in a 18.5" barrel youth gun the .243 starts to fall on its face. The .243 even in an 18.5" youth bolt gun is plenty for deer at the ranges it gets used. The 6.5 grendel and the 6.8spc in the 18-22" barrel range perform on deer size game very comparably to a .243 does out of a typical 20" barrel but with a larger bullet diameter and far less recoil and muzzle blast. If I was going short action in my upcoming lightweight bolt gun purchase, it would likely be in 6.5 creedmoor. Not because I think it's a magic caliber or anything but because it really fits that role very well. But Howa has their mini action guns specifically built on the .223 length action. It comes chambered in .223, 6.5 grendel, 7.62x39, and 350 legend. The 350 legend is an option I haven't ruled out yet as it fits my "tracking rifle" platform arguably better. However, it is likely going to be a gun my wife and daughters come up to shoot in the future as well. The .350 legend is not an inherently accurate round and is highly susceptible to wind drift. It also recoils ever so slightly more. The social regressive posted a lot of ballistic gel testing videos on the 350 legend and while it's touted as a 250 yard deer gun, he had many loads fail to expand out of his rifle at 200 yards and his actual muzzle velocities came up a decent amount short of box velocities. The prior mentioned Howa mini action comes with a 16" barrel in the 350 legend only. So it should be a good representation of what I'd be expecting from that chambering. All other chamberings come with a 20" heavy barrel or a 22" smaller contour barrel. Velocities should be considerably closer to advertised and from ballistics gel videos of the 6.5 grendel from ar15.com out of a short barrel AR gives a representation of what downrange performance to expect from true rifle length barrels in the bolt gun. The .350 legend has earned a positive reputation of being an absolute hammer on deer though, clearly bettering it's ballistics gel and paper ballistics in the real world. Unfortunately the 6.8spc is limited to the AR platform and for a lightweight mountain/brush rifle combo the AR platform doesn't interest me. It's also more difficult to build in a true lightweight outside the 223/5.56 chambering. For that reason I'm suggesting the 6.5 as a superior to the 6.8spc but I know as well as most should that they realistically are both going to perform on game similar to a .270 managed recoil load offered by Remington or Hornady. Possibly slightly better due to the bullets being specifically built for the sad chamberings while the managed recoil loads for the .270 normally are just downloaded with projectiles from full power loads.

[@APBT-Bandog]

The 350 Legend does not look very promising to me at all, and honestly, I am surprised anyone really considers it a contender. The 6.8 can be built lighter than the 5.56 because of the larger bore diameter, so not sure how you came to that conclusion, plus it offers better performance than the 5.56. Now, you closed with "for that reason" you suggest the 6.5 was superior to the 6.8? Huh? What reason? The ballistic achievements from HEAVY 20+" length barrels that no one carries with deer hunting? When people choose a set up for deer hunting, they should look at the data from the EQUIPMENT USED WHEN DEER HUNTING. There are going to be far more 12.5-16" platforms out there than there are "heavy barreled" 22" set ups...for if you are going to carry something that heavy, heck, just get a 7.62 AR-10...or a 6.5 Creedmoor AR-10. The entire goal of the AR-15 is to be lightweight. Kind of defeats the purpose to run a 22" heavy barrel.

[@liberty4392]

American Sentinel K9, the .350 Legend rifle round has gotten big because of eastern hunters in my opinion. A lot of rifle cartridges are outlawed for hunting out in eastern States, but .350 Legend is not.

[@vastv7082]

Your right the 6.8 was meant for short range and shorter barrels for self defense type applications. The 6.5 Grendel was as designed for long range shooting or mid range hunting. So the caliber you want depends on want you want to do with it. Short range the 6.8 is it. If you plan on shooting long range then you need the 6.5 Grendel. Having said that I already have a 6.5 Grendel and I still want a 6.8 SPC because I want one of everything. In closing the 6mm ARC is where it’s at now for the AR-15 platform

[@WorthDoingRight]

both rounds are anemic beyond 400 yards for deer and hogs. Better stay within 300 to be honest. Beyond that, step up to a larger caliber...unless you are shooting rabbits or groundhogs.

[@450ktm520]

Ya. The grendel although it's claimed for long range. That was intended for human targets where humane kills aren't a factor. It wasn't designed for hunting animals long range. The guy that did this video really explained it very well better than 90 percent of the professionals. You need more gun powder behind that grendel, better get a credmoor. Laws of physics.

[@WorthDoingRight]

@@djl5634 at the muzzle the 357 has over 500 foot pounds of energy, while the 6.5 Grendel has about 400 foot pounds at 1000 yards, and with the energy at these lower levels one requires a high degree of accuracy to be effective, as wounded people can shoot back. So accuracy matters. My pound being, even a 22 works at close range with little energy because you can hit with it. Unless one is a sniper, one is EXTREMELY unlikely to hit very well at 1000 yards so you might ass well quit dreaming. I just saw a video today of a cop shooting at a criminal after he had taken a shot in his hand by the criminal (his radio was also shot) and couldn’t even handle his firearm properly.

[@WorthDoingRight]

@@djl5634 if you want to shoot at a 1000 yards, you should get more rifle…but if you are happy wounding game, by all means, get your 6.5 and live in dream land. I myself believe in humanely killing game quickly, so I say with 300 yards…& I see no need in carrying a heavy firearm when an 11.5-16” 6.8 is effective, accurate, & precise in these ranges.

[@tofan2622]

Um the 6.8 SPC II is short and mid range, all coming from a 16" barrel. If I am going to shoot past 400 yards, I will just pick a far superior caliber than 6.5 grendel, the round is pointless to be honest.

[@450ktm520]

Very good video... What do you think of the 300 hamr versus the 6.8 spc II

[@tofan2622]

The 6.8 SPC II is far better, but thats just a silly comparison. 300 hamr is like a 30-30 man??

[@450ktm520]

@@tofan2622 I'm looking into this more with the spc ii. I already have 556 mags, can I change the follower or it has to be specific mags

[@timl8302]

@@tofan2622 Actually, The 6.8's parent cartridge is the .30 Remington (A rimless 30-30). 300Ham'r is the .223.

[@WorthDoingRight]

ammoseek.com/ammo/6.8mm-remington

[@joaquinalejandroferrero1187]

Sir what is the barrel life of the 6.8 spc and the 6.5 grendel?

[@crashdsnowman1]

It will cost you about $4000 in ammo to wear either of them out.

[@jmgates09]

I got a 6.5 Grendel 18in ar in 2020 killed 2 deer with it did its job both deer didn't run past 30 yards but then covid hit and ammo was hard to find for it so I traded it for a ar10 in 308 it's a hammer would make the trade 10 times over and even got a 6.5 Creedmoor upper the Creedmoor isn't a power house but it's way ahead of the Grendel in my opinion just because it can shoot 140 grainers

[@stephenhair5501]

I went the 6.5 Grendel route. It performs just fine on the game I hunt. Whitetail and Hogs are taken well under 300 yards. I got plenty of Hornady factory ammo before things got crazy. I also shoot Federal 120 grain Fusions with great results. But reloading is where I really get enjoyment with this cartridge. 120 grain Sierra Pro Hunters sitting on H335 is the ticket in my AR. Interesting data on the 6.8 SPC. Enjoyed the video and thanks for sharing. God Bless.

[@tofan2622]

The only thing is that a 6.8 SPC II crushes the 6.5 grendal completely inside of 300 yards. 16" barrel and then it's not even close man. This has been the same data since 6.8 SPC came out, and a 6.8 SPC can shoot 120 grains no problem. I guess if you like carrying a musket thats heavier!

[@kendalldawson162]

Constitutional Carry dream, 6.8mm spc2 beltmag sbr or 6.5mm Grendel 10.5", mag❤

[@nozrep]

why wouldn’t it just be the 5.56/.223 that it was designed on originally? Is that not the best? Anyways, I’d more opine that, best, is a totally different idea from “preferred”

[@randallkelley3600]

Love my Rock River Arms 6.8 Coyote Carbine. I replaced the Ace stock with a Magpul and I took off the flash suppressor. The 16 inch barrel has a relatively short Hogue hand guard, not one of the currently popular long hand guard. it is a lightweight and compact deer/pig killing rig. It’s so accurate it’s boring.

[@scoutdynamics3272]

6.8 is better for CQB, the 6.5 is better at range

[@JJ_MTB_15]

This is the most unbiased comparison ive seen yet

[@tofan2622]

It's the comparison all of us who love 6.8 SPC II have been saying since 2010.

[@boogerwelder]

Grendel is the best..... because that's the one I own.... 😂

[@toxicityD]

I think since 2020 the discussion has been more about 6 arc and 6.5 Creedmoor. Neither 6.8 SPC nor 6.5 Grendel are really relevant these days. 224 Valkyrie largely beats both of these cartridges out in adoption, and is based off of the 6.8 SPC case.

[@APBT-Bandog]

The 224 Valkyrie is a long range target round, like the 6.5 Grendel. Neither beat the 6.8 for hunting. The 6 arc however is looking promising and is much better than the Grendel and Valkyrie. Still doesn’t compete with the 6.8 in a 12-16” barrel sub 300 yards. As far as the Creedmore…silly comparison as that is not available on the AR-15 platform.

[@cbwelch4]

Love the XD’s. Own two. I was disappointed in the Hellcat. Doesn’t feel as good in the hand as my XDS but recoils a lot more. Also the trigger just doesn’t break as nice. I prefer shooting the P365 XL. It shoots way better than the Hellcat IMO. Thanks for confirming what I thought about feeding that fat bullet out of the AR-15 mags. I knew about the longer Grendel bullets flying better because I shot Creedmore. Reliability is King to me. Both are better than a 5.56, but I always thought 6.8 was a winner for the AR-15. I’d have opted for a 6.8 SPC upper on my AR. I love my .300 AAC. Thanks for the info. Too bad it died…. I think it is a better choice for troops than the .277 Fury. Too much and more training to use the weapon in combat as it is going to be close to .308 in recoil. Full auto in a should fired rifle? Not likely unless you’re really well trained.

[@Freedomishere-im6ug]

Everything dies with my 16inch Grendel including paper

[@WorthDoingRight]

www.ammoland.com/2021/02/6-8-spc-new-choices-for-deer-hogs-and-the-range/?Ammoland+Subscribers&RSS_EMAIL_CAMPAIGN&#axzz7R9NGLxfo

[@johnisabeth2504]

So what you are saying is the more surface area, the more speed down the barrel. Then the fact that the 6mm arc with very similar case capacity, which out performs both 6.8 and 6.5 in every way is confusing.

[@APBT-Bandog]

The reported data on the 6 ARC is with 20” barrel, but still impressive. Also, the BC on the 6 ARC retains energy better to maintain 900+ ft#’s of energy out to 500 yards. Impressive round

[@johnandsherikropholler3582]

Good info BUT... 6mm ARC all day!

[@WorthDoingRight]

6mm ARC is looking very promising. It wasn’t out when I made this video. The only concern I see with the 6mm ARC is the bolt strength; however, grab an extra bolt for backup and run with it. It is very capable.

[@bobborlog1677]

6.8 at 2.260 lenth can only us short stumpy .277 bullets. But if you use the lwrc lower and mags now your talking about using longer 120 - 150 grain .277 bullets which is a different animal

[@crashdsnowman1]

You can't use bullets over 140gr in the 6.8 regardless of mags, those same 140 gr Bergers were loaded by SSA to 2.26"

[@timl8302]

@@crashdsnowman1 IIRC SSA(Pre-Nosler) used 2.3" when they loaded Berger 140gr for SPC II(ONLY). It was supersonic at 100 yards according to their table.Some people are using bolt actions or cutting out part of the front of 6.8 Mags in a 'U' shape to get over 2.3" & loading 130gr+. Actually, there are multiple companies that make mags out to 2.3"COAL. CPD, Stoner & PRI are 3. SPC II = .114 Leade + throat. I have the schematic. I've loaded out to 2.295 COAL in both SPC II & 6.8 ARP. 2.26 max mag/COAL is for the outdated SPC I (AKA: SAAMI specs). SPC II has much more freebore than the SAAMI specs. So as to allow you to load longer & add more powder.

[@broot1375]

Alot of Numbers on paper dont mean a hill of beans to me.....get 2 Rifles with the same barrel lengths and some ballistic gelatin and lets see who the winner really is. It may very well be the 6.8....but thats the only real evidence in my book. Plus it would be more fun to watch.

[@erichix6762]

Good video on facts. A lot of mis-information out there.

[@johnnyk5]

6.8spc is the basis for my favorite wildcat. A straightwall 10mm/.40 caliber that's a better fit than 450 BM and 350 legend in an AR15.

[@mr.mr.3301]

Every argument you just made as why the 308 is better than the 65 Creedmoor. Sidenote, I would love for someone to come out with a 7 mm PRC or a 7 mm Granville something in the seventh that’s not a 7.62.

[@jayn6496]

Bruh even tho I agree 6.8 is a better all purpose round, it’s not faster the 6.5 Grendel out of a 24” barrel!!!

[@timl8302]

Same here. The 6.8 was designed for a short barrel (16" = Sweet Spot) {about 25fps/inch of barrel - YMMV}. The Grendel is a barrel length dependent cartridge.

[@frederickhildebrandt3892]

I went with the 6.5 gendel

[@tofan2622]

You made a mistake, sell it and get a 6.8 SPC II. You will thank us later!

[@paullee4042]

Not a bad comparison but remember the 6.5 Grendel was developed by Alexander Arms the to replace the 5.56 because of complaints from the military about ineffectiveness at 500-600 yds. simple swap of barrel, bolt and mag. Unfortunately someone up top want to develop a larger caliber and spend billions on a totally new design. 6,8 spc is great for hog, coyote and deer.

[@tofan2622]

Um, 6.8 SPC was developed by USASOC to replace the 5.56 long before the 6.5 grendel, learn the history brother. Who cares what some commercial manufacturer wants to try to do, and you are smoking a little crack if you think there is any sort of real complaint about accuracy from an infantry rifle at 500-600 yards. That is just outside the range of 95% of engagements infantry will end up getting in.

[@crashdsnowman1]

Troubling reports about 5.56's performance were coming back from the field. Several soldiers had been killed or wounded by Taliban fighters who had already been shot multiple times by the Americans' 5.56 M4 carbines. These failures to incapacitate spurred the 5th Special Forces Group (SFG) to design an "Enhanced Rifle Cartridge" (ERC) to outperform 5.45x39mm, 5.56, 5.8x42mm and 7.62x39mm. MSG Steve Holland (5th SFG (A)) and Cris Murray of the U.S. Army Marksmanship Unit (USAMU) led the ERC project to provide optimum terminal performance from an M4 with minimal changes to the weapon. Troy Lawton (Chief Ballistics Technician) and Cris Murray (Service Rifle and R&D Gunsmith) of the USAMU assisted in developing loads, and built the rifles for the ERC project. Cartridge assessment began with the 6mm PPC case, necked up to 6.5mm. The 5th SFG soon discarded the fat PPC case due to poor magazine capacity and insufficient reliability in the M4. Their attention then turned to the .30 Remington case, which is essentially a rimless .30-30 Winchester. Its head and body diameters are larger than 5.56 (0.378 inch), but smaller than 7.62x39mm (0.445 inch). This thoroughly obsolete cartridge was chosen as the parent case because its smaller head diameter (0.422 inch) required less metal to be cut from the bolt head compared to the PPC or 7.62x39mm cases, which improves bolt service life. Several rebated-rim prototypes were created with an SPC body but 5.56's rim (0.378 inch) to utilize unmodified M4 bolts. After trials, it was clear the full-diameter rim helped extraction as compared to the rebated rim design.

[@timl8302]

@@crashdsnowman1Excellent job Mr. Brown! To add: Also, Remington sent the wrong chamber design to SAAMI. It was a prototype with pressure spike issues with a freebore of .05. FWIW - The interesting thing the bolt head is very very close to a 10mm/.40 S&W. Actually, my shell holders are interchangeable with the 6.8.

[@angela4fsu]

Had a very pricey 18” BBL LWRC M6A3 DMR in 6.8SPC, sold it. Wasn’t impressed with the gun. Built two 6.5Grendel’s after that: one 18” LaRue hunting gun and one custom spec’d 24” target gun. Much happier with these over that 6.8SPC. Evidence collected from my real world hunting experience doesn’t agree with your “anemic past 300yd” assertion. Deer & coyotes both dropped in their tracks with that LaRue at 300-400yds. The 18” LaRue is an incredibly fast, light, snappy, and handy carbine…though i agree the feeding isn’t always reliable w/ 123gr SSTs. That’s my biggest complaint. Thanks for the vid.

[@WorthDoingRight]

Comparisons should be apple to apple. Same barrel length and quality of manufacturer. My comment is both are anemic in a 16” platform beyond 300-400 yards. With a longer barrel, you can still work about 100 yards further. Shot placement becomes more critical as power is lost, and distance reduces shot predictions on any non-stationary target, such as game that may move at any millisecond. These are things I consider. Game is not punching paper. I like the 16” barrel for sub-300 yards, and in this set up, the 6.8 out performs the 6.5 grendel.

[@tofan2622]

You are doing something wrong if you couldn't get an 18" 6.8 SPC II barrel to work right, although LWRCi isn't for everybody. You need to compare a 16" barrel, because the 6.8 SPC II absolutely smashes that caliber in literally all fronts.

[@jimedick9496]

I’m gonna call your bullshit!!! I own both, and you can’t tell me the Grendel kills better than the SPC. From my experience, they are neck and neck using the same grain and bullet type. Unless you used full metal jacket, or varmint ammo on medium sized game, like Hornady’s Black ammo, you shouldn’t see any difference on either calibers ability to kill inside 300 yards. I don’t even have to claim my experience. There are plenty of videos comparing these two cartridges on hogs that show both capabilities. They are both excellent hunting cartridges. Anyone claiming one is better than the other inside 300 yards is biased bullcrap.

[@angela4fsu]

@@jimedick9496 I never claimed one “kills better” than the other. That statement alone is asinine. Last time I checked, dead is dead. If i could post the pics of my LaRue Grendel harvests on Michigan whitetails and coyotes using 123gr SST, you’d see a distinct pattern of well placed shots, large exits, short tracks, and 100% recovery rate -furthest shot was on a coyote at just under 300yd. The exit hole was massive, nearly took off his front leg. For the $ I spent on the LWRC, I wasn’t impressed with the rifle, independent of caliber. Happy shooting

[@jimedick9496]

@@angela4fsu Fair enough…. After reading your first comment over, I see what you’re trying to say, so my apology. Personally, I’m a fan of both calibers and I’ve seen the results of both. A hunter can’t go wrong with one, yet I come across those who own a certain caliber, and they trash the other. Even though they’ve never even shot the other, let alone seen both in action. Typical fan boys. Anyway, Happy shooting and hunting!

[@cardinalcrazy09]

I disagree with your first point, the trust on the base of the bullet. Each round is fired from a different diameter barrel (6.8 vs 6.5) Which would make the diameter of the base irrelevant imo.

[@WorthDoingRight]

You are free to your opinion but physics is physics and facts do not care about opinions. The larger diameter increases surface area. Force is is created on a bullet by PSI, so the greater the surface area the greater the thrust.

[@pyaeger911]

Sounds like someone doesn’t like 6.5 Grendel.

[@APBT-Bandog]

It is great if you want to punch paper at distances with a long barreled gun.

[@WorthDoingRight]

www.68forums.com/threads/winchester-6-8-spc.135958/

[@adamlong54]

I run a 24" barrel with a dead Air muzzle break. 6.5 grendel 26.5 grn h335 140 grn bullet 6.5 grendal average fps 2363 per calculator . My gun hates factory ammo I hand load my bastard child. Lmao Max loads work better with longer coal set it just under mag length for my grendel the 123 6.5 grendel hornaday black is ok at close range but further out opens up in my rifle being factory loads hence my hand loading and controlled powder charge and seating depths. Some factory ammo brass is slightly off of the true 6.5 brass chamber specs. Once fired it corrects brass as its fire formed to chamber then full sizing it makes for more accurate ammo.

[@tofan2622]

I don't get you guys. That is some dog garbage performance out of a 24" barrel. Thats really the thing 6.5 grendel is pointless, because if you want short range the 6.8 SPC II is way better, if you want long range there are still way better caliber choices than the 6.5 grendel.

[@adamlong54]

@@tofan2622 the accuracy is there and the shooter's skills matter sir. Hell I run 30 grain TNT solid copper bullets in my 223 over 4k fps why cos I like it works and will punch through body armor at close range . Everyone has different things that they like about their own loads and uses for them. It's all about the dope and their placement.

[@chadblodgett8634]

@@tofan2622 way better long range cartridges that fit into an AR15 length action and can shoot and feed well out of a gas gun? Or you saying just better long range cartridgres in general? Most people understand that neither are the best choices when cartridge length isnt considred. Not even the best choices in their respective diameters.

[@450ktm520]

Your chamber must be cut too deep at the limit of a head space gauge if you're having to fire form to your specific chamber. But your FL sizing back to, not to factory specs and now shooting correct... curious to see if you FL to factory specs.

[@adamlong54]

@@450ktm520 there has been issues with the 6.5 grendel some make it to the Russian AK 47 shell but 6.5mm the shoulder is slightly different in some manufacturers when they chamber the rifles. Bore is 6.5mm chamber is the 7.62x39 then you have chambers that are to the true grendel that the shoulders are just a tiny bit different. So I read. Type two bolts vs gen 1 bolts and the chamber. My dies are Hornaday the ammo I heard was Hornaday that was different slightly in the shell shoulders. My grendel wasn't shooting the light ammo for shit so I tried heavier bullets and left it as long as I could just under mag length as the bullet shape has a big jump into the lands in the barrel.

[@BEder-it4lf]

CZ-75 for first gun. Or Hi-Power. Yes I am a Boomer. 😁

[@jasoncarr551]

Built a 6.8 spc on a stag arms upper and lower. Bison Armory heavy 22 inch 4 groove 10 twist ( 6.8 Bison chamber is minimum throat). Used a Vortex 4-16-44 Diamond back tactical First focal plane. First 3 shots with Hornady custom sst 120 grain clover leafed into 3/8 inch. I absolutely love this rifle.

[@CaptShocker]

I think the sst for 6.8 just wants to group tight .

[@jasoncarr551]

@@CaptShocker I was at a Michigan Department of Natural Resources (State police wildlife law enforcement) ran public firearms range and an officer who reloads and is a gunsmith said it was running 2700 fps and was very interested in my rig.

[@timl8302]

Interesting. My 6.8 ARP hated factory 120gr Hornady's. Although. I heard the actual crono readings are faster than published. Oh, great scope. I have one on my .270 Win. You can actually see the crosshairs on 4x. Downside is each hashmark is 2 MOA. But, at the price & the crosshair view at 4x (for a FFP) plus the clarity. I bought it. Can't wait for deer season!

[@aaronwilcox6417]

Finally a video that truthful and factual. Have both and like the video points out both max out on game when the range reaches 300m. I prefer the 6.8spc for hunting game because that performance envelope can be had in an 16" barrel and ARP bolts. If paper punching is your game then the 6.5 is a better tool. Both offer very low recoil. Ive taken game up to elk under 200yd with the 6.8spc and was favorably impressed but it wasnt some giant bull it was just a good mature cow elk years ago. My issue with both these cartridges are the fan boys who favor one or the other and wont be truthful about their actual performance in given barrel lengths and weights. Each has its specialized uses and both are quite nice.

[@miker258]

I think it’s undeniable the 6.5 Grendel is the superior round without question but both will do the job the 6.5 Grendel will just continue to do the job at a further distance but trying to argue in favor of the 6.8 over the 6.5 Grendel is just ridiculous. GOD BLESS YOU ALL

[@APBT-Bandog]

Using words like “superior” while not stating any objective facts on the topic mean nothing. Listen to the video and you will hear the strengths and weaknesses share by both rounds as well as between the rounds.

[@miker258]

@@APBT-Bandog I watched the video and I stick with my comment

[@APBT-Bandog]

@@miker258 Like I said, "superior" without qualifying the constraints of that definition, is completely subjective. Meanwhile, I added qualified my statements with objective parameters, terms, and numerical data. You are free to believe whatever you like, but until you present quantified objective parameters to the assessment and comparison, your statement is just a biased undefined and potentially non-factual opinion.

[@MegaAppleshit]

Personally, I prefer the best AR cartridge *300 Blackout*

[@liberty4392]

I used to have a .300 AAC Blackout. It is a good round. But I ended up with a 7.62 x 39 AR-15. Ammo is way cheaper.

[@timl8302]

@@liberty4392 Yep, & about the same ballistics for both the 300 BO/300Whisper and the 7.62x39.

[@paolosasso2189]

It's not a fair comparison to say that by reloading 6.8 that you can spice it up when that is true of any caliber.

[@APBT-Bandog]

I was comparing 6.8 reloads to 6.5 reloads. Apples to apples

[@crashdsnowman1]

The Grendel is about maxed out with factory loads, the 6.8 is a different story because they are loaded down so they will work in the original SPC chamber. Barrels that are made to the correct spec can push a 110gr bullet to 2700fps out of a 16" barrel, 120gr SST to 2600. Grendels 123 sst max out at 2400 out of a 16" barrel.

[@crashdsnowman1]

H. said thanks and he had a barrel for you, 12.5, 16, or 18. Send him an email

[@WorthDoingRight]

Very cool