Best Budget and Beginner Hydrofoil for Wake Surfing | Slingshot

[@originald5369]

The stiff ones that get up easy are a lot of fun!

[@__nathan___]

So happy you’re getting small commission and these retail companies are reaching out and supplying wings to demo. I’ve learned so much from your channel this past year. Thank you for all your great content!

[@WakeThief]

It’s messages like this that keep me going. Thank you. I love this and love to know I’ve helped.

[@stephens.9748]

Their sales model is deal direct so they are not sold thru shops. I honestly just happened to come across them when I was in the market for a new wing. I bought a new 5 meter wing from them and it was almost half the money of the named brands. I was very impressed with the quality and figured it was worth a shot with the foil. I purchased the first set up with an 85 cm Carbon mast; Curve XL wing (1900 CM2), Rear Stab, and fuselage and the whole thing came to about $950 Euros. With shipping it was under $1000. The mast seems really good but the only other Carbon Mast I ever used was the Neil Pryde. Where I ride I seem to see a lot of Armstrong and Fone.

[@WakeThief]

Wow. That’s a great deal. Thanks for sharing. I’ve been trying to get in touch with them. I don’t suppose you talked or emailed with anyone there? Thanks again.

[@jmunkki]

Thanks for making this video - it helped me remind I have some of these foils and that they could still be useful. I have a Gamma 68 (my first windfoiling foil) and Infinity 76 (my 2nd Windfoil and also the one I used to learn Wingfoiling). I haven't really touched the Slingshot gear ever since I got the Takuma Helium, but I've been meaning to give a try just to see how I feel about it after almost a year on the Takuma. I got the Gamma 68 all the way back in 2018 , so I'm impressed that you still find it a viable option in 2022. Mine is the older, blue and black full carbon construction, but it's the same shape AFAIK. The Infinity76 was all the rage for windfoil freeriding when I got it.

[@WakeThief]

We reviewed it behind the boat only. I think a big boat wake hides a lot of the subtle differences we see in foil that can’t be hidden when pumping, as an example. I wouldn’t say these are high performance foils, but they are a great entry point for a beginner on a budget.

[@stephens.9748]

Hey! I just wanted to tell you that you put out really great video's and reviews. I learned a lot of my technique from watching you. I have been foiling for about 3 years. Started with Boat then Kite. Past year I started Wing Foiling and I am soooo hooked. My initial gear setup was the Slingshot Infinity 76 for Boat and Kite. Got a great deal on the Neil Pryde system with Carbon mast and HP 23, 19 and 15 wings. This past summer I switched to Gong gear for the Wing's and foils. Prices are insane and the selection of wings is actually too many. Only thing with them is their fuselage are aluminum and a little heavy. Not sure if you every tried Gong yet.? Thanks again for the great video's and techniques. Steve

[@WakeThief]

Thank you, Steve. I so appreciate you taking the time to leave a note like this. It made my day. I haven’t tried Gong. Where did you order it in North America? I didn’t think they retailed here. Thanks again!

[@jamesimcb]

I would love to see a review of the Neil Pryde Surf foil. It currently sells for less than $1,000 complete!

[@WakeThief]

Thanks, James. I will add it to our list.

[@Giovanisbr]

thanks a lot for all your information about the hidrofoil!! helps a lot to know the sport!

[@Pete_R63]

Oh wow, beautifully done! Now you have me wanting the 99 since I weigh about 212. You are supposed to be making this easy for me! Now I want the AXIS and this! I was even considering the Armstrong V1 that had about 2400cm2 on the front wing but that kit runs about $2K. I would like the Slingshot since it has a larger front wing than AXIS offers and me being a big boy. Off topic, holy cow, those big glassy waves look surreal!

[@WakeThief]

Thanks Pete! Sorry to make life difficult. You know how to reach me if you have any questions!

[@Pete_R63]

@@WakeThief Tomorrow is a new billing cycle for my Mastercard and I think I might just be ordering the 99 set up. Who knows, knowing me, I'll probably end up with the AXIS, too! Thanks so much for all you do putting these foils through their paces and reporting it all to us. It has been an incredible help, excellent entertainment, and extremely educational. You go over things I wouldn't have thought of that are really important. I am sure that so many people appreciate your efforts as much as I do.

[@erbartlett]

Great review. I kite foil and recommend hover glide for the cost and versatility. I learned on the 76 and eventually moved to the Apollo 60.

[@WakeThief]

Thanks, Evan! Appreciate your comment. If I can ever help, please feel free to reach out. [e-mail].

[@jonastverring6925]

Very nice review as always! I am on the infinity-99 and am just learning to dock start and pump. I dig the sport and I can see myself putting in more cash for gear. The question is which is smarter for me as a beginner A) to stay with the low aspect infinity-99 until I’ve learnt to pump for a minute and then upgrade to say Axis PNG1300/1310 or Sabfoil WL1350 or B) should I buy into a large high aspect foil and learn ”the right technique” right away? Thanks!

[@WakeThief]

If you love this sport, you will inevitably upgrade, so do it less to “learn the technique” and more because the performance (largely glide and speed and less effort pumping) is something that will make you smile … and that smile might never go away (it hasn’t for me).

[@fleetwoodmarine]

Hey wake thief !!! I have enjoyed your videos for years ...got a quick question, which you are uniquely qualified to answer. I Have been wind-foiling for years, I will be in Florida for a month this winter and want to learn dock-starts and pumping as a no wind foil activity. (typically only windy 50% of the time in February) I have lots of slingshot Hover-glide foiling equipment from my early days. Can I learn pumping and dock-starts with my old Infinity 84 wing or is it worth buying the Quantum 100 wing? How big a difference do you think it would make in learning this difficult skill. (I could also use the quantum 100 with my sup foil board - just learning this as well). I am 6ft tall 165 lbs

[@WakeThief]

At 165 the quantum and 84 will work. 99 would make it a easier though! Good luck! Send me a video of a one minute pump and I’ll send you a hat!

[@kessler960]

Lots of great Info, Thanks for putting in the time to make the video. What board are you riding with these different setups? Looks smaller and more maneuverable!

[@WakeThief]

The dwarfcraft 100. It’s my favorite board.

[@WakeThief]

But it’s not a beginner board (too short so harder to tow up)

[@ryanjones5680]

liquid force has many cheap beginner options as well, review them next

[@WakeThief]

Thanks, Ryan. That's a great idea.

[@derekmelle]

Any More feedback on the 76??

[@whatdoiknow1803]

Great channel! Can you get a Crazyfoil and do a review? Now that’s a low budget foil!

[@WakeThief]

I’ll add it to our list. You’re the second to ask.

[@FoilFanatic42]

First off, I am a huge fan of the videos and they really inspired me to get an eFoil and start a youtube channel! I am 145 lbs and ordered the slingshot setup with the infinity 84 for wakesurfing behind the boat. Will I be able to surf behind a jetski and/or dockstart with this wing as well? If not do you have any reccomendations for another slingshot wing that will allow this? Thanks again!

[@WakeThief]

Thanks for your support, Drew! Good choice! You will definitely be able to surf 1st wake, and likely second (as long as you don’t have a tiny jet ski … like a spark, but maybe even a spark … I could be wrong). You can dock start 84 at 145lb. Try this one out. If you want better carving behind the boat, go Gamma 68. If you want even easier dock starting go 99, but for now you should be great! I’m here if you need anything.

[@FoilFanatic42]

@@WakeThief Thank you so much for the advice, I can't wait to try it out!

[@ianbisson9669]

Using Slingshot Phantasm range for kite and wing.... but what works well for dock starting in this range? Keen to progress this now?

[@craiggutoskie]

Have you tried the hyper lite boost 1300? I’m looking into one as it’s available from a local vendor. I’m 180lb and would like to ride behind my 18’ bow rider. Thanks!

[@WakeThief]

I have not.

[@polyspiel]

I'm surprised. I thought there would be major winners and losers but it seems like they all worked pretty well behind the boat.

[@WakeThief]

I think I’ve realized that exact foil performance isn’t as critical for beginners and all seemed good enough to get flying and enjoy the wake, except the wings that were too small in area.

[@wakedink91]

Great video! What’s your favorite for the first wake?

[@WakeThief]

Gamma 68

[@Leo3247-x1f]

Hey, I am new to even understanding this sport, however since I live on a pond, I am 100% going to get a foil board or whatever they are called. So would you be able to send me a link to an actual board I can use with the gamma 68? And also, do you need a boat to tow you to use it? Or can you just hop on and pump? Edit nevermind I found the link, but can I just pump it without a boat?

[@WakeThief]

It will be easiest to learn behind a boat or jet ski. If you want to hop on and pump, this is what I’d recommend. mackite.idevaffiliate.com/idevaffiliate.php?id=102&url=3

[@Leo3247-x1f]

@@WakeThief Bit out of my price range lol, but thanks!

[@petrihirvonen]

Great video! I've been thinking if in the future I should get the Quantum 85 in addition to my Infinity 84 for wing foiling. I think the I84 glides pretty okay compared to the Space Skate 65 I first learned to foil on in a cable wake park. But the I84 is a bit chubby so I'd imagine the Q85 cuts through water with much less drag? How do the stall speeds of the I84 and the Q85 compare? Care to comment? Thanks a lot!

[@WakeThief]

I think you're exactly right. The 85 is nice and fast. The biggest indicator of stall speed is area and 84 is quite a bit more, so will stall at a lower speed but you will go faster with the 85 for the same pull force.

[@Maximo8368]

Great to see the HG line up comparison. Thanks. I've been running the Q85 this season. Really been enjoying it. But have begun to wonder how it would perform on a slightly shorter fuselage. Any thoughts? It'd be nice to close the performance gap between it and the Gamma 68.

[@WakeThief]

I didn't think Slingshot had a shorter fuselage. Please let me know if they do! Shorter fuselages tend to reduce pitch stiffness, making it more sensitive in the pitch direction.

[@Maximo8368]

Thanks for the reply! For the HG, Slingshot has a standard 61cm fuselage and a 78 Switch Fuse. With multiple mounting options. But that's a huge difference. I was thinking of chopping the fuselage in small increments. I have access to a machine shop so the process would be fairly easy. I just don't fully understand the effects. You mentioned it would ease up pitch stiffness. How would it effect yaw and roll? Is there a point where a shorter fuselage creates instabilities? And can a looser pitch lead into an easier roll? I'd like to shorten the turn radius and ease the transition linking such turns.

[@WakeThief]

Great question. Your thinking is exactly right. A shorter fuse has more pitch sensibility and yaw sensitivity. Think about the rear wing resisting in the yaw direction. If it’s closer to the rotation point there’s less resistance. Beginners favor longer fuses. Advanced rider favor shorter. Pumpers prefer longer too. I’ve always liked longer. Get used to longer then go shorter by cutting it. The A position has the mast coming out of the wing. That moves the center of lift pretty much right underneath the mast which means your feet are close together near the back. The b position shoots that front wing way forward so now your feet are both more forward. Some slingshot wings are best in A. Some are best in B. I recommend the switch fuse for this reason. I wish this sport was simpler. Please feel free to reach out if you ever have questions, Max. [e-mail]

[@glucklichprutas4631]

It would be best just to add afew thread mounts fwd of original stabilizer position, then, if you like the stabilizer forward and don't plan to use original position, then, cut length.

[@Maximo8368]

@@glucklichprutas4631 I believe the rear shim won't allow that method.

[@luiferreira4253]

Thank you for the video…did you use the same rear wing on all front wings?

[@WakeThief]

Yes, I did. I've always liked the 42 more than the 48. It has more than enough area to stabilize the front wing, and any more area just gives pitch stiffness and more drag, neither of which is needed compared to the 42.

[@user-bn5ox3mu4y]

Quantum 85

[@r3trogam3rstudios83]

I have the quantum 100 and weigh 150 pounds and it's a dock start machine...

[@WakeThief]

I bet it is! I struggled with it at 180lb but was able to do it easily with my dock launcher. We really enjoyed the quantum 100 behind the boat too!

[@jefferymcdowell4339]

I'm a heavier rider are 210lbs but have been wake surfing for years. Have a MC X23 that throws i pretty giant wave. I love aggressive turns 360s etc. And really would love to try the 68 from how's you describe it. Is it just not possible for to my weight?

[@WakeThief]

It will work fine with a giant wave

[@DanielGates]

If I want to get one of these for behind the boat (no real experience) and want to dock start also what do you recommend. Can one of these do both? 150lb.

[@russkielol]

Don’t get the infinity 99 that’s way too big. I have infinity 84 for sale and it will be perfect for you. I am selling it for 850 plus you pay shipping. It’s also listed on eBay right now

[@WakeThief]

See the other comment just left. 84 would work well. At your weight you could dock start it. Check out our review from 2 years ago when we compared 84 and 99. I couldn’t dock start 84 at 190lb but I suspect you could at 150lb

[@russkielol]

@@WakeThief I watch all your videos so I agree with what you say100%

[@DanielGates]

@@WakeThief Thanks! That is a very old video :)

[@sabrinazimmermann2739]

You briefly said the slingshot mast was stiff enough. How does it compare to the moses/sab 82 mast you reviewed with the w1250 a while back?

[@WakeThief]

I’m sorry. I didn’t test them back to back so hard to know. I suspect the aluminum mast is stiffer in torsion and the carbon is stiffer in bending, but exact geometry matters.

[@russkielol]

I have one for sale on eBay as of 7/25/22 infinity 84 with a bunch of extras like new condition for 850. If anyone has questions let me know

[@WakeThief]

Check out Daniel’s comment!

[@Pete_R63]

I'm bummed. I ordered the 99 a couple of weeks ago and they never sent the poncho. It showed on the order online. I'll have to see if they gave me a printed receipt. I woke up late last night, couldn't sleep and was thinking about all sorts of things and suddenly I remembered the poncho. I had to come back to this video to try to see if maybe I remembered it incorrectly.

[@WakeThief]

Oh no! I’m sure they’ll send it. Did you use the wakethief coupon code?

[@shender944]

Have you tried the phase five? Just curious what your thoughts were on it compared to the others you’ve been riding.

[@WakeThief]

Ive never tried Phase 5 but I’ve learned that the Phase 5 foils are similar (perhaps nearly identical) to the slingshot front wings.

[@tadge74]

Hi I'm new to this. Are boards and foils different for lakes and sea surfing? Or can one be versatile enough for both? If so which ones would work for a beginner? Cheers from UK

[@WakeThief]

Check out out how to buy foils video. Boards are different and foils are different. No one size fits all

[@tadge74]

Thanks will do. 🤘

[@kurtschlaudt1881]

I noticed you are riding the Slingshot Dwarf Craft 100 Foilboard. Which Dwarf Craft would you recommend for an intermediate wake foiler that is 6'-3" and 250lbs please?

[@WakeThief]

I’d recommend 120cm at your weight. I usually say beginner 120, intermediate 110, and advanced 100, but weight shifts one direct or the other. Please use WAKETHIEF coupon code at REAL, MACKite or Greenhat. We can earn a small commission. More questions please email. Happy to help. [e-mail]

[@lifeoftopher00]

Great video would I be able to wing foil with a mic like that??

[@WakeThief]

Yes! Check out the coupon code in the description to save 10%

[@lifeoftopher00]

@@WakeThief would I have to have my gopro connected to it or phone? Nice affiliate work on your channel

[@WakeThief]

A phone … unfortunately.

[@boardndude]

Your Gamma 68 evaluation is a bit deceptive. You show a picture of the std Gamma 68 package (3:00) , but in the test it appears to be mounted to a different fuselage that has an A and B mast mount location (3:04).

[@WakeThief]

I often mounted in A or B, depending on what’s better. I believe the packages we link to have the switch fuse, so every rider has the option to try. I like the configuration at 3:00 more than the 3:04, but most boards I ride don’t have a foil track long enough to permit the 3:00 approach unless you move both feet further back on the board. The 3:00 setup has better yaw sensitivity, which will make it shred even better! Which one do you prefer? Beginner riders should like the 3:04. More advanced riders the 3:00.

[@boardndude]

@@WakeThief The reason why I posted is because I'm not sure which is better. I started foiling behind a Ski Nautique about 3 months ago because I wanted to be able to surf behind a non surf capable boat. I started with a Gamma 68 package but couldn't drop the rope for very long. The Gamma 68 fuselage didn't have a B position just like the picture at 3:00. I bought the Quantum 100 (FPUMP) and use the B position. I've able to drop the rope for a max best of 4 minutes so far. It's just that there isn't enough online help to figure out the best position of the fuselage mount for pumping and dropped rope riding. It's like you have to "buy and try". So when I saw the 3:04 video of the Gamma 68 on a different fuselage without it being mentioned and the rider doing great with no rope I felt like I needed to make that point. I do have the option now to switch the Quantum 100 fuselage with the 68 and try it myself. But it gets expensive buying different parts to figure out what's the best.

[@WakeThief]

Thanks for explaining, John. I completely understand your dilemma. It’s why we created the channel. If you ever have questions, please ask. We will do our best to answer and help folks like yourself buy the right thing the first time. I spent about $6k before I figured out my mistake … then about 100 KZbin videos of learning before we felt like we’ve learned enough to share with confidence … but we are still learning (and still making mistakes along the way). Please email in future if I can ever help. [e-mail]

[@Giovanisbr]

Can purchase to Brazil!??

[@luiferreira4253]

Another question please…my set up is 68/42/61 and the fuselage compatible with the 68…I want to go 84, can I use the same fuselage?

[@WakeThief]

yes

[@jcal545]

Did you have any ballast in the boat? I weight 185lbs and have a wakeboarding board that throws a wave just barely big enough to use a normal wake surf board behind. Would you suggest the 84 or the 99? I would like to be able to foil the second wave if possible. I think the 84 would probably be best, but am nervous it won't have enough lift. I'm new to this, looking to get into the sport.

[@WakeThief]

Hi John - I'd play it safe and go with the 99. Please use our WAKETHIEF coupon code at MACKITE and we will send you over a gift. Thanks for your support! Here if you needs anything ([e-mail]).

[@jcal545]

@@WakeThief Will do! Thanks!

[@Giovanisbr]

one more question! It is easy to stand up?

[@WakeThief]

I wouldn’t say it’s easy but the kinds of wings we reviewed today were among the easiest.

[@DaveSails7]

How does slingshot compare to axis SES?

[@WakeThief]

Similar. A lower aspect, larger area front wing makes learning easier so you can always compare those two metrics in a slingshot vs axis comparison. The pro about SES is that it’s an AXIS compatible setup which is nice for folks that want to progress long term (axis is well built, stiff, and has a wide range of front wings / rear wings for those who will eventually seek high performance). The con is that it will cost more. If you already had a board, the SES might make more sense. If you’re cost sensitive and haven’t foiled, these slingshot foils might make more sense.

[@AAAAAAAAAAAAaron]

How fast is that boat going. Any ballast?

[@WakeThief]

Yes. Some ballast. 10-12mph.

[@AAAAAAAAAAAAaron]

@@WakeThief thanks. I was curious if the speed changed at all with the bigger wings but was trying the largest wing at a lower speed and it was very unstable. Seems I should be trying it a bit faster

[@sergeyantonov3961]

hi, what board are you using in the video?

[@WakeThief]

Dwarfcraft

[@sergeyantonov3961]

@@WakeThief hello dear, you mean this: Slingshot Kite Foil Board Dwarfcraft V1 2022 which volume ? 11 or 14? Thx

[@WakeThief]

@sergeyantonov3961 11

[@Giovanisbr]

which speed of the boat is better?

[@WakeThief]

Usually the speed that produces the best wake … 10-12mph

[@TMcK-yh2wj]

I need help. My 72 year old mom wants to be able to get up on foil. We bought a foil set up read below but we can’t get it to porpoise through water unless we hold onto rope. It’s extremely difficult to get up on and my mom certainly can’t do it. We have a slingshot flying fish 5' 22.5" 2.3" with a foil set up with liquid force Flite 120 Front Wing which has this. :Surface Area 1200 cm² | Wingspan 65 cm TC 28 Rear Stabilizer Wing - Surface Area 280 cm² 27" Alloy Mast 54cm Bayonet Fuselage Can you recommend a foil we can buy to attach to the board we have????? My mom surfs all the time behind the boat so she has strength to pull herself up.

[@WakeThief]

The link in the description would work. Go slingshot 84. Takeoff at slower speed than LF120. The board you have will work with it.

[@TMcK-yh2wj]

@@WakeThief my board is so extremely hard to get up on. You can’t just get up like surfboard. (We can all surf behind MasterCraft NXT and my daughter and I can do 360’s. Is there a way to message you directly? I just don’t want to waste $1,500 again on a board and fin setup that is impossible to ride. It’s also so squirrelly it will throw you off in a heartbeat. My daughter is 15 and is only one that can currently ride the board and fin we have. She wants to let go of rope and pump it herself to other friends boats to look cool. However, current set up won’t let her pump to release rope. She wants to dock start with it too. My mom is 72 and needs it to be easy get up and super stable with ability to let go of rope and pump too but stay behind boat. Getting up is so hard with current set up. Not sure if it’s fin or board or both. 😩

[@WakeThief]

This is not an easy sport. Please send me some videos of your attempts. [e-mail]. Happy to help. You’ll figure this out.

[@jimbaldwin1088]

If I’m lighter than say 130lbs, would the 76 be adequate for jet ski surfing on the second or even third wake? Maybe with a wake shaper?

[@WakeThief]

It will be close. The wake shaper would help for sure. I’d go 84 just to be safe.

[@jimbaldwin1088]

@@WakeThief and would that work well with the 42cm rear wing that I already own?

[@WakeThief]

Yes! It’s preferred in my opinion.

[@jimbaldwin1088]

@Wake Thief thanks so much! Have a great day and a better tomorrow!

[@jimbaldwin1088]

@@WakeThief I was looking more into the surfmode viper and I was wondering how it compares to the liquid force on the first, second, and third wave.

[@shexd4r048]

Hi . Can i buy one under 500$ ?

[@WakeThief]

I haven’t found any new ones that cheap. I recommend you check FB marketplace for a used one.

[@tylerdurm]

The coupon code doesn’t work anymore :((

[@WakeThief]

I think it's back working. I just checked. Thanks for your support! If you ever need anything, please reach out. [e-mail]

[@sammyhenry4839]

What size mast

[@WakeThief]

71cm

[@jhobaugh45]

So at 240lbs rider (used to snowboard and wakeboard) borrowing a ride behind a tritoon or small bow rider (18ft) and would like to try to do it all in case no boat is available (jet ski or dock starts)...infinity 99? gamma 68? Quantum 85/100? Or is the only choice to spend more $$ on an Axis?

[@WakeThief]

Infinity 99 will be the best at surfing small wakes among that group.