BEWARE OF CUSTOM BUILT CATAMARANS!

[@russellesimonetta3835]

Hey it,s like buying a new cessna or a home built. If it,s built right it will outshine the production certified airplane in all paramiters!! Production boats are built to a price point. Fit and finish hides a lot of shoddy work!! I,d go for a well built dix in a heart beat.

[@bizim_eller]

Russsell e simonetta 👍

[@jeffmisiaszek9462]

I tend to agree about being cautious when it comes to buying new when something is first released, such as a brand new car in its first model year. Let the company work all the bugs out. However, I don’t think you can extrapolate this to every custom catamaran built once several hulls have been produced. I would argue much more attention to detail in the design and manufacturing is put in by the “custom” manufacturers, hence the higher price point typically. The Leopards, Lagoons, FP’s, etc are mass producing yachts, which has its advantages for sure (amortize design costs, hull molds, etc over more boats which reduces costs) , but to throw out the baby with the bath water and assume all custom catamarans are going to have issues doesn’t seem accurate to me. I would buy (if I had money lol) an Xquisite, Privilege, Maverick, Antares, or a Majestic any day of the week over a cookie cutter Leopard, Lagoon, or FP. Just my 2 cents. Seems like he has an axe to grind against the custom builders, and there is probably a reason for that. I believe for example that Xquisite does not go through brokers, so he can’t make money off of them. Even their old boats being put up for resale are through the original company, i.e. they have a program to buy back the used boat, inspect it, make any necessary repairs, and resell it themselves. I could be wrong about that but it seems like he has an agenda and it’s probably financially related (i.e. if I can’t make money off them I’ll just trash them). As always, caveat emptor.

[@Catamarans]

New boats, production or custom (doesn't matter), typically aren't available for co-brokerage. We only do used, we aren't a dealer for anyone. FWIW, IMO Xquisite is kind of an outlier. Compared to other SA semi-custom boats I'd say they are ahead of the game. They will actually extend warranties to second owners as long you do what the on-board computer tells you to do for maintenance. I saw it at the boat show, it was pretty neat! Also I'll admit interiors on a production boat will never be as nice as a semi. May want to double check on the used Xquisite boats. Currently the only used one is for sale from Catamaran Guru...not the official dealer. Disclaimer: Me (Benjamin) and Gary don't necessarily agree on Xquisite. I think they are doing some good and innovative things, but I'll readily conceed buying is still a risky proposition since we have no aftermarket sales data yet. For better or for worse the boat buying approach we "sell" is extremely conservative. For instance I can send you data and current market analysis on resale of Royal Cape/Majestics... but I'll warn you it's...not pretty.

[@HopeOfJoe]

Thank you so much, Gary. ✨👌✨👍✨

[@ek9772]

You reminded me of something I read a while ago “don’t buy a car made on Mondays or Fridays.” Common sense is uncommonly rare.

[@ahsut3554]

I hope you are still working in 10 years when we are ready to buy!!

[@It-b-Blair]

😜 right?

[@larrysimpson2748]

I love listening to you you tell it straight up about this or that. I be getting in touch with you next spring when i retire I'm will looking for a lagoon around 45 to 50 feet to live abroad and travel. Keep the videos coming

[@michaelm9621]

The level of truth we are getting from Gary is impressive. Thanks

[@DifficultNerd]

what a gorgeous place you're in :)

[@Catamarans]

This is the Marriott Harbor Beach Resort in Fort Lauderdale. I live next door.

[@lisaserenechaos6833]

You sound like Mr Howell III. I love it! That said I know the video is a few years old. Now manufacturers like Lagoon, as an example, offer some custom designs on the interior layout and things. But, my question is would it be better to buy new or get an older model and have it refitted for the way you would be using it?

[@Catamarans]

TY! Look for "Gems": Remember, 85-90% of all catamarans go into a charter program for 5 years so if you exclude them be prepared to pay a big premium. The best value is to find one that was in a "Crewed Yacht Program" (that was super-well-cared-for) OR one located at a low-utilization charter base. For example, in the BVI (where 70% of all catamaran charters happen in the world) some popular models can do 35+ weeks of charter per year and have 4,000+ engine hours at the end of the 5 year program. The exact same boat in a low-demand charter location may only get 15-20 weeks/year and only have 2,000-2,500 hours and plenty of "life" left. The charter fleets do have "Owner Versions" but since they may generate half the income of a "charter version" they are less common (maybe 15% of a charter fleet). I can help you find these types of "gems".

[@daveesteves3509]

Thank you Sir !

[@johnperry7534]

Thanks Gary useful

[@laur-unstagenameactuallyca1587]

Thanks for these vids, just found your channel since I'm thinking of buying a cat soon

[@Catamarans]

Glad I could help!

[@jwrappuhn71]

Great vid Gary.

[@mikewilsher1005]

I have two what would you buy questions,... What would buy at or under 200K and between 39 and 45 feet, gally up if you were looking to purchase in 5~6 years from now, and what would you buy today that meets those general specs and conditions?

[@zed9zed]

Wise advice, as usual.

[@deonbrunette9767]

Most new products, first models have issues, but not always serious

[@TheNutzandBoltz]

Holy shit, stand still. lol

[@DQ-su6qf]

I wonder if by nature the number of solar catamarans have substantially fewer initial defects..

[@joselinan3802]

You should watch Parlay Revival and see the quality build of the Lagoon they are repairing.

[@Catamarans]

JOSE, I SOLD PARLAY TO THE OWNER WHO HAD IT BEFORE HURRICANE IRMA HIT IT HARD. WE PERFORMED A FULL RIG SURVEY AND I CAN TELL YOU THAT PARLAY HAD NO RIGGING ISSUES OR ANY OTHER MAJOR ISSUES BEFORE IRMA HIT. HURRICANES DO WEIRD THINGS TO YACHTS. THIS ISSUE IS WAAAY OVERBLOWN.

[@masonjar706]

@@Catamarans Perhaps you would like to change your opinion now that we know most are defective?

[@russnurse2b807]

I really enjoy your videos and have learned a lot. I'm curious what you consider a semi-custom boat. Would Aquila, Intrepid, or similar fall under this? Also, I've been looking at a couple of different power catamaran fishing boats from a couple of Japanese manufacturers. They are a lot less expensive than buying a boat from the states. I understand I'll have to figure out any import fees to pay at the port when I pick it up and shipping will be around $6,000.00. But, if I can get a nice 22-36 foot aluminum fishing catamaran for around $20,000.00 to 65,000.00 plus the $6,000.00 for shipping and the import fees do you think something like that would be worth it?

[@Catamarans]

Aquilas and Intrepids are "Production boats"...Leopards are production boats...

[@masonjar706]

Yeah sure, you are a lot better buying a Lagoon 450, for example. What could go wrong?. A lot that's what. Most production catamarans by and large are wooden boats with a small bit of fiberglass and suffer from all the rot problems of wooden vessels. Look it up on KZbin. A fully fiberglass and foam catamaran built to a known designer's plans is far superior even if there are small cosmetic or living defects. However from a yacht brokers perspective, which is what we have here, it is much easier to deal with a production boat because it is easier to sell and requires less boat knowledge to sell. That does not make it a better boat.

[@Catamarans]

Concerning semi-custom yachts: STAY AWAY FROM CUSTOM AND SEMI-CUSTOM BUILDS unless you own a boat yard and employ skilled shipwrights for $6/day like Chinese builders do. I can talk for hours about why you generally do not want a Custom One-Off or a Semi-Custom built yacht, unless you own a boat yard or have a free place to store a yacht and can do mechanical or fiberglass work yourself, but let me try to condense it by telling you a true story: When I bought Florida's largest sailing yacht dealership (Eastern Yachts with multiple locations and a boat yard in the Port of Palm Beach) I discovered something that really surprised me. We had these very experienced, high-net worth yacht buyers in Palm Beach who would order new yachts every 2-3 years. Several of them approached us and would say something like "I really like the new Lagoon 44, BUT I WOULD NEVER, EVER BUY HULL NUMBERS ONE THROUGH TEN". This struck me as strange because Beneteau ( builder of Lagoon catamarans) has been building yachts since 1880 and they give a full warranty for a year but I later realized what this was all about. Even Beneteau, the world's largest yacht builder, who has eleven different major brands of yachts with large numbers of highly-experienced naval architects, designers/stylists, engineers and shipwrights, screws-up each and every new model they introduce. One time we took delivery of hull #1 of a new model/design and the Buyer hired a Marine Surveyor who found 55 defects and it took us 4 months to fix everything! The Buyer was not happy. This is actually typical for all of the first hulls and for all builders. I wondered "How can this happen?" As best as I can explain it, the naval architects and designers/stylists will create a new model on paper. The plans are given to the engineers who specify the equipment and attempt to translate these drawings into a new yacht that the shipwrights use to build it. But something gets lost at this stage. The first few yachts of a new model are ALWAYS a big mess even with a large, experienced builder like Beneteau/Lagoon. The builders always try to entice charter companies and dealers by discounting Hulls # 1-10 heavily because they know very well that these first boats will be botched. Sometimes it can take 3-4 months to work all these "bugs" out which means you cannot use your new toy. Some of the serious "bugs" may require major work and re-tooling the molds while the production line is stopped. This takes time so the changes may not show up until hulls # 11-15 are produced. Sometimes the first hulls CANNOT be fixed because that would require taking the yacht completely apart which is usually not possible. These molds are very expensive to create. In a 40'-50' catamaran there may be 200-220 different molds/sub-molds and these may cost $800,000-1,000,000 (!), so you must build a lot of yachts to recoup this cost. A large well-financed builder like Beneteau/Lagoon or Leopard can afford to change the tooling immediately to correct the problems. There is no way a small custom one-off builder can afford to do this like the large "deep pocket" builders can. So, the Custom Builders perform "Cheap Charlie" repairs and many times these boats never get fixed correctly because once they are put together you cannot undo it .... We often see these Semi-Custom Builds come onto the used market when they are 1-2 years old and the real reason is that they are so screwed-up that the Buyer just gives up. Of course, these little builders will dazzle you with their credentials but it doesn't matter. They are under-capitalized, they will never put up a performance-bond and their build contracts protect them... Also, Beneteau/Lagoon and Leopard are building thousands of yachts (most of which go into charter immediately) so they get a lot of feedback on new models quickly. They find out the issues quickly and they attack the problems immediately and thoroughly and remedy the issues in subsequent hulls that are built. BOTTOM LINE: The small Custom and Semi-Custom builders CANNOT possibly compete with the big production builders because of the "economies of scale" they get and the larger "braintrusts" they employ. When the big builders buy fiberglass resin, for example, they do so "by the ton". So they pay about half of what the custom builders pay for a barrel of resin. Same thing goes for engines, sails, masts, rigging, wiring, hatches, plumbing, etc.... The production builders can sometimes build a yacht for 30% less.When you buy custom and semi-custom boats it sometimes turns into a nightmare and you lose a lot of money. STAY AWAY from Custom built and Semi-custom builds even if you are tempted by their low price! Stick with a well-known popular production yacht and buy it at the right location and time of year to save money and you will be a happy owner. This is the smart and financially safer way to yacht ownership .

[@masonjar706]

@@Catamarans I could say the same thing about commercially built catamarans. For example, stay away from Lagoon 450's unless you own a boatyard. Just see KZbin videos. Yachts International does not dispute that most commercial catamarans are basically balsa core wooden boats with a small amount of fiberglass applied onto the wooden core. Inside, all the bulkheads and cabinetry is plywood. Polyester fiberglass used on the inside of these boats to bond to the plywood bulkheads is flat wrong...Polyester does not like to stick to wood. Wood rots. Wood is heavy causing displacements of over 35,000 lbs for a 46' boat.. But, wood is inexpensive compared to foam or other modern boatbuilding material. This construction is ok as long as the boat is used for the purpose it was designed and the owner is ruthless ferreting out leaks. See Lagoon's rating for wind and waves for example. There are some more expensive large scale manufacturers that produce better boats but even Gunboat had its problems. Each boat has to b surveyed and taken on it's own strengths.

[@masonjar706]

Turns out that the Lagoon 450 is not the only one with bad construction and broken bulkheads. See Lagoon 410. These boats are not designed nor built to go to sea! kzbin.info/www/bejne/l4DKh2ugmtKYmbc

[@robertstraub3235]

Gary is a skilled salesman, and if he doesn't want to deal with custom catamarans as a broker, he will talk you out of them. The reasons he's given were mostly assumptions, he has no way to know how skilled and wealthy the builder was, he just blanket dismissed them all. Then he goes ahead and contradicts himself with a production catamaran story with over 100 issues at inspection. Wich just proves: it's a case by case thing, you can't just call all production catamarans good and all custom cats bad. If you like the boat, get a survey done, don't dismiss it just because Gary said custom cats are all bad. Like he has seen every single one of them

[@TorDaiShan]

Good information ty. Are Privilege Catamarans safe to get? I see they have their new 580 coming out next year and sold out till 2022. As a new model should people wait on it?

[@Racebuiltinc]

What about building your own custom cat with an experienced builder? Say you want a hybrid power/sailor and they don't exist? What would you recommend?

[@Catamarans]

Forget it for now unless you have money to burn. Nobody has really figured out how to do this cost-effectively.

[@masonjar706]

@@Catamarans I can't believe that some people might actually believe you know what you are talking about. Yu still haven't answered for the Lagoons you have sold to hapless individuals.

[@rightright6582]

Great info. I was considering a small Boutique builder like Vision Yatch for a 55 performance-cruising catamaran with emotors(400k just for the full electric option). any suggestions in any other country.?

[@Catamarans]

Well, if you have money to burn these semi-custom builds can be OK but they usually don't hold their value well.

[@BennyTheNerd]

I am looking to buy the new Xquisite X5 Catamaran, what is your take on that Cat? Pro's and Con's !! Thanks

[@Catamarans]

If you have around 1 million dollars to spend on one please email me [e-mail] and let's chat.

[@infovet2679]

dont buy custom because lagoon paid me a lot ))

[@Catamarans]

No, don't buy Custom because they are inconsistent and I have wasted many many days going to surveys on these only to have them rejected after survey because of the inordinate number of defects. Unless you have time and money to waste.

[@SailingSarah]

I have a pearson 33. I think id like a catamaran. Talk to me.

[@penlavits3305]

Nice cap.

[@jimanderson2518]

Ok Gary so here is a loaded question.... If Gary was going to buy a 40 something Catermeran today to blue water cruise . Which boat would you buy and which model year would you look at . Best bang for your buck😁 Btw keep those Sunday sail videos coming . I enjoy watching them with my morning coffee ☕😎⛵ Fairwinds from the @captains.chair

[@garyfretz1152]

Hi Jim It's all budget-driven...what max budget are we talking about?

[@Catamarans]

@@garyfretz1152 The key thing is to find a 4-6 year old boat that looks like new because it was well-cared-for AND capture the depreciation AND "buy right" by buying at "the right time and place".

[@ek9772]

Yachts International I thought 5-to 6-year old boats were “money pits.”

[@jasonstrong4610]

You just reinforced my desire to build my own cat epoxy/ply, Like a dix 47 maybe. Thanks! When my kids are grown up if the world is still navigable. One building now in Melbourne, great method!