Big Refrigerant Changes to A2L w/ Jason at ESCO

[@scottk0623]

Thank you both for the information. It was great.

[@austinisfullpleasedontmove653]

That color is called dusty rose because of the male dominated industry.

[@jtops3000]

Let us applaud the genius who painted the R32 jug the same color pink as the R410a jug. Yeah, that won’t be a problem!

[@NeighborhoodDada]

They’re all tan now anyways

[@andrewhernandez4353]

Tan or grey

[@REFRITEKREFRIGERACION]

Now they all the same color. Worst idea ever.

[@Freonleon]

Only grays ones are the ones being phased out that’s why you see the pink r32

[@SpaceCadet327]

I still find 410a in pink and grey. Also find 407c in orange and grey. I usually try to keep the tanks in the box because even if they’re grey the writing on the box is colored, not that it’s going to help much if they’re the same colors. I guess it’s time to learn how to read 🤦

[@steveturcotte7435]

As an HVAC contractor for 35 years, this is a huge mistake. Keep It Simple Stupid. Develop more A1 solutions. Liability issue based costs will hurt the smallest contractors and poorest family’s and Seniors, it’s already too much for many.

[@universalservicetechust3578]

It’s all Biden’s fault

[@Themadscientist1969]

sadly seem to be their goal all the time.... SMH

[@Garth2011]

Just like the new vehicles being made, those sensors and circuit boards are going to fail from a small solder crack or a printed circuit crack and make the entire system come to a halt while the consumers are getting the shaft on down time, parts expenses and HVAC tech's who cannot do a good diagnosis.

[@SovereignTroll]

You understand HVAC 2nd largest user of world energy and CO2 production behind cement plants. A3 will be what we end up with (R-290 and R-600).

[@Garth2011]

@@SovereignTroll Yes and who is collecting taxes on it? Seems to be a conflict of interest from day one. I wouldn't be surprised if one day, CO2 is deemed non destructive to the atmosphere. The energy experts were worried about it in the 1970's, 80's. You have to wonder who the investors are in "green energy" manufacturing

[@zjeepgozweeln]

R1234yf costs an absolute fortune right now. It's currently almost 10 times as expensive as R-134 and 3x the already inflated R-22 price. It's so expensive they mostly sell it in 10lb jugs instead of 30lb. Hopefully it's just because it's new and the price eventually goes down. I have no problem moving to new refrigerants and phasing out the old ones, but the cost of 1234yf so far just doesn't make any sense. Refrigerant theft might become a new criminal enterprise. Before stealing condenser, they actually recover the charge. LOL.

[@bobb.6393]

They would have to get licensed first to steal the refrigerant from recovering.

[@MegaDysart]

1234yf isn't that new we've used it in automotive applications for quite a few years now. It's always been super expensive and to be honest it doesnt cool as well as 134a

[@flybyairplane3528]

BiG TOM, R1234YF, is ONLY USED FOR AUTOMOTIVE, STARTING WITH IMPORTED EUROPEAN CARS🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸

[@vidard9863]

@Mazinblaster Z not legally! so be sure to get your license before commiting theft! lol

[@zjeepgozweeln]

The industrial version is 1234ze, I've not seen pricing on it, but I'm sure it's not cheap either.

[@AirsoftColeraine]

We,ve been using r32 for inverter split systems for a few years in the uk now, really no big worries with them, just need to be speced right with dispersion in rooms if there is a leak. Harder to to on large VRF systems but don’t panic,

[@MrGarcon98]

maybe my old sniffer will come in handy after all ,,,,? it was made for flammable refrigerants ,,,,,thank you guys for teaching even the retired guys keeping their knowledge to a good level ,,,,god bless

[@MrBrd09]

We have our refrigerant monitor inspected every year in our chiller plant. Residential inspection will be a must with A2L but i cant imagine itll happen much. Very informative video.

[@terryj.macmullen9968]

very good information. i ve been doing refrigeration for forty years.. and l learned a lot today.as for sweating joints apart ,something i rarely did.seen too many flare ups with residual refrigerant and oil.you have be real careful if going to unsweat small tubing.could end up plugging line with solder when you sweat line back in to a compressor discharge port for example.happened to me ,that was the main reason for cutting tubing rather than unsweating.

[@tmacgee1234]

I can't wait for R-dietpepsi

[@keepthinking2666]

R-dietpepsizero

[@luisalvarez8266]

Im in

[@michaelszczys8316]

Finally, a good use for diet Pepsi

[@s.j.5850]

A highly informative video on the "new" refrigerants that will become mandatory. I am glad to see that best practices were emphasized because it is not always employed in the field. I recommend this video to all HVAC technicians & contractors. Really appreciate this presentation.

[@keithhall7492]

Great video on the coming changes. I have concerns about these products though. In the northern part of this country. We install burners in between the air handler and the indoor coil with open flames. I have worked long enough to realize propane lays around awhile and does not dissipate quickly. The poor quality micro channel coils being manufactured today I have concerns for customer and property safety. When the heat pump does not keep up and the furnace ignites. The house could get real warm. And jtops3000 is correct. Pink jug for R32 and 410a. GENIUS

[@johnnya4236]

Why so many comments on both pink? Who cares they will all be gray started in 2020 (AHRI)

[@pauldombroski5185]

That is where the on board RDS will come into play.....if it senses a leak, even erroneously, it starts the blower motor and moves air, which really makes an A2L hard to even nitrogen.

[@johnd4348]

When a customer calls in and says their heat pump is on fire. Now they will really mean it.

[@michaelstewart7368]

Was getting my panties all twisted up over these A2L's before I considered: A) Fuel Oil will only ignite under certain conditions. B) Propane and Natural Gas are considered highly flammable. These Fuels have been widely used since the beginnings of our Industry. I suppose we will learn to adapt our work practices and respect the potential risks of these A2L's in the same way we have with those Fuels. Many Tech's are already using Pro Press and Zoom Lock. Pretty sure we will see an increase in the use of these press type fittings. Still trying to figure out how we are going to change a Reversing Valve without "unsweating" it. LOL Everyone be safe out there

[@steveturcotte7435]

Imagine your trucks needing retrofit for hauling and storage of A2 refrigerants. Sprinkler systems at all shops. Huge mistake

[@Garth2011]

I thought that commercial systems used ammonia for refrigerant...

[@nickmarte3279]

@@Garth2011 yep ice cream places in particular. And it is one of the most dangerous parts of this feald. You make a shit ton of money because you life is Genuinely at risk.

[@Garth2011]

@@nickmarte3279 I see, I use ammonia all the time around the house, floor cleaner, greasy clothes, windows and carpet spot cleaning etc. You won't see any bugs in the house either.

[@carbine85]

Great Video. I'm going to tell my Techs this is a must watch video

[@wadeplank5043]

Looks like I’m investing in a refrigerant press tool in the near future.

[@jamesduffey4442]

Refrigerant press tool?? You mean a recovery machine ?

[@wadeplank5043]

Copper line -set fitting press tool. Like a zoomlock or RLS.

[@AirsoftColeraine]

Why?

[@wadeplank5043]

It is only a matter of time that using press fittings will be the method for connecting refrigerant lines in the field. I might as well get familiar with the tool and have it in my arsenal. Whether I prefer this system or not, they’re going to prohibit an open flame in many jurisdictions soon. I don’t know what it’s like overseas, we already have fire watch requirements many places here.

[@peppersaltman1805]

I was thinking about that too, because the risk posed by the flame. But it should not be a problem with evacuated systems and nitrogen

[@sparkytech8787]

We already have been using r32 in the last 3 years in Australia.

[@jamesmooney5348]

Wow, I still get to work on two R12 systems and just recently lost the third do to a K frame compressor failure.

[@Trident_Euclid]

@ 24:00 basically every HVAC business in the middle east doesn't evacuate, flow nitrogen or even the basics to keep refrigerant from being contaminated.

[@joshmason1725]

Facts

[@jorzer18]

This was great info. Listened to the podcast but couldn't help but watch it again. Jason did a great job explaining what we should expect in the near future. For those of us using the R290 are not worried about A2L refrigerants. ESCO is a great resource. I don't remember where I heard Jason first, here or Shoptalk but I booked marked the ESCO website.

[@KINGPAFA]

Thanks for info, It is what it is and We should get used to it. I have worked on a few R-290 coolers in past few month ["Takes a lot longer to do any repair"] and My understanding was that since GWP is very low, On the smaller equipment [Less than 1 ton] We could vent it outside! Since There are no service ports on these units, We should add temporary service ports and then purge the R-290 outside with Nitrogen, Fix the problem ["Use only OEM parts"] and blow Nitrogen through the system while brazing & no modifications to the original design! The Coolers & Freezers that I install right now use R-453-A or R-407F, I gonna start advising my customers to buy these HFCs and store them if they can [Money/Storage] before the price goes up!

[@hellhound-si5oz]

I just bought a window unit from Walmart in 2020 that still has r410 in it mini fridge with R12 are upstairs GE refrigerator has R134a I'm in my process of getting my EPA certifications

[@DRHVACR]

yes because the epa is just sitting outside your house waiting to give you a fine

[@bsair9444]

WTH? I've been alive long enough to have to go through the changes from R12, R22, R134 R41o, and R410A. Now you're telling me I have to now start going back the other way???

[@johnwindsor9069]

Sad to see what is happening to the HVAC industry. All being pushed by greedy corps, and inept EPA officials. ECM motors with high failure rates, aluminum coils that start leaking half way through their useful life, inverters, E- TXV's, nothing is affordable anymore. Now another refrigerant change....great. I'm just the guy trying to explain to my customer why they need a second mortgage for yet another "new" system.

[@dporrasxtremeLS3]

Now to do things right, we need to develope our own home systems, so that we can make the parts to repair them without 2000.00 motors and controls that have to be programmed by a certified 250.00/hr. companies.. A friend of mine was complaining about a standard car battery that cost 750.00 because it had to be programmed by the dealership...

[@keepthinking2666]

The old r22s even some of them that I service now that will build in the '70s and '80s they still have solid aluminum coils with no leaks and are perfectly fine compared to these days just like the above quote about cheap aluminum coils leaking after 5 years 10 years that's the other part with so many units that have issues with coil leaks and failures if you have a refrigerant that is explosive a flammable in these conditions and you have a leaky coil yeah shutting it off and having a fan turn on is really nice but when it dumps the entire thing out into the house and that sense a doesn't go off because like everything else there's always bad senses that have to be replaced now that house has to have everyone run out and pray to God it doesn't blow up it's going to take about maybe 10,000 homes cashing on fire and burning down before they'll understand that it was a stupid idea

[@sethmeistergee]

@@dporrasxtremeLS3 Which car has a battery that costs $750?

[@dporrasxtremeLS3]

@@sethmeistergee Buy any German newer car battery... Not available at the Parts stores. Has to be a certified battery from the Factory, also has to be Programmed to your car computer! 750.0 up up up Don't froget the newer exotics 9K UP!

[@s.j.5850]

The automotive industry is in a similar situation. Customers will just have to pay for mandatory upgrades. More opportunity for selling service contracts because the alternative (for the customer) will be purchasing a new system that may be more expensive.

[@FrostHVAC]

I listened to the podcast about the change, and the lines of "policy makers, EPA 'understand your frustrations'" sold it to me, Emerson is on the payroll. Every 10 years of change, really? They expect homeowners to be able to afford changing units every 10 years, and if they can't afford it, pay high prices for refrigerant being phased out and the cost rolling over onto them. On top of that, having us stock more than needed refrigerants in the truck. 2 different ones in high temp refrigeration now. This industry is going to hell, i get the efficiency efforts and environmental efforts, there's a small amount of techs who recover, having us carry more than 3 recovery tanks for just a/c alone is going to make blowing the refrigerant charge a better option to contractors and techs, and absolutely just roll backwards on advancement. They need to stop testing on us, and stick to testing in the factories. Someone needs to clean this mess up, streamline one refrigerant for high temp, 1-3 for medium to low temp, and regulate for special types of refrigeration. At least doing that would help somewhat. Edit: They also say this is for the sake of the environment... Yet bigger industry gets away with zero to none regulations, especially ones who cause more pollution than refrigerants could ever dream of

[@cfaure051194]

Very good video on new changes to the industry. Was wondering if there will be any significant changes to compressor technology or design?

[@MarcMeal]

I wonder how long it will be before we can't buy 410 a equipment?

[@clevc112]

Tomorrow.

[@kfury19]

4-5 years I’d bet

[@jamesduffey4442]

Yesterday

[@wakeboardbob]

@@kfury19 if the gas is being phased out I'd think we'll see less maybe next year but for sure 2023 there will be a sharp decline. Industry knows 410 is done thanks to the greenies so why sell equipment that will be exorbitant prices to repair if the gas is already on a known schedule for eventual banning?

[@kfury19]

@@wakeboardbob I agree completely about the equipment being sold. But I know most manufacturers in the US don’t plan to change platform for new refrigerant untell 2024-2025. It cost a lot to re-engineering the equipment and get new AHRI certification, there for corporates being how they are want to get as much cash out of what’s already done as they can before changing again. The EPA hasn’t released the phase out scheduled as of last time I looked. But that being said the expectation is 10% reduction in 2022- 40% in 2023- 70% in 2024. 2024 is when you’ll really start to notice as a consumer that things are changing. You can still get R-22 today and it’s phase out was started well over a decade ago.

[@brianmcdermott1718]

Great info. and guest Bryan. Thank you.

[@dandohner8107]

More and more complicated equipment changing every year with less and less techs wanting to deal with this over engineered heating and cooling equipment.

[@nivin69]

It's great when egg heads get involved in the blue collared mans territory aint it?

[@Jugc0006]

Job security sweet, I got 25 years left to retire. Unless Cardano hits 100 dollars.

[@josemuniz9750]

EVERYTHING changes over time with more tech and more complicated. You either have to adapt or move out.

[@nivin69]

@@josemuniz9750 dude I get that, but this constant change isn't as productive as it seems. You do understand these customers have no clue how this industry works. All they see if us standing there going..... Yea they don't make that anymore, or , yea that's been phased out. Time for a new system sir/mam. Just makes us look like the bad guy with each change in equipment.

[@josemuniz9750]

@@nivin69 you wouldn't be telling a customer "they don't make that anymore or to been phased out" on a 5 year old system... Can you tell me any part or anything that wasn't replaceable due to being phased out on a unit that's not 20+ years old?

[@alberthartl8885]

Was at a LG training facility last year and all the refrigerant lines were press fit. Makes sense with a flammable refrigerant.

[@JamesPettinato]

You work on a unit with flamible refrigerant, then 8 months later the customer has a fire, they're going to blame you. I'm on the front line, I don't like the liability issue.

[@davejohnsonnola1536]

Good to see you stil active. Miss your vids.

[@JamesPettinato]

I looked up "refrigerant explosions" ... I found 2 technicians with half their arms missing, one asian guy looked dead. I'm wondering if insurance companies are going to drop anyone associated with flamible refrigerants, service companies, supply houses and manufacturers...liability issue...it just doesn't sit right longterm. I've been in this business since the sixties, R502 was the new refrigerant, I've seen new things come and go , flamible refrigerants are not a good idea.

[@rayzerot]

It's not new. These refrigerants have been the standard in Europe for over a decade now and have been in use even longer than that. If a tech isn't competent enough to use these refrigerants then they probably shouldn't have been technicians to begin with. Edit: in the video they even say that natural gas and propane are both more flammable and and explosive than A2L refrigerants.

[@davejohnsonnola1536]

¡ Jim P, good too see an OG KZbinr chiming in. Wish you still posted refrgeration videos! Hope you and yours are well.

[@davidspillman8596]

Thank you both

[@michaelthurber2660]

Very informative. Thanks for the insight.

[@davejohnsonnola1536]

Just called out to recover refrigerant from 20 window units. Five of the were R32, the rest were R410. Told the scrapper to hold those off to the side, you need another recovery tank and I need to do some research before touching them.

[@xraceboyex]

What research did you have to do to recover a window unit? Piercing valve - done. No?

[@davejohnsonnola1536]

@@xraceboyex The "scrapper" in this case is an idealistic entrepeneur who bought his own recovery tanks and thinks he is going to resell the recovered refrigerants. He did not have any other recovery equipment and wanted to see how it was done. My questions at the time, having never worked with R32 previously were: 1) Since this gas has a flammable component, can it be recovered using Appion machine? ANSWER? yes. 2) Since R32 has some of the same components as R410 can they be mixed in same recovery cylinder not intended for re-use only for resale to recycling company? ANSWER? ???????

[@JamesPettinato]

A fire under a compressor in a refrig ...you have propane MIXED with flamible poe oil...napalm bomb

[@graywolf2694]

i wonder if they will use these on transport refrigeration, they use diesel engines to power either a genset or a directly coupled compressor, now we are talking about heat, oils and fuel.

[@Garth2011]

When will 410 units no longer be repairable? Some folks have just replaced their systems with the current 410A and have 10+ year warranties?

[@sheltonhood4428]

Keep up the updates to the new coming out it helps

[@johnnyprotalk3352]

I hope they talk about the change during the 5 hr class required for hvac/r license renewal

[@ODucks55]

License renewal? What state are you in?

[@dexenationgracey1979]

@@ODucks55 I don't know where he's from but you have to renew your license in my state as well.

[@briangc1972]

I just read the recent documents on the EPA website and apparently, there is a requirement for color coded freon line sets. I wonder if they will allow us to simply spray paint old, existing tubing or will we have to install new tubing that is factory color coded? Should we, as a general best practice rule, replace all old line sets when converting/ installing a replacement unit using R32? First for the color code and secondly for the security of eliminating potential leaks in the tubing...

[@michoacano4783]

Keep the blower running ? And spark and boom 💥

[@rayzerot]

Did you watch the video? They said in the first 6 minutes that A2Ls have such low flammability that sparks can't ignite them. It takes actually open flames. Plus we've been using R290 for quite a while (propane) which is more flammable and explosive.

[@boby115]

It takes 1000 times more energy to ignite an A2L refrigerant then it does an A3 refrigerant. I feel some of these codes required with the A2Ls are getting a little ridiculous and adding to the cost of not only the equipment but the installation for a small likelihood of ignition ( all the stars would have to be in alignment for such a scenario), not that it can't happen but we're making these assumptions without real-world data. I also feel the cost of these refrigerants are exorbitant due to patents on what I feel as simple refrigerants and the manufacturing of such.

[@j81851]

Don't drink the coolaide. Mercedes vigorously resisted this change to R1234YF. BTW to your point the auto ignition of R1234YF without a spark or open flame is 760F meaning refrigerant leaking onto a very hot surface (escaping exhaust gasses due to an exhaust manual crack or leaky gasket) could cause it to flame or explosion

[@boby115]

@@j81851 , The German highway safety department and the Honeywell corporation deem the Mercedes test highly unlikely (possible but unlikely; no more than a fuel rail line coming loose in a Head On collision & catching fire). From what I hear most of the fire departments are being trained to fight these type of fires and if there is a refrigerant leak it would most likely be depleted by the time they got there.Mercedes tried to use R744 (CO2) but it did a very poor job in hot temperatures. So from what I understand the German manufacturers are using R1234yf . Mercedes may add a argon generator as an extinguisher but I haven’t heard too much on how that would work. We had a John Goodman grow up in my neighborhood of South St Louis (Affton) but he grew up and became a TV & movie actor, not a service technician. Stay safe out there👍.

[@ramchillarege1658]

Great Video. Thankyou.

[@winstonwright3613]

Just so im clear .... they said new equipment for the new refrigerants, but as of now, people still change condenser units and in some cases, the old indoor unit remains including the coil, just with a different metering device, and 410a is used... so my question is.... with A2L's, NONE of the original equipment can be reused? Cuz it sounds like the indoor unit (with these sensors it will need) will have to be a new animal. If so; I can already see hacked together units now. With R32 condensers and metering devices, with 410a coils and indoor units and none of these flammability sensors. But I just want to know if I have that right... that the ENTIRE system is replaced if A2L refrigerant is to be used? .... or WILL there be instances where the condensing unit, evaporator, and metering device are changed, and a detection system is installed into the indoor unit and the furnace remains as-is? A retrofit, so to speak?

[@MrAdamd83]

Thank you bryan this was a very good informational video and I got a lot out of it

[@P0lBr]

Good Job on the Text RACT Jason!!

[@edlauren9434]

So, refrigerant leak sensors, new re-designed electrical controls/sealed electrical part and components.... So, regular 2 pole contractor for $10 will be replaced with hermetically sealed contractor for $60? All these relays, switches, motors.... everything hermetically fireproof sealed... The cost of regular residential split equipment will be double or triple?

[@mainj54]

What about split systems on gas furnaces. They will all have to be fitted with leak detection sensors . $$$

[@MrBen527]

Yeah, I don't like the sound of that

[@frankieb1951]

As usual in this country it's all about making more money. Like cars they have gotten overpriced and cost to repair them is asinine. The technicians will have to invest in $5,000.00 code readers to diagnose the problem and charge hundreds of dollars for what use to be a simple cheap repair. The Mafia ie corrupt government has now taken over the HVAC industry like everything else.

[@pedrocastano6410]

Pretty sure they're bringing ammonia back.

[@rayzerot]

They said in the first 6 minutes of the video that A2Ls require so much ignition energy that sparks won't ignite the gas. They literally said it would take an open flame. No need for sealed contractors.

[@smacleod69]

There were huge problems with the transition to 410a systems that took a few years to figure out for practical application, installation practices and training. The governament requiring More inverter systems means more shit can and will go wrong. And we as technicians will be the ones who have to clean up the mess again!

[@davidryder3374]

You're implying that 410a systems ever became practical? In my experience, all they do is leak and get customers pissed off.

[@smacleod69]

@@davidryder3374 You are right. Leaking evaporator and condensor coils with 410a have been a constant problem. Until the government or manufactures take responsibility to make the product good again. Customers will still become pissed off.

[@davidgallegos4771]

Hopefully this means that more homes will be built with package units

[@davejohnsonnola1536]

Bring on home sized chillers!

[@waylonlevins]

So what I’m understanding is that R32 and 454B run at a similar pressure to 410a? I wonder how that will affect condenser change outs, can we use a 410a rated evap with A2L? Or do sensors and “Intrinsically safe” electrical components also have to be used conjunction?

[@jasonobrzut2605]

Cannot retrofit a system to an A2L.

[@Garth2011]

I'd think no because a 410a won't have the leak and temp sensors.

[@DM19154]

I think engineers are going to love this!!!!

[@bobo11112222]

Interesting. So are we phasing out the torches with these "Kinda flammable Refrigerant"??? Moving toward zoomlocks & propress

[@rayzerot]

We would just need to recover the charge and do a quick nitrogen purge. No big deal

[@DRHVACR]

yep anyone caught with a torch on his truck faces 20 years

[@bobo11112222]

@rayzerot you mean flow nitrogen flow while braze after nitrogen purge. Have you seen how much crap build up that gets caught up in the TXV inlet screen? SO MANY Bad 410a TXV. If it's indoor coil, far from CU, I use staybrite so I don't have to flow. Anywhere near compressor gotta braze with nitrogen. Staybrite not so good with vibration.

[@lucaswhite3411]

​@@DRHVACRthat would be foolish

[@realestateservicessaleshea99]

As a retired Gas man 🤔 🙂 We already have natural gas /propane in houses now,my thing is we need to get on board with a world standard?? When 410A came out it was this is IT,HUh?? here we go again. Now I have 14 different gauges in the back of my truck 😢 😭 Thanks again for the video! 🍺🍺🍺🥃🥃🍿🏌🏻‍♀️ Stay safe. Retired (werk'n)keyboard super tech. Wear your safety glasses!

[@etherealrose2139]

Lol you'll notice a certain political party drives this and people gladly vote for it. Nevermind China puts out far more crap into the atmosphere than the rest of the world combined. This changeover is just pissing into the ocean.

[@jamesbennett9654]

Got rid of R-12 Because of ozone problem, Replaced it with R-134A to heat the world up, so what is wrong with the designers of all this problematic Refrigerant, one after another???

[@mrdrchad6110]

Well there is no magic button to press to make a perfect anything the first time. Progress is slow usually because people will have to be dragged through the process kicking and screaming with every change because they like how things are now and do not want to learn something new, especially if the new thing is more complex, time consuming or cost more money.

[@frankieb1951]

When their patients run out other companies can manufacture it cutting into their profits therefore they come up with something different to make. Then they make a fortune for seven more years. It started when all of a sudden R12 and R22 were bad refrigerants. Now every few years the current refrigerants in use needs to be phased out for some strange reason..

[@billsimpson604]

You definitely don't want to reduce the ozone layer too much by releasing a lot of R-12 into the atmosphere. If it ever got depleted much, we would all starve, as plants got cooked by vastly increased UV light from the Sun reaching the Earth's surface. THAT would be bad.

[@davehuber6949]

Last time I checked a 80% furnace has a open flame.

[@deadrabbits2114]

I deal with LP gas ptacs this will be fun.

[@jamesmooney5348]

Manufacturer need to build higher quality coils.

[@felipecordero9847]

Thank you both for information I'm from Puerto Rico no body are talk about it. But thanks

[@OH-uo3nq]

What about storage in a hot work van in the south? Here in Wisconsin, our summer is getting hotter. This summer we had the hottest summer so far.

[@leonardkimbler3689]

Hotter then 126 in the desert? or how about 150 in the van.. EPA is in a condition space testing these things with out real world application. Sure they step out and work in hotter areas for maybe hr or so but Techs are out here 7 days a week in same heat not just in one day testing they do on 100 degree day.

[@mrdrchad6110]

A work van may get to 160 degrees in the hot sun if these refrigerants need an open flame ( about 1500 degrees) in order to ignite then they will be perfectly safe inside a hot van.

[@mrdrchad6110]

I carry a 30lb tank of R290 (propane)and R600 (butane) in my van at all times and have never had a problem.

[@etherealrose2139]

The refrigerants reach temperatures and pressures hotter than your Wisconsin van on a normal day to day basis in the desert. Lol.

[@robertlyman9789]

Welcome to PHX,Az

[@jimburns348]

Sooo, why the move to flammable refrigerants that operate under high pressures and temperatures???

[@s.j.5850]

GWP (Global Warming Potential) is a growing concern. Increase the earth's temperature & bad things are likely to happen. If you like to eat - crops can be destroyed, fish populations can decrease, etc. You do realize that you are in the HVAC industry? You are in the business of regulating indoor temperatures. Same goes for the earth's temperature. The planet is alive, keep it healthy, it's the only one we have.

[@kevinlawson8124]

What about pressure drops do to reasons other than leaks?

[@serenity6988]

what happens if the terminals blow out on the compressor with 454B. BOMB????

[@jeffdominici3528]

HAHAH THIS IS WILD!!! JASON WAS MY INSTRUCTOR AT HVAC TECHNICAL INSTITUTE!!!!

[@christopherlent7895]

What if your partner has gas? Will the system shut itself down when he farts in the crawl space?

[@charleshayden8079]

One more failure point, another $200 added to the equipment cost, will probably add more than that to the cost of insurance due to slight flammability, all to be more green? Who's running this joint? Didn't the hole in the ozone layer pretty much close up?

[@paulkenney1661]

@@charleshayden8079 When they say GREEN I think they mean MONEY

[@Zeuzxxx]

As a former industrial hvac installer foreman i appreciate the info especially about the possible fire watch. At the company i worked for the fire watch ranged from 8 to 12 hours. Could this mean the same with a2L if so it will be a fantastic time to be an hourly tech. I been transferred to residential tech for a few months now, for one i cant get rid of the boots or all the ppe training that came from battling osha. I been slowly but surely reminding my coworkers everyday to make sure they have reloaded their nitro tanks. However i been seeing a sustancial decline in finding this resource have your heard anything? Or is it normal to not find it for weeks at a time in the supplies of the area?

[@ThisyoungTony]

I was recently told R32 will be using PVE oil not POE

[@dipley3771]

Great video. Thanks for sharing

[@davehuber6949]

Would you answer the question are they going to let contractors install this refrigerate install this with a 80 present furnace with a standing pilot what happens when you have a unit that holds 200 300 pounds of refrigerant on top of the elementary school. What is the cost gonna be to install this?

[@reftech1]

R-32 is slightly flammable, with flammability limits of 13.3 - 29.3% by volume in air, has a laminar flame speed of 6.7 cm/s. A spark won't ignite R32, an open flame is needed. By comparison the flame speed of butane is 46 cm/s and hydrogen is 317 cm/s.

[@DRHVACR]

have you ever seen the connectors blow off a compressor...... with this stuff it will be great the force of the pressure and oxygen in the air lol kaboom the arc flash from the 230v-460v will do it 3phase🧨🧨

[@officialmadgamer8399]

Will you be able to vent the new refrigerants use in residential and commercial sense it has lower gwp or do you have to take the same steps and precautions like the previous refrigerants being phase out..

[@tomkacandes8286]

Maybe R-290 0r 600a, not R-32 please

[@notanewbie1718]

Apparently, little or no concern has been given to the cost to the industry and the consumers that will be attached to this changeover. The price gouging will be in full force. Actually it is already at work. Poor consumers.

[@kfury19]

EPA doesn’t care what it costs. They want to save the i giro ent at any cost ( good thing ). Protecting the future cost money.

[@ODucks55]

@LabRat Knatz You are so right. “Climate change” is man made only by idea, so industry can make money. This is a great example of the industry phasing out a product before its used up so they can sell more “new” equipment.

[@lucaswhite3411]

​@@kfury19no sir, they aren't saving anything. This is all about greed and government overreach.

[@lucaswhite3411]

​@@kfury19there is no real hole in the atmosphere and they only keep crying greenhouse because people fall for it.

[@TonnyCassidy]

As someone who have wprked with lots of r32 systems, they are fine, ive even seen and done once or twice, hot work on those systems without problem, the only time i got issue is when some idiot at my local gas filling station filled my niteogen tank with oxygen,R600a compressor turns into a flamethrower for brief period, but aside from that its not that scary, besides, typical flammable refrigerant use very small amount of charge compared to something like r22 or 410a, never have fire issue with r32 system even when brazing is done without nitrogen (of course, not recommended to do but sometimes you just have to) Dont do what i do, it is indeed dangerous and risky, but nitrogenless brazing is very common here in asia and done all the time by most other techs

[@VacMaster2020]

Not happy about this 410 A is perfect our 1234 is too expensive compared to our 134A This is the worst idea I’ve ever seen

[@jman0870]

410a is literally the most shit refrigerant ever created. We should have adopted 407c instead.

[@lunytoo]

Question? Does this explain why everyone is getting rid of there hvac tools, are we still able to use the same tools that we have been using for checking pressures and vacuuming and recovering. Or manufacturers coming out with new hvac tools?

[@travisewing1795]

Why in the graph at 16:57 does it say that R22 has lower GWP than 4-10a?!?!?! Why have we been converting all these system to a refrigerant that is worse for the environment supposedly?

[@realSamAndrew]

It's true. They are all full of it. Something like 2000 times as bad as co2, which is already a big sin. Follow the money $$$$$.

[@joeshearer1247]

22 was "bad " for the ozone.

[@rogerf3622]

Because R22 is horrible for the ozone layer.

[@soxfan000]

R22 had a high ODP. R410a has zero ODP but high GWP.

[@realSamAndrew]

@@soxfan000 the original diet Coke had no sugar but allegedly caused cancer. Good substitute, huh?

[@keepthinking2666]

Honestly is no one going to talk about how r22 is still better and safer and no it did not destroy the ozone layer because the ozone layer was healed by itself decades ago and there's no actual proof that it came from Freon from the ozone molecules this other things on the planet that give off 03, how many people are going to have to die from exploding units and fires before they stop this lunacy so let's see if you have a hot water heater a furnace and maybe even an old dryer that's all gas ran off of and let's just say it was some old equipment with standing pilots and your coil goes bad and there's a leak and like everything else that fails you're rds fails like some will as soon as that unit ignites you have a perfect recipe for disaster

[@davehuber6949]

Read the safety data sheet

[@abazism]

We have to stock more refrigerant every couple of years

[@davehuber6949]

This will also count the consumer probe 5 times more money and does this have the same energy rating as r 22 ace 410a

[@michaelvanrheede7225]

In the northen states what do you do with the furnaces. Thia now means lone sets cannot go through that area or any area where flue gasses may leak into, and also not anywhere neat where a fireplace or gas stove is

[@mainj54]

So are all the existing and new 410A systems that are being installed today going to be obsolete ? Just like the 22 systems that are being replaced by 410 systems today.

[@joeshearer1247]

Yup

[@Icytits]

Everything becomes obsolete.

[@etherealrose2139]

@@Icytits you're obsolete. /TwilightZone

[@nivin69]

bingo

[@rickdunn3863]

It's all part of "you will own nothing & you will be happy". They will put everybody in the poor house one way or another. Yup keep telling customers they need new equipment every 10 years.

[@juliocastillo1988]

Jason was my teacher 👍Awesome teacher

[@jeffreyrex8232]

Don’t get so worked up everyone. It will be fine, just need to remember to reclaim correctly, purge correctly and just go back to basics and beat practice. R454b is already here in the U.K. on our YLAA aircooled chillers. As for low GWP you’ve gotta love 1233zd 😉

[@CommonSenseFishing209]

You seen the compressor explosion that killed 2 men in Europe?

[@tscotw1997]

It’s called government common sense…. Let’s tackle one problem and create 10 more to regulate! Ohh and homeowners will be paying out the butt because I see my inspection problems going through the roof!

[@abjz71]

So we are going to have a sniffer to shut the system down if there is a leak and its already installed and we just have to set the dip switches? Remind me again where that sniffer is in relation to everything. I also have to wonder how well that sniffer is going to work after a few year in a apartment or rental house where the renter is responsible for changing the filter which only happens when we show up because of a lack of airflow

[@keepthinking2666]

What about tdx20 also named bluon r458a it's a drop in r22 with better efficiency and energy efficient and cooler running

[@DRHVACR]

oh hey you can't say that..... don't talk about stuff that works... we spent millions in R-N-D to f up the world.... you will eat this s**t and like it

[@nmbr1son64]

I have a question: how will a burnout affect the new refrigerant? I would surmise that flammability and burnouts don't mix well...

[@chribrian]

If you evacuated system properly there will be no oxygen for a fire or explosion to happen. You will get the same or similar issues we have now. Acid and sludge

[@nmbr1son64]

@@chribrian I'm just considering the worst case scenario.

[@jman0870]

Combustion requires oxygen. How can a burnout possibly create ignition when zero oxygen is present?

[@richzamora1393]

When it burns out the terminal, leaking and the arc. Not common but I have seen it several times...

[@tedpert8786]

I am so glad that I will be out of this ridiculous business!Thank god!

[@rayzerot]

Scared of doing a little mental work at work?

[@jamesharris4744]

I've been reading all these comments and no one has brought this up : Does anyone remember electing the EPA to rule over us and force this crap on the nation ?

[@russellebenton]

Wait. What new tools?

[@newstart49]

R454b is going to be the refrigerant of choice.

[@per995]

The A3 paper has not R1150 ethene (ethylene) on it. Also an used refrigerant on ultra low temperature systems as freeze driers and cold traps. I have worked with that stuff on equipment made in the US way back at least 20 Years As I remember the makers did not sell the units in the home marked in earlier days. Good to see the ULT freezer brands in US convert to hydrocarbons due to export. Europe is much harder on out phasing.

[@mikedickinson9730]

No more 410 equipment manufactured after 1-1-25. No more 410 equipment sales after 1-1-26.

[@gmcjetpilot]

. R-454B or R-32 is being proposed. I just changed my 20 yr old R22 home AC to a "new" 410a unit. This will be around for decades.

[@lucaswhite3411]

Thank the government for overreach

[@ironeagletrike]

This was very informative. I have been an HVAC contractor, still maintain my license but haven't worked in the field in years as I have been a Facilities Director for a school but still do some training and was getting up to speed on some stuff and have seen your videos before. If you answer questions I am curious what you think about someone who has an older R-22 unit but has been thinking about changing it out to a 410a unit but now that I have heard this information I am curious, sounds like we may be transitioning to R-32 or possibly something else, if nothing is wrong with his unit I am thinking of telling him to hold off for now, especially considering 410a pricing is going through the roof like it is trying to catch up to R-22?

[@xraceboyex]

They'll just keep jerking the prices around to keep you guessing. I think I'll start playing refrigerant prices like the stock market

[@NW_drew]

@@xraceboyex lol

[@feedog9326]

Now how about the static discharge of disconnecting equipment from these refrigerant? I work in the auto industry. I had a static discharge while servicing vehicle after removing the gauges. That singed the hair on my hands from R-1234yf. How do we prevent this from happening?

[@nmbr1son64]

Probably ESD training courses to minimize or eliminate future mishaps.

[@feedog9326]

@@nmbr1son64 I already have been train ESD Damn. Just disconnecting this does not make it any safer, Tommy Jackson.

[@pauldombroski5185]

A static spark will not ignite an A2L, not enough energy.

[@ReliableHVACR]

Appreciate the info 🤙🏽

[@f1reguy587]

So r32 I was told at tech will only be around for another 5 years or so, we are headed toward co2 blends etc, it’s weird how r32 isn’t just lpg, which is also another looming refrigerant, but at least 410a had a fire suppressant in it… I’m on the fence about r32, but since I’m a new tech, could be stuck with a few things behind it, gets me worried about house fires and the deadly gas that can be produced from temperatures around 675 degrees C.

[@kfury19]

You’ve been lied too

[@f1reguy587]

That’s coming from the general manager at Mitsubishi? .. I’ll take that as about as true as it can be…

[@kfury19]

@@f1reguy587 Mitsubishi may be trying to go to co2 blends and small refrigeration maybe trying also. But engineers still haven’t been able to make co2 work for large capacity systems. There more than 5 years away on traditional split system and large package units.

[@iloveloosey101]

AIM. 410 phase out law passed already. Each manufacturer will have its own refrigerant soon..

[@dannynabors8167]

there was nothen wrong with REF.12/22 IT WASJUST THAT DUPONT LOST THERE PATEN AND THE PRICE WENT DOWN SO LOW ,BIG COMP.SCREW THE PEOPLE AGAIN !