Breaking the cycle (excerpt)

[@TrapMusicNow]

Prisons are meant for rehabilitation.

[@XxV3NGEANC3xX]

Trap Music NOW. It's weird because I agree to an extent, but what about serial killers and rapists? These crimes are unforgivable they don't deserve a chance like this

[@No-hf1xq]

They have their places for the mentally ill and unrehabilitatable. But those people probably make up less than 1% of the prison population. Most of them are in for doing or selling drugs, robbers, muggers, felons and gang members, almost all of which could be rehabilitated by pulling them out of the toxic neighbourhoods they live in, offering them education, a job and a future.

[@awesome20878]

that's where you are wrong, prisons are for punishment, not rehabilitation.

[@Lamawalrus]

Functionally, it's a deterrent and a rehabilitator. I guess the question is how vengeful do you want your justice system to be. There are costs though, they come with losing these people as potential productive members of society, who in Norway help pay for your medical bill if you get cancer, etc, since that is covered by taxes. That's the basic idea, minimise spite and animosity through shared wealth when as many as possible are productive

[@mikehawk9531]

@Lamawalrus Prison doesn't work as a deterrent though, I know that might be it's purpose but it sucks as a deterrent

[@kapuseta]

It's nice to see that at least from this clip it seems like James Conway or whatever his name was was actually more open minded towards prison reform that he seemed from the previous Norden documentary! Cool! Tack så mycket John!

[@unterohr]

the camera works was amazing

[@starkjo]

On behalf of our cinematographer Rasmus Tåg, thanks a lot!

[@rooi77]

Would be fun if you made an episode where you took one or more of the inmates who did the "project" to Halden, and let them experience what they draw in real life, if they are available now.

[@FranciscoMartinez-wk1yp]

Great documentary, thanks for the hardwork!

[@starkjo]

Our pleasure!

[@tomppilindh]

Thank you!

[@karlbbb]

Fantastic! So glad to have a clip of this. Can't wait to see the full thing.

[@tomppilindh]

The full thing w/o ads and with english subtitles is here : arenan.yle.fi/1-3964779

[@karlbbb]

Thank you so much! Perfect.

[@tomppilindh]

This is up to the browser sadly, Safari sometimes tries to fetch the old flashplayer.

[@kapuseta]

@@DatNdNd I'm 3 years late but it should now work without the flash player!

[@youreprettygood2603]

"80% of prisoners get released, who you do you want coming home, to live next door to you? You want somebody who took education, a program, has bettered themselves, or somebody who hasn't learned anything?" very powerful, the purpose of prison should be to reinsert people into society, not to destroy them further.

[@peacelovehope-jq1ry]

I don't think you can ever return to society after being locked up in such an inhumane environment for 10, 15 or 20 years. As you say, it destroys those people even further. Yes, they need to get punished, but not destroyed. No surprise most of them end up committing crimes again after they are released. Honestly, I thought such prison cells didn't even exist in more developed countries anymore or that people only get locked up in such cells for a few couple of months, not for a lifetime. But I guess I'm just a naive European.

[@Powerule23]

In the United States, the goal is incarcerating as many black men as possible. Prisons were originally constructed to force blacks into free labor following the abolition of slavery. When the "War on Drugs" was announced in 1971, a prison boom occurred, whereby the majority of state prisoners are black and brown. The War on Drugs has been nothing short of the War on Black Men. "Law and Order" only means one thing in the United States: the legal oppression of black and brown men through paramilitary police tactics and mass incarceration. There has never been a focus on rehabilitation in prison because the goal is to completely disenfranchise the incarcerated.

[@76678-m]

I always make this point when talking to people who support tough on crime policies. People seem to forget that 98 percent of inmates here in the US are going to be released. When they are released, any reasonable person would want them to be LESS likely, not more likely, to reoffend. The Nordic countries understand this. America doesn’t.

[@The_Tortoise_and_the_Hare]

yes that is what the Norwegian prison dude speaks on, so I think he heard that from him, but it's a great point to make.

[@andrewhall7930]

No one in this documentary is saying that the U.S.A. is going to, (or should) fully implement the Nordic Prison System, but the U.S. prison system is so inhumane, that simply looking to this model for inspiration is a good idea. Improving the U.S. prison conditions even slightly is worth the time.

[@zuditaka]

*Nature deficit disorder* is normally part of the brutalising prison set-up. There is no reason why prisons cannot have more trees, or ivy allowed to grow up walls. Huge aquariums and aviaries and glass beehives could be built into prison walls. Long Bay prison, in Sydney, for example, is right beside the sea, and the benefits of a huge polycarbonate wall where prisoners could watch the fish swim would draw them closer to nature. A brick or concrete wall, and asphalt everywhere, did never edify anybody. Most schools could be redesigned, as well, to allow more of the natural environment into the classroom situation. I remember my high school had windows situated in such a way that a pupil could only see the sky if they were in a sitting position, with no view of the trees outside. In other words, they were meant not to be "distracted" by anything. It's like putting blinkers on a horse. That's as manipulative as the average supermarket that has no windows anywhere, or, if they do, the windowglass is completely covered in advertising posters. The "quadrangle" at my high school was a militaristic square, concrete and asphalt and bereft of anything from nature. Human beings were the only life form there. So all these places, prisons, schools, hospitals, etc, all need to be redesigned and thought out in such a way as to bring the natural world back to us. Taking nature away from prisoners brutalises them. Many modern prisons are no more than electronic zoos that contain humans. Prisoners need access to, and the friendship of, animals, as well.

[@arcadiaenlightened6330]

Norway has a massive social safety net, whereas the States does not, so it's not just about the prisons, it's about what happens to you when you get out

[@judywaits4u]

And while you are growing up.

[@LMB222]

That's a common misconception. You don't get the Net until you work xxx months. Not sure about Norway, but I wasn't legible in Germany until I worked 24 months.

[@whattheydidnttellyouwithbr2844]

@@LMB222 In Norway the social safety does completely follow you into the prison

[@samsara678]

I just saw this on Netflix! Thank you for this documentary! You did a really great job of questioning the correctional system & its role inside the prisons and beyond, in the community! 👍

[@starkjo]

Thank you very much for your comment, we appreciate it!

[@philipmango3288]

One problem is that there are many people in the United States who would say that the lifestyle and living arrangements of the prisoners in Norway are far better than what they themselves have now as free citizens.

[@SC2warms]

This almost Norwegian utopia could be the same in USA. Theres not that big of difference between the wealth in both countries (Gdp per capita - US 56k$, norway 61k$). Distribution of wealth. Must keep the "American dream", so you can be part of the 0,1%, which will definitely happen! (For 0,1% of people).

[@starkjo]

I understand the point. One of the inmates in Norway that we interviewed (he's not in the movie though) talked about that, and his point was crystal clear. To the outside world, it's easy to think that both Halden Prison and other Nordic prisons look very nice and seem almost "luxurious", but that doesn't mean much. The punishment is the removal of their freedom, and after that, how nice your cell is doesn't affect you so much. A much more central point is the staff - their respect, dialogue, values, methodology, proximity and approach is at the very core of the whole correctional system. Flatscreen tvs, relevant programs, education and music studios all resemble society, which is very important as well, but the human aspect is THE thing.

[@philipmango3288]

Thank you for putting up this video. It is absolutely brilliant.

[@TheRickyH]

Good point John, I think the private prison system in the US has completely destroyed the "Humanity" or hope of it in any of our prisons.

[@gmcannon]

And only contributed to further crime and violence. There's a reason beyond prisons that no one in the world is looking at American Workers wanting to import them. We can correlate to how we treat our education system as a whole to prisons, you don't educate or better people and you have a very sub-par populace with little skill sets. What do people with no jobs, free time, no money do? Just adding my thoughts not trying to spark another conversation

[@centril]

Tack! Jag hoppas verkligen att du blir ordentligt prisad för denna enastående dokumentär!

[@starkjo]

Hej Mazdak, tusen tack för kommentaren! Vad fint att du gillar den, jag uppskattar att du skrev detta!

[@LehrerKoch]

Thank you for your effort, I really enjoyed watching this. It is really informative and puts things into a perspective.

[@tomppilindh]

Thank you - our pleasure :)

[@ediwho_]

wow, love how this documentary was shot. great cinematic.

[@starkjo]

Thanks! Our cinematographer Rasmus Tåg will be happy to hear this :)

[@verbat1900]

So that is why the next book is taking so damn long, he's in prison playing a damn guitar.

[@ThorbjornTaule]

Thank you for putting the link to the full doc. As a norwegian myself. i think how we do it in halden is how we should do it in all norwegian prisons. yes that would be alot more expencive. but id rather have a well educated man out of prison ready to get to work and pay his taxes. than some rookie that will live of wellfare. so the price we pay for a good prison system is well worth it. and as a person who have lost a family member to murder i know the feeling of wanting people to get revenge. i had it. but you got to thinkl that the person who is now in prisson wil be able to come at as a much better person. and be helpfull to our society . thanks John stark. Wonder full Documentary .

[@ollierkul]

Well said brother, and sorry for your loss.

[@complexdrive304]

Loved how one inmate mentioned, which inmate would you rather have moving next door as a neighbor. Not everyone has the luxury to just haul tail it and move when someone they don't wish to associate with moves into their neighborhood. If the inmate was treated humanly; chances are they would be no different than any other person on your street. Actually, you hope they would landscape, go to work, and participate in the community.

[@oliverbeck9655]

this documentary is very well done, good job!

[@starkjo]

Thank you, much appreciated!

[@danielgiddings8839]

Excellent documentary

[@HelenEk7]

I would say that one of the biggest problems in the US is poverty. Poverty = crime And it doesn't help to have a broken prison system. Treat people like animals, and that is how they will behave..

[@elbuggo]

It is crime that causes poverty. You have more from *your ocean of stupidity* that you will share with us?

[@docsgt]

Poverty is no excuse for crime. You make choices in life, that causes crime.

[@ranndino]

@@elbuggo The only one here who is swimming in the ocean of stupidity is you. Crime causing poverty is an extremely dumb statement. There's actually data on this. Go google it.

[@elbuggo]

@@ranndino - shut up stupid bitch.

[@definitlynotbenlente7671]

​@@docsgtif you jeed to steal to survive its not a choice and being in poverty is also not a choice

[@JohnSmith-gy1nc]

Norway has a very socially advanced society. However I would say they do not really need maximum security prisons in the same way as the USA do, as Norway does not have tens of thousands of prisoners who have filled other people's bodies with bullets.

[@JuicedUpLemon]

john smith Nah, In Norway, We eat the bodies. 😂😂😂

[@starkjo]

Just a comment - Halden prison is still a maximum security prison, and the guys who are serving their time there have still committed vicious crimes, often violent crimes as well. Of course, the societies differ in many ways when you compare Norway and the US, and that's a big discussion in itself :)

[@mar504]

John Stark, how does Halden respond to prisoners who could care less about bettering themselves and routinely put other prisoners in danger?

[@jackmiddleton2080]

That may be, but the prisoners are still more positioned to transition back into society. In the US the prisoners are divided by race and gang and origin and so on. Nobody trusts anyone. I saw this documentary where the prisoners would try to ejaculate on the guards and would masturbate while staring them in the eyes all the time. I just don't see that in Norway.

[@starkjo]

mar504, I'm by no means an expert - after all, working with correction and rehabilitation is a profession, whilst I'm merely a content producer - but from my understanding, the same method is used for every inmate (apart from people with mental illnesses, which is a completely different thing, and demands other solutions). The foundation is a respectful dialogue, from the very beginning. They talk a whole lot, the communication is key. Mind you, at Halden, which is a high security facility, the COs don't carry weapons either. Not the male, and not the female COs. One reason is the feeling of respect, they're equal. The term they use in Norway is "dynamic security", which is based on creating a humane environment based on dialogue and respect. If there would be a disorder at Halden - which rarely occurs - there are security cells, not unlike solitary cells in the US. But compared to the US, at Halden the violent inmate is only kept within the security cell until both he and the situation has calmed down - a few hours, max a day or so.

[@goransvraka3171]

Amazing doco. Love stuff like this

[@HelenEk7]

When the American inmates present their ideal prison I wanted to cry... This kind of prison exists, they just don't have any access to it. :(

[@bigfan1041]

Feel free to try to replicate the system but I think there's too many significant differences between the US and Norway for it to work.

[@TheKeithvidz]

Always happy to hear and share norway.

[@chibixzero]

I should go to that country and go to jail. I would get all my education, food and medical and live better.

[@suggarachel]

Aggressions you can Get that without going to jail in Norway.....

[@grazie0316]

can you just imagine what you can achieve without even going to jail here in Norway?

[@thehavok2]

Thank you for sharing this video. The prison system in the USA is in dire need of positive change. We should not have private prisons. We should not condone the suffering of prisoners. We should do away with private prisons and the people that support them.

[@judywaits4u]

Until less than twenty years ago, all death row prisoners in Texas had freedom of movement within their row. Then one incident happened and it was all locked down into cells that never let light in, let alone sound. THis created problems that had never existed before. Murderers hope to be sentenced to death rather than LWOP because they get solo recreation for about two hours per day. You do not get that if you are serving LWOP.

[@xex321654]

Great video

[@Chillypuwn]

The problem obviusly is that United states have privatized prison system, thus the prisons have no incentive to rehabilitize inmates back in to society. In fact it is better for the prison business if the inmates commit crime as soon as they are released. It is the same with privatized medical care. Lesson: don't turn your most important functions into mechanisms of profit.

[@General_Townes]

Im kind off late but... That is capitalism for you, its all about the money.

[@docsgt]

Do your homework, Privatization of prisons is on a downward trend in the US. Try again.

[@General_Townes]

@@docsgt does not mean that private prisons are not a problem and are not big

[@ickdon7999]

Chillypuwn 90% of US prisons ARE NOT PRIVATIZED. Where do you morons get your info from?

[@mrbgnle]

America, land of the free

[@judywaits4u]

Free to go to prison as often as you like, or do not like.

[@davidmorin8705]

I remember when some outside Inmate reform group got permission to go an interview inmates at our spot. CO’s made it very clear that if we ever exposed the real deal, we’d pay dearly!! There’s absolutely no way those advocates for Inmate reform will ever help Inmates currently incarcerated, all that shit does is cause more pain within the facility!!!

[@SadisticSenpai61]

I can tell you why. There's two reasons behind it. The first is the revenge and punishment motive. But that can be changed with proper messaging and political efforts. The second is far more perverse - private prisons. They make profits off keeping the cells full. That means they make more money when recidivism is high, as well as making more money when minor non-violent offenses (like drug use) is punished with lengthy sentences. I'd like to see a program set up a state where, instead of sending a few inmates to a private prison, send them to a Nordic prison (paying for their expenses as they would with the private prisons, and it would probably be cheaper), and then track them when they return to the US after serving their sentence and seeing how they do in society compared to the inmates who served similar sentences (for similar crimes) here in the US. We could use those stats as a basis for making reforms to our prison system. All it takes is 1 state to start the process.

[@2darktwoC]

My sister sent me this, super eye opening

[@mortenfredenlund3016]

Norway should start to build and run a prison in the US, so that the US would have a model to go after, just saying

[@ickdon7999]

Morten Fredenlund 🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄

[@Xanatissimo]

This is a very interesting documentary. All my life I have been convinced that the prison system model, like in most places in the world , was completely obsolete, reinforced criminal behaviors, institutionalized and marginalized people from society. This Norway prison model is the best example of what a prison should be: a rehabilitation institution. Of course this model is very specific and can only work in a different more balanced society with less poverty, less violence, low unemployment, high living standards, high levels of access to education, etc. But still, many many things could be implemented if at some point someone took the time to actually restructure the prison system. But most people just close their eyes and let the prisoners rot in their cells forgetting that one day those same people will be out and be their neighbors. In some asian countries the inhumanity is even worse (20 guys per cell sleeping on the floor aligned to each other). I want to see this doc.

[@starkjo]

Full doc available here: arenan.yle.fi/1-3964779

[@Invictus1017]

Unfortunately the US doesn't want rehabilitation. The prisons here are run for profit, and the corporations that run the prisons lobby the government to enforce laws that allow these prisons to be at 99% capacity year round.

[@jellybeanx489]

I wish this was still on Netflix. Where can I still watch this?

[@starkjo]

@jellybeanx489 You can watch it here for free, with subtitles in English: arenan.yle.fi/1-3964779

[@torolavmelhus1092]

Who made the subtitles for this video?? There was alot of translation lost in space! Great that the world is finally starting to get aware about our humane jail system in norway, u wont ever think about torture there!

[@starkjo]

As producer I'm responsible. I'm aware of some of the differences in nuance. One of the reasons is the need to squeeze many words into relatively few characters. But I don't want to explain if there are obvious errors, the responsibility is on me. The full version, which you can view on NRK TV (jag utgår ifrån att du är norsk?) here, tv.nrk.no/program/KOID35000017/fra-halden-til-attica, has better translation I hope. Thanks for watching, we appreciate it!

[@torolavmelhus1092]

John Stark ja, er norsk. Takk for forklaringen, det er greit. Det var ingen feil i betydningene :)

[@starkjo]

Då är allt gott :) Tack för din respons, vi uppskattar det!

[@archkyle]

i personally believe that the revenge mindset comes from the strong religiosity of the country (im a US citizen, born and raised). religion is very divisive by its very nature, it creates a "them vs us" mentality derived from tribal mentality. christians are perfectly ok with believing that non-believers suffer in hell for eternity as a punishment for their non-belief. it's not a far stretch to see the connection here.

[@angelgonzalez-du1oo]

I think that what the prison system need is to place cameras in all the areas of the prison in that manner you can reduce the violence not only by prisoners but by the prison staff that are in many cases instigators and love to go after a particular prisoner.

[@orange42]

Apart from the gangs, drugs, racism, cultural diversity, socio-economic background, and total inmate numbers, Norway and the States are identical.

[@Cyber128]

Very interesting. The American "justice" system needs a complete overhaul

[@literallymyusername8291]

More to do with culture in the US than the system itself.

[@mikehoward4856]

The justice system is a reflection of the culture.

[@adambuesser6264]

can we have something similar to Halden prison in Norway to the United States?

[@dwightshowman]

Well done to james for being willing to change his mind

[@Speederzzz]

What is the name of the song at the credits, it sounds so great.

[@starkjo]

It's called "Only Human", and it's written, composed and performed by Sam Tax and the Mugshot Shooters, courtesy of Criminal Records (which is the music studio inside of Halden Prison).

[@MrThreeWorlds]

Criminal Records is such a dope name for a prison music studio.

[@railvlogger1439]

The whole culture of the US needs to change, from religious attitudes to the gun laws. They see guns as a mark of freedom. You don't need guns to be free.Sentencing people to ridicules terms of imprisonment tells me that rehabilitation doesn't figure in the process. It is about revenge and retribution.

[@MrOttopants]

Yes! I'm overjoyed. Prisons in the US are one of the worst things about this country. We use prisons in a way that props up all sorts of class and racial discrimination and stereotyping.

[@asianinnorway1475]

Great video! The USA prison needs to change the system!

[@judywaits4u]

The system needs exploding.

[@davidmorin8705]

U wanna break the cycle!!?? Train those in Blue how to be human!!!!

[@egilb844]

Check out Halden prison in Norway...

[@Flinkjo]

Great documentary, but there are several important translation errors.

[@starkjo]

We are aware of that some nuances do get lost in translation due to the limited amount of space and time for subtitles. Hopefully though the core message is intact! We do appreciate you pointing this out, and in the name of transparency we definitely don't deny any potential errors.

[@kathyoberle9093]

In prison inmates are hungry,it is cruel to stave inmates as punishment.

[@EddieValentino-l5k]

I been there.. i went to b block first then d block.... the yard has 15 phones you gotta put your id in the box by the guards to use the phone

[@earthVOD]

I really like this video. Shows the difference in our societies and the way they treat people in prison. Also, no change will happen in the US. The US has millions in prison, Norway has thousands. Think of the upkeep/renovation costs.

[@whattheydidnttellyouwithbr2844]

That only means it will have be gradual and take longer. First that means that US will have to 1) Implement progression and dynamic security, low cost parts of the Norwegian system, 2) build a social safety net, 3) decriminalize minor crimes and use probation more instead of prison

[@c99kfm]

US model prisoners dream prison is the supermax of Norway. Wonder what those same inmates would think of Bastøy prison?

[@jennifer6753]

I am having trouble finding this in English (not English subtitles). Is it available on any platform?

[@starkjo]

Hey Jennifer - are you asking if there is a version where non-English is dubbed into English? If I understand your question correctly, then the answer is no, unfortunately.

[@annetteslife]

That is what the Americans should be doing in the first place is rehabilitation not punishment. If they want the inmates being released and not come back then they need to work on rehabilitation and punishment

[@docsgt]

Unfortunately the majority of inmates don't want to rehabilitate, but enjoy using the excuses that special interest groups create for them. Very small percentage are interested in changing their situations and following laws.

[@toxendon]

Do you have any research or data to back up your claim about the motivations of inmates?

[@blackfalcon1324]

'But we arnt the department of emotional responses, we are the department of corrections and rehabilitation"

[@davidmorin8705]

How about breaking the cycle of Inmate abuse from some of the most Sadistic people on this planet???!!! NYS CO"s!!!!

[@broccoli_lad]

It's sad that in Norway, they care about their citizens. In the USA, citizens are commodities to be bought and sold. ESPECIALLY impoverished people.

[@Lone2011Wolf]

You commit crime you go to jail. It’s not a frat house. It’s a punishment.

[@lifeisastruggle5517]

the funny thing is that the prison system of Scandinavia is actually american system from the beginning. the founding fathers wrote it. The Eighth Amendment (1791) no cruel and unusual punishments

[@heikonpeikon2]

The big difference is that in america prison are business. People own prisons and make money from it. In norway prison is run by the government to rehabilitate and they use government money to better the society. America have many privately owned prisons where they dont care for rehabilitation because that would take away future "clients" the more people that reoffend the more money they'll make. Thats why its also so bad inside the prisons, with bad food and everything. Is basically in poor condition because they want to spend less and make more.

[@filipringnell4083]

is there a longer version of this somewhere?

[@starkjo]

arenan.yle.fi/1-3964779

[@LeNaInLoVe]

I mean....in the US, a criminal is seen upon as a crimial his entire life, it seems.. Not being able to vote when sentence is done, almost no system to help people that comes out of prison. So mostly doomed to fail. How can you break the chain when you are constantly reminded of it and it even seems weight being added on, both when incarcerated and when time is done. Another thing is the f'd up system, where inmates are working and making money for prison companies. Example being brought up is for example; during the wild fires, inmates have gotten basic training for fire fighting, get little or no pay, not even a note of recommendation after prison time ended. Yeah, maybe some foreigners should come in and run a prison company like the states of Scandinavia does it? Wouldn't be as profitable short time, but the benefits in the long run..... unmeasurable, but incarceration rate will be lowered.

[@sledge6693]

Such a broken system & with soo many vested interests such as for-profit prisons I sadly can't see any changes forthcoming anytime soon.

[@geemeff]

Wow, buddies cell in Norway was nicer than the room that the oil company used to put me up in.

[@The_Tortoise_and_the_Hare]

not all prisons' are like halden, halden is the best one, but they have their own rooms and they get treated with respect, they have nice common areas and they chat with staff, they also make their own meals in a kitchen with knives and all of that.

[@jacobchmura4903]

huh. I go to school at Attica, the prison is less then a mile away from the school. that's probably OK.

[@SnowElf_96]

Most crime is non-violent so why punished the non-violent criminals in the same system made for violent criminals. Norway chooses to do it the other way and guess what happens they have way less violence even if the violent people get a better experience than if they lived in America.

[@ButtonWalls]

Takes place in a prison and is named "Breaking the cycle" Reminds you of anything?

[@judywaits4u]

Yes, Denmark.

[@jaycobfreeman5772]

Where can i find the entire Breaking the Cycle documentary?

[@starkjo]

arenan.yle.fi/1-3964779

[@T1Earn]

i know this sounds a bit weird but i have my beliefs towards people in prison no matter who you are ... this sounds a bit far-fetched but hear me out .... I Dont believe you should be in prison unless you have committed a cold blooded violent crime. Towards another soul. If you think about it everything else isnt someone to fear ... So a cold blooded violent crime to me is .. you go out of your way to cause any kind of harm to another human or animal for any reason other than self defense ... Murders being number one, child sexual assaults, bullying, even cyber bullying, etc. ANYTHING that has to do with harming another soul, without any reason, should be jail or prison time no matter what ... Ok so that leaves everyone else ... people who dont pay taxes ... people driving without the right documents, drug dealers, thiefs (without threat or the presence of people yes he can still be shot on property) , a 19 year old in a relationship with a 17 year old consented by parents and them , the list goes on but everything that doesnt endanger another human. My belief is everyone who has done non-violent crimes have a reason (not saying its good) for doing what they did ... YES they should be punished, they should have debts to pay to society ... they should be rehabilitated .. they owe the people however it may be ... EX. Someone gets caught with a pound of weed ... IDK the exact repercussion in America but lets pretend its 5 years in prison ... Why does this man have to spend 5 years in prison for having a drug ... hes never hurt anyone .. hes never stalked anyone .. we dont know 100% but im sure its the same guy who holds the door open for the little granny entering the gas station. He was doing a job illegally and got caught ... Did it affect anyone in their homes that day? No ... his punishment should be money he must pay and community service of some sort... But years in prison? it makes me sick ... this guy can genuinely be a good person at heart but now hes locked away for who knows how long ... someone who commits a violent crime we KNOW is a bad person .. cause in the end thats the worst thing you can do as a human. If anyone reads this there is a lot of detail to this but you can ask me anything specifically and i will respond as best as possible. But the point stays the same .. Non-violent crimes are treated blindly in America

[@PatrickHutton]

This is very interesting. I have a question; what's the difference in the types of criminals going into a Norwegian Jail and to a US one? How do the levels of education and dysfunctionality compare?

[@starkjo]

One way of looking at it is looking at the similarities and differences in the societies themselves.

[@Volthan]

The video could get it's message a little better across, without the scores/music telling me what to feel. Apart from that, thanks for the video.

[@rytterl]

Treat people like animals, they will become animals. Treat people like respectful humans, they, become respectful humans. It's pretty simple. We've taken out the societies revenge in prison. When someone goes to prison here in Norway, it's without a doubt a punishment. They have to leave their family for however long their sentence is. That's the hard part. But we don't kick the people when they're already down. We try to prevent them from coming back after release. And people in Norway who doesn't agree with this approach are few and far between. It works. It's as simple as that.

[@peacelovehope-jq1ry]

I mostly agree with you. Also prisoners lose most of their freedom and it's for sure not easy in that Norway prison either. It only looks like a great place to be in direct comparison with the NY prison, that is just inhumane in every way. Many prisoners have a history of mental illness, that started long before they became criminals. How are they supposed to ever get better in a place like Attica? It's just not possible. It will only damage them even more and that doesn't help anyone. It's a loss for everyone. Not all criminals can be reintegrated into society, some just enjoy hurting, raping and killing people for sexual pleasure. But that's a rather small amount of prisoners.

[@WookHarlem]

That's cause these inmates come from a different culture American inmates act like animals you give them an inch they take a foot these men really appreciate it

[@The_Tortoise_and_the_Hare]

we had more issues in the prisons before we made a change, we made a change because we saw it didn't work out the way we were doing it.

[@annetteslife]

Any updates?

[@starkjo]

Hey Annette, we’re working on something new - we will probably have the opportunity to lift the lid a bit more later this fall.

[@annetteslife]

@@starkjo thank you for the information

[@kathyoberle9093]

You are lucky to have a cell with a window.

[@mrtinythumb5363]

id rather have my tax money go towards rehabilitation then a revenge system prison because in the end society wins. simply because you show him or her how good life really can be and make them want to get better.

[@aleksandrifyful]

The recidivism rate and prison sentences in the U.S. are just way too high. Our tax money is going toward keeping people like non-violent drug offenders in prison for decades. I'd rather pay slightly more in taxes to fund a better prison system and more social safety nets for prisoners so that they can contribute positively to society and our economy once they are released and so that they stop re-offending.

[@carolinadrew170]

Unfortunately, there is so much poverty and poor living conditions in America that jail will never be better than living in a free America. I can only imagine how beautiful life is in Norway for the prison system to look like that.

[@003SOK]

we would have people robbing joints just to live there.

[@lightingthedarkremoteviewi8086]

Norway is very rich. What happens when you make prison better than real life? But I agree they should be making changes but they need to look at the whole picture.

[@BlueJDMMR2]

I've talked to a lot of shitheaded Americans in my time. This will NEVER get implemented on a state or local level in the vast majority of the country. Americans are even opposed to providing low income Americans with healthcare. I once pointed out "Why is it that prisoners have a right to some level of healthcare in the infirmary when they're behind bars, but law abiding poor citizens don't?" Answer I got from the American, a coworker of mine (a real Ron Paul guy too not to mention)? "Stop giving prisoners healthcare". That was his solution. You get shanked in prison? Don't see a doctor, die from your wounds, that was solution to what I said. Speaking of Ron Paul, lets all remember, we live in the country that cheers the idea of an uninsured 30 year old man dying because he didn't get health insurance, and boos gay soldiers in a combat zone.

[@wydeglyde0012]

Norway is the origin of Vikings. How could they have become so soft, - so naïve -and not recognize and eliminate the criminal elements that would haunt them in their future.

[@svent1000]

Nothing soft here. Only confidence. So we are like our forfathers, the vikings, we dont live in fear, therefore we dare to treat each other with respect. Even those who tread wrong and commit a crime. We're not soft at all. But you dont know your history. We already started thinking of democracy 1500 years ago. Viking community was based on free mans right to speak his mind at the ting(lawmaking gathering). And women had right to divorce, to inhertage theyre parents, they owned theyre own farms and property. So vikings wasnt savages. They just protected theyre own, and fucked the rest. Now we have enough wealth here, to include larger portion of the world. We no longer need to fuck the rest, just some of you. You can come to norway, go in the streets and pick a fight, and see if you will win it. Im not so sure you will. Most people here are fit and strong. And healthy. 😀 Ignorant.

[@c-spam9581]

I didn't notice when they cut from Norway to Attica and wondered where Norway got all those black guys from.

[@judywaits4u]

The USA.

[@heckyes]

Justice vs. Rehabilitation. Old world ideas lagging behind.

[@adamgreene831]

Another thing that you have to consider is the gang problem in the United States. Norway doesn't have the gang lifestyle like we have here in the US. Half the people in our prisons wouldn't know what to do with themselves if they were presented that type of lifestyle in prison. They never saw anything that nice when they outside of prison to begin with. I'm not saying it wouldn't work; i'm just saying there would be complications. Also, think about the ENORMOUS amounts of tax payer money that it would take to house ALL of prisoners like that. MASSIVE TAX INCREASES...

[@Cta2006]

We have gangs and also European mafia in Norway. Just like we have murderers and Serial killers, pedofiles etc. The same type of criminals as the US and also in every color and from various nations.

[@angrysshark]

Just adds to the long list of reasons that I'm ashamed to be American.

[@kathyoberle9093]

In prison inmates should have the right to have seconds food,if there are leftovers.

[@BEARTASTROPHY]

Privatized prisons

[@stapleboss]

Probably the best way to do this is to send the US prisoners over to Norway and let them be rehabilitated there. The US should pay the Norwegians, just like a private contractor, to do this. I think this will only work if the US prisoners are fully immersed in the Norwegian culture. Then, upon release, maybe the US prisoners can become Norwegian citizens and give back for all they've received and help expand the cultural diversity of the country.

[@Jakeb978]

You guys want all our murderers, rapists, and wife beaters? Take em'

[@kra2787]

Relevant info: Cost per prisoner vs US, # of gang members, average offense committed, how homogeneous. The US prison system is powered by lobbiest, that needs to end, prison shouldn't be a business. We also have the added challenge of some people that act more like animals than people, and the addition of ample gang warfare.

[@mikehoward4856]

" We also have the added challenge of some people that act more like animals than people" Well well. I would add that you also have the added challenge of treating a certain group of people like animals and expect them to act like humans. Please watch the documentary "The 13th" and read about "Black Wall street".

[@daedalron]

Though I agree completely with the norway system for 99% of inmates, what about the most extreme cases, people who truly you can't expect to get reinserted into society?

[@Crowly0]

In Norway we have a sentence called "Forvaring" that translate to confinement (more or less). After your sentence is up you are reevaluateed. If you are not fit for release the sentence can be extended up to five years. Then another eval, so on and so forth There is no upper limit to the number of extensions, it could end up as a life sentence.

[@georgek.9394]

man that guy in the US prison seems so decent. like i know it mustve been a bad crime to get thrown into max but for fucks sake treat people well and theyll trest others well... also id love to be arrested in norway

[@ranndino]

I agree with the premise of rehabilitation. However, you also have to consider, and that's not going to be PC, the fact that Norway doesn't have black ghettos. There are real hardcore thugs in US prisons who spent their whole life, from early childhood, in the very tough black ghettos. It would be interesting to experiment with having them in a prison like that but I'm skeptical that it would work. To clarify, none of that I've said is racist, as I'm sure someone will accuse me of. It's just a fact. The make-up of the prisoners isn't the same in US compared to Norway. Our ghettos here happen to be black but what I said has nothing to do with race but the environment people grow up in. The Norwegian prison system, for example, is having trouble with this approach when it comes to prisoners from Eastern Europe (35%) who grew up in a very different way from Norwegians, in very poor and rough neighborhoods.

[@judywaits4u]

There are some of our most maximum security prisons that have freedom more like the Nordic Countries, some States have outlawed solitary confinement without due cause.

[@Mister.Psychology]

Here is the full documentary: arenan.yle.fi/1-3964779

[@mtealey34]

Does Norway have an open immigration system. Can I just travel to Norway and live there or no?

[@sokorny]

Only if you hold a EU passport ... although Norway not part of the EU they have an agreement with the EU that allows for freedom of movement of workers.

[@suggarachel]

No, you need a visum

[@tipsycat27]

I think it's good to recognise that MOST law breakers are doing so out of circumstance and the way they've been raised. They steal to get by financially, or they hurt people because they were hurt themselves. It's good that Norway recognises this and tries to ACTUALLY rehabilitate them, rather than just push them further into a negative space. I think this works for minor or petty criminals. Those that have more of a hope. The murderers and rapists and child abusers- yeah, I dunno.. maybe it's better to make their lives fucking miserable. As a person who lives in Norway though, I can say that there really AREN'T that many crimes committed here. Not in comparison to America. It's cheaper and easier and makes more sense to treat inmates this way when there are so few. But then again, there is so much money being made out of the prison systems in America, you guys really don't have that much excuse.

[@judywaits4u]

It is not better to make their lives miserable; it is better to get them to realise they can do so much to be an addition to society and not a paracite.

[@youdoitillwatch]

....and meanwhile, Anders Breivik is pitching a fit that they'll only give him a PS3, and not the PS4 he thinks he deserves. I wonder where he gets that idea from...