Building A Dedicated Elk Rifle - Season 3 Episode 5

Welcome to the Ron Spomer Outdoors Podcast! In this episode, I answer listener questions about the 30-06, low recoil rounds, elk rifles, and more.
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Who is Ron Spomer
For 44 years I’ve had the good fortune to photograph and write about my passion - the outdoor life. Wild creatures and wild places have always stirred me - from the first flushing pheasant that frightened me out of my socks in grandpa’s cornfield to the last whitetail that dismissed me with a wag of its tail. In my attempts to connect with this natural wonder, to become an integral part of our ecosystem and capture a bit of its mystery, I’ve photographed, hiked, hunted, birded, and fished across much of this planet. I've seen the beauty that everyone should see, survived adventures that everyone should experience. I may not have climbed the highest mountains, canoed the wildest rivers, caught the largest fish or shot the biggest bucks, but I’ve tried. Perhaps you have, too. And that’s the essential thing. Being out there, an active participant in our outdoor world.
Produced by: Red 11 Media - www.red11media...
Disclaimer
All loading, handloading, gunsmithing, shooting and associated activities and demonstrations depicted in our videos are conducted by trained, certified, professional gun handlers, instructors, and shooters for instructional and entertainment purposes only with emphasis on safety and responsible gun handling. Always check at least 3 industry handloading manuals for handloading data, 2 or 3 online ballistic calculators for ballistic data. Do not modify any cartridge or firearm beyond what the manufacturer recommends. Do not attempt to duplicate, mimic, or replicate anything you see in our videos. Firearms, ammunition, and constituent parts can be extremely dangerous if not used safely.

[@KretinD]

This thumbnail is pure gold

[@sasquatchrosefarts]

I'm offended..Ron assumed my species and called all the viewers homosapiens. He should be cancelled.

[@MrRdvs87]

6.5 grendel has become my favorite deer round but I wouldn’t run this on an elk. If I can ever hunt with people I know in Idaho, I’ll grab a .308 fit my elk gun.

[@brianjaynes1030]

My 5' 0.5" wife (God forbid I forget to mention the last 1/2 inch!) owns a Mossberg Patriot Super Bantam in 6.5 Creedmor. It's a rack driving little rig that I grab off the rack far more often than she does.

[@davidcarmical4083]

Love the thumb nail. Lol us old guys need all the help we can get.

[@RonSpomerOutdoors]

Ain't that the truth. The hardest part was convincing my wife I should pose for this photo with just that apron covering my massive muscles.

[@paullesho9294]

Dear Ron , my 6.8 spc inside of 200yd with a 120gr SST has been very effective out of a 16" barrel on deer , im actually building a bolt action 16" for my girls , in tree stand and blind , very compact minimal recoil

[@chrishill1286]

Great video. Retired to Montana NW corner. Young man built my fence was also a guide for archery and rifle. So we hit it off and he was/is buildin a long range setup. for 1k yard shooting. I will attest to the accuracy of a browning Xbolt out of the box and berger bullets for sure. So I dusted off my M77 MkII in .300 Winmag that was never impressive at 100 yds. I bought a 4-24 scope for loaded some up and still 1.5 MOA, same as factory ammo. So I dropped a bullet into the bore and gently seated it and measured to the tip from the muzzle tapped it out and closed the bolt and measured from the muzzle. I subtracted .050 and worked up 6 groups of 4 rounds each at .005 increments. Using fireformed brass I found the sweet spot and transformed the rifle into a bug holer. on the third group up. Now I have some Bergers 185's I'll be working those up when I get time. Fun fun fun, keep up the good work Ron!

[@RonSpomerOutdoors]

Congrats on finding your best seating depth, Chris.

[@andyherzfeld9492]

My purpose built Elk rifle is an 8mm Rem Mag. I have a 27" Shilen Barreled action in a McMillen stock. The scope is a Valdata 4.5x14x50x30mm. The round I use is a handload using Nosler brass with a Swift A Frame 220 grain traveling at 3,000. FPS. I haven't killed an Elk yet but it dropped two bull Nilgai pretty fast.

[@Mike_Collins392]

The 8 Mag is a " sleeper " cartridge , the factory loads and ballistic numbers are at the low end of performance for it. Unlike some others where the average guy reloading can't stuff the same amount of powder as the factory , or even get close.

[@casanovafrankenstein8875]

🤭

[@michiganwoodsman2199]

To the guy tired of the 30 06 recoil. GO and get a cheap muzzle break put on the bbl. Under $200 and will reduce recoil by 40 to 70 percent! It will turn it into a 243 :-)

[@davidteague5461]

I love your videos. I waited very impatiently for each one. Thank u for all the information.

[@RonSpomerOutdoors]

Thank you, David.

[@BradMcclun]

Well I've been following you for a long time

[@BradMcclun]

No I've always liked the way you and I'm always like the way you've come across😊 you know your stuff and I like it I like reading your stuff and then hunting magazines then I like to show you that on TV there shooting in Millie's over there in Oregon

[@NELLY-jg2rx]

Indiana Hunter here! We have a very unique set of laws for hunting. Currently in 2023 the following is true On PUBLIC land your Shotgun is ok, Rifle cartridges must be no more than 1.8 inches in OAL, over .35 caliber, and no restrictions to straight wall, just OAL traditional AR length straight wall cartridges are popular, 350 Legend, 450 Bushmaster are popular However, on Private land in the law pretty much anything above .243 is totally legal. So it really just depends on the type of land you are hunting! Shoot straight Ron!

[@bethhensel3741]

Super doper Quack Quack

[@diggernash1]

For the gentleman wanting to step down in recoil, my suggestion would be a Howa Mini Carbon Stalker in 6.5 Grendel. A rifle that weighs 4 lb 9 oz bare and around 6 lbs ready to hunt is very pleasant. Recoil is only a little more than a 5.56 and is very effective on whitetails. If he is a reloader, I am even more emphatic with this recommendation. A 115 grain Barnes TTSX on top of a top load(remember you can load a little hotter for the bolt action) of Reloder 15 made for a bughole shooter for me. As with all copper bullets, spend time tuning the jump to the lands for best accuracy.

[@drakeslocum2564]

I’d say 7mm-08 or 6.5 creedmore

[@jmgates09]

I'm trying to decide between the 6.5 grendel and the 6mm arc in the Howa for a deer rifle for my wife is what I'm telling her lol

[@ricktaylor5744]

According to the P O Ackley handbook for shooters and Reloaders Vol . 1 1 pages 205 200gr bullet 48 gr . 4320 powder 2400 fs Standard twist 14" The 444 Marlin necked down to .35

[@danhoff4401]

Re reduced recoil. There are several factory down loads available for common calibers. I have exp with Hornady custom lite in .270 and HSMs reduced recoil in 30-06. Both cut recoil in about half and perform excellent on whitetail. Great podcast Ron thanks!

[@craigleibbrand7761]

A dedicated elk rifle has to weather resistant and tough. Rain, snow, saddle scabbards, 4 wheel drive vehicles. Rem 600 or 660 in 350 Rem Mag is one of the best.

[@MartianLivesMatter]

The 6ARC, 6.5 Grendal or 6.8 SPC are more your stalking type cartridge's with the small lightweight rifle (16-18" barrel) chasing elk or similar sized game. I wouldn't recommend anyone take aim past 200 yards. You really want to be down in the 100-150 yard range.

[@anthonymurphy2540]

I decided to switch my elk rifle from a 7mag rifle to 7prc, also switching to a proof research barrel. I really like idea going from 16 pound rifle to a 10 pound rifle. would do think of that tsx 160 barnes bullet? my twist rate 1-8 rate?

[@fedup3582]

A simple way to extend length of pull, put on a slip on recoil pad on the shorter stock. Easy, inexpensive, quick, and effective.

[@RonSpomerOutdoors]

Good tip, fed up. thanks.

[@trihall2273]

28 nos all the way🎉🎉🎉

[@stevenhutton241]

Thanks for all your info I found out that 10% of the serria bullets I was buying 130 gr spbt did not meet specs. After I started micing all the bullets my groups went fromm 2" at 200 yards to .75" psit took one year to get these results shooting every weekend at the rod and gun club in tucson

[@trihall2273]

Idaho has fallen off the map for hunting and Montana is also struggling.

[@500spectre]

Next video: 10 cartridges that would suffice all firearms applications. From small game, medium game, large game, rifle, handgun.

[@alexandrealain]

I think Gerard maybe meant is there something inherent in a certain design of bullet that is “stable”.?

[@MrBowNaxe]

Great stuff Ron! Fairly new to the channel and really enjoy your knowledge. I wanted to know what your thoughts on hunting with a suppressor is? I apologize in advance if this topic has been covered in the past, I'm slowly going back through previous videos and haven't seen one. Thanks for sharing and I can't wait to see what's next.

[@RonSpomerOutdoors]

Good ? Bow. I have not covered suppressors but think their effect is wonderful, their "look" not so much. We will be covering soon.

[@jmgates09]

Just built a 300wsm tikka action put it in a bell n carlson stock put stainless trigger guard plus stainless bolt shroud and handle and knob replaced trigger spring 1.5lbs trigger now cut and threaded factory SS barrel to 21.5 inches atlas bipod now just waiting on prefit prefferd barrel with 1in9 twist its going to be 20 inches

[@jamiehurtt3530]

Too my hunters invest thousands of dollars in a rifle but neglect their health and are in horrible physical cindition 😅 To make a memorable and enjoyable hunt physical fitness is paramount

[@Leebprice]

Hey Ron! Lee Price here from bowling green Kentucky. Love the podcast. Been listening to you for a long time! It’s great how you break things down to the ridiculous and speak it in plain manner. Teachers are good at that! Anyways on to my questions… I recently won a Elk cow tag for Kentucky. I have until December 2023 to prepare. I have a Bergara b-14 .270 24” barrel. With a 2x12 scope second focal plain on it. All I’ve ever shot with it is deer from a stand about 75 yards off. Going into my first elk hunt what kind of bullet would you use with a 270. Also anything else you think I should be prepared for and any pointers would be gladly appreciated! Thanks in advance and god bless!

[@RonSpomerOutdoors]

Thanks Lee, and congrats on your elk tag. I'd recommend a Hammer, Barnes TTSX, or similar copper hollow point in 130-gr. Alternatively, any of the bonded or partition style controlled expansion bullets in 140- to 150-grain. The idea is to make sure you have bullet mass and integrity to penetrate deep in case you need to shoot from a poor angle. I've taken elk from front of shoulder to last rib on the far side, straight on back through the high brisket, and once an insurance shot to the root of the tail before one disappeared after initial hit. Lighter copper bullets penetrate as well as much heavier lead core traditional bullets because they lose almost no weight. I think the sharp edged petals spinning create additional tissue damage. Practice shooting to the longest distance at which you feel comfortable or likely. Best of luck! You're going to love elk meat!

[@danlindeke2561]

What is accuracy window guy was looking for?All bullets on 9 inch paper plate at distance you plan to hunt is my test. 300 yards my max.

[@hedge7743]

Mr. Ron, Another excellent video with some very enlightening content! I especially like learning about different bullet compositions and their pros and cons. Do you have any experience with the Berger Hybrid Hunter bullets? From what I've seen, they tend to drop animals very quickly, but I have no first-hand experience. Any thoughts would be appreciated! Thank you, Sir! Hedge

[@danielkearney3295]

great vid yet again!i want to hear about that 444 wild cat

[@ricktaylor5744]

200 gr. @ 2400 fs. Approximately

[@traviskuntz7503]

It sounds like he's shooting a 358 Bellm

[@elgato9534]

I finally bagged an elk in Colorado. We hauled our atvs and a jeep up the mountain. I hate to admit I used a 300 win mag and factory ammo.😢 it was my dads. The scope cost $2500 and we had it butchered 😢

[@BMWQC]

A 300 win. Mag with factory ammo is all I use for elk and it has performed superbly. It’s all you will ever need and not too much gun, in my opinion it’s hard to beat a 300 for a dedicated elk rifle!!

[@RonSpomerOutdoors]

Congrats on getting your elk, Elgato, but why did you butcher your scope?

[@edwardabrams4972]

@@RonSpomerOutdoors🤔😳😂

[@willbyrd3445]

Any info on the PO Ackly 230 mag?

[@RonSpomerOutdoors]

Not a lot, Will. Ackley called it simply the 230 Ackley and built it to accommodate certain state minimum caliber regulations calling for a .23" bullet. In the early years a .228" bullet was often used in 22 centerfires. The case was a slightly shortened and necked down 30-06. I have no data on actual specs. I suspect this never became popular due to the paucity of .23" bullets. Unless you made your own, they were hard to source. Ackley's handloading data listed a top MV of 3,510 fps with a 75-gr. bullet, pretty close to 243 Win. performance, which might be another reason the 230 never took off.

[@scottstruif3939]

What you want to hear is Ron’s forte.

[@jeffward8278]

I don't know anything about the 358-444 case, but the contender will not handle the type of pressure of something like a 350 rem mag or a 35 whelen . I would think his cartridge would be similar to a 35 Remington.

[@Paul-q3m7k]

Here is another difference between the factory 180 grain and the 200. The 180 is a flat base bullet and the 200 is a boat tail . I’d run the 200 if it were me but my Whelen has a 1-12 twist . If he truly loves that Whelen …barrel it with a 1-12 twist and run what I think is the best Whelen bullet . The 225 grain nosler accubond . This makes that rifle a true 500 yard elk cartridge

[@anthonymeyer183]

Would like to see a comparison 30-06 with a hammer bullet, say 160gr vs. 300 win mag Ina 180gr, say hunter eld-x in preference as well as drop and energy

[@echofoxtrotwhiskey1595]

Why such an apples and oranges comparison? Hammers have poor BC for copper bullets, and going heavier with lead in the 300WM just exacerbates the difference. Short answer, the 180 gr has less wind drift and probably drop, with more Ft/lbs across the board.

[@StevenMMan]

Your Ruger .35 whelen owner is incorrect about the rate of twist. Ruger factory .35 whelen barrels are produced with a 1 in 14" for me in a Barnes bullets the 225 is the way to go. I proving an average of 2805 fps with Accurate 2015BR powder. Now I have noticed that Accurate no longer gives the 2015 an BR at the designation. What's changed I don't know. My whelens have been a major elk and moose getter. Hmm it sounds like the contender guy has a variation of the JDJ cartridge line. I know that JD Jones utilized the .444 marlin case for his. 375 JDJ. I'm pretty sure that was the case bases for the. 358 JDJ as well Mountain man

[@kylelee9474]

[@GetMeThere1]

I think not a lot of people are aware that (at least for very long range shooting) there is such a thing as bullets being TOO stable. The ideal flight of a bullet would be like an arrow shot at a 45 degree angle: the point would lead the rear all along the trajectory -- pointing upward as it climbs and downward as it comes down. But a bullet that is too gyroscopically stabile wants to stay in exactly the same way it came out of the barrel. That means that, as it tends toward a rainbow type trajectory at longer range the point is NOT leading as it falls, but instead it stays pointed "straight" (as it came out of the barrel) as it travels at a different angle. This causes the air to hit it much differently, and results (at least) in a significant change in effective BC. Ideal stability is a twist which allows for some change of flight direction at very long ranges.

[@RonSpomerOutdoors]

Interesting but, I think, largely academic because the effect is so tiny with effects realized only at extreme ranges, i.e. 1000 yards plus.

[@derallrounder8835]

Hey Ron ive got a question,can lighter bullets be shot accuratley in a fast twist barrel. Like in a 22 inch barrel with a 8.7 twist rate in the caliber 6.5x55 wich likes heavyer bullets from 140 grains to 156 grains ,would lighter bullets be more unstable like 130 grain or even 120 grain in that kind of twist? or is ti just fine? Thank you for your time to make for us things easyer.

[@RonSpomerOutdoors]

It's just fine. No such thing as "over stabilized" except some thin-jacket frangible varmint bullets can be spun apart. Monometals would be fine. I pushed some old 45 grain varmint bullets from a 22-250 AI 4,100 fps and put 10 inside a 1" circle at 100 yards.

[@drakeslocum2564]

I plan on using Barnes TTSX 200 grain bullets for whitetail. Should I switch to 180 grain

[@lenzadlberger]

In what Caliber? I say for Copper speed kills (for lead i stay heavier then with copper) with 308 i am down to 130gn 30.06 i am at 150gn, 7x57R i load 120gn in 7x64 140gn, i want to be around 3000ft/s V0 with Monolith Bullets with lead i would be a number heavier Bullets and a little bit slower. And yes i am a Hunter that culls some Deer and Hogs every Year (around 50 here in good old Germany / this Huntingyear from 1.May till today i have shot four 1 Year old Red Stag and Deer and some Roe and Hogs all with 308 130gn Barnes TTSX they worked as i want it) P.s. for my German Magnum 8x68s i use 160gn TTSX with around 3300ft/s 😂 Hope this helps you.

[@RonSpomerOutdoors]

Either will more than suffice, but what cartridge and what MV? Less recoil with the 180. I'd run a 150- or 165 TTSX in a .308 caliber.

[@michiganwoodsman2199]

In the first 5 mins i can already say this. LEE dies are not so good. When shooting competition etc ive had the best luck with rcbs and forster etc. And the more expensive it is the better it works as a rule of thumb. But im glad first guy got his accuracies figured out!

[@deannalemburg10]

Give us viewers the caliber shells of ones you have on your left

[@bryanmiller6833]

Hey Ron question for u I picked up a 338 rum and I was wondering what would be a good round for elk for about 400 or 500 yards

[@jmgates09]

200gr accubond will do great

[@gsnicholas8522]

You’re 338 rum is more than adequate for elk at the distances you mentioned and beyond.

[@RonSpomerOutdoors]

Absolutely sufficient. And then some...

[@mqeqeshe1]

250 grain accubonds work great for me.

[@jameswalters4358]

I have a a 375 Jdj wildcat.

[@robertsebacher44]

7mm REM Mag with a 175 grain factory Ammo if you want to shoot a Elk across a valley and wrestle a grizzly for the carcass when you get there.

[@LilyRose-l6l]

416r

[@TheLPN05Fan]

Someone already said but that Thumbnail is LIT! Fantastic job there!

[@RonSpomerOutdoors]

Thanks. I gave our photographer strict directions to NOT photograph me with my shirt off. Darn.

[@mattevans-koch9353]

Back in 1980 I had a Thompson Center Contendor in 30-30 that I used for pistol silhouette shooting. What a fun single shot pistol. Shared barrels with my business partner who also had one and had barrels in .357 mag, .44 mag, 35 Rem and .22 LR. Thank you Ron for today's pod cast.

[@alpham777]

My grandfather had one of those I have some mighty damn fond memories shooting it with him. He had barrels in .22LR, .357mag, 44Mag and .30 Herrett (30-30 brass shortened). Anything inside of 150 yards was yours with it. It was the one shooting experience that opened up the rabbit hole to what was possible for me.

[@kevinsimonsii6605]

To answer your question Ron. In indiana we can use bottle neck cartridges on private land but have to use straight walled cartridges limited to 1.8 inch cartridge length on public land

[@garyglenn5233]

It's always fun to argue about which caliber is the best. Some people get downright defensive if you don't agree with their favorite. I've always been partial to the 270 Winchester because growing up that was dad's favorite caliber. I've owned and shot other people's rifles in a lot of calibers and in reality there's not that much difference between any of them when you are talking about ranges 300 yrds and less. If you look at a ballistic chart one caliber has a little more velocity or energy that makes it seem like it's way better than the others in its class, but in real hunting there's not enough difference to even notice. The 270,280 and 30-06 are so close in performance that it's silly to even argue about it. But it is fun. When people are always talking about taking 600 yrd shots, I'm always wondering why even take a shot that far. A quick look at the latest Pope and Young trophies should show you that you can take huge animals at very close range. I've never heard of a bow hunter talking a big 6×6 elk at 600 yrds and yet bow hunters take big trophies every year at about 35 yrds. If I ever get the chance to go on a guided hunt, I'm asking for a bow hunting guide for a rifle hunt. Then I'll just take dad's old 7×57 sporterized military rifle and get the meat. I don't have to have a long range setup in 338 or some other big Magnum. A 140 gr bonded 7mm bullet will do just fine thank you. I'm partially disabled so walking and packing out the meat is not an option. I'd rather go on a management cull hunt anyway. I much prefer a doe deer or cow elk to the biggest buck or bull with a rack like a pine tree on his head. Much better eating. I've let 6 pointers walk by and waited for the yummy doe . There's one deer around here that I couldn't pass up if I am ever lucky enough to see him again before he dies of old age. He's a non typical with the biggest rack that anyone that has ever seen him has ever saw. Even the one picture that was lucky enough to catch him on a trail cam isn't enough to count all of the points. His daddy was the same way. I saw him once about 20 years ago and never saw him again. Nobody is likely to ever kill the Grey Ghost because nobody ever managed to get his daddy, who we gave the same name to. But, I know where his bedroom is and nobody else does and I'll never tell a living soul. I really hope that he dies of old age too. That means more of his fawns will be born and hopefully his bloodline will be passed on for many years. But if I ever get a shot, I don't think I can resist taking him because he's definitely a record book buck. I want to take one big rack before I die. I've took so many 5 and 6 pointers over the years that I don't even want to kill another average buck. I'll just take spikes to fill my buck tag and all of the rest are gonna be does. Here in Watauga County NC we're way overpopulated with deer to the point that they're a driving hazard and they are wiping out people's gardens and yards. Most of the hunters are just after antlers and don't take many does. If CWD or Blue Tounge gets started it'll wipe out the entire population. It already happened a couple of counties over. Thankfully it make it here. I wish we had more hunters and that the ones we have would start taking does to reduce the population back down to a more manageable level. I don't know if it will happen, but they need to look at the big picture and start solving the problem before it's too late. I'm sure that the non profit food bank would be grateful.

[@danchristopher7957]

Just about the time I think I'm pretty knowledgeable, Ron puts me in my place... 👍

[@Vikingocazar]

😹😹😹right!!! He’s forgotten more than I’ll ever know!!

[@jarredlkling]

I'm building my first big boy rifle this year. Specifically for Colorado Elk and high elevation Goat, as well as Muel, Whitetail and Pronghorn. I'm using an old beat-up Winchester model 70 pre64. It's going to be blue printed and then glass pillar bed into a McMillan Hunter's edge carbon fiber stock wirh a custom lightweight aluminum two-piece trigger guard and magazine. It's going to use a Krieger #1 profile, 1 in 10 twist barrel & be chambered in 30-06. The stock & barrel are on order, about 11 months wait on both of those. The action is to be sent off and blueprinted sometime in the next month. I'm hoping to be able to take itout next season

[@warrengreen3217]

What you mean by blue printed

[@RonSpomerOutdoors]

Sounds like a great project. Best of luck.

[@fedup3582]

That contender cartridge sounds like the 358 JDJ, developed by JD Jones of SSK Industries. I would bet SSK could help you out there. I considered one years ago but went with the 375 JDJ. I used to remember all the specs but old age is taking its toll. The 358 JDJ was a 444 necked down to 35 caliber.

[@walkingcontradiction223]

Grew up with my father's hand me down 7mm Remington Mag.. Taken many a mule deer, elk and hog, works for me.

[@WillyK51]

358-444 Marlin. is basicaly a rimed 358 Win or a bit more powerful or equal than a 356 Win as far as case capacity, Guess you could shoot 356 Win in that gun. The 444 case is a bit longer, but when necked down about the same as the 356 Win. and if it won't fit a 356 Win reamer will do it and Google 356 Win Brass or ammo, also for 444 Marlin brass to form. They are available( Not so much 356 Win)

[@Tinman3187]

When I was a kid I would go to the range with the adults before elk season. Based on these practice shoots, I imagined the ideal elk cartridge would have to be delivered by a US Airforce strike aircraft. They had me patching targets at the 700 yard pit.

[@nicholasbarcomb2324]

280 AI for that guy looking for an elk rifle. Sky's the limit and can equal the 7mm Rem Mag with the right powder/bullet combination. Love mine and am moving into a 151 gr Hammer bullet for it. Good luck and stay safe!!! 😉😉😉

[@greasemonkey4god]

My son’s first rifle was a 6.5 creed in a mossberg patriot youth model. Wouldn’t stabilize factory 147gn bullets. Just an fyi

[@seanburns4632]

I have both 6.8 SPC with a 95 or 100 grain bullet works great on deer and same for the grendel the 120s kinda just punch a little hole without much damage in both my guns just what I have personal seen

[@ChrisMiano-cg7ll]

The SigCross is perfect for a kid to deer hunt. Lots of adjustments and light weight. A kid could easily grow into that rifle.

[@lmbear]

What, you don't have "accuracy"??? Oh, it's a bergara. That explains it..

[@pepepepito623]

Mr.Spomer builts something in/over fire. "Keels" rifle?!...

[@erronwilliams1431]

The guy with vanhorn needs to look up mark Hampton he hunts with pistol

[@leenevins8719]

I'm from Indiana and you can use high powered rifles in private land. If you hunt public its a different story. On public you are limited to shotgun. Muzzle loader, and some straight walled. I'm not sure of all the calibers you can use but I know for sure you can use a 450 bushmaster. At least that's what a game warden has told me. Love the videos and all the info from them. I look forward to the next one.

[@RonSpomerOutdoors]

Thanks Lee.

[@waynebrown2546]

neck tension, seating depth

[@tonydevich7937]

It's the rpm of the bullet

[@robertpettus6037]

Ron, can you go over whether it's the bullet length or bullet bearing surface that dictates a barrel twist rate? Thanks

[@RonSpomerOutdoors]

Bullet length.

[@robertpettus6037]

@@RonSpomerOutdoors how then do bullet manufacturers vary from others on twist rate recommendations with like weight and length bullets? It appears to be based on whether bullet has bands, like barnes ttsx, or a rebated boat tail reducing the bearing surface. I know bullets can loose stability in flight if it slows its spin enough to wobble but I can't help to think the bearing surface plays a part. I'm mainly referencing the Alco bullets with rebated boat tails being able to stabilize long bullets with a slower twist rate than others, just one example I can think of.

[@RonSpomerOutdoors]

@@robertpettus6037 Manufacturers vary based on bullet length. All copper bullets are longer for equal mass to lead cores, thus the differences there. Berger Bullets has an online twist rate/stability calculator at bergerbullets.com/twist-rate-calculator/. Note that inputs do not include bearing surface.

[@robertpettus6037]

@@RonSpomerOutdoors So bearing surface only really affects barrel wear and not the ability to impart twist and stability to the bullet. Thank you for the clarification and as always the wonderful videos.

[@Der-Oberst]

I think the best cartridge for Anything is the 300 Win Mag. Its able to take any game on the North American continent or Alaska. Available in many weights and types of projectiles. I traveled all over the USA and never found where it wasn't available. Just my option.

[@ChrisEdling]

So can 308

[@trevorkolmatycki4042]

This dropping all of the bullet’s retained energy into the animal with fragile expansion bullets thing is highly overrated IMO. I will take full penetration with high velocity fast expanding full weight retaining tipped copper monolithic bullets like the Barnes TTSX and LRX and the Hornady CX over tipped cup and core bullets any day. Strong blood trails from reliable exit wounds are an invaluable asset. Cheers!

[@warrengreen3217]

I get good groups with varget with multiple cals 30-06,308,303British,30-30,6.5creed all give good groups with varget powder

[@johnnyv.223]

AND, on the subject of twist-rates to stabilize projectiles, a very SHORT bullet(like a patch and ball that flies best with a 1/72" twist for example) requires a SLOWER twist rate to stabilize, just as a basketball flies very well with very little rotation.

[@glockparaastra]

In 308Win, 0.2gr intervals will work to fine-tune your load. Try Match primers from CCI or Federal. Lapua brass is the way to go. Starline is not great. Good quality seating Die is important too. Also, remember to FL size and bump that shoulder back 2-3 Thou. Viht-N140 is perfect. You can even try N540 as you have a short barrel.

[@joshawageorge2122]

Hey I never heard any mention of hydrostatic shock in which will drop a deer or moose where it stood .the hydrostatic shock will basically turn the guts to mush!

[@lisaannaallen6283]

do away with the burgers AND TRY A NOSLER BT if that does not work get someone else to reload for it "sell that gun"

[@charlesschenck911]

I got it! I understand! The bullet is "key holing".

[@stephencooper5040]

The tikka T3 compacts also come with spacers, as do the Savage compacts.

[@zechnarwilliams8019]

Yes they have to use straight wall cartridges in indiana.

[@randy129]

Ron that thumb nail is so hilarious.

[@trevorkolmatycki4042]

For the fellow John seeking cartridge options for deer with recoil lower than his 30-06… I think the ideal choices are: 6.5 Creedmoor 127gr LRX Or 7mm-08 REM 145gr LRX These will both recoil way less than a typical 30-06. The beauty of the 708 is that it is also Moose/Elk capable out to 350yd… so darn near as versatile as his 30-06. But if it is strictly for deer, why not go 6.5CM?… ultra low recoil and absolutely fully competent on deer at ethical ranges inside of 500yd. Compared to the 30-06 the 6.5CM recoil will feel heavenly, making precise shot placement and follow through easier and follow up shots faster. Cheers!

[@jmgates09]

I'd say that lrx in the Creedmoor will be nice on elk in 200to 300 range and 130 gr Terminal ascent will do work too

[@mickys4636]

Lpn05fan & davey j are the only ones taking about the important thing, OMG the thumbnail 😅😅 you legend Ron, love your videos but that made me watch it so much faster with a smile & laugh, awesome 👍

[@RonSpomerOutdoors]

All credit to Silas Pippitt, Red 11 Media, for that thumbnail.

[@JonRangel87]

That’s why I bought a 300 win mag, we’ll 2 of them. Designated big game rifle. I’ve seen people take elk with 6.5 cm but I’m second guessing it’s capability

[@lylewalters909]

For the guy buying his sons first deer rifle. I found the westherby youth is a great option. it comes with a extra stock you can switch to when he gets older. I have one for my youngest daughter, she is 4ft 8, by the way and no she won't be getting any taller. Hers is in 308 and the way the stock n rifle are designed she handles the recoil.with ease.

[@jmgates09]

Should of got her that 30-378.....lol just kidding

[@jmgates09]

308 is probably the greatest cartridge ever created

[@huntergainer2431]

Ron, i enjoy your videos and appreciate the knowledge. You do not talk about 7.62x39 much. I am seriously considering getting the ruger american ranch model in 7.62x39 for a multipurpose hunting rifle (whitetail, hogs,smaller varmints etc) within a max range of 300yds. its still pretty cheap to shoot as far as steel case target ammunition. my question is could you talk about the ballistics compared to say 30-30 or 350legend specifically hornady SST loads. Thank you

[@jmgates09]

I have one and it's a nice rig for whitetail I use winchester deer season xp shoots it .750 3inch groups not crazy about the bullet does alot of damage but my number 1 is the federal fusion 123 gr it doesn't shoot as good as the winchester round but it's 1moa most the time plenty good for hunting and 2 deer I've took with it complete pass through and very short tracking jobs 1 fell in 10 yards other ran 30ish and plenty of blood to track through the woods

[@RonSpomerOutdoors]

Hunter, because the 7.63x39 shoots the same bullet weights at same MV as the 30-30 but with sharp noses, they have significantly higher B.C.s, so will outperform the 30-30 at range.

[@huntergainer2431]

Thank you!

[@jfess1911]

Wow, you really blew it with the 6.8 SPC and 6.5 Grendel comparison. For hunting, they are pretty much identical. It is only for 500+ yard target shooting that the 6.5 Grendel really shows an advantage. The two cartridges have virtually the same case capacity, are nearly the same diameter (0.277" for the 6.8 SPC, 0.264" for Grendel), and typically use bullets in the same weight category. In barrels of the SAME LENGTH, the slightly higher chamber pressure and slightly larger diameter of the 6.8 SPC usually produces more muzzle energy.* Most of the hunting loads for the Grendel that I have seen use bullets in the 85-123 grain range, with the 129 grain being relatively less common. Probably the most popular factory hunting load for both are made by Hornady: a 120 grain SST for the 6.8 SPC and a 123 grain SST for the Grendel. There are currently more monolithic hunting bullets for the 6.8 than for the Grendel. and the monolithic 105 and 120 grain 6.8 SPCII loads sold by Cavity Back bullets are pretty impressive (and have taken Elk). *Most of the confusion about velocity of factory ammo comes from the SAAMI V&P (velocity & pressure) test method, which specifies a 16" barrel for the 6.8 SPC and a 24" barrel for the 6.5 Grendel.

[@RonSpomerOutdoors]

Thanks for the up-to-snuff info, J Fess.

[@daddysbees3698]

Howdy Ron. When are you going to get a bolt action in a 35 Whelen for yourself? They are so fine!!!!!