C1 kept cutting out every now and again, so I removed throttle body and deep cleaned it with carb cleaner. I filmed the process to capture the experience, and upload it to the toob specifically for your viewing pleasure.
Пікірлер: 126
@klashninez2 жыл бұрын
I just did mine and it wasn’t even as bad as in the video but the amount of difference it made is unbelievable! So much smoother and quieter. Recommend this to all bug owners lol.
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos2 жыл бұрын
Yes, made more difference than I expected. Not only to tickover but it’s actually smoother when driving a low rpms too.
@klashninez2 жыл бұрын
@@StupidBlokeStupidVideos definitely I agree with rpms it drops back way smoother
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos2 жыл бұрын
@@klashninez yes, definitely seems to.
@732daven10 ай бұрын
cleaned my 2007 C1 the same way with less than 60,000 Km. Was not too dirty. Many thanks, was very helpful
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos10 ай бұрын
Glad it helped. Thanks for watching
@trickywoo3562 жыл бұрын
Thanks for that vid mate, I'm gonna try this on my peugeot 106. It tends to start fine on a cold engine but once warmed up and I park the car somewhere to nip in and out of a shop for 5 minutes, it has problems starting and idling and I have to pump the throttle for a minute while running the starter motor to get it started. It's progressively getting worse too. I had a quick look at the inside of the throttle body and it doesn't look very dirty, at least not the flappy round valve bit, but I'll take out the sensors and give them a clean too like you did. Just waiting for my carb cleaner to arrive in the mail. Thanks again!
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos2 жыл бұрын
Let us know how you get on
@arnietwo112 жыл бұрын
Bien hecho amigo ! I degunked the inlet manifold of my beemer with oven cleaner then rinsed off with carb cleaner !! Worked a treat !!
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos2 жыл бұрын
That’s what I did with the with my 330d. Oven cleaner is good shit.
@anthonyenglish9298 Жыл бұрын
Great video, I’m gonna clean mine now, big thanks, way better than a Haynes manual!
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos Жыл бұрын
Thanks mate, hope it helps! Feel free to check out my other vids too if you’re after more CityBug related stuff 🤣
@flaviomarzocchi7444Ай бұрын
Nice work, very useful
@StupidBlokeStupidVideosАй бұрын
Thanks mate. Hope it helps
@voodoobantu7582 жыл бұрын
Thankyou for sharing that, top bloke 👍
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos2 жыл бұрын
You’re very welcome 😊
@michaelmccarron69762 жыл бұрын
Another great video!….as soon as I can rob some carb cleaner I’ll be under the bonnet for sure🤪
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos2 жыл бұрын
Unlike most of my videos, this one is actually worth doing 🤣
@matt91eoo2 жыл бұрын
FIRST! Thank you for sharing this!
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos2 жыл бұрын
You’re welcome lol
@garyphilpot73382 жыл бұрын
Hi fella did this last year but did not take that bit out on the fuel control unit, so gonna have a go in a couple of weeks and. Clean that out too
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos2 жыл бұрын
Yea the icv is well worth taking out I’d say.
@volt86842 жыл бұрын
Superb bro thanks will be doing daughters. Think those cars are such tough little machines, highly rate them very easy to work on. Thanks for these vids, great channel. Would have greased or oiled o ring on throttle cont valveand map
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos2 жыл бұрын
Cheers mate and yea they’re great cars, bulletproof and easy to work on!
@carolineyoung5487 Жыл бұрын
Oh, it again gang bang
@tedrobley15292 жыл бұрын
Top videos, 🙋♂️ I have a 2013 C1. When I rev it gently and let it go back to tic over. The whole Engine, cabin shakes for a second. I thought it was a engine mount but it’s more of a slight mis that’s causing it. If I hold paper to the exhaust pipe it’s sucking in slightly on tic over too. Maybe under powered slightly as well. I’m wondering if it’s all linked to this fault. So I’ll clean up the throttle body today and see how we go
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos2 жыл бұрын
Worth a try. Some very late mk1 model cars have an electronic throttle body iirc, so have a look at it before you take it off
@edarcher27992 жыл бұрын
hi ted, im wondering how did the throttle body clean up affected your issue of engine shaking after a gentle rev? or if you found any other cause for the issue? thanks
@flapsfalkland51812 жыл бұрын
See, i told you that it was your channel i watched and the videos were brill 🤣🤣
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos2 жыл бұрын
The height of automotive repair instruction?
@flapsfalkland51812 жыл бұрын
@@StupidBlokeStupidVideos of course! Not only do you show how to repair but you show it in an entertaining and useful way so that all city bug owners can save money by doing it themselves........👍👍
@Gourmondise2 жыл бұрын
Tim is an old school mechanic and I like the fact that he won't cut out a bit if swearing here and there. - as we all do when we fix cars. I caught myself today swearing at a car door that I was fitting. Needless to say the door was for a Pug 3008 and it is bulky and weighs a ton. Doing it alone was a challenge, but I learned that a brown food bin can be so handy to pack under the door, so you can put the door pins in place.
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos2 жыл бұрын
@@Gourmondise swearing at cars is a lifestyle choice.
@jilaniashraf88112 жыл бұрын
Hello sir I have Aygo 2008 model. Existing idle air control valve was always stalling . Installed a used IAC valve but it’s only fixed half of the job . This time doesn’t stalls but the reg keeps bouncing and sometimes it’s gets louder but when I turn the AC on it then balances it. I noticed someone has already been at the wires because someone had added a brown wire that’s been soldered. Toyota wants £1100 for the throttle body but I’m not sure what it could be . Any idea please
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos2 жыл бұрын
Which wire has been altered, to the throttle body? Sounds like you may have an air leak somewhere, maybe spray some break cleaner around the inlet and see if the revs change, if they do then it’s sucking it in. On a 2008 it should be cable throttle body, whole unit can be got used for about £30 so maybe worth a try?
@SkyeH78 Жыл бұрын
Is it right these cars don't have a cold start choke? Would cleaning these parts help with cold starting.
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos Жыл бұрын
They are automatically controlled. This controls the idle, so could help
@HandHaben2 жыл бұрын
must be a new pandemic for these C1s… mines just started to do this recently too! cheer again for another helpful (ish) video! 🤣
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos2 жыл бұрын
Hope it helped 👍
@saeed1akuk1 Жыл бұрын
Good clean
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos Жыл бұрын
Runs better too
@carolineyoung5487 Жыл бұрын
Tim, we had a pretend cheap head unit as what you’ve had in your car and Adam was in the process of removing it and he’s put a shower one. He tried it without it without plugging the speakers in and it was okay but we are going to have some lunch and Adam is going to see what Radio is a better another one or a top one, but I do want the standard Panasonic radio so I like the Panasonic Radio but we’ll have to do with Eva. I am FM one like what are the Panasonic Cornwall or adopt one?
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos Жыл бұрын
Panasonic are a good brand. I like pioneer the best personally. Pirate FM should sound alright on it though. Is pirate FM still a thing down there?
@carolineyoung5487 Жыл бұрын
@@StupidBlokeStupidVideos I don’t know when I was cheering when I TuneIn my preset when I have my citron C1 car radio allotment. If we don’t make it into Walkman I will check but it might not be because birds BBC radio 2BBC radio three radio four Jovic BBC, Leeds, BBC Humberside Amman BBC Radio 1 wild one classic FM why are one radio BBC radio York play assistance, radio York, North Yorkshire, capital UK and heart UK
@carolineyoung5487 Жыл бұрын
@@StupidBlokeStupidVideos but the only pirate radio station Tim is your loss. I think a pirate radio is BBC not BBC pretend to miss out for BBC. It’s Radio, Caroline and I forgotten which frequency broadcasts on boats. If you have still got that pioneer sound system in it would you like mine but has it button out because it’s not clicking and not want me back heated windscreen off ask your Mrs I don’t know who owns that black sea one now ask her or whoever owns that black citron so you can where are you live we can get someone to take it over to my reason why I can’t get pirate radio is because we’re in York and we were in North Yorkshire on the radio station locally of North Yorkshire I don’t know why are you can get it over here in North Yorkshire there’s a radio station on FM and one on the a BVD a B1 is York mix Radio why okay am I XRID, I O, and then there’s one in one in York, but this one is on only available over here on FM. It is Jovic Radio I know it’s spelt with a J but we pronounce it as Jorvik instead of Jarvik it it said on my dad‘s Ford Fiesta car radios it said on the radio screen Jovic 94.8 FMCD one and if we do make my citron C1 car radio gonna I’ve got into a woman, are you give a black citron to me so I can muck about in it and I might have a Volkswagen Polo car radio so if I hadn’t of been in my mucking about citron C1, I will collect the citron C1 Zlatan walkabout with all have a heater controls on the radio and I might be able to take what it has a might be able to take all of it out what powers it, including the radio the speakers I don’t know where the speakers are and Tim, I don’t know if you can drive where in North Yorkshire and you’re near Manchester I think so you might have to drive hold on a minute. Let me just ask Alexa oh wait sorry Tim I had to use Alexa‘s leads to charge one of my Nannie And Grandad‘s iPads up. I’m charging Grandad is up so I think it’s 35 miles I think from where you live to North Yorkshire, I don’t know and I can keep that Radio win so I can use all of the powered stuff to power mine or I can put mine in and take that one out because if it has the air-conditioning button I’ll be so great full when I see it I will be so so shocked and sorry if you see a white and black DAB radio if you bring it over I’ll be here at one priors walk 39 Shirley Avenue, York YO26 5NJ. Sorry for giving Nannie Wilsons street address code. I don’t know what it means. I don’t know why that’s why artists 65NJ. I don’t know but I will be either at 39 Kelly Avenue, one prize walk or 14 Moritz close and I’ll 14 March close is where I live and for two what I announced before 14 Mark Clause is one priors walk and 39 Shirley Avenue of us two places, as where I stay so one prize walk is my grandad‘s house GYOJY not JGJY sorry JYMSYO 39 Shirley Avenue is my Nannie Wilsons how the house belongs to PWNO no you don’t know what PWSP is very very short for Pauline MW is Wilson Nannie Wilson and to make notes on this cough, but my TANINNEC. Think it’s bells Nannie spell mummy mummy is MANNA0 thanks Adam Tim hold on I’ll just go into my app called Phone and see how it’s spelt sorry Tim it’s NRN sorry MANNIERI don’t know why I spelt Nannie wrong but I’m a silly Billy Wang Wang. Would you know what you’re first I don’t know how we don’t know we didn’t know what’s your name is name was so we called you wanna bombard and your actual name is called Tim And same reason why I want your your black citron you can keep your blue one reason why I want to vote, black one I can say that black just came out as that that that Aunty if it has air-conditioning, that will be absolutely brilliant because I might be in there all day, invert most of the day in the car and if I think you might have to drive it maybe Emma after come and live in the North Yorkshire area so we can get rid of you by you put my phone number into your phone and saving it is minus my initials BY and I’ll put yours and then Tim and then tea and then your last night last name when you drive it to Nannie Wilsons and you can phone my school what am I now what I’m still at until July or June I think it’s I don’t know what time I leave Karen Junior, but you can phone up car Junior and say sorry, Brendan is never there inform the police and my headteacher Mr would have a very very hot bottom and I will connect my phone up with. I would have to get my own like little adapter for iPhone is where you can like change it from USB to auxiliary. I’ll plug it in via real jewelry cable and plug it in via plugged in, it’s N23 auxiliary input on the car radio and plugging it in Siri like I don’t like little adapter so we would start off. I would have re-tribute to Absolute radio 1215 And the message will be playing van then move onto the funny ones I have ee‘s very very very very very very very very very very very very funny hilarious versions of Peppa Pig. No Peppa Pig is a cartoon movies ones would make you laugh so much that your needs a monster energy drink to keep you warm to keep you awake because I’ve always sound effects sound including the farting warm will make us oh for heads off and I am and Tim 00000 what happened to him? If you’re driving when you’re driving on a citron C1 to Nannie they both live on the bridge Road one is on priors walk/who’s acres and one is on is burn/Shirley Avenue so it’ll be only a few minutes only a few minutes drive only a five minute one of traffics not that bad but a 10 minute walk to traffic is quite congested on Barbridge Road and I would set all my presets up and I won’t be able to pick it up, but I’ll turn the car off work for about a few seconds or only one minute or something and I don’t know if a citron C1 car Radio is live when you tell me your favourite live or not I’ll have to have a key in the recognition only on accessory skip the radio to work and I will know how to get the standard stereo out and we will talk about it and you’ll talk about it okay to him why couldn’t you use them sound affects like bum bow wow And oh no how to put how to remove a standard stereo and then put another standard stereo in its advert, the aerial is only a short one, if only it can be sort of longer so where I’ll be sat, I can walk right as I said earlier take all of the internals what can make it work for music on that one of the first ever ever ever I knew Radio closure I’ll get my phone and record it only because down message, where is just the computer voice telling you what is three children and then it would go silent until repeat it self I think it would be BBC Radio 5 live online or 9KHZ a.m.
@carolineyoung5487 Жыл бұрын
@@StupidBlokeStupidVideos where are you pirate radio station what is not a pirate radio station but what is called a pirate radio station over here in North Yorkshire is Viking Viking FM
@carolineyoung5487 Жыл бұрын
0:53 0:53 0:53
@paddrivers2 жыл бұрын
Good idea telling the world yer teefin carb cleaner!
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos2 жыл бұрын
The best thing is, my boss watches my videos sometimes lol.
@flaviomarzocchi74442 ай бұрын
Where i can buy this idle valve spare?
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos2 ай бұрын
I don’t think it’s available, I’d probably buy a complete new throttle body from a breakers
@szuak2 жыл бұрын
Just wondering: how long was the whole process?
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos2 жыл бұрын
Without filming, whole job can probably be done in less than half an hour I reckon 🤔
@davidB997 Жыл бұрын
I have a later 2012 Aygo with the electronic throttle followed your guide and cleaned throttle body, sensor etc but car still stutters at low idle any other suggestions on how to get the car to idle smoother/pick up better when you accelerate? Thanks as always. D
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos Жыл бұрын
In my other vids there’s one for the VVT solenoid and also looking for a misfire, but they aren’t the smoothest engine to start with lol
@peribsennesachbit702110 ай бұрын
Will you ever make a video about cleaning the intake manifold?
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos10 ай бұрын
Maybe, but as far as I’m aware they’re not really known to be an issue at clogging up
@peribsennesachbit702110 ай бұрын
I was thinking about preventive cleaning, maybe there is some carbon deposits after a few years of use.
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos10 ай бұрын
@@peribsennesachbit7021 possibly from then pcv valve depending where it enters the inlet 🤔
@garyphilpot73382 жыл бұрын
Hi fella how ya doing, I need a couple of your stickers to put on my back side windows
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos2 жыл бұрын
I’ll have a look if I’ve got any left when I’m back in work pal 🙂
@itaiitai896011 ай бұрын
will it correct the car response to pedal ?
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos11 ай бұрын
It can sometimes do this yes
@StechaReal2 жыл бұрын
Good vid mate If that doesnt cure it, renweing the inlet gasket / o-ring probably will - it is quite awkward to do Did it on mine and it seemed to help, wish I'd done the idle control at the same time, but, didnt think of it
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos2 жыл бұрын
Yea air leaks are a common cause of bad idle. Injector o-rings can cause it too. I filmed this a couple of weeks ago and it’s been bang on since. What I didn’t mention in the video cos I hadn’t really driven it by the end of filming it, is how much smoother it is at low revs when driving too.
@StechaReal2 жыл бұрын
@@StupidBlokeStupidVideos Mine is pretty good uo to around 2000 odd revs and then can be flat as a fart after., especially on gradients. so, did the injector upgrade make any difference to yours ?
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos2 жыл бұрын
@@StechaReal injector upgrade did make a noticeable difference for me, even without mapping them in. It’s still slow as fuck though. Is yours flat as in just how they are, or is it broken?
@StechaReal2 жыл бұрын
@@StupidBlokeStupidVideos Pretty sure just flat, not broken I didnt realise you had to map them in
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos2 жыл бұрын
@@StechaReal you don’t have to map them in, I haven’t had mine mapped in and still make a noticeable difference. It is most noticeable at the lower end of the rev range. To get the most of them you’d want them mapping in though, that’s the same with most mods though. I’ve got a few other mods to do on mine and then once done I’m hopefully going to get it mapped. Nothing too fancy, just basic stuff to see how much difference it makes more than anything else lol
@AngeIblack19952 жыл бұрын
hi i have an annoying problem in my citroen C1, every time i take a hole the rear glass makes an annoying noise. Do you know how I can solve this problem?
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos2 жыл бұрын
The tailgate or the rear pop windows? I’m pretty sure the latch on the tailgate can be adjusted a little bit iirc, but the opening where the rubber seal sits on is easy enough to bend outwards a bit to make the tailgate sit against it tighter. Can take the seal off, then just accurately and precisely twat it outwards a bit with a wooden block. As long as you get it within 1/10th of a mm all the way round, it should be ok 🤷♀️
@AngeIblack19952 жыл бұрын
@@StupidBlokeStupidVideos yes yes the tailgate, i will try with your tips 🤞
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos2 жыл бұрын
@@AngeIblack1995 let us know how you get on
@alinvasile31272 жыл бұрын
Hello,i have a Daihatsu Sirion from 2009,with this engine 1kr-fe.I clean the throttle body and the idle control valve and after i refitted,and start the engine he start with 2000rpm and after a few second droped to 1500.When the engine get the normal temperature the idle speed stailized at 1000-1100 rpm.What have i done wrong? Is any metod to learn or reser the idle speed? Thank you!
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos2 жыл бұрын
Make sure there’s no air leaks anywhere. Sounds like it’s drawing air in where the throttle body mounts to the inlet manifold
@alinvasile31272 жыл бұрын
@@StupidBlokeStupidVideos Thank you for reply.I manage to resolve the problem,i remount again the idle control valve and seems to be ok now.The idle stay at around 800-850 rpm.
@boulton45510 ай бұрын
Hiya mate. Ive done a few bits to the 107 this week. Changed plugs, air filter, oil filter, oil change, coolant change, and new mani/cat. Things looked good for a few days. Then, its going downhill since. First issue started as whats possibly happening in this video. Id turn the key, engine would start, but really rough, then die a second later. Turn the key off and back on again, it would start perfect. It would only really happen on the first start up of uhe day. Now today, its decided it doesnt like to start. It will start, but it struggles a bit first. Then once started, the idle is a bit rough and it seems like it wants to stall at points. Would cleaning the throttle body help this, or do you think i need to look at something else? Thanks mate.
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos10 ай бұрын
It could help it, but I’d look at your plugs and coils first. It could be a faulty plug you’ve fitted, or one that’s been dropped and the gap closed up. I did a vid on how to find out which one is the problem, I’ll find it and post a link.
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos10 ай бұрын
This will probably help mate kzbin.info/www/bejne/gp6YoqOEpMuWqbssi=VAIMzTJj8p9NX_a2
@boulton45510 ай бұрын
@@StupidBlokeStupidVideos funnily enough I've just been watching a bunch of your vids and did see that one. If it was the plugs, wouldn't the issue have happened straight away after I changed them? I've had about a week of good starting after changing the plugs, before this issue came up. Been reading everything on Google that I could find. Could another possible cause be the stater motor? I'm not getting most of the symptoms of a bad starter, but I am getting a long crank time before the engine starts, and the interior lights dim during cranking. Sorry for the questions, I'm not very mechanically minded, I just like to tinker. Thanks again mate
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos10 ай бұрын
@@boulton455 it could happen at any time really. It could be something as fluky a bad plug that was just about ok until it got a bit fowled up, or a bad coil/connection to a coil. That’s the area I’d be leaning towards cos it’s something that’s been disturbed recently and could give the symptoms you described. The ICV valve and throttle body can also give those symptoms, but it’s not likely to come on all of a sudden if it’s just dirty. More likely to get gradually worse over time. I definitely noticed a big difference after craning mine out though.
@boulton45510 ай бұрын
I didn't pull the plugs, but just checked the coils. All 3 seem good. They're all sparking the same, and the engine behaves the same as I pull each of them. So it seems it's not the coils. Could it still be the plugs, or would that have shown when pulling the coils? I didn't pull the clips like you did, I lifted the whole coil. I could hear each one clicking as the spark jumps the gap. They all seemed to click the same speed and volume. And the engine got just as lumpy with each coil pulled. The starting seemed easier this morning. So the struggling might start once the engine warms up. Does that point you in any particular area to check next?
@garyphilpot73382 жыл бұрын
Do ya still have a couple of stickers I can use on my side back windows
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos2 жыл бұрын
Yes course mate. Send me your address to the Insta or fb page. I knew someone has messaged me about one but I couldn’t find the message.
@garyphilpot73382 жыл бұрын
@@StupidBlokeStupidVideos can't find your name on fb what is it on there
@mktnv6371 Жыл бұрын
Can you link the products you use : )
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos Жыл бұрын
No links as only really used basic tools and some carburettor cleaner which I got from a local shop. Brake cleaner should work too, but carb cleaner is a bit stronger
@Dark-Lord33862 жыл бұрын
Did it work?
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos2 жыл бұрын
It did, very well.
@benclark48562 жыл бұрын
Easy bud are u in oldham?? England I have a c1 and I'm struggling to find the issue 😫 it's killing me I can't explain the issue only show u in a video wondering if you could plz help me
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos2 жыл бұрын
I’m in oldham but I don’t usually work on other peoples cars. What’s wrong with it?
@benclark48562 жыл бұрын
@@StupidBlokeStupidVideos mate I have zero clue iv changed injector and now there's no codes and it's running starts up but at idle it shaking and jittering like it's trying to catch spark I'm so confused
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos2 жыл бұрын
@@benclark4856 sounds like possibly coil issue. You could try unplugging them one by one. The one that makes the least difference is the likely culprit. The start swapping bits to see if the fault moves to another cylinder
@benclark48562 жыл бұрын
@@StupidBlokeStupidVideos cheers bud will this still work with a diesel hdi mate ??
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos2 жыл бұрын
@@benclark4856 no mate didn’t realise it was a diesel. Have you checked injector seals. Little copper washers on the injector. They can cause all kinds of weird shit to happen
@MShah-ch6st7 ай бұрын
This car if well maintained, can easily reach over 300,00km.
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos7 ай бұрын
Yes, these engines are pretty bulletproof
@stoglegend Жыл бұрын
Have you flocked the dash 😂😂😂
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos Жыл бұрын
I tried to… kzbin.info/www/bejne/rpnMkqh4qKeAjas
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos Жыл бұрын
And then I made another vid trying to fix it haha kzbin.info/www/bejne/qpjEhKhtm7WKaNU
@stoglegend Жыл бұрын
@@StupidBlokeStupidVideos 😂😂😂😂 I'll watch it later . Mine really doesn't like to go into reverse gear atm, any ideas ?
@carolineyoung5487 Жыл бұрын
Car
@userbasba Жыл бұрын
AND! I think you should invest in a forehead camera. :):)
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos Жыл бұрын
I had one but I couldn’t aim it properly 😂
@userbasba Жыл бұрын
@@StupidBlokeStupidVideos Well, m8, we can only do ONE thing with one hand. 😉😉
@muhammadabdulalim30332 жыл бұрын
hehhe i asked about the injectors
@StupidBlokeStupidVideos2 жыл бұрын
You did, have you got a set in yours yet?
@muhammadabdulalim30332 жыл бұрын
@@StupidBlokeStupidVideos sadly don’t have the car yet but will probably be the first thing i do
@tobywood17332 жыл бұрын
@@StupidBlokeStupidVideos I’m considering it when I can get me hands on some