C5 & C6 Brake Upgrade Options (Using Only Factory C6 Corvette Parts!)

[@DirtDude117]

I've been tracking and autocrossing C5's since 2008 and want to give people some tips. C5/C6 Calipers are the same Piston Diameter but have different brackets for the C6 Z51. The C6 Calipers in the REAR as he went over have a smaller inner diameter for brake bias to avoid ice mode in the C6 The C6 FRONT Caliper is stiffer than the C5 AND has better wheel clearance. The C5 will dissipate heat better though The C5 Rotors are CHEAPER than the C6 and the directional vanes are more effective with the C5 aero and brake ducts. The C6 being a front breather also has more volume of air thru the ducts and better directing. The omni-directional vanes will have higher rotor temps than the C5 Directional vanes on a C6 or C5. The C6 rotor hats are beefier to help prevent cracking the hat but if your rotor cracks its from the outside in usually. For the C5 you can do just the C6 J55/HD/Z51 sized rotors and bracket to get the benefits of the rear rotor. The ABS system will not need the smaller diameter piston from the brake kit. The C6 rotors up front are technically an upgrade, but the Z51 rotors and C5 calipers do not clear all 17" wheels and the C6Z51 Calipers have better clearance, but it's TIGHT! C6 Z06/Grand Sport Brakes are not worth it. The pads are more costly and less efficient. The Padlets wear unevenly and cause odd wear to the rotor as well. They do also have wheel clearance issues. Just buy the Willwood or AP Racing 4 Piston Kit and be happy with better brakes, bigger pads, and more compound options.

[@swiftripper7557]

So what would you reccomend for a cost effective setup for rotors that won't crack? Is there a such thing? Trying to get it figured out for my daily which I plan to do hpde and autocross in.

[@Toys4Life]

Interesting, thanks for mentioning this. I did some research on the subject & I wouldn't be too worried about upgrading knuckles unless someone was becoming a very skilled track rat with very good tires and was producing a ton of heat (and extra forces due to very good track tires) with C6 Z06 Brakes or better(bigger). For street or even low level track I think this is a non issue.

[@Toys4Life]

Anything can crack - I keep hearing use solid decent rotors and choose the right pad.

[@DirtDude117]

@@swiftripper7557 Sorry for the delay, no notification. I'd recommend getting the C5 FRONT rotor rings from KNS Brakes & match them to C6 Calipers to stay in Stock Classing. For the rear using the C6Z51/HD/J55 Caliper MOUNT only with C6 Z51 Blank Rotors from Rock Auto that are NON-DRILLED & NON-SLOTTED and fairly inexpensive. You will likely not be called out for using Corvette Calipers of the same size and Corvette Rotors of stock size. The C6HD Rear Bracket and larger rotor MAY get you moved out of a class if you go to Nationals or have "that guy" call you out. Getting some C5 Stainless steel brake lines for HDPE is a requirement, and a 4 year consumable. I'd recommend KNS brake Shims & possibly DRM Stainless Front Pistons (especially if DIY Rebuilding used C6 front calipers) to ensure you get the most life out of the pads & keep the heat from the calipers and fluid. When you get REAL deep into HPDE or are in non A/B-Street Classing, upping the front brake Calipers to Willwood 6 Pistons (Spec Vette) or AP Racing 8350x32s are great cost effective setups. The AP Fit under 17" wheels where the Willwoods need high clearance 18" wheels. Most C5Z06 Autocrossers also run a 18x9.5 C6 wheel as a cheap Autocross front wheel where the track guys run 4 C5Z06 rear wheels all around. I found it most cost effective to also run 4 C5Z06 Front Wheels square to abuse the 255/40R17 tire options and prices.

[@DirtDude117]

@@Toys4Life I'm not going to come on the internet and say I'm a skilled driver, but I have won RAW-Fastest Time of Day (FTD) at Autocross in a A-Street C5Z06 (with C6 brakes and seat frames to be fair) & usually have a top 5 time at the semi-local HPDE and Time Trials events. I say this with 14k of logged miles at events & I have not broken a knuckle yet. That's more of a "when yours breaks, get the C6 one" or for drifters who use angle kits. Even running 18x11.5 wheels square on A052s (Basically Hoosiers) I have not encountered knuckle fatigue. Making sure your wheel bearing+hub doesn't have play & your ball joints are good is half the battle. Installing ball joints properly is another thing.... But for brakes, like you said a quality blank rotor & good pad for your use case is all you need. IF YOU DON'T TRACK YOUR CAR get Autocross Pads at most. Stick to a Low-Dust and Low-Noise pad to make your life cleaner and easier.

[@TacticalEagle29]

Can't wait for the "video for another time" on aftermarket brakes!

[@JWsGarage]

I went C6 Z06 front and rear on my C5 been a great upgrade for over a decade, trouble free.

[@Toys4Life]

eBay parts or where did you get them??

[@JWsGarage]

@@Toys4Life eBay parts. Best place to shop.

[@bat5917]

Do they require a larger diameter wheel?

[@JWsGarage]

@@bat5917 yes they do.

[@JWsGarage]

@johnnykay727 that’s a good question because I have seen them break and a lot of em. to my knowledge there is not a HD spindle / knuckle for the corvette platform their the same on all C5 and C6 models. Please correct me if that’s not correct. But Otherwise yes every single component on my car has been replaced and or updated my spindles have been Tig welded to beef them up in specific areas, I rebuild it all every 30-40k miles, & I run a HD racing wheel bearings. Go to the channel and check it out it’s my black C5 Z06 / Targa 👈 “not a typo” street legal track car.

[@chrismunos7741]

I have a brand new set of CTS 4 piston calipers and also a set of CTS-V 6 piston calipers. The 6 piston calipers were a direct fit on my 4th gen Camaro and as soon as I get free time I'll be test fitting them on my 2005 Z-51 C6. The rotors measure 14.25" and are also finned as the ones you showed, as well as drilled. The 4 piston calipers are obviously smaller but either would be an upgrade over the Z-51 dual piston calipers. I'm really hoping GM kept all the same dimensions on both car platforms. The CTS-V setup is massive. they take a MINIMUM 18" diameter wheel that's compatible with big brakes, and even that is a razor thin fit.

[@DHenry-cs8up]

J55 Cross Drilled Rotors were standard on C6 Corvettes with Mag Ride.

[@margaretmesacortez2421]

I am grateful for all of the information given. I am slowly learning about my C5 and what to ask whenever i need to take her in for any problems and check-ups. Thank you for explaining the brake systems of both the C5 and C 6. ❤❤❤😊😊😊

[@danlaur7973]

The J56 brake option was also standard on the 2013 427 convertible

[@Firebert79TA]

I've worked as an engineer for two different aftermarket companies that dealt with Corvette brakes. Both companies treated the (smallest) base front C6 brakes as interchangeable with the front C5 brakes. The directional rotor vents do make a difference and usually flow and cool better. The non-directional pillar vane alternatives can also flow well, but at the cost of strength. It's much easier to crack a pillar vane rotor than a directional vane rotor that has more metal holding the two sides of the disc together. The pillar vane rotor was likely strengthened to try to account for this relative disadvantage. If you want to track your car, look to an aftermarket kit from a good brand like StopTech or AP Racing (as supplied by Essex). A stiff caliper with good friction and a floating 2 piece rotor makes a huge difference. Do not track a Z06 or Grand Sport with the stock padlets. The padlets taper rapidly and create really bad knock back. Use one-piece pads or get an aftermarket big brake kit. From a road course lapping perspective, the stock brakes are one of the biggest weak points on these cars.

[@Toys4Life]

Appreciate your thoughts! Any thoughts about the very intentional difference in the rotor hats between the C6 base and C5 rotors?

[@Firebert79TA]

@@Toys4Life Other than the cost-saving pillar vanes, the C6 rotor is an improved design. The shape of the metal between the hat and the friction rings is less prone to warp the friction plates out of position when expanding at higher temperatures. That means less knock back and a firmer pedal when the brakes are hot. The C6 rotor is heavier, which I think is from both the different shape and more thermal mass in the friction plates.

[@zedrone7975]

GM found one of the larger warranty expenses on C5 was the brakes, so when C6 was being developed they made sure that problem was fixed.

[@davidncw4613]

cool great channel. looking foreward to the aftermarket vid.

[@Toys4Life]

Thanks 👍

[@joels6736]

I have been very happy with the factory c5 z06 calipers. I replaced the rotors with wilwood 2-piece rotors, pads with Hawk HPS, and stainless steel lines. I have R-rated Nt01's all around and if I stomp the brakes the ABS goes off and the car skids. I'm not sure how a bigger brake is going to make my car brake faster if my current brakes can already exceed the grip of 100 tread wear sticky tires.

[@Toys4Life]

In my view Bigger C5 brakes are about handling higher heat loads without fading. Or drilled & slotted for bling.

[@darrylsjodin7184]

You are sure a big help to all of us! Thank you! Maybe the C5 brake engineers thought the parts common to all C5’s would not need to be upgraded for the Z06 because of the addition of brake cooling ducts that the Z06 has?

[@Toys4Life]

Thank you & good point!

[@ctvette1318]

Very informative video! I’ve got the J55s on mine and they’ve been great. Couple years ago was planning the zo6 brake upgrade and ordered the front calipers. My god are they huge in person/in your hands. I returned them as I didn’t want that much weight sprung on all 4 corners. Plus I never track the car so don’t really need them.

[@rodb8274]

I have a stock C5. I like the look of the smaller 17” wheels and would like to keep them. You mentioned that all C6 calipers and rotors will fit a C5. But what is the largest front caliper that will fit under a 17” wheel?

[@doug.s6289]

Agreed C5 vs C6 rotors may help heat transfer in C6 but check the weight and rotational inertia as C6 seem better for both. Also brake "upgrades" are most meaningful of value for $ if the stopping distances improve as well as resistance to heat fade....and other concerns on the track. Stopping distance comparison would be useful to know in deciding to upgrade brakes. Sometimes pad changes alone are a big improvement. Besides costly, carbon fiber brakes have definite issues for daily simple (not track) driving.

[@Toys4Life]

Good points!

[@jimipuffit]

This is a great precursor to hopefully the inevitable aftermarket video! put some wider forgestar f14's on my c5 and the stock brakes look so little! definitely would like to beef them up but dont want to pay the crazy price for c6 z06 brakes.

[@labf5213]

I would love to hear a good value brake upgrade for the C5 while maintaining 17” front wheels and 18”rear. Good value meaning no Wilwood or brembo lol. Something you can street go to HPDE events.. thank you in advance

[@swiftripper7557]

Exactly what I've been trying to figure out. Hawk hp+ pads look perfect, but still can't find a good rotor setup without getting reccomended to step up to atsv calipers. Just want to find a rotor that is going to work and not worry about cracking

[@nautilaz]

I've got a z51 and only done back road mountain use so far. Good brakes, stop good and no fade, but I'm more concerned with how to cool them if i get on track.

[@firstlast-yn4qg]

Shrake and bake upgrade

[@TJsVette]

You already had both tires off, you should have swapped them and then you would have known for sure if it could be done lol. Good video none the less.

[@Toys4Life]

I know, you're correct. Problem is this video took way way longer to make and I simply ran out of time. I would have wanted to switch them both over spread the brake pads tighten everything up and test drive it just to be sure and I just didn't have the extra time. That having been said, measuring the offsets and from everything I've read they are interchangeable. Damn production deadlines!

[@TJsVette]

​@Toys4Life it's all good man, I was just giving ya hell lol. Keep up the good work! BTW love it when you use my hometown sheriff's corvette in the videos haha.

[@Toys4Life]

Can you organize a review video, so you and I can test drive it? 😁

[@TJsVette]

@@Toys4Life I would be totally down!

[@chancec2259]

Whats the smallest rear wheel size i can run with JL9 brakes?? My c6 may have a bent wheel. Thinking about buying new wheels/tires soon and i want to run a drag pack. I hear 17s fit fine?

[@Toys4Life]

Not sure - front C5 stock rim for sure, but not sure how much smaller.

[@browningbelgium2326]

Are you saying the brakes for the C6 Z06 is harder to find or the calipers, rotors, and brakes combined?

[@Toys4Life]

I am saying that finding a good set of C6 Z06 brackets, calipers and rotors in a package to convert a C5 or C6 that does not already have these brakes is getting much harder than it used to and more $$$.

[@browningbelgium2326]

@@Toys4Life Ah-ha! I get you now. I own a C6 Z and got a bit concerned. Thanks!

[@C5Zthings]

At least the c5z had the brake ducts

[@rapid13]

C6 Z51 brakes should be included in the non-base group.

[@Toys4Life]

Not sure what you mean - J55 = Z51/H.D. Brakes.

[@rapid13]

@@Toys4Life Sorry, my fault: I meant at the open when you showed the Z06, GS, and ZR1.

[@Toys4Life]

Oh, I see what you mean. Yeah I probably should have mentioned it there so I would say you're right sir!

[@rapid13]

@@Toys4Life Love the channel!

[@matthorvath7562]

Times werent good for gm during the c6's production run lol.

[@kanishkakasturi2798]

Is your c6 is co6

[@Toys4Life]

?

[@kanishkakasturi2798]

@Toys4Life i mean z06

[@Toys4Life]

Gotcha - no, mine is not a Z06, just a regular coupe.

[@rapid13]

And is there any actual evidence of this drilled rotor thing? I don’t buy it. Every sportbike on the planet, including the top tier Superbikes, uses drilled rotors with zero issues. There’s no reason for drilled rotors to suddenly become an issue with these cars after 15 years.

[@Toys4Life]

There's more evidence than you can shake a stick at., it's not even close just Google it and do some searches on reputable websites. Sport bikes use them but they're power to weight ratio is so different, Corvettes are much more abusive to the rotor. Plus the rotor holes were drilled years ago when the brake pads had adhesives and whatnot that would off gas and the holes help the air escape which is no longer needed. I see where you're coming from, I like everybody to be skeptical, but this one is absolutely a fact for serious track use. For street use, they're fine but track use is not the same animal.

[@rapid13]

@@Toys4Life Here’s the thing, boss: it’s not on me to do the research. Not trying to be a dick, but you made the claim, you should provide the evidence. Also, I must have missed the caveat of the ones cracking being the original rotors. Didn’t occur to me you were talking about old gear, sorry.

[@gotmylk]

The original rotors on C5s never came slotted or drilled. And Ken is correct. It's been known for decades that slotted and drilled rotors are more prone to cracking. Hence the reason NASCAR doesn't use them.

[@rapid13]

@@gotmylk Who said anything about the C5? And do you have a source for that NASCAR claim?

[@Toys4Life]

www.tirerack.com/upgrade-garage/can-i-use-drilled-brake-rotors-on-the-track