Calgary VS Oulu - WINTER Safe Cycling Showdown | Collab with

[@Jompe69]

I'm from Oulu and I can confirm that this was a really fair and NOT a cherry picked image of bicycling in Oulu. Especially as Pekka went through city centre (which is the worst part of Oulu to bike). From like 26 minutes and further is what most of the Oulu's bike paths look like really. Bike paths through the forest and next to public parks is what I have bicycled since I was a kid. To school, to a grocery store, to work etc

[@AssBlasster]

Downtown is the worst? That sounds like a nice problem to have. I live in the downtown of my US city because it's the only place with bike infra....

[@Littleweenaman]

@@AssBlasster any bike infrastructure at all is welcome in a U.S. city usually y’all we get is rail trails or a greenway in a random park that doesn’t connect to anything

[@AssBlasster]

@@Littleweenaman Sounds about right. I use any separated or protected bike path that I can, even if it causes a delay in my commute.

[@SirHeinzbond]

hi iam living in switzerland and want to ask, i heard Pekka talking about Saöt and the not usage... Wondering how it work with wet snow but i guess you have not that kind of snowfall very often

[@Kristofburger]

@@SirHeinzbond The city doesn't use much road salt, but the national highway running through gets salted when the temperature hovers around freezing point. Spillage from bicycle underpasses gets spread around in bike tires, which occasionally creates conditions where the snow-packed surface gets slightly mushy.

[@kimberleemodel7182]

I think the juxtaposition of "pickup truck murder machines" and "oh noes the bus stop is on the wrong side of the path" makes for a funny and succinct description of Calgary and Oulu.

[@GreenJimll]

I laughed when you went over the bridges and complained that they were 40 years old and too narrow, as I'd already watched Tom complement Oulu on the number of wide cycling & pedestrian bridges. 🙂

[@PekkaTahkola]

Ha, I totally understand it 😅 But think about it this way - driving on a highway that just suddenly narrows down by 30% just for a bridge because there wasn't enough budget (or will) to widen that single spot.

[@jasonriddell]

@@PekkaTahkola that happens in Canada often and sometimes 2 lanes compress to one and back up to 2 once the bridge is passed

[@jasonriddell]

would also point out the LEVELS of traffic those bridges HANDLE during "rush hour" and I can imagine they are congestion points

[@kalebhaugen5084]

14:02 -2 “Attempted murder” 😂 so true. Some cyclists in my city have 1 metre flexible poles attached to the side of their bikes with lights/reflectors on the end to encourage safer passing.

[@PekkaTahkola]

It's so sad and just unbelievable that we have to resort to such means just to be able to stay alive on our daily trips from A to B 😥😤

[@Daniel-hj8el]

Yeah Kaleb, it's actually called punishment pass. Maybe. 😅

[@tossedman]

I live in Calgary and agree 100% with your score Pekka. I think Tom is just accustomed to riding through all of the hazards here and didn't score as hard as he could have. Oulu looks like a fantastic place to ride, summer or winter. Thanks for sharing.

[@PekkaTahkola]

Thanks!

[@georgeg7840]

I found Tom’s rating a bit more objective but I may be biased. Here in Montreal the cycling infrastructure is similar to Calgary’s, the biggest difference being the slightly more cycling friendly attitude of people which is probably due to more European like culture.

[@kostiemuirhead8187]

@@georgeg7840 If you haven't had the "Pleasure" of biking in Calgary - Tom spends most of his time in a comparatively extremely and excessively bike friendly part of the city compared to the rest of what we have here (the exception was a similar video he did that had me scratching my head as to why he chose to ride McLeod Trail when there was a much safer parallel route that wouldn't have been any further). In many cases, this city is downright hostile to pedestrians and cyclists.

[@matthewk2725]

Ah man, as a North American it is great to here your commentary on our eff'ed up infra. These are similar conditions to what I face and one sometimes forgets how nice it can be. I spent 2 weeks in the Netherlands last summer and now I'm pretty depressed whenever I ride here. You're pretty damn funny too, thanks for doing this. ✌

[@PekkaTahkola]

Thanks Matthew! And I've understood Calgary is still one of the so-called better cities on the continent, when it comes to cycling. Calgary, and so many other North American cities are cursed with lots of space, which is also a kind of blessing when it comes to fixing the past mistakes. With so much space you have in your cities, it's much easier to build bike infra. And also densify them.

[@4GregF]

I'm from Canada. I watched Tom's video prior to your video. In my opinion, your rating for Tom's ride is very realistic. I feel he is used to the poor infrastructure, so he gives it a passing grade, even though it's horrible. Did he even dock Calgary 2 points for plowing the snow from the road into the painted bicycle path, he should have.

[@jasonriddell]

as a Canadian Toms ride is "normal" and "expected" so a LOT of issues go un noticed but being "spoiled" by the FAR better "BIKE FIRST" base design AND Infrastructure you NOTICE those short comings

[@TTRTIM]

I realised how awesome your bike network is when you complained about the poor visibility due to the trees and I was looking at it and thinking "oh wow that's so picturesque and a Christmas wonderland." I guess it really goes to show how much we here in North America long for better infrastructure.

[@PekkaTahkola]

The poor visibility because of those trees 🌲💚 is much more understandable from the opposite way as they block the view. Unfortunately it is a dangerous spot 😕

[@Allan003]

@@PekkaTahkola I think it could be solved with one of those circular mirrors mounted on a post. They are quite common in Japan for narrow backstreets and alleys. I love your city by the way, it's very pretty. :)

[@MikkoRantalainen]

@@Allan003 As a Finn with experience with those mirrors, too, cutting the bushes and trees too close to intersections is 100% better. Mirrors should only be used if nothing else can be done.

[@Bolga4K]

You're one funny guy, Pekka, and should take your act on the road! Really enjoyed watching both your and Tom's videos. You Finns of Oulu are sure fortunate to have such great biking infra. I live on a small island north of the Arctic Circle in Norway but am encouraging our municipal center on the mainland to focus on biking infra as they plan and develop coastal transportation in our region. Oulu is truly a shining example of getting it right. ❤👍☮️

[@jasonschubert6828]

I have to make a comment about your observation of the (lack of) drains. Here in Melbourne it does not snow, but ALL bike lanes in the city, even when they are actually separated from traffic with a kerb, have gaps for water to run through onto the bike lane. This not only causes more water on the lane, as well as oil and other car fluids runoff from the road, but means that large, slippery, wheel-bending grates often take up a large portion of the bike lane! Loving your observations so far!

[@PekkaTahkola]

Thanks! It seems to me that not even city engineers often understand how important proper drainage is. And it gets ever so much more important in places where liquids freeze.

[@MarijnRoorda]

I gave about the same points for Calgary, but i gave yours more. Then again, i'm from the Netherlands, and i was amazed by the infrastructure you fine Finnish folks have. You got yourself a subscriber!

[@PekkaTahkola]

Thank you! 🤗

[@jan10916f]

Not a Finland, but an Oulu thing!

[@Second247]

@@jan10916f Yeah. I live in small rural town south of Oulu and it's closer to Calgary than Oulu, thou roads are smaller (one lane per direction) and in last decade we have got "light traffic lanes" to most trafficed roads where cyclists and pedestrians can move along. Conditions were very similar to Calgary's bike lanes back then, basically you had to ride with cars on snowy days. I much rather ride among pedetrians even if it comes with it's own set of problems... At least they don't kill you.

[@rotary65]

I really learned a lot from your perspective. I’m in eastern Canada and my city of 180,000 is extremely car centric. We only have paint, signs, and a couple of recreational multi use trails. They are shifting towards active transportation, but it takes so long. We take risks with our lives on every ride in our city. The trucks are so big and all of the vehicles drive 70km/h in the 50km/h zones thanks to the ridiculously wide streets. Winter maintenance is non existent. Pedestrians need to walk on the busy roads in the winter after storms. There are pedestrian and bicyclist deaths so often here and everyone blames the victims instead of the systems. It’s very sad,

[@kalencrowe103]

Good video. Not sure if anyone mentioned it or not, but there is a semi understandable reason for Calgary to use as much salt as it does. There are many freeze-thaw cycles here, and the Chinooks can cause the weather to go from -20 to 0 over the course of a few hours. It's not uncommon for everything to melt during the day, then re-freeze during the night in a new formation. That's the main reason for the salt on the roads. For the dedicated bike paths, there is no salt used, only plowing and sometimes gravel for traction. Sadly, there are many routes with no fully dedicated bike paths, so Tom was on a lot of streets. To me, the freeze-thaw cycle is just more evidence that even more separated infrastructure is needed, so that it can get different treatment from the snirty roads.

[@randyconnolly572]

Laughed at your comment about the size of the pickup trucks! That's Calgary encapsulated!

[@jeffreygleeson2444]

Thanks for the collaboration! I'm immensely impressed Oulu's biking infrastructure. Canada could learn so much by simply looking to Europe, in urbanism and beyond. One suggestion for your next such video; it would be interesting to see the routes taken by each of you on a map.

[@arirahikkala]

It only barely comes through in the video, but Oulu is *so* beautiful in the winter. Not bad in the summer, either, but I've lived here my entire adult life and it's still just magical to bike here in January.

[@paulaspinall919]

Your observation skills are finely tuned. You spotted loads more stuff than I did. Oulu is an amazing place for winter cycling. I cycle all year round but with little to zero cycling infrastructure it always makes it a challenge (UK). The occasional disused railway track and canal towpath help but are mostly mud traps when it is wet or snowy. Oulu would be heaven for me. Thank you for your great video.

[@PekkaTahkola]

Thanks! 🤗

[@jasonschubert6828]

I'm glad you mentioned the time it took both of you to ride the distance, that was missing from Tom's video. I would imagine that brown slush would slow you down too, both staying upright and trying to keep clean, even with mudguards!

[@darkiee69]

To be fair, Toms shifter had frozen so he couldn't change gears.

[@ja_ma]

@@darkiee69 How many gears did Pekkas bike have?

[@jamesphillips2285]

@@darkiee69 In my experience my speed drops in half on snirt.

[@darkiee69]

@@ja_ma But it was a higher gearing. He didn't have to pedal like a maniac to go forward.

[@leopoldleoleo]

I love getting the 2 perspectives, especially because (as Canadian cyclist) I really feel like I’ve gotten numb about how bad the infrastructure is. Don’t get me wrong, I’m still constantly outraged, but I end up letting all the little stuff slide. Your commentary is a good antidote

[@Spanderson99]

Those tire tracks on the bike path towards the end of Tom’s trip could only have been left by my boss and I on our way to work at Ridley’s bike shop, situated comfortably in the middle of that parking lot! Before we opened up, nobody had any reason to use that path in the wintertime. Your city looks fantastic, i use it as an example of the ideal winter biking city.

[@PekkaTahkola]

Thanks! 😊

[@cjg3045]

I love this comparison. I live in Calgary, about 2 blocks from that hardware store, and work close to downtown, and Tom came within a few blocks of my kids school and daycare. I bike some of those areas all the time in the summer, and avoid some of the streets he took for obvious reasons. Toms score for Calgary is fair. I can’t deny that there is still a lot to improve for cyclists. However, he did take the most direct route. When I bike that same start and end, I take a different route. Takes about 15 min more, but only 2 or 3 street crossings, with better scenery, plus 2 points. However, -10 points for the inconvenient and huge detour it takes me on.

[@themanyouwanttobe]

It's not boring because you fear for your life every few seconds when an oversized pickup truck passes you!

[@PekkaTahkola]

😬😬

[@intergalacticspacecanoe4659]

my polish friend was laughing. "i´m glad i live in egalitarian country! we plow nothing and it is safe for noone!"

[@garysandel6549]

I watched both this and shifter video. I laughed at both scoring biases (both demerited each other's bike racks for example), and as pointed out, isn't even close....yet, Calgary is bike miles ahead of most US cities (not even snowy ones...and I would gather beats the hell out of even the most bike friendly cities and their nascent efforts towards bike infrastructure). There are some really nice touches and great solutions in Oulu...especially the lighting and lighted ground signs. +100

[@scmorton8]

Very very insightful. Kudos for calling out many details in your hometown that you probably just take for granted or haven’t had to think about before. For us in North America, there were many subtle details that seemed to make a big difference to the cyclists overall experience. Thank you for the education. Now how do we get this video to go viral for our policy makers in North America 🙂. And thanks to Tom for introducing us to your channel.

[@ThalassTKynn]

I still can't get over how great those projected signs are!

[@BoulderHikerBoy]

Fantastic analysis of the rides in both cities. It really felt like an education in what to look for in cycling infrastructure. Just brilliant! Thank you so much!

[@PekkaTahkola]

Thank you so much!

[@robadr13]

I think your scoring for Calgary was pretty accurate. Not to bash my own country (O Canada!), but the overall experience was pretty depressing. How could anyone cycle a route like that in the winter unless they were forced to, or unless they were in the top 5% of gung-ho cycling enthusiasts (to whom we should be grateful for their persistence). What's really evident is that the experience of individual human beings just getting around under their own power (walking and cycling) occupies a very small portion of overall planning awareness in many North American cities. That's not an 'accusation', just an observation of reality, and it affects our quality of life to a degree that I think few people realize. There are historical reasons for this course, but we need to wake up and recognize both the mistakes that have been made and the ways that exist to make it better.

[@jasonriddell]

the big thing I see in this vid and "NOT-JUST-BIKES" videos is North America is "forcing" bikes into a 2 model system WITHOUT REMOVING capacity for the OTHER modes (vehicle + walking) where as they use totally systems for "powered" vehicles and "NON-POWERED" vehicles / walking and allow / assume that walking / biking are compatible

[@rileynicholson2322]

Just imagine having to do that route every day for a commute. I'd happily take the route in Oulu every day for some fresh air, scenery, and exercise, but in Calgary I would rather take the bus every time. I think the Shifter really underestimated the effects of all that boring waiting on shit-coloured snow compared to the absolutely beautiful infrastructure in Oulu.

[@tidiz]

Funny story about the city center pedestrian area. It was completely renovated around 2011 (+/- 2 years maybe, can't remember the exact year). After the renovation it was meant to be just for pedestrians only and you weren't allowed to drive bicycle there let alone park your bicycle. You had to walk your bicycle through the area. When the area was finished and opened completely there were police watching that no one is cycling there. They tried to fine people, but soon they just felt overwhelmed of the number of cyclists cycling through the area. Later the city decided to lift the cyclist ban on the area :D You can still see some "no bicycle parking" signs on the old "Stockmann pylons" and hundreds of bikes in front of them. You can't stop people from cycling in Oulu I guess

[@LordJashin]

Im from Oulu too and I don't think I've ever had to cycle among the cars like that, looks horrifying! My biggest complaint cycling here at the moment is the amount of noice the cars make when im crossing the tuira bridge because roads are right next to each other for a while. 😅

[@PekkaTahkola]

Exactly. Someone would probably say that our problems here in Oulu are First World Problems 🤭 And yes I hate the noise and lack of space on Tuira Bridges as well. Hence I almost never go there, and also because there are so many so much more comfortable alternatives available :)

[@jan10916f]

Afaik, they need to redo the bridge soon and they plan to make it more bike and pedestrian friendly. Maybe you don't need two lanes of car traffic in both directions...

[@1st1anarkissed]

I'm still laughing at "but when you make an entire continent a grid..." You ought to see Saskatchewan. The whole landscape has been scored with grid roads, farm land sold by grid location, and one can always find a road going in the right direction. Until it doesn't, because there's closed ones, lost ones, and land deformations making them turn or end. But it's great fun to get lost in a summer afternoon knowing you can eventually get back using compass directions. As long as you have enough fuel. We are a lot like Siberia out here. The snert problem in spring is usually over fast and it rarely melts, in Saskatoon, between autumn and spring.

[@intervrt]

this video makes me feel almost determined to become involved in city planning, there's a bunch of things to improve here in estonia

[@PekkaTahkola]

Happy to hear it could give you some motivation! 🤗

[@wesleycanada3675]

at least your not in Phoenix, AZ look at google maps its bad

[@NortherlyK]

I'm from North America, Chicago, and our bicycle infrastructure is very similar to Calgary. The drains clog all the time, even on the sidewalks that are so narrow they made it illegal to bike on unless it's a mixed use path like through a park. We get puddles so big that I have to cross the street just to walk safely. Temporary sidewalks? We don't do that.

[@roelsch]

12:09 it is more analogous to the fence around an enclosure in a zoo. It is surrounded by an area where whatever is in it probably cannot survive, and it contains a small terrarium to make whatever is in it somewhat comfortable.

[@PekkaTahkola]

Yeah, a good analogy 👌 Or a fenced safari zoo where you can sit in the safety of your metal box and watch the horribly dangerous caged children 🤷‍♂️

[@miniskiipperi]

I started winter bicycling when I was living in Oulu because it was such an easy way to get around the city. I moved to Rovaniemi about 10 years ago. Even though the infrastructure and mainentance wasn't as great as it was in Oulu, I still continued to prefer bicycling. I wouldn't feel comfortable bicycling in Calgary.

[@MikkoRantalainen]

I have lots of cycling experience in Jyväskylä area only and the biggest difference to Oulu is that cyclists get right of way over cars in many intersections. Jyväskylä still prioritizes cars over cyclists.

[@MikkoRantalainen]

18:15 I think the most important question would be "Would you let your kids to cycle there? Independently? During the dark time?".

[@PekkaTahkola]

Definitely, even better.

[@AnotherDuck]

I live in Stockholm, and I've biked quite a bit here years ago, and while it's not as good as in Oulu, it's still comparable. The city centre is worse, but still better than Calgary, which is a comparably sized city. And it's better since last I owned a bike. What was more relatable was the part with having many different paths to take. If I've got the time, I take the scenic route home, but a different path is not necessarily much slower. It's just that the paths through forested areas and at the shore of lake Mälaren tend to be a little slower than the straighter paths, but they're much more relaxing. I also used to live in Västerås, which is very comparable to Oulu in terms of bike infrastructure and maintenance. I biked everywhere, and wintertime there are heated paths and plowing from early morning every time it snows. Someone said a major reason is because there are lots of farms around the city, which means lots of tractors that can be used for plowing, and since winter usually means less work on farms, the extra work doing road maintenance is welcome. Of course, that's a small city, and while there are suburbs, there's not much of them. Outside that is just country roads and farmland, usually without much bike infrastructure (although there is some along the major roads).

[@TukaihaHithlec]

13:33 These signs are required around almost all children’s facilities (schools, church daycares, playgrounds, etc), and are fortunately the rare exception of vehicle safety actually being heavily enforced here (most of the time). The black SUV on the left at 13:54 has someone monitoring vehicle speeds, and they are eager to fine people for going even barely above 30km/h. They try to hide amongst parked cars, but being right at the zone boundary and the only car clear of snow makes them stand out. Unfortunately, you get aggravated people speeding out of these zones because they didn’t want to have to slow down, which is what happened at 14:01. Evidently, not all zones are monitored, like at 14:09. Locals can usually spot the monitoring vehicle, so if they don’t see one (especially if there are no parked vehicles around), they know they won’t be enforced.

[@kailahmann1823]

"oh, there is a person outside, +1"… I had to laugh so hard on that! Really, most of it feels like it's illegal to be outside a car there and these "residential freeways" have a size like a German Autobahn! And that bike rack might have been a prison bed in it's previous life :)

[@carstarsarstenstesenn]

As an American we've unfortunately become numb to the dangers of our infrastructure. It's great to hear a different perspective

[@savannaha5038]

What's crazy to me is that if I tried a route in my city of Saskatoon, well first of all I'd probably die, but also it would lose spectacularly to even Calgary. I've tried biking in the winter before here - couldn't make it 3 blocks without crashing due to ice (and I had winter tires!), and what few bike lanes there are are simply not maintained in winter, and mostly not well connected to each other anyway. All that in a city that's actually not much larger than Oulu, a bit less than 1.5x the population.

[@Coccinelf]

My comments to Tom: You are braver than me, how many points if you just don’t take your bike at all because it’s too scary? I feel the need to mention that I would find it too scary in summer too. Your take on salt was really interesting. I do think they use too much salt here but I think it’s absolutely vital that they do in sloped streets. The only only reason they are usable is because of the salt. They can’t dedicate a snow plow just for one street to plow every 10 minutes.

[@Cindershadow]

In both Calgary and Edmonton they are pushing for more bike lanes integrated with traffic, lights, and more trucks. Spending millions on it. With refusing to move to pathways away from traffic with the response of trying to turn these higher elevation cities into winter bike cities. weeks at a time we have -20c weather with stop and go lights or up and down paths. As for the 4 lanes down residential streets, 2 of those lanes are strictly parking for residents, so really the street is only 2 lanes. Those are nice compared to the ones where it is a shared one lane in the middle of 2 parking lanes on the sides, the winter ruts get so bad you can barely drive a car let alone a bike down them.

[@coconspirator]

Hi, Pekka, greetings from Novosibirsk, Siberia! I remember you visiting us some years ago and joining a winter group ride through the city center. I wonder how low my city would score in "Plus 1 Minus 2". In winter the surface here varies from thick layer of salt and dirt slurry on the main roads, to ankle deep icy snow ruts on the secondary roads, to completely unplowed snow porridge or ice on the sidewalks littered with snow dumps and parked cars. And no cycling paths whatsoever, so any winter ride is something in between an extreme cyclocross ride and a suicide mission. But we do cycle here, so it could be fun to film a similar ride and compare it both to Calgary and Oulu, although the result would be quite predictable ;)

[@fallenshallrise]

I live in Canada and I love to see our 'cycling infrastructure' roasted. Outside of cycling one point i never thought about before is how our cities have always plowed the streets for cars, for free, but during a snowfall our sidewalks are usually blocked until each home or building owner eventually shovels them. Of course some buildings are vacant or some business owners just don't bother shoveling over the holidays. Makes it hard to walk, makes it impossible if you have mobility issues. Of course the city should buy some snow removal machines and give more hours / money to the workers who are normally mowing park grass & boulevards in the summer. Use the same trucks to move the machines.

[@PekkaTahkola]

Exactly. I've never understood how's it even possible that such a crucial part of traffic infrastructure as sidewalks are, are left basically totally neglected over there. It's a human rights issue imho.

[@fallenshallrise]

@@PekkaTahkola Yeah we had a couple of little snow storms here this year and I didn't even think about the fact that I had to stomp through the snow in big boots to walk to grab coffee while the roads and even the bike lane were plowed. Give them credit for that. I'm so used to the idea that we plow roads and not sidewalks or paths that I didn't even think about it or get annoyed until I saw this video today. :)

[@I.____.....__...__]

@@fallenshallrise I took photos of some main sidewalks in a busy area next to wiiide roads where the city hadn't bothered to plow after two days and left knee-deep snow. I wish I could win a lottery so I can move, then I'd post all the photos and publicly shame my shitty, uh, I mean my city, no, I had it right the first time. 😒

[@danielnicola1602]

Tom seemed to be riding a fully suspended bike that made watching seem like we were on a boat in choppy water. Reluctant shifting at those temperatures is no surprise to me, my touring bike gets sticky at much warmer temps. Oulu allows for such smooth rides, you are making good time on a much simpler, vintage bike which is probably a breeze on maintenance. Nice saddle, Brookes? I guess they are coveted everywhere.

[@PekkaTahkola]

Nope, not a Brooks. Some other unknown brand since the markings of this original 85-year-old saddle have already worn out beyond recognition 🤷🏻‍♂. And yes, a breeze on maintenance with no gears, no cables, and of course, no salt ;)

[@GarfieldHiscock]

Great videos from both of you. Your bridges are 40 years old, our are 20 years old. We haven't been working as long as you have on winter cycling; you both have missed an opportunity to give our cities some credit for our improvements. Your peace of mind while cycling is +30; our stress is -30.

[@Skip6235]

Very interesting, but as soon as you started showing Oulu, it immediately struck me as looking like many college campuses and ski-resort towns in North America. Interesting how we know how to make good bike and pedestrian infrastructure here, but only for university students and rich winter-sports enthusiasts.

[@theepimountainbiker6551]

Loved your view on Calgary, I'd love to see what you'd say about my city just 2 provinces over from Tom. At least he had divided bike lanes and plowed paths. Sudbury Ontario has neither. Based on cycling alone Im moving to Oulu, being epileptic I'll never have to worry about having a seizure infront of a car again 😍

[@PekkaTahkola]

Thanks! And welcome to Oulu 🤗

[@KaLeN11]

Fellow Sudburian here to say that biking in Sudbury is a challenge and I've never biked in the winter. I'm definitely too afraid. It would be awesome if we had Oulu level biking and walking infrastructure.

[@I.____.....__...__]

Yeah, city-planners tend not care about disabilities. You saw how that light changed after just six seconds and counted down from 10. 😒 In fact, I just went out for a bit tonight and the intersection here did the same thing but worse; it went from the walk-light directly to counting down from 6 seconds. I was confused because it takes 7 seconds to cross the wide road; I timed myself on the way back, walking at a normal-brisk pace. 🤨

[@NYCCEJ]

Came here from the Shifter collab, amazing video and bicycle infrastructure! I live in New York City and advocate for bicycle/ped infrastructure and Greenways. We are so far behind and struggling to get the city to implement a Greenway network for the city. Thank you for sharing and showing what is possible. Love your commentary too, I subscribed within a few moments of starting the video.

[@PekkaTahkola]

Thanks! 🤗

[@JSchmidt412]

I live in Calgary and 100% agree with you about traffic lights and snirt; Calgary planners overuse lights because drivers in my home city don't seem clever enough to understand roundabouts (bless you, Australia!). However, I used to bicycle commute almost on the same route that Tom rode in his video and would note that the elevation gain constitutes a significant portion of the time difference you experienced; Oulu seemed to be fairly flat throughout your ride. Thanks!

[@dutchman7623]

Nice video! Saw the one of Tom as well. Good infra in Oulu! We had a little bit of snow overhere as well. On mixed use neighborhood streets with max speed of thirty km/h, cars turn the snow into water and in ridges, after that it freezes up again, making the street bumpy and extremely slippery. So I had to walk with my groceries, bike on hand. The main bicycle paths were plowed and clean. We got only a few cm of snow and at only -5 'C.

[@gordongilbertson943]

I did about a decade of winter comutting in calgary. The path out of downtown shown did not exist then. The riverside pathways were better than what you saw... but from those pathways to most downtown destinations it was worse than you saw. The score for Calgary is fair.

[@userunknown7395]

Thank you for that nice video. It is really impressive how good the biking infrastructure and maintanance is in Oulu. I live in Augsburg a town of 250k people in south germany and my city could learn a lot from your city. Especially the handling of snow (we use way to much salt) on bike paths and how to even build them in the first place :)

[@MrMartinSchou]

One thing that REALLY stands out between the two cities is just how many people you that are NOT in cars. I almost suspect there were more people not in cars in the Oulu video than there were cars driving in Calgary video.

[@Pappa_66]

Thank you wery many Gents! Great video! Just shortly, the main thing for using/riding bikes is the safety for our children. I got 3 children and they want to use their bikes like always/everyday. For school, hobbies, friends, picnics, bike cross, downhill and forest trail biking. And I feel much more safe, when they can use these bike lanes. Ps. They are using helmets, always. Best Regards from Finland!

[@madelineduffin1352]

i have biked the same roads and pathways that Tom has in this video for years with my son on a Yuba cargo bike as we rode to school and work. In the winter, I dont bike on 26 ave because the bike lane is always clogged with dangerous snirt and ice. So we rode on the sidewalk or the multi use pathway along 26 ave. There are many dangerous spots to ride in Calgary but I ride all year to work using the pathway and sidewalks. If i fall on the ice or snirt on the sidewalk then i have a better chance of picking the bike up and continuing on.

[@OfTheGaps]

Liked both videos, but yours was a little more informative. You seemed to notice more detail. You also judged Oulu much harsher than you judged Calgary, surely based on your higher expectations for Oulu. I hate snow, so I'm glad I don't live in either city - though I'd guess I'd hate snow a lot less without the salt and cars. I'm so jealous of your infrastructure!

[@dougwedel9484]

The snirt lane. I love that. In Toronto, we have plenty examples of gutter lanes and door zones marked as bike lanes. But we have so many bike lanes filled with snow and with snirt that this has become the main way to treat bike lanes in winter. That's the bad side of Toronto winter cycling. A massive positive is that this winter I see cyclists at all hours, at all temperatures. It looks like winter cycling has become a thing a few people do. That's a big change compared to past years. And being this is happening after the pandemic, not during, means this is trending and may grow a lot more, if we are on that illusory S curve. But that will depend on installing more bike infra.

[@numetalmarkchavez24]

I didn't even notice the weirdly placed bus stop at 19:02 on Tom's video, I was too enamored by the cycling infrastructure and the jarring difference in comparison to ours in north america.

[@jasonriddell]

where does the BUS go? across and park ON the bike road OR do they expect the riders to WALK the 10 meters from the shelter to the coach ACROSS a busy bike route??? my town in Canada does the "proper" bike path behind the shelter alignment on our FEW bike paths that are actual divided ones

[@_KroW_]

@@jasonriddell that bus stop is old so when they made it there wasn't a dedicated bicycle path there, it was just a wide street but i do agree its a really annoying for bikers and bus goers to avoid each other there

[@jankoodziej877]

I want to cry watching this, especially the second part. Here we are so terribly behind, that I can't even see a way for progress at all. There are only some token, terrible infrastructure elements, like a very narrow cycling path leading from nowhere to nowhere, not connected with anything...

[@soccerdad93446]

I’m astounded that you can take a shorter route than by car. In USA, a bicycle route would be longer. Even short cuts for pedestrians get closed because of security and lack of maintenance (dollars and effort). Thank you for showing that there are better ideas out there.

[@swtexan6502]

Oulu looks like such an inviting city, Pekka! Thanks for sharing.

[@MikkoRantalainen]

12:53 Great point about *totally invisible* crosswalks during the winter.

[@TheGozzeh]

You should see the UK on the rare occasions it snows. The whole country grinds to a halt. The main impediment to riding in winter here is the incessant rain 😄

[@PekkaTahkola]

Yeah, I've seen some videos about the chaos happening over there often on what I'd call a beautiful winter and cycling day 😅😅

[@TheGozzeh]

I have tried cycling over here in the snow. The snow quickly melts and then freezes again overnight presenting very treacherous conditions. We dn't handle that sort of weather well at all. That said, one of my usual routes around my hometown of Oxford is currently under 30cm of water! 😮

[@jasonriddell]

like Vancouver BC Canada a LITTLE snow and it all shuts down and add in freeze/thaw and bad becomes worse and the near total LACK OF equipment in "serviceable" condition

[@tigerholm1]

Thank you for your videos on winter cycling in snow. I have cycled in Michigan Upper Peninsula (near Lake Superior) so there is snow. Another challenge is where there are hills and they use salt and sand.

[@Nhkg17]

I like your assessment (and Finnish accent ;-) ) much better than Tom's. He's too soft on the crappy infrastructure they have in Calgary. And I live in a city that probably has even worse bike lanes than Calgary...

[@PekkaTahkola]

Thanks! As for Tom's judgement, perhaps it's partially because he's lived there for a long time (as I've understood) and has seen it transform to much better from what it was before.

[@TukaihaHithlec]

7:48 I think that might actually be considered 2 lanes. A lot of streets are made to have 1 lane in each direction with “enough room” for parked cars. Using the extra space to pass someone technically in the same lane would therefore be illegal, for example. We’ve largely stopped using road salt because of all the harsh side effects. Usually we use sand now, which absorbs more heat from the sun and adds traction, then in spring we just sweep it up for reuse. Lots does definitely get into waterlines though, and snowbanks deposit it in grass, which aren’t good, but at least an improvement over salt.

[@davidn2612]

I love the simple animations you use. Very professional!

[@alankingchiu]

I am so jealous of the fantastic Finnish cycling infrastructure.

[@kimberleemodel7182]

Unlighted bike/foot paths is a north american staple. The river trail near where I am, which is so alive and vibrant even on a cold day is a complete liminal space at night.

[@PekkaTahkola]

It's really a pity that even such beautiful places are completely ignored when it comes to planning them being usable 24/7. And it would be such an easy and cheap solution to fix it.

[@kimberleemodel7182]

It's getting better, very slowly. There's a big bridge on one of our rail trails that they used to gate up every night. They put lights up on it and now they don't have to gate it up.

[@PekkaTahkola]

@@kimberleemodel7182 Happy to hear that!

[@rastaranger]

Lovely video. Just a "funny" point, in Ireland when getting my motorcycle licence, the look over the shoulder that dude does on the bridge coming out of Tuira, was hammered in my head as "suicide look", since it is suicide to change lanes without it. I keep doing that while biking all the time.

[@ja_ma]

A video where you discuss each other's score and comments would be interesting.

[@lacai527]

Watched Tom first, ya were ruff to Canada! but then again usually a good blow wakes hibernating stuff, im from Helsinki (Finland) did not even realize how LOONG straight Tom had to cycle, sure it was fast forwarded so not so oblivious for me, in Toms video it was so funny that he was like OOOH lights in cycle lanes and underpasses or these "forest" paths for me they are granted, should probably start to travel more.

[@PekkaTahkola]

Yes, having been born and raised in Oulu region, it really opened my eyes already when I just moved to Tampere. Not to even mention visiting some really bicycle- and people-hostile places.

[@10tenman10]

Fantastic route home. Im totally jealous.

[@Error403HRD]

It's kind of sad that even the terrible conditions in Canada are better than the conditions here in the southern US. Snow is getting more common, but the cities don't plow, maybe they'll salt if they feel like it, and there are ZERO bike lanes and a few sidewalks that just randomly stop in the middle of a road 😅

[@krudointegrale8399]

Wonderful city planned by intelligent people, congratulations I too would like to live in such a place, which with a minimum of will could be used as a model by any public administration.

[@s0ulshot]

Huh, I never knew how easily and fast you can get to Kaakkuri from the centre. Even as I hate every biker as a rule I have enjoyed biking in Oulu this summer and will continue to ride probably through winter too as its my favourite type of exercise.

[@stevenparkin6486]

I'm in Utah, USA. Overall, my city earns a score similar to Calgary. Once infrastructure is built for a car-centric city, government officials resist spending money to change that infrastructure for bicycles. Bit by bit, my city is changing to favor bikes in some areas; we needed a bike-loving mayor to get that momentum. ~ One key strength of Oulu is that officials planned smart pedestrian and bike paths from inception, saving money by avoiding bad design to later change to good design. ~ I live in a city with grid streets. The city has some dedicated roads for cars and alternating, parallel roads (built for cars) are now marked to encourage bicycles with cars minor on those roads. Still, bikes and cars share the same pavement. On a budget, officials are encouraging bikes to mix with cars by painting the road and installing signage with shared bike-car markings, a low-cost mod that Tom of Calgary hates, but I accept all the bike progress I can get.

[@johnbrann75]

I live in Regina (750 kilometres east ot Calgary) and I'm jealous of the cycling infrastructure I see in Tom's videos of Calgary. But Oulu is a completely different level. I'm curious as to what prompted the political powers in Oulu to concentrate so heavily on cycling/walking infrastructure.

[@espvp]

I'm nowhere near an expert on the subject but my guess is that the question should be inversed: What prompted the political powers of most of North America to concentrate so heavily on car infrastructure... even though is worst for people? And to that I'd say: lobbying.

[@KaushikNSanji]

@@espvp You should check the recent video from "Not Just Bikes" titled "Would you fall for it?"

[@47f0]

@@espvp - Being the home of Ford, General Motors and Chrysler, North America has seen heavy political resistance and some outright skulduggery involved in making sure that municipal leaders are invested in cities for cars, not people. This has included pressuring the city councils to disrupt bicycling infrastructure, and in some cases, buses and trolley cars were actually bought and destroyed by major car manufacturers. The documentary "Bikes Versus Cars" is also a good resource, although it is not strictly North American centric.

[@jasonriddell]

@@espvp not even lobbying LOW COST and plenty of LAND in the early days and it is CHEAPER to "greenfield" develope then redo existing areas for the POST WAR housing demand and the CHEAPEST housing stock to build is the single family home so everybody GOT there 1/4 plot and "picket fence" and "car hell" to service it and early counties did NOT NEED to invest in running transit as "everybody has a car"

[@jonnection]

John, this is not only Oulu. This is normal in Finland. I live in Lahti, south of Finland, and I cycle to work 22,5km (14 miles) one way. I do not have to share the road at any point with cars, there is a dedicated cycle/pedestrian network all the way. Until this video I can honestly say, I never even considered it special. This has been urban planning over here for decades.

[@grahamturner2640]

12:35 also in a 50 km/h zone. I don’t understand how those are safe with speed limits above 25 mph (40km/h). Edit: also, that joke you made at 15:19 actually made me laugh. It seems to be a reference from the other video Shifter did, though I imagine if he was in the US, it would be something even worse.

[@jamesphillips2285]

Yes I believe the summer video, with not just bikes, featured the crack cocaine on an overpass.

[@jeremyhershberger3012]

Great video. I would and do cycle in North America (specifically Columbus Ohio) in winter but not with kids, older people or people with mobility challenges.

[@PekkaTahkola]

Btw gotta love that omafiets (mummiska) rider passing me at 33:08 and the food delivery rider right after. 🤗😋 #ThisIsOulu

[@klapiroska4714]

From 24:34 till 24:50, just look at the number of busses, pedestrians and cyclists compared to the number of cars. Didn't really notice that on Shifter's video.

[@PekkaTahkola]

Well spotted! I didn't pay attention to buses at all either. Perhaps I'm just used to them ;)

[@MikkoRantalainen]

@@PekkaTahkola I think busses are just so common and work well enough that most Finns don't think about it. It needs a foreigner to notice the good parts, like this: kzbin.info/www/bejne/p6jFZZ2GbJiWh7c

[@10tenman10]

I always worry that cars can't see me. Bike lanes in Germantown (suburb of Memphis) are spotty--you might have a lane which mysteriously vanishes making it less safe to ride. We don't really get snow here so you can see lines and lanes. We have dedicated bike lanes but they are in the woods (maybe not the safest place). And somehow there are always 2 fat and slow ladies in the middle of the trail!

[@AndreiNeacsu]

Thank you for the video! I wish that one day, Bucharest would be at least half as bike-friendly as Oulu.

[@PekkaTahkola]

Thanks! Hoping so too, never visited there yet!

[@beardannyboy]

Hi from Canada. Thanks for the insight into your cycling culture

[@jfmezei]

Couple comments from a Canadian in a Montréal suburb (this suburb closes bike paths in winter, but the city of Montréal does clear a numebr of them downtown). - When bike paths are seen as "recreational" there isn't much point in lighting them for long winter nights since only used in summer. (aka: Canada). But I noticed hiw well your bike paths are lighted. For Tom's video, I can't soeak of the actual situation, but where I live, snow clearing is done in multiple steps. At first, the use a plough to clear middle of road (which is case in To'ms video). Then they pass the plough on sides to push that snow onto middle of road and then use a snow blower to pickup the snow and put it in a truck that brinks the snow into a large snow dump. In residential streets without sidewalks, they jsut plough the street wull wdith and push sow onto the sides onto peoploe's properties. So had Tom ridden a couple days later, he might have found very different road conditions. With regards to use of salt, at least for Montréal, it is often spread pr-emptively not to clear snow, but ahead of predicted freezing rain event which is happening more and more often. And also in hilly areas. Look for the video "Crazy car pileup in Montreal Bus Police and Snowplow! (Benny Hill theme)" to see what happened one year with ice followed by snow. Consider even the salt truck got taken. And when you get days of temperatures above 0, snow melts and then when it freezes again, it forms bit patches of hard ice, hence the salt. Not all winters are created equal. And you are amazingly lucky to have such clean streets that don,t need salt. There is also the issue of lassuits of someone slips and falls because of lack of salt. And salt does wonders to a bicycles which you miust coast with oil to survive winter. What I find amazing in your video is the trust you have in the road surface. Here, because of potholes and cracks in road, you never trust it when it si covered with snow because you can,t see them. Where I live, there are 0 facilities for bikes in winter, but I manage. But my longest trip is 6km to the post office (which is about to move to a stroad that will become almost off limits on bike). When I need to travel on busiy roads after/during snowfall, I use red lights to my advantage: cross road, wait for red light, then spring in middle of lane that is clear till next intersection knowing I have about 30 seconds without cars behind me, then repeat cycle. (once the snow clearing cycle is complete and road wiodth restored , then I can usually ride on side along with cars).

[@Allocated_Brain]

Hi there. Shifter brought me here.

[@PekkaTahkola]

Welcome!

[@LoneHowler]

Me too, I have come across your videos before, but because of the colab I'm now subscribed

[@highwaysbyways4281]

'Attempted Murder" 🤣 Yes, you can have a more boring arterial street grid than Calgary. It's called Edmonton.

[@PekkaTahkola]

Guess I'll need to visit Edmonton then to calibrate my brain 😅😂

[@jamesphillips2285]

@@PekkaTahkola It is not a complete grid! Some roads follow traditional paths that were in place for centuries (and are diagonal to the grid)..

[@mediabuyer4188]

Excellent video -- curious about the time of day when this video was recorded. Also, is it typical to give some sort of "call out" when passing on these lanes (i.e., "on your left"), or is that not Finnish bike etiquette?

[@PekkaTahkola]

Thanks! I recall I started riding at 15 something. Often there's no need for call outs, since the paths are pretty wide. Most common is probably ringing the bell. Or simply saying "on your left", like you said 🤷‍♂️

[@joeybuddy96]

What kind of clothes do you wear in this weather? What company made a coat that can work in like -20 C temps???

[@PekkaTahkola]

I recall I had jeans or some other regular pants with long johns, a merino longsleeve and some jacket. Nothing special. At least for me pretty much any regular outdoor jacket works fine, just put a longsleeve or a thicker longsleeve under and I'm good to go 👌

[@10tenman10]

So this is the Calgary bike route on the previous video

[@MikkoRantalainen]

It's interesting to see how much more critical you were compared to Tom. It nicely shows how much it matters which is your typical experience.

[@PekkaTahkola]

That exactly, but I'm also very much looking it at the point of view of those who have much less exprience or none at all, but could potentially cycle if the conditions allowed. Those people, that we would like to get cycling. The able and the daring can do that already.

[@pbilk]

Great observations and video! I seen some of your content before but I will definitely be subscribing today.

[@PekkaTahkola]

Thank you! 🤗

[@pbilk]

@@PekkaTahkola you're welcome! Keep up the great content.

[@kevviekevvie]

Hi Pekka Great Video. You are sure lucky to have such awesome winter bike infrastructure. I would be riding daily. I'm from Sault Ste. Marie Ontario Canada. We have a significant Finnish population here. I am surprised that your city uses such little sand and salt although we get similar winter temperatures. Our city is a brown sloppy mess all winter and it's so pretty after a fresh snowfall. I ride all winter but only on days when there is a good melt and I stick to the sidewalks. The bike infrastructure isn't maintained here and our streets are narrowed by high snowbanks so it's really unsafe to ride on the streets. I have to get a hot bucket of water and rinse my bike down after a ride and then hose the chain with wd40. There is a park that the city maintains for walking all winter that is similar to your bike paths. Boy what a difference it makes to ride on hard packed snow. I wish the bike paths were maintained like that here!!!

[@PekkaTahkola]

Thanks! Perhaps you could try to put some pressure for the local council or government to move things forward? 🤗

[@olavsantiago]

Cycling around Oulu, I have seen a few people with "disabilities" cycling. Would be good if the next comparison is with a disabled person cycling vs canada. The point is - if infrastructure is well-designed for the user then all sections of society can use the space.

[@Sirgoone]

Shifter brought me there, greeting from Montreal :D

[@I.____.....__...__]

I keep hearing people saying Montréal is great for biking, but it's all hills and highways, it's like if San Fransisco and Los Angeles had a baby. 🤨

[@aurionson]

​@@I.____.....__...__ Let's just say you get good at planning your route around the geography and highways. Well that is, if your destination is not on the mountain. Sorry to those that live in the Côte-des-neiges borough, literally "snowy hill".

[@Skip6235]

Interesting how other than the heated roads or car streets with heavy traffic, almost all of the bike paths and streets in Oulu had a thin layer of snow on them. I wonder why in North America we INSIST on bare pavement, which uses so much salt!

[@baddriversofcolga]

Everyone in government should have to watch this video. Enjoyed it and also angered by it (because of how bad the infrastructure is in North America)! lol

[@rogerzhang2335]

Even as a motorcycle rider here in NA, the amount of snirt, salt and lack of infra, make motorcycling a summer-only transportation. Sad.