California Ramblers (as Golden Gate Orch) - Charleston (HOT!)

[@ellecampbell5067]

Awesome to realize that this music is 100 years old! Makes me want to dance!

[@jeremypreece870]

Hello from the UK. Before seeing this site I had never heard of the Golden Gate Orchestra. However, there are some very famous jazz musicians here who went on to become stars in their own right in the 1030's and 40's. Red Nichols and of course both of the Dorsey brothers, especially Tommy.

[@roybo1930]

THE ALL TIME BEST VERSION OF THIS AWESOME SONG EVER RECORDED! Who says EDISON Records were not HOT? This is proof that some of the HOTTEST Records sported the EDISON Label! 4 Minutes of FUN!

[@RedHotJazzLover]

I had read that, knowing Edison's distaste for popular Jass, songs would be recorded a bit slower & in a lower key, to please Edison, but relying on the youngsters to adjust their speed control at home playback to heat it up and still sound right, and matches the Ramblers other releases of "Charleston" on so many other labels. Any truth to that? Also, I've heard 3 distinct takes of "Charleston" by Golden Gate Orch on Edison, where we hear distinct variations of the exact same solos as though recorded at the same session, with all 3 takes being released at that time. Furthermore, I suspect this may be "Take A" that so many have been trying to find.

[@brucemercer8458]

The take letter would be very appreciated. Thank you.

[@brucemercer8458]

There is no chance the following is anything but a fanciful tale. BTW I have all issued takes but are scattered apart in machines and file cabinets. I'll get them all together and see. I don't remember for sure if this is the best take, A or otherwise but I think not.

[@brucemercer8458]

Only the older Edison machines had a speed control on top of the bed plate. The speed was adjusted by the dealership and rarely needed resetting per what an old former dealer told me. Edison was very fussy about maintaining 80 rpm. The speed was set from early on by use of a pitch pipe and a special record with the note "A" recorded on one side of the record used with the pipe in the same "A" tone.

[@MajinBuuButtercup]

I used to do The Charleston when I was a little girl. My grandma saw me doing it one day and told me that's what it was! It is amazing how many shows sample this without crediting the song. Family Guy (Mr and Mrs Stewie during the "roarin' 20 tidal waven"), Amazing World of Gumball (the Banana Song).... I'm sure I've heard it in many more places, but those 2 are in my head now.

[@vibemasterguitars2306]

this is my great uncle frank on trumpet

[@janettewalker3991]

This wonderful record gladdens my heart - your expertise is highly appreciated!

[@nickdellow6073]

Thanks Janette, very much appreciated.

[@benardduncan9726]

Nice record

[@michaelmills7198]

Never heard this take before. Thanks!

[@PaulinesPastimes]

Wonderful transcription for an acoustic recording. Great version of the song too.

[@nickdellow6073]

Thanks Pauline.

[@benardduncan9726]

Nice instrumental

[@benardduncan9726]

How are you doing today?

[@tommarion9007]

Same as Cameo 741, Varsity Eight, Excluding dorsey Bro, Nichols and Cush, Arrangement basically the same, with Adrian Rollini!

[@jourwalis-8875]

A very nice restoration work, I must say!

[@debbiewhite8770]

Well done, Nick !

[@benardduncan9726]

Nice work

[@MrSuperbatone]

EXCELLENT work, Nick! Edison Diamond Discs are great source material, and you make the most of them. It really sounds like music, with no mechanical artifacts. Great Galloping Kudos.

[@nickdellow6073]

Many thanks Brad. I really appreciate your comment. In fact, it has give me the confidence to have a rummage around my Edisons to see what else I could have a go at. As you say, there's a lot of great source material amongst the huge numbers of Edison Diamond Disc recordings. For someone who didn't like jazz, Mr Edison seems to have let quite a few hot sides slip through the net!

[@richardlaine9994]

No. 2 on my list of favourite performances of "Charleston'' -- behind only that by The Varsity Eight, featuring Red Nichols and Adrian Rollini. (Yes, it hasn't escaped me that Rollini is also on this side -- who could miss that throaty bass saxophone ? ) There may well be a lot of overlap in personnel between the two performances ; I don't remember exactly. Even if that is so, there is no doubt that the same group of players can play a given tune at different points in time and sound quite different. Neither run-through is lacking anything, for that matter: I say it's mostly a matter of the "Varsity Eight'' version having a more sprightly tempo that really ''settles in the groove." What I AM sure of is that YOU yourself have now posted both versions of this classic on KZbin! Warmest regards, as always, from Richard Laine.

[@nickdellow6073]

Many thanks, Richard, much appreciated. Yes, definitely a lot of overlap. By the way, I now think the alto sax solo is by Bobby Davis (as is the case on the Varsity Seven version), and not Jimmy Dorsey as listed.

[@jorgealbertopitari6351]

Excelente...!!!!

[@alkohn1844]

Wonderful job restoring this acoustic recording. I'm listening with dual driver in ear monitors and it almost sounds like an electrical recording. :-)

[@gunnarthefeisty]

good ear! This was one of Edison's early electric pressings for DDs!

[@stevefish3124]

@@gunnarthefeisty No! This is an acoustical recording! Edison switched to electric recording in 1927. But it sure shows how good they were.

[@pizzadomb8527]

3:41 is the part I'm waiting so far

[@the2ndcomingoflaynekrusz654]

Hey I know you.

[@paradoxmailbox]

shoutout to daisy

[@the2ndcomingoflaynekrusz654]

Robert Helpmann

[@CPorter]

Wish i could hear the difference between Cush and Nichols. Wanna be able to identify Cush's stuff specifically.

[@jourwalis-8875]

How large was the "Diamond Disc"?

[@Tadfafty]

10 inches diameter, quarter inch thick.

[@ethaneade4937]

This feels kind of long for a gramophone (78) record. Im no expert on the subject by any means.... But seeing as I own and play 78's sometime, And doing some of my own research.... It's my understanding that 78s could really only fit just over 3 mins of audio.... But then again I dont know too much about Edison records.... Did Edison ones fit more audio on them than say.... HMV, Zonophone, Decca ect

[@nickdellow6073]

Yes, Edison Diamond Discs have a finer groove size, allowing a longer playing time of up to four and a half minutes per side. The groove undulations are vertical ("hill and dale") not lateral like normal gramophone records. The Wikipedia entry on Edison Diamond Discs gives a good general overview.

[@roybo1930]

5 Minute 10" 78 RPM Records came out in 1920! On some rare Recordings but it was in 1931 that ARC, Columbia and Subsidiary labels, And the famous HIT of the Week Cardboard Records sold 5 Minute Records, I have several 78 `s from the 1920`s that squeezed 4 minutes on a Record with a smaller or cut down label! Then there were 12" 78`s but that is a different topic! British Broadcast Twelves were 10" Records that had a longer playing time, Using grooves finer like the 5 minute Records from the early 1930`s! EDISON Had a 80 RPM Record that would play around 30 minutes, on each side, But these were Dubbed and were hard to track!

[@davidglow3]

A stellar line up of musicians,but they are no match to the boys at the Savoy in London with their more spirited version.Nice solos on this version but to my ears all rather leaden and plodding. Rollini was a fine soloist in 1925 but rhythmically he was at his finest in the late 1920s (in my opinion)

[@nickdellow6073]

As you say, to your ears and in your opinion. You say "leaden and plodding", I say "laid-back". I like the Savoy Orpheans' version, but it is rather stiff by comparison - to my ears that is! The Savoyards are reading the dots and don't even attempt to play hot solos on a side that is crying out for at least one or two. Sorry, but I do think it is a bit ridiculous to state that Adrian Rollini, Red Nichols, Jimmy Dorsey, Stan King et al were "no match for the boys at the Savoy"!! Having said that, I agree with you that Rollini was superb in the late 1920s and into the early 30s (some super solos on bass sax on Elizalde and Bert Lown sides), but this is 1925 not 1928 or 1930. The best musicians never keep still. But much of what Rollini plays when soloing - regardless of the year - has a timeless quality. In any case, he was certainly doing his bit to free-up the bass end of the dance band format, along with others like Steve Brown (I'm specifically talking about white dance bands of course). I should also add that what one enjoys listening to can often be a subjective matter, and the "leaden and plodding" vs. "laid-back" is a case in point in fact.

[@alkohn1844]

99% of the time the bass sax is played on a stand. It's doubtful that Rollini is holding the instrument as it is huge and monstrous, so I'm sure that he had time (giving up a few beats) to get over to the piano to duet with Brodsky. :-)

[@nickdellow6073]

In 1929, the Melody Maker ran a series of articles by Adrian Rollini, in one of which he talks about wearing a body sling (there is a photo too), but there is also a cartoon of Rollini, again dating from 1929, which shows the bass sax on a stand! Having said that, regardless of whether Rollini was using a sling or a stand, I still doubt that there was time to get to the piano. In fact, I am now inclined to agree with Daniel Weinstein's comment below that the piano "duet" is probably just a piano solo.

[@clubisas]

Good but very out of pitch. My copy requires 86rpm to be on pitch