The death of Runescape - The fall of a legacy

[@CallumUpton]

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[@itchylol742]

grats on the sponsorship

[@zidahya]

Is it any good? I kinda expect Callum to have a real opinion on these online security tools.

[@wrecktitudemedia6514]

I'm a skiller that plays rs3 so this video means nothing to me.

[@CallumUpton]

@@zidahyai've been genuinely using it for 3 months, their opt-out requests for data brokers is worth it alone. i tried manually a year ago and it just wasnt worth the hastle. they do all the work for you, its honestly great!

[@arisaek7764]

Nightmare world update???????? The project is dead????

[@ArchOfWinter]

Public library, that's how I started playing. It even worked at home on dial up connection.

[@Sir_Lagg_A_Lot]

That was the way I started playing Runescape. My guess is that many kids who didn't have a computer with internet acess at home, started playing Runescape that way. That is also why the ability to hop worlds in RS was so important. They could see another kid playing at the library, and get on the same world as them.

[@penguinworldorder3545]

It was summer in 2005 after school closed for break. Met a few of my friends from middle school at the public library saw them playing this weird looking game. I went home and made a character... oh boy that was when it all happened thats a feeling you can never regain I was instantly hooked

[@RayRictor]

Found this game in the same way in 03 with nephew:) Beating Jad on dial up I'll NEVER FORGET..

[@offtime915]

Insane! I started at a public library too! A friend of mine at middle school introduced me to it. After school, we would run to the library

[@brandonswift8261]

I never played at the library but I got my membership from there. Told them I needed to call my mom and did pay by phone 😂

[@KitsuneOfTheNight]

I got a Dreamworld ad on this video. I wasn't aware it was still around.

[@Legomanshorts-c5o]

surprisingly it's a game... but it's sloppy. they had me build a house before i claimed it but i had built a house between two claims and i could not claim the space as it overlapped both. then i jumped off the edge of the world and survived but my trial ran out.

[@dylanherron3963]

@@Legomanshorts-c5o Man, I was going to... not say nice things about "having spent your money" on Dreamworld.

[@Legomanshorts-c5o]

@@dylanherron3963 what you mean? of course the next part of my story was how i bought me and my friends 7 copies.

[@snooganslestat2030]

​​@@dylanherron3963The ads iv seen on KZbin(started popping up a couple wks ago) under videos says play for free but I figure that's a trial.

[@Maximus-b7h]

@@Legomanshorts-c5oThis proves that you haven't played recently or probably even within the last year. They dropped their "Free Trial" mode months ago. You have not played recently, it looks pretty amazing (on Ultra Graphics), you can choose your own quests so you don't even need to build if you don't want to, and you can jump in right now for FREE and adventure the entire infinite world they made. This is not accurate to what the game is today. Also ... why are you trying to claim the only unavailable land in an infinitely generating world... what 🤣🤣🤣

[@QMulative]

Combat systems are super important for me when I pick a game today. That said, I don't think either of the Runescapes might be the kinda thing I'm looking for, but the story behind it is both inspirational and cautionary.

[@LoLrand0mness]

yeah, i started osrs relative late and the combat suxx ass. (pvp is a pure random roll mess - nothing that would ever interest me - have been top 0.1% in multiple other pvp games) started a skiller acc and only play the game like an idler :D

[@onlyusememontana]

@@LoLrand0mness Nowadays PVP (on pay to play servers, in free to play worlds it's quite simple and reliant on RNG) is actually very advanced and requires a lot of skill. You have to be aware of the tick-system and be able to do multiple switches (in under 0.6 seconds) with near perfect precision to be able to keep up with the rest. Being able to 'triple eat', escape using freezes and switch prayers, etc is all needed to pk these days. I would recommend trying out the Last Man Standing minigame since there you can try it out without the risk of losing your items and without having to build a player killing account that has specific stats you give you an edge. Apart from that a fair amount of game knowledge is needed too.

[@Kavou]

RS was more of a parent for me than my actual parents where. That fake gf lesson that I and everyone playing RS received that early in life, was priceless.

[@TheAdarkerglow]

It's always important to remember that, when we think of evolution, we're generally thinking of the success stories, because they're the ones that're easiest to observe. They're still with us, or at least were around long enough to leave an impression. Most Evolutionary Branches, however, are dead ends that don't go far or last long. And dramatic or extreme evolutionary mutations are relatively rare, and usually not successful.

[@Draugo]

Not gonna lie, the wilderness update, reducing random PK, replacing free trade with and auction house of sorts and protecting drops after death all sound like massive buffs to my interest, not negative blows to the game.

[@soundrogue4472]

You're in the minority on this one. People like having a sense of risk of, "oh I can lose all my stuff" you want a safer/ easier Runescape which nothing is wrong with that.

[@exantiuse497]

@soundrogue 4472 He is absolutely not in the minority. The overwhelming majority of players, both in RS3 and OSRS, are in favor of both the GE and item protection mechanics outside Wilderness. Losing most of your gear might have been fine back when you risked a 1-2M in total which would take you 4-8 hours to make, but not when you risk hundreds of mils that will take you dozens of hours to make back. Which is why OS, which has community polling for its updates, has item protection

[@soundrogue4472]

@@exantiuse497 that is bizzare to see. So people only cared about x game mechanic once gold drops got high enough?

[@displayer6023]

@@soundrogue4472 You are so confused about such a basic thing lmao

[@brijekavervix7340]

Yup, 2009 Runescape was peak Runescape and I'll die on this hill

[@cmosser144]

watching this while grinding the new Varlamore hunter rumors in OSRS

[@peterdowftw]

Same XD

[@CallumUpton]

Hunter rumors are so fun!

[@mattiasjohannorglaan2967]

I remember being 8 years old, not knowing english well enough & struggling with the tutorial island 'baking' part, being stuck on it for WEEKS til an older kid helped me out with it. I also remembering quite liking the Dungoneering - it being one of the few things i really got into on runescape. Good times.

[@Mischievous_Moth]

I still remember my first time traveling to Varrock, It's not a big deal now but I remember walking into the city and being amazed as a kid. This was in 2004... oh my god that was twenty years ago.

[@fang4223]

damn. same here. I remember it so clearly... the joy of discovering free food you didn't need to cook as you passed the cabbage farms, the moment of wonder when you passed by the unicorn, the oh shit with the bear that was nearby it, That one giant rat that would always target you right near the outer wall that killed me on my first journey that I will never forgive nor forget.

[@respectdat1]

The 2 things I remember the most back when I first started was: 1: the first month I started playing... I'd never even heard of varrock... all I had known was lumbridge. It wasn't until the fateful day that someone in full steel armor died at the cow pen somehow. I only managed to pick up his steel battleaxe. That was the day I ventured to Falador, thinking it was Varrock. 2: 2005 Easter event. I got to be a cute little bunny rabbit. Me and my friends would just say stupid shit whilst looking like a cute and harmless bunny. Literally just hopping around doing fuck all.... Man........ fuck........................

[@fang4223]

@@respectdat1 You can't go home again. The place you called home no longer exists. : /

[@dannysha6458]

Same I remember logging on in 2006, with my friend who got me into the game on the phone and he’s showing me around teaching me everything, it was wild going to varrock for the first time, seeing all the npcs and players

[@SissypheanCatboy]

yeah I'm gonna be honest, I think RuneScape is one of those things that solely exists because its got a mobile game level of addicting grind and nostalgia. Every time I hear something about this game its never about how fun the gameplay is, but about the social aspects and the "fond memories". I tried both new and old-school RuneScape and both times I just ended up thinking "wow, I could be playing literally _any_ other fantasy RPG right now and having a better time."

[@UmbrasMercy]

Actually there are 2 other major reasons for people liking it that i can think of. It is lighthearted and funny and doesn't take itself seriously (Commiting corporate espionage for the easter bunny in the new event as an example) and the fact that it's so solo friendly. There is no other MMO that's nearly as solo friendly, to the point it almost feels like a mmo single player game.

[@sporeham1674]

How can I be nostalgic if I never played it during my childhood? I just genuinely enjoy the grind, doing the same thing over and over is fun to me

[@SissypheanCatboy]

@@sporeham1674 fair but, counterpoint; Yo mama.

[@freddyready8756]

To me it feels like RS is having an identity crisis and people dont really know where to take it or bring new content. Sometimes with WoW too or other older MMOs. Liked it most when it was inbetween new and old RS, good mini-games, events, amount of people etc. New with convince but in other parts more grindy mobile experience. With way too much daily/timed content. Old, holding more value to some parts, but feels outdated, bugs, addons? Visual cues in both? But like most of these subscription based mmos, was cool and can have fun, but dated and expensive, also finds more ways to waste your time than actual progress.

[@freddyready8756]

Some quests are still cool in RS, some needs a bit of change, and the quest prepping is absurd in some places.

[@erichstanski6768]

Old school runescape is still alive. a lot of player and enjoy every second with this community

[@anarchisedlute3463]

RS3 ironman here, I think RS3's story is a sad one because Jagex has mishandled it so badly with their decisions over the years, to the point where people aren't even willing to give it a chance and only see it as 'the bad p2w version of Runescape that is funding OSRS's existence'. Like OSRS, RS3 genuinely has a lot of cool things going for it in its own right in its current state, and overall I find what it offers more varied and relaxing for somebody like me who has to work a lot and so can't dedicate myself to an active and linear grind. It's just that people only remember the low points, like the initial launch of EOC despite literally nobody wanting it, or the battle pass fiasco from last year. It seems that every time RS3 climbs up to a level of newfound respect, the Jagex execs find some way to milk and invalidate the already substantially smaller playerbase even more. It sucks, and I feel bad for the players and content creators who decided to primarily stick to RS3, because most of the people I've met on there are genuinely really nice and helpful, but they feel isolated by both Jagex and the wider RS community.

[@GuiriTV]

I resonate with that "isolated from the rs community". I think RS3, at the moment once they polished the hiccups from RS2 (EoC), is the best RS version if playing ironman. Tons of new skills, content, and convenience tools that I wish OSRS had. The mining/smithing rework was much needed, and I have yet to hear OSRS do something similar. There's a reason folks hate runecrafting, and RS3 made it enjoyable with the Runespan for leveling. This is coming from an 2007 veteran player who absolutely hated any skills outside combat. If the reason why folks dont like RS3 is the microtransactions, then just dont buy into it? Most of the perks arent even necessary or give anyone significant advantage. Sure, it makes people progress faster, but just stay in your own lane, go at your own pace, and it's much more fun than OSRS from my experience. It took me 3 years in OSRS to get combat level 80, and it took me a few months in RS3 to get 102. Ironman, no MTX, just QoL updates that make the game flow better.

[@HappyDragneels_page]

@@GuiriTV in OS we have a minigame now for RC that makes it much enjoyable (guardians of the rift) and were about to get updates to some of the most tedious skills like agility and thieving. i also dont think the biggest off-putter for rs3 is even eoc anymore, or the mtx, its the scale of the game people who jump right into the game and last played in 2010 are gonna find it much easier in the version of the game theyre familiar with. ive sunk 6 years into osrs and im not even maxxed yet rs3 to me is a game you have to have played as the content released, a lot like wow, as someone with zero wow experience youd really struggle to get into retail wow today, and thats what rs3 is, retail runescape

[@GuiriTV]

@@HappyDragneels_page I can def see that. I didnt have an issue being a returning player from original OSRS, but I had friends try RS3 and hate it because of how overwhelming it is. I have experience with FF14 and WoW, so RS3 was a breath of fresh air because it is WAY less complicated in combat than those games. But I never had trouble with the expanse of the game. Just use the wiki and set goals for yourself, and you learn a ton of new things. Im nowhere near close to PvM release content, but I dont have to be, because as an Ironman Im enjoying all the game content. Heck, I've even done Stealing Creation with an FC just to get the crafting skilling outfit, and all I had to do was a bit of googling to understand that content. Maybe I'll give OSRS a change again but RS3 QoL and new skills just make it more interesting. I know people say AFK-scape or dailyscape, but folks already play it like that from my experience. I log in, level one skill, and log out. They now just reward daily logins with fun minigames. Non-combat skills should be AFK, while quests and PvM should be active. That's a perfect balance I never saw OSRS have, where sometimes combat grind took forever.

[@YourFavouriteDraugr]

2007-2009 was in all truth still brilliant. The trading restriction didn't actually ruin the core gameplay, and all the additions at that time were good. Yes, even Dungeoneering.

[@fabiang334]

There is something i quite cant understand, why would you link venezuelan gold farmers right behind the removal of wilderness??? Venezuelans had no need to gold farm in the time such event happened, the economic crisis hit hard in 2017, so the influx of gold farmers actually peaked in that year, and we are talking about osrs in this case, because osrs gold actually held value in black markets unlike rs3 gold which was essentially worthless for them to farm

[@HappyDragneels_page]

there were gold farmers long before the venezuelans dude lmao, the price of gold was much higher back then too

[@fabiang334]

@@HappyDragneels_page I mean, yeah that's what im saying, vennies came to osrs

[@BloodwyrmWildheart]

You shouldn't care anyway. They're just leeches, like all MMO gold farmers.

[@Mapijs]

I stopped at the evolution of combat update, I hated it... untill I gave it a try and I really like how the action bar and abilities make bosses way more fun and complex, I do not want to go back to "you hit enemy" "enemy hits you" "repeat", to each his own

[@eddythefool]

I feel like RS2 combat did need an update in the early 2010's but the way it was done was completely wrong. A slow implementation with player feedback directing it as it was implemented could have mitigated some player loss.

[@fursty.]

fair, but at this point in osrs, the combat has evolved to be far more than just clicking on an enemy and waiting for attacks

[@daoyang223]

It was too slow. The afk combat like you mentioned is fun with friends. Lately its not about friends anymore.

[@HappyDragneels_page]

yet we managed to forge skill based pvm and pking in that same exact old skool combat system..... go check out odablock pking or rastaman smashing out an inferno run in 40 mins. it was " "you hit enemy" "enemy hits you" "repeat" " because you were a 12 yr old playing a level 50 combat character

[@evil993]

​@@eddythefoolplayers aren't game devs tho and RuneScape polls are like, a hellish joke of inefficient design/decisions. Unfortunately. Player feedback is super important but players don't always necessarily know what's best for the game.

[@helloruan]

Me having played RS in different forms basically my entire life and know everything about it's history but still sitting through this 45 minute video about the game's history.

[@theskulled4265]

Great video as always. It was a pleasant surprise l seeing some of my work in this video :) I had completely forgotten my old video of the Falador riots! It was also cool seeing the fresh start world trailer I made in here too :D

[@CallumUpton]

Dude, that video was nostalgic as hell!

[@jsx0328]

44 minutes to basically say: it was the microtransactions and EOC.

[@HappyDragneels_page]

what were you expecting? also thats not all he talked about, he also mentioned bots and goldfarmers, real world trading, the removal of free trade and in game gambling...

[@Blisterdude123]

5 seconds to type a comment on a video you watched five minutes of.

[@DarthChosen]

i play both games and dont think EOC is that bad at all. confusing to new players yes but once learned its just fine.

[@MeanBeanComedy]

​@@DarthChosenBingo! Happy to find another guy that plays both. 😎👉🏻👉🏻

[@captaincardigan1857]

Honestly, when I first heard of the squeal of fortune. Kid me thought it was an add-on to the circus minigame and was totally onboard with the idea… until I realized it was a gambling machine for you to get xp and gear….

[@Jolfgard]

Call me a tasteless idiot, but I had 2.5 years of fun during a period after EoC in Runescape 3.

[@CallumUpton]

Some people enjoyed it! And thats good!

[@Gutigwolfe]

I liked that the comabt was finally becoming more than click and wait. I was mainly a skiller, cus I found combat boring, but EoC was the direction I liked, minus some of the changes like removing weapon specials. Now the combat is fantastic IMO and is one the the things I enjoy the most. The combat is one of the biggest reasons I never went to OS. Even now I try to go back, but the combat is too boring. I like the idea of trying the newer content, but its hard on the head.

[@aarons6935]

It wasn't too bad directly after the EoC, i prefer old school but i didn't hate it.

[@doomsdoor]

I only enjoy rs3 with ironmen accounts which aren't so bad with all the updates to make eoc less bad

[@godlynewbie]

people hate change but expect change as long as it's exactly what they want. eoc was nice adding to the game and spicing things up so combat was no longer god tier boring

[@mattgibson9337]

I remember the EOC and yeah it was rushed out in an attempt to deal with a real problem that being 1 the combat system in general was good only for pvp and 2 weapons and armor were not intuitive best example of this was dragon claws which prior to EOC were 12 mil and thebonly reason you used them was for their special attack. Another issue was that for melee weapons; attack speed was the most important stat if it didnt have very fast or fast attack speed then it was suboptimal. On the armor side of thing ganodermic chest being one of the best armors for melee was again not intuitive. But probably the worst thing about pre eoc was that for level 60-70 gear had an absurd price difference. You went from dragon scim being 60k to an abyssal whip being i think around 400k (i could be wrong on that one) the sarawdomine sword and the zamy spear were a few million despite being level 70 weapons and all the good borrows weapons were also in the millions and while in that level range you didnt have any good money making methods available. Players in the level range and below would often complain about how the rich get richer and it was that hard to see why. Now again eoc on release was utter garbage. Bosses were pathetically weak abilities were janky as hell and it just felt unfinished. But that isnt the case today, nowadays the combat feels good to play, bosses are so much better compared to how they were pre eoc having actual mechanics besides just prayer swaping. They have legacy mode and revolution mode for those either new to the game or returning after having not played for awhile legacy making the combat very very similar to pre eoc combat and revolution acting as a middle ground between the two combat systems auto using abilities so you dont have too. It is genuinely frustrating seeing lots of people bash on rs3 for reasons unrelated to microtransactions. It has the best questing system in any mmo (and yes the quests are better then osrs) they fixed alot of the old and outdated skills and made them useful again. And they managed to create one of the best item sinks in the game in invention. They do alot of stuff right its just it constantly gets bashed for its combat system because people still think its like it was at eoc release.

[@UmbrasMercy]

The New EoC and Necromancy make it feel like a whole new game cause splashing was such an archaic mechanic it blows my mind that it was only just removed.

[@ElysianAura]

A bit surreal reading that Jagex knew the EoC was not liked, was in a state that was not favored in the beta but then said "oh shit, we'll have a content drought, better put it in anyways". That's just straight up in the anniversary book. If they had pivoted to do purely player voted content like OSRS eventually did at that time, I'd bet the game would be doing way healthier in general.

[@JackTheFallout]

I have played runescape for over 15 years on and off. I was so attached to my original account that's now rs3. Because of that, I never got into osrs. I wish I had accepted the death of runescape.

[@gabriellessa7706]

me to

[@sinine1100]

I still play RS3 with EoC OFF, just the visual noise is ... eugh.

[@lipvandip6480]

I just wish my original character never got converted to RS3, it'd be so nice and nostalgic to see my character in the version of the game he was born in.

[@penguinworldorder3545]

This here is why I can never play osrs my main character is stuck in a realm he doesn't belong in

[@Kourindouinc]

@@penguinworldorder3545 It definitely feels good once you can say you finally were able to beat your RS3 stats in OSRS. Speaking from experience.

[@Vroomerz]

As someone who played years and years of Asheron's Call, I am sorry for your loss.

[@ferinzz]

Ah yes. I love it when a dev tells me how valuable an item should be.. Nothing to go wrong there.

[@ixiolirion8781]

The GE was released a couple of weeks before the trade removal, and prices could shift up to 5% a day, so incorrect prices did have a bit of time to adjust before the free trade removal, while players could trade outside of the GE as well. That said, there were problems on those lines: Lots of players dumped items they had previously hoarded in their bank onto the GE so prices crashed very, very hard compared to what they had been before, especially for things like food, potions and runes. Many items had hard caps on the prices they could never rise above or below regardless of the demand (these were usually tied to a few hundred gp above a shop price/a few hundred gp below alch prices, but sometimes these were shops that most players couldn't or wouldn't reach so there was good reason for the item to be worth more). When updates came out that used a previously unused item, the price couldn't keep up for a while (unless jagex manually hiked the prices, which was usually total guesswork). The result was that the trade worlds remained active, but with people trading in "junk" - basically adding items that were vastly overpriced to a trade to balance out the sale of an underpriced item.

[@TylerDull]

Very entertaining and educational. Great video Callum!

[@CallumUpton]

Thanks! Glad you enjoyed it 😁

[@uchihazariya1148]

Ya that thumbnail all click bait. Plz callus. I like ur vids. Don't click bait us

[@SissypheanCatboy]

"clickbait is when the thumbnail is attention grabbing" you do not understand the meaning of clickbait.

[@LuigiDOTexe]

​@@SissypheanCatboy I think a better word would be "misleading." Runescape never truly died, so it's misleading to title a video, "The death of Runescape - The fall of a legacy."

[@iphoeniximarco5488]

What is going on with nightmare world? waiting for a update on that

[@Demonmack0]

Great video. I DID see most of this live, but its nice to see it all at once.

[@CallumUpton]

Glad you enjoyed it

[@warfighterarmy]

Now on to brighter shores.

[@ragincaucasian9209]

the aesthetic or art direction of Rs3 was just a turn off for me i don't know but i guess i might at least give it a try i don't know but good luck to andrew i guess

[@UltimatePerfection]

You can't make a successful MMO without $HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS budget, as Worlds Adrift, Boundel (not to be confused with Boundless, which has a huge company backing it), SkySaga, Linkrealms and similar attempts prove it. That thing will be dead within a year from release. Not in the "mmo ghost town" kind of dead, proper server shutdown dead.

[@HappyDragneels_page]

@@UltimatePerfection except when he did and made runescape in his moms kitchen..... hes literally done it before X D

[@UltimatePerfection]

@@HappyDragneels_page That's only because WoW, Black Desert, etc. weren't a thing yet. Now it's not gonna fly. Look at Linkrealms. Same antiquated concept (wannabe Ultima Online) and look where it lead them to (spoiler alert: bankruptcy).

[@vidaistvan1418]

In all fairness after the dust settled rs3 is a decent game, few months ago I started a fresh character for the hell of it after a bit of osrs burnout. If you can tolerate long hours of wading through the swamp of dead or empty early-midgame content the endgame pvm slaps quite hard and there is still the good old grindy RS under the surface, except instead of painstakingly grinding levels you autistically tweak your gear with invention archeaology and such. I will always prefer OS(started my first acc at 12 in 2005, so yeah i'm a vet) but I found genuine enjoyment in rs3 endgame. As one of my friends put it : "Rs3 begins at max total"

[@vidaistvan1418]

Also the rs3 playerbase is insanely dedicated and they are very nice and helpful people all around

[@AsianRailgun]

Just max combat tbh, you don't actually need to max plenty of skills but they happen to be decently fast to level up so might as well.

[@JonoabboFE]

Feels like a bit of a sensationalist/misleading title on this one to be honest with you

[@CallumUpton]

Is it? The game literally died

[@JonoabboFE]

@@CallumUpton Feel like the title implies it's currently a dead game, and it's legacy has "fallen" now. Could just be my perception, of course.

[@JonoabboFE]

Actually going back to look at it further I'm not even sure the assessment of it being "Dead" is correct. Social media up in flames? Complaints flooding the forums? That's the sign of a passionate, very much alive, fanbase. The lowest point at the graph you posted at 40:32 seems to reach about, what 35k players (The numbers in the top left don't match the date of the point shown so I am a little confused, also it has a bar for OSRS, but this was prior to OSRS existing?). That's not a dead game at all.

[@gregariousgaming6265]

@@JonoabboFE the forums officially shut down today. "Complaints flooding the forums?" is nomore

[@peterdowftw]

@@gregariousgaming6265 Why continue to host a forum when the reddit and discord is more popular?

[@raptor152]

OSRS is still fun, but it is a bit gross supporting Jagex with all their terrible decisions. Looking forward to Brighter Shores.

[@4dragons632]

The changes they made to trading honestly seems like a fantastic idea to me. I can understand people hating it, especially with the grand exchange being a rubbish replacement. But seriously, they managed to do it more fairly and intelligently than I would have done. Frankly I would have removed all trading of all items if it were me. All these other things the company did are terrible though. A very sad story.

[@exantiuse497]

Grand exchange is a very popular update. The removal of free trading was a hated change but the GE was a welcome change that saved a ton of time. After Old School was released the playerbasewas very conservative with updates, it struggled with the old trading system for 2 years before going "yeah, maybe we should have GE after all" and it finally passed the poll

[@evil993]

The ge was by far one of my favorite things added to runescape. I wasn't ever that hardcore into the game after the rise of other more popular games, but I played it a fair bit. I remember my buddy showing me to turn clay into wet clay and selling it for a profit or whatever. Just worked well imo.

[@travissapienza4930]

Reminds me of the fall of my favorite mmo conquer online. Removed all real ability to hunt to make money. Removed the maps specifically for that. Replaced the once thriving player driven market to a ghost town replaced by an npc you could just buy whatever you wanted as long as you had enough money on your credit card.

[@papapawpaw8877]

This is a sad video. I think most of us here remember runescape fondly and miss those simpler times before all this moneygrubbing corporate greed.

[@devinschwartz7596]

They made up for it with OSRS honestly, they did such a great job with that game

[@ZeroSupport1]

Runescape 3 gets a lot of hate from oldschool players, some of it deserved, especially right now it's in a very poor state, but it also did many things right and has a lot of good content IMO

[@Sl1mch1ckens]

Osrs player that poked his head into rs3 as i had never tried it, it wasnt for me and thats fine but fuck me do i want the toolbelt. I feel like osrs is kinda getting there with items like the fish barrel etc while not being a tool belt there are now items added to fix the lack of inventory space which i think is the closest we can hope for. I dont think a tool belt would pass the polls tbh lol

[@MeanBeanComedy]

I still love playing RuneScape. *Both* OSRS *AND* RS3. 😁

[@ashanator]

Nightmare world update when?

[@Tehgon]

Anyone watching this keep in mind he's just exaggerating for views. Game's doin fine I still play both versions and they're both great the microtransactions don't really effect the game, goes without saying if you don't like them don't buy them I personally don't buy keys when I play rs3 and I use what few I get doin in-game stuff on skills I dont particularly enjoy training and dont spend a dime on it. The idea that social aspect is dead is nutty I've never lacked people to chat with. They definitely did the EoC wrong but in the end they made it a lot better than when released and rs3 is fantastic now especially if you love the lore of the game. OSRS is great as well it even just had a great expansion release and have been really enjoying it.

[@CallumUpton]

Its a story of its past, the past doeant change the present. I mention this in the video...

[@Tehgon]

@@CallumUpton I don't think I suggested otherwise. Comment was about you exaggerating by calling it dead for multiple reasons that didn't actually kill it, saying the social aspect was gone etc etc but we get it gotta get those flashy clickbait titles and thumbnails. Been a subscriber since the earth 2 challenge stuff so its not like I'm some hater here to hate, though this was probably the first video of yours I've given a dislike to x D.

[@Madway]

Sadly even old school rs couldn't bring me back because it wiped my stats that took me 4+ years to farm =(

[@CallumUpton]

i feel you with that...

[@Langharig_Tuig]

This might be one of your best videos so far Callum. It's a very clear and well paced video that is great for someone like me who hasnt played or followed RS in years.

[@CallumUpton]

Glad you enjoyed it! 😁

[@stewie410]

Ahh, EOC -- the update that finally broke my addiction to the game. I do remember playing some EOC content as a kid, but _really_ not understanding it, and eventually gave up and moved on. I think I was around for all of the controversies as a kid, actually. I did return when OSRS was originally released, but couldn't get into it since all of my friends/progress were on my RS3 account; so I didn't feel like grinding it out again. I've recently committed the great sin of getting a friend into OSRS (unintentionally), and have returned to OSRS myself -- at least for the moment. I *really* like the community-driven content model Jagex has taken with oldschool; it really sets the studio/game apart, even if you ignore the antiquated graphics/design. That, and they really seem to be designing the game around "The community is people who played as kids; let's keep the dream going", which is also quite interesting.

[@Just_Flipy]

coming from someone who was an avid players, the chaos around the event was insane, i generaly liked it, but only because I started an entire new acount. meaning that I knew that my old acount was worthless anymore. the big improvements were however that magic and range were niver to play with, there was a learning curve and bosses seem to be cooler to kill. but I know a lot of players felt otherwise, which is why OSRS was so important. you did not have to grind anymore on rs3 like it used to, instead you now have to grind the learning curve of bosses instead. instead of relying on every combat lvl to be perfect, you know can take on bosses with your fav combat (magic was overpowered btw) but the truth is, this came out WAY too SOON. it should have been tested more with weapons, bosses should have been made harder, especially quest bosses, weapons should have been more imported that became obselete. but it needed to happen, runescape knew that pvp was going to end, somehow runescape knew before any other game that it was over, so they focused runescape onto PVE instead. there was no future for the old combat style with how runescape was moving forwards, but that does not mean it was usseless and runescape failed to see that. but we see now with osrs, that the issues are becoming stronger now. a month ago runescape came out with a new combat update, it fixed everything that the evolution of combat was missing, like showing the damage you are going to deal with each ability. but it took UNTIL NOW FOR THEM TO DO IT. how can they make such an combat update without them being able to fix it to the lvl it needs to be? thats why OSRS was better, they were able to fix and add updates to the game how it needs to be. and while EOC was great, runescape was unable to add updates to it in forms that mattered for so long. but right now I enjoy my resource gathering, my farming of animals, and then do my bosses and hope I dont make that one mistake that destroys all my progress on its rage (arch glacior) :(

[@mrtango1824]

Never played runescape, didnt have the internet when it was all the range when i was in school. But odd parallels in rmt issues with escape from tarkov.

[@grayaj23]

Hey! I saw Gilded Weebsword last week at the Tacoma Dome! It was awesome, until the lead signer slipped and cut the power to the bass players amp. No one really noticed, though.

[@Eliwood407]

Oldschool runescape has come back to life. RS3 is still dead to many of us, and not just because of the numbers. I think I am safe to say OSRS players side with the OSRS dev team, and we want nothing to do with the RS3 team after they tossed us out in a wild gamble to make their game popular.

[@RedHoodRubyRose]

Many updates that Runescape did is questionable. I had to submit a ticket when they change how email works, with high and lower keys being sensitive. So I lost my account, it took them 3 months for them to get back to me and basically tell me "We banned your account" ... Never touched the game again.

[@Axterix13]

The one nice thing about Runescape Classic that other games with their "classic" servers lack is that it doesn't continue down the time line. Playing something like WoW classic, for example, means you will experience the game falling off midway through Lich King (or wherever your own breaking point is). Those servers will never be a long term home, because the reason why there is a demand for them in the first place will be added to the servers. It's just a matter of when. Actually splitting it, making its own game, avoids this issue.

[@CallumUpton]

the fact they keep OSRS updated is incredible!

[@dannysha6458]

I quit RS at the end of 2010 because I got hacked at 122 combat and 192mill. When eoc happened it pretty much cemented that I would never return. By the time OSRS dropped I was 17 and didn’t even care about games because I was partying in school. I plan to return once sailing drops

[@RayRictor]

The turning point was skill capes, that's when I saw the massive shift in everyone's attention, the old community didn't last long after. WIldy ditch, GE were extreme annoyances & what made me finally walk away EOC.

[@damyzs]

Now do death of nightmare world

[@t-yoonit]

I blame the vote to add sailing to OSRS for the death.

[@ruthmorrison3962]

Thanks for this video, I actually wound up quitting Runescape just after the point where they introduced the Grand Exchange and the player-to-player trading limits, I remember before that happened there were all kinds of like "companies" on the forums where there were groups of high-level miners or woodcutters or etc. who would deliver large orders of ore to people who wanted to train smithing, for example, or wood for people training firemaking or fletchery. I actually got most of my mining levels because someone contacted me to get them a large amount of iron... and the Grand Exchange basically killed off that whole part of the community even if it did make buying things more convenient sometimes. I haven't been paying any attention to what happened to it after that, but I dunno, now I'm thinking I might check out old school some time, to see if I'm still into it.

[@kaliek5281]

See when I think "Runescape" the 2D version is what I think of. I started about a week or so aftwr the Wilderness was initially added. I played up until it went ***3D*** and stopped shortly after. I used to call it the Poor Mans Ultima Online, cause it was VERY MUCH inspired by UO but had no subscription fee back when I started playing. It got me through rough times. I was able to play in the hospital after surgery because their game room had an old PC and RS was a simple browser game back then.. Its crazy to see how far its come since then.

[@eddythefool]

So the issue with EoC is that it was my gateway to other MMO combat systems so when I decided to check other games out they are able to get a better hold of me from the start. I'm not saying that without EoC i wouldn't be a FF14 player, but it made getting used to the combat system way easier and since the game was designed from the start to work with that system it avoids the weird quirks that RuneScape ended up with.

[@AmberKrenn]

thank you for this rundown history of RS. I never actually really played it. I went from text-based MUD straight into guild wars so this was really intersting from an outsider/RS nublet POV :)

[@luizdrumer]

I worked as a seller of runescape gold in for a Canadian company for a month, our suppliers were mostly Venezuelan players, it was very disheartening their plead to not scam them because that gold was needed for bitcoin to pay for food or other stuff.

[@ArDeeMee]

So this is why you‘ve been quiet for so long… Well worth the wait. I‘ve never played Runescape or EVE, but both are incredibly fascinating to me. Both are quite famous for all kinds of shenanigans, and hearing from someone who was there when they happened, and in such detail, is my favorite kind of entertainment. 🙏

[@CallumUpton]

Thanks! Im glad you enjoyed it! 😁

[@SnowyRains]

omg im so grateful you did this video. I used to play runescape in the early 2000s and only just logged back in the other day and was like WTF happened to runescape???? looks like i need to be playing old school runescape. Though i remember back in the day mum used to warn me "i dont want you playing runescape or have anything to do with runes its evil blah blah." I got away with playing and being a member by saying I'm playing Run Escape lmao

[@kentuckyproproductions1624]

Eoc combined with having to start over on osrs to get what I wanted back pissed me off so bad that I just started playing again in 2024

[@mnnervi]

2 minutes in and Callum has already put all the cards on the table. That is something I haven’t seen ina youtube video in a long time

[@jkasaunder228]

Andrew Gower is just about to drop a new game he's been working on for the last decade or so.

[@CallumUpton]

ive been watching closely, im super excited to see more

[@GYOJIBOT]

EoC was founded on a bed of lies. They brought in a bunch of developers that didn't work on the game prior. I remember one Jmod during EoC beta claiming their favorite weapon combination was a whip in the main hand and a crossbow in the off-hand! Cross-class dual-wielding is possible, but is so ineffective it's practically worthless. There were other lies, like saying it would make it possible to create more complex boss encounters. Dungeoneering on its own proves that EoC wasn't needed for complex boss fights. OSRS continues to prove that a lie. EoC was bland, and most abilities were just "click here to increase DPS." It's a combat system with no real identity, and the change stripped Runescape of its niche in the process.

[@belstar1128]

the early 2010s period was very bad for mmos when they discovered microtransactions combined with a mindset of making everything linear and easy world of warcarft and most great mmos from the 2000s went down hill during this period .some learned from their mistakes during this period but the genre was forever damaged from what happened during those years

[@LilskeevsGaming]

Great video 💯💪🏼🐇

[@dl2ndnp]

I'm all for video essays but the way this was made, sounds like callum was just reading off script. Even the jokes he had were just read. I think I would have my attention more immersed if callum tried talking about it than reading about it

[@Lonit-be]

everyone has a script for these kinds of videos, I think we're just not used to Callum doing them

[@zackjoseph9127]

In regards to pvp. Drop potential was a thing. Someone could risk 100m in items and when they died you got at most 150k from the kill. It was a dark time

[@LAKXx]

You either die a hero or live long enough to see yourself become the villain

[@SandroWalach]

I played Runscape for less than one hour. It was the game I learned that I dislike PvP games. I left and never returned. Still, this story was a sad one.

[@jeremalice]

I love a good happy ending I remember back then agreeing with some changes but when evolution of combat appeared that's when i stopped caring prior to that played regularly on my school's computer Runescape helped me grow some bonds with some of my friends and even to this day i always come back to old school for some good mindnumbing grind

[@thomaskrogh1244]

Got a dreamworld ad on this vid😅

[@zomgl2pnoobffs]

Guinness Records is a racket that will create and populate a record category for money in a backroom deal. I've dealt with them. Everyone should stop talking about them.

[@Unknown_Genius]

The only reason we talk about them is because it's noted down and everybody and their grandma knows them. Yeah, it's dumb that most of the records solely exist because they charge money. On the other hand: Once it exists you can beat whoever paid for the entry.

[@gretchen457]

Great watch

[@Milennin]

I was already not that interested anymore around the early 2010's, but I completely dropped out with the Squeal of Fortune, lol.

[@wach9191]

OSRS was the best thing ever.

[@lolxmew6114]

Brighter shores is gonna be so dope

[@imskiller99]

Go to wintertod on the iron "Yooooo, just got a t-bow on my main" "gz, split, cv lvl, nice" "Anyone know how to trasfer it to old school" Wintertod chat engaged

[@Vinewood8]

great vid to watch on my 2nd monitor while doing wintertodt

[@valo6302]

Great video! :)

[@MysticalDeerKnight]

It's funny because the MMOs I spent the most time on was Everquest and Everquest II. I've barely touched Runescape and couldn't really get into it, however, I don't think Runescape ever died, it's always been a massive success and the QoL updates, from what I've heard, were great so.. this video just sounds like the same type of people screaming "FF14 is DEAD, WoW is DEAD, GW2 is DEAD" etc. when they're doing fine and will continue to do fine for quite some time. I will, however, agree that EQ and EQ2 are both dead/dying.

[@KoffinKat]

It's bonkers that effectivelly eliminating one of (if not THE) biggest root of toxicity in games, PK-ing, was viewed as a bad thing by the community. Sometimes, we view the past through rose-tinted glasses, things like this instantly remind you that the past actually kinda sucked 🤣

[@mikcon63]

The thing i hated the most was they migrated all the characters to RS3 and i couldn't restore it to OSRS and had to start from scratch.

[@No_Doe]

Just got a DreamWorld ad on this video

[@Afrecta]

Can't wait to play Brighter Shores later this year!

[@CallumUpton]

Or me!

[@dakotaDklunsford]

there are still thousands of people who are playing either version daily, not sure if you got your acct banned and are upset or what lol. this game still has more people playing than quadruple and triple a titles. shame callum.

[@fastpuppy2000]

This is covered in the video there, bud.

[@Syphonfllter]

​@@fastpuppy2000 What good is that if it's BS regardless? Lol.. doesn't make any sense to me.

[@AArdW01f]

Listening to you read the removal of free trade justification word for word gave me a millenial vietnam flashback Woah i literally memory holed the replaced wilderness. *spits in disgust* If only they had the idea for bonds in 2007. And yet EOC was all this and 10x worse. Rioters on runescape are some of the most noble citizens of the internet. My account turns 20 this October.

[@paulsmith410]

Oof! When I heard the description of Squeal of Fortune I cringed so hard. Buying items with microtransactions is one thing (whether cosmetic or game changing). But, buying a "chance" to get an item. Evil.

[@kagari1426]

I remember when v3 was launched, and alot of people didnt like it. I didnt mind it

[@kagari1426]

Though one thing I think came out with eoc was armor getting bumped up a level. Like I had a character that could would rune armor or weapons, don't remember which. But yeah I had to grind up the stat another 10 levels

[@Xhotic]

OSRS is still poppin' and had its record number of players in the recent months (whom apparently were actual players, not bots, Claimed by Jagex) so i dunno bro, RS3 is cooked yea but if you are an Avid Runescape enjoyer, youll already of known that by now.... OSRS is where your cared for, RS3 is the ex you wish you could forget ruined your life by making everything costs money and force feeding you nonsense MTX

[@MichaelOcherz]

RS3 is probably the game I have the most hours in. I play it over OSRS largely because I love EOC combat (it differs from a lot of other ability combat systems in being more about planning and micro-optimisation than reactive, and I'm a video gamer who prefers spreadsheets to twitch reactions). With that being said, launching it *in the existing game* was obviously fucking stupid. As it happens, I've been playing OSRS for the best part of a year now because I'm ironically unhappy with some more recent changes to the combat system which is now removing the best things about it, and OSRS has better skilling, better questing and better graphics (this seems counter-intuitive but a consistent art style is so much more important than pixel count IMO).

[@jordanhardwick9046]

I enjoy playing runescape until they release rs3 and the customizable interface. What kills rs3 for me is the dailies, everyting is daily oriented like Player owned ports, daily challenges, there are SO MANY

[@iwolfman37]

Runescape 3's combat is good and underrated. Unfortunately Jagex still doesn't care, but the devs that worked to make Runescape 3 good again do and they did a great job

[@raid_or_die8962]

"It shouldn't effect actual players AT ALL" is the craziest line I've ever heard. The single worst decision Runescape ever made and at the time they were like. "There not even gunna notice. Taking away trading and the wilderness is gunna be so smooth there not even gunna notice" dumb dumbs man. I get they were dealing with a lot but because your having people hurt the game the solution isn't drop a fucking nuke on the whole game. "I know how will get rid of the gold sellers. Make the game unplayable and then they won't have anything to sell. Boom! We're geniuses." I can only imagine how everyone looked at the guy who had that idea. That man should never be allowed to work on another game again

[@CommissarMitch]

Going into this quite literally all I know about this game is Sea Shanty 2.

[@SetariM]

I'm literally in F2P OSRS after finishing Dragon Slayer 1 on a new character right now, fishing up swordfish and tuna in Corsair Cove lmao. But yeah, the population of the game is really dead. :(

[@TurtleKwitty]

Never quite knew what exactly happened to casue OSRS just that it appeared; but how in th fuck did no one at jagex think they should just... make a new game if they're remaking the game in the first place for EoC ??????