Can Master Duel EVER Be Competitive?! (Discussion)

[@RiverHawthorn-i4j]

I don't know why they dont add more permanent game modes in master duel. A tourment mode or draft mode would be great.

[@CarlitoxL25]

Hilarious how the "best of" always escalated stupidly from 3 to 200 something😂

[@FlareBlossom]

I loved this new general discussion video format from you, I hope you start doing more also really solid/intelligent takes, good logic, couldn't agree more

[@shivagaming1085]

What if the game let you build going 1st and going 2nd version of the deck, same rules apply as with the side deck in TCG. After the coin flip the game automaticly takes the version of your deck acording to the toss result. Still a Bo1 but now going 2nd you have better chances to have a good match.

[@almisami]

Holy shit, I never thought of that, but that's fucking brilliant.

[@solemnyugioh]

I think you'd find people playing two completely different decks lol. With the most degenerate board-breaker+OTK approach going second and the most degenerate floodgate flipping going first.

[@joelm3281]

This could work. Just add the side deck option when editing the deck so you can only use those when prompt something like, "edit deck before the duel?"

[@kiba2780]

​. True, unless there was a limit on how many different cards you're allowed to have between both decks.

[@heartbeat9429]

​@@solemnyugioh konami can make an in game restriction so that the 2 version of the deck are still familiar. There can only be 15 cards difference (like a side deck). With that, you cannot have your runick spright as your go1st deck but, Galaxy eyes as your go2nd deck

[@KnightlyBrosGaming]

When you mentioned all that stuff about Maxx C and its counters, I felt that. I love building my decks with cards that support the deck, but lately, I've had to sacrifice that in order to have Maxx C and its counters. Really hope Maxx C gets banned, especially with Spright now who can search the level 2 Maxx C.

[@Shirouya]

The thing, without maxx c people will have one less disturbing when they go second as much people hate maxx c but we have acknowledge how to it help the game in general, without It people won't face much problems in doing long combos and making all negate board which won't let you play, with maxx c in truth almost 90% of decks need combo, this why maxx c is very effective card that's should never get banned

[@darkerhaze5233]

Amazing outro 🤣, also those where all very good points i always thought MD needed a harsher banlist for power cards like Max c, and skill drain ever since i built swordsoul and thought this deck is so fair since it requieres skill... and then i saw protos wasnt banned WTH

[@earlsaverson5387]

I honestly would rather have MD stay B01 to give it different flavor from the TCG. Some people wanted MD to be purely a testing sim for IRL play, but we already have, uh, other avenues for that. Konami just needs to commit to making an actual B01 format. Limit/semi-limiting dumb floodgates hurts consistency, which is nice, and makes it harder for them to draw an additional floodgate if you actually Twisters/Cyclone them... But at the end of the day, Maxx C takes up the backrow removal slots that could combat dumb floodgates. Engines are so powerful and condensed these days, it is interesting to see just how much interaction you can slot in to cover your butt versus any matchup, and to see how much you can cut into engine to improve your interaction without bricking. But playing the Maxx C minigame actively impedes that deckbuilding aspect. Some players have gone on record saying wide-open formats aren't as good, because in the current game, that could mean that there's too many blowout cards that you don't even have room to sideboard for. That's like triple the case for B01 format with no sideboard. B01 just can't support blowout cards. Most have to be outright banned if not limited.

[@EricGT_YOC_Winner2008]

The original yugioh online had match duels built into the game. Not sure why Konami is hesitant to add match duels to MD.

[@micheal_fontes]

Amazing video as always solemn

[@scxizm]

This is why i think conquest/gauntlet format is the best competitive format for card games.

[@vitorapollinario9335]

Just why can't we have the two? Why everything with Konami needs to be 8 or 800? Or we have a tier 0 or 5-10 decks that can make an top. They could just make a ranked mode better of 3, just that, don't need to exclude best of one, just make the two... .

[@Lich_V.]

I completely agree. Best of one is not only fine as a format but also for competitive tournaments. The thing which is holding the competitive side of MD back ist that MD is not balanced for a best of one format (e.g. Maxx C and the tons of floodgates).

[@G4Gano]

Worth every second, thank you for telling it as it is!

[@bballhunter2988]

Ban Maxx "C" and it gets instantly better. It doesn't balance anything, the good combo decks thrive with or without it because it has no damn restrictions. It just adds another coinflip to determine the winner and gives less skillful players a higher chance to cheese out wins from good players. Deckbuilding is stale and it makes the meta more favorable for floodgate strategies. As long as Konami listens to the people who don't get why the card is toxic specifically in Master Duel which has a BO1 format, the card will never be banned though.

[@almisami]

Maxx C is there because the OCG is addicted to it. At least they're getting a biiiit better with hitting problem floodgates now.

[@tymedia5717]

you forgot one important part being the the ban list follows the ocg where the card is at 3 until the ocg changes it master duel wont change it

[@Noojtxeeg]

Really great take on this topic. Bo3, while great, also has it's own issues too. I'd rather have Bo1 but have something like a double elimination bracket.

[@shanedukorn4854]

Floodgates are more toxic in best of 1 than best 3

[@Beelzebubz24]

Solid takes! Would be cool to see you collab with MBT & crew sometime

[@bryanboria608]

For me it’s the time. like if I have play someone 3 times it’s gonna be over an hour. Ranking up would take forever

[@rokmare]

Yugioh seem to be balance around side decking to prepare decks for different plays which is impossible to do in master duel BO1 format

[@silver100091]

why not best of 2? that way both player has the chance of going first. then if the both lost going second it's a draw. I think this is the most fair way of doing it.

[@vysusvt]

That was an excellently crafted pitch.

[@renaldyhaen]

I love how control deck with minimum special summon never be an option for Maxx "C" problem. It is okay to make "combo in check" because combo needs sacrifice their slot and consistency, because today most combo only need 1-1.5 to play. Easy access to generic extra deck is a great advantage too because they have a lot of consistent options to use. . Most people talk like they will kick Ash and Called from their deck if Maxx C gone. And use condition where Maxx "C" magically always appear in hand without any counter in opponent's hand. Of course, if Maxx "C" has effect like Quicksilver in Marvel Snap, it would be broken card.

[@13ytby]

Right now the "Dice roll" is who drew maxx c and who didn't draw the answer to it

[@momiji7308]

THE MAGICAL HATS!

[@Billy_Wyatt]

Solid input Solemn. At this point, everyone wants to see Maxx C gone because like...every game revolves around it.

[@xenonim]

3 maxx c, 3 ash blossom, 2 called by grave and 1 crossout designator is a must in card building deck. Semi-limited some top floodgates yes it already hit the consistency but I prefer some top floodgates must be limited to 1 copy. Maxx c really need to ban in MD to be honest and crossout designator must return to 3 copy as imperm currently have only 1 card to out it as so difficult to negate it.

[@beelzeduard]

I believe MD with its BO1 format can be competitive. The problem is the banlist. The current one in MD is safe to say, not good enough. You can't use BO3 banlist for BO1. Aside from the maxx c problem you've mentioned, balancing the banlist for BO1 is quite tricky. There are a lot of cards that provide unfair advantages in BO1 format, that must be taken care of. But this is such a huge homework for Konami that I'm 100% sure they'll ignore it. If Konami don't bother changing the banlist, I think any competitive events should be held in BO3, at least. For ranked, IMO it would be better if Konami implements a different rank system (BO1 and BO3) with different rewards.

[@jakequinsee]

Great video!

[@charliewijaya4447]

BO3 with side where skill has more plays… BO1 cheesy decks and luck has higher winrate lol

[@wicked_t_wraith]

Konami is more than aware of how problematic Maxx "C" is for Master Duel and they actively choose not to do anything about it.

[@z-o-r-o1007]

Excellently said

[@OverlyCriticalAnime]

I don't you are factoring in the power of these decks where if you don't have an out or some how draw into an out you just lose. It can become to fringe

[@Jeyz1965]

In a best of 1 you automatically lose if you brick. In best of 3 it can happen and there are 2 more games to win. So luck becomes much more important. And you can easily lose to Decks like Numeron you wouldn't In the TCG. You have to build less consistent Decks because you needs outs for a lot of things or automatically lose to some decks

[@Jyxero]

You said everything... The argument of "Maxx C to keep combo in check" would be resolved with going second cards such as Dark Ruler, Kurikara, or, yes, creative techs to make your deck even more potent (Case and point: @Mathmech circular, but outside of Cyberse decks) Tearshizu will make Maxx C stick for a while, again, as people will complain about combo (And ends up playing floodgates to counter that even further), but hopefully skill expression with a proper banlist pre-Tearshizu (Kitkallos banned pre release?) makes people think twice before asking for those annoying cards to stick around to counter it

[@josephmurphy6127]

Maxx C being used to keep combo decks in check always made me laugh since all combo decks I've ever seen also run Maxx C at 3. It isn't a card designed to keep in check one strategy, it's just an inherently unfair card in this day and ages yugioh since everything has special summons.

[@dewanegara8333]

@@josephmurphy6127 it does has more chance to keep combo deck in check when you are going second more than going first tho. Going first on turn one you most likely won't throw it since it give the least benefit. Going second on turn 0 is the best timing to throw it up since it gives the most benefit. Getting second and opp maxx c you on turn 1? Just draw the out like DNRM+evenly bro. Can't draw the out? Just use maxx c during turn 0 and pray that it resolve.

[@lostinthenight2005]

@@josephmurphy6127 I wonder if it would be possible to add an restriction to Maxx C, for example you are only able to use it if you have an empty field, that would help keeping the combo decks in check and also help not being abused when you already have a field.

[@renaldyhaen]

@@josephmurphy6127 Because Combo deck should sacrifice their slot and consistency. While most combo now only need 1-1.5 card combo with easy access to generic extra deck.

[@NotsoNaisu]

Do you think Master Duel should have a reload mechanic since it is a FT1 game like how other online TCG’s allow you to shuffle back bad cards? Although this would be an all or nothing in my scenario as I think shuffling back specific cards might be too good.

[@WOLFKW1]

i maybe is att low level but if the (enemy) playing max c i end the turn i do the minimum for protection gud or bad don't know

[@returningwhisper]

No side deck is the biggest difference in Bo1 imo.

[@necolgordon7219]

Without maxx c how would I beat Sprite with my blue eyes deck?

[@sauravistheascended7161]

All the BO1 players are shaking at the prospect of BO3

[@solemnyugioh]

I play the tcg, Im fine :^)

[@sauravistheascended7161]

@@solemnyugioh that's what I mean, us TCG players are fine

[@jameilmcnally9022]

The thing is...Md has maxx c

[@rhyned]

Maxx C/Ash/Call are problems. After that, Combo Cooking that ends up with big monster negation are problem. Yugioh has so much problems.

[@BellesBottes]

Maxx C is okay if you know how to play Faris

[@inhalethegreenexhalethedre4443]

For me the problem is not the game being best of 1 but the fact that it's clearly rigged , anyone who's been playing Master duel or Duel links for long enough knows what I mean.. it got to the point that I predict the card that I'm going to draw next , it happened more than once or twice.. for example , when I see my opponent setting many cards and passing , I know I'm gonna draw into Harpie's feather duster or i already have it in my hand.. once I lost a game where I was playing a Eldlich deck , i went second , set 5 and passed.. my opponent had set a card called "Straight flush" who the fuck plays straight freaking flush?? I didn't even know that card existed.. that's no coincidence like what's the chance? Konami does this to make "Anime duels experience" but sometimes it just feels like the game doesn't let you win , no matter how you build your deck, also drawing 3 copies of the same card in your opening hand , that happens a lot.. and sometimes you get the perfect hand with each piece of the combo you need or the cards to counter exactly what your opponent do.. That's not competitive nor fun

[@TheLumaknight]

So as someone who exclusivley plays best of 1 heres my take. I think yugioh is one of the highest variance card games. So mych is determined by 5 cards and the die roll even if its best of 3. In contrast i think flesh and blood (another best of 1 like vanguard) is the most competative game. You see a lot of your deck and there is a low chance of bricking since every card dose everything. This is also helped by the us nationals, worlds and the larest calling (mtg gp) all being won by the same guy. As well as protour 2 being won by the guy who won uk nats. You always see the same names at events. Even the case in vg people like derick dao and solemn do well every event every format. and a lot of yugi players say vg is all luck. I really dont think best of 3 is the deciding factor for yugiohs competative viability it verys so much format to format

[@monarch2500]

My thing is that master duel should 1000 fucking percent replace remote duel, bc I’m sorry to say this, remote duel, has to many problems, mainly cheaters, there have been some ppl caught cheating playin that stupid format and they should use the master duel for there online tournaments u know

[@WShoup9818]

Ocg main event is bo1. Top cut is bo3. Ocg basically always wins worlds so.

[@TheNewblade1]

When will ppl put respect on belle name. She can negates the called by forcing your maxc through, that is unless they also have the gamma.....

[@determinedoolemon1327]

Never

[@5.99USD]

Yugioh was designed with side decking in mind which is why I prefer BO3.

[@claudiopolonia7854]

I disagree somewhat. Best of One means I’m forced to gimp my deck to main cards that are normally only side worthy to counter the sheer amount of gimmicky or goofy decks that win without giving you a fighting chance. If I fight Despia I know for a fact they’ll never side most floodgates because it hurts them so I’m not gonna lose to them because I mained 3 cosmic cyclones.

[@solemnyugioh]

Cosmics taking care of branded in red and/or branded lost isn’t bad at all. If you weren’t forced to play 10 cards for the dumb maxx c minigame, that commitment would feel extremely natural in MD.

[@claudiopolonia7854]

@@solemnyugioh backrow removal is also pointless against sprite because they always have a negate handy in my experience

[@claudiopolonia7854]

@@solemnyugioh you’re dead on about the Maxx C situation, that’s not even a debatable point

[@claudiopolonia7854]

@@solemnyugioh you should make a video about players addressing Maxx C as necessary evil and perhaps debunk the whole thing

[@ksiliana]

Games have different mechanics and playing a best of one even though it might work for one it may not work for the other. Not to mention that most people don't know how probabilities work. Even the person that you know that was topping, might have just always won the dice roll or their opponents bricked but most importanly, anyone can participate and most people can't even read. And I'm asking you honestly now, have you really watch any of those tournaments? Most of them are laughable, just watch all the finals and you can see for yourself that most of the people there, don't even know how to play their own deck, yet manage to win. I have seen many people saying that these tournaments are good because good ocg player take part in but none of them have actully watched any of those tournaments.

[@hongsing1073]

Now u just go and win one to prove your point. Thank sir.

[@ksiliana]

@@hongsing1073 I love your answer. When you grow up and your iq grows come back and reply again.

[@hongsing1073]

With your IQ, my peanut size IQ is sufficient smileyface

[@ksiliana]

@@hongsing1073 Just the fact that you have the need to insult me to make a point is enough.

[@hongsing1073]

Look who started to insult first.. Dont act like a victim all of a sudden. Thanks sir

[@Mulcam29]

The game is competitive, people just can't understand how it is. Like VG is definitely comp even with Bo1. I can disagree about decks, but I'll admit other builds probably always will be better.

[@MitternachtssternXIII]

Master Duel rng is rigged

[@AdreusF]

Card that make something in check is bs, also card that need specific anwer is also bs They need make destroy great again

[@Bio0012]

Master Duel can be competitive, but Konami needs to hit or ban problematic cards that force the player to either have the out or they lose. Example cards are Maxx C, maybe Grass, and maybe some sacky floodgates.

[@zhipengren]

but we need tearlaments though

[@tomcrizzel9321]

I only played competitive when maxx c was legal. I have nostalgic feelings for that card and even I want it banned.

[@D4rk_Dragon926]

The only problem is calling it best of 1 which first sounds stupid and didnt even makes sense. Luck impacs all versions that and what deck you have especialy in a competitve Environment it matters even less how good a Player knows the game because they all know the same. I wouldnt compare yugioh to chess because chess needs real skill and thinking

[@youtubeenjoyer7279]

game 2 and 3 in a best of 3 format nowadays imo is less skillful than their game 1's since the release of thrust. players can now search a dedicated floodgate(d barrier etc.) that can completely shutdown their opponent which makes winning game 2 going 1st is more likely then proceed to game 3 as deciding factor, this makes best of 1 more competitive, skill based and deckbuilding oriented than best of 3, the problem is that MDkonami didn't have a banlist aggressively tailored around best of 1. lastly BAN MAXX C~! f*ck that card., aside from dedicating 1/4 of your 40card deck and playing a maxx c mini game before any turn, you also/definitely need to put board breakers (raigeki, lightning storm, feather, black hole, kaiju, lava golem, sphere mode etc) and negates (imperm, droplet, drnm etc) for their constructed board which eat another chunk of your 40card deck., 1/2 of your deck are already spent which should only be around 1/4 if maxx c is banned., on top of that, your deck should be able to 1card combo to have a chance of winning. "maxx c keeps combo deck in check" - as if the combo decks are also not running maxx c. to sum it up: -banlist tailored for best of 1 -ban maxx c -ban floodgate -promote back and forth interaction = "duel"

[@rastafari2k3]

Tournaments are bo3, right?. Bo3 is too slow, and the only incentive currently for ranked play is either practice or for fun. The bo1 format is all about your winrate over several matches, as the online environment let's us pump out way more games per day than TCG. One loss here or there because of Maxx C or whatever does not matter at all. Maxx C reduces the winrate of decks that have long combos vs decks that aren't reliant on special summoning. It's annoying to deal with in combo vs combo matchups where one player draws it and the other one doesn't. But the bigger picture matters more for Konami, I think They could have different banlists for ranked vs comp play, though. Idk

[@charliewijaya4447]

Yeah and when the combo player has maxx c in hand with negates going first… ez game

[@CrimsonKnight]

best of 1 isn't the problem the shitty banlist is

[@WhiteRaito]

and the flood to the power crept itself

[@zaczez92_ygo]

OCG is BO1 and is obviously competitive...

[@Cardlimits]

I've played vanguard, truth is a best of one is always doable. since it's a different banlist as well it just makes players build differently with what the banlist entails, no different than any other.

[@DuelistWave]

3:27

[@carlosjavierpalacios6793]

yeah, as a chess player the yugioh community seems like a bunch of caveman screaming over fire. The fact that they wont even agree on a serious time control is WILD to me, everyone is a meta sheep, no one takes time to study cards and memorice combos ("oh, a 3 minute combo, my attention span can handle it"), people still complaining about going first (going first is an advantage in game since the dawn of humanity, get use to it), everybody is salty about anything (like backrow, combo, negates, floodgates, etc.) and basically, the community talks a lot without going nowhere. Go to a chess forum, no one will ever talk about how the sicilian defense is broken and stuff like that, because we know: if you want to win, you need to get gud. People here instead complaint about maxx c... great community guys. I'm here because I find yugioh fun and time efficient, but the community is trash beyond his content creators...

[@main-browsing5521]

format yes, bo1 ladder hell no

[@martin22336]

But yugioh is a luck based game. Chess is competitive because both players have the same exact set of rules. Yugioh isnt chess

[@Adalon-]

Bo3 allows for more skill expression in deck building than bo1. Also your entire argument is based off a hyperbolic strawman, which you yourself admit. Bo1 also allows for more """toxic""'" decks to reign (see Runick) that otherwise in a bo3 wouldn't fo well due to side decking. To counter them in bo1 you have to hurt your deck just to slot in sub optimal cards just in case so you don't auto lose the match up. You then now perform worse in every other matchup as a result. Not to mention the other cons to bo1 Maxx c with no answer drawn? Gg Going 2nd without a handtrap due to draw rng? Gg Etc, etc, etc. These issues go beyond mere competitiveness and impact the overall quality of the game and how fun it is. So yes, bo1 bad.

[@Adalon-]

And yes, maxx c bad

[@solemnyugioh]

An argument and an illustration are not the same thing.

[@hongsing1073]

As mention in video, BO1 is where all the rogue deck could shine. Making BO3 or BO11 argument is the same, as number of games go higher, players will start to realize best deck in the format will be the deck that does not lose to blow out cards, thus more tier 0 format, and guess what, meta will be still the same dead boring

[@arrownoir]

Maybe once Maxx C is booted. Stupid card.

[@andrewgood7586]

None of this matters because master duel sucks anyway.

[@alexanderdennis7307]

Ban Maxx c petition

[@f2pdood56]

TCG nerds talk smack about Master Duel being Best of 1 because of the Ranked Ladder. League of Legends is also Best of 1 on its Ranked Ladder, but the top cuts are Best of 3. TCG nerds should stop putting themselves in a box, hehehehehe

[@EleazarGarcia-lh7kk]

Maxx C is going to make me quit the game soon. Many of the matches I've lost this month have been because of this card resolved, or I wanted to activated and got negated. It doesn't make me enjoy my builds.

[@tejoadi4349]

Play a different deck that doesn't involve alot of special summoning then, im still waiting "the true sun god" arriving to MD to compelte my Ra deck and dunking maxx c users

[@Aureum94]

D-shifter's fine, poor example

[@pabloac.8100]

Nope...And it shouldn't be competitive...Its a game for casuals, and making it a bo3 would literally kill the game experience...Of course, IT should promote tournaments with side deck and bo3 where the best player undoubtely wins (as its currently doing), but the ladder should definitely remain bo1...

[@almisami]

Dude completely doesn't understand side-decking and its inherent importance to YuGiOh card design. This take is is bad to the point of being idiotic.

[@solemnyugioh]

So true, bestie, anyway puppet effect?

[@LordKenntax]

It is 100% competitive. There is a publicly known card pool and everyone has the same chances to make a deck. If your deck can't handle some situations then your deck is not good enough. Is it better than best of 3? I don't know but best of 1 is just another kind of playing this game in competitive and I like it! We have so many diffrent decks beeing used and it's just nice.

[@almisami]

It's not a question of "Best of X", it's a question of "Do you get to side-deck?". Without side decking you might as well just roll dice, because there's a 50% chance you'll get an automatic win in you win the dice roll/coin flip

[@alpha34098]

That's one of the keys of Master Duel: It's Card Pool. But this card pool has a better advantage than TCG's and that is the fact that all cards are constantly accessible thanks to the digital nature of the game specially if you're a 60 card deck user (like myself) and gives room for them all the time.

[@LordKenntax]

@@almisami side decking would ruin the game. With side decking no nische decks would be viable. I could definitely not playing eldlich anymore and would need to farm or buy for crystals.

[@sucRipper]

Best of one in ladder is more casual because you have shorter games. But best of 3 could be events. On the other hand if gems tripled I would be ok with investing 3 Times the time to rank up.

[@giuseppevaccaro7521]

Ok, but the real question is, why is Yu-Gi-Oh so trash in his meta?