Can You Notch Joists To Run Cables?

[@efixx]

Where in a joist can i drill a hole? 👉 kzbin.info/www/bejne/oKizi4qMqsSpaZY

[@KendalMike]

Interesting video as always. Just a shame about the audio quality on this occasion.

[@pauls9830]

Good video but some views on what would be sufficient mechanical protection would be good. 1mm steel plate, 2mm plate or thicker? There are times when there are notches already there preventing extra holes being drilled and you have to use existing notches.

[@dougsaunders8109]

More holes and notches houses will fall down. Does the notch already exist, yes don’t put more in

[@GeorgeHafiz]

@@dougsaunders8109 yes, exactly, hence the desire for guidance on how to protect the cable you necessarily are going to run in the existing notches

[@therealdojj]

If only the guy who ran loads of cables around my house previously had known this, at least 3 floorboard nails had penetrated the wires in the notches he'd made and on one he didn't even notch and fust laid the floorboard over the top We always wondered why there was a bump in the floor at that point until we found out 🤦

[@Rivenworld]

Great video and thank you, sound quality leaves a bit to be desired though Dude, sounding a bit muffled.

[@gnlgrim2]

Great video. Check the audio before uploading next time

[@jameshansing5396]

rude

[@james.telfer]

One for the structural engineers - if you drilled a hole through a joist and inserted exact sized steel conduit into it, have you restored most of the structural integrity? Are compressive forces now transferred almost as before the hole existed?

[@_______DR_______]

Sounds like a good job for the apprentice, cut these lengths of 25mm galv into 1ft sections and thread both ends of each piece so we can get it through the joists 🤣

[@Dr.Stacker]

It improves the matter but doesn't restore it to its original integrity. You still have a weakened structure with the slit/cut in place that could propogate/settle/move over time or under the same stress conditions

[@acelectricalsecurity]

I would say it's all nonsense, have you ever heard of a house falling down because someone notched a joist in the wrong place or drilled a hole in the wrong place.

[@Dr.Stacker]

@@acelectricalsecurity The question wasn't will the house crumble, its was will the structural integrity be restored and the answer is no. If you would like to prove it to yourself feel free to model and simulate with finite element analysis two beams with a load applied, one with no notch and one with a re-inforced notch. The answer will be the re-inforced notch will fail before the un-notched beam. Hope that helps.

[@acelectricalsecurity]

@@Dr.Stacker I don't really need to try it, drilling a hole in a joist or even a notch will have little to no effect.

[@thoughtful_criticiser]

What drives me mad is spending a morning drilling joists for pipes only to come back from lunch to find cables run through them. Don't use other trades routes as cables are more flexible than pipes. If you do, don't get upset when we cut them out.

[@LeighWinspear]

How do you approach a metal framed house joist? Good video learning as usual, just wondering as Im going to be rewiring one soon.

[@GeorgeHafiz]

brilliant video with solid references, much appreciated. i hope in another video, you dive into compliant protection of cables when notches might be the best option (e.g. when preserving a ceiling with no access from the floor above in victorian house->flat conversions)

[@Mike_5]

As a starter for ten never ever think of notching an I Beam which is used more frequently now

[@AK-IT]

Looking forward to the engineered joists cable runs video.

[@mr.b.4048]

Had sagging floorboards upstairs where plumber and electrician had run cables and pipes across the width of three floorboards, with the middle board held in place by the t & g of the other two! Sorted it by sheeting out the whole landing with 10mm ply to support the compromised boards from above.

[@DICEGEORGE]

misleading diagram at 4:23, notch shouldnt be int he middle should it ?

[@jameshansing5396]

they supplied the numbers dude, it's just a diagram..

[@almerdiahmed3160]

Happy New Year❤❤❤❤🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉thanks

[@JosnierRamos]

Very good explanation

[@codenamenel]

your man in your video at 0:08 doesnt look like he's got 50mm to the bottom of the joist from his holes there you know 🤔

[@jameshansing5396]

look closer, looks to me like there's an extra bit of wood along the bottom (not sure the correct name) but bit like an I-joist.... I think that's what you're looking at..

[@codenamenel]

@@jameshansing5396I dont know what youre looking at but the hole he's feeding the cable through with his left hand and the one before it looks about 10mm from the bottom

[@jameshansing5396]

Oh I was looking later on. Maybe that's them showing how NOT to do it, given that it's before they have not passed on any info at this stage? @@codenamenel

[@MrFlyby34]

You could apply a layer of battons underneath the floor joists and attach the gypsum boards to the battons. This means that there is available space for running cables between the gypsum and floor joists..... it's that simple!

[@GeorgeHafiz]

good option if the ceiling hasn't gone up yet and you don't mind losing a bit of ceiling height

[@MrFlyby34]

@ that’s how we do it in the Netherlands

[@andysims4906]

Sometimes in old cottages they have cased floors (double floor boards ) example you take one board up and there is another underneath. Often running opposite directions. I have even seen 3 layers of boards . You have no choice but to notch the board underneath. It there is a likely hood of a nail being put through them I put a safe plate over them. If that’s unlikely I normally just put a buckle clip over the notch to stop the cables moving and keeping them in the notch . It’s surprising how many notched cables we see crushed as the previous electrician couldn’t be bothered to put a clip across the notch. All this will sound alien to new build house bashers

[@rorymcdonnell6534]

Interesting point Andrew !

[@hks-lion]

How do you know the entire length of a joist when there is a ceiling beneath it and floor above it?

[@jameshansing5396]

One assumes you'd be lifting floor boards to drill through the joists? So ummmmm see if you can look? and I guess in some cases a little common sense. EG NOT one foot away from the outside wall would be a good start..

[@hks-lion]

@@jameshansing5396 sure but I was thinking of retrofitting downlights and just drilling holes not notches

[@jameshansing5396]

you're not an electrician, are you? @@hks-lion

[@hks-lion]

@@jameshansing5396 no I’m not and not planning on doing any electrics but would just like to understand the process

[@jameshansing5396]

@@hks-lion other than the retrofitting of downlights you just mentioned? 😂

[@dougsaunders8109]

Good luck with finding protection for cables against modern screws and impact drivers

[@justbreakingballs]

Easy

[@wackypeace1135]

For most electricians, it appears anywhere.

[@acelectricalsecurity]

You mean plumbers

[@johnhoward2104]

That's odd - he listed what cable types / requirements should be used when less than 50mm from the surface, the last one being that the cable should be mechanically protected, then a few seconds later states that soft skin cables should not be installed in notches - but surely they can be if they're mechanically protected, such as by a steel plate minimum 3mm thickness.

[@GeorgeHafiz]

yea sadly they decided not to go into detail about that and basically this video ends up as a caution against running cables through notches

[@WilliamMulligan]

Audio quality is awful!

[@jameshansing5396]

comment quality isnt much better

[@tonywatson1412]

If good old common sense still existed a tradie could take a look at a joist...and could determine " nah "... you'll weaken it... BUT these days " nah " get the book out ....let's have a site meeting...ring the office...check the Internet...and all after you've donned all the PPE ....and text mummy..... bollocks.....

[@chrishorrocks4882]

Think you'd be lucky to get any consideration TBH. Cable's would be laid over or underneath 22mm central heating pipes with alarm cable wrapped around them all by here today gone tomorrow house bashers

[@meatkurtin9747]

Paddle bit that sh*t and keep living your lyfe.

[@edc1569]

Is that why all the joists in my house look like they’ve been attacked by a lunatic

[@kevinpickett7249]

Your not allowed to use common sense anymore

[@cag9284]

I think the same rule should apply to plumbers... Some of the butchering of joists have seen made by plumbers is crazy. I know there is guidelines for them, but they clearly don't follow them.

[@sockitz.splatez]

great video 👍⚡️⚡️⚡️

[@alanrobinson847]

The engineer should supply the information required before you start that's why they get paid more if not they are not doing what they are paid for

[@acelectricalsecurity]

If you are doing a rewire for a private individual there's no engineer involved. You just use common sense, if a house falls down because of a hole or notch in the wrong place, I would say the house was f#&ked before you started.

[@acelectricalsecurity]

Who the heck is going to ask a structural engineer if they can cut a notch, if they did the answer would be, you need a steel in there, that's all they rely on these days. You can't put a cable in a notch but a few gas pipes will be fine, no danger there, I assume these people writing these regulations realise we can now get screws and nails that are longer than 50mm, I know that may shock them, nowhere is completely safe.

[@GeorgeHafiz]

that line is also there because a joist of >=250 mm depth suggests that there might be something particularly heavy above. or you can just go the safer route of a central hole

[@curtisj2165]

Bet plumbers don't follow these guidelines

[@Goodwithwood69]

Notch my joists at your peril!

[@Benoit-Pierre]

👍🏻

[@stevelawrence7111]

Ask a structural engineer and he will always say no.

[@trevormorris1281]

No notching joists as it weakens them!

[@jameshansing5396]

a couple of notches in accordance with the regs set out is not overly likely to cause a housetop fall down... hence we are allowed to do it.... Otherwise they're pretty shit joists. Maybe dont use balsa wood for your joists

[@robertburrows6612]

Try using English. The most garbled efix video ever, that didn't quite explain nothing