Can you smell Parkinson's? - with Perdita Barran and Joy Milne

Retired nurse Joy realised she could smell her husband's Parkinson's disease. Scientists are using her discovery to learn more about the disease and its diagnosis.
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Find out how Joy first noticed the smell of Parkinson's on her husband Les, and realised that she identified the same smell on other people who had Parkinson's. Scientist Perdita Barran is now investigating that discovery using mass spectrometry, as well as looking into the role of human sebum for diagnosis.
Perdita Barran is Chair of Mass Spectrometry in the Department of Chemistry and Director of the Michael Barber Centre for Collaborative Mass Spectrometry which is located in the Manchester Institute of Biotechnology. She is also Associate Dean for Research Facility Development.
Professor Barran holds a Chair of Mass Spectrometry in the Department of Chemistry, is Associate Dean for Research Facilities and Director of the Michael Barber Centre for Collaborative Mass Spectrometry at the Manchester Institute of Biotechnology, The University of Manchester, UK.
She is a Fellow of the Royal Society of Chemistry and was awarded the Theophilus Redwood Award from the RSC in 2019, Researcher of the Year 2020 from the University of Manchester and the ACS Measurement Science Lectureship 2021. In 2020 she initiated the COVID-19 Mass Spectrometry Coalition and was appointed as Chief Advisor to the UK Government on Mass Spectrometry as part of their pandemic response. Perdita has had the privilege to mentor 38 graduate students through the successful completion of their PhD’s. as well as 16 postdoctoral fellows. Perdita has authored over 160 publications in peer reviewed journals which have been cited over 4000 times, by people other than her.
In 2021 Perdita founded the company Sebomix Ltd. to exploit sebum as a diagnostic biofluid with a focus on Parkinson’s Disease.
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[@kdeuler]

Very interesting indeed. I have a tenant who has Parkinsons. Whenever I visit him, I can smell a peculiar odor as soon as I step in the door that I don't smell anywhere else. Maybe I'm a diagnoser too.

[@peetrutzPNZ]

The researcher who took her serious, huge respect!

[@luminyam6145]

That is fascinating. My sons have insanely powerful noses. My son smelled cancer on my daughter in law's breath. She was later diagnosed with Stage 4 esophageal cancer.

[@JK-dv3qe]

WHAT DOES BIDEN SMELL LIKE?

[@luminyam6145]

@@JK-dv3qe ok boomer

[@JK-dv3qe]

@@luminyam6145 trying to deflect, are we?

[@AndreasDelleske]

@@JK-dv3qe No. You are just dull.

[@cleof1503]

@@JK-dv3qe 🤖

[@dugldoo]

I'm a physician with a specialty in Geriatrics. We've often notice that Parkinson's patients are prone to developing facial seborrhea. Research suggests that at least 50% of PD patients have facial seborrheic dermatitis. I suspect there a connection here. Perhaps the change in sebaceous activity (and associated change in microbial profile and activity) so often associated with Parkinson's patients is what Joy has learned to detect.

[@voodoomotion5855]

Hi, despite washing regularly I'm regularly applying clotrimazole cream to remove what I guess is a fungal rash on my skin. It appears as strange light brown patches almost like a world map. It doesn't itch or flake, just visually annoying. However it seems to appear where my skin sweats most and often around my neck. Could this be where the fungus is living off the yeast from the sebum? Just wondered if there is a possible connection. Thanks

[@tradtke101]

Could it be related to "Parkinson's mask"? It seems like an immobile face could be a different enough biome from a mobile face. Maybe the mechanical action of the movement and friction self cleanses, or removes moisture better? Why do bed bound patients seem to be prone to fungal infections ? Why does it occur in skin folds more so than exposed skin?

[@unatwomey7112]

Will be interesting to see if microbiome has an impact.

[@symbyxbiome]

We have found similarly increased prevalence of skins conditions such as these amongst our patients too. The right laser light seems to help clear it up in some cases

[@Saysomething164]

I have never heard of this woman before in my life. I cannot believe she’s not all over TV. She’s literally helping them come up with a test for diseases. This is a huge breakthrough. This woman is truly amazing.❤

[@peznino1]

Joy, you are a gem of a human. The researcher too. Well done. Great work.

[@isiso.speenie5994]

Great work ! She can smell death ! Just as many people can ! It's sad and disgusting to advertise as a wonderful thing !

[@jonathanvandenberg3571]

This is why I'm subscribed to The Royal Institution KZbin channel.

[@gorillaguerillaDK]

This is really interesting.. I've worked with Parkinson patients and I've always felt there was a certain smell.. I just thought that maybe I was just imagining it, but after seeing this, I'm beginning to wonder if it's not correct...

[@1MarkKeller]

Interesting, I wonder if it can be related to a change in the gut bacteria that is also causing a metabolic change in the body ... or vice versa.

[@rondo1775]

I had a friend who's smell changed dramatically seemingly overnight. A few months later he was diagnosed with Parkinson Desease and died in just under three years time. Twenty-five years later my father-in-law began smelling that same smell. Although, his smell was the same it was much less potent. He lived for many years. I wonder if there is a correlation between the strength of the smell to the person's longevity.

[@lizelleswanepoel116]

But can you describe the specific smell of Parkinson’s? I kept watching to hear the identity of the smell but it was not mentioned. How would you describe it? Sweet? Sulphur-like? Like a certain known chemical or food?

[@rondo1775]

@@lizelleswanepoel116 not like anything I've ever smelled before. It was an unpleasant foul smell like some sort of aftermath a la, something one might associate with waste, yet unique unto itself. Once you smell it you'll never forget it.

[@HairyNumbNuts]

Probably the best RI video I've watched to date, and I've watched a lot of them.

[@joeynessily]

Brilliant video. I love this fantastic open minded problem solving and exploration of a phenomena, even though it sounds far fetched.

[@helmutzollner5496]

Amazing story. A little bit of hope for Parkinson patients. If we can detect the smell of Parkinson it could be possible to understand the changes in the metabolism that lead to Parkinson.

[@paultruesdale7680]

Wow Something wonderful to think about. Thank you Joy for standing up at the end of that meeting. Thank you, to the researchers that were willing to give something new a try. I hope this brings us closer to a cure for this disease.

[@staminapromos]

I often smell people who I think of as "wrong" in some way. I can smell when someone is developing a cold and I could smell COVID in colleagues at work.

[@AndrewBlucher]

Wow

[@germanlondono8700]

I first listened about this lovely lady from the podcast Invisibilia a while ago. The episode is called "An unlikely superpower". Check it out, there you can listen her whole story in detail.

[@riverbender9898]

Thank you for that cogent report! A few years back, my Neurologist identified me as "possibly" having PD. I scoured the net, hoping that some animal might be able to diagnose my condition by smell. This report gives me renewed hope.

[@Robert_Fiori]

A very enlightening video in several areas. I especially marvelled at the last part where sebum and its smell through the lifecycle were discussed.

[@mariannestrandeng6489]

Oh, I think I am able to smell it. I have always been talking about the different kinds of smells from people at different ages, and I remember one of my grandmas had Parkinsons disease. She smelled different than other people.

[@JK-dv3qe]

Biden: THAT IS TOTALLY A CONSPIRACY FROM QANON

[@isiso.speenie5994]

That is so Gross.

[@dac545j]

@@JK-dv3qe Really? Here? The shame.

[@godfreypigott]

@@JK-dv3qe QAnon and science have no overlap.

[@MacChew008]

Thank you, it may seem to be a causal observation, used to diagnose the onset of illness. But it offers clues to the root of the disease.

[@mikewebber7553]

I noticed this a few years ago, remember Parkinsons start in the Gut as well as the brain.

[@paulcooper8818]

I've never like the way babies or young children smell and I don't like the smell of old people either. This is becoming more of a problem now that I'm getting older because I'm disliking my own smell.

[@penguinista]

There is a lot of natural variation in almost all aspects of biology. Unless the variation kills you super quickly, you can usually find it somewhere. So, it makes sense to me that individuals would find themselves somewhere on a spectrum of sensitivity to pheromones as well as reaction to them. That is a drag about not liking your own smell. My condolences.

[@tactileslut]

"disliking my own smell" Maybe that's why some people slather on the perfume or cologne.

[@paulcooper8818]

@@tactileslut Could be ... or because they've adapted to the fragrance and can no longer smell very well.

[@sobraine123]

Try having Vick Vapour rub to hand. I believe it even blocks the smell of dead bodies !

[@whitepouch0904]

What do you smell to yourself? To me children smell snotty and acidic. Old people smell moldy to me.

[@lindaw505]

Absolutely fascinating 😮 Thank you for your presentation 😊

[@parrotraiser6541]

If the diagnostic mixture can be identified and automatically detected, a test for Parkinson's could become a standard part of a routine medical exam. (Until a treatment can be identified, the patient might not want to know.)

[@tommyhanlon8012]

Absolutely brilliant,

[@VictorKibalchich]

that was absolutely fascinating!

[@bethduffus4598]

An excellent and fascinating video.

[@ManuduBruxale]

Yes I have Parkinson disease stage 3, been smelling the Parkinson Musky smell on myself for years also. Sometimes not, sometimes quite strong. I also wonder if it is a sign of disease progression?

[@whitepouch0904]

How are you now? I hope you’re doing well.

[@joeldejonge2986]

It seems that there's a strong correlation between the strength of the smell and the progression of the disease. I hope you're doing well.

[@ManuduBruxale]

@joeldejonge2986 I would be lying if i said I was well. Still feeling that PD progression. Smell now turned to bad saliva tasting just like the smell. A silent and slow ghost killer.

[@rickharold7884]

Wow. That’s totally fascinating

[@catalinaacevedopacheco]

Thank you!

[@everynamewastakenomg]

This is one of the most incredible things I ever saw. I wouldn't even think a disease like Parkinson would change the smell of the person's body

[@kennyloggins465]

this is incredible. surely joy will go down in history for this

[@ahaaaaaaaaa]

Wow if a person can develop that, surely we can train dogs to detect it too!

[@JK-dv3qe]

spoiler alert: they already did

[@khairt1731]

Certain dogs can smell cancer

[@jwebb4382]

The statement that people during the last days/hours or even minutes of there life exude a certain scent is something I have experienced many times during palliative care is something I found strange but thought that it was just me. Happy to see a scientific answer/response to this (:

[@destresschiropractic]

Love this!!!!

[@robbiejames1466]

Diag nosing

[@AndreasDelleske]

Wow.. you got a point there!

[@nHans]

🤣 "Joy Milne-the nose in diagnose!"

[@AndreasDelleske]

@@nHans Joy Milne - we put the "nose" in "diagnose" :)

[@lizelleswanepoel116]

But can you identify or describe the specific smell of Parkinson’s for us in words?? I kept watching to hear the identity of the smell but it was not mentioned. How would you describe it? Sweet? Sulphur-like? Like a certain known chemical or food? What ís it’s smell?

[@nHans]

It was kinda obvious to me that the smell of a person with Parkinson's is unlike any other smell that Joy is familiar with. Otherwise she would surely have described it: _"He smelled like the leftover chicken fat in a Foreman grill, with undertones of kerosene, iron rust, and a very faint hint of cat urine."_ 🤣 Can you describe, in words, what you mean by _"sweet"_ or _"sulfur-like"_ smells? I mean, obviously, without using constructs like _"the way a_ [sweet dish / sulfur / a person with Parkinson's] _smells."_

[@sobraine123]

Trade Secret !

[@nHans]

Prof. Barran, if you haven't already done so, I'd suggest using the chromatography results to train an AI. Of course, you'd need far more than the dozen or so samples that you tested on Joy. BTW, I do appreciate your bookshelf-it's natural and realistic. Mine too look kinda like that-actually, messier. Others in the comments have criticized it for being untidy. But that's how actual bookshelves of normal, hardworking, non-OCD people are. I'm glad you didn't superficially tidy it for the camera.

[@ktinav]

I dont know about other people but my mom had a very strong musky woody scent just before she was diagnosed with parkinson and nobody noticed it except me.

[@finaldeljuego7841]

This was very interesting

[@jackidezell3736]

I’ve been noticing my mom smells like this yucky dying flower scent. It’s how I found you because I wondered if I was smelling a disease or cancer on her, and she does have dementia and Parkinson’s. So maybe there’s a chance I’m like you?

[@RedcoatsReturn]

Extraordinary! ….olfactory diagnostics….certain diseases make smell different…to…..a gifted nose.

[@Malakawaka]

My dad had a strong cebum smell and parkinson. Old people smell. Great investigation! If you could find out where the smell comes from I hope you cannot only diagnose but prevent PD

[@BlackHattie]

Interesting video. But I believe even more in smell. I believe human can distinct between smells of infections even in your own body. I.e. flu. I just stink differently. Any digestive problem is let say "stinky". But valid research of this delicious processes could be challenging... Another example: Malfunctioning livers or kidneys can be recognised by urine fumes. And yes, im pretty much certain. And not only smell but bad kidneys gives you a strange salty taste on your palate, worsening after drink of alcohol and after meal. There is a lot of chemistry involved and the theme is huge. So thanks for your work and best of luck.

[@bloodmoney88]

it's terrific to recognize such with scent. It's true that women have something special going on with their scent glands, how women can smell the partner they need proven. Our bodies speaking to us on another level.

[@deesenuts1000]

That lady is doing real science

[@catherinemontblanc1430]

Very interesting! I have always had a very sensitive sense of smell and others do comment on my sense of smell. It seems I can smells what others can’t, it does cause me stress, as some times when I am out, some smells can make me react rather negatively as well a very positively… a smell can actually stop me on my tracks. I wonder if I have ever smelled Párkinsons or other conditions… 🤔

[@MariandBreeClub]

Cancer also has a smell

[@I.____.....__...__]

So what happened, did the isolate the compounds and build a detector? Shouldn't it be relatively easy with a GCMS to find the spikes that are common to Parkinson's patients? 🤔

[@kellycook2943]

I supposedly have it and would love a description of what she thinks if smells like. I think I know but would like confirmation of the smell which would help confirm the disease. Why would u not share this?

[@williamarmstrong7199]

It might not be the volume of chemicals or their weight. The shape of molecules greatly effects their smell. Some chemicals can be in many specific shapes but exactly the same weight and formula. These are usually given a letter to denote if a chemical compound is predominamtly say left handed oposed to right handed. (To simplify it as much as possible) so the difference in smell might simply be the same chemical but altered in its shape. No organic chemical is ever going to be 100% anything, there is always variables which is why solid Glucose (as an example) can legally be sold as 100% pure glucose, so long as it contains less than 40% "other sugars". My 1st job was a quality control lab rat... sorry tech. If any of my lecturers are still alive and read this.. see I did learn something! Lol

[@joltsofdeath]

Wonderful discovery! I imagine that may prove that it is a chemical imbalance, perhaps a gene that turns off and that smell is related, so fascinating.

[@chattykathie7129]

She smelled him at 35 he was diagnosed at 45. The symptoms don’t manifest for 10 years.

[@whitepouch0904]

It started when he’s 31. That’s pretty young 😱

[@guyh3403]

I can smell if old people are incontinent.

[@miryreina925]

😂

[@fauxvillage3811]

Wow.

[@kellycook2943]

Please tell us! What does Parkinson’s smell like? How would u describe it or what would u say the closest thing that smells like it is?

[@AndrewBlucher]

"I'm a measurement scientist" I notice a high level of entropy in that office :-)

[@Mr.Anders0n_]

Well, levels of entropy in offices and homes are quite relative. I mean give me that office for a week and I'll triple its entropy for you without making any effort :D

[@therealkellyiom]

It sounds crazy but I did have a similar 'talent' until I had a major epileptic seizure while on a staircase. Cancer, to me, smelt like those old fashioned 'Parma Violet' sweets. Very sickly, sweet aroma but people around couldn't smell it and it worked for both dogs and humans. I don't know if it was the blow to the head or the haemorrhage which caused the epilepsy but I've lost certain notes of flavour.

[@williamarmstrong7199]

Might it be worth the effort of training dogs to detect this smell? Save Joy's nose a lot of work and can be done world wide quite easily. Some dogs have been trained to be able to smell an impemding hypo glysemic event or epilepsy so this should be an eaay one for them to learn.

[@sherrywarnock6627]

Do you think there is a hormone released through skinnthat smells differently? I smelt my Dad and he later developed Parkinson. My older and younger sisters also has a smell. Nobody else smells to smell it? You make sense to me!❤

[@traceeglenn7475]

Could this close exposure to Parkinson's put Joy in any harm to possibly contract the disease?

[@claramanana7463]

Anosmia algo May be an early symptom for Alzheimer desease.

[@karatsurba4791]

Quite logical. In Alzheimer's, there's loss of memory. The association between an smell & the substance being smelled is "likely" saved in the hippocampus (memory store). So, a malfunctioning hippocampus could result in loss of smell. Thanks 👏 for your comment

[@NS-jt4kg]

Hear me out... I feel like I can smell when people are close to dying or have just passed away. It's a very strong almost acetone like smell. I can almost taste it. I smelled it around my father 2 weeks before he passed away (around the time my dad told me he thought he was going to die) my dad also had a different smell on him. It was mildewy and kind of like fertile soil. He has had that smell since he moved into his last house. But I have to say the house already kind of smelled like that before he moved there. Now here's the weird part Around my grandfather and grandmother I smelled the same milldewy smell for a while. They also lived in the same houses in the same neighbourhood. My grandfather passed away in december and he had cancer and highter proteine counts in hia blood with lewy body dimentia symptoms. And had the strongest smell of acetone in the days leading up to his death and it got worse and worse when he was laid out the days before his funeral. I almost couldn't eat when I was over at my grandmother's house when we did the wake. Now a few days ago I went over to my grandmothers house and I smelled the acetone smell. I do have to say I noticed it when I was close to my grandfather's cremains, but I have to say I think she is close to passing away. Her speech is getting slower, but as far as I know she doesn't have any other symptoms. I really hope I am wrong and I can just smell old people very well. But I am worried.

[@gendoll5006]

I wonder if she gets requests from people for her to smell them? I’m another video she said she can smell cancer and other conditions too. I’d pay to have her smell me every few years! Lol!

[@xy11xy]

yeah, but what does it smell like??!

[@isiso.speenie5994]

How do you put B.O into words ? LoL

[@jimbarchuk]

She said something like 'at the start he smelled like a man, nice.' Nothing more, nothing 'descriptive.' 'Changed,' that she didn't like it. That's it.

[@isiso.speenie5994]

@@jimbarchuk that is sooo sad and gross of a statement on the human condition. It plays right in to the Eugenisists credo that people are just disgusting biological machines that are obsolete !

[@symbyxbiome]

Amazing research. Thank-you for sharing this. However, there are some emerging treatments for Parkinson's - under large cohort clinical trial now - infrared laser on the gut microbiome for 20 minutes for 3 times a week...has been successful in improving symptoms such as sleep, digestion, smell, motor skills, mood, cognition....

[@sobraine123]

So Trump was on to something ! “Supposing we hit the body with a tremendous - whether it’s ultraviolet or just very powerful light,” Mr. Trump said. “And I think you said that hasn’t been checked, but we’re going to test it?” he added, turning to Mr. Bryan, who had returned to his seat. “And then I said, supposing you brought the light inside the body, either through the skin or some other way.”

[@shiningstar2903]

Can you say where it's being used as a treatment. It's fascinating results and I'm so pleased you have experienced improvements.

[@symbyxbiome]

@@shiningstar2903 The laser light is shone directly on the gut and the neck. Light helmets are also showing to be effective, although these mechanisms are different as the light is shining on the head.

[@beachboardfan9544]

Joy is the predecessor to the xmen abilities!

[@nody31]

So have you identified the exact element that joy is smelling?

[@w2g707]

Can we teach dogs to detect rather quickly and on a broad-spectrum? God bless Joy, and may we one day be able to attack this horrible disease. 🙏🏼

[@magic7ball460]

What does it smell like? Is it a dense, dusty, smell? Like an old basement?

[@michaelstevens1085]

?So are you training people to recognize these smells?

[@sobraine123]

People with schizophrenia have a strange smell too

[@Denvermorgan2000]

They could maybe teach dogs to do the same.

[@wktodd]

To me the only surprise that a disease like Parkinson's can be smelled , is that it could be sensed by a human's small nose , instead of a dog's fine hooter 8-)

[@robertfletcher3421]

Bring in the HeroRATs they already detect TB and brucellosis as well as explosives. RIP Magawa

[@franciscojose6496]

The royal exellent channel pure english fantastic

[@yosconisi]

Wouldn't it just be easier to each other people the smells, so more people other than Joy Milne can do this. She can't be the only person a nose sensitive enough to do this. Certainly, exploring sebum and what that means for the disease can be valuable, but shouldn't we just get diagnosis fast and cheap in the meantime?

[@facejets]

I've heard of some research into dogs and, I think, bees. But there is no treatment for Parkinson's, and not a lot of profit to be had by solving medical mysteries that pay dividends already, anyway.

[@finaldeljuego7841]

Well , there are dogs that can smell cancer or diabetes, so there is a smell

[@user-zu9wx4oh8w]

My wife can smell my bank accounts...LOL

[@antondelacruz9362]

Babies smell delicious, sure. But theyre soft and chewy. I like a bit of crunch.

[@hampsonmealey]

Anyone else get a hand tremor from swab tests?

[@jameswhyard2858]

Medical Detection Dogs...

[@sandralynn5211]

Sums up why I like physics and geology. Revolting.

[@natv.6206]

Robot or A.I. nose would be even better

[@thirstyviaduct]

We already have dogs

[@isiso.speenie5994]

Kind of Gross 🤢🤮

[@misspeggy1771]

Oh yes there is a treatment for Parkinson's you just haven't discovered it yet

[@isiso.speenie5994]

Just say it straight out ! You can smell death ! So disgusting !