Carrier package unit not cooling: Part 2

Today I comeback to remove the economizers from two package units and it open the panel our return ductwork is attached to. I then go through and verify operation, temp splits, static pressure and operating pressures.
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[@jonnymac31]

Looked like the little spot they had cut out was the only way they could avoid return air bypassing the economizer. Really no way to go to full economiser now that the whole side is cut out. They should have had that return tie in the back where its suppose to go instead of the side. I initially thought that unit would have a downflow return opening, but seeing the unit again that was incorrect. Enjoy the videos man!

[@leifhoganson6996]

That units return was on the back not the side with the supply. Should have corrected the duct work. Now the economizer isn't going to work properly. Recommend reading installation and service manuals prior to installing and or cutting panels. Typically like your video's very helpful. Please keep learning and sharing what you learn.

[@stanleyroberts2461]

I like that comment" student of the trade" , im a old guy in the trade really enjoy your viedos . Keep up the good work!

[@curioushvacguy6876]

Thanks

[@sterlingarcher46]

I keep going through the library of your older vids bro , bloody brilliant mate 👍

[@curioushvacguy6876]

Glad you like them!

[@bryantylerservices]

Great job on return air suffering catch! Basically it comes down to installer(s) not cutting enough duct out behind econmizer. As your videos title ( CANT BREATH)!!! Nice job recommisioning unit! Bryan Tyler service

[@cameronblades7551]

Good vids. That’s a split coil. If it’s worth cleaning it’s worth splitting ( even though those 24 tons suck to split). Just so you don’t leave chemical behind on accident and rotting it out early. You’ve got my subscription.

[@daryllneuburger4946]

That's a funny looking sawzaw lol! Good video 👍

[@curioushvacguy6876]

Yeah it's a new model, lok

[@johntorcomian5223]

Great video- was so curious about what had happened at this place Glad to see problem was resolved!

[@grindstone5368]

Keep posting videos, you are doing this trade a great service being able to see and discuss stuff like this👍🙌. I'm not gonna say I would go a different route...but my first impression is air balance? I'm obviously scratching my head on the duct design and economizer setup for that application. Hope you don't take this in a negative. Sometimes it is what it is get the unit running and achieve the ultimate goal. Comfort for the customer.

[@curioushvacguy6876]

Hey Grindstone- thanks for the feedback-- I did some research and figured this out after the fact because I knew what I did to correct airflow bypassed the economizer, when this unit or any unit really is ducted out the side like that it needs to be equipped with a different economizer, one designed for side ventilation. Thanks for watching

[@moe4hvac]

Awesome videos. Came from HVACR VIDEOs recommendation. Subscribed!

[@leonbogon148]

Nice job as usual-worked on supermarket refrigeration for most part-like your channel and several others great mix of knowledge got me thinking of taking a refresher course or try to get job in a plant or state job working on chillers and towers etc.,something in house-keep the vids coming!!

[@curioushvacguy6876]

Thanks for the feedback Leon- gotta keep learning, I like to read up on the basics once in awhile just to keep it fresh

[@paulyazzie1519]

Love your blogs. Very informative

[@jpp9876]

It would have been interesting to see how the air return n supply temps were during the heating season.

[@chap3845]

Wrong economizer for that return going in the side... Should have a verticle style made for side inlet.. But the cheapest way was the way u did it. A lot of people don't really use the economizer much.

[@curioushvacguy6876]

Hey Dan- Your exactly right on both ends, I basically bypassed the economizer they had and told the customer they need to get the side ducted economizer- havent gotten the approval for it so I think there just going to let it go

[@kenji369]

Keep on keeping on like the sawzall tho

[@dizziedallas]

Job came out great.

[@walkingfreak]

I can safely say that's the first time i've seen an RTU.....on the ground haha.

[@walkingfreak]

@@curioushvacguy6876 I don't do any RTU's at my work place much at all but it's a good thing to know.

[@prettycureforever7102]

Anything can be anywhere . maybe not strong enough roof

[@Randylazz]

Awesome video.............

[@jackbrennan754]

Good video learned a lot

[@yamohvac3181]

Yamo Here Great Job

[@FireandFrostHVAC]

Strange that the installers did (what looks like) a decent installation job and missed opening the return to the unit... if I had made that mistake I would have corrected it (which they apparently realized when they cut the triangle out)... 🧐 love the hat airflow test btw

[@tommymason334]

Nice fix Bro. 👍💪

[@timothysambolin5293]

You the man,

[@lewiemcneely9143]

Beard of knowledge. I'll go with that. And it sure looked like someone messed up bad as far as the little hole was concerned. And the reason you have no hair on the noggin is all the activity of your brain burned all the covering off! GOOD jobQ!

[@curioushvacguy6876]

Im gonna use that reason for my bald head from now on,, lololol

[@lewiemcneely9143]

@@curioushvacguy6876 I wished I could use it but everybody that knows me AT all knows that'll never be the case. You do GOOD, Pal! A-PLUS! Keep that hair burned off!

[@hrdworkin7633]

Excellent video! Did you find reduced amp draw on the blower and compressors after opening the return air? Just a thought....Thanks again

[@johnnyb8629]

you fan motors do not draw less amps with more air flow, they draw more. If you were to put an amp meter on the blower contactor and open the door it will jump up in amps. The same thing happens with the compressors with more airflow but not as dramatic. The more airflow, the more air to move and cool, and thus the more work is being done, more work requires more energy, more energy is measured in more amps, Its basic physics.

[@edwardgaddis8333]

Funny my wife heard your voice and said you sound like Mike Rowe lol

[@curioushvacguy6876]

Lol- best compliment Ive had in awhile

[@kcomfortsystemshvac7060]

Nice video,,very informative,,,,,I have litle question ,,,max static pressure how much should be ?

[@jcgal70]

when its windy it won't stay trust me ,and the ends they break easily so be aware.

[@SpazyFunk]

I bet the company that did the startup on that equipment added charge to make that low airflow work.

[@HVACRNorth]

cool bud

[@madcitysw]

That also looks the wrong economizer kit for that setup, there are two different economizers for Vertical and Horizontal. I think you need the Vertical economizer for this setup.

[@jasonwb6884]

Would've just left that economizer out, it's not going to work right with that duct setup that way. The return duct is obviously supposed to go below the economizer inlet. The dampers do nothing with duct on the long side of unit, except bypass air.

[@dumptrks]

Great video Bill ..one question how do you keep the "beard of knowledge " from catching fire?..lol

[@jeffgrant6914]

How many compressors does that unit have?

[@hotrodriguez549]

2 types of diagnosi I live by: big picture and big beard diagnosis.

[@curioushvacguy6876]

love it, lol

[@Darklanmaster]

Is the package not now sucking outside air around the closed economizer? Or did you close the the hole that they cut? Greetings from Germany 😉 nice channel 👍

[@curioushvacguy6876]

Hey Darklan- In order to restore air flow I had to bypass the economizer. It was either do that or have them re do the duct work, they said no to that idea. In the fall when the economizer opens it will not be able to block the return air coming from the building. Thanks for watching

[@Darklanmaster]

@@curioushvacguy6876 thx for the feedback

[@FansOfGames]

I’m no expert in HVAC work, but I do have a question out of curiosity. Isn’t the purpose of having condenser fans to prevent the compressors from overheating? If so, how come some compressors aren’t even under the condenser fans?

[@curioushvacguy6876]

With most hvac package units the condensing fans aren"t there specifically to cool the compressor, they do cool it a little bit but the compressor is cooled mostly by the suction gas coming back from the evap coil.

[@FansOfGames]

Oh okay. That makes sense. Thank you for the information!

[@PeterParker-tb7ce]

@@FansOfGames To Add to what Curious said most compressors are designed to be cooled by the suction gas. Some may not because of their design and usually have their own fan. We have some split units that have the compressors separate from the Condensing Coils. The can be in their our box with no fans. This can be down to cut down on the weight of the Condensing unit on the roof or other design reasons.

[@ryanw.k.2840]

I dont know, looks like thats the wrong econ to me. Looks like its made for downshot config. Does Carrier make a different style for side discharge?

[@ryanw.k.2840]

Great video overall! Subbed

[@curioushvacguy6876]

Hey Ryan- your exactly right, I knew something didnt look right besides having no air flow but didnt realize until later after I basically bypassed the economizer it should have been equipped with a side discharge economizer- Thanks for watching

[@ryanw.k.2840]

@@curioushvacguy6876 cheers bro! Your channel is great

[@curioushvacguy6876]

Thanks man- much appreciated

[@JohnJones-wt2cm]

Your not supposed to hook up the return on the back side of those units when you have an economiser, supposed to hook it to that opening under the out door air hood

[@JohnJones-wt2cm]

@@curioushvacguy6876you didn't install it , I'm sure it works better now than it did. nice videos, just found your channel, keep up the good work

[@tinwizard6447]

The original installer completely blew it and should be sued. Could have saved it by raising the unit on a 2' high stand and connecting RA to bottom. Too late now.

[@zekemontgomery6678]

The umbrellas suck in the wind btw

[@corycorkill5610]

Be careful with the arms on that umbrella I’ve already warranty out four of them

[@corycorkill5610]

Yeah I’m just going to get a welders umbrella way more sturdier. And better design The Umbrella was a good design and a good concept but it’s just not meant for Windy climates the arms are just weak

[@theamazoner4075]

What coil cleaner do you use?

[@curioushvacguy6876]

It varies, but usually nu brite or calgon

[@theamazoner4075]

@@curioushvacguy6876 thanks

[@dirkcanyow]

Great vid my gf loves your beard

[@IFIXCASTLES]

Supply was cut out ok?

[@rowdybroomstick1216]

Seems pretty strange to only cut an opening in the one return and not the other , if they had realized they didn't have any return air on both units?

[@rowdybroomstick1216]

Not that it made much difference on the one they did cut an opening on.

[@chevguy8587]

That's an angle grinder not a Sawzall

[@Dave-dr4yy]

That is a downflow economiser, not a side outlet. It should be changed.

[@Dave-dr4yy]

I love your video’s though. I was in the field for 30 years before I went to an office position and I have learned a lot from what you do. Hoes to show you that you never have seen the half of it. Please keep the great content going. I am also requesting the 0 techs that work for me watch your channel as well.

[@Dave-dr4yy]

10 techs, sorry

[@joshstevens9826]

This is a hack repair. Duct should have been moved, now essentially they have no economizer. Think before you act.

[@HVACDan]

Really need to wear a face shield when using an angle grinder. Look for pics online if you want to see what happens when those wheels explode and your face catches the pieces. It isn't pretty.