Case 104: Mark and John

DESCRIPTION
First responders rushed into the alley after receiving reports of a stabbing. Towards the dead-end of the narrow passageway, they found a teenage boy...
CREDITS
Narration - Anonymous Host
Episode researched and written by Eileen Ormsby, author of ‘The Darkest Web - Drugs, Death and Destroyed Lives: The inside story of the internet’s evil twin.’
Production, scoring - Mike Migas
Additional scoring - Andrew Joslyn
SOCIAL LINKS
Website
www.casefilepo...
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Instagram
/ casefilepodcast
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RESOURCES
For all credits and sources please visit www.casefilepo...

[@geordangullock1237]

Now I've been known to be pretty gullible in my time, but I draw the line at getting someone pregnant without ever coming into contact with them.

[@gabriellahedarv1782]

😂😂😂

[@nickykeightley9355]

@Bobby Friday you naughty boi, you😁😇😇😇

[@TriggB44]

Yup, right on🤣🤣🤘

[@donnablack6280]

I'm going to hell for crying with laughter at some of this. The Queen entrusting some 14 yr old kid from Manchester with the combination to a safe full of treasure 😂😂😂

[@klientproby]

I'm also on my way to hell. I was also laughing at the part in which "Agent Janet" mentioned the Queen and the PM.

[@MM91845]

When it got to the code “6969” I couldn’t hold back my laughter any longer.

[@nicoleburns345]

Literally that stupid when chatrooms came out...hes not the only one sadly...at least there is more awareness around these storys for the kids now

[@cordrust]

rachel west disappears and then a few weeks later lindsey east appears 😂

[@NIN1]

Janet Dobbinson specified that even though she was in her forties, she was still "very sexy" 😂😂😂

[@brendanquinn6894]

@@NIN1 Apparently it is true. Even if you are really old like that you can be attractive.

[@drewmadenew3000]

This podcast is the most underrated channel on KZbin. You guys are brilliant.

[@AMYV3]

👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼. Right on point ❤️❤️🇨🇦

[@Andrew-ri5qo]

They are the best.

[@bekkismith5643]

But recognised on podcasts

[@joediesen1]

The Mark kid was beyond naive. His BS meter should have gone off very early on. And wasn't John introduced to him as the step brother of the hot girl (John) he met who was later murdered? Then the girl showed up again claiming to be pregnant before disappearing forever? Did Mark ever ask John about her?

[@peterlightning9235]

I was never this dumb when I was a young teen.

[@tammyallen3813]

how many people you know that will agree with this comment about yourself?

[@katieb.1184]

Well. The did say he was exceptionally naive? Not everyone has the same environment to teach them what to be cautious of online. And in the early 2000s, there wasn't as much info out about catfishing and lies. I'm a couple years older than them and I'm pretty sure I believed a few fake identities back then. Hell, I'm almost 35 now and I wouldn't be shocked to hear some of my Fandom friends are faking things too. Granted... Murder is another topic entirely.

[@mikelittle1715]

@@tammyallen3813 I don't know him and I agree. I don't know anyone lives being this stupid.

[@VladRadu-tq1pg]

mark was 16 in 2003,,so nowdays he s 36, and you are 37, how tf are you a couple of years older ffs ? also this whole chatroom shit is beyond me , i was born in 95 and we had yahoo messenger, i don t even understand what thes chatrooms were. nvm no 16 years old should be that dumb@@katieb.1184

[@Vortigan07]

This is, without a shadow of doubt, just about the most bizarre story I've ever heard!!! Honestly, at one point I had to check the upload date, wondering if it had been April 1st!! We've all been taken in at some point or other, we've all had moments of gullibility, but this is next level and then some!! Absolutely unreal!!

[@shad0wfir3]

This is the saddest thing ever... on so many levels :(

[@jamiedawson7060]

That case was BONKERS!! Absolutely insane and unbelievable!!

[@merncat75]

I remember A/S/L I hated that "greeting" so gross

[@ldg1414]

Only scammers use it now

[@claudiapaz3718]

Unlike other cases, nobody died in this one, but is without a doubt the creepiest one I've listen

[@darbyandmichaelhanson7652]

you know you're old when ASL had to be explained so viewers knew.

[@hilarysettle227]

Darbles Elise Hanson haha that brought back memories

[@mikelittle1715]

Agreed

[@Jolenesmart1980]

Haha yup!

[@VladRadu-tq1pg]

what s asl ? i was born in 95, and growing up we just had yahoo messenger , hi5 and then when we reached hs facebook here in romania

[@darbyandmichaelhanson7652]

@@VladRadu-tq1pg Age/Sex/Location

[@KirstyCampbell22]

Listening to this episode for the third time. Such an insane case. You covered it brilliantly💙

[@CasefileTrueCrimePodcast]

Thank you

[@sfletch3042]

I know he is just a kid but I cant fathom anyone being this gullible and naive. Smh. And this catfish pos is a freaking sociopath! My GOD!

[@SerTasera]

This is the most batshit insane catfishing story I've ever heard.

[@11Shot111]

Gotta Say, you do the best job! Love your work, the amount of research you put in and how the story is retold. Haven't found anything as good as yours! Cheers for the work you put in!

[@faithackett3228]

HOLY CRAP THATS INSANE

[@hannaphe6250]

I feel bad for Mark. But he really was a bit slow wasnt he?

[@mariannairam2218]

or he was just simply lonely so he catch a bait

[@VladRadu-tq1pg]

lol no, just because you re lonely, which mark wasn t, doesn t mea that your brain can be that dumb. he was 166 ffs, thats not a small kid@@mariannairam2218

[@yukiefromoz2573]

Wow, what a story huh. Interesting how the older boy was the gullible one, but the younger boy was quite intelligent for his age.

[@karen81986]

My favourite podcast

[@zoo2263]

Wow! That is off the charts bonkers. Brilliant listen thanks for uploading.

[@garrethgoodworth2494]

My favorite of all of your covered cases.

[@angelabordack]

Holy crap! This case is insane. This is an epic example of catfish!

[@rodericksloan1255]

As always Casefile Great thank you.

[@chels3707]

Just shows, high grades don't equal intelligence.

[@VladRadu-tq1pg]

no shit. high grades just mean that you re a nerd and sometimes that you re actualy smart

[@chezchez2005]

I’m from Altrincham and similar age to Mark and I don’t remember this being widely publicised considering the story (I suppose due to protecting their identities ; although “John’s” real name is available with a simple google search); truly bizarre! Casefile you do an amazing job, I’ve seen some of these cases previously on other KZbin videos but I am always compelled to listen to your narrative ; great listening and always has me hooked from beginning to end

[@texastea5686]

Absolutely ridiculous..... im glad I've always been a suspicious person and kinda skeptical

[@myathewolfeh1156]

"Rachel West" and "Lindsay East"? Good lord, this kid was gullible.

[@lovehearts8486]

Fabulous work! Well done and thank you

[@andrewhunter2520]

That boy ain't right

[@MissWoman1]

Yeah I'm sitting here thinking "There is something wrong with that boy...and it's a pretty BIG SOMETHING WRONG!" I mean I was over 16 when the internet became a big thing and yeah there was alot of naivete of first time users back then but in 2003...That's only 2 YEARS after 9/11 when cyber crimes were big news cos of the 'terrorist this' and terrorist that' and 'hacking this' and 'hacking that' so how the f**k could a 16 year old NOT know about chat room 'dangers' - it was taught in schools back then🥴😯🥴😯🥴 I mean even if the kid was mainly sports orientated he would've been taught about what a MINOR can do and what an ADULT can do so he should've known at 16 years old he couldn't even sign a government employee contract...even watching James Bond movies you see there are NO 16 year old spy's😫😤😫😤

[@pkloveskp5477]

Both Hank Hill and I agree 😂

[@hopeharder6749]

Which boy? Lol They both have huge issues.

[@belladonna5904]

Something is really wrong with John. He basically manipulated Mark into having sex with him on top of all the other things..really predatory behavior. I would say the only victim here is Mark.

[@user-mt4ku7jw1y]

Im pissing myself laughing at Mark 😅😅😅

[@theheroine177]

Kid should have became a screenwriter

[@brendanquinn6894]

I never knew Queen Elizabeth would get involved in such things ! Well I never!

[@nesadcruz7840]

Unbelievable that a kid could weave such a web

[@robyn7287]

Actually only a kid could come up with this type of batshit stuff.

[@Kaladin07]

This isn't real. I refuse to believe it lmao

[@Stoate]

oh my god mark MARK! COME ON MARK

[@SHurd-rc2go]

It's unbelievable.

[@theheroine177]

Oh wow! I have a hard time even hearing anyone could be that gullible .... 😢😰

[@naomiledger1374]

I could see the writing on the wall very early in this story so wasn't surprised when it turned out to be all of John's hand. It was somewhat reminiscent of another story whereby a schoolboy was groomed online by someone with a fantastical story only to end up killed. It's horrifying and for parents it must be a total nightmare bc the restrictions they can place are very limited these days with so much access available to kids via various social media and IT equipment. I was stunned that "Mark" didn't seem to cotton on that something was bogus, and was so willing to overlook anything that was a bit odd. I'm glad they both survived. I'm glad the judge was so sensible in his/her findings. And I hope both John and Mark have managed to grow and live happier fulfilling lives. It makes me wonder if all young teens are that malleable, no matter how clever or advanced or mature they seem to be? It's really frightening.

[@loritracy1385]

Wow. Great job. Thank you. 🌺

[@Stoate]

lol i don't wanna be harsh but come ON mark ffs

[@fireflamewolfs4216]

Love your channel!

[@CasefileTrueCrimePodcast]

Thanks!

[@Pillock25]

Mark and John aren't their real names? Now I feel just as gullible as "Mark". "A payment of £80 million and sexual favours" Wow.

[@thelastperfectman4139]

Really, how gullible can someone be?

[@JR-xw5nv]

This is the craziest case I've ever heard of.

[@tammyallen3813]

thank you for bringing this stpry to us

[@MM91845]

What did I just listen to!?!?

[@kevinwalkingPH]

This is INSANE.

[@julieblackstock8650]

WTF, I live in England and I never heard about this...Crazy

[@mattcollins2848]

Probably didn’t get much media coverage like other cases due to the double permanent name suppression. Then again a case this bizarre you’d think it’d be more widely known. I’m from the north west and still only heard of this from podcasts 😮

[@christinaperrigo]

Heartbreaking.

[@philfluther2713]

"I went to rest myself into a room full of fine old paintings; the first of which, when I examined it, and it was large, was of an old surgeon dying by dissecting himself! It was worse than dissecting -tearing: and with circumstances of horror about the treatment into which I will not enter" scene from nightmare dream of John Ruskin 27th. Dec. 1875.

[@christopherjameslee3341]

It appears to be a very thin line between naivety and stupidity.

[@hankjones7054]

You can actually quite easily find the real identity of John online and look at their Instagram account.

[@kass_G59]

Do you recall what his username is on Insta? Or his full name to look him up?

[@kiki29073]

@@kass_G59 Daniel lomas is real name. Haven't looked up hisnIG though myself. He would be 31 now.

[@kass_G59]

kim mcdonald Thank you!

[@Jasmineliketheflower]

@@kass_G59 Did you find his Instagram with that name?

[@kass_G59]

@@Jasmineliketheflower Unfortunately not :/

[@mikelittle1715]

Did these boys parents have any children that lived past birth?

[@leahstone9308]

Ultimate Mark

[@daz350]

Well that didn’t turn out like I thought it was going to. I have to lol at the way John got Mark to engage in sexual acts with him... “you must make him look gay” 🤣🤣🤣 I bet John couldn’t believe how well he orchestrated that.

[@starroddy5588]

daz350 And he ‘incited murder of himself.’ I didn’t want to laugh but I couldn’t help it. Lord have mercy!

[@KenyanBunnie]

I remember watching this case on one of those true crime shows and I couldnt believe it! But since then I have watched a few cases of murders committed by someone whom was tricked into doing so by their online loves. And a few were adults being tricked by other adults. I have had my own bad experiences when I was a teen to my early 20s in chatrooms. Even being groomed, naked pics taken, by a man who lied about his age, turned out he was about 3 times older...SMFH. I was 16 and believed in fairytales.

[@naomiledger1374]

I know most commenters here are incredulous, and rightly so, but they also mock when I think it's really scary and sad what happened in this case and in many others, such as your own. Parents of these kids must feel utterly powerless. I think it's easy for us in this modern world to assume kids know more than they do, but I think no matter how much they're exposed to, they still only have a minimal number of years of life experience (as young teens) and are still very naive. Something needs to change big time.

[@tiarnan76]

Mark: Hi Lindsey glad u finally logged on.... Lindsey: Mark I need to tell u something...I'm an invisible alien from the galaxy Flaptopia..and I'm on secret mission to earth... Mark: oh, ok... Lindsey: I really wana tell u what my mission is Mark....would u like to know about it? Mark: Yeh I guess so... Lindsey: Great - but in order for me to tell u, I need u to turn your webcam on n have a big hairy w@nk - can u do that mark - can u have a big hairy w@nk on camera so I can tell u about my secret alien agent mission on earth? Mark: ziiiiiiiip........

[@veronikapelzmannova9967]

😂😂😂

[@stee8345]

Best comment I've ever read 😂😂😂

[@marieyatestaylor5732]

Wow! And Wow!

[@rapitup45]

I tentatively suggest the case of Cherish Perriwinkle because of the 🇦🇺🇦🇺connection. I say tentative because i also know how truly disturbing it was and the way it impacted me.

[@thedisabledwelshman9266]

a fourteen year old spy? yea right.

[@Anneh1fd]

I am from Stockport and I have never heard of this case! But Stockport is definitely not an afluent area, trust me.

[@rmooreg]

Compared to Mark, a brick is like Albert Einstein, Or else John could sell snow to Eskimo's. They both could have been successful politicians.

[@SlimSlashie]

20ish minutes is... What level of catfish is this? Like 8 at least, eh? Seriously you're meeting a dude who's sister you're MADLY in love with, but can't ever actually meet the sister? I mean I've heard of suckers, hell I've been a sucker, but this got my BS meter pegged.

[@SlimSlashie]

Holy smokes the girl is a junior MI6 spy?! LOL I'm a seal, yeah well I'm SAS, oh yeah? I'm MI6 b!tch! LOLOLOLZ The online version of "my dad can beat up your dad."

[@SlimSlashie]

"You can meet the queen! And tony blair!" Shoot this is 2000s? Probably would rather meet limp bizcuit or Kid Rock... lolol Hang on, Titanic is at the bottom of the Atlantic ocean too, it's unreachable! How the F... A safe with beeeeelions of dollars. Man this kid is above and beyond gullible at this point. I officially lost sympathy for him. Hope he isn't the stabbed up kid.

[@SlimSlashie]

PLOT TWIST! Holy F what an absolute goat rodeo these kid's lives are. The police woman was stumped at one point. lol Shows what level of intelligence you need to get into the police force these days... I don't know weather to laugh or cry, but this is entertainment right here. Excellent story.

[@Fallen_Venus]

Never heard of this case, and I live in the area!

[@redfire20003]

Bizzare....what a story

[@sirhillarybillary]

I think maybe this is a meet cute? Theyre clearly made for each other lolol

[@redbeki]

Is John still being monitored online I wonder? I hope so .

[@jsmith5509]

John was a brilliant child! He could use that brain for so much good!!!

[@aminashaikh2331]

i found John's photo as well as his real name. full name. so much for protecting identities haha. you don't have to look that far on the internet.

[@chloeew4627]

James Pond…. Bloody dill

[@lenafranklin7262]

At the beginning I am thinking that Rachel west doesn't exist. It's John I'm thinking

[@cynthiagibson3069]

Can anybody really be that clueless?

[@KathleenCalhoun-em6ys]

After hearing about Kevin, I suspect that Rachel and he are the same person. Bail out now.These are the dangers of the Internet. I am bailing out myself after hearing about Lindsay. How could John and Mark not know! Sounds like more B.S. from "Kevin."

[@alecdruckenmiller4409]

Who’s here from Reddit?

[@lexschrauwen6553]

Alec Druckenmiller hahah just read the article

[@chefboyardee8542]

Woop woop

[@cainification]

I am a person who is here from Reddit

[@nickdaboii]

I'm late but yeah

[@danmac73]

This is too f'kd up 😮

[@secularbeast1751]

Wow, that's quite a tale, CP, mind blown.

[@janicekamalski5938]

Omg did Mark grow up in Lilliput or something.? Dude, you believed that at 14 or 16 or whatever? I don't know if it means he was really really coddled or not really bright or both. I mean I know it's sad and in his own way he isa victim but God damn, really?

[@brendajstevens3719]

👏👏👏

[@xWILZTAx]

GULLIBLE

[@erinsaxton83]

not the sharpest knife in the draw is he

[@malovela]

*drawer...

[@radityaa5076]

Ewing HD bring me to this podcast

[@MichaelBrown50000]

This really is a story that reveals the extent of human stupidity. Stupid always deserves what stupid gets.

[@thedisabledwelshman9266]

whats all this missing in action guff? its not a bloody war

[@starroddy5588]

OMG!

[@loribellusci7047]

Oo

[@meganmatushik85]

U should cover michelle carter the texting suiside case.

[@mustafadiaa8251]

😂😂

[@lenafranklin7262]

Alissa was killed by her step father. SOLVED

[@dhanishayaz1025]

The gay guy that was behind all the accounts is called Daniel Lomas , someone help me find mark ?

[@MichaelS-yu7dt]

i found a pic of daniel now i’m pretty sure idk if it’s him looks like a older version of the young pic, can’t find nothing on mark tho

[@Adawg420]

not sure i believe this one...also happens to not be verifiable due to the gag order...

[@41mortiz]

Yeah nobody knows their complete name, how their face look like? Usually we could see at least the pic of the criminals

[@caterpillakilla]

i dont get it