Cherry G80-1000 review (vintage Cherry MX black)

[@jacobematt6222]

"I measured this fucker with a tape measure" inexplicably hilarious, holy shit

[@harjoat]

how stupid can a company be to redesign a product and make it worse

[@paianis]

short term profit

[@harjoat]

still not worth it, the profit they'd make from that would be minimal

[@paianis]

Harjoat Not with the kind of sales volumes Cherry has in the corporate market.

[@harjoat]

waiting for the day gateron are actually considered better than cherry by most reviewers then lol

[@paianis]

+Harjoat Nah, the current vast market for gaming-oriented keyboards with Cherry-like switches won't last.

[@lfenney5028]

The best no nonsense reviews of keyboards by far. As for your voice it is pure gold, I've found i have become a keyboard fanatic after watching your videos the last few months. I've been looking for a Omnikey Ultra or evolution for a while now to no avail. PS. If people haven't noticed this guys a fucking genius.

[@Chyrosran22]

Thanks man :D .

[@dalriada842]

Ah, nostalgia! I used to own this very keyboard. I gave it to a relative with an old computer I'd finished with. Sometime later, when they replaced the computer, they thoughtlessly threw away the keyboard as well. The thought of re-using an old keyboard with a new computer never occurred to them!

[@yanguYT]

oof oof and oof

[@placeholder3863]

may they suffer through membrane hell

[@KosherPorky]

@@placeholder3863 Model Ms aren't much of a hell I'd say

[@placeholder3863]

@@KosherPorky when were model M's mentioned again?

[@KosherPorky]

@@placeholder3863 When membrane was mentioned

[@Neightr0]

In the keyswitch market, we have innovators like Kailh x Novelkeys and high end switches like Zeal. What does that leave Cherry with? It's time for them to step up their game. They could start by restoring whatever manufacturing techniques were used to make the vintage switches and introducing some new switches like a first-party ergo clear.

[@zack_szh6769]

they actually did redesign their switches. try retooled blacks, they are pretty good

[@ARCOPWNS]

What do they have? Marketing and brand recognition.

[@hoder4857]

What do they have? Cherry mx blue for gamers Kek

[@Tao-dh9yz]

Zeals arent high end. They are overpriced. Plus the kailh x novelkeys havent aged well AT ALL. (Yes i get this is from 2 years ago.)

[@Olumin37]

I think much of the "smoothness" of vintage blacks is not so much due to different materials, but the fact that they are worn, or "broken in"... they are "vintage" after all. The plastic certainly also makes a difference, especially regarding the way they wear over time. One would need to test that with a new-in-box and unused cherry board with vintage blacks.

[@Chyrosran22]

Yes, there has been some debate about this. People did report NIB vintage Cherries being smooth like this too, but I don't have one like that so I purposely left it aside in this video as I can't confirm or deny it myself.

[@0M9H4X_Neckbeard]

Just test the Vintage MX Black right shift key switch, nobody ever uses that. If it sounds scratchy like the modern MX Black too, we have the confirmation.

[@jacobematt6222]

Uhh...Almost everybody uses right shift. You're the nobody who doesn't use it.

[@Thirsty_Fox]

It seems that it's the switches, not the wear. Otherwise, you would have a variety when you build a board from second-hand vintage MX Black switches and the board wouldn't be uniform. Even rarely-used switches are said to still be as smooth.

[@y11971alex]

Maybe try the pause key. It's rarely used even with MS-DOS.

[@SoulcatcherLucario]

I NEED those Doubleshot keycaps!

[@TommyFenstermacher5150]

If you're lucky, you can get a similar set from GMK. It'll be expensive, though...

[@my_negative_world]

Just got that keeb with those caps for 8 bucks.

[@fartimedes]

the keycaps are so beautiful yet i cant find any that are like under 40 dollars and that are ds

[@CaptainShovelHead]

@@my_negative_world you underestimate how hard it is to get these vintage keyboards, if you find one at a thrift store for really cheap that's just really good luck

[@my_negative_world]

@@CaptainShovelHead boiii trust me I don't underestimate. I've been looking for a deal like that for the past 2 years.

[@doug834]

Fascinating review. Until recently I never really thought about key switches at all, but I see now that I have been missing out on a lot of very interesting bits of mechanical goodness. That being said, I think that you have demonstrated that the vintage Cherry switches do seem to be of far superior quality than the more recent ones. Now I am beginning to understand why I have been seeing so many Cherry clones in modern keyboards - other manufacturers are outdoing the original. Nicely done.

[@Chyrosran22]

It's a very interesting study of market development, if anything. How long can you get away with making inferior products until someone comes along and out-does you on your own product? Products are still marketed as containing "genuine Cherry switches", but that's beginning to mean less and less. Of course that's not to say there are no horrible clones either.

[@doug834]

The market has a way of weeding out those who fall behind, and if that means that Cherry will end up being the "inspiration" for future switches instead of an actual player, then that's what will happen I suppose. I honestly only recently discovered some of the backstories of these companies and their products, so I am finding this all very interesting ;-)

[@y11971alex]

As long as median income doesn't go up, inferior goods will persist and dominate.

[@iNViSiBiLiTi]

Did you hear recently that Cherry updated their linear switches because of the Silents? Natural whites, reds, and blacks have new design stems and are supposedly far smoother than previous models.

[@Chyrosran22]

Yes, I heard, I'm in the process of trying to find out what's happened. I think new moulds, personally.

[@iNViSiBiLiTi]

Yup, should be new molds since it's the same mold as the silents but without the rubber dampeners attached.

[@Aggrofool]

Not much different. Very slightly smoother is all

[@legend131000]

I can confirm actually,I have a board with blacks from 2012 with blacks that are extremely scratchy even tho I like them,I few failed on me because I play alot of rhythm games,so I decided swap them out because they started ghost tapping ALOT. I bought some brand new blacks and they actually feel so smooth compared to the old ones that they almost feel lighter.

[@Neightr0]

@@Chyrosran22 That seems to be the generally accepted theory. They're referred to around r/MK as retooled reds and blacks.

[@thorwulfx1]

I have never really had any sense of my Cherry MX Black 'board being scratchy. It has a feel unto itself. I wouldn't say that it was the best for typing, but I can only sense a roughness when I'm depressing the key very slowly, which doesn't happen during my typing action. I find it to be good for gaming (not that I have time any more), but its main benefit is that it's pretty quiet for a mechanical. I can use it without annoying anyone nearby.

[@Bf34free]

Well I own a modern cherry mx black board and this made me feel bad :(

[@royalarchergaming3541]

He just doesn't like them! If you do good for you. Mechanical switches are largely about preference, I HATE MX blue but they're chyros's favorite cherry switch.

[@Boyetto-san]

Chyros actually hates MX blues, just probably prefers them over other Cherries just because they're clicky and more tactile than MX browns. I tend not to agree with him when it comes to Cherry switches, like with how much he hates MX browns. Some people really may prefer a non-clicky tactile switch that's very subtle, especially if they type or play games with a soft touch. And I honestly don't see what he means that MX blacks are fatiguing, but that's entirely subjective and based on what you're used to. On the other hand though, Chyros is entirely correct that modern day MX blacks, like the one I own, really are quite rough and scratchy. Not having tried any non-Cherry linear switches prior, I got to try a Bloody optical switch keyboard and the smoothness blew my mind.

[@dogechallenger4994]

Syed Atif I own a 20 years old one :)

[@radar._.]

Soldier in some gateron yellows or box blacks then lol

[@steveballmersbaldspot2.095]

Try and grab a newer one if you can. Cherry redid all of the tooling for their switch housings and sliders and as a result, many of their switches(particularly linear) are much smoother.

[@Megalink82]

"I measured this fucker with a tape measure" - Had me dying lol

[@SudosFTW]

as I've probably mentioned a few times before, I have a '91 Hertz keyboard with 'vintage' MX Blue switches. the cutoff seems to be someplace around mid-1992. my board was made in 1991, so I consider it to be "vintage Cherry".

[@Thirsty_Fox]

What do you think of yours? I have what I assume to be vintage MX Blue switches in an old G80-1800 (Dolch) and they don't seem to have aged all that well when I compare them with the newer ones in my '12 BlackWidow.

[@ominous-omnipresent-they]

Think about it, someone living in 1992 paid over $100 dollars for this thing. My Ajazz AK510 cost me only $75, has individual key RGB lighting, a chassis that doesn't flex, and SA profile PBT keycaps sitting on brown switches that, honestly, are quite pleasant to type on.

[@KirstenleeCinquetti]

I had one of these a g80 with a card swipe originally a POS keyboard and it had some really nice blacks, I did morn its passing. Also mine was a black cased variant what really sold me on the g80 was its compact footprint for a full sized keyboard. I'm a heavy handed user and my current ride of SA caps on reds is noice but I yearn for gateron greens on a solid deck. For no other reason to get that super heavy key feel.

[@vennox1598]

where do you get all these Keyboards from?

[@evanjrowley]

Your links "here and here" are missing... :(

[@royalarchergaming3541]

Cherry feels like putting tiny wood bits and tips of slivers into dusty alps or rubber domes because of how scratchy the are.

[@RelaxandSleeping]

Im using it right now xD

I have this exact same board with vintage MX Black switches. I don't like linear switches, so I'm gonna replace them with some Kailh BOX Pale Blues/Kailh BOX White switches. But these Cherry MX Black switches have integrated diodes, which complicates things a little. I plan to resolder new diodes but on the other side of the PCB, opposite from the one where the swiches are. In that way diodes are not going to interfere with the new replacement switches.

[@nerdyneedsalife8315]

It's been over a month. Have you gone through the project or are you changing your mind?

I sure did. Diodes soldered on the opposite side of the switches. And I absolutely love the board. Kailh BOX Pale Blues are awesome. One more mod I plan to do is to put some padding under the PCB to reduce the flex. Keep an eye on /r/MechanicalKeyboards if you're interested, I'm gonna post a build log.

[@stopthephilosophicalzombie9017]

Is this board programmable?

[@deathtaco4095]

will you ever try speed swichis

[@Pavilions2]

The vintage one's sound way much better than the new switch's.

[@BenMursa]

I like my Cherry MX blacks on my Steel Series SG because of the fact I can hammer them pretty hard. If I was looking for a retro board with a similar actuation force and build quality, what would you recommend?

[@dogechallenger4994]

Ben Mursa I'm late but I recommend the MX 1500. Rare but really nice. I own one.

[@UncraftedPlays]

Coming from only watching his new vids, I was shocked when he started swearing LMFAO

[@lettuce7378]

hey, the switches don't sound scratchy as hell! That might be a record for cherry switches.

[@Dyto69]

Just bought a G80-1000 HAU and I needed to watch this again

[@Nintendo8bit]

Strange... My G80-3000 looks exactly like your G80-1000 and with the same print on the keycaps. Maybe because it's a Norwegian version? The article no. is G80-3040 HEN/02

[@missgradenkoMC]

How do these compare to linear alps?

[@Chyrosran22]

Roughly equal in terms of smoothness if the Alps aren't dirty. Keyfeel is a little more boring, and stiffer (vintage MX blacks are stiffer than modern ones).

[@mogtrader8]

where u buy

[@IIIJFRIII]

Wow did not know cherry was sucky now a days. Makes me sad, I wounder how good cherry blues were back in the 80's. Still if I had more options I would love to get a new 1980's blue alps keyboard with out the problems that alps have like if they get dirty they brake. Anyway thanks for another great review man!

[@Chyrosran22]

Thanks, glad you enjoyed it :) . The difference is said to be less obvious with blue Cherries because the tactile event masks the scratchiness. And I agree, a brand-new blue Alps board would be amazing on the market. My KB-101A was totally unused when I got it, and I'd love for everyone to get the chance to try it like that as well! :D

[@knyaz3v]

Could you please tell what exactly the difference in consctruction between vintage black's and modern black's? I'm using black's in office, just buy it used for only 30$. I actually prefer red's because it's so fast and light. But there's advantage of black's that they are quiet. I would like to know if I can improve black's some way, things I dont really like about them: they feels too heavy and looong.

[@Chyrosran22]

The weighting of Cherry linear switches is a common complaint; many find that reds are too light and blacks are too stiff. This is partly why I like linear Alps a lot, because they have a nice weighting in between the two (and they are smoother than either). It is known that the type of plastics used in Cherries changed at some point, but AFAIK we don't know the exact details (nor what other things changed over time).

[@knyaz3v]

I mean, what if just disassemble vintage and moderns black switch and compare them? Is it only plastic makes the difference? I have no option to use alps and even average ~100$ keyboard is way too expensive for me to buy.

[@Chyrosran22]

Grell Sutcliff We don't know the exact differences, that's the problem.

[@ldandco]

"... there is no screw anywhere in this mother fucker" lol classic

[@lemin9343]

Tweeday?

[@jackyluu1311]

Hi, are you willing to sell this keyboard? I am really looking for this for a while.

I have this exact board, with those nice smooth MX Black swiches with diodes in them. Problem is I don't like linears. I would like to solder some Kailh BOX switches in this board. Am I gonna lose NKR because the diodes are in the switches?

[@alexf933]

Brilliant video.

[@isTheNightfly]

How about the G81-8000LPDUS-2?

[@Chyrosran22]

I have one. Don't really know how to use the card reader, but the keyboard is really awful (all G81s are).

[@isTheNightfly]

Chyrosran22 well, so i wont buy one, thanks for the anwer.

[@add_tekaru1057]

shit, i need do find my granny's cherry keyboard right now!!

[@DuyLeNguyen]

Chyros, how common are these recyling centres where you get these keyboards? Do you have to know the people running them to get in and pick things up or is it quite common for these centres to sell their wares for people who wants them?

[@Chyrosran22]

I've found at least two dozen of these over time at recycling centres, they turn up pretty regularly. The guys at the recycling centre know me quite well by now xD .

[@DuyLeNguyen]

That's awesome! If it's not too much to ask, could you grab one of these the next time they turn up? I've been looking around ebay for one of these for a while without any luck. More than willing to compensate you for your time and efforts and will pay for postage too! Oh and goob job with the channel, I find your videos really informative, keep it up!

[@Chyrosran22]

Sorry, I completely misread this, I thought I was replying to a comment in the Dell AT101 video xD . No these aren't common at all. G80-3000s are, though.

[@DuyLeNguyen]

+Chyrosran22 Ah that's a shame. Any chance you want to sell yours? :)

[@Chyrosran22]

Half the switches are dead as a doornail xD .

[@overcooler91]

I'm wondering, what about vintage cherry mx browns? Are they just as rubbish as modern ones? If you happen to have a board laying around or you find a good deal on one, I'd love to see a review about it.

[@Chyrosran22]

It's not that easy to find them, and tbh you don't hear about them very often anyway. The scratchiness really stands out on linear switches, so that's probably the reason.

[@Chyrosran22]

Besides, I don't think scratchiness is the main problem with MX browns.

[@overcooler91]

Instead of a tactile bump it feels more like a tactile rough spot. So I was wondering if the bump could be a bit more pronounced or just feel less shit in any way.

[@Chyrosran22]

Exactly, and this is quite simply a problem with the MX design; it doesn't allow for particularly nice tactility. Vintage or new, this won't be fixed, because the switch design can't allow for it.

[@Fassette]

Your videos and knowledge about computer keyboards and their history is impressing. Congratulations and thanks for this really relevant and really useful exception of such a thing like a video channel on KZbin. We (a collective of writers for the Fassette magazine, sadly German only) really appreciate it and follow your videos for quite a while now. Have you ever thought about collaborating with a manufacturer to create your "dream"-keyboard? Like WASD did with the Code one in collaboration with Jeff "Coding Horror"? And one other question: In terms of realistical chance of any realisation - since we really are frustated about any choices we know today - what would you recommend for some of our writers, who really feel the difference of sound, response, etc, and are not satisfied with the new generation of Cherry no more? They feel missing real haptic, jump, weight, and true tactile bumpiness like on many old boards, not only in marketing words but in real life ;) since they all feel very cheap and thin sharp unrounded plastic like today. To get an old one is an option, but compatible with exchangable switches noadays? Hard to manage...

[@Chyrosran22]

Hi, and thanks! I haven't looked into a collaboration yet, no, although I might ask several for donations to review. I can understand it if you're not satisfied with modern Cherries, it's not a very good design to begin with in my opinion. I myself am a big Alps fan, but the problem is that the switches and keyboards need to be extremely clean, or they will feel like crap, and it's not easy to obtain keyboards in such condition. IBM keyboards like the Model M and especially Model F give very nice keyfeel as well, and they were built from the start for typists. Model Ms are easy to get as they're very common. Model Fs tend to have alienating layouts, but if you have room enough on your desk the F122 is pretty damn close to ISO layout - and you can change the keycaps around to make it look close to QWERTZ if you like. If you like very small layouts like 60%, Ellipse actually makes brand-new USB Kishsavers (60% layout Model Fs) commercially in ANSI, ISO and HHKB layout, although they're not cheap.

[@jani80k]

Vintage Blacks from that era are maybe smooth... I just disassembled a board from 1992 (still Vints) and those switches were scratchy as heck. Again I disassembled a board from 1995 (not Vints anymore) and the switches were smooth. I think every time Cherry changed the tooling the first batches of switches were fine. This goes for Vints, Pretooleds, and Retooleds. All Vints being smooth is a myth.

[@BlackAcePlays]

I have a question. I use a "G80 1000 LFADE /01" from Feb. 1998. The switches under the cap are blue and also the article number says they are MX blue. But they feel completely strange. You get a tactile feedback, like a little bump, but no click. Completely different to my other MX blue boards (G80-3000, TriggerZ, BlackWidow). And it's not only the keys that you use a lot and could be worn out, but also Numlock and Scroll lock are like that. Did they sell different blue switches?

[@Chyrosran22]

Your keyboard is a German-layout winkeyless G80-1000 with lasered keycaps and MX blues, correct? No, these won't be any different switches from other MX blues; they're probably just in worse condition.

[@BlackAcePlays]

Thanks for the fast reply. Yes it is. Think I have to open one of the switches then to solve that mystery. Hopefully I don't fuck it up completely. :D

[@TheMstwntdLMSV123]

IDK if I have asked this before, but have you tried a brown alps board? Or are brown alps clones? Also, where are you able to source your keyboards? The only keyboards that I can find are in poor condition and inconsistently priced.

[@Chyrosran22]

I just go out and look for them :) . I haven't tried brown Alps though, no, although I have tried Neon Green ones.

[@MisterComment25]

Make Cherry Great Again

[@elsasslotharingen7507]

Make Cherry Forgotten Again*

[@iiatyy]

no joke the sound of the modern scratchy MX Black at 6:35 made me cringe and my body tense up like I just ate something really sour. God that's awful.

[@laughtrack686]

The modern ones sound like someone pleasuring theirself.

[@missgradenkoMC]

Do a Commodore 64 keyboard next.

[@NoEntertainment]

he's more of a mechanical kind 'a guy

[@Chyrosran22]

"I'm a mechanical, I'm a mechanical, I'm a mechanical man."

[@missgradenkoMC]

Chyrosran22 I'm pretty sure the keyboard is mechanical.

[@Chyrosran22]

Nope, Mitsumi hybrid switches. I reviewed them in my dome with slider megareview ;) .

[@missgradenkoMC]

+Chyrosran22 oh , ok

[@CrankyStorming]

I bought a brand new G80-3000 with MX Blues. They feel much smoother than some MX Reds on a Corsair keyboard I tried in a shop, those were horrible. Is it possible that Cherry are using new old stock? I know it's brand new because it has modern Windows legends.

[@Chyrosran22]

No, Cherry hasn't used "vintage" models of switches since the mid-90s. The turnover and production of these switches is so high that there's no way that the stock could've survived for 20 years, let alone actually used in production. Are you sure both are genuine MX blue? Alternatively, you might've misremembered, I only try to judge switches side-by-side personally as it gives a much fresher perspective of the situation :) .

[@worldhello1234]

@8:09 You meanie, Cherry MX snobs need to justify their purchase. :( It is Cherry MX, it commands a higher price, so it must be better, according to some people. ;)

[@morbue7575]

hey do you know of any keyboards with cherry mx vintage blacks that are still avalible in europe ?

[@BombedByMe]

cant wait till the day I find a good deal on a g80

[@z4nn1ch]

Easily worth 5$s - GMK nowadays multiplying this by 30

[@dariusXdmemes]

I love your handsome voice, omg.

[@mikhail6289]

So, Old Cherry = Gateron, pretty easy))

[@TAVIII]

abs turn shiny though...

[@Chyrosran22]

Yes, but there's ways to combat that. Regardless, PBT goes shiny too, just slower ;) .

[@TAVIII]

Chyrosran22 well the difference is I have an Amiga here with PBT dye sub caps and they have a tiny amount of shine. ABS get it in like... a month, real bad. PBT... that Amiga is 26 years old.

[@TAVIII]

how do you combat ABS caps turning shiny/

[@Chyrosran22]

OK One does not, unfortunately. You'll have to replace it when it does.

[@TAVIII]

Chyrosran22 but you said there are ways to combat it?

[@2moons72]

I’ll put links here and here. No link.

[@AnvilSP]

KZbin removed annotations a couple years ago. You used to be able to add links and text in-video, but they didn't work on mobile and the feature was phased out in favor of end cards.

[@yukimo3341]

..recommended vid

[@Thorogrimm]

How they ever outdid alps, I'll never know

[@Chyrosran22]

They didn't. They just didn't leave the business.

[@andrewenglish3810]

@Chyrosran22 have you ever come across older cherry mx switches, like the ones they used in the Commodore Amiga 2000 keyboards? Watch this video, you can see what the switches look like. kzbin.info/www/bejne/iWWlgaKVo51-iZo

[@maxwellcrafter]

*Looks towards wallet*

[@chunkymilk1288]

Hello my friend

[@dogechallenger4994]

I own a MX 1500

[@TprogamerYOUTUBETerraria]

50p?! Absolute bargain

[@far1581]

is this Hugh Laurie? :DD

[@Chyrosran22]

I sound like Hugh Laurie? xD

[@hieronymuscanterbury3196]

Очень классно

[@fataldreidel5846]

I like Popped Cherrys the best