Chieftain's Q&A 18. Guinness, Almond Fingers, and a Revisit to Elbonia

Part 1 of two. Edit: Since posting I have been informed of at least one armored train engaging tanks (in Poland) and have been told by a reliable source that my earlier source regarding Poland turning in Fireflies for 76s was a not uncommon misunderstanding: They actually turned in 75s for American 76s.
00:00 Greetings!
02:03 Is Guinness is actually a decent drink?
03:09 Have I ever trained with other nations’ militaries?
05:37 Thoughts on current Canadian armor?
06:25 For tank-infantry co-operation, what differences are there when the infantry’s transports are APCs vs IFVs?
08:19 Which German tank would I prefer to command on the Eastern Front?
09:20 What has been the biggest inconsistency I’ve found in one nation’s archives when doing research?
11:06 The impression is the Germans went much more into disruptive pattern camo than the Allies. Is this true?
14:27 Are there any accounts of armored trains used vs tanks or other AFVs.
15:37 How would German AFV production numbers have looked had they only produced Panzer 3, 4 and associated variants, rather than also producing Panther, Tiger, etc?
17:11 Can the Elbonian Armored Force be saved from its sabotage?
22:19 Which uniform/tank color scheme do I find the prettiest?
22:35 If the “water tank” subterfuge had not occurred, what would tanks have been called?
23:11 Can autoloaders unload rounds, and is there a manual backup?
23:55 How is a tank ace defined?
24:12 Can I briefly describe the development of the organization of armored units
25:03 What’s the deal with the swing-out rubber panels on T-72s?
25:49 Does adding extra infantry or equipment on top of the tank cover air intakes and result in problems?
26:08 How will armored doctrine evolve to deal with the drone threat?
26:47 The merit of indirect fire equipment on tanks
29:45 What was the first tank wider than one man to have a centrally located driver?
30:30 Why eliminate the bow gunner so quickly after WW2?
31:00 I’ve mentioned I play DCS. Which modules?
31:24 How would I deal with an enemy vehicle I came across but couldn’t confirm had been knocked out or abandoned?
31:55 Would I use Operation Fortitude inflatables as Christmas decorations?
32:24 Did the “traditional” armored units of England and the Commonwealth keep their existing British tanks and the Americans go only to the ‘new units for the war effort"?
34:37 What are my thoughts about the Hussite Wars and the use of the War Wagon?
35:40 Were there armored clashes in the early battles of the war in the Donbas
36:20 Do I plan to or would I like to go back and do full Inside the Hatches on any vehicles I looked at with Sofilein?
36:57 If the Cold War went hot in the mid to late 60s, who would have fared better in tank on tank engagements?
38:00 The 17pr was known for excessive blast and blinding muzzle flash, what was done with the 20pr to fix this?
38:25 Will the Aberdeen Tank Collection ever be seen by the public again?
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[@dr.sommercamp3435]

One of my patients was a Tiger I gunner back in WW2, someday I asked him how it was serving in this legendary machine. He told me this little story: Once they got stuck under allied fire, teaming up with a bunch of infantrymen. As his loader got injured, he asked one of the guys in cover next to his vehicle, if he want to come in and help him loading, it might be saver for him. But, the soldier said: "No, thanks! They shooting at YOU, not at US! I'm fine!"😉

[@ruddyff]

'I will be working with the French soon' *Forgotten weapons wants to know your location*

[@malebetegrrr5793]

If you want to see them go crazy inside their team, just ask : "Do you say "chocolatine" or "pain au chocolat" ?" (A pure french joke about food couteaux-et-tirebouchons.com/chocolatine-ou-pain-au-chocolat-la-vraie-reponse/ )

[@michelguevara151]

@@malebetegrrr5793 chocolatine bien sur

[@brag0001]

@@michelguevara151 Je n'ai jamais entendu ce mot. Pain au chocolat bien sûre 😉

[@RexKarrs]

@@michelguevara151 Tres bien aussi.

[@myfavoritemartian1]

An ensign was once given a task by the Captain: "Load and stow that cargo on the dock." After 4 hours, the Captain called the Ensign and told him to depend on his men and stop micro managing. The Ensign told the Chief to get the cargo loaded, the Chief turned and took a deep breath...........30 minutes later, the cargo was aboard.

[@CaptainSeato]

"I'm not going to let you sit through [a multiple-hour-Q&A]." BUT I WANNA :v

[@Ie_Shima]

14:27 During the invasion of Poland, Armored Train Number 53 of the Polish Army took part in the Battle of Mokra, in which it is accredited for arriving on the field just as a German armored assault from the 4th Panzer division was crossing the rail line. Apparently it wiped most of the assault from the field by firing on the Panzer Is and IIs with its 75mm cannons at point blank range.

[@avokado2888]

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armoured_trains_of_Poland

[@sawekkucharzyk2329]

Train No 53 did engage vechicles of 4th Panzer division three times during the first day of war, destroing some tanks, routing some more, train got shot in return, one of the 75mm turrets got dammaged, there was amunnition fire (some ammo expolded, but this did not cripple the train), in the end Germans started to dismantle the tracks, so the train withdrew. Train was armed with two 75mm anti armour cannons, two 100mm howitzers, and 19 heavy machienguns. (I have no realible numbers on german losses, only "primary sources" i have right now are memoirs published during soviet era, witch are usually extremly unreallible, they say 104 armoured vechicles and 40 tanks, tanks were supposedly panzer ones and twos)

[@GARDENER42]

@@sawekkucharzyk2329 Fascinating information. Thanks for sharing it.

[@quentintin1]

@@sawekkucharzyk2329 History says the train was sourced from Austria-Hungary, so i doubt the 75mm guns were really anti tank guns, but more likely field guns that had some kind of anti armour munition as even in polish service, the only at gun they had in service was a licenced production of the Bofors 37mm gun, but they had loads of ~75mm field guns from various sources between 1918 and 1939

[@wardasz]

@@quentintin1 They do not even need special AT munitions. For PzI or PzII 75mm HE was more than enough.

[@MandolinMagi]

Air Force Museum: Four huge buildings. It's a legit three-day visit.

[@Shaun_Jones]

I can (just about) see the whole thing in one day to a fairly in-depth degree; but that’s mostly because I can walk fast, don’t need lunch, and know where everything is. Seriously, I’m like the Terminator in search mode when I go there.

[@Attaxalotl]

Oh heck yeah! I'm going in a few weeks!

[@qunt2742]

15:54 "This strikes me as being the sort of question which can only be answered by pulling a figure out of the fourth point of contact" I love that

[@peterstickney7608]

A single reply with a few thoughts - As to the Lada - I've had experience as a civilian working on Soviet Era Russian aircraft, vehicles, and electronics. (So that the only logistics were self-logistics) The statement that you can fix it by poinding on it with a rock is essentially correct - but you need a lot of rocks. My impression is that they tend to be generally simple to fix (for relative levels of simple), but you need to be fixing it often. As to camouflage - a friend of mine who spent a lot of time in the 1970s in the Fulda Gap pointed out that it didn't much matter what camouflage scheme you had the vehicles in - after a half-hour out of the Kaserne, they were all the color of the local dust/mud. About uhm, missing the range and the the Master Gunner calculating probably impact - While my youngest brother (Tank Boy) was in Armor Basic at Ft Knoz in the mid-80s, (M60A3), one of his classmates shot a 5-round series of Sabot Rounds with the system set up for HEAT. The lost shots easily cleared the backstop berm, and, I think a hill. A nice old lady Kentuckian called the post to see if the Army could come out and collect the metal Lawn Darts that showed up in her back yard.

[@jessekorhonen3406]

In finnish the official word for "Tank" (often traslated to just "Tankki") is "Panssarivaunu", literally translated to "Armour wagon", often shortened to just "Panssari" (Armour). During WW2 in use was also a name "Hyökkäysvaunu" (Attack wagon), but as far as I know it hasnt been used since. Nowadays tanks are classified as "Taisteluvaunu" (Battle wagon, similar to MBT in english, for example Leopard 2A6) and "Rynnäkkövaunu" (Assault wagon, for example BMP-2 or Bradley)

[@ComfortsSpecter]

Incredible Historical Insight A Very Bad Supposed English Contemporary It’s just Battle Tank MBT Is too Specific and only Common Casually and-or Proper Formally Used for It’s Inefficient (Illiterate) Definition Ofcourse The Finnish may use Battle Tank as Their stand in for MBT but It’s Objectively not the Same A Bradley Is Literally an MBT Not just Technically, It’s Better Practically as an MBT More as Medium BT It’s Better to not Reproduce This Failure in Finland Though ofcourse: It’s already too late

[@Joelsfilmer]

If we're renaming the tank I propose a slightly poetic translation of the Swedish word. 𝓑𝓪𝓽𝓽𝓵𝓮 𝓒𝓱𝓪𝓻𝓲𝓸𝓽

[@_nanking5374]

or we could just use swedish. Their abbreviations for tanks and their ammunition are glorious word spaghettis. stridsfordon stridsvagn, pansarvarnsluftvarnsvagn, etc.

[@LankyAssMofka]

@@_nanking5374 🤯 I hope they are at least pronounced how they look

[@mooneyes2k478]

@@_nanking5374 Pansarvarnslavettvagn, actually. Not that that thing ever existed, it's entirely made up. Well, sort of, there was a very rudimentary testing of something, later leading to the Fm/43 anti-air vehicle. Anyways, when it comes to the name, at least "anti-armor mounting carriage" makes a bit more sense.

[@filmandfirearms]

@@LankyAssMofka Swedish is pretty easy to read, actually. Just try Polish and you will appreciate the Germanic simplicity of the Norse languages

[@Tallus_ap_Mordren]

In Harry Turtledove’s Great War: the American Front, the prototype Union armored line breaking vehicles (aka tanks) are delivered to General George Armstrong Custer in containers labeled ‘barrels’. For the remainder of the Great War, and the subsequent war that inevitably followed, tracked armored vehicles continue to be called barrels.

[@michaelmorrismorris6113]

That was a great series,alongside War that Happened Early series

[@Pershingtank]

And then the lizards in Worldwar call em Landcruisers!

[@carldebellis7310]

That book series and the subsequent series are full of allusions to both world wars. Like Jake Featherson is a confederate Hitler, etc....

[@Tomek1001]

22:34 A tank in polish is "czołg", wich means - The Crawler. The early ones moved at slow speed, they crawled.

[@otohikoamv]

I just want to take a moment to appreciate the term "doing a Drach", which definitely made me fall off my chair!

[@womble321]

He is famous in his own lunchtime. No I don't know what it means my Grandfather used to say it!

[@LankyAssMofka]

@@womble321 old saying meaning he's well know among his peers or in Drachs case the relatively small group of us interested in listening to in depth military history / military hardware history/mechanics/development.

[@amuslockhart519]

"if it didnt land anywhere important, who cares?" Irish Genius!

[@WalkaCrookedLine]

My first thought was EOD. Then it registered he's talking about a training range and I suppose they use some sort of non-exploding practice rounds for training.

[@MaxwellAerialPhotography]

6:18 “but thus far the limited feedback I have received from two operators has involved the word garbage.” So what you’re saying is, life continues as normal in the Canadian Army.

[@calvingreene90]

Royal Canadian Navy's adopted Barrett's Privateers as an anthem for a reason as well.

[@justforgaming5059]

I'm in the Canadian infantry, but I have some friends in armored recon that I've never heard complement the TAPV even once

[@njake19]

For finding where the rounds went, it is to help ensure it landed where no one else was present. Also, if it was a service round like HEAT, we have to locate it and ensure it denotated. Otherwise, it becomes an UXO and time to call out EOD. From C92.

[@decnet100]

11:06 Very interesting, goes to say: The guy with the best camo is probably the guy who doesn't have air superiority :).

[@xxxlonewolf49]

Excluding recon forces

[@decnet100]

@@xxxlonewolf49 True :)

[@Kumimono]

I've yet to see the guy with the best camo. :)

[@MartyBCNB]

I remember stories from many many years ago that circulated that during one indirect fire exercise with Canadian tanks in Germany someone fired a sabot instead of an HE round. Never confirmed the validity but the story assumed the round ended up somewhere in Czechoslovakia at the time.

[@marty2129]

Any chance to know the year and location of that happening? As a Czech, I would like to czech it... I mean, check it... and we might get the rough idea of the place in czechoslovak borderland teritories that particular sabot might buried itself into...

[@MartyBCNB]

@@marty2129 unfortunately no... it’s one of those stories that made its way around the mess and reserve unit back here in Canada in the mid 80’s.

[@calvingreene90]

My brother told me that when training with Ma Deuce that the last round in the last belt of ammo to be fired didn't fire and they didn't work the action to confirm that the chamber was empty. then when they were dismounting the gun the round cooked off in the general direction of the town Virginia Beach. Figuring no harm no foul decided to wait till it hit the news before admitting to the mistake. They got away with it.

[@Gizmomadug]

It was done by the Scots Greys in 1966. By my brother-in-law.

[@bigblue6917]

Sounds familiar

[@Zyme86]

When going to a class at Oregon years ago I spoke to an elderly man who was auditing a geography course. Turned out he was a loader for a Panther tank and only survived because they noticed just before Kursk that their barrel had taken damage and would have detonated any round fired.

[@Styvistan]

The most interesting Guinness I´ve had was in The Gambia in 2015. They have a local brewery there (as a legacy from colonial times) and as I attended a wedding held at a Joint Officers´ Mess, I was served cold Guinness in a champagne glass...

[@alanfhall6450]

I can remember drinking bottled (local) Guinness in a tin shack in Kumasi, Ghana in 1992 whilst sheltering from a riot during the presidential election.

[@ScottKenny1978]

Guinness being served cold is useful. You wait till it has warmed up to 50-55⁰F, aka cellar temperature and it's great.

[@andyc3088]

When i was trained as a cheiftain gunner we, were taught indirect firing using a HESH round. Regarding of were a round went it was funny when someone firing an APDS round on the HESH scale!

[@f-xdemers2825]

The point with the Azimut chart uses on the range is maybe to be able to find and retrieve unexploded HE rounds or other suprised rich ammunition which went astray.

[@bigblue6917]

With some of Drach's Patreons Q&As this would be barely warmings up

[@ApostasyUnlimited]

I love Drach's 5+ hours Q&As

[@davidbrennan660]

You do have to send the men to dinner first before engaging a Drach Fleet Action at the beginning of a month.

[@bigblue6917]

@@ApostasyUnlimited Fine way to spend a wet evening. Come summer though not so much.

[@bigblue6917]

@@davidbrennan660 Dinner? Could send them off on fleet manoeuvres.

[@bigblue6917]

@Edgar Miller Biremes, triremes, penteconters the lot. And how many of us would be surprised if he could name the crew.

[@peteranderson037]

I second the comment about TF Lafayette in Afghanistan. The "never fired, only dropped once" meme is just that, a meme. The problem, as always, is with the politicians and highest tier of their military bureaucracy. Though that can be said about a lot of armed forces in a lot of countries.

[@nk_3332]

A German friend once commented that the French military was brave, capable and tenacious but suffered by facing the one force for all their skill they could not overcome and had a track record of destroying them for over a century and a half: The French Government

[@jimmehjiimmeehh9748]

@@nk_3332 "The problem, as always, is with the politicians and highest tier of their military bureaucracy." At least for WW1 and 2 this is not true and is actually a pro French myth. A nice example is the Battle of Sedan, in which pro French revisionists like to claim the reason the French retreated from Sedan before the Germans even arrived was because General Lafontaine moved his HQ which caused "confusion and panic". Except the whole reason he moved his HQ in the first place was because the 55th had already started to retreat en mass and he was trying to rally them. French might be lions right now, but they were not in the first half of the 20th century.

[@peterstickney7608]

@@jimmehjiimmeehh9748 They were certainly lions in 1914-1915. Given the level of communication and recon available at the time, a mobile force from an unexpected direction, even on foot, is an almost insurnountable opponent. As it evolved, their recon/intelligence doctrine - particularly aerial photoreconnaisance, and the artillery doctrine that tied to it, was the basis for the U.S. Army interwar and WW2 artillery command and conrtrol organization. Where the French lost out in the Interwar period was that they didn't update their Command, Control, and Communication beyond mid-1918. The pace of battle had increased - particularly a mobile battle, if you were unfortunate enought to be meeting one of the relatively few German Armored/Motorized formations, while the French Army's command system was still at a walking pace. Remember - The losers generally aren't as bad as the victors think they are, nor are teh victors as good as they think they are.

[@jimmehjiimmeehh9748]

@@peterstickney7608 I wish I knew how broken minds like yours work. I mean I bring up a specific example and you respond with an aside which is incorrect and even if it had been true is irrelevant, a generalisation which is both wrong and is disproven by the example I mention so nonsensical to even mention and then follow it all up with an empty platitude that had nothing to do with anything said by either of us up to that point. What on earth..?

[@johnegan7622]

@@jimmehjiimmeehh9748 Go watch The Great War channel, please. Your ignorance of the French military is Rumsfeld-like.

[@littlefatso]

"Not convinced by the TAPV..." Hey there, 10 Years Canadian Infantry (2009-2020) here. Can confirm, it has its good points but, overall, its very much an enigma as a piece of kit...like something decided on in committee rather than something with a lot of practical consideration or input.

[@SindriTheReaper]

Been waiting way to long for this. Great job, Saint Nick!

[@m4sturb33f]

I got way to excited seeing this while im working

[@thegodofhellfire]

thanks again, looking forward to next week's part 2. 🤙

[@frankgulla2335]

Fascinating talk again, sir. Nicely done. Love the small details you know about when it comes to armor.

[@Sedan57Chevy]

Another great (first part of a) Q&A! These really are wonderful to watch: the perfect combination of interesting history, intriguing personal opinions and experiences, and fantastic dry humor. Can't wait for part two! On a side note, I live a few hours north of Ft. Benning and it's super frustrating that the collection isn't/wasn't more available (I can understand the recent restrictions given Covid). One of my dad's bucket list dreams is to see a Tiger in person, and it'd be great to be able to see the one at Benning with him sooner rather than later...

[@AgentB7]

It looks like “chariot” or “carriage” is the most popular non-“tank” term of tank, so I can imagine it being adopted worldwide. In English it might be “armored carriage” or maybe simply “armo” or something, not unlike German “Panzer”. In Russia, “tyazholaya bronemashina”, “heavy armored machine”, might have been used.

[@fabiogalletti8616]

In italia is "carro armato", so chariot with weapons - "armato" has no connection to armor or any kind of protection.

[@iabnatgeo]

@@fabiogalletti8616 Swedish: stridsvagn = battle wagon/battle truck

[@MGB-learning]

Outstanding video and presentation.

[@JoshuaC923]

I would like to say a big thank you Chieftain, really appreciate you spending many hours of your week working to keep us entertained

[@billd.iniowa2263]

Just wanted to thank you for your time. It really is appreciated.

[@yalelingoz6346]

Thank you for these Q and As I love how precisely you frame you answer. And I love that by answering 'The merit of indirect fire equipment on tanks' you indirectly answered a question I've been meaning to ask any of my tanker mates when I caught up with them in real life. I was curious if they felt a loss of range capability when going from the 105 rifle to the 120 smoothbore for HE fire support. But knowing that they probably don't have 120 HE rounds, that question is answered.

[@Krzysztof.l.Polak.84]

15:10 There is at least one incident in `39 campaign, when German tanks from 4th PzDiv were stopped by Polish armored train during battle of Mokra; Polish Cav. Bde was supported by armoured train no. 53 "Śmiały" pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C5%9Amia%C5%82y_(poci%C4%85g_pancerny) According to this, this one train had at least one more encounter with German tank froce apart from this battle. In general, Poles considered trains as regular combat units - were aware of their obsolescence, but in our conditions this was still very useful weapon, approx. battery of field artillery, higly mobile (in its restrictions), usually with small inf. and tank support... I`m pretty sure, that Soviets would also have some examples of direct fights between their arm trains and panzers.

[@MrCrazySpike]

Germans got harassed so much by those Polish trains they created their own armored train task force. From wiki "Poland used armoured trains extensively during the invasion of Poland. One observer noted that "Poland had only few armoured trains, but their officers and soldiers were fighting well. Again and again they were emerging from a cover in thick forests, disturbing German lines".[21] One under-appreciated aspect of so many Polish armoured trains being deployed during the Polish Defensive War in 1939 is that when German planes attacked the railroads, it was usually the tracks themselves. As late as September 17, three fresh divisions in the east were moved westward by train. On September 18, three more divisions followed. This in turn prompted Nazi Germany to reintroduce armoured trains into its own armies."

[@phaeronseherekh1754]

@@MrCrazySpike As I recall the Germans had armored trains during WW1 and were thus aware of them to the point of considering making them in the interwar years afterwards, once in poland they had captured and made a few (presumably because the reports reminded the higher ups that they existed) along with sticking with the WW2 axis tradition of capturing and using more or less anything they could. After going to read said wiki it is also notably poorly sourced in the sense its missing a fair few.

[@TNX255]

Perhaps The Chieftain doesn't realize that we love to watch long episodes of his Q&A's, they are very entertaining! Hell, we even loved watching paint dry with him! :)

[@FollowedGaming]

Always love these

[@jonathancoetzer6937]

Thank you sir excellent as always

[@Sir.Craze-]

The Canadian AFV thing looks bloody amazing! Sadly, I think we all know that's only #4 on the list of importance. Right behind "does it have an external audio system for ambush tunes." And infront of "Kettle, Tea."

[@Freedomfred939]

According to the Organization of Army Ground forces volume of the "Green Book" series the Army tested the effectiveness of camouflage uniforms and found their usefulness was defeated by movement. Since the Army that was being built had to be offensive in nature the additional cost was not warranted. (Notice the fancy helmet camouflage in the band of Brothers on Dday compared to the helmets near the end). I suspect the Army had the same opinion on painted vehicle camouflage. Later in the war the Army Airforce also quit painting airplanes in order to save several hundred pounds of weight in exchange for 10 MPH of improved speed. I imagine their was savings in production cost as well. When the Army went from the simple green fatigues to the BDU my uniform costs went from under $10 a set to nearly $100 per set. And the BDU was not permanent press, hard to iron, was hot and had the goofy collar. And my superiors could still find me.

[@tarjei99]

A thing to remember is that Von Seeckt required that officers in the German Army had to have a techical education. That probably had an effect that was not expected by anyone else.

[@wardasz]

About tanks vs armored train battle - on 1st of september '39 near Mokra polish cavalry brigade was attack by german panzer divizion. Polish forces (dismounted and heavy fortified) hold them for an entire day, destroing 76 tanks. Besides using integral artilery and AT guns, brigade was reinforced by armored train armed with 2x75mm guns and 2x100mm houtizers. Due to the fact that polish defence line was set along the railway line, train have pretty good mobility, and it's fire was very efective against german tanks. Here some basic links, hooks for those who want to search some more: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Mokra en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C5%9Amia%C5%82y_(armoured_train)

[@just_one_opinion]

What happened to the train? Did it get stuka-d?

[@wardasz]

@@just_one_opinion If I remember correctly (and I base on the book "Honor żołnierza 1939" by Bogusław Wołoszański - he is more of the journalist than historian, so the book may not be 100% accurate, but but it is not based on data pulled out of someone's arse either) the Luftwaffe does attack (using stukas) and part of the planes aimed on the train, but AA fire (including those 100mm howitzers use in AA role, despite the lack of proper AA sights) made a attack pretty unefective. According to the wiki page I linked, train retreat after the battle and than participle in other action, also including tank vs train combat. Fighting on bouth fronts, it end service in Lviv, captured by the soviets when town's garrison surrender. From looking on the polish wiki: -on 1 of september it support the cavalry twice, bouth time destroing several tanks. -later than day it meet with "column" of the german mechanized battalion (1 bat of the 12 mechanized regiment). Not sure if it was a full batalion or only part of it, not sure if the train was alone of have any support. Train engage a german units when they was preparing for an attack and force them to retreat, but take heavy damage (on of 75mm out of action, fire on the amunition platform) and retreat himself too. -next thay it once more support the cavalry, but from the way it is written i guess it was indirect fire support. It retreat when germans bring "an entire [unit] of heavy artilery" I'm not 100% how to translate the unit size, but from really brief look - battalion-size artilery unit. -between 5 and 10 september it was on patrol duty together with other train, being rerouted sever timed due to railway damage. No mention about any combat here -on 14 it participate in the defense of Zabinki, near Brześć nad Bugiem. It support infantry, repeling the attack of tanks form 10 panzer divizion. -after that, it move east, performing fire support several times. Around 18 of september it get into a Lviv, with two other trains When Lviv surrender on 22 of september, train was abandoned by the crew. It was taken by Russians and called BEPO 75, serving in 75 regiment of 10 NKWD divizjon. On 7 of july 1941 it was taken by Germans, serving under name Pz Zug 10. It participle in the fight around Stalingrad and was probably destroyed there, although it was officially removed from the list of equipment only in june '44.

[@bigwrenchgarage1360]

Very glad I was able to see the Aberdeen tank collection years ago. Was shocking to see them out in the field, but great to see in person. The small arms collection was unbelievable. Missed my chance to get a pic with Dr. Atwater, would've loved one with him wearing the white gloves while holding the Sho-Sho.

[@gregowens6165]

Hey Chieftan. Enjoy your videos. As a Sheridan tanker in the 82nd ABN, we had tables for indirect fire using the 152mm gun on the Sheridan. No HE. Just used HEAT.

[@ScottKenny1978]

Interesting. I mean, it's not like the 152mm HEAT is a small boom, so it makes some sense. But the idea of lobbing a 152mm seems odd...

[@chigichigrizund5311]

Thank you, Chieftain.

[@jamesharding3459]

4:02 My word, this sounds far more fun than company golf.

[@JessWLStuart]

Howdy Chieftain! Would you consider giving us a tour of the items on your book case?

[@carsontodd2443]

I recall when I was in OSUT at Benning, there was fenced off area near where we were on sand hill that had old and rusted out tanks. Sadly I never got a chance to get a closer look, probably never will sadly.

[@dmorgs4]

The “hello” at the start of a radio call is to allow a delay in getting to the meaningful bit of the message and allow the transmission to break squelch, particularly important with older analogue encryption but just as useful in preventing retransmission and all that entails. As explained to me by my pommy radio instructor on squadron exchange in merry England

[@ES90344]

The Guard here in VT has a nice little museum I'd recommend if you ever make it up here. They have a couple interesting vehicles on display, and a couple brdm-2 variants behind a fence.

[@ThroneOfBhaal]

11:48 That camo pattern actually looks really good! Going to have to model that now. :O

[@ericgrace9995]

I'm not sure whether or not this counts but one of the two times that Americans engaged Tigers in the French campaign was when an American armoured car recon unit surprised a train being loaded with Tigers that were being shipped back to Germany for repair. The dismounted crews tried desperately to remount but we're driven off by concentrated MG and 37 mm fire. The Americans were able to disable the train and capture it's cargo of Tigers. So armoured cars took on a train...loaded with tanks.!

[@KevinSmith-ys3mh]

Something seems odd about that story. I assume it was an American combat sector in the line of advance where this occurred, the Tigers are damaged such that they required rear area depot repairs, yet no previous US forces engagements are reported? How weird! Did the train just stop for lunch and tea on the way from loading up in the UK forces sector after combat recovery? An outbreak of very bad driving into ravines or rivers? Lucky hits by air attacks? 🤔😉

[@1ytcommenter]

I would love to see an video by you on the worlds self propelled / tracked artillery pieces.

[@keithplymale2374]

In the background writings by GDW for the game Assault there was discussion of the move to 5 to 4 and why they did not go to 3. I think they referenced US Army manuals and articles in professional magazines in the discussion.

[@TheFirstVonGunther]

There is a tale of an armored train running front line support for the Fins during the Winter War. Machine guns and cannon. I read it in A Frozen Hell by William R. Trotter.

[@bigblue6917]

Thanks vongunther

[@aldenconsolver3428]

The Hussite Wars are an interesting topic, an early attempt to wrestle control from the monarchy. Obviously the horses were a crummy addition to the war wagons but they did not have any thing else. There were some of their engagements where the enemies were only armed with pointy things. Making it possible to use covering fire to protect their 'engines'.

[@MililaniJag]

Is there one website that lists Tanks on display in the USA? Great Q&A as usual!! Cheers!!

[@HanSolo__]

22:35 Poles call it "crawler" in Polish "czołg". The older (Polish) word "tank" to call a tank would still work tho.

[@alltat]

In Swedish it's a "stridsvagn", which translates to battle wagon or chariot. The word "pansarvagn" (armored wagon) is often used by civilians.

[@core3086]

In Norwergian its "Stridsvogn" more or less same as the Swedes. IFV is "stormpanservogn" Storm(as in fast/quick) armoured wagon.

[@brag0001]

In German it's "Panzer", which is essentially the word for a specific type of armor. Funny enough that's also the German word for turtle shells 😉

[@Kumimono]

In Finnish, a bit boring taisteluvaunu, or panssarivaunu. Combat wagon or armored wagon or "panzer wagon", same root word. Taistelupanssarivaunu is also... a long word. :) Panssaritaistelutelaketjuajoneuvo is probably not in use, but, seems grammatically correct, which is the best kind of correct. And of course, panssaritaistelutelaketjuajoneuvohuoltoaliupseerioppilas is the NCO trying to learn the maintenance of armored tracked combat vehicles. I'm being silly here. :)

[@fazole]

@@brag0001 Schildkröte just doesn't sound as cool 😎.

[@saoirseewing4877]

One question: My father the old M41A1 crewman was dumbfounded when he found it was necessary to add an infantry communication set to the rear of an Abrams. What was the thinking behind removing those from American tanks?

[@TheChieftainsHatch]

That radios down to the platoon or even squad level would make it irrelevant.

[@saoirseewing4877]

@@TheChieftainsHatch Thank you much. Although, that does leave me wondering why they then put them back during a TUSK. Is this the Army's answer to "Missiles have made guns obsolete"?

[@rapter229]

@@saoirseewing4877 sounds about right. An idea that in theory could be true, but in practice, you find keeping the old solution around solves more problems than it causes. Why clog radio lines and take the time to get the right radioman with the right channel, when you can just pick up the phone. Communication is faster, the problem that necessitates the call gets solved faster, lives (At least friendly lives) get saved.

[@THX11458]

One of the biggest inconstancy of data about famous tank that I've seen is the thickness of the Tiger's gun mantlet. It's often stated as 100mm in both German and Allied document (although a few German sources state 120mm). As far as I know, it wasn't until Jentz and Doyle actually measured various Tiger's mantlet thickness in the 1990's that it was discovered that it ranged from 90mm (edges) to as much as 145mm (reinforced sections) with an average thickness of about 135mm. For a detailed graphic, Bird & Livingston have a nice diagram of the Tiger's mantlet in their book "World War II Ballistics: Armor & Gunnery in their chapter "Special Cast Areas" page-33.

[@kriztov265]

Having been lucky to have enjoyed Guinness in several different countries , I can attest that the best ive ever sampled was in Ireland . Here in Australia the tinned product from Ireland is as close as you can get unless its on tap and its fresh. Even in Ireland unless your drinking it in a pub where its turned over regularly you can get a bad pint. The staff at the factory in Dublin told us if it doesnt taste right complain !! Stout or porter in general is an acquired taste which makes it hard to get it on tap in most small pubs. Best pint I had outside of Ireland was in an irish pub in New Orleans called Boondock Saints. Worst was in a pub in Tokyo ..... didnt even finish it and went back to local beers which are awesome.

[@xXxTripleHxXx]

You could use the Comet chassi to mount an occilating turret together with a bigger gun as an interim sollution preferably together with the 100mm gun already suggested by the Chief

[@Jonesec1]

I appreciate the AAVp7 center front i spent 20 years maintaining them and came from wicklow so we have that in common.

[@colbeausabre8842]

1) APC VS IFV - OK, I was commissioned in 74, so I do remember pre-Bradley doctrine. Simply, the M113 and its predecessors were battle taxis. In the attack, they would stop in the last covered and concealed position to drop off the infantry, then move to hull defilade position and support the attack by firing their 50 calibers. In the defense, the grunts dug their fighting positions and the carriers moved back to overwatch positions in support. The one thing they were NOT supposed to do was fight from the vehicle, When the South Vietnamese did so when they got APC's in the early Sixties, their US advisors tried to break them of their nasty habit. 2) Camouflage - Here is a reference that includes camo'ed M4's from every theater in WW2. Medium Tank M4 Sherman - Tank Encyclopedia (tanks-encyclopedia.com) Of course, that begs the question what references are these illustrations based on. The Russians didn't seem to use camo besides a deep green - it was even rare to see a red star on their vehicles. Given their “shove it out the door”, no frills method of production that makes sense. Why waste effort on something that had an average life of just a few days...In the Battle of Berlin, they painted a white tactical markings on their turrets Russian IS-2 advancing through the rubble during the Battle for Berlin [3264x1836] - Imgur 3) “Tank Ace” - Nebulous concept that was invented as propaganda by the Minister of Public Enlightenment (George Orwell didn't make much of a stretch) Herr Doktor Goebbels. The Allies didn't use the term in WW2 and nobody, especially the Israelis - who have had the most opportunity to have those who could claim the title - has used the term since the fall of the Third Reich. A lot of it is invention by wehraboos and wannabees. 4) Indirect fire- Common in Italy in WW2. Why let a perfectly good gun and ammo stand around idl) Empty_75mm_HE_shell_cases_being_collected_from_Sherman_tanks_firing_in_the_indirect_fire_support_role_in_the_Anzio_bridgehead,_Italy,_5_May_1944._NA14606.jpg (800×800) (wikimedia.org) and mmu_get_jpeg.php (504×291) (militarymashup.com) 5) Hussite Wagenberg - I agree about the use of wagons by the Hussites. The wagonberg was a circle of wooden armored wagons chained in a circle like a Boer laager or Wild West wagon train The Wagenberg: How wagons became a medieval weapon of war (medievalists.net) and Josef_Mathauser_-_Bitva_u_Lipan_roku_1434 (1).jpg (1350×849) (nationalinterest.org) They had protection and firepower, but no tactical mobility, so they lacked one of three essential qualities of an AFV. 6) Don't forget the Patton Museum at Ft Knox was stripped of a lot of its equipment. One reason the private foundation for an Armor and Cavalry museum failed was a heck of a lot of us got burned. From 1948 to 1972, we donated funds to build a world class museum and we funded expansion from 1972 to 1992. Then, the heart of the museum is gone! There's a bunch of pissed off people out there.

[@stephend50]

If you're ever in Michigan, Wolverine Brewing in Ann Arbor only produces lagers. We're east of that Fort Custer place

[@PJTakeda]

About tank indirect fire. I've read a book about polish tank commander Bohdan Tymieniecki that was extremely proficient in indirect fire. He fought in 2 Polish Corp in 2 Tank brigade, 6th Tank regiment. Earlier he was a tank commander and tank instructor in the British Army, and there he finished also artillery course. In pre-war Polish army, he was in Horse Artillery. So as you can imagine, he was quite skilled in the artillery field. He was quite good in indirect fire and kind he liked to show this. He often used his whole platoon in this role. As his unit worked mainly as infantry support, he had a lot of opportunities to show off. His first "field" promotion was for extremely effective indirect fire. He could hit target not only with his platoon first salvo but also with each shot in one line on the same height and with the same separation between each other and exploding exactly at the same time. British artillery commanders were impressed ;) He used Sherman III (M4A2)

[@AbleOneOne]

30:05 Actually I think it was the Soviet T-28, just depends what we call "wider than one man", you know, the T-28 was a wide tank, just the driver's position was really narrow, but none the less his seat was centrally located

[@Shaun_Jones]

In that case it would probably be the British MK-3 medium.

[@petesheppard1709]

Nice to see a P-7 front and center! :)

[@prjndigo]

US plats from 5 to 4; at 8:40pm 23rd March 1918 Patton received 10 Renault light tanks. Being the only one to know how to drive the damned things he unloaded all ten then taught 9 others how to run them. He then lead them off to a field and split into two groups to practice maneuvers of a cavalry nature. In the invariable answer of "but why" in the military we get "thats what we always did". Switching to 4 had to do with railcars.

[@dana696danass6]

hussite wagons were usualy used as mobile fortifications. but at kutna hora were used in atacking role

[@vtbmwbiker]

Come to Vermont to see what they have at Camp Johnson. They do a nice job there with what they have, including an M-7 Priest and an early M-1 Abrams. Also Norwich University, the Military College of Vermont and birthplace of ROTC. Oklahoma-- not only Ft Sill, but also the 45th ID museum in OK City and the World War Two Airborne Demonstration Team in Frederick, OK.You can definitely fit out the door of a C-47....

[@breadenthusiast-rr5vr]

35:40 Yup, there are a handful of videos of tank-on-tank engagements in Syria. Mostly dating to the early days of the war, 2012-2014.

[@michalkavula8344]

Lagers for the win 🍺. Although i have to say some local craft beer places do have decent ale one in a while. Also ... where could i find what equipment was usually carried on/in tank ? (Both issued and stolen) Btw. any chance of tank stream with Sofilein ? loved vids you did together.

[@ScottKenny1978]

The equipment I have seen on models has been shovel, axe, occasionally a jack, tow cables/chain, and cleaning rods for the main gun.

[@aliasalias8433]

Very good

[@neuroshrink]

The Fort Sill Artillery Museum is really quite impressive, and Oklahoma is the next State North.

[@polychromia]

I've read Mark Urban's work on the Royal Welch Fusiliers' service in the American Revolution, and on the 95th Rifles in the Napoleonic Wars. If his 5th RTR book is anything like those, I imagine that would be a good read as well.

[@pieguy7157]

Missed opportunity not calling this The EMIEs Strike Back

[@mikemurley8656]

M4s were used in the indirect fire role in Italy according to my late father. I thought there was a photo in the CMH US Army in WWII Series Special Study "Three Battles - Arnaville, Altuzzo, and Schmidt" but I was wrong. I had one I used in my presentation on the battle for 7th ATC staff rides, but those files are lost in the mists of time.

[@mikerifraf183]

I lived in Lawton, which is the town attached to Ft.Sill. The base is a nice place, the town not so much. If you go there keep your eyes open.

[@herveblanche226]

Try a summer shandy. Leinenkugel. They used the 75's on the M4s for indirect fire. The were actually burning the barrels out because of the volume of fire.

[@catlee8064]

"out to you" is used when the convo with the current C/S is finished and they need to speak to a different C/S

[@6038am]

Matilda, i would say had a central driver in the hull.

[@matthiuskoenig3378]

matilda 1 was a 2 man tank so doesn't count and the Matilda II is beat by other vehicles (specifically the A13mk1 which came out about a year before matilda II wich itself is beat by BT-2 and BT-5)

[@Bigma_Industries]

the IS-1 also

[@alexanderhartmann7950]

@@Bigma_Industries and 2,3,4,5,6,7,8

[@TheArklyte]

@@alexanderhartmann7950 5, 8 and 10 are same tank, T-10.

[@TheChieftainsHatch]

@@Bigma_Industries Good call on the IS

[@bogdanvino]

As to tank battles in Donbass at 36:00, there definitely were at least some tank-on-tank engagements, and tank deployment by at least one side was quite prolific across the entire theatre. I can't be very specific off the top of my head, both because I am aware of this mostly by virtue of being from Ukraine rather than deliberately tracking it, and because the sources there are are mostly in Ukrainian, which probably wouldn't be very helpful to most people gathered here. That being said, the battle at Debaltseve is one prominent example of armoured action. Both sides deployed tank formations there, and fighting was quite intense, so you can put two and two together there. For a bit more robust proof, I managed to find one article in English that has an eyewitness account mentioning at least a "small tank battle" m.dw.com/en/ukrainian-forces-withdraw-from-debaltseve/a-18265259 Ukrainian Wikipedia article on this battle has a more detailed account of engagements, if anyone is able to make use of that here

[@Riceball01]

I find that Guiness tastes best when it comes from a tap, it doesn't taste quite as good from a can or bottle, especially from a can. But I was lucky enough to actually have a Guiness in Ireland once, and on St. Patrick's Day no less. This was back when I was in the Corps and my unit got to go to Operation Battle Griffin in Norway and we had a brief layover in Ireland and I had enough time to grab a Guiness at the bar in the airport. It was my first time having a Guiness and I've loved them ever since.

[@jorelo4313]

Yes more knowledge!

[@rrobb9853]

I used to live next to a German chap who went through the whole war driving tanks. To clarify, he served 1939-45 but had (genuinely, though it sounds strange) a year away from the front, in 1943, to complete his university studies. That likely helped him survive. Looking at war memoirs, even fit German tank crew could be rotated back to Germany for training courses, rest, collecting equipment, etc.

[@TheArklyte]

Hmm, would be great to hear what you decided to do with 5 Harry Hopkins, 5 Comets, 5 IS-3, 5 Fireflies and 5 Jagdtigers you've given to Elbonia:D Sorry for writing this before watching the episode, but my guess was to 1)switch Comet's 77mm gun to Shermans and look for upgrade packages, 2)install freed 17 pounders into Comets in Avenger/Challenger style, 3)focus on making better observers from Harry Hopkins or looking into what british developed for Alecto, 4)trying to fix IS-3 and later on try to update it to next heavy tank generation by giving it range finders, upgrading recoil mechanism to eliminate muzzle brake, add barrel fume exhaust, try to add HESH, APDS and HEAT into ammunition variety of D-25TA and finally 5)either remove the guns completly and use them as separate AT pieces in fortifications or ask french for help with updating Jagdtigers by removing majority of armor and updating components so that they'd work good at least from prepared hull down firing positions.

[@Gizmomadug]

An Irishman going to a British counter-insurgency course...

[@Kumimono]

"You'll be playing the op-for part. No reason."

[@anotherianp]

With respect, the UK forces were regarded to be "world leading" in COIN and peacekeeping, thanks to that stroppy, argumentative, corner of Ireland I live in. I'm not entirely sure that half the locals would agree, but then the comments were made about constantly wanting UK troops for UN ops, during the 1990s, so... Might just have been that the US didn't want to do them? ;)

[@KevinSmith-ys3mh]

@@Kumimono Good one! ......Realistic training with convincing locations, sets and destination culture actors can be a huge advantage, like deep immersion language training. Reminds me of San Diego area post 9/11, when our large Mid-Eastern refugee immigrant neighbors found ready-steady jobs at the Navy/Marine pre-employment training facility.

[@KevinSmith-ys3mh]

@@anotherianp Yeah, the Vietnam era was still too fresh in most memories to stomach dealing with another continental mess, until it was an obvious murder-fest, again! Too bad social collective memories only seem last ~ 20 years.

[@MaxwellAerialPhotography]

The irony is lost on no one.

[@smka1719]

In terms of infrantry soldiers on engine deck- in Polish booklet titled "We. Drivers of a tanks" I have found war story about T-34 engine overheating due soldiers which seat on tank engine deck (important note- soldiers use coats as it's wearing). When soldiers changed it's position on tank fron "seating" into "staying", engine overheating problem was eliminated. In terms of bow gunner- Polish army in postwar era used T-34-85 tanks without bow gunner (extra ammo rack instead bow gunner seat). In these tanks bow MG worked as fixed MG. Even in Polish T-34-85M manual from 60ties we have info about 4 crewmembers in T-34-85 tank (driver in hull and rest tankers in turret).

[@chewie_nz]

as a new zealander, can vouch for Guinness not travelling well, having one in Dublin was a revelation!

[@alexanderhartmann7950]

What's wrong with 5 hours of Q&A?

[@georgewong8128]

Have you tried Cost Plus World Market for almond fingers? It;s a specialty retailer that stocks imported goods including food product. It is one of the few places you can get Bird's Custard, Lydell Golden Syrup, Digestive biscuits and Maggie products.

[@AsbestosMuffins]

What you described for the tank museum is basically what the AF did for their museum, 4-5 giant hangers with AC built on publically accessable land, though it does still sit on an Airforce Base, they just sort of fenced out that area. I can see why the army probably never bothered with an armor collection though, they have had too many vehicles to ever fully catalogue and they have less of a need for a reference collection than say the airforce who has a habit of obtaining foreign fighters as well as retaining large piles of their own, but its also sad that with the wide availability of suitable land and old army bases, they never thought to just convert one to a proper collection space and convince a senator or two to get some funds to get the whole thing up and running

[@lordoftheunderpants6075]

Thanks

[@rolf-joachimschroder917]

29:00 you Care about your Tank round if you use depleted Urania. We watched M1 tankers on the desperate search for the spent ammunition with depleted uranium outside the Grafenwoehr training area in the early 80th

[@sae1095hc]

Platoon leaders rode in the back (supposed to at least) of 113s and always dismounted (again, supposed to). My platoon leaders in Bradleys almost never lead the dismounts. The platoon sgt and squad leaders rarely dismounted either. The 12 to 16 ground troops were usually lead by a spare E-5. I always thought that we never had enough ground pounders to do much infantrying. A "company" that can deploy only 40-50 grunts is only big enough to secure the vehicles, at least that's what I thought at the time (late 80s)

[@xxxlonewolf49]

I, personally, enjoy the long videos. While I do enjoy the inserted pictures and such, someone could just listen to this as a pod-cast and get 99.99% of all the information and detail.

[@logicbomb5511]

9:00 "this is a personal career bummer" is why this dude its golden, a national treasure!!! Which state guard are you with these days im joining just to serve under you no shit! TELL ME!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[@Disanthrophobia]

35:40 The Donbas War did see a number of tank clashes, just no large unit fights. It also saw a T-64 get killed by a direct fire 122mm HE round, though its unknown if that was from an SPG or towed gun. Syria has seen few (4 or 5) tank on tank actions. First was a rebel T-72 with a 2 man crew which killed a T-62 and most recent was a government T-72 killing a rebel T-90.