Suburban Chicago's ABANDONED Retail Nightmare: What Went WRONG?

[@ChrisHarden]

See more of what Matteson looks like here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/eIHJgYKcfN9mn9E - In my defense of the pronunciation, I triple check these things before hand. Not only is there several clips available on YT of Chicago TV News anchors pronouncing it as “Madison” but there’s also the Village of Matteson themselves pronouncing their Village as “Madison” in THEIR OWN promotional video!! lol. kzbin.info/www/bejne/pofZdHqGnJiCkLsfeature=shared I’ve talked to a few people personally from the area who have also called it “Madison.” Not saying any of you are wrong, just saying that’s where I got the pronunciation from. Usually going the route that I did along with validation from some ppl in the area is a good way to find out how to pronounce a place. I guess not this time. Illinois Playlist: kzbin.info/aero/PLkAKbwTlGHeKoOBxconpFSyUSO32NKREy Chicago Suburbs Playlist: kzbin.info/aero/PLkAKbwTlGHeILgN75aeaBe0EHvhBHyagP Help me grow my other channels! Chris Harden's Travel Archives: www.youtube.com/@chrishardenarchives Nostalgia Tours Radio: www.youtube.com/@Nostalgiatoursradio ==================================================================== EVERYTHING THAT I USE IN THE FIELD: Main Camera: amzn.to/3iS4vvF Side Cameras: amzn.to/2WuCYIs Media Mod for Camera: amzn.to/3j7CMGF Lav Mic: amzn.to/3lsMkz9 Drone: amzn.to/3ITcKBV SD Cards: amzn.to/3C2co9O Camera Mounts: amzn.to/2UXVR6p Cables Required for Longer Recordings: amzn.to/3BYnr3Q Computer: amzn.to/3787b2j External Hard Drive: amzn.to/3lb23Tf WHAT I USE AT HOME: Computer: amzn.to/3rKIdiN Sound Mixer: amzn.to/3C15Ubx Microphone: amzn.to/2VaCjvo Microphone Accessories: amzn.to/3v7A35Z INTERACTIVE MAP that shows you all of the places that I've made videos on: (Doesn't always work on mobile devices. Will always work on PC.) www.google.com/maps/d/u/2/edit?hl=en&mid=1Lhzf04ocimPu-ROkg4cfXEYEvKMNnlI5&ll=34.29834970801405%2C-91.53765609999999&z=5 SOCIAL MEDIA & CONTACT INFO: Email: [e-mail] On Twitter: twitter.com/Chris_Harden55 On Instagram: instagram.com/c_harden7 On Facebook: facebook.com/ChrisHardenYT DISCLAIMER: Links included in this description might be affiliate links. If you purchase a product or service with the links that I provide I may receive a small commission. There is no additional charge to you. As an Amazon Associate I do earn a small commission on qualifying purchases. As always, thank you for supporting my channel!

[@justdiane5]

Pronounced MATTsen

[@ChicagoBidness]

Great Video, it’s pronounced mat•sn though!

[@lilsuzq32]

I live in the NW Chicago suburbs (CrystalLake)...I've heard it pronounced several ways, most usually MATT-sun or MATT-sn

[@tajgibson8776]

It's called Mattson not Madison.

[@kevinadams9468]

If this is what people are worried about, they should go read a book instead.

[@charleykeenan6171]

I still admire you documenting these Midwestern communities. Without this there would be no reliable way to remember these towns as they were..

[@matthewvaclavik1639]

The problem is a lot of the South Suburbs court businesses with a 10 year TIF. Once that 10 years is up, they’re out of there.

[@africkinamerican]

Shouldn't happen. There needs to be a stable, sensible, simple and business friendly tax policy.

[@kcmaldonado3948]

​@@africkinamericanThe words stable and sensible generally don't apply to Illinois fiscal policies.

[@evilplatypus514]

@@africkinamerican IL democrats will never allow that and the morons keep voting for them. They deserve this.

[@berniemarkley]

When I was in high school and college, in the 70's, Lincoln Mall was the place to go. I'm talking a 60 mile drive north (Watseka) to the nearest mall. Kankakee didn't have theirs, yet. The Sam's Club was the only one for 60+ miles, too! It was a great mall, and our favorite restaurant there was Fuddrucker's, which was across the lot from the Chuck E Cheese. Oh, the good old days.

[@animejanai4657]

Looks like the city and Cook County taxes were too high and forced changes in both residential and business demographics. The Cook County government gets weighed down by huge expenses, so the taxes kept going up and stores had to leave.

[@carlsaganlives4036]

I stopped at that Fuddruckers once when I was in my 30's and got carded for a beer with my burger by some kid who looked about 16, back before the 'we card hard' era - funny the odd, meaningless shit ya remember...

[@Just_a_guy06]

Miss that Fuddruckers. I still see the building all the time when i drive by. Live and work in the area still.

[@daytonafuntim]

Miss the Sam's club and Fuddruckers also. No other chain offers legit 1lb burgers with choose your own toppings.

[@Manwithaplan2021]

Fuddruckers's survived until 2020! Miss that place.

[@craignovy2090]

Absolutely masterfully done. A logical detailed narration and history with old and current maps and even historical aerial views all thoroughly researched. I knew about the disparity between Illinois and Indiana taxes but had no idea between the counties in Illinois. I now know why when driving through Southside Chicagoland there was a sudden change...it was the Wiil-Cook county line! Thank you so much for all your effort here and then matching everything up with an excellent drive through. There is nothing else like this second to none production online.

[@Danny-fs1hk]

I am from this area and your research is very thorough!

[@valm4739]

Thank you for highlighting this. I lived there for over 20 years. I bought two homes there over the years. I am now retired and have moved. I loved this town. I built a new home there. I had my work career to downtown Chicago there. I fell in love and married there. I lost loved there. I gained and lost friends there. A lot of memories. A lot of joy and heartache. When I told co-workers and others that I lived in Matteson it was a badge of prestige. It hurts to see the decline. Thank you for your 😢coverage.

[@harrygoldun5779]

That picture is replicated right across the US. I have watched costless videos from vloggers showcasing various regions, what I had noticed is most towns and cities are dead. The lack of foot traffic in these places. Everything deserted, not even kids playing in parks. Never seen any kids for that matter in any video. Society in the US is sick, the art of getting outside, going to a Cafe, the mall, the main street for shopping seems to have vanished. Contrast that with what happens in my part of the world, Australia. Large towns, small towns, cities all exude life. The shopping mall is the heart of the suburbs, any day of the week and it's busy, other places like hardware stores, electrical furniture all buzzing with patrons. Think.our thought on life is polar opposites to the US. You guys can keep zombieland, I'll stick to life.

[@gwensmith6]

Never ending story America😮

[@ednitsche8188]

Thank you for the information. We are close to retirement, and the over 21k property tax a year we are paying in one of the suburbs of cook county, is screaming at us to get out of Illinois. Due to family and friends we don’t want to move too far. But staying feels like being robbed.

[@joannunemaker6332]

I've been to the Matteson mall years ago. I think in the early 80s. It was loaded with stores then. In the 90s, I went to a Fudrucker's restaurant with co-workers after work a few times. There were many businesses still. I live in Will County, so I really don't get the chance to go to Matteson anymore. I enjoyed this video. 😊❤

[@Elrond_Hubbard1]

My God. I remember taking my family to that infamous Chuck E Cheese. I didn't think we were going to get out alive. My 5 year old daughter was pushed around by a bunch of kids twice her age, and two families started fighting. And the mall towards its end was gang ridden and sketch as hell.

[@robertPharry777]

RIFF RAFF OBAMA TYPES MOVED IN LIKE A PLAGUE AND THIS IS WHAT HAPPENS ALL THE TIME!!

[@Jaydatrucke]

Matteson use to be the place to shop back in the day

[@ricogomez4020]

Then some certain residents moved in and that's where we are now.

[@beevirgil7901]

Matt....son

[@ChrisHarden]

Hmm. The Village of Matteson pronounced it the way that I did in their promotional vid kzbin.info/www/bejne/pofZdHqGnJiCkLs

[@ChrisHarden]

In my defense, when the Village's own KZbin channel pronounces it as "Madison" that's how someone from somewhere else is going to pronounce it. I've seen several clips of Chicago TV news anchors pronouncing it as "Madison" as well. I've spoken to a few Chicago area people about Matteson and I've heard them pronounce it as "Madison." Maybe the Village should sign into their KZbin account, take down their promotional videos and re-upload them with the proper pronunciation if they want people like me, along with news anchors to pronounce it as "Matt-son."

[@m.e.5482]

​@@ChrisHardenbesides just driving by and using sources U did. Go 2 MattSon n ask any1 what they call it. Never in life heard your pronounciation

[@whattheshep6814]

I've spent my entire life in the suburbs (I'm in my 40s now) and I've never heard anyone call it "Madison", it's always "Matt-son". Interesting video from the town though, I bet the voice actor mispronounced it.

[@sjh60633]

Exactly!

[@KillerDoc42]

Matteson was thriving up until the mid 90’s. Once they lost their grocery stores, & started building 500k homes. The taxes just got crazy. What a shame.

[@patkcorcoran]

Great research and reporting Chris

[@nancyoffenhiser4916]

They had a beautiful Borders bookstore at Matteson that I spent a lot of time at when I lived in Bourbonnais and commuted each day to Chicago. I met several different authors there from Oliver North to TD Jakes. What a shame.

[@lorihoop3831]

Better throw the TD Makes book away. False prophet, all over Diddlers party

[@lindabedker9105]

Oh, I miss the good old days! I'm glad I got to enjoy a beautiful life in the 50ies and the 60 and all the history I've lived. ❤️ thanks for the trip!

[@dree55]

I live in Matteson and I think you did a really good job with this video. 👏 Thanks!

[@johnvrabec9747]

Back in the day on the south side and suburbs, you had Lincoln Mall, Evergreen Plaza, Ford City, and River Oaks. Then, Orland Square opened and started siphoning off customers. The strip malls came in force with urban sprawl, changing demographics and then online shopping put the nails in the coffin. I used to shop at all of them. They were all busy, too. The malls killed local business shopping districts like Roseland and uptown Blue Island, etc., and then Wal-Mart and eventually Amazon killed the malls. It's sad, I miss going to the mall, getting Caramel Corn and those huge egg rolls at the Plaza, playing pinball at Lincoln, going to Lafayette Electronics and Orange Julius at Ford City. Walking outside at River Oaks, taking a quick detour to Hegewish Records.

[@BadidaJackson]

Remember Peacock Alley in Ford City?

[@johnvrabec9747]

@@BadidaJackson Yes! Good call!

[@TheOldTapeArchive]

Two things: online retailing, and demographics. All cities & towns die without a reliable tax base of law abiding home owners, which attracts retail tenants. Once the law abiding residents with disposable income flee, it's a race to the bottom. Matteson's trajectory mirrors Harvey and all the others.

[@jasoncarr5379]

Well said sad to say! Race to the bottom

[@Bonzi_Buddy]

@@jasoncarr5379 "Race" to the bottom. I see what you did there. :D

[@ArethaRenee]

Most of those stores went out of business across the region and nation. Red Lobster would have been closing next had it not gotten out of bankruptcy. Amazon and Pete’s Fresh Market pay no taxes.

[@EbolaxMonkey]

That's about the nicest way you could possibly say it. All of us who grew up in the south suburbs know exactly what happened to all of them.

[@johnschultz9023]

Yeah and if you point out the obvious, you're called racist. Same thing happened in the Northridge area of Milwaukee. That was a high end area until the cancer came.

[@chronocross7174]

Awesome! Great Video Chris!!!!

[@BigSlotterToo21]

Great video! Used to go to Lincoln Mall a lot as a kid. It was actually a really good mall up until the late 80's, although after Wieboldt's closed in 1985 it only had 3 anchors vs 4 that the other malls had. Sears did move from the Park Forest mall in 1995 but then the first JCPenney left soon after until they came back later in the early 2000s on the ring road. Lincoln Mall did a renovation around 1991 and upgraded some stores, but then some issues with teenagers started to happen in the mall particularly on weekend nights that made the mall feel unsafe. Then when River Oaks in Calumet City was renovated/expanded in 1994 that actually pulled a lot of business from Lincoln Mall despite the area around Matteson having higher incomes. That started the slow death spiral here, combined with ever increasing taxes that just kept any new investments from coming into Matteson. Now the retail investment all went to Tinley Park/Orland Park and even Homewood so it just leaves nothing left for Matteson, with really no solution for it.

[@k.chriscaldwell4141]

I studied community blight- towns, cities, etc. “Sticky” and/or rising property taxes in an area experiencing economic decline are the number one reasons for a area falling in to blight. The “sticky and/or rising property taxes in such an environment are due to the prevalence of legacy corruption. ALWAYS. The main focuses of my study were Harvey, IL, Gary, IN, and Detroit, MI.

[@guywatchingmovies]

Lincoln Mall and that area use to be one of the main place to go to shop. It's really a shame what happened to that area. I hope someday it can be more like it was in the 80s and 90s. With that said this was an awesome video! I enjoyed the history you included.

[@ybmomo]

thank you for showing the current situation in and around Chicago.

[@heatherframpton9693]

Aww, ☹️☹️☹️☹️☹️☹️☹️☹️ Growing up in Steger, IL 1970's & Peotone, IL, 1980's, Lincoln Mall, & across the way. Venture, Payless Shoe Source & Marshall's were our favorite places to shop. ❤️

[@doneown503]

, great job , Chris ! you come across so well in your videos !👍👍

[@FrankHouston-v5e]

Hella high tax burden check, overpriced housing check, white flight check 😱. Sounds like a future Ford Heights or Dolton 🧐. Great video 🔥

[@robertanderson5334]

It has nothing to do with online retail or high taxes. The Walmart in Homewood just east of Matteson had to close because of so many shoplifters. 8:50

[@toomanybears_]

Shhhh, you're not supposed to tell the truth. They left because the store wasn't "meeting financial expectations".

[@Rmbrown1964]

Yeah because of theft

[@American-Motors-Corporation]

Well yes it definitely doesn't have anything to do with online retail that's very true. However, it doesn't need to have everything to do with taxes. The reason America had shopping malls coming out of the walls since basically the late 1950s and definitely through the decade of the '60s beyond was simply because it was a tax shelter for rich people it's where they would invest their money and avoid certain taxes while making more money. A lot of what accounts for the demise of the American mall is simply municipalities came in and taxed the shit out of them to where it was no longer a viable tax shelter so these people pulled out and they sold it to big time investment firms who are only interested in the land. Yes shopping habits did technically change but that is a combination of an income deficiency across the population that has forced people to go to cheaper stores while at the same time there was the realization that everything that you would go get at a mall you could go get it Walmart or Target at a much cheaper price realizing that it's the same Chinese made shit. but then of course you have the story about the stores that commonly would occupy them all particularly the anchor store companies well their problem is largely they drove their companies into a ditch because they got saturated with debt they took on stupid amounts of debt and ran the company straight into the ground. And of course that income deficiency across the population means that the customer base no longer supports their bills. So that is basically the problems that have contributed to the killing of the malls.

[@American-Motors-Corporation]

In conjunction with the previous comment... No I did not purposely leave out theft however I can tell you as a former retail manager with over 23 years business and management experience, Yes theft is high however before the Walmart CEO got on TV and started bitching pissing and moaning about theft and attempting to blame every problem they have on theft none of you talked about theft a few people that worked in retail probably discussed theft but you never really saw it and comment sections certainly not as heavily as you see it today. So I know firsthand except is detrimental to the retail trade, over 23 years in retail management I definitely know that however I can also say that the retail industry has allowed that problem to fester because it was the policy of most companies four and five years ago to not call the police like the manager on duty could get in trouble if they called the police for reporting theft it was commonly told to staff that they don't want to bother the police that they'll just go ahead and take the hit. That was the mentality as long as the money was flowing you see The reason that they're hollering about it so much now is the same reason that they bitched pissed and moaned about the internet last decade trying to convince people to blame the internet. Theft is detrimental but I can assure you that is not the reason why a lot of these places are closing see my other comment for other answers but the one that I will provide in this one that also figures into the situation is you have the entire industry in retraction. It is the thinning of the herd because the customer base is going broke so that income deficiency that I had mentioned in a previous comment is the real reason that they're closing locations yeah theft is a contributing factor but it is not the sole reason they're just telling you that because well it makes some logical sense right? These CEOs feel that they have some political or public duty to explain away everything to you and a manner in which you can swallow they are politically active in fact they're political pals known as politicians also pull the same stupid shit. They don't want you to know that you Johnny q public can no longer support all of these locations and they yet know that you want to know why all of these locations are disappearing they're not going to tell you the truth in business terms which is simply it's a thinning of the herd because there's an income deficiency across the population Yes some areas are worse than others for theft so yes that can happen but it is certainly not every single location I would say it's probably more like 00.5% of all locations that would be closed for theft alone 99 plus percent are closed simply because profits are down in that area because the population of that area is going broke Yes there's probably theft that happens at that store but it is not the sole reason it is not even the major reason it's simply an unprofitable location. For some companies there's a corporate spacing problem you know back when they were expanding they would build one location on top of another subway restaurants are famous for this That's actually why a lot of those are closing they're in too close to proximity of another location neither of them can really make it sometimes they're actually owned by the same franchise owner they decide to thin the herd to maximize the profits of the remaining locations Big chain stores do the same. So even though there is a grain of truth to the theft issue I can also say that the theft levels across the board are basically the same that they were seven years ago and yet you didn't see all this shit being talked about everywhere so there's actually more going on behind the scenes than just theft but they're using theft is a means to explain it away to Johnny q public.

[@REDDOGG24]

Yea it was theft. My Bro in law lives on Joe Orr directly across from Marion High School. I’ve seen swat at that store and the food for less across the street. I personally witnessed an armed car jacking at the shell gas station on the corner on Lincoln hwy and western. I’d go to that Walmart every now and again. That Walmart wasn’t even in operation for more than 7 years that was damn near a brand new Walmart that closed down. Gotta love thieves and criminals!!!

[@TheMidwestWaterproofing]

Most south suburban homeowners just got wacked AGAIN on property taxes. The average increase is going to be upwards of 27%.

[@thorpower1015]

@@TheMidwestWaterproofing ohh yeah Im just under 11k a year in oak Forest il

[@rayratajczak]

Whoa! Not even close, Richton Park got hit with 52.5% My home got reassessed from 98k to 160k, property tax went up from 3548 t0 5407.

[@seanjones21]

Mine was a 60% increase in Oak Forest It's in appeal lol

[@rayratajczak]

@@seanjones21 I tried appealing my assessment, they gave me a quick "No" They had these so called community meetings where these Democrat politicians who were responsible for the tax increase kept repeating the same BS at each meeting, telling ppl they can appeal ( most get turned down ) or that its the villages fault for not keeping better records. MF'ers lost my vote forever.

[@africkinamerican]

They're trying to squeeze blood out of turnips

[@Brandon714_]

I live in Matteson. They just voted to become a Home Rule community 2 years ago. So, things are slowly starting to make a comeback. In fact, they're currently building a Chick-fil-A, which is a very popular restaurant. Which means we won't have to travel to Homewood or Tinley Park.

[@JoeBlow-fp5ng]

lol Fried chicken will save them.

[@gwensmith6]

Hilarious😅

[@megacide84]

I and a buddy of mine used to frequently visit the south suburbs in the early 2000s. Matheson, Homewood, and Olympia Fields, were beautiful bustling places. I remember Lincoln Mall during the heyday of the PS2, GameCube, and OG Xbox era. How I truly miss those times.

[@williamlegge2167]

Great job, very well done and very informative.

[@lloyddavies5587]

I remember this mall... Came here once or twice when visiting friends I had near Sauk Village. I think there was a nice buffet restaurant there in that old shopping center back in the mid to late 90s....

[@stevenpiehl6199]

Chris so very much enjoy your Vlogs you bring insight facts and statistics which I really enjoy others don’t do this well also appreciate you dry sense of humor seems that you’re in Illinois quite a bit I unfortunately live in Illinois due to the tax situation I’ll probably be moving out of the state soon it’s gotten ridiculous Keep up the interesting work thank you

[@sergioleone4215]

I got out of the military in 1976 and used to go to Lincoln Mall occasionally. Across Lincoln Highway on the north side of the mall was a stereo component store called Pacific Stereo if my memory is correct. I bought a pair of Bose 501 speakers there along with a couple other items. Still have the Bose speakers and use them in my bedroom.

[@BrianDuffie]

Bought my Pioneer stereo at Pacific Stereo in Matteson.

[@abby57254]

Dixe Square was the first in Harvey. The Blue Brother was made there.

[@ChrisHarden]

Good catch

[@AEMoreira81]

That mall was already closed forever when Blues Brothers was filmed there.

[@je_suis_le_vent]

Matteson is basically the middle of nowhere. Shopping malls are all hurting, but those in areas that haven't got a strong local economy have an ice cube's chance in hell of surviving.

[@ChrisHarden]

It’s pretty far out

[@TheJustineCredible]

Really sad to see it decline the way it has. I remember my hometown started looking like this before they started re-investing in new businesses and construction. For decades we had one single-story mall that sat vacant for years before they demolished it, but because of stupid zoning laws the plot sat as a pile of rubble for decades all while they had built a newer two-story mall on the opposite end of town. That mall started to decline and the town realized they needed to rezone areas to attract more businesses and to build housing. My hometown has seen massive growth spurts over recent decades. (My home town: St. Charles, IL - Far Western Kane County)

[@africkinamerican]

There aren't effective incentives in place to force Developers to clean up after themselves. Among other problems.

[@AlexanderWaylon]

I know online shopping caught department stores off guard and by the time they realized it was too late. Also however, I’m an earlier millennial that remembers a time when going to the mall areas was an exciting event that usually took better portion of that day. I guess sometimes I look around and I’m still surprised all the malls are disappearing.

[@Bonzi_Buddy]

In urban areas they have an urban problem with inside malls. "Unemployed behavior" is common.

[@American-Motors-Corporation]

Now it did not simply because 99% of those retailers are the internet and have been the internet for like 28 years okay they've all had a website with the capability of shipping directly to you and or you would pick it up in the store just like the old catalogs okay nothing's changed the only thing to changed was the technology you use to place your order so blaming the internet doesn't work. Internet retail sales only make up 8 to 10% of all retail sales that didn't given time meaning 90 plus percent still actually happen in the brick and mortar environment of course you're wondering well then what's the downturn? Very simply put that is a two-prong problem and the first prong of this would be that and all of these retailers have taken on stupid amounts of debt they've driven their company into a ditch followed by the second prong of this which is simply their customer base is going broke there's an income deficiency across the population that gets worse year-over-year. there is technically a third prong in terms of shopping habit changes and there again it's not the internet it's simply Walmart and Target carry anything and everything that you can buy in them all it by the way a much cheaper price there's no sense in going down to Sears Penny's Macy's and Kohl's because you're going to overpay for the same Chinese made shit The customers in some cases have realized this and once they did it was over but that income deficiency problem that I had mentioned has also forced the customers into shopping at the cheaper stores. So now this concept that the internet hurt brick and mortar is stupid it's a bullshit excuse given to you by bad management also politicians that would like to explain away or attempt to explain away why commerce is disappearing they don't want to talk about the income deficiency across the population they also because these companies are run by bad management they don't want to talk about the big amounts of debt that they have taken on that has screwed them. So blaming the internet is frankly for stupid people!

[@American-Motors-Corporation]

In conjunction with the previous comment I can say one of the biggest reasons that malls specifically are disappearing and basically have been for a couple and a half decades is simply because they were a tax shelter it was a place for rich people to invest make more money while avoiding certain amounts of taxes well over time municipalities have picked up on that and so they increase the taxes and through the years it made it less and less of a tax shelter until those investors sold out to bigger firms so you have a lot of capital investment companies that come along and buy these malls up and if you ever notice they don't do much to those malls after they buy them and the reason being is because they're just there to gobble up the property they just want the land they'll let them all exist providing it still has some stores and it's able to make a certain amount of money but once it drops below a certain threshold they will close up shop and then they will attempt to sell the land or they will demolish the building and attempt to sell the land or they may think of something else to build a lot of them are being replaced by storage units especially as the income deficiency across the population worsens people need storage units. So now it had nothing to do with the internet that is a bullshit excuse from way back.

[@africkinamerican]

You sound like you have a lot of knowledge in this area, maybe you could work with guys like this creator for future videos ​@@American-Motors-Corporation

[@BobG127]

Good for you for getting the pronunciation of Matteson right. The reason is that the town was named after an early Illinois governor, Joel Matteson, who pronounced his name with three syllables -- not two (with a silent "e"). The "e" gets pronounced, so it sounds like "Madison," not "Mattson."

[@kamala2111]

Rough crowd starting taking over Lincoln Mall little by little and customers left in droves

[@JimSpurlock]

😂😂😂ur lying 🤥🤥🤥🤥😅

[@jondoes7836]

Unrealistically high Cook County property taxes have stifled growth in these south suburbs.

[@kristoffMR]

they run everybody out! property taxes should be abolished!

[@midwestcampingfamily]

Yeah, that's it. Meanwhile western and Northern suburbs pay just as high if not higher taxes but still thrive.

[@jondoes7836]

Please explain how you can have a house in an impoverished south suburb worth &100k with a $7000 per year tax assessment? Justify your response.

[@midwestcampingfamily]

@@jondoes7836 Matteson is in no way impoverished. In fact their median household income was $92,236 in 2021 which is above average for our country.

[@jondoes7836]

@@midwestcampingfamily I never said Matteson was impoverished. I'm talking about south suburbs like Markham with unrealistic property tax rates on homes & commercial properties.

[@DreaB]

Great video and overview of Matt'eh'son. My family moved to Matteson in 1988, I was 8yo, and it was beautiful and thriving with quality education, shopping and amenities during my upbringing. Today, still in the area, we have to drive 25+ min to quality and substantial shopping. Once Dominic's grocery store left, everything else started going downhill. They have since brought us a Pete's grocery store, expensive, but it's the quality produce for me. Matteson has also just broken ground for a Chic Fil A, (yay to a popular food establishment), but again, more restaurants, as Matteson has plenty of. The casino would have helped with a boost, but without any real retail upgrades, I don't see Matteson making a comeback, and especially not with these new property taxes. This area is likely headed into a "ghost town".

[@RonSparr]

This happened all over America all the malls are closing up people shop online

[@seanjones21]

I lived in Tinley when they built that Brookside Marketplace you referenced They built it 100% to serve the southwestern Cook residents trying to avoid the Cook County sales taxes It worked exactly as planned, but Tinley residents still pay sky high property taxes lol

[@Cre80s]

The reason you'll find signs left when a business building is totally absent is because they have a value all their own. It's a legal and administrative pain in the ass to get permission to erect one, but once you get it, it can transfer ownership indefinitely, and is incentive for future buyers to buy the property when all they have to do is fill it with their new logos. In short, it's throwing money away to tear it down along with a useless building. Now, that's not suggesting it makes sense to leave the old logos up on the sign, but covering/altering them is another expense/bother and risks damaging a sign when "the next guy" can just do it.

[@toomanybears_]

This area isn't ever going to be rebuilt except maybe as a made-to-order Section 8 slum.

[@garyb6219]

Part of the construction fees should guarantee a demolition.

[@tktkoftk1354]

19:23 I did a restoration on that barbershop it’s one of the oldest barbershops in Illinois. I even painted the gold sign on the wall that tells how old it is. Across the street is The Hidden Mana Cafe it’s a hidden gem in our neighborhood

[@waycool1969]

My first house I bought was next door in Park Forest. I was able to get a microwave, dishwasher , washing machine and dryer paint and curtains all at once from Sears in 2001

[@andyanderson3628]

It's similar everywhere. The suburbs of Toronto are littered with dead malls. The pandemic was the beginning of it when people switched to online ordering.

[@popularopinionpod]

I live in the area and the funny thing is that as much as I'm in that shopping center area around the abandoned Lincoln Mall I completely forgot that JC Penny is still back there 🥴

[@williamlloyd3769]

Lincoln Mall = new Chicago Bears stadium? PS - brick-and-mortar stores all over the USA couldn't compete with internet shopping at home.

[@dangabor8585]

Amazon made people lazy.

[@robertreilly4946]

Matteson (rhymes with the capital of Wisconsin) used to drink deep from sales tax money, as well as pre-TIF property taxes. All of those vacant stores used to thrive. So did the Rich Twp. high schools, which paid teachers very well and build first-class facilities. The downfall came with white flight to ... the Frankfort area (for those who could) and Indiana (for those who couldn't). Now the local governments have gigantic pension obligations, decaying commercial hulks and a collapsed tax base.

[@Neozio]

we had so many good stores Pharmor, service merchandise, f&m distributors, Dominick's grocery store, Cub foods then turn into ultra foods, Toys r Us pep boys Best buy, circuit City a little bit everything.

[@beaniemac]

My ex wife is from Matteson. It's pretty nice. But the property taxes are OUTRAGEOUS for not having the greatest schools. This is a problem that plagues the Chicago south suburbs

[@doktortutankamazon31]

I lived in Matteson 1999-2002 and it was a hellhole. I am not at all surprised it continued. Plenty of other retail locations in the area. Online purchasing is a major cause.

[@TheMidwestWaterproofing]

You put a lot of work into this. Nice job.

[@EdwardClinton]

Great video based on exhaustive research. Good camera work.

[@MikeyLikesIt89]

I want to dispel this misinformation that has become ubiquitous with cook county. Cook county as its own entity does not tax the hell out of property owners, my actual cook county taxes were $56.47 this year so I would know. I’m sick of everyone blaming the county when it is actually the school boards who are taxing the hell out of every property owner. The two school districts I live in each got me for over $2,500 this year. Even my village doesn’t get that. What has happened in the suburbs is the reckoning of the Ponzi scheme that are America’s suburbs. During their creation (including the schools) they take out all sorts of bonds and loans to finance the construction of the village and it’s infrastructure and then years down the line just before the infrastructure begins to fail, the wealthiest residents begin to move on to the next new village, less affluent people purchase the homes and the downward spiral continues until the town is inhabited by people who are just making enough to live alright and those people are stuck footing the bill for failing infrastructure through their property taxes. If you mix with a state that is almost last in school funding then you get high a property taxes paying for schools that have aged beyond their useful life because the labs and equipment are obsolete by this point. Now you are stuck with the stereotypes that the media loves to show.

[@nancynelson5411]

Crook County. And I live in Illinois.

[@garyb6219]

@@nancynelson5411 The most corrupt county in the most corrupt state.

[@lesliea7394]

IL relies on property taxes to fund schools. This problem is exacerbated by the fact that every local school board is populated by the parents of children in school. They are not professionals. Where I live in Lake County, the school boards have been very irresponsible. Springfield needs to change this. IL needs to stop soaking property tax owners for schools and school districts need to be consolidated in each county. IL is a failing state because of the property tax inequities.

[@troyv8302]

The most important elections are local and school boards. These are also the elections nobody takes interest in. The same people get elected year after year and make their own fiefdom and next thing you know, the towns or villages they control decline but their personal wealth goes up. These little villages could teach Chicago a thing or two about corruption. Just look at all the local mayors and trustee's or alder people and look how long they have been in power and then look at how taxes have increased since they took power and how local services along with the neighborhood in general declines. I live in Bridgeview and it's out of control with the same people running things for decades leading to deficits that would make a small nation blush with embarrassment. How these people are not all doing time for corruption and theft is beyond me.

[@mikemiller659]

its been my experiences that stereo typs ARe based on facts

[@Doltonboy15500]

These South suburbs are hopeless. Nothing will ever revive them. They will continue to spiral downwards

[@Manwithaplan2021]

I mean Flossmoor and Homewood are still quite nice and have good downtowns.

[@seanjones21]

@@Doltonboy15500 not true. We just need property tax reform and state funded schools instead of this archaic scam of a system we're working in It might be time to revive that county split idea and make Chicago its own county to save the burbs from the grifters and charlatans

[@PaintballVideosNet]

Let nature do its thing.

[@BadidaJackson]

@@seanjones21you nailed it.

[@africkinamerican]

They ain't what they used to be either, but they're the best in the South burbs. Go Vikings!❤

[@billsander364]

Dixie Square Mall in Harvey opened in 1966 as the first enclosed mall in the south suburbs.

[@jaysmith5175]

watching all these videos about chicago and really anywhere in the us overwhelms me with a feeling of dread, wow im so glad i moved to the new economic and geopolitical capital of the u.s. las vegas

[@derperderp9036]

The McDonald's in Lincoln Mall was trippy.

[@Bigirondoug]

I lived in this area since to 70's, Chicago Hts and Matteson were the place to be back then but lets not sugar coat it, when the black community started moving in the crime rate started going up and people stopped shopping there. Kind of like what's happening to Orland Park mall now in the '24.

[@2006gtobob]

I haven't been to Orland Park Mall in about 10 years, and the dents in the armor were showing back then.

[@jondoes7836]

Lincoln Mall - ruined. Ford City - ruined. Evergreen Plaza - ruined Chicago Ridge Mall - ruined North Riverside - ruined All ruined because of a specific demographic.

[@Starbeoghtuser3475]

@@jondoes7836🎻🎻🎻

[@JimSpurlock]

😂😂😂😂 and you didn't break any law they put black people in jail for smoking pot for 20years and trump tried to overthrow the USA government and isn't in jail yet 😂😂😂😂 and Chicago heights had nothi

[@JimSpurlock]

​@@2006gtobobbecause you are too lazy to leave your house 😂😂😂😂😂

[@MacktheKnife-r1g]

I do all of my shopping on Amazon, even my groceries. But I admit to really missing big box stores like Barnes & Noble and Blockbuster. Browsing for books and movies online isn't as enjoyable as doing it in person.

[@Paramount531]

Back in late 2020, we decided to get out of CA for lots of reasons. One reason was the fear of the loss of Prop. 13 property tax protection on our residence, purchased in 1996 for $180,000. We sold that house for $1.25 million, the new buyers get a property tax bill of $16,000 per year, which was more than our mortgage, insurance and taxes. So, we started talking about where to go, and for a very short time, maybe 10 minutes, we considered moving to Carol Stream, IL where we had some family. The real estate prices were pretty good, then we looked at the taxes. We now live in the greater Boise, ID area where the taxes are pretty reasonable.

[@OldSchoolJules]

It’s so nostalgic looking at you drive down Lincoln highway. I shopped in Matteson all the time back in the day. I bought my house in Indiana 8 years ago and I’d NEVER return to Illinois.

[@supercinos8924]

Really good video, but I believe because Tinley Park, Orland Park, and Homewood are all right there, part of why Matteson retail declined could be attributed to comparable but more profitable retail in those places, but otherwise, yeah with a lot of similar places in both Indiana and Illinois such as Merrillville, Joliet, Tinley Park, Orland Park, and Homewood all having similar but more profitable retail off of the junctions of their respective state highways and interstates, and offering either better locations for highest and besy use or tax incentives, it is safe to say thay those places do offer better amenities and utility than Matteson, but it would be cool if Matteson made a come back with something like an outdoor mall, but with many comparable locations and the factors I stated, easier said than done.

[@Decoy0527]

Matteson will make a comeback someday, but it's likely to be at least a decade down the road. Property taxes on residential are just too high and school district scores are mediocre, at best. It will take some really good governance to turn it around.

[@lopinotshay3972]

A new children's museum is under development on the former Lincoln Mall site.

[@jimkinner]

These large former retail tracts offer an unprecedented opportunity. A huge plot of land in a populated area, almost always close to an interstate, with infrastructure (water, sewer , electric ) . The land generally isn't contaminated like brownfield sites. Ideal for a new stadium, medical campus, or university.

[@GlennSelan]

The demolished mall is a good place for a solar farm , so they don't take up valuable farm land ?

[@naotosenpai2789]

That 2nd target you mentioned was that really an old target? I remember it being like an electronic store once you mentioned it's next to the Menards and pip boys

[@donjonbovi3840]

Growing up in Illinois I always heard Matteson pronounced MattSon.

[@sophiekrichardson]

It's pronounced Matt-e-son sort of like Madison but if you weren't from the area you had to call it Mattson or it would confuse people with the Wisconsin city. You eventually had to adjust.

[@donjonbovi3840]

@@sophiekrichardson I literally lived in that area for 25 years of my life and no one ever said Matt-e-son, they all said MattSon.

[@sophiekrichardson]

@@donjonbovi3840 and so did I.

[@donjonbovi3840]

@@sophiekrichardson So you realize it’s pronounced MattSon by the residents and everyone in surrounding towns.

[@Viaductvienotachicken]

I lived there in the late 70's and called it Matt son.

[@geneard639]

We moved to Richton Park in 1973, I was 10. Lincoln Mall had just opened, they had these giant mobiles suspended by Jay Calder. To me, it was huge and magical. Aladdin's Magic Castle was a magnet for me. In the 1970s it was mostly Pin Ball Games and a Kart Track in the back with a few coin operated Foosball games and pool tables. I remember the first true computerized game consoles going in there. Back then Malls didn't have food courts or Multi-Screen Theaters, or even just plain single screen theaters... but eventually a Multiplex Cinema was built to the south west across the ring road from the Montgomery Ward wing. It had 3 book stores, a Swensen's Ice Cream Parlor, a HUGE Singer and small White/Bernina store. My mom pretty much would walk into the Singer store, it had machines, patterns, fabrics and notions, and she would spend the afternoon in there. Usually she gave me a few dollars to go buy a book and play some video games. Its one of the few places of 'happy' moments during that part of my life.

[@fuzzybutkus8970]

The Opposite used to be Oak Brook. Used serve beer and wine at the McDonalds home store.

[@Starbeoghtuser3475]

Is Oakbrook mall still there?

[@pulidobl]

@@Starbeoghtuser3475Yes. Thriving…

[@rcusa4863]

👍Chris Harden really does his homework. Not only does Chris know the property tax issues, he knows the difference between downtown Matteson and Lincoln Mall part of Matteson. Chris even drove through the closed Target parking lot, and Chris knew it was Target even though no signage exists there anymore. The reason I mention that closed Target parking lot is because that is where both my wife and I park our vehicle, dismount our bicycles, and bike the eastern part of the Old Plank Trail that connects with Sauk Trail Woods--which is the main reason why my wife and I bike ride through Matteson. How did Chris know that Old Plank Trail existed in Matteson when there is absolutely no signage, and how did Chris know it connects with Sauk Trail Woods? That level of detailed research is what separates Chris Harden from other road-trip videographers. Chris Harden just operates at a higher level.

[@vs.2463]

I live here, thanks for stopping by!

[@marykrueger6039]

Very interesting video. Yeah the dying of retail America. With all the online shopping and all the shoplifters. Stores just cant go on.

[@kimkruger5913]

I am a former "region rat" as they called us back in the day. I have been to this city not recently but while Mall was still around and it was not all empty businesses. We went back and forth on how to pronounce it! You did a great job here. I remember when all the people were fleeing Illinois to Indiana because of the taxes and cost of living. Merrillville grew up so to speak because of all the flight from high taxes. Even where I am from originally Valparaiso In saw a massive growth back in the day. Heck the whole County (Porter) in Indiana just blew up from Illinois people escaping high taxes and prices. Until they get things figured out people even on a decent income don't want to pay 7k taxes on a average house in Matteson Illinois. I landed a few years ago on east side of Indiana so much more peaceful and much like NW IN was a few decades ago before all the growth. Ever go thru Chesterton Indiana on HWY 49 thats where the old family farm used to be! State bought for the road then everything became businesses. Bless her heart my GrGramma was a pioneer back in the early 1900's on till she passed at 99.

[@jamesbarca7229]

As a Porter County resident who lives outside of Valpo, I am absolutely sick of people moving here from the People's Republic of Illinois then complaining about the way things are done here and voting to make it more like the hell hole they turned their home state into and fled from. They are quite literally like locusts. If they don't like the way things are done around here, I wish they would move back to Illinois instead of trying to turn our home into the same kind of s-hole they came from.

[@tomculbertson5569]

I remember going to this mall often as a kid with my mom. I remember watching a Whitney Houston video while my mom was in a fabric store. They had a popcorn shop named Karmelcorn or something along that line. Amazing popcorn. The nacho cheese was so good I still long for it all these yrs later. I got approved for my first credit card at Sears. Bought a bunch of tools with the credit. I remember seeing this beautiful girl working at one of the stores. We lived in Hazel Crest and would and would go to the mall for fun. Good memories. Sad it is no more and watching our country slowly fade away like this once vibrant mall did.

[@EASJR1991]

It’s weird how Matteson has lost a lot of retail, most notably the Lincoln Mall, but the houses are very nice. Matteson is becoming a bedroom community.

[@ChrisHarden]

It is weird. It's a nice looking community away from that retail area.

[@thefluffyklan]

You misspelled "ghetto". You're welcome.

[@American-Motors-Corporation]

Well that's the cycle of retail. Before retail came in and did their developments a lot of these areas really were open fields but then you have the situation specifically to malls that malls became a tax shelter it became a place for rich people to hide their money this is why America had shopping malls coming out of the walls we had more malls in America than we ever needed but the reason was because they're again rich people built the damn things as it means of hiding their money but when local municipalities raise tax rates beyond the point of it being a tax shelter then they pulled out that accounts for the demise of most smalls first they fall into a state of disrepair and a lot of cases they were already charging stupid amounts of money for rent but in a lot of cases they will increase that that forces a lot of stores out you have external problems that is actually related to the businesses within the mall but is not directly the company that owns them all such as like most of your major retailers taking on mass amounts of debt and running their companies into a ditch while at the same time you've had the rise of the income deficiency across the population it's not the internet to blame That's for stupid people to believe. So what you have is a lot of cities and towns that life after retail is they don't know what else to do with it business is becoming less and less viable simply because of it didn't come deficiency across the population so if anything they demolish it restore the land and talk about how it's a fuckin park. It sizes ad or they turn the complex into storage units.

[@BobMckinsey-w7e]

Minnesota has a lot of empty malls also , except for Mall of America that relies on Japanese tourists.

[@dvferyance]

I was at Eden Prairie recently. It appeared to be doing well. I beleive Ridgedale, Rosedale and Maplewood are doing well too. The malls in Duluth and Rochester are doing fine too. So I don't which malls you are referring to. Other than maybe Burnsville but that is just one mall.

[@American-Motors-Corporation]

Well the only reason why America had shopping malls coming out of the walls was simply because it was a tax shelter for rich people That's what it was used for That's why they built so many of them it was a place for rich people to hide money while they make money what killed that was the local municipalities raised the taxes beyond the levels of it being a tax shelter so they pulled out. I mean the demise starts at different times for different locations it's like for instance I live in Central Ohio and I would say that the demise in my local area of the mall began basically in the '90s especially as the '90s went on and the mall is still sitting there with 1980s decor very very minimal updates. But it's not even really the aesthetics that matter it's simply there's also a certain amount of disrepair to contend with and then of course things that made them all fantastically attractive much like fountains our mall ripped out our fountains in the early to mid-90s and even is like a seven or eight-year-old I knew that that was the start of the demise and then I also remember the disappearance of a lot of stores now they were always able to get another store in there there for a while there seem to be a rapid turnover but to be honest it was over the minute that everybody realized that you could go to Walmart and Target and buy everything that you would need at a much cheaper price and the fact that it's all the same Chinese made shit is what Sears Penny's Macy's and Kohl's are going to sell you back in the day Lazarus included then it was over so I would say it's about a three-prong destruction. You know it became to where it was no longer a viable tax shelter because of tax increases number two was simply Walmart and Target really started to carry pretty much everything you could find in them all at a much cheaper price followed by there's an income deficiency across the population that has been getting worse year over year especially when you take in consideration the past 18 to 20 years as times went on that income deficiency has become more noticeable but then you also have a fourth prong which is simply that most of the companies is it have always occupied balls took on stupid amounts of debt and drove their companies into a ditch.

[@cosmictraveler1146]

@@American-Motors-CorporationCovid also was the final blow to the mall-scape

[@American-Motors-Corporation]

@@cosmictraveler1146 it was dead way before that. Covid has become a false marker in time much like 08 because, most don't realize nor remember as it was reported everywhere last decade that malls are dead crap from another time.

[@williamwatson4625]

Could it be that there's been too much shoplifting and theft going on that Target, Sears,........ were forced to close their doors for good?

[@PhantasyStarved]

Nope. That's happening now in some urban areas, but this is due to good-old unprofitability due to declining revenue and increasing expenses.

[@robertanderson5334]

@williamwatson4625 I am slowly watching the decline of Southlake Mall in Merrillville and the surrounding retail stores.They actually put a police substation in the mall. Living north of there and never head out there anymore. Shoplifters have it easy here because store employees are told not to confront anyone,so load up the shopping cart and head out the door. No security in most of the stores. Shoplifters come far and wide to US30 and RT 65 to ply their craft.

[@TimEric4d3d3d3]

I rode through here on my bike on the Old Plank Road Trail just about a week after you were here. I noticed how nice looking the downtown area was, but extremely under utilized and quiet.

[@tonywestvirginia]

Thanks Chris

[@Irving-gp9oc]

I always think of Matteson and Harvey when I think of Chicago! Turn the empty space into affordable WORKFORCE HOUSING....wait there are no employers that want to be there. so maybe an Industrial park would be a great idea being close to great interstate systems......

[@mikestriegel791]

There are several employers just south in University Park. A big Amazon warehouse. Central Steel & Wire recently opened a huge facility, Dot Foods has been there since '17, and many, many more as you go south on Central towards Monee.

[@lilsuzq32]

Lincoln Mall was named for its location on US Route 30, the Lincoln Highway.

[@natalietank]

Was a wonderful place to shop. Left IL in 2015

[@1rjbrjb]

I'm a south suburban expat. And I don't care how Matteson is supposed to be pronounced. I've heard "Mat-sen" and "Madison" and it's not an independent nation with nuclear weapons. We didn't think about it a lot. So the area was very nice in the 70s & 80s. You actually had hope for integration. Matteson, Olympia Fields, Flossmoor - integrated, safe, middle to upper middle class. I never felt unsafe in those towns. In Harvey, you had to stay alert, but you had Rube's and a stellar library. Seriously one of thr best libraries in the burbs circa 1980, wonderful staff. Bad Mayors. High taxes. A VC desert. Closed factories. No, it wasn't black people shoplifting. It's sad. In 1986, you might have concluded that white middle class people and black middle class people could share a flourishing community. The chimera lasted decades. I miss it.

[@lnelson5704]

I'm 65. I had to sell my house because the Will County property taxes were $6,000. The house was 1,700 feet. I had to move to a small town far away. There are squatters in my house. They won't leave. Cops won't do anything. A McDonald's and store are a half hour away. I'm far away from my friends. Not what I worked my whole life for

[@actionatnetrox]

Great Job!

[@TimGilkison]

The original Target in Matteson was where I had my very first shift after getting my Pharmacist license, January 2007. 😢

[@ronaldwilson9525]

We used to go to Lincoln Mall every so often in the 90’s. Haven’t been there in many years.

[@jamesgasik3424]

It's sad; as a kid I lived in Frankfort, and I have lots of memories about Matteson and the Lincoln Mall. Seeing it now, it's nothing but a ghost town.

[@markscott5421]

It sounds like they overdeveloped this village too quickly and didn't account for the high taxes eating way spending power for the residents. Granted some of those store chains went belly up not the fault of the village. A roller rink might be a good thing for that empty space it could at least be some entertainment in the village. The taxes are the reason many residents actually move to places like Merrillville, Dyer and St John Indiana get more home for less money all around. Then they just commute to their jobs in the city of Chicago. I did that in the late 70's traveling from Hobart IN to the Prudential Bldg in Chicago until they moved their headquarters to Merrillville IN. I didn't know that Homewood got a casino!!! My aunt and uncle lived there for years and you could see an abandoned horse race track ( the name of it escapes me). Was a real nice area. Love the video!!!!!

[@Decoy0527]

I think the horse track was Washington Park. The new casino building is on/near that property. It's by far the tallest building off I-80 in that area, and on a recent drive to Michigan City I saw one other tall building. A casino also. Weird that the 2 tallest buildings are casinos rather buildings in which a product is produced.

[@markscott5421]

@@Decoy0527 thanks for the info on that for the life of me I couldn't remember the name of that track. Blue Chip is the casino in Michigan City IN.

[@ernestconnell8087]

Too bad most of Chicago doesn’t also look like that

[@Ka9radio_Mobile9]

Crook County for sure! Thanks for the V.

[@joehrlein847]

I lived in Posen IL for many years. The shopping malls in the area were Dixie Square in Harvey and Lincoln Square in Matteson. Actually there were other shopping locations like 95th and Western Evergreen Park, River Oaks and eventually Orland Square opened. Lincoln Square was the place to be and my friends and I went there many times. There was a restaurant in Lincoln Square mall that served great gyros and tall beers in a wooden frame. Drank many a beer there. In 1985 I moved from the south suburbs and never looked back.

[@melissafloyd3341]

I grew up going to Lincoln Mall and then worked there at the spirit Halloween, coach house gifts, treasures in Pewter and GNC. I was there on 911. Sad what happened to it. It was starting to die when I left, a lot of theft.

[@Bbbuddy]

Thanks, J.B.

[@grtjr71]

You need to come out to the old spring hill mall in w dundee, carpentersville. the city of w dundee just bouht that mall and the only store oddly left all alone is a Kohls.