CNC Machine Setup and Alignment Part 2: Leveling

Hello everyone, welcome to At-Man Unlimited. This video series is on machine setup and alignment. We will walk through all the steps needed to get your machine making top notch accurate parts.
In this video we will level our machine. Proper leveling is the critical first step in any machine setup. We will first level the casting of our machine. Then move onto the table and adjust the feet of the machine to remove any twist in the casting. Last we will take some measurement data in the X and Y axis for any Abbe error.
If you have any questions please feel free to comment or email me, [e-mail]
If you would like to support the channel please visit our Patreon page
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[@nowar9220]

This series is absolute gold! Thanks for taking the time to help us out!

[@rahulrajan]

Just found this series, thank you for explaining in detail about the process, I couldn't find another one anywhere. Please keep making videos explaining these topics. Thank you.

[@hacc220able]

Best presenter on KZbin by far.

[@AtManUnlimitedMachining]

Thank you very much

[@rdavit]

Absolutely awesome video! I just finished powering up from 3 phase to single phase (what a P.I.T.A. !)....now on to leveling (getting the ABBE error out). Great explanation! Thanks again! Bob

[@AtManUnlimitedMachining]

Your welcome Bob, nice progress! You wont be able to get all the abbe error out depending on the machine. Just the nature of some designs. If the table over hangs the outer Y rails, the weight shifts the ways and "bends" the saddle.

[@alicehumphrey5153]

each to there own, i feel asleep twice trying to what it before doing my block course assessment.

[@jackward-fw1pu]

@@alicehumphrey5153 here for the same thing a year later im sure they could find a better video for us to watch

[@bstevermer9293]

This is one of the most underestimated channels on you tube . Are you planning on doing any turcite replacement??

[@AtManUnlimitedMachining]

Thank you B, as of right now I do not. I would like to get a nice cnc lathe for the shop at some point though. Depending on what machine I end up with and its condition, you never know.

[@dbuilder81]

I feel like you talked a lot about the leveling but we never saw a level on the rails....that was what I was looking for....did I miss something?

[@aleks138]

is it possible to shim the linear rails to take out the sag on the ends?

[@sohailathar6440]

Please let me know the procedure to level horizontal machining center HMC like Makino a81, a81nx etc.

[@Alistair_Spence]

I just discovered your channel, very interesting stuff, thanks. This was a great primer, for someone like myself who is fairly new to these concepts. It would be great to see you go through a machine and implement the techniques you're talking about. Maybe you already have such a video on your channel, I will look through the archives to see if you do.

[@jaxtonjerry6685]

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[@magnusclay9978]

@Jaxton Jerry Yup, have been watching on instaflixxer for since november myself :D

[@dakarijamari8946]

@Jaxton Jerry Yup, have been watching on instaflixxer for since november myself =)

[@mpmachining7227]

I'm betting that you are no longer checking the posts here but I figured I would give it a shot and ask you a question. I love this series and learned so much about level and squareness of the machine. I have a hobbyist level bench top machine that I have converted to CNC (Started out life as a Precision Matthews PM-30) and it is a smaller machine with dovetail ways. I built and welded the stand myself and unfortunately did not watch this video before I did. The surfaces that the casting mount to on my stand are roughly level and straight but certainly not to the accuracy required now that I have seen this video. I realized when tramming my Z head that I have twist in my table and am so glad I stumbled on your videos because I was about to fix the symptom rather than the root cause. I have access to a 10 arc second level and plan to shim between the casting and the stand so that the casting does not twist when the bolts pull the casting down to the stand. There inlies the question. On a dovetailed machine, the datum I would imagine I have to use for level would be the dovetail as it is the only surface that the saddle touches. How would you go about positioning a level on a dovetail way machine to achieve the effect you got here? Thanks in advance for any help you can give

[@AtManUnlimitedMachining]

Hello, I still check in, been super busy so I'm a bit behind. With dove tails you can try to put a piece of ground bar stock in the dove tail on each side. This should contact the ways and stick up just enough to give a point for a level to rest. You can also use the table carefully.

[@mpmachining7227]

@@AtManUnlimitedMachining Thank you for getting back to me, it really is amazing the community on here and how people are willing to help. After spending many hours using my Engineer brain (I over thought it and came up with really complex solutions that were almost impossible for me to accomplish) I decided to give it a shot just using the table mounted to the ways as you suggested. I couldn't be happier with the results I was able to get. I still have a very slight lean of the table from front to rear, but after the amount of time I spent unbolting, shimming, torquing and repeating I am willing to accept that it is likely already beyond the accuracy of my mill. Running the table from front to back, my 10 arc sec level does not move at all that I can see and is as close to 0 as I can read. Adjusting my column perpendicular to both axis is my next task as I still have quite a bit of nod which is giving me quite a bit of grief. Can't say again how thankful I am for your videos!

[@vivicristina5304]

you are amazing. thank you

[@vladimirdoskocil399]

Thank you very much.

[@terrellbradshaw3504]

Do you have your machine sitting on feet or directly on the concrete? I have some CRS 1x3 bar stock I am planning on putting under my machine where the adjustment bolts sit. Should I be using these bolts to level the machine or use them to just lift it enough to insert shim stock?

[@AtManUnlimitedMachining]

The factory supplied steel plates with divots in them for the bolts to sit in. My machine did not come with these so I just used a piece of half inch plate and put a small counter sink in it. I would not put the leveling bolts direct on concrete. You use the bolts to level the machine. Get an Allen drive with a 2 or 3 foot breaker bar so you can fine tune the level. A small amount of rotation goes a very long way when dialing the machine in.

[@ShopperPlug]

Can anyone recommend a good book or two which specifically describes on how to rebuild or building a CNC from the ground up? I don't care about all the high tech bells and whistles, just want the theory and foundation of how to properly align and setup the linear rails x, y and z axis. With precision in mind.

[@Dsmiffb]

So If I am understanding your video correctly, (I did watch the whole thing) You actually want to physically place the level onto the liner rail and level it that way as opposed to leveling the machine on the table. Once it is level on the liner rails, (both on the x and y) you then want to actually place the level on the table just to see the level of accuracy doing the tests that you did in this video. That determines the amount of error you are basically "going to have to live with" Am I on the right track?

[@Dsmiffb]

I have an older VMC similar to yours in size/ age.

[@Dsmiffb]

Also the only real reason I'm worried about this is I am now seeing a .001-.002 step in between facing cuts when only stepping over about 70% of the diameter of the cutter. It only does it when facing in the Y direction. It is almost perfect when facing in the x direction and basically (for as good as I need it) Perfectly flat when facing that way.

[@AtManUnlimitedMachining]

I feel it is always good to start with the bed, then move up to the table to check for twist and fine tune from there.If your seeing steps with a face mill that is most likely the spindle is out of tram in one axis. Mine is out of tram a bit but in the X axis.

[@Dsmiffb]

@@AtManUnlimitedMachining ok thanks. And this would most likely fall under your other video which talks about shimming the spindle? I'm most likely going to have a friend who is a Haas tech help me out with this. I'm more of a machinist not necessarily a maintenance guy haha. I will tackle very basic things but once it goes past that, I'd rather have a knowledge person help me.

[@AtManUnlimitedMachining]

Yes, you need to loosen the spindle and put a shim between the spindle housing and the Z head.

[@zooandr]

Camera typ?

[@timleech7593]

Hello Tim. I'm trying to level my machine, as you suggest, on the casting itself. So my machinist level won't bridge the gap between the machined surface that the linear rails rest on. I'm assuming I would need to bridge it with a surface plate and then set my level on that? I think that is my only option, just thought I'd ask to make sure. Thanks for the great videos!

[@AtManUnlimitedMachining]

Hi Tim, This is common, you have 2 options A) You can get a longer level or B) You can use any precision straight edge that has two parallel calibrated surfaces and is ridged enough. There is a third option, little more sketchy, but if on a budget can work good enough for a home shop. You can take a piece of square tube stock, then machine and stone spots on the ends and then a spot in the center on the adjacent side. Place that on your surfaces and your level on it, take a reading, then rotate it 180 and take another reading. As long as its repeatable and you can adjust it in so you get the same reading in both rotations you should be good. Not official practice but try to present all options.

[@sm670699]

Where can I get those tools for leveling at?

[@AtManUnlimitedMachining]

You can get them at a number of machine tool distributors or you can get them used on fleebay sometimes. Search for "SPI Spirit Level" or "Swiss Precision Instruments" These are "Inspection Block" levels, NOT machinist levels. You can get them with a 10 arc second or a 2 arc second vile. Most times you need to start the job with a 10 arc second level and then go to a 2 or less. If you start with a 2 arc sec level it is so sensitive you chase then thing around. Keep in mind a Starrett "precision" level that many people use is only a 80 arc second level. These are over 8 or 40 times more sensitive.

[@liamthegamer9174]

Why don't you level off of the rails, instead of the table?

[@dylanrink3130]

Hey bud, I've been watching your vids and some things you refer to are wrong, when you talk about aligning a box way machine you say to use shims, that is absolutely wrong, they are either ground or hand scraped for perfect alignment. The shims are used for plates on say the bottom of the saddle to base to keep it in full bearing, when the Machine is worn and is either reground or rescraped for alignment the shims are added to or decreased depending on what work was done and how the rebuilder went. for the most part I think your pretty informing. I have a video or two on my channel where I machine a cast iron master square from solid durabar, I don't have the scraping videos up yet...

[@AtManUnlimitedMachining]

Thanks Dylan I don't think you can say using shims on a box way machine is absolutely wrong. The Fadal maintenance manuals specifically call out shims for adjustments. Many machines will use shims to adjust the square of the saddle or other items. The adjustment can be made by replacing/adding shims or grinding the existing ones. Every machine is a little different in how they need to be adjusted. I believe in a few of these videos I refer to replacing the Turcite and then scraping the ways. If you have some good videos on scraping I would love to see them. I have not found really good educational videos on scraping. There are some higher level how to's but no one has sat down and completely covered what there doing and looking for while they scrape. It is definitely one of those black magic art forms. Tim

[@dylanrink3130]

there isn't alot out there for scraping. I'd like to see some excerpts on the shim use from fadal, pertaining only to alignment... and yes the turcite comment is true, my knee mill has turcite on the ways that slide on hardened cast iron ways. there are no shims on my Machine for alignment, the only way to fix it is to scrape it true. same goes for the bigger knee mills that have actual BOX ways rather than dovetail ways.

[@AtManUnlimitedMachining]

You should also have adjustments on the gibes.Check section 6 "Axis Drive System" in the maintenance manuals, you can google for them to find them. I tried putting links in comments before and got yelled at by google for some reason.

[@premnathmore7568]

Nice video sir...could you added English subtitles.for more understanding.

[@bstevermer9293]

Why did you stop making vids? Even fadal is back building , you should too!

[@chsubramanyam]

how to measure it

[@AtManUnlimitedMachining]

I'm sorry? Are you asking how to read the level? Each hash mark on the tube should have a set graduation (IE 0.0005" per foot). For each hash the bubble is off center that would be one unit of the levels graduation. Does that help?

[@WatchWesWork]

I appreciate the effort, but this is a pretty poor effort. You didn't do much of anything to actually level the machine. You just checked the level and made up some excuses why it's not as bad as the level shows it to be. A linear guide machine should not have a hump in the ways like that. Something is badly worn or you didn't actually level it correctly. Also, there is absolutely no reason to use the base casting for the rough level. You can use the table. It makes no difference. The machine doesn't even need to be "level" as you found out when you started monkeying with it. Box way machines sometimes use shims for the clamps on the back side of the ways, but most adjustment is done with the gibs or by milling or scraping the turcite.

[@AtManUnlimitedMachining]

The machine has already been up and running for over a year. So no, I did not see value in showing viewers how to turn a 1" bolt. I would hardly call this a poor effort as these videos take a fair amount of time to produce and edit. They are provided for free. You are welcome to disagree and not like them, but please do so in a constructive manor. The proper term for that "Hump" as you so call it is Abbe error. Every machine of this design will have it to some degree due to the ends of the saddle not being supported. The saddle is literally bending down at the ends. Better machines will have there Y axis ways closer to the ends of the saddle and use a heavier saddle to minimize this. So your assumption of badly worn out or not leveled is incorrect. The leveling procedure that is presented here is the Fadal recommended practices. I invite you to read the maintenance manuals.

[@WatchWesWork]

I know man, I've done it. I've leveled a pile of linear guide and box way machines. I would not consider that amount of error normal. I know it's just a Fadal, but it's not a floppy Bridgeport. Do you have the original test sheet for the machine? It should have been checked at the factory and again at the first installation. Most machine manuals allow for 0 twist in the ways. None. I've worked on machines that were worn bad enough we had to use floor anchors to pull them down to get the twist to 0.

[@UshouldTryReality]

Wes Johnson I'm a Journeyman CNC technician with 20 yrs experience & although I don't do installs & alignments everyday I've done several especially during machine moves but I'd love to know your secret to eliminating the error caused by the weight of the table bending the rails because of a lack of support offered by the design? I've got the level & twist in very good condition but still have the bending @ extreme left & right travel which is also linear & equal as it bends. So how do you stop the bending?