Copyrighting all the melodies to avoid accidental infringement | Damien Riehl | TEDxMinneapolis

[@2ndviolin]

I heard him use several sentences that have been used before by other people.

[@ZefParisoto]

Which ones?

[@RealityTrailers]

I'm calling my verbal lawyer now, maybe he's used copy right verbal material.

[@2ndviolin]

@@ZefParisoto too late, I've filed the lawsuit already.

[@jothee-bee]

not only have i copyrighted all sentences, all sentience & all maladies .. i've also copyrighted all spelling mystics too

[@NajwaLaylah]

And not a single word with which I was not familiar. Hmm...

[@Bhatakti_Hawas]

Lets take this video to 3 million views. So that everyone has 'ACCESS'

[@astenix]

This videofile is, in a essence, a sequence of 0 and 1. I saw them already, so…

[@MoGratitude]

Ted talk has over 3 mil subscribers. and youtube has over 3 mil users, everyone already has access

[@Bhatakti_Hawas]

@@MoGratitude U didn't get my point. Watch Adam Neely's video on this topic. 'Access' in this case is a legal term

[@MoGratitude]

@@Bhatakti_Hawas yes, im broadening the application of "access" does access to something easily accessible excuse knowing about it? rhetorical question

[@CED99]

Feed the algorithm!

[@OddwicMusic]

Adam Neely sent me on a mission.

[@A.F.Whitepigeon]

69th like!

[@letsnotgothere6242]

Same, brother!

[@mrkrunch4340]

PREACH!

[@wookielocks]

I've come to do my part

[@MrBanzoid]

Same here!

[@onesyphorus]

Aight.. lets bump this to 3 million bros!!

[@oldtimetinfoilhatwearer]

onesyphorus Ὀνησίφορος yeeeeeeet

[@jamescanjuggle]

For the algorithm!

[@jeanfid]

bros -.-

[@hvanmegen]

These guys are musical HEROES.. they've created ACTUAL and FACTUAL melodies that are TANGIBLE and EXIST and copyrighted them as public domain to save the music.. This is what makes them heroes in my book.

[@felix-ve8jk]

Lol...

[@PierreVeniot]

Nor Actual or Factual, no copyright infridgments have been legally done in a court using this pseudo-copyright exercise.

[@patriciodasilva7902]

it won't fly, legally. it's all about what a lawyer can prove to a jury in a court of law, that's it, that's all that matters. Now then, The court has ruled that AI computer generated melodies are not protected by US copyright, and if I come up with something that duplicates anything in his catalog, he would, in order to deny my copyright, prove it was 'public domain', he would have to prove I had access to, and likely heard, his melody, and given that there are billions of melodies in his catalog, online or not, have fun proving that in a court of law. No jury is going to let one guy get away with copywriting all melodies, that's just nuts.

[@digitalgenes]

Pure genius. On their website in the FAQ they illustrate how it might protect someone from a lawsuit: - July 2019: Our All the Music project (ATM) has mathematically exhausted a large melodic dataset - which contains Melody X - October 2020: Adam writes Song 1 - which contains Melody X - November 2020: Beth writes Song 2 - which contains Melody X - but Beth has never heard Adam’s Song 1 - December 2020: Adam sues Beth over Song 2. Beth argues that because Song 1’s Melody X was in the public domain already - when ATM project generated it a year earlier, or as fact existing since the beginning of time - Adam cannot later copyright something (Melody X) that is either factual or has been in the public domain. So far so good ... but what if Adam had written his melody BEFORE July 2019 ? Can he sue both ATM and Beth ?! Could the prosecutor argue that brute computation for a non-profit goal is not infringement, but Beth writing it in a song is ? Or could the defence convince the jury that the melody can't be copyrighted by Adam in the first place because it has existed since the beginning of time, or is one of a relatively small, finite set of possible melodies and so cannot be unique enough to be copyrightable? It is already very encouraging that Katy Perry won a reversal of the infringement verdict for her song Dark Horse on the basis that "A relatively common 8-note combination of unprotected elements that happens to be played in a timbre common to a particular genre of music cannot be so original as to warrant copyright protection".

[@DarkPoet669]

As a musician, a song writer, a sound engineer, a producer, and a recording studio owner who also has had a record label in the past, I think this is a talk that needs to be had. Money grabbing litigation is the worst thing this world has created and it has impacted the creativity and freedom of the arts. This reduces the quality of the art we can enjoy and stifles creativity, without even considering the way it can cause the creative well to dry up. We all stand on the shoulders of giants and everything we take in is an influence, there is bound to be a sign of that in any work you create in the future, and that is not a bad thing necessarily. And even if someone does copy your song, are you just passed that theirs is superior? Go out and redo it then and make it even better and use their improved version as the stepping stone to take it rob the next level, or are you not capable of doing that?

[@DamienRiehl]

Yes, well said. All art iterates upon the past. Originality is less important than authenticity. If copyright is (arguably) meant to encourage art proliferation, then the copyright laws should align with that goal.

[@elilauffer]

Shoulders of Giants originates from when Newton stole all Robert Hooke's work and took the credit- he used it as a slight since Hooke was a hunchback due to, ya know, actually using a microscope

[@AdviceandAdventures]

That's all well and good until you find out some millionaire took your stuff and made a lot of money without credit/royalties to you. Of course, they will never admit to it. Then when you try to take their stuff, they copyright claim your azz!

[@coolbuddyshivam]

@Windows XP Professional Service Pack 2 It's Creators Life + 95 years or so.

[@chaseikpa5077]

Dope

[@xf_art_]

One day, KZbin's algorithm will pick this up again. I've done my part, and will be waiting.

[@companerger9416]

Thank you for this service. The idea that George Harrison pulled back on writing music is a catastrophe to art. The ingenuity of this project is really helpful for establishing all art is prior art, especially in our songs.

[@ZachCortez]

When I was younger I always wondered if there was a limit on how much music humans can create. This is def one of the more interesting TED talks on here

[@chuheihkg]

the combination is very big. We will NEVER know the exact amount with 12 notes.

[@weakspirit_]

you don't actually need to generate every single melody. just enough to disrupt creative liberty. i admit the number would still be very large, but any disruption by a big player (maybe Amazon) would be catastrophic.

[@cameron7374]

@@chuheihkg "We will NEVER know the exact amount with 12 notes." So I have some news for you: If we restrict ourselves to one octave (8 different notes), the exact amount is 429981696. (About 430 million) If we count every key on a piano as a note (so that's 88 possible notes), the exact amount is 92885869784266333550318482747592186663612968312311404275495006694290687472567021380958888656896. Or, in English, just under 92 trigintillion.

[@PierreVeniot]

it is infinite in many ways. just think about the computation about rhythmic values in a melodie, which is the absolute part of a song... this guy is not a composer... just fiddling with computer algoritms.

[@0live0wire0]

No, that's bs people with no actual knowledge of music like to say to sound smart. It's the same as with language. When writing prose, can you unwittingly replicate a sentence someone else used, or a whole plot, the protagonist, or maybe the title? Sure, but that doesn't mean you can't write anything original at all. Plus context is key. Same goes for melody. Composers or producers can arrange/orchestrate the same melody in so many different ways that the casual listener wouldn't probably tell it's the same thing. The possibilities are close to infinite.

[@misterlyle.]

Fascinating talk, Mr. Riehl! You are effectively showing that a basic melody should not be a basis for a lawsuit. Copyright law in the United States seriously needs reform. I am looking forward to hearing how this holds up in court!

[@meis18mofo77]

This is literaly one of my greatest fears when producing, like how am I supposed to know every melody that was ever written and then avoid them WTF

[@rapskallion]

You have exposed the failings of copyrighted music. Thank you.

[@adondriel]

He should upload recordings of all the music to KZbin, see if he gets hit by any of the big companies, then sue them when they try to take away his rights.

[@dubliostower]

Wouldnt it be the same thing, but the other way around. Those big companies actually do have the copyright to the song, so the randomly generated melody has already been copyrighted.

[@MrLuigge]

well supposing the a. I. could know the copyrighted songs, you could upload only the public ones

@@dubliostower Actually they can prove that they neither used other songs to write it NOR wrote subconsciously xD

[@kenvh8569]

@@dubliostower That's a can of worms a record label won't open: If they sue Damien for copyright infringement, win or lose, Damien can now sue them for every single song they'll ever release - and use the record label's own testimony against them.

[@b.n.a546]

I'm just commenting this for the sake of this getting recognized by the algorithm.

[@softporcupine4514]

This mans picture needs to be on every wall of every music classroom, every recording room, every band room, and any room that deals with music on the planet.

[@aylbdrmadison1051]

Except that any musician worth a damn knows there are only seven notes, not eight. But he's right that it's a problem, only that problem is 12.5% worse than what he says.

[@DamienRiehl]

@@aylbdrmadison1051 Of course I know that a major/minor scale has seven notes. (My bachelor's degree in music - along with four classes in music theory and many other classes in composition - taught me a thing or two.) But if I had limited my dataset to only seven notes, then it would have eliminated the melodies that end on the high tonic. I used eight notes to increase comprehensiveness.

[@aldo_mores]

@@aylbdrmadison1051 rekt, lul.

[@philippgrunert8776]

Simply brilliant. Thank you. The "Copyright lawsuits" were already going nutts.

[@Kaskets3D]

This is the best TED ever... Hands down.

[@TheQuackinator]

these guys may have single-handedly saved the whole music industry. Hopefully as the years go on, more of the already copyrighted melodies are released into public domain as well.

[@Cheese_Flavour44]

*Microtonality walks away quietly, hoping not to be seen*

[@sweetwheatsy]

If you can show me one instance of microtonality-usage in a mainstream pop-setting I will absolutely acquire and digest a hat

[@janramonmartin]

​@@sweetwheatsy king gizzard and the lizard wizard

[@AUBCodeII]

@@sweetwheatsy Marty Friedman?

[@sweetwheatsy]

@@AUBCodeII Oooh, who's that and what fitting track can you recommend?

[@Max_Le_Groom]

@@sweetwheatsy The West doesn't know about the existence of Microtones

[@COVID--bi7rl]

EVERYTHING IS A REMIX.

[@ZaneDalton]

OK BOOMER ok boomer

[@joethompson9124]

@@ZaneDalton ok dalton

[@ayoungethan]

the court would like to know: did you or did you not have access to your parent's genetic material when you created your own? all of life is copyright infringement. when the prokaryotes lawyer up we are all screwed.

[@COVID--bi7rl]

Spread this video far and wide everyone!

[@Freakybananayo]

For ages I've wished someone smart enough would come up with something like this. And I found this by complete accident

[@leandro.1.2.1]

Same!

[@juliafrost9082]

@DamienRiehl thank you for your servicing of the song writing community! You are appreciated and loved!

[@4goezm]

This talk really needed to exist and I hope it will get a lot of attention.

[@daikimizu9324]

Glad someone talked about this, people need to understand that the language of music is becoming more and more thin and narrow for new writers/composers for not accidentally hiting pre-existing melodies that they didn't heard before or knew existed, alot of artist have filled lots of gaps in that grid that we are left with not much to work with when trying to be original.

[@Submersed24]

Music really shouldn't have a copywrite on it. Unless someone blatanly copies a song, changing it a bunch to make something that sounds similar but not the same is how everything else in the world works anyways. Buildings are constructed from the same design patterns and science is done with the same formulas.

[@Multi-Waves_Music]

THANK YOU

[@swagar]

Right, but how would you prove those cases where someone DOES blatantly copy a song? They're going to deny it and use the same excuses a legitimate songwriter does.

[@Mr.Beauregarde]

@@swagar If you but forgo this misheld belief that capitalism is the only structure that the world can take, this problem becomes no problem. Provided of course one's sense of self worth is not founded on the opinions of others.

[@Submersed24]

@@swagar I'd say give them a 5 year copyright hold on a song, then after that, the money they make comes from concerts and merch. In the cases of big labels ripping melodies off smaller ones, the songs usually sound way differently anyways (like the katy perry darkhorse one). After 5 years the song already had made 90% of its money and is considered old anyways.

[@juanestebanlopezquintero2948]

These dudes attempt to initially copyright this, so they can put all this melodies as public domain. Actually it is a great card to play for all out there.

[@squeebbb]

As someone who writes music for a hobby, I can't tell you how many times I was working on something I really loved and then realized was subconsciously "stolen" from an already existing popular song. I hate when that happens, it's a huge hit to creative morale lol

[@chidianuforo3670]

Good stuff. I've been a producer for half of my life and I produced this song once. It was an original idea and I was very proud of it. When a friend heard it, he said that it reminded him of another song. When I heard the other song, mine and theirs sounded exactly the same. I'm no big name artist so my song was never released but if it had, I might've been on the hook for millions. I applaud these two men.

[@misterlyle.]

Only on the hook for millions if your song had been that profitable, or if you otherwise have a sizable asset base. A lawyer here in Florida explained to me the concept of being "judgement proof." If there isn't enough money in play, a case typically isn't viable.

[@maul6117]

Every KZbinr that has anything to do with music should be talking about this

[@LucasFeijo]

Worse, some channels get all their videos claimed because of some intro music that's misinterpreted as being copyright infringed. And youtube ignores their complaints about the algorithm.

[@joethompson9124]

yeah for sure

[@Milewskige]

Unfortunately, people are now suing over chord progressions and if a song just SOUNDS stylistically similar.

[@christopermitchell5019]

chord progressions and rhythms cant be sued over. only melody.

[@Milewskige]

@@christopermitchell5019 That HAS been the conventional wisdom, however, recently, it has started happening & people have WON! Rick Beato has some good videos on this subject referencing some recent cases. Look up the Katy Perry case as one example.

[@burningflower1]

@@Milewskige The Katy Perry one was a melody

[@Milewskige]

@@burningflower1 Watch the Rick Beato video

[@-someone-.]

The copyright of every single melody is in good hands it seems❤️😇

[@frenchyroastify]

If he releases his melodies on that drive, he will be sued by everyone, even Vanilla Ice for copyright infringement.

[@MorpH2k]

They already did release it on their website, along with all the code for the generation algorithm. It's all open source too. Looking at the files right now.

[@austinanthony4016]

The hero musicians have been waiting for....tired of reading copyright lawsuits.

[@torbenmeldgaard8112]

Thank you Adam Neely for pointing me in this direction. Shared on a bunch of musician fora and crossing my fingers that this monstrosity will come to an end eventually.

[@Lucidiumshards]

Anyone else come from Adam Neely’s vídeo?

[@LoraCoggins]

Even if you have heard of the song that you are allegedly accused of infringing, stealing can be a good thing! The only way I think it would be bad would be if you stole every single aspect of another song (i.e. its melody AND its lyrics AND its chords AND its instruments) and then claimed it as yours. A musician must be able to have that blank page! Let's get this to 3 million views!!!!!

[@marytyr3494]

Science (Math) + Art (Music) + Humanities (Law) = The key to beauty and justice. Raise your kids loving the said branches.

[@DamienRiehl]

Well said. In an era of programmatic upheaval - where machines are making previously useful rote "skills" obsolete - the future belongs to those who can use their diverse educational background (Science/Math + Art/Music + Humanities/Law) to solve hard problems using creative, cross-disciplinary methods.

[@avishmusic]

Best and the most crucial music related video on the internet 🙏

[@letsnotgothere6242]

Not the hero we deserved, but the hero we needed.

[@417salior]

Damn! So cool to see a good guy out there fighting the good fight! Thank you, Damien, musicians need you!

[@Cloud9MediaTv]

THINK AGAIN ..this is a TROJAN HORSE.

[@brunofrye]

this. i don't trust these fast talking lawyer types selling some "solution" that actually fucks you over@@Cloud9MediaTv

[@user-iv5wn1su4c]

You create music after you hear music. And the memory before wont disappear, it will emerge in your music.

[@sosasees]

Yes! We're getting Closer and Closer to reaching 300 000! If we don't work together, we may never reach 3 000 000!

[@javadragon7475]

This is one of those things I've never thought about, but now that I hear it I'm like: Yeah, of course.

[@tyler3201]

Dude is a legend in music already, thank you and I dont even write music that much.

[@J2Jedi]

This is a big step for the future continuation of music! It is universal and should be in the public domain. Very good work! Music is life and I think without music (singing) there would be no life, but just existence. Not to disrespect the song witers that already filed copyright law suits, but it just might be that in the (at least) 5000 years of human society even their songs have been sung before. The same goes for rhythms from old tribes. They might not have been recorded, but one might have heard one of them. And what about sounds (frequencies) and rhythmes that float around in space (chemical and physics), those are there since... Maybe far fetched, but in reasoning it just might be helpful.

[@letsnotgothere6242]

Even silence was copyrighted by John Cage🥴

[@dangevin]

Hello, darkness

[@vadym1316]

Hey! It sentence was copyrighted by my!

[@letsnotgothere6242]

@@vadym1316 Я плохо говорю по русски. Вы хотите помочь друг другу?

[@vadym1316]

@@letsnotgothere6242 i'm speak english badly too

[@theviewtifullife]

bc it was written as sheet music, the piece is copyrighted. however, i can copyright the same thing by laying out all half rests instead of measure rests, put in a different time signature and key

[@kalvincatlin7777]

Hmmm for some reason the audio on this is pretty low for me, you should turn it up on the video because THIS MAN NEEDS TO BE HEARD!

[@AlexGreen1991]

Can anybody turn that vid louder? XD

[@KutAnimus]

That's super easy to do. In mpv just hit 0 to turn up volume (make sure you have volume-max=200 in your ~/.config/mpv/mpv.conf file first). This of course assumes that you also have youtube-dl installed and are viewing this video in mpv via youtube-dl script.

[@sudokuzcalkami]

@@KutAnimus so the answer is "no"

[@dandy4706]

​ Qt Animu 🤣

[@KutAnimus]

@@sudokuzcalkami In what sense? I provided steps to achieve the intended result.

[@ZeroRelevance]

Qt Animu I think it’s reasonable to assume that very few people aren’t just using their browser/mobile app

[@SusloNick]

Copyright laws need a rework, thats for sure

[@ARE_YOU_SICK_OF_YT_CENSORSHIP]

absolutely

[@Dowlphin]

Law won't cut it. Society is insane. Work needs to be done on that level.

[@GregStewartecosmology]

Music cannot truly be owned... As it's all ultimately been cloned... Because every melody and beat... Is most likely a medley of repeat! That makes me wonder... What dimension did Mozart's art, start? Did they beat with an ear? Or hear, with their heart?

[@Lucidiumshards]

Greg Stewart the fact that you took the time to right this is commendable, good stuff mate👌🏼

[@05Matz]

Cool. Hope your message gets out -- this sort of law needs reform badly. The current state is untenable.

[@TomaszKalusMusic]

Imagine that Frederic Chopin or Mozart could've hypothetically played the melody from Linkin Park- In the End, or any other contemporary melody when playing piano, just by accident or something. It's entirely possible. Mindblowing.

[@EmpyreanLightASMR]

I'm just making a stab at this, but classical and romantic music is far more complex than a pop song's structure. A Mozart melody might take up, for example, 30 notes. Beethoven's Fifth, everyone can hum the first four notes, followed by the next four notes, but how many notes follow that? Good luck counting lol. But for the record, classical composers often plagiarized themselves (Bach was notorious) and even Rachmaninoff apparently subconsciously rewrote a church piece he'd heard as a child much later in his life... but this to me is more remarkable than anything to be frightened by.

[@Ownd4h3r]

I can understand copyright with sound design, but with melodies it’s ridiculous! I love this!!! Ur awesome!!!

[@maryanne2025]

Do you mean sampling? Why sound design?

[@FacePomagranate]

"Every popular melody that ever existed is those 8 notes" Laughs to the tune of the most covered pop song ever, Yesterday, which deviates from the major scale by the 4th note.

[@infinitefretboard]

Isn't it just in E Major but it modulates to the relative minor? Are you implying that it's in lydian?

[@FacePomagranate]

@@infinitefretboard It's in F major but makes use of the relative D melodic minor scale

[@rainbowsprinkles4234]

An author named Spider Robinson wrote a short story, Melancholy Elephants, warning of exactly this problem. It was published in 1982.

[@CatogMedia]

When you brute force music to create the Final Fantasy 7 Battle Theme

[@sanathgs3254]

Leaving this comment for the algo because every musician needs to watch this video

[@Advent22mix]

Copyright laws are very recent. In the past composers borrowed heavily from one another. Bach extensively used melodies from existing chorales to create incredibly complex and beautiful counterpoint. Next time you try to defend modern copyright law remember that many of the greatest composers of all time would have infringed on copyright countless times had the laws existed in their era.

[@devinbae9914]

More people honestly need to watch this

[@usualatoms4868]

Someone copyrighted volume too?

[@imsaduwu3604]

I hope that as many people as possible will see this video

[@XxWillyRocksxX]

Down with greedy lawyer's and corporations that inhibit innovation, and let get this Renaissance started!

[@frankie1136]

They need more views. Important work they're doing.

[@snoookie456]

Musicians needed our very own Elon Musk, this is the closest we ever came, I'm pretty grateful for that

[@TypicalRussianGuy]

This guy is even cooler than Elon Musk IMHO

[@Bennet2391]

This should get way more attention.

[@death13a]

Good job guys thank you for your service

[@gaborm5673]

They have all the melodies of the chromatic scale but not all that could exist. By definition: "A melody is a combination of pitch and rhythm". If they really want all the melodies that could exist there are so much other variables to consider than the 7 main musical notes to care about in the algorithm. What about microtones? What if I use a microtone as the reference note on my tunning? (Like we use A on 440hz). This leds us even more frequencies and tone variables because at the end the 7 main musical notes are just a standar name of certain frequencies. (like A=440hz) If we think more deeply the fact that the commonly stated range of human hearing is 20 Hz to 20 kHz and that the chromatic scale only uses 12 specific frequencies for each note if this range we have the remaining frequiencies that could represent the pitch of a note, not a standard one, but by definition (pitch). Quote: "In all technicality, music can be composed of notes at any arbitrary physical frequency." But of course, I get the point of the video and this "notes" are not of common use in music, neither classical, Pop or "commercial music" that is more suceptible of this kind of sues, but saying that they have "all the melodies" without touching this topic is kinda pretentious. (and this is only the pitch part).

[@rolands.7870]

I dont know Adam Neely ... but I watched his video and here I am. Lets get to 3 Million :)

[@romanblahynka4536]

As Damien said, this is something that's not exclusive to music, but in music it's more easily quantifiable. As a designer, when faced with designing a product, you have certain constraints for the functional shape for example, but the rest of the styling is up to you. Now you can start sketching and coming up with ideas for the shape, but the worst part is that you have to check first whether something similar hasn't been done by someone else. Worse yet is the subconscious copying that's mentioned here too. In theory, there is also a finite way to shape a certain product, especially if we're thinking with a filter of "attractivity". Since there can be thousands of manufacturers of a certain product, it's nearly impossible to check them all to see whether you're not using an already used shape by accident or whether you saw it somewhere and your brain is copying it subconsciously. Because in the end, a brain is just a combinantion engine and disassembly and recombination of percieved reality is the essence of creation itself.

[@misterlyle.]

Interesting observations, Roman. When I have helped a client with a logo design, I would do an image search for related designs, and make sure that I am not replicating something already in use and easy to find. It seems to me that once this is done, subconscious copying is moot. The odds of a legal issue developing should be proportional to how easy a given design is to locate in a search. Something impossible or otherwise hard to find online probably will never become a problem.

[@GameyRaccoon]

At this point we should just abolish copyright

[@onesyphorus]

Imagine an AI writing out every type of Lyrical combination, of around 500-1000 characters, In the English Language, and copywriying it aswell. That's mindblowing already.

[@Roxor128]

Not feasible. Assuming an average of 6 characters per word (my go-to assumption for estimating word count from file size), then 1000 characters gives you 166.666 words. Call it 150. With somewhere on the order of 100k words in the English language, that's around 10^750 possible 150-word text files. The number of atoms in the universe is only on the order of 10^80.

[@cogswellsprocket5530]

That was an eye opener and I really appreciate the work..

[@faisalrkhawaja]

Sometimes, I just love humans. What a gift to the world. Thanks to both gentlemen, sanity may start to creep back into our modern society.

[@alchemicalguns]

just straight up hacking open the core of music and slapping copyright in the face. this is a cause i can get behind.

[@daviskreeling7062]

Okay, I just got to the bit where he says they've expanded to 12 notes (the full chromatic scale) good. Otherwise it's all a waste of time.

[@Andratos95]

Me: Slams the piano ~Door blasts open~ *DMCA, GET ON THE GROUND!*

[@bakedmomo5693]

now if this and adam neely's video reaches 3m views...what now, copyright laws? ->adam neely's vid took me here

[@aycc-nbh7289]

BakedMoMo Well, Mr. Neely’s video has already gotten 10% of the way there... and the Katy Perry lawsuit is under a retrial and possible appeal, so the “3 million views” argument will likely no longer hold any water.

[@thealleys]

my guitar neck shows me 12 notes if you include #/b. Some scales have more than 8 notes... so that would change the math to 12 to the power of 12 not including the next octave. Am i wrong here?

[@ZefParisoto]

Although I completely agree with everything he did and he criticised about copyright infringement laws, I don't like that he got the minor scale wrong, acted like all notes have the same length in every melody and all melodies are about the same length. Although he probably willfully simplified that for the talk, the number of *all* possible melodies would be significantly higher and you wouldn't be able to display it on such a kind of sheet.

[@DamienRiehl]

Yes, I was limited by both (1) time and (2) audience sophistication. I had to make three technical, arcane topics, making them interesting to laypersons. I could talk with experts for hours. Rhythm doesn't really matter that much. Cover a song - but vary the rhythm - and it's still a copy. On total universe of melodies: it's hypothetically true. But how many melodies are outside of my dataset? Particularly if you stitch together 2 or more of my 12-tone melodies?

[@EmielBlom]

@@DamienRiehl basicly Bach owns all music with his wtc books

[@rhejamphi]

This guy is outstanding. Changing the world with a clever idea.

[@soundkanvas9248]

It’s seems like today more than ever the majority of pop songs have identical melodies

[@shilohpatten3761]

That makes it easier to understand that those musical ideas are mathematical computations, which makes it public domain. There’s only 24 ways to build a progression with the same 4 chords, etc. Next, lawyers become disbarred for deliberately misrepresenting copyright infringement.

[@MadDragon75]

17:48 No, We thank you Sir.😉👍

[@bryan3dguitar]

It would be better if lawmakers understood and believed these arguments and passed legislation that lawyers wouldn't have to explain and argue to judges and juries - and that judges and juries would be expected to understand and abide by.

[@Ivan_1791]

This video: Beethoven writing the 4th movement of the Hammerklavier: So you have chosen death.

[@TainlorrMusic]

Haha yeah It'll be a few centuries until a computer can create the Hammerklavier 2.0

[@CharlesLouisRosario]

This is brilliant work. You know… when you copyright a song, there should be a process that determines if it even qualifies considering the current system in place. Otherwise l, what’s the point if this can still happen. Sickening.

[@grrggrrg4805]

Come on guys! We just have to get it over 3 million!

[@mitchkahle314]

It's time to repeal copyright laws that protect ownership of the "components" of music and limit copyright protections to complete finished productions. Thus chords, rhythms, melodies would be removed from copyright protection.

[@Atlas65]

Rythms and chords have never been copyrighted. It has aways been said nobody can own a set of chords. They realised that long time ago. It is to limited.

[@mitchkahle314]

@@Atlas65 Except when chords are arpeggiated (ala Stairway To Heaven)

[@scrambledID]

I'm curious why intonation and tuning- 1/4 tones, various Hz- aren't part of any argument/discussion. The Pythagorean 12 tone system isn't the only system to exist.

[@ARE_YOU_SICK_OF_YT_CENSORSHIP]

they aim at addressing only pop music because this is the primary field of copyright lawsuits, very few people write in penthatonic or Indian or Arabic scales in the West and very few of those types of melodies or scales are used in pop music

[@DamienRiehl]

BayanTheOne is right: One could include 1/4 tones. It's just math. But let's count the number of copyright lawsuits that involve 1/4 tones. Is the number greater than zero? If not, then is the juice worth the squeeze?

[@reboxetinmesilat]

The guy is my hero. Well done.

[@Violet111]

hey algorithm! look at this! I made a comment!

[@armandoduranboger]

Gracias Nohan y Damien.

[@t0nnnyyy]

Adam Neely brought me here!

[@wadetisthammer3612]

Me too! 😁

[@dextro7349]

Me 3 😁

[@mantenbrink]

Copyright saves just as many people as it takes down. Copyright laws are so outdated and should really see major changes sooner than later.

[@abdullahibrahim2631]

That was excellent thank you for your work! Yet; I was wondering considering there are more tonal systems than equal temperament of western music with only 12 distinctive tones. The number of permutations of melodies is also infinite, like a paintings number of brush stokes, if we include any tonal system that is existing or when imagining any derivative. One could make up any custome scale in cents or hertz; making the number of notes infinit..? Of course this is more theoretical and might miss any practical application to the real world! Keep making music!

[@DamienRiehl]

Yes, you're absolutely right: We're covering the vast majority of songs that are litigated. The odds of a non-western temperament (e.g., 24-tone) getting sued over is tiny. It'll probably never happen. So we're covering the primary use cases: Major, Minor, 12-tone. Thanks for your note!

[@marcelwustner5798]

Keep on Pushing!

[@tsbrownie]

Mathematicians and programmers can copyright the formula/code to generate all melodies, etc.

[@MrLuigge]

I just remembered of something else, I remember once that a KZbin channel I used to watch proved that another KZbin channel was purchasing for cheap, the rights of people's videos just to sue everyone that had "their videos" on the video. for example: [YTC (a)] purchase the rights of [video (1)] from [YTC (b)] so if whatever other YTC (KZbin channel) contains any part of [video (1) from YTC (b)] they [YTC (a)] can sue and get a lot of money this way. This is just unfair altough it would I guess not be illegal since you buy the rights and have the right to sue. altough I don't know if this is actually legal or not.

[@Yetzederixx]

Now this is proper patent/ip/copyright trolling!

[@FrankHarwald]

SUPER! I like that step! But for practicality - could someone consider uploading them to KZbin & mark them as Creative Commons so that noone will be able to get copyright clammed again?

[@user-vn7ce5ig1z]

10:54 - No, that won't happen. Even if they keep just 12 notes, and only 88 keys/notes on a standard piano, that would create over 216 _sextillion_ melodies which at even just a single byte per melody would take up over 186 _zettabytes_ which you definitely could not store on a hard-drive to make it count as automatically copyrighted, forget about 100 notes. The most you could do would be to write down a _description_ of the melodies instead of the melodies themselves, which doesn't count.

[@TheNewsDepot]

While there are 88 keys on some keyboards, those are not all separate notes. It doesn't matter if you play a song in B flat or A minor, the notes are the same for a melody. There are only 12 actually notes weather you have a keyboard with 12 keys or 1200.

[@DamienRiehl]

@@TheNewsDepot That's exactly right. And that's why we chose those parameters. A cover song in a different key is still a copy.

[@jppagetoo]

Also the octave does not matter. A melody doesn't change because I shifted up/down an octave or so. That limits the song space by a lot. The real number eater is when you have long melodies. But a melody is rarely more than 1 dozen or so notes long and even at twice that length, it can be set to copyrightable form. You may not be able to cover them all, but you can cover most of the useful ones.

[@DamienRiehl]

Yes, @@jppagetoois right. And a way to make even longer melodies: Connect Melody1 with Melody2. So a "long melody" is just two shorter melodies.