Corsairs of Umbar Tactics - Middle Earth SBG

Kevin tells about his experience with his corsairs army.
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[@TiagoRamosVideos]

I love these videos! 👌 I'm still watching and I'm really enjoying it, thanks! 🙏

[@kevinvanravenswaaij4060]

15:05 hahaha, I didn't expect that one Sil! 🤣

[@DarkhorseOldWorld]

You are back! 🎉 more videos more often please 👍😎

[@kevinvanravenswaaij4060]

We try but sometimes it's hard to find the time!

[@roboretro]

Hey, love the videos! Hopefully you'll do a faction review on Rivendell soon????

[@kevinvanravenswaaij4060]

Unfortunately I don't play rivendell (yet)

[@jmaccsarmiesofArda]

Love these vids man keep them coming. I always leave wanting to start a new army. Next time you have a massive tournament take a new army and make a video with terrible advice so people think thats how your going to play xD Next level bluff.

[@darchensol5112]

a couple of black mumenoreans can be useful beyond the banner, they make good arrow blockers / charge blockers(terror) for the squishy corsair heroes (everyone tries to snipe bosuns)

[@jamesellis5942]

Love the production value of these videos. I find a black num front line just turns your army into a regular cannon instead of a glass one lol

[@oddeivindsvendsen2385]

Good video! It will help many new and players with some experience! Looking forward to see your next army or combat video!

[@landonbellum8021]

These videos are GOLD. Keep the list breakdowns coming!

[@clinchin2k862]

You should make more tactics videos there my favorite!

[@kentonbiffert2802]

Great Video again!! Every time I see one of your new videos I put aside what I am doing to watch it because I know it will always be worth my time.

[@kevinvanravenswaaij4060]

That's high praise! Thanks so much

[@severintw]

Excellent video. Rivendell next please.

[@Smashotron]

That plane crash that is perfectly scaled with the models, mmmah chef's kiss!

[@levianr.3283]

Great video! Thank you very much! I would very appreciate a Video to Azogs Hunter/Legion :)

[@smoothbrush4722]

Nice tactics and lovely painted army

[@sneakybeak4032]

Yesss been waiting for this next video.. i wonder which faction is next?!

[@harrybrass734]

great video! I would love to see one of these for the shire as they have next to no content on youtube, looking forward to the next video!

[@severintw]

I think it is time for Rivendell now. 😅 I am eagerly waiting for you to covering them. 🤞

[@SevenStarsandSevenStones]

Great video with a ton of detail! One thing I thought was curious was that you said that Dalamyr's smoke bombs aren't always worth it because there's nothing else competing for will from the Corsair list. And you specifically mentioned terror and magic as things the list doesn't have. While I'm confident you meant that in the sense of "things you don't normally bring," how would you design an army around the Knight of Umbar and some Black Numenorians? They're definitely much-maligned by the community, but I'd love to see someone salvage them. What are your thoughts?

[@kevinvanravenswaaij4060]

Black numenoreans are absolutely amazing profiles, and I haven't heard anyone claim otherwise here. The Knight of umbar on the other hand is pretty awful. If you want to combine dalamyr with a spellcaster and use a black num front rank, there is actually a pretty decent way to do it - ally with mordor and use the witch King with the crown of morgul. Dalamyr brings the numenoreans, and the witch King brings morannon spear supports and cavalry. One of the top Italian players played a list like this at ardacon last year, and I faced it with my Easterlings in recon at table #4 (it was game 2 and we'd both won the previous game 12-0 with oath). The game ended in a draw.

[@mennokouwenberg4200]

Sad Betrayer feels left out :( great video again boys!! Time for some tournament vlogs aswell maybe?

[@wcfromaz]

Aren't the Hasharin also available in this army?

[@kevinvanravenswaaij4060]

Hah, they are! It wouldn't be a army list video if I didn't forget about a profile. I'm personally not really a fan of the hasharin. It's not that they are bad, I just think the other options are better, so I never end up taking them. But I'm also aware that there are people out there that love them and take multiples of them

[@rodpfled]

i cant seem to find the minis you used to convert in you corsair army

[@kevinvanravenswaaij4060]

Perry miniatures agincourt French army box set!

[@TrippyTheShroom]

An army I'm very much interested in, they sound like such a fun army to play albeit very glass cannon.

[@alexandersporl3]

Just stumbled over this gem. Nice summary and nice description of the army. I play corsairs for a long time, at least since 2019. I play another, i guess more rounded philosophy. Never take reavers, never take delgamar, necer take bosun. Suladan is my leader, then dependant to points Level captains with crossbows and if fits in dalamyr. Warbands of corsairs are roughly 1/3 black numenoreans, corsairs with spears and shield, arbalester. In suladans warbands next to cavalry , warriors with spear and bow. Reavers play more into some strenghts of corsairs, but you trade in some weakness, the main one you get vulnerable to hero sniping and magic. It is not hard to counter or simply threaten the bosun and therefore make the use of reavers very risky. Your battleline is killy, but cannot hold long vs an elite shieldwall. Black numenoreans can hold the line often a bit longer. You can use black numenoreans as in the way in a real shooting war, and those harad bows can counter the 24" (or 12" in moonlight/aol) game to a certain amount.

[@15mmGustavus]

I really hope you do Mordor or Isengard next

[@baronsob]

Best teaching MESBG channel

[@CapitanCorner]

Good video. Thumbs up! Some corrections. First of all of course a hero can call a heroic action in the fight phase after rolling a 1 or 2 to 5 for the thrown rider test. The model cannot make strikes after a roll of 1 or 2-5, but is still able to call heroic actions. It is clearly written in the thrown rider test. So the plan to shoot in a combat with Dalamyr and Boromir like you suggested is a really bad idea. First Dalamyr with D4 will suffer under crossbow fire with s4. Secondly Dalamyr is only f5 and 2 f behind after Borormir, if he has the Banner of MT. So it is possible that you wound Dalamyr on a 4+ and then lose the strike off and die to Boromir. Therefore I only would do that if Boromir has charged and Dalamyr has no might left and will lose the fight anyway most likely. Then you can try to safe Dalamyr by killing Boromirs horse and Boromir not rolling an 6 for thrown rider check. You mentioned that this army has no terror to force your opponent heroes to spend their will. Well you have the best terror troops in the game with black numenoreans for 9p. There is a argument not to use them and only use corsairs cause of backstabber. If you compare the profile of the black num with a corsair it is obvious that the black num is better with D6 C4 and terror. In germany in harad-umbar was dominating the tournament scene. The german champion played harad-umbar and was using 2 corsair captains with crossbow, with 8 black nums and 4 arbalesters + Suladan, 3 serpent riders, 6 haradim with spear and 9 haradrim with bow and spear.

[@lowlandswargaming1302]

Yeah you're right, this was later faq'd and updated in the new rulebook. Hard disagree on the black nums though, I will maintain my position that if you want to play black nums + suladan, just ally with mordor instead of corsairs. It's the better pairing, and you see it all the time at the top tables.

[@CapitanCorner]

@@lowlandswargaming1302 Witch King + Suladan is for sure in UK a top meta list. If you say black nums in mordor are meta the profile must be very good right? So why should the profile not be very good in corsairs of umbar. Like I said in germany the german master won with Suladan + 2 Captains with black nums and arbalesters and you see it harad + corsairs on top tables all the time. Corsairs have way better shooting than mordor. Sure Suladan + Witch King is meta. Suladan + Dalamyr or 2 Captains with crossbows and a ton of shooting is meta too. It's crazy how many models harad + corsairs can field. In harad and corsairs you don't have a shaman and only c3 troops, only c4 troops are the black nums in corsairs. So if you're playing against a witch king and your army breaks a ton of corsairs will run with c2. Black nums are usefull for base courage 4 alone. D6 is very good and terror is one of the best special rules in the game. I would go even further and say black nums are a top 3 or top 5 warrior profile in the game.

[@pWndConan]

Love your Guides and Tactics! Do you have any experience with Dwarves Factions? I love those little stubborn buggers and would be interessted in your take on them. :) Keep up the good Content! All the best at Ardacon!

[@lowlandswargaming1302]

I still want to try my hand at iron Hills at some point. But that would be a while from now I'm afraid. I can only paint so fast :)

[@danieljurek8994]

Can you do one about Mordor I just got the starter box

[@stillunsure7630]

Sharing info on how to play each faction is a great way to improve your own skills as people learn how to play vs different forces they too become better players.

[@szymonstachura3792]

Awsome videos. Thanks for Your job. ;)

[@clinchin2k862]

By any chance can you do a Mordor tactics you by far have the best videos for entry to expert level

[@lowlandswargaming1302]

Mordor is probably next! But it's a very large faction and I haven't played all the different versions of it yet. So it will take a while.

[@azazelakos95]

my friend can you make an isengard tactics video???

[@Yoyoyoyoyo2431]

What about the Hasharin? He doesn’t have the Corsair keyword but fits in very nicely with the entire list

[@grimgrauman7650]

What? Not realy. Hasharin are a bad version of dalamir. There problem is that they only have one might, in a army that needs might and does not even have it.

[@YUP3RS]

You forgot to mention the Hasharin (They can be taken as a Hero of Valour in the Corsair list)! Are they just trash or amazing?

[@lowlandswargaming1302]

Some people love them, personally I think they're a bit underwhelming. They're cool, but their single might point really holds them back.

[@lucalodi2305]

Thanks for the commitment behind this, It Is the first guide in all the web that goes so deep on tactics and tricks. You sir are the best around and if possibile i would gladly donate something.

[@lowlandswargaming1302]

We're not in this for the money Luca, but your words mean the world to us! - Kevin

[@soul_vicex]

how do you voluntarily fail a courage test?

[@kevinvanravenswaaij4060]

Normally you can't, but it is stated in the Reaver's special rule that they can for this particular rule.

[@soul_vicex]

@@kevinvanravenswaaij4060 Oh i see! thanks for clearing that up

[@robfletcher6881]

Hi there, I am now loving The Corsairs, had my first battle with them, against the Gondoliers, but I am not sure I am playing the Mindless Killer rule correctly. I have Bo'suns, so if they are within 6" of these guys then I can basically chose if they go on a rampage or not - is that right? Does the rampage remain in play from turn to turn? - or am I checking at the start of each of my turns if I want them to be in a rampage or not? There doesn't seem to be much of a downside. I feel like i am missing something, can you advice? Thanks

[@lowlandswargaming1302]

Yes there pretty much is 0 downside when they're close to a Bo'sun, you're not missing something. They are really strong. It is checked every turn at the start of that reaver's movement. And within 6 of bosun you can still voluntarily rage

[@spqrnemesis2801]

Theese Videos are really really good! To cover armys you have too little experiance with you could interview players that used them successfully in tournaments or do collaborations. I really appreciate the comitment to speak from experience.

[@miguelcasado9755]

Great stuff Kevin

[@Reagusmage]

Question - Is it worth putting Shields on Warriors w Spears, in a Corsair army?

[@kevinvanravenswaaij4060]

I answer this question multiple times in the video :)

[@nehrigen]

Reavers are terrible because of their rule. It doesn't say "closest enemy model they can charge" it says "closest enemy model", which means they will go berserk on your own guys if the enemy is closest but can't be charged (which isn't hard to do). The rule desperately needs a rewrite.

[@kevinvanravenswaaij4060]

Interesting. No-one here plays it like that, but I guess rules as written you are correct.

[@kevinvanravenswaaij4060]

Even if played that way they would still be really good. If a Bo'sun is nearby it's a non-issue, though you do miss out on the bonus.

[@kevinvanravenswaaij4060]

Actually, on second thought: "If the test is failed, they will be driven into a bloodthirsty rampage, and will charge the nearest enemy model." "If a reaver fails this courage test, and it is not possible for it to charge an enemy model, it will charge the nearest friendly model instead" It mentions an enemy model in the second paragraph, not the nearest enemy model. So I'd say you only have to charge a friendly if there is no chargeable enemy model at all, not just the nearest one.

[@muesliman100]

​@@kevinvanravenswaaij4060 I think you can read "closest enemy" as the enemy that has the shortest charge path. Like shortest path on foot, not as the nazgul flies

[@kevinvanravenswaaij4060]

I've played it as nearest reachable enemy, even if the path is a bit longer. But if it is out of reach or unable to get there, then the next nearest enemy is selected

[@ianwhitehouse3064]

Really good insight. Is there any way to make the Betrayer work instead of Suladan? Was thinking with some poisoned archers...Would probably mean bringing black Numenoreans then i guess...

[@lowlandswargaming1302]

The betrayer can be a great hero, but not in a corsair-focused list. He's a great take when you have lots of poisoned bow in a pure Serpent horde (or serpent+far harad) list.

[@arashh23]

Hey Kevin, you mentioned if an enemy heroe is dismounted in combat and doesn't roll a 6 for thrown rider, they cannot declare a heroic action such as Heroic Defence? In the rules manual, it says they can do nothing else for that turn but doesnt explicitly mention heroic actions?

[@lowlandswargaming1302]

Yeah this has been faq's and changed since then. Heroes can still declare heroic actions on ANY result on the thrown rider chart now.

[@MrMintyfreshsmell]

How many models should i have at 500 and 800 point list

[@lowlandswargaming1302]

There isn't really a specific target to hit. You should focus on numbers over heroes, and then the list practically builds itself. If you include suladan and some riders you will have slightly lower numbers than if you go pure corsairs. Try to hit (close to) a third arbalesters, include some reavers with a Bo'sun, and fill up the rest as points and warband slots allow