Could Denmark’s labour market model unlock European competitiveness? | The Big Question

[@TheKyosanim62]

This is part of the reason why Denmark is so insanely rich. An exceptional, free education system (incl. university level) provides world-class skills, which have built companies like Novo Nordisk, Lundbeck, LEO Pharma, Maersk, LEGO, etc. It is VERY difficult to copy this societal model, however, because it requires the very highest level of trust between people and the government. And that is not something easily attained.

[@TainDK]

+ the stated companies do not try to pay 0,- in tax - they are part of Denmark. Unlike Nestle or McD who try to circumvent any and all taxes to pay as close to 0,- in taxes as they can... Our companies understand that by paying taxes they also gain a workforce as stated in this video...

[@Kim-lc3fv]

Unions are big in DK. Even professors are unionised.

[@kevinu.k.7042]

We have some organisations run like this in the UK. However the standard MBA management qualification in the UK draws heavily on the American right wing management models, where workers are seen as wanting to do the least work for the most pay and people are reduced to a set of skill specifications where teams and the other things a worker brings to the workplace are counted for nought.

[@jebbo-c1l]

It wont work if a country doesnt have strong labour unions and labour union protections

[@djahman8501]

Denmark is one of the worlds least corrupt countries, if not nr. 1, that is why this model works, among other things aswell ofcourse. Unions is another factor in this. Furthermore Danes learn from an early age to ''groupwork'' in school, so the whole mentaly aspect of this is ''learned'' in school, highschool etc. In Denmark we have an expression --> ''to lift as a group'', that sums it up pretty well. Also Denmark ranks high on the global ''Trustworthy'' list - #4, which also has its downsides if you have a ''blue eyed'' approach to things😉But most importantly Denmark ranks #2 on the 'Happiest country in the world' list, just after Finland, a shoutout to my Finnish friends😄So I would argue that a country/society like this is worth aiming for✌

[@parmentier7457]

I think the Netherlands has a similar economic philosophy as Denmark. Only the unions do not play such a big role in the Netherlands. Only 10% of the Dutch workers are members of a union.

[@cmk353]

The DraghiReport has mostly been ignored

[@rustix3]

Can you provide exact numbers regarding easy hire and fire? What is the minimum period that employer and employee have to consider when firing/quitting? Is there a probation period for new employees and how long is that? Can employee be fired at short notice? How long in general does it takes on average to start working, if counting from the day of start of looking for a job actively?

[@johannesbachlarsen4384]

Most positions I know of have probation periods of 1,2 or 3 months. I have heard that a reason must be given if the employee is terminated after the probation, but I have no idea how strict this is. When leaving a company you usually have 1 month.

[@Argondo]

​@@johannesbachlarsen4384 yeah that is about right. Probation is usually 3 months (paid of cause) after 3 months it is usually 1 month, before you are out. Most employees have A-kasse (unemployment welfare) if not all have it. That covers 60% or so, of your last paycheck level. For a max of 2 years. And most have found a new job way before that. Unemployment depends on your job type or education. I work as a steel fabricator and we have had a lack of workers for a few years now. It is slowly getting down to normal due to recession but generally i should be able to find new work within a month if i wanted to change jobs. Though i like the place i work at and have been there for like 8 years now .. I have never been unwillingly unemployed for more then like 2 days in my 35 year life...

[@antoniochen6866]

Please do not hurt me, weak & alone am me. I need you.

[@Kakker71]

Are you ok?

[@oceanwave4502]

How can Germans' 4-day workweek compete with China's 996? 🤔

[@sedecim]

The unions have become weak in Denmark and many people don't often become members of a union. And the public system is also reducing benefits and more Danes are choosing private health care.

[@Julleisa]

And still over 70% of danes are member of an union, and that's why it works.

[@poulbghlassen7679]

In 2023 private health care in Denmark was only 2,6% of total health care cost. 97,4% is still public health care (source: Danmarks Statistik)

[@stopnd]

Easy fire makes easy hire. Else employers become too cautious and slow hiring. This especially harms young and older workers. Changing economy means flexibility of employment - once a project if finished, why keeping someone employed? While other parts of the economy might need the worker desperately. But it is important to force employers to reply to all job applications within a short time period, so job seekers do not wait in vain, and can immediately switch to a new search!

[@TainDK]

Tbh - job seekers should immediately switch to a new search regardless of response time - many applications around, might land you a better job than the first one you are waiting for a reply from...

[@AdrianUrsu-x4c]

Unfortunately there are a lot of employers that do no have collective agreements. As Danmark does not have a minimum wage, there are a lot of people working for a low wage, legally, as the employer does not have a collective agreement, and in this case, unions are kind of powerless.

[@JanBruunAndersen]

No, workers unions are not kind of powerless as long as it is possible to instigate sympathy strikes. Imagine a bakery that refuses to sign a collective bargaining agreement with its employees. The employees asks the local unions for help, and the next day lorry drivers refuses to deliver flour and other ingredients to the bakery. How long do you think the bakery owner will hold out?

[@AdrianUrsu-x4c]

@JanBruunAndersen you are right, but I also know a lot of small companies that do not have collective agreements, think about all the farmers, all the sole proprietorship ( enkeltmandsvirksomhed) th Unions do not have the power to reach all of them, so we are talking about hundreds of thousands of employers that are not into a collective agreement and.

[@kasperchristiansen4234]

One problem with Denmark is the public sector is simply too big and occupies too many highly educated people who could provide better use to the private sector.

[@TainDK]

Like?

[@MrBandholm]

Det stemmer bare dårligt overens med den økonomiske udvikling vi har set i DK de sidste mange år.

[@anotherelvis]

The government has interfered on several occasions. Lately they wanted to regulate the salary of nurses.

[@JanBruunAndersen]

Who employed these nurses? The government?

[@TainDK]

@@JanBruunAndersen nope - the regions do... Part of our governance sure, but not the government as in those at Christiansborg - who where the once interfering... Very un-danish like...

[@JanBruunAndersen]

@@TainDK - quote from a publication titled "Generelle tilskud til regionerne 2024" by Indenrigs- og Sundhedsministeriet: - "Omkring 83 pct. af regionernes udgifter på sundhedsområdet finansieres ved et bloktil- skud fra staten. Dertil kommer en kommunal aktivitetsafhængig medfinansiering, som udgør ca. 15 pct. af regionernes finansiering. Den statslige aktivitetsafhængige pulje ud- gør ca. 1 pct. af finansieringen." As long as Regionerne receives 83 % of their funding from the central government, then I think it is entirely fair that the same central government have some influence on how that money is spent.

[@jakob520]

Denmark's labor market might have its strengths, but being a man in Denmark can feel challenging. The system often seems tailored to benefit women, particularly in areas like middle management and HR, where they are strongly represented. (but nobody really talks about it). And we have a huge segment of sick people, which the working class have to finance.

[@iwiffitthitotonacc4673]

Of course we help those who are sick, that's what makes us human and thus why our country Denmark is great. We're not eugenicist barbarians.

[@Finkeldinken]

Is our segment of sick people bigger than in other western countries, I wonder? I do find it interesting what you say about the system being tailored to benefit women. I am sure it is in some areas, to compensate to the professional time hit we tend to take for pregnancy, a bit lower pay in general, but do you think it might be quite field dependent too? Also, it does seem like the vast majority of upper management and highest earners are still men, that has to count a bit against your experience of the whole thing being tailored for the benefit of women. The men I know have never had the issue you write about, but I understand that maybe it is field dependent, and as such I just haven't met anyone in your situation.

[@MrBandholm]

Antallet af langtidssyge i DK er ikke uden for normalen, der er blot mere fokus på dem.

[@maverickhanecak1682]

Skipper hates Denmark

[@TheKyosanim62]

Who cares? LOL

[@maverickhanecak1682]

Skipper does, @

[@MohamadSahrij-m5p]

Horror ideas in Society (Europe and the all west) (The mime .. On a late night at a lonely train station🤔

[@programming658]

Please don't try to model something from Nordic countries. Nordic model requires higher, super high taxes 50%+ (indirectly+directly together). No country in Europe wants to replicate that part of the Nordic model so anything you model from Nordic countries will not ever work if you don't take tax model as well

[@augustuswarglewinkle6328]

Why do people focus so much on the tax %? It's meaningless to discuss if you don't also take into account salary levels. I'd rather pay 50% of 40k than 30% of 15k.

[@askeskipper3783]

most of us are quite satisfied with that, compared to the alternatives

[@user-pt1ow8hx5l]

Sure. But people in the US pay comparable amounts. On top of taxes they have to pocket out for health care, private, schooling of children, college and university education and,.... the list goes on,..... The point here is that the labour market in France, especially, haven't been reformed. ITs very expensive to fire people. And the retirement age is 61. Work is seen as a plague to be endured,..... Imagine being stucked and stifled in a somewhat dysfunctional company with little in the way of job satisfaction,... whilst being on a decent salary, too good to let go of...

[@ronnie5329]

Just look at healthcare as extra tax, then you get close to the tax rate of 38% which is paid on first 100k usd here

[@JanBruunAndersen]

The tax rates does not really matter. What matters is how much spendable money you have left each month after you have paid your reoccurring bills. Of course, in a less taxed society you do have more freedom, like the freedom to gamble with your life by choosing not to have a comprehensive health insurance policy.