Craft Your Own High-End Horn Speaker with the HORN one Module

[@thomasschafer7268]

😮😮ob nur eine 6db weiche sehr dienlich ist stelle ich mal in Frage. Sicher nicht wenn man sehr tief trennen möchte! 👍🇩🇪

[@shinjitsuaudio]

Dies hängt vom ausgewählten Treiber ab. Weitere steilere Pisten sind auf Anfrage möglich.

[@quartzwatching]

This is a really neat idea - congratulations :-) But, adding a horn to a speaker does not make it a hornspeaker, but a speaker with a horn - the hornspeaker is normally considered horn all the way. When that is said, you still reap the dynamic range and low distortion in the upper midrange and treble - nice!

[@shinjitsuaudio]

Good point! Are the Avante Garde speakers horns then? According to EnjoyTheMusic.com "In the mid to late 1990s, I heard a pair of Avantgarde Acoustic horn loudspeakers (hornspeaker) for the first time ". and..." These hornspeakers' 107dB/W/m sensitivity is typical for horn speaker design and engineering.". Avantgarde speakers often use powered dynamic woofers or subwoofers for the bass frequencies. These woofers are integrated into the speaker system but are not horn-loaded. The woofers provide the necessary low-frequency extension and impact that would be challenging to achieve with a horn, especially in a compact form.

[@peterlundskow4061]

Thanks, very much, very interesting!

[@shinjitsuaudio]

Glad you liked it!

[@lekmannen9990]

I´m not an expert and could be wrong but if that´s the case please explain how you solve these problems. With a crossover point at 4k hz how do you deal with say a 10" woofer that starts to beam at 1.35k hz or lower? I can´t see how to avoid massive comb filtering in the vertical of axis with that setup, especially with 1st order filters. You should get away with a 4" woofer mounted as close as possible to the horn but a bigger woofer or greater distance between the woofer and the horn will introduce problems with a crossover point that high. You will probably also need a baffle step loss compensation circuit if you are gonna let a woofer play up that high.

[@shinjitsuaudio]

Thanks for your response, and we appreciate your attention to detail! In our video, we do mention that the HORN one can indeed be paired with a 10-inch driver; however, it’s crucial to lower the crossover frequency to avoid issues like beaming and comb filtering. Addressing Beaming: Using a 10-inch woofer can cause beaming at around 1.35 kHz or lower, which is why we recommend adjusting the crossover point appropriately. In the Horn One, while the crossover is nominally set at 4k Hz, its acoustic roll-off starts closer to 2k Hz, which helps align the woofer and horn’s dispersion characteristics. For 10-inch woofers, we suggest using a larger capacitor, such as a 10 µF, to lower the crossover frequency effectively. This adjustment helps maintain smooth off-axis response and minimizes beaming. Also a 2nd order filter or higher on the woofer will help mitigate beaming as well. Here is the formula for a 2nd order crossover at 2K low pass: A 1 mH coil with a 7 μF capacitor in parallel. These values align well with standard Butterworth configurations, providing a smooth transition and between the woofer and the horn driver. This setup is effective for managing the crossover point at 2 kHz while balancing the system’s overall acoustic performance. Power and Protection: The HORN one’s high power handling, paired with an adjustable L-pad that attenuates the signal ensures that the horn is protected from low-frequency damage even when crossing over at lower frequencies. This setup keeps the horn operating safely within its limits while allowing it to pair effectively with larger woofers. Baffle Step Compensation: Additionally, if the woofer is allowed to play higher frequencies, we recommend and incorporate baffle step compensation circuits to ensure balanced sound across the listening area, addressing the natural output loss due to baffle step. Expanded Options: For those looking for even greater flexibility, the Horn Two, featuring a 12-inch wide horn capable of crossing over as low as 800 Hz, will be available tomorrow. This model is ideal for integrating with larger woofers like 10-inch drivers, providing enhanced versatility and performance. Thank you again for your engagement, and please feel free to reach out with any more questions or specific requirements. We’re here to help optimize your audio setup!

[@peterlundskow4061]

I found the Horn 2 on your website but not the Horn 1, am I missing it somewhere?

[@shinjitsuaudio]

Its coming my friend. Just finished the photos yesterday.

[@peterlundskow4061]

Coming, right?

[@shinjitsuaudio]

I'm just sorting the photos and the options. I will post it tonight. Thank you checking back.

[@bartvanransbeeck1341]

Faital pro horn is it LTH 102?

[@shinjitsuaudio]

On the HORN one is is the FaitalPro STH100 an the HORN two its the FaitalPro LTH102.

[@59seank]

Price?

[@shinjitsuaudio]

The listing will be on our site today if all goes well with the art director. The price is < 1K in standard configuration. Add such as various compression drivers we recommend, boutique parts etc. are a bit more if ordered. external jumpers.

[@jamesmansion2572]

I have a question about the standalone horn products - do you have any waterfall and off-axis measurements? In particular in relation to the Horn 2, if it can reasonably cross at 1kHz. I have some Satori WO24P drivers that have a slight resonance at about 1100 and will beam shortly thereafter (about 1300 or so, depending on how much you allow). I do have some moderately horn-loaded Wavecor tweeters that I thought I might chance it with, but this product looks interesting if I can put -6dB right on 1k - which I'd think pushing it with that rather nice Beyma ribbon which I can get in Europe. The crossover will be active at least in the first instance, though I'd probably look at retaining an LPAD to avoid too much unmatched digital attenuation. The Satori impedance is remarkably flat around 1k so I might get away without a correction if I go analogue after some digital playtime. I'll not be looking for 1st order, and will definitely need to notch out the woofer cone breakup even at 2nd order LR. Supplementary question: how much to ship to UK? Also, note that Horn 2 text starts: 'Introducing the Horn 1' and there's a bit more design-related info (including the 'Design' section, suggesting even 1.5k xo) on the Horn 1 page. Could you correct and align please? Nice vids you are doing. Will you be looking at the MA 20cm - it seems to have a weird resonance. I do wish they didn't claim 20kHz for these things though, your beaming vid is spot on.

[@shinjitsuaudio]

Thank you for your thoughtful questions and for your interest in our Horn 1 and Horn 2 products. Let me address each of your points: Waterfall and Off-Axis Measurements: We appreciate the importance of these measurements for fine-tuning and optimizing your setup. While we haven’t published waterfall or off-axis measurements specifically for the Horn 2 yet, we are in the process of collecting comprehensive data, including these metrics, to better assist our customers. We understand the significance of these measurements, particularly when dealing with crossover points and potential resonances. By the way the Horn 2 is being redesigned as the HORN two with the FaitalPro LTH 102 tractrix horn and the Beyma CD171 FE/PK compression driver. Crossover at 1kHz: The Horn 2 is designed to be flexible, but crossing it at 1 kHz with a compression driver might be challenging. While compression drivers typically perform best with crossover points slightly higher than 1 kHz, around 1.5 kHz or above, this ensures optimal performance and avoids stressing the driver. Given your Satori WO24P drivers, with their slight resonance around 1100 Hz and the beaming that begins around 1300 Hz, a crossover point near 1 kHz could indeed be tricky. If you intend to push the crossover lower, the best approach would be to utilize a steep slope, possibly a 2nd order or higher, to minimize the load on the compression driver and manage the woofer's resonance effectively. Active Crossover and LPAD: An active crossover setup, as you're planning, will provide you with the flexibility needed to experiment with different crossover points and slopes. Retaining an LPAD to fine-tune the attenuation is a good idea, especially to avoid excessive digital attenuation, which can impact sound quality. The Satori’s flat impedance around 1 kHz should indeed give you more freedom in your crossover design, though as you mentioned, notching out the woofer cone breakup will be crucial. Shipping to the UK: We do offer international shipping, including to the UK. The shipping cost will depend on the specific product, its weight, and the shipping method chosen. I’d recommend reaching out directly through our website or customer service for a precise shipping quote to the UK, including any applicable taxes or customs duties. Product Page Alignment and Corrections: Thank you for pointing out the text discrepancy between the HORN one and Horn 2 product pages. We’ll make sure to correct and align the information, including updating the introduction text and ensuring the design details are consistent across both pages. Your feedback is invaluable in helping us maintain clarity and accuracy in our product descriptions. Future Reviews - MA 20cm: We’re glad you enjoyed the videos! The MA 20cm is indeed on our radar, especially considering the resonance you mentioned. The beaming behavior in drivers claiming extended high-frequency responses is something we aim to address in future content, as it’s a crucial aspect of accurate sound reproduction. Stay tuned for more detailed reviews and measurements. Please note that while we offer standalone compression drivers with the Horn modules, we do not currently offer ribbon drivers. If you’re interested in compression drivers, we can certainly help you find the right match for your setup. If you have any further questions or need more specific information, feel free to reach out. We’re here to help you achieve the best possible setup with our products.

[@MARVELOUDIO]

You need measurements to make it work correctly!

[@shinjitsuaudio]

Thanks for your feedback! You're absolutely right-accurate measurements are key to getting the best performance. For optimal results with the Horn 1 module, we recommend using Room EQ Wizard (REW) software and a measurement microphone like the MiniDSP UMIK-1 or Dayton Audio iMM-6. Start by measuring at 1 meter from the horn mouth to get a clear understanding of the module's output, and then take additional measurements at your seated listening position. This will allow you to adjust the crossover and sensitivity via the integrated L-pad and the included capacitor value to fine-tune the crossover point, achieving the precise response you desire. If you don't have the tools to measure, generally, woofers that are 8 ohms and less than 10 inches wide will be suitable for pairing with the Horn 1 module. The sensitivity of the HORN one can be adjusted according to the woofer’s posted response curves available on the manufacturer's site. Simply check the bass driver’s specs for its sensitivity, which is usually listed as SPL (Sound Pressure Level) in dB, measured at 1 watt/1 meter (e.g., 90dB @ 1W/1m). Match the posted value of the bass driver to the included chart to achieve seamless integration of highs and lows. We also provide a chart that indicates the values of resistors and capacitors needed to achieve a proper match to your bass driver. We're happy to suggest woofers that are a good match for your setup as well. If you need any assistance with the setup or interpreting the measurements, we’re here to help!