DOOMGUY CANT JUMP: How Simplicity Leads to Strategy

[@my_cellium]

Sorry for the audio or awkward voice, this is my first time making a video essay and I was experimenting with different approaches to voice over.

[@my_cellium]

Oh and the reason why Doom has no jumping... I have no idea. There are tweets from John Romero saying that it was an intentional restriction but nothing more than that (Doom's engine supported jumping, you get launched in the air by Arch-Vile attacks). There is a video of John Carmack and Romero talking to each other (The 30th anniversary stream) where Carmack says that "if something didn't feel solid I didn't want to do it."

[@Novastar.SaberCombat]

30+ years of experience in production here (acting, directing, sound design, V.O., etc.). If you need some help, contact me. And as a matter of note, I actually designed and uploaded two entire D1 episodes ("Darkhell" & "Blakhell"--18 maps) back in 1996. This was when editing tools were rudimentary and cryptic to say the least. 💪😎✌️ Cheers.

[@purple781]

the only problem is that i can't enable "stable volume" on the video so it's super quiet, very great video anyways

[@Ails1234]

@@purple781 Stable volume was enabled by default here (maybe it takes a couple extra hours to process it), and it sounded great

[@merrittk7403]

@@my_cellium I think part of the reason is that doom movement is super sensitive. You stop and start so fast, and you have so little air control, that jumping would always be awkward, and you would always run the risk of launching off edges. Voiceover sounds fine, btw.

[@hi-i-am-atan]

a particular detail about doom's movement that's worth emphasizing is that doomguy is _really fast,_ but not particularly _agile._ he takes quite a while to reach full speed from a standstill, but even a light tap in a direction can leave him sliding for a noticeable chunk of a second afterwards. there's an unmistakable heaviness to his movement, which means switching the directionality of a circlestrafe or stopping yourself from running directly into a missed projectile takes _significant_ commitment that can leave you vulnerable, while on the flipside micrododging can't be done as late as streaming in a danmaku game because doomguy just ain't fast enough from a standstill to move out of the way of a fireball right in front of his face all of this together means moving him around a fight is much more like navigating a _truck_ around an obstacle course, because you have to plan around your current momentum and where it wants to take doomguy and how much time you have to gain or lose speed and pay attention to not only what dangers are currently flying towards you ( or you towards them, more than infrequently ), but also foresee what could potentially _become_ and additional danger and how you'll have to accommodate for it. and just like with driving, all these complex considerations vying for your attention become something you do more from feel than thought as you acclimate to the slippery bastard you're piloting, freeing up that part of your brain to organize everything _else_ going on in a complex fight

[@my_cellium]

Managing attention is very important for more chaotic fights I agree. Its very important when the mapmaker puts in spectres into a rocket launcher fight. Ouch.

[@danielsmokesmids]

and the best part is, when you’re playing, your brain just automatically does that. it doesn’t have to think about this complicated paragraph to do it. it’s amazing

[@audiosurfarchive]

The movement is heavy for sure, but once you get used to it you'll be tapping those WASD keys to hammer a particular combination for every imaginable angle, approach and intensity.

[@Tony-nt5zd]

This is one of the things that unironically makes me say classic Doom is a better model for designing a mech shooter than more modern titles. Between the apparent weight and momentum of your character, the aim tracking that resembles those lock-on mechanics mechs often come with, having to navigate paths that aren't intuitive unless you learn the unique limitations of your character and how to adapt to them, and priority being on using the right tools in your arsenal to target the right threats, using Doom's model with some limited exploitation of more modern game design creates something that feels like OG Hawken.

[@hhbi]

@@Tony-nt5zd O! I'm already making a mech shooter and I was thinking about either keeping influence of weight on my character or making it completely agile so mech easily dodge almost everything everywhere I made it in two possible option: fast aggressive movement but takes some time to stop or very slow precisive movement

[@michaelsteiner5203]

I am a newcomer to classic Doom WADs with the new Nightdive release. This is exactly the sort of game theory video I've been looking for.

[@UltimatePerfection]

Do yourself a favor and get GZDoom to play them. Some of the WADs are made specifically for GZDoom or ZDoom (such as the famous MyHouse) and will crash or be glitchy in other source ports, including the Nightdive one. On the other hand, it's rare to find a WAD that is NOT compatible with GZDoom and any such incompatibilities are usually resolved within a version or two.

[@josephunderwood1875]

if you want to truly experience what the video describes, strategic FPS combat puzzle gameplay, get ahold of DSDA Doom and WADs like Sunlust, Ancient Aliens, and Simulacrum

[@roadkill_52]

@@UltimatePerfection lol GZDoom sucks... get DSDA or Crispy if you want to try the high level wads in this video

[@UltimatePerfection]

@@roadkill_52 Those wads work in GZDoom with no issues. I know because I played them.

[@harrylane4]

@@roadkill_52 “the source port that plays these wads at 120fps no issues is better than the other source port that plays these wads at 120fps no issues” listen to yourself

[@yurifairy2969]

Wish you went into the regular shotgun more, I think it's one of the most fascinating examples of Doom's weapon balance because even with the super shotgun it still has its use cases. Clearing out chaff, enemies from mid range, enemies on ledges, etc.

[@my_cellium]

Sometimes I really do miss the regular shotgun when pistol starting

[@nineonine9082]

Actually making a mod that makes the standard shotgun a rare weapon, so when you get it, you gonna be happy you can finally hit stuff at mid range effectively.

[@yurifairy2969]

@@nineonine9082 no more repeatedly tapping the chaingun is a good reward lol

[@mjc0961]

My favorite strategy for the shotgun is to switch to it from the Super Shotgun against Imps to save on shells, then the Imps take 2 or sometimes 3 shells each to kill, so I wasted my time and should have stuck with the Super Shotgun. 😅

[@joshjames582]

I use it often against imps and former humans on ledges, especially far away. That or the Chaingun in short bursts. Both seem to work pretty well for that function.

[@GangsterFrankensteinComputer]

Doomguy don't jump, but he does run full speed off a ledge to clear a gap fairly often.

[@my_cellium]

doomguy when he falls off an edge: "unf"

[@GangsterFrankensteinComputer]

@@my_cellium Good video man, please make more stuff like this.

[@comet-fy6pd]

the sunlust archvile carousel really left a lasting impression on the community

[@Headaches_hurt]

next video is probably gonna be titled something like "QUAKE RANGER CAN JUMP"

[@my_cellium]

Quake guy: "HUH"

[@Headaches_hurt]

@@my_cellium *insert trent reznor grunting sound effects*

[@denifnaf5874]

@@my_cellium quake dude can't crouch

[@FLYNN_TAGGART]

"METROID CAN'T CRAWL"

[@shiadyne]

This video inspired me to play DOOM II with GZDOOM jump and keeping my weapons through levels. Thanks!

[@my_cellium]

LOL

[@nonamednn]

with texture filtering

[@nightfightsday]

@@nonamednn gross

[@peabrain6872]

? You keep your weapons every time

[@my_cellium]

@@peabrain6872 It's a playstyle doomwiki.org/wiki/Pistol_start

[@yungbushwookie6832]

Very well organized video. I love the new Doom games, but I'll always come back to classic Doom because there's a very different dynamic going on there compared to other shooters. Spatial management and crowd control vs raw reflexes and weapon combos. No other games really offer the experience of the former. There's something very special about weaving between Cyberdemon rockets to 2-shot it with the BFG or dodging Revenant missiles in a tight corridor.

[@my_cellium]

Exacto-fucking-lutely

[@H00DEDCR0W]

this game is a good reminder that complexity is not the same thing as depth also 5:28 is some spicy dodging, especially that moment backpedalling at 5:37

[@Bob_Beaky]

Excellent video. Don't worry so much about your audio quality. You were clear and conveyed very well some really interesting points. I really liked your thumbnail, too!

[@my_cellium]

The shitty audio was to make the video more down to earth ;) JK

[@coincident]

What a great video. A solid explanation of how Doom's brilliance is due to it's simplicity, and not in spite of it.

[@FrMZTsarmiral]

What an amazing video. You hit the nail in the head regarding how "less is more" Doom is. I feel that too many games since the 7th console gen focus on complex AI rather than simple AI that can lead to more clear and deliberate scenarios. Doom and RE4 are one of my favorite examples of this. Specially regarding enemy behavior compared to Doom 2016 since in that game it feels like you gotta run at all times cuz otherwise you will get hit by a borderline unpredictable projectile rather than moving strategically and with a clear purpose, even if at simple glance one appears to be "faster" it leads to less nuance.

[@Snufflegrunt]

This is why I *borderline* don't consider Doom an FPS, but more of a first person real time puzzle game. I've been trying to explain this stuff to non-Doomers for decades. So many think it's just some really simplistic FPS with autoaim.

[@formbi]

you don't have to have autoaim, you can use vertical mouselook in GZDoom instead

[@TheElectricUnderground]

Excellent vid! I agree with your analysis that limitations (when properly balanced) create depth rather than preventing it.

[@bentybursky858]

Couldn't have said it better myself. I've always looked at doom as real time chess. It's not so much about learning the pieces, but what move is best to make now and how that will effect you 59 moves later.

[@pechudin9086]

Ehh not really. Doomguy's speed and general slowness of the monsters allows you to quickly get out of trouble in all but the most devilish mapsets.

[@HotPocketHPE]

Very very good video, covers almost all the same conclusions I've reached myself. I would add that Doom's simplified mapping lets people churn out unique scenarios that actually capitalizes on the possibility space of the game's mechanics, an advantage almost no other game has.

[@homerhat420]

This is a great video explanation of why pistol start UV is a great way of playing the game.

[@nightfightsday]

it's really not....fuck pistols starts, I like to actually enjoy the game

[@Chasodey]

It's good in doses. Sometimes you want it, sometimes not

[@purebaldness]

​@@nightfightsdayI hope you don't insist on playing everything on UV

[@ComradeCommissar17]

​@@nightfightsday git gud

[@HydraKittten]

A few things 1. I liken Doom's way of strategizing to Hotline Miami, planning who to take on first and how 2. while projectile enemies dont infight with their own type, hitscan enemies make no distinction for what enemy types hit them (besides a few outliers), and will attack their own if they get hit with a stray bullet. that being said, Pinky's have no projectile or hitscan attacks, they have to be close to you to attack, this is useful as they often get hit by enemies trying to get you, this makes them very useful for setting up infighting 3. the chainsaw is very niche, typically reserved for when its you and a enemy thats a bulletsponge and has a mid to high flinch chance, allowing you to take them out a lot easier Overall, Great video, I look forward to seeing more from you

[@my_cellium]

The first time I saw the chainsaw was actually useful and better than the berserk fist was in sigil where there was very little ammo but a lot of cacodemons.

[@HydraKittten]

@@my_cellium You can usually herd caco's into a row if theres a hall or something where they are, thats where the chainsaw really shines

[@launched_]

Top tier video, I agree with every single thing you said. While I liked Eternal, I am _really_ looking forward to play The Dark Ages for the presumably much more methodical player movement.

[@my_cellium]

There's a very good Errant Signal video on Doom 2016 where he talks about how it evolved/remixed the original Doom formula. The thing is, he brings up the exact same points about how Doom 2016 is more like a movement scramble (He also cites the same blog post comparing Doom to Robotron) but says that its an evolution of the formula. Funny how people can have entirely different conclusions on the same thing.

[@trenth3492]

I’ve seen only a few videos (outside of the main doom sphere) that so perfectly capture why doom is so great. I loved every second of this video and I hope you make more!

[@elfera8133]

Even though DOOM is a product of its time, it has been proven timeless by the community taking what simple mechanics it had and creating something different. It boggles my mind how these creators get these ideas. The Given is by far the most far removed from the bullet hell idea, but the puzzle solving and emphasis on movement without enemies is something to truly behold.

[@wymanrtaylor]

Great vid. Also, for any console players, the recent re-release includes every official classic Doom game plus access to a metric ton of community maps and mods created over the last 30 years (including classics shown in this video like “Sunlust”). From what I understand, literally anything can be uploaded there now, so console players will have access to almost everything that PC players have been able to enjoy. So there’s no excuse not to play classic Doom anymore and I strongly encourage everyone to play. The game truly is timeless

[@jpa3974]

Good video, man. I've had enough of trying to explain to players unfamiliar with Doom's mechanics why the game is so complex, despite having such simple foundations. I think this video covers all the most important points, from now on I'll just pass on the link to this video in future discussions. It's also worth noting that Doom 2, in particular, is an excellent example of “emergent gameplay”, something that video game players usually associate with silly things and sandboxes because of a video by an influential youtuber who thinks that “emergent gameplay” is when an ostrich fights a soldier in one of Ubisoft's soulless open worlds, and not when really complex situations arise from the interaction of super simple rules. In this sense, Doom is more like the famous board game “Go”, where extremely simple rules that you can learn in two minutes generate increasingly complex situations that require complex analysis on the part of the player. Finally, in my opinion, the only series that really explores these same elements of classic Doom and is still active is Serious Sam. It's basically the last bastion, since Doom 2016 began to take action FPSs in a new direction, a direction that despite being apparently more complex, in practice can be much shallower. Serious Sam, however, is generally seen by players (including players familiar with Doom) as a shallow game.

[@my_cellium]

I gotta check out Serious Sam. I've always avoided it because I thought that it was a silly retro-revival shooter from the 00's but a ton of Doom players really like it so there definitely seems to be something good about it.

[@my_cellium]

Oh yeah additionally, I wish immersive sims/games with emergent gameplay were harder. It's hard for me to replay Deus Ex these days because my mind is so geared towards optimizing the fun out of a game and I just upgrade the pistol immediately and pop heads the entire game. If you ever have the time, check out the game Ctrl+Alt+Ego. Not only is it an inventive and cute puzzle game, but on the hardest difficulty, its REALLY hard and makes you do the most of your tools. You have to be really inventive and resourceful to get past some encounters.

[@Chasodey]

Serious Sam is a very good example of creating gameplay system​ that is suited for combat puzzles. Fight spaces are rarely set up for vertical play (unless that's the gimmick or a deliberate choice) and enemy roster makes the player dance a lot. And speaking of sound design of Serious Sam... AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA @@my_cellium

[@HamidKarzai]

the serious sam games have always had a lot of potential but they're just not designed tightly enough, they're not very balanced, the level design is not as thoughtful as it could have been. stil good though, and the moments where everything comes together and works well, it works *really* well, lots of great fun memorable encounters but surrounded in a mire of filler

[@Chasodey]

@@HamidKarzai It may be a hot take for some people but SS4 + Siberian addon have the best combat in the series. And I'm not sure for others but imo they handled dual-wielding rather interesting from balance perspective like how it helps weaker arms like pistol to be more effective later into the game and how dual miniguns aren't the best weapon for every moment of the game due to massive spread.

[@vampirecount3880]

I've never played the original Doom games (or any modern Doom games) once in my life, but I love watching videos about this game. There's something artistic about the sprites, maps, and game design that has aged like a fine wine where other, more modern games haven't aged as well.

[@azheetmidraws5889]

A lotta games feel like you vs. the computer, but doom does the rare thing of feeling like you vs. whoever the wad creator is

[@TehNoobiness]

Something that's deeply interesting to me about Doom's development (and Quake's, too!) is that, as far as I know, the level designers at iD learned everything they know about level design from doing dungeons for D&D campaigns, and you can see a lot of that in the way that levels are laid out. There's plenty of looping back on earlier parts of the level, sure, but there's also things like monster closets that suggest a very "and then monsters ambush you!" kind of approach to how the level's laid out. In that context, it makes a lot of sense that Doom is mainly a game about target prioritization; that's where a lot of the strategy for a fighter or rogue would come from in an encounter deep within a dungeon.

[@Emperor_SPOON]

Very well made video essay. As a Doom mapper, there are many of the concepts presented in the video that are simply subconscious when planning and designing the levels. The mechanics in the game can be so nuanced that strategies to encounters can drastically change from how you planned them to when the encounter is created in the level editor. I've had plenty of those instances where I design a fight in a map, playtest it, and think "Wow, this turned out WAY different from what I was planning." and a lot of times I like to flesh that idea out more because I liked the fight idea better. And sometimes, yes, I feel like I have to go back to the drawing board, but that's all part of the design process that any mapper would know. It's why I've stuck around the game and the mapping scene for nearly 5 years by now. There's just so much you can do and so much that has been done to pull inspiration from.

[@404waffles]

awesome vid, i think it's also worth mentioning how some mappers will take advantage of the slow weapon switch speed by triggering fights on weapon pickup, forcing the player to fight with that weapon or risk eating shit while switching to a better weapon

[@axtrifonov]

This simplicity is what modern shooters (including new Dooms) lack.

[@ambostralian]

I would actually argue the new dooms are very elegant in their simplicity. I'll grant you that weapon upgrades adds complexity that ultimately contributes nothing. But, particular in the "combat chess" interaction between the weapons and enemies creates a situation where you know what the best action is and it becomes all about execution

[@formbi]

And the sound design! All the monsters in new Dooms just say «arghhh», when the old ones had very unique and fascinating sounds. (edit: ah, it was mentioned in the video)

[@Igor369]

Are FPSes like Amid Evil not considered modern then?

[@SleepyAdam]

Awesome vid. You vocalized a lot of things I've felt about Doom for a long time. Doom to me always registered as kind of an evolution of the arcade action shooter. Like Asteroids, Robotron, etc. Games that are famously super duper simple but hard to master. But in 1st person with way more than a single screen of interesting areas to explore and like, the greatest enemy and weaponry lineup ever. Perfect balance between arcadey simplicity and ""modern"" variety.

[@my_cellium]

Thanks. I was inspired by your Quake video. My favorite part from that video was when you talked about wanting to play TF1 because you couldn't run TF2.

[@MullyWhizz]

As a doom fan who just got into Touhou this year, Doom is absolutely a bullet hell game at heart. Awesome video!

[@Spellweaver5]

Hitscans don't mix with bullet hell.

[@MullyWhizz]

@@Spellweaver5 I don't think that's true at all. If a bullet hell game had a hitscan enemy and cover you had to move behind, I think that would work fine. Plenty of bullet hell games have areas of attacks that are fundamentally un-dodgeable and you have to move elsewhere to dodge it, so it wouldn't even be that different I dont think.

[@Spellweaver5]

​@@MullyWhizz but that's not how it works in Doom. In Doom, it's next to impossible to hit a chaingunner and not get at least a couple of bullets in your face. And you are talking about Doom, not some abstraction.

[@MullyWhizz]

@@Spellweaver5 Well I mentioned cover, so, you shoot the chaingunner, move behind cover before he attacks you, then attack again and he's dead. Cover can include the map layout or other enemies. You identify areas that you can dodge the attack and move in and out of them to attack and dodge. Not so fundamentally different from a bullet hell game. Also I am talking about doom, but you only mentioned the abstraction of hitscanners so my response only had to do with that. Even other fps games from the era (duke nukem, blood) don't bring out bullet hell sensations like classic doom does.

[@CountGraze]

Heya, if you enjoy Touhou and are looking for more when you get through the back catalogue it has, definitely check out the Len'en Project. The patterns can feel sucker punchy at times but they are all so visually interesting and have neat concepts such as splitting the screen into 4 sections with the dimensions flipped or a boss who is entirely based on manipulating the boundaries of the player area. I'd also recommend the Spell Card Collection danmakufu script if you want a photo/ISC style game. It's also great for general practice, helps get the rust off after breaks~

[@gloweye]

Been playing 2016 recently, but what I much prefer about the older games is that the demons are already there. They don't teleport in. The teleportation is random enough that there's no room for strategy. Infighting is uncommon at best, because you can't lure them to shoot each other because *they're not there yet*.

[@karamelflan]

My guy has the whole numbers of the degrees of a circle for subscriber count, but gives quality to his videos like a sphere of all-encompassing love

[@CRCR0201]

I'm very much excited to see this kind of gameplay in the Dark Ages

[@miikavihersaari3104]

10:14 These large ascetic maps with tons of enemies are only one class of Doom map among many (the video seems to refer to them more than anything else). Most of Doom 1 and 2 maps are more about the level design. Especially Romero's maps have a strong focus on aesthetics; it was important to him to spend time and effort on creating interesting spaces and detail, and a flow between areas.

[@my_cellium]

Yeah I have a lot of slaughter as examples in the video because I found it really hard to write about maps that are more about incidental combat because I feel like the things that make them good are much more subjective and hard to put into words (Especially since I have never made a Doom map in my life). I mainly talked about maps with high enemy counts because that's where most of the parts I really find interesting about Doom's gameplay emerge. There was a quote from somebody who didn't like these maps and they said something along the lines of "I signed up to shoot demons, not to do fluid dynamics" and I really like that comment because that's exactly why I love these maps so much. They feel like I'm managing fluids.

[@miikavihersaari3104]

@@my_cellium That's a really cool perspective, looking at Doom monsters as fluid dynamics! I've never thought about it that way. But it makes perfect sense, as once there is a bigger crowd of monsters, they become a kind of system. And now that I think about it, having for example imps and pinkies is like having two types of particles which eventually separate once you strafe around them enough, kind of like a centrifuge. Very cool perspective! I started playing Doom when I was in elementary school, but what really blew my mind was when I found the level editor for it. We made maps with a classmate and I noticed we had very distinct styles. That's when I also started paying attention to how there were different styles of map in Doom 1 and 2, and I speculated whether they could be made by different people, hence the distinct styles? Turns out it was true :) Sandy's maps were perhaps a bit less nuanced aesthetically, but his ideas and usage of gameplay elements were so creative, it's clear he is a game designer. Anyways, thank you for the video, it was interesting!

[@my_cellium]

@@miikavihersaari3104 Yeah doom mapping is an art form

[@ArcadeStriker]

This video is likely gonna get me to give a shot at Doom again - geeat video with a great explanation of how this game is still built different compared to other classic shooters to this day

[@Songbearer]

I'd love to hear an essay about Blood if you ever found the time, it's such a great FPS and not enough people have examined it closely

[@my_cellium]

blood is probably my second or third favorite singleplayer fps. its definitely an acquired taste, but once you get good enough and start playing AGGRESSIVE rather than waiting behind corners it becomes really fun. PROTIP: Cultists get pseudo stunned when you fire the bullets in their general direction. Tommygun altfire is useful somewhat on medium difficulty because of this

[@benismann]

I think movement based dodging is underrated. I roll my eyes over every time i see dedicated "dodgeroll" mechanic or something like that since it, frankly, sounds kinda lazy. Also you talked a lot about modded doom maps things, most of what you said isn't much of a thing in just UV base game. Good video tho, never saw your channel before

[@my_cellium]

Yeah that's why I like Nuclear Throne more than Enter the Gungeon, I don't really like the dodgeroll. I focused a lot on custom Doom maps because there are many other well-made videos on vanilla Doom (Game-maker's toolkit has a great video) and the content there is on Doom modding is about GZDoom stuff like MyHouse.wad or Brutal Doom.

[@benismann]

@@my_cellium oh yea, i have like 200 hours in TBOI yet i couldn't get into ETG at all coz of dodgerolls.

[@ColonelKurtz772]

Eviternity, Ancient Aliens and Sunlust? You've got good taste in WADs my friend. Great video too!

[@superfightman2053]

On the note of pistol starting I recommend doing it even if you're new to Doom, but only when it happens naturally. In other words, never reload a save when you die and just keep playing when the game restarts the level and takes away all your equipment. That way you can enjoy the best of both worlds. It's super satisfying to carry a huge stash of weapons and ammo in one life through a handful of levels as a sort of win streak bonus, with the stakes increasing for each win since you don't wanna lose your fully kitted out doomguy. But then when you DO die that's ALSO super satisfying since that's when you get to fully engage with the tightly balanced resource economy of that particular map. Pistol starting manually for every stage with console commands is also fun but I prefer to do that when replaying campaigns I've already beaten, personally.

[@my_cellium]

Doom 1's maps are surprisingly hard with pistol starting

[@ichimiustin8390]

​@@my_cellium Same can be said about the expansions. Sigil and Sigil 2 are stingy with their ammo, and that forces you to think twice before using a shotgun on imps, or rockets on a cacodemon. I've found myself killing cyberdemons with the shotgun, and barons with the berserk and pistol

[@todesziege]

This is the most fun way to play vanilla Doom IMO. The tension from risk of dying really brings out the horror element.

[@TheWolfgangGrimmer]

I do this a lot with DSDA doom, basically using failures as checkpoints. It can be exhausting depending how invested you are in the moment however.

[@EVS2585]

My theory, based on the Doom Dark Ages trailer, is that they are gonna bring back the slow projectiles, shmup-like gameplay

[@dodofilmed323]

Amazing video! Thanks for putting all the complex thoughts I had about this game into words. It really cleared up why I love this game. DOOM video essays are fun to watch since every channel tackles the game from a completely different angle.

[@sigtryggureinarsson5910]

This was super interesting. Love how these older games have such devolped and deep gameplay

[@GoodmansGhost]

Doom DOES have rocket jumping, there's even a secret in Doom 2 that requires it. It's just that you jump horizontally with it, launching yourself like a canon rather than jump up.

[@deaglan6641]

I like how you respect the newer doom games but know when to take the new fans down a peg and show why the original games are so special. Never really could put my finger on why I liked the design of doom so much but you made it clear. Thanks!

[@pauldaulby260]

This is such a great video on dooms combat, maybe the best ive seen.

[@LVENdead]

Great video. I mean sure, voice stuff could use some work, but it barely matters; the content is solid and organized real well. I'd watch more videos like this!

[@my_cellium]

I liked your Doom Scholar video and your video on deleting stuff in maps.

[@kashnomo]

Very nice analysis and very much agreed. I, personally, found the audio apologies more distracting than the changes in audio quality. 😅 Thank you for this video!

[@MsMacintosh]

28:45 Dude, you didn’t have to disrespect the razer like that, he's just trying to do his jooob

[@atronx2794]

Good video, gave me a different approach at how I viewed this game! Def took some notes ✍

[@my_cellium]

I LOVE YOUR EVITERNITY MAP Ironically during the caco fight, that's when the gears clicked in my head for the first time and I realized monster herding existed

[@atronx2794]

Glad you liked it!

[@mansoorhameed7075]

Doom is absolutely a bullet hell game, it just doesn't get credited as such because it was soo groundbreaking in sooo many other areas.

[@my_cellium]

It continues to be groundbreaking. Unironically I think Doom has my favorite first person melee combat.

[@pscwplb]

There are bullets, it takes place in hell. Checks out.

[@kveller555]

@@my_cellium I don't know if you've played Hexen, but the fighter class in that game is some of the most fun I've had with first person melee combat, and it makes me wish someone made a classic-Doom-like game dedicated to it. There's something really special about having to dance around projectiles to be able to hit someone in the face with an axe.

[@my_cellium]

@@kveller555 Really? I gotta play that then.

[@kveller555]

@@my_cellium I hope you like being lost and confused in complex hubs though! It's the reason a lot of people stay away from it.

[@Carbine64]

Excellent video, with great introductions and explanations for abstract concepts that are second nature to most Doom players, but are very difficult to articulate in such a simple and straightforward manner. I'm a KZbinr myself so I'll use this video for reference on how to improve my scripts in the future. Great job and I hope you make more.

[@my_cellium]

Tips I've found on writing scripts: Keep joke count low. It makes the remaining jokes land a bit better Unless its an unknown game/you're not trying to do a deep analysis, don't summarize the game Read what the experts/pros of the game say about it. Email or DM them if you need help. Pay attention in English and Social Studies classes. They're intended to teach you how to argue. Keep comparisons to other games brief, to the point, and nuanced. Comparing to other games is very hard to do and introduces a lot of weak points in your argument. Try to steer clear of ultra-nuanced points that don't really contribute to the flow of the video. Only care about them near the end. Delete sections and constantly re-evaluate if all your sections are actually needed or can be deleted. Originally before the dodging section, there was a 5 minute chapter where I talked about how Doom has good mappers, why id software didn't add a jump, talked about wolfenstein and quake, but I realized that there were too many points that I didn't really have evidence to back up and the section could be deleted entirely because the people coming into this video already have a background on the game. They've watched civvie, they've watched game maker's toolkit. Finally, don't be vague, don't make generalities. Attract flies with honey not vinegar.

[@RRTS2556]

Archvile: Let me help you to jump =) Doom Guy: Thanks =) Now die =D

[@HandelGothicEnjoyer]

0:17 Bro thought he was playing Marathon 💀

[@markklem]

My favorite part was the "Weapons Segment" because that music was straight fire slappers. lol

[@my_cellium]

Mark Phlegm of MM!

[@markklem]

@@my_cellium 🤣

[@DuckAlertBeats]

Really nailed it. This is why I can't really see any games ever completely surpassing the genius of OG Doom. As fresh and fun as the day it came out imo which is rare.

[@awsomebot1]

Scythe II forces pistol start on Map 26 by making the player kill themselves at the end of Map 25 in order to "go to hell", narratively. It's a pretty cool idea even though newer players probably have a difficult time understanding what exactly they're meant to do. Then again if you made it to Map 25 on Scythe II, you're probably not a newer player.

[@mmjp088]

As someone who's played too much Fractured Worlds, there's another useful hail mary choice in that map32 "tap the switch" fight: The ssg. Due to autoaim making the chaingun miss thetarget, if you're in a situation where the switch is up and cacos are in the way, the ssg's vertical spread is your only hope (if gutting your dps) of hitting that switch. There's an additional balance on the BFG: Range. Having to get in close means that it's super dangerous to use and is far more reliant on good crowd control. A long hallway is just better for rockets since you can hang back compared to a tight square room which favors the high damage close range ssg. Covering both facets of enemy prioritization is cool: damage danger and space danger. Sometimes, hitscan goes first cuz they're gonna melt you. But other times, pinkies and imps go first because they have the most space per health

[@imbreadth11r5]

18:52 The chaingun in 64 is also great for clearing out troublesome Lost Soul swarms (who have their grace period after a lunge reduced in exchange for having less health. Left unchecked they can easily chew through a lot of health and armor within seconds!) and stunlocking Pain Elementals.

[@legallyafish]

Very interesting video, love the thumbnail, you have some real talent. I think that similarly painted stylized thumbnails might help boost your future videos.

[@SarcofagoBlackThrash]

Really cool video, you nailed the point as to why Doom's combat is still so satisfying 30 years later. Looking forward to more doom content my man.

[@bsharp111]

love seeing these concepts compiled and outlined in a video essay , really sick video !

[@franthehonest-eyes4883]

The Doom guy can't jump but can dodge raindrops

[@Toozey]

This video really summarizes and says it much better than I could when I try to explain the strengths and depths of Doom. Especially with looking forward to how the next game might play, great video from an old time Doom player !

[@diprotodon8943]

Awesome vid! Really put into words stuff I've felt but could not quite articulate to non-doomers; especially the part about how the dodging is analog.

[@mr-alexander-doom]

Great video, man! It's a really concise statement of what keeps Doom appealing all these years later. Thanks for providing a list of wads in the description.

[@shawn576]

Great breakdown. I like how Doom doesn't do damage resist; you can use any weapon on any enemy and it will always work. Your choice of weapon has much more to do with context like how many enemies are in the room, how big the room is.

[@soliddew]

If you want a more modern take on the classic doom formula try Supplice, hitscanners are converted to fast projectiles but all of the chess pieces have ways of pouring aggression on. It does natively use mouselook but that's how I've rolled since Doom Legacy anyway

[@IdarkshadowI]

28:33 That sounds mean... RUUUUN BIIIIATCH!!!!!! Great video, even today I'm still watching Doom speed demos from twitch, with the mods and everything the game became almost endless!

[@ErosXCaos]

One rarely mentioned aspect to the fixed camera is how the level design can be intentionally built to let you see something only on your periphery. You can’t just move your camera to look directly at it, only catching a glimpse out of the corner of your eye, so to speak. It lends an air of mystery when you can’t just look directly at something interesting that caught your eye.

[@r.g.thesecond]

List of Things Doom Does Not Teach You Well: (based on what was mentioned and my personal experience) - How BFG Works - Bumping into a demon wakes it up, and it won't attack right away (unless it has a melee state) - Automatic Weapon Switching when you pick up a new weapon or run out of ammo, RL has the least priority (?) and unlike others you need to retrigger for it to start firing. - Pain Chance, and how it's based on _hits_ rather than _damage_ - Retaliation mechanic - Monsters melee you when you are in melee distance 100% of the time - Retaliation + Melee mechanics, Revenant Dance and its dangers - Archviles can retaliate from far away - Shootable switches can only be activated with hitscan! - Vertical Spread of SSG is a downside - SSG shot has 20 pellets compared to 7 of the normal shotgun (_more_ than double) but shooting speed is less than half. - Strafe running, wallrunning, and SR50 (advanced!)

[@noot4622]

Great video on the unique qualities of DOOM. Qualities that will continue to be special forever since I don't think many people want to make/play games that don't feature the ability to look up and down.

[@Marisquizo]

I deeply appreciate the comparisons to danmaku games, keep cooking bro

[@Stokkolm]

The monster attack windup animation are so important to the flow of the game. It's the only thing that allows you do deal with hitscaners, it gives you a fraction of a second to shoot them before they hit you. Try Shadow Warrior and there the enemies shoot you the instant they see you, it's very hard to avoid taking damage, and for that reason you couldn't design maps with anything near the amount of enemies Doom has. TNT Evolution Map 07 has a teleporter that takes you to a room where you are surrounded by Imps and Hell Knights in cages that shoot at you from darkness, and because you can't see their attack windup animations, the projectiles are so much harder to dodge.

[@BONNIEE1983]

For a first commentary this video is a 10/10 And also your paintings are amazing

[@FateEverywhere]

Hi. While the tinnitus sound effect at about 6:05 is really cute, and makes your point wonderfully, I'm now stuck without a sense of hearing for the next hour or so. Thanks for that.

[@puncherofbread]

You really hit the nail on the head here. An offhanded but relevant quote that I remember from Civvie11's Doom 2016 video is that he briefly mentions "I always felt that Doom 2016, with its verticality and movement, was more of a successor to Quake's gameplay than Doom's". Which imo is why when I went back and played Doom1&2 I liked it but when the Quake remaster came out I loved it. I am hyped for Dark Ages because it has the potential to succeed where Eternal (kinda) had some shortcomings (I have hundreds of hours and still really love it) in my eyes. Mainly the way arenas were designed and enemy mobility (giving them a super-jump) meant that most combat encounters were structurally very similar and especially some of the DLC ones, when they throw the entire beastiary at you, felt the exact same at times. There's also a few other things that aren't done badly but are done by Ultrakill in a much better way.

[@gaurangshukla8235]

Finally a video which actually talks about the nuances of limitation in game design. This reminds me of, how Ghouls n Goblins Resurrection was slandered by people, for not having mid air controllable jump. Most critiques, straight up called it outdated game design, when in reality the levels/enemies/weapons where designed around that restriction.

[@Vryndar]

Completely agree, Doom is like a chess FPS. Fantastic video , the format of it and also small bits of humor felt like a breath of fresh air. Demonstrations were also on point, like what you were talking about was always relevant in the gameplay but not done annoyingly like some do, where they're assuming the viewer wasn't paying any attention. All these things about doom is also why it more or less never gets tiring to play, especially any maps that makes good use of these aspects to bring it all together to it's limit. In many wads it's like maps are their own game to learn and master, different styles combined over the same or several maps. It's just timeless and never gets boring.

[@itzmatos]

This game was so ahead of its time it's mind boggling. Thanks for the video and explanation too 😁

[@kingbaby8761]

That thumbnail brings up an old theory of mine: that mario would be the most horrifying video game character you could face in real life. He runs 50 miles an hour, has a vertical leap of 30 feet, can fly and throw fireballs from his hands, he breaks bricks with his head, he kills dinosaur-human hybrids with his hands and feet, and spends his free time fighting a gorilla, stomping turtles, and eating mushrooms. I stand by this theory.

[@andiemano3555]

Thats not even talking about the backwards long jump Imagine you just see him for half a second and next thing you know your dead

[@Josep_Hernandez_Lujan]

Sonic can do that as well but harder & faster

[@Nicolas-ni7jn]

great video very informative

[@xXNickPXx]

Wooooah this is so exactly spot on about everything that makes playing Doom still so great with the best-designed maps (& mods, provided they don't break this fundamental way of playing the game) from the community. Puts into words things I've explicitly thought about and others I couldn't quite place. Great stuff 👌

[@LuciaS_VA]

54 subs, 461 views, 30 minute video about some old shooter. You have my attention, continue. I am here for you. Edit: One criticism! Definitely up your gain next time. Thank you for this video! DOOM is just Touhou for Americans. I understand all now.

[@V1_The_Machine]

Oh hey! It's nice seeing ULTRAKILL thrown in there even if just for a couple seconds.

[@ianhunter919]

Awesome video. Genuine joy to see content like this. One point I’d argue for though, is that aiming does matter a lot for higher level play. While auto-aim is generous, it doesn’t guarantee good use of spread, tracking, or accurate flicks. And scenarios are made much more manageable with better aim, for a couple reasons. 1. More accurate flicks and tracking saves ammo. An extra few rockets and shells can give more cushion against missed and bad shots. This also allow you to place more pressure than you might have otherwise. For example, using less rockets in one encounter means more another encounter. Therefore making that next encounter more manageable due to higher dps. 2. More accurate aim reduces time to kill. A Rev killed at midrange with an SSG takes 3-4 shots. At close range it can take ideally 2 shots. However, because of the Rev’s speed and variety of ranges they are placed in, your spread and spacing may not always be perfect. But good flicks with the SSG means better focus of the spread that can make a harder to kill Rev less likely to add to the chaos for too long. And lastly, I’d also add better aim broadens your potential strategies. Excellent rocket flicks combined with excellent movement means certain portions of fights get neutralized more quickly and let you take up space better. See the first Okuplok fight as a great example of this. Again, awesome video, and I’m so glad to be able to express all this (that’s why this is so long lol). Keep on posting!

[@ziopao85]

im drunk and this got into my recommended section and i still havent' watched it but I respect you dude, keep going at it. p.s ill wait it when I'm sober

[@KingGameReview]

I think this video did a great job putting something into words I always felt, but never knew how to explain. It's the reason why I feel like Doom/Doom 2 are so much more engaging than the new ones and the new dooms really aren't that similar to the old ones. Not as much as they seem. I never made a ton of doom levels, and I haven't made any in a long time, but I kind of want to make one now with this video in mind

[@UltimatePerfection]

Not being able to jump also made sense lore-wise, I mean would YOU be able to jump if you walked around with a chainsaw, two shotguns (one double-barrelled), a plasma cannon, a BFG, plenty of ammo for each one of your weapons, and likely a heavy armor?

[@charliedarwins]

this was such a quality video. Thank you for everything you put into this!

[@DogsRNice]

29:35 so that's why it's called pink eye

[@creepersonryestudios]

This video perfectly sums up almost everything that goes through my head when I'm playing classic Doom.

[@alexanderglassgames4170]

Great video; I'm trying to work on an old-school FPS and this gives me ideas. Also, thanks for introducing me to the 'Take these pills and be who you are' track 🔥🔥🔥

[@HamidKarzai]

i'm glad SoBad is getting appreciation for his guides

[@GreenGuyCombine]

Really great video! Also the thumbnail is really striking and very well made

[@puerkahsuciah]

gracias My Cellium por este ensayo maravilloso, y gracias joseju por mencionarlo.

[@PaulRezaei]

Surprisingly good video. Good luck with growing your channel.

[@SneezyMcGlassface]

Very epic video, thoughtful and with lots of examples to boot. May the almighty algorithm bless you with views 🙏

[@zylinderkatze]

Nice job! Fun to watch and good to hear your opinion / evaluation / summary :D