Curved Backdrops For Your Model Railroad (187)

[@markwakeley3835]

Excellent. Who knew household cleaners were so versatile.

[@richardwest9054]

Great idea. I will be using it on my layout. Thanks, Larry.

[@Madonsteamrailways]

You’ve really helped people like me to make back scenes for layouts. A great video for those who need the kind of education you’re providing for us.

[@Madonsteamrailways]

@Eduardo Jericho Thank you for the tip, Eduardo!! I’ll be watching more of your videos when they come if I’m not volunteering at my local heritage railway.

[@kevinwhite1967]

Great tips and video. Would have never thought of Windex.

[@sojibro4811]

I thought it was real for a second. the curve makes it look so real!

[@peterjhillier7659]

Thank you Larry for a very good Video, lots of good Advice and it’s so good to see Things in first Principles.......keep safe.

[@jvanamb]

Larry, Great job. I agree with your friend about using WINDEX. I have done this exact same thing numerous times over the past 40 - 50 years. I think I found the idea an edition of Model Railroad Enthusiast (in the mid late 1960's). An additional hack I have used dealing with your vertical support. When you screw you wood supports to your benchwork attach the support BEFORE you begin bending the mica-board.. Then when you start to unscrew the top screw all the way out. The bottom screw you ease out enough to spin the support to the side. Yet still connected to the benchwork. Then as you wrap the mica-board around the bend simply spin the support back in place and screw it back to hold the mica as the WINDEX dries. Now you had an idea that I am adding to my war chest. The use of a piece of plywood as a wedge protecting the tunnel gap. I used to over kill this by mounting many to many up rights. Your idea of bracing the cutout is masterful. It adds more support than multiple supports & it safely crosses the gap. Really nice job ~Jim

[@TheDCCGuy]

Goo idea on the uprights. I bent the other end of the backboard yesterday and it went even better as I learned a couple of things from the last one. I have a really big one to do on the Piedmont Southern that will take some real tricky maneuvers-video to come on that one.

[@jimko4666]

Great tutorial, Larry, and very timely for me. I was just in the process of scheming how to make curved backdrop corners for my layout and here you are with some great ideas. Thank you!

[@Madonsteamrailways]

A truly educational video that has taught me a heck of a lot about getting your back scene absolutely right.

[@medwaymodelrailway7129]

Like the video very much .Lots of detail .Hope there more to come.

[@jhoodfysh]

Great technique Larry, thank you for sharing. I will be able to use these ideas.

[@mariner3485]

Gus Portokalos was right: "Put some Windex on it!" I will use that technique to make a center dividing backdrop (with a much gentler curve) on the modular 'island' layout I am building. Thanks for the tip!

[@TheDCCGuy]

Yes, that’s what my friend Dale had done on his layout. The backdrop running down the peninsula has a slight curve built in and therefor is totally self supporting. I just carried it a step further with a much sharper radius and the Masonite can take the bend without cracking. A great method for doing outside curves on a layout too.

[@johnmcdermott6220]

Just in the process of building my benchwork and was wondering how to mount and curve the masonite. Appreciate the time and effort you take in making the videos, as always very informative

[@ricter591]

Thanks Larry,🐾🚂 BearCreek, Cov. KY.

[@schadowolf]

Thank you so much for sharing this technique to curve masonite! I have been struggling with how to do this in my layout room as simply slightly bending would take up too much real-estate around the room corners. This is a perfect solution for very tight curves without having the boxy 90deg corners. Thank you again!

[@JohnMullerJDGCTRy]

Nice post the curve looks really good. The Windex really works well. Thanks much for the info, l've got to try it cause I hate 90° in backdrops.

[@mapit07]

Great technique thanks for sharing!

[@martinpattison4018]

I like that idea. I have a printed back scene that I would like to curve around the layout and fix it to the Hardboard. Many thanks. Martin. (Thailand)

[@erniepike3902]

I like the idea. Having worked in a shipyard where metal plates are shaped and bent, the only suggestion I would make is to not cut the hole until after the bending is done. The is both for having a uniform resistance for the bend and because materials stretch and deform while bending so the location will be more precise if measured and cut after bending.

[@TheDCCGuy]

Good tip but the problem was that the track and roadbed protrude from the ends of the layout so I had to cut the hole first to get it to fit over the track.

[@vincenthuying98]

Great tutorial Larry, great tip; windex with ammonia D, I’ll store that on my hard disk. Anyhow, for the vertical support you had to remove and remount after bending the masonite, your screw both held the support as it did the horizontal bracing. Therefore the screw isn’t able to grasp on the vertical brace, because the winds of the screw between the two pieces will in fact remain the same, which will eventually pull the screw into the wood of the vertical support. To solve this you can drill the pilot hole in the vertical support slightly bigger than the screw diameter, this will make the screw winds only grab the wood of the horizontal brace and allow for your vertical support to be attached fully flush without extra hands. It’s a technique that’s often forgotten because of the availability of screw machines and impact screw machines, however this method allows for easier construction and tighter mechanical attachment.

[@JohnMullerJDGCTRy]

I'm very glad you brought these points out. It was screaming in my head. I was just about to start a new comment when I saw yours. Very good expansion.

[@vincenthuying98]

@@JohnMullerJDGCTRy Thank you John, I very much appreciate your comment. Especially in construction videos one can see that this method isn’t used anymore. People who are into construction and producing videos really should know better. I skip watching when I see it. Larry’s videos are a different ballgame, he speeds us all up into the wonderful world of todays model railroading. Just from the standpoint of being thankful, it comes with ease to share this knowledge for all those out there struggling with screws and just a single pair of hands. I used to work in construction, plumbing to be precise, but had to say farewell to the job and business because of a serious back injury. Model railroading or Modeling is a way to maintain and up my skills on a fine scale.

[@simonalexandercritchley439]

Thanks,I am looking to do similar,always prefer curved backdrops.Also in that end corner I would put a radius so it is not sharp,and looks better imho.

[@tas7997]

Very nice! Thanks!

[@MikalAasved]

Thanks for the great information, Larry. After a 40 year hiatus, I'm finally able to get back into model railroading so I've subscribed to your channel. Do you think a fan blowing on the wet Masonite would make it dry faster?

[@cattaraugustonawanda4426]

I've never done this before ( have bent wood) but would use ammonia and water along with a heat gun to apply heat to the back side while bending. Making some bending molds to produce an accurate curve might be very helpful. Will be playing with this in a few months.

[@TheDCCGuy]

Don’t overthink it, the process works surprisingly well with free hand bending alone. Forms might help in some complex cases but as I showed in this and the one on the Piedmont Southern it is easy for simple but tight curves.

[@cattaraugustonawanda4426]

@@TheDCCGuy 😁 Definitely not over thinking ! The Windex you use works only because the active ingredient is ammonia (used on some types of wood bending because it softens the lignin) and it has detergent as a wetting agent. You appeared to be struggling with that bend and I've bent American Beech easier. I might be wrong but it looked like the radius at the top is wider than at the bottom. Using Windex or ammonia solution on the back (rough) side (to help allow the fibers to stretch) and applying some gentle heat ( speeds up the softening) will make the bend easier. Wetting the inside of the curve probably has little advantage since it is on the compression side of the curve. Using a very simple form will provide support while doing the bend and maintain desired radius while drying.

[@scottyo9551]

Count me in the list of folks planning to install a curved backdrop soon, so I really appreciate this video. I’m still vague if the smooth or rough side of the Masonite faces the layout.

[@TheDCCGuy]

I would think you would want the smooth side facing out-I’ve never seen anyone use the rough side.

[@jeffhallford5284]

That is very good to know. Thanks for sharing. I wonder if pre-bending the board around a piece of large diameter PVC pipe, using clamps once you have it wet might make it easier to bend. That way you don't risk damaging your layout. As you struggled with holding the back drop and drill, all I could think of is the disaster of the board cleaning off the top of the layout. Very cool technique. Thanks again.

[@TheDCCGuy]

Jeff-I actually had considered bending it around a lolly column in my basement but then decided it would give a better fit to do it i place. Just being off a few tenths would have resulted in a less than perfect curve and created problems at the fascia.

[@68Jaguar420G]

Larry, this is a very fortuitously timed video. I've been trying to get tight bends in Masonite for fascia and have been trying it with steam and fabric softener with varying degrees of success. (Both "fuzz up" the surface and I still haven't managed curves as tight a you have demonstrated in what appears to be 1/4" Masonite and I'm only using 1/8" stock material.) I would never have thought about an ammonia based product. It would have been nice to see the saturation process itself, particularly how much Masonite you wetted out in terms of the curve arc length and any leeway either side of that and just how much you sprayed on but I can experiment with that. Well timed great help, thanks.

[@TheDCCGuy]

I basically just measured the area to be bent, marked it on the hardboard with a pencil then saturated the backside out to about 1” on the straight. I sprayed it on until Windex ran off, let it sit, then repeated it once it soaked in. Did that about 3 times. I also sprayed the front just to see if it would soak in and it did so I sprayed it a couple of times for good measure. BTW this is 1/8” not 1/4”. This was a pretty tight bend and I don’t envision trying anything sharper. As I said it would have been easier with a helper-just go slow and then clamp it in place ti dry. I would think a fascia would be much easier than a tall backdrop section. I have one more on the Piedmont Southern that needs to be 26” tall so am not looking forward to that.

[@johncrisafulli201]

Larry, Great tutorial. Realize it’s been awhile since the video was produced , but hoping you still review all comments. Ready to start my curved backdrop & will be following your tutorial. Have 2 questions: * how did you measure including the curve to get the side section abut perfectly with the front section? * what spacing did you use for the back section vertical braces? Thanks

[@TheDCCGuy]

First I cut the foam base on the rear corners to the rounded shape I wanted. Then I ran a piece of flexible stranded copper wire along the edge of the foam the entire length of the area where the backdrop would go. I then simply measured the length of that wire to get the length of the hardboard. For the supports I just eyeballed them, but the two supports on the corners need to be placed at the point where the curve meets the tangent. The supports at the other locations are 3” in from the ends.

[@bobainsworth5057]

Great video. I'd like to see how you attach the board from the back side, I hate joint compound over screws it seems to me movement as you say the compound will pop.

[@melfordhorrocks3327]

Thanks for the informative video I am looking forward to seeing the next one. Windex is an American cleaner and is not common in the UK however, I managed to find it from a store in London which had a couple of bottles of the original windex. It cost me £21 for two bottles including postage so I am wondering how it compares with purchasing bendy board for the UK subscribers. Thanks, Mel

[@TheDCCGuy]

Mel, do you have a similar product that has ammonia in it or can you get a bottle of ammonia used for cleaning? Given Dale’s instructions to me I believe the ammonia loosens the internal bonds between the wood fibers making the bend possible and the when it dries the fibers rejoin creating a permanent bend. You might test that on a scrap piece of hardboard. I think bendy board is a plastic material so it should work too. On one layout I cut down 4’ x 8’ sheets of 0.040 styrene but the cost has gone up too much now and it is hard to find where I live so I went back to Masonite.

[@thomasdecker7631]

Great video. Changed my mind completely about using a curved backdrop. I was skeptical about the lost space, but it looks like you are achieving a very tight radius. Question: What do you consider to be a safe minimum bend radius?

[@TheDCCGuy]

I have never tested minimum radius but it can be very small. I think the small test bend I showed was bent around an old 1 lb coffee can. I suggest using such a can or a steel support column in your basement and give it a test. Most of my large backdrops on the Piedmont Southern were installed dry allowing the hardboard to take a natural radius similar to the curve of the track. However I do have an outside curve on a corner that had to be wet bent.

[@davidbellamy5445]

Very helpful Larry. I’m just wondering how much windex to spray, and I’m guessing it’s better to over spray, than under spray? Also ( I may have missed it) how long did you wait after spraying to bending it?Thanks.

[@TheDCCGuy]

I sprayed it on until it ran off and would not absorb more. I waited about 15-20 minutes before starting the bend.That was essentially how long it took me to clean up the mess in my truck bed and drag the hardboard inside, pop it into place on the layout, and get the lights, camera, and microphone ready for recording. If it doesn’t bend easily then just give it some more time. It would really have made it easier if I had a helper.

[@malcolmgiles549]

How long did you leave the Masonite soaking? And was the runoff brown? I’m in NZ and I think I have a compatible product but not completely sure. Thanks in advance.

[@TheDCCGuy]

I only left it a few minutes before I started bending and it soaked in fairly quickly. I don’t remember any brown runoff but your product may have a dye added. Basically you are looking for Masonite or a similar product. I suggest you do a test first with some scraps just to see how it works with your product.

[@malcolmgiles549]

How do you avoid surface crinkling on the inside of the 90 degree curve? Will it sand down to a smooth surface once completely dry? Thanks Malcolm Giles

[@TheDCCGuy]

I’ve never had any surface crinkling, came out smooth as a babies bottom, first time, every time.

[@malcolmgiles549]

@@TheDCCGuy I’ve realised I tried it on MDF board, NOT the same thing at all. Bit of a newbie q I’m afraid

[@charlierumsfeld6626]

Parson's branded Ammonia a substitute for the Windex? Windex smells better but just thinking out loud

[@TheDCCGuy]

Maybe, I have never tried anything but Windex. The maon ingredients are water, isopropyl alcohol, and ammonia. It may be the ammonia alone or the combination of it and alcohol. A few scraps of Masonite and some ammonia would make a quick test.

[@keithkarbel2000]

What radius curve did you do, or does it vary on your layout corners?

[@TheDCCGuy]

I just bent it to fit the edge of the modules.

[@keithkarbel2000]

@@TheDCCGuy thank you for replying. That makes sense. I’m about ready to try this.

[@1701_FyldeFlyer]

Hi Larry, for us UK viewers, what is Windex? Is it some window cleaning solution?

[@TheDCCGuy]

Sorry, I assumed you had it or something similar. It is a very old American brand of window cleaner. The original formula has ammonia-D which I think refers to the chemical formula H3N or ammonia d3. It was invented in 1933 and was mainly alcohol and ammonia with several other components in much smaller quantities. As I said in the video the ammonia seems to be the critical component however I have never tested other types. I don’t know if a solution of ammonia in water and/or alcohol would work. There are a lot of websites purporting to tell how to make your own Windex.

[@stevesntrains]

Windowlene is/was the UK equivalent of Windex. But check the formulation still has ammonia in it. I think the UK “Nanny State” had the ammonia removed.

[@chriscox4023]

I would have clamped the 2x1 before screwing.

[@TheDCCGuy]

Yes, as an afterthought I will try that on the other end. You learn as you go along with these kinds of projects and you watched me do it without any retakes.

[@strobelightaudio]

did you soak both sides in order to bend?

[@TheDCCGuy]

I mainly saturated the rough side thinking the smooth side would shed the Windex. However at the last I also gave the smooth side a few shots too and it did soak in.

[@kite7214]

What are you using to paint it with Larry? Keith

[@TheDCCGuy]

Small soft roller about 6” and Behr paint.

[@johncrisafulli201]

Larry,