Custom layout design for a customer in Sydney Australia

[@chrisridd9423]

Rebuilding the house to fit his trains shows some impressive dedication by the customer!

[@hippyjason]

Great content. I really enjoy these track design videos of yours. I especially like how you tell the whole story starting from a blank piece of paper, talk about the design goals, and then go through each iteration describing the pros, cons, and reasons for each design decision taken. Excellent stuff.

[@mpeterll]

Thank-you. One of the reasons for talking through the whole process is to try to educate my viewers in the art of layout design. There will always be model railroaders out there who simply cannot fork out the money for a professional custom design. Hopefully, by helping them to improve their own design skills, they will be less likely to become disillusioned and leave the hobby.

[@TheSwitchList]

Peter - I watched the video from the customer and all I can say is - I guess you are not JUST a pretty face!! 😁 Love watching your layout design videos (and ALL your videos) for the depth of knowledge, the explanation of the thought process, and seeing the excellent craftsmanship you bring to everything from building flat car loads to building entire layouts. I wish you continued great success with your work so that we can reap the benefits of having many KZbin videos to come! Oh, BTW - this layout is really awesome! -Rick

[@yorkiepudd7404]

Just gotta love the thought & planning process you go through, plus the how and why something goes in a spot in relation to it`s surroundings. One does not get better service then that Peter. cheers ken uk

[@EForrest88]

lots of very clever ideas and solutions in this, but I have to say my favourite little one is putting a different name on the stern of the container ship so it's read in the mirror and doesn't match the publicly-facing name on the bow.

[@mpeterll]

Thanks, I was quite pleased with that idea when I first came up with it.

[@TrainzLuvr]

Peter, thank you for making these videos - they are very educational. I hope you keep them coming in the future.

[@johngrady3492]

I agree with all the other comments, Peter...this is a wow! Your creativity is wonderful and your attention to detail is masterful. I really enjoyed this one! Thanks for providing us w this insight...John

[@jolliemark6294]

Wow! This is a really nice layout, like all the industries and staging, second small area it nice ....thanks for sharing such a nice layout Jack 👍👍👍👍👍

[@DwayneKlassenTheCoachForMen]

Brilliant! Your spacial awareness and industry ideas are really next level. You truly over deliver. Your client must be beside himself to see the ideas come through. I'm looking forward to living vicariously through the course of this build and set up. Cheers!

[@justaust4342]

Another great design, will be good to see some of your designs built down under. Cheers from Melbourne Australia

[@PeterTillman3]

The plan is for Peter to build the layout and install it in my basement when the renovations to the house are completed. Hopefully I can share it with fellow enthusiasts in the Sydney area 👍

[@mapit07]

Excellent walk through of your design, enjoyed it immensely! Thanks for sharing! Jim from Michigan

[@philmorton4590]

Personally I would have broken up the long L shape table into 2 sections to get more loops and allow a walkway in the center, would have also created positions for bridges.

[@mpeterll]

Thank-you for the comment. I have to disagree with you however. What you are proposing is actually quite a common mistake for inexperienced layout designers. Cutting a long peninsula into two short ones is almost invariably a bad idea. Not only do railroad scenes need to be as long as possible to appear realistic, but the turnbacks you create (often called "Blobs") eat up a huge amount of space. Each blob requires a circle about a foot bigger in diameter than twice the minimum mainline radius (about 7' diameter for this railroad), and this space is a lot less useful than the same area in a long narrow space. Furthermore, each blob introduces a lot of additional minimum-radius trackage, while eliminating the long straight (or gently curved) scenes that are so much more desirable. Overall, with the inescapable geometry of the additional blob, both the overall main-line length and the total useful layout area will always be less with the arrangement you suggested, simply because of the space you are wasting inside the extra blob, and the additional aisle length you are introducing to get around it. You also comment on making opportunities for additional bridges. Quite the contrary. The only bridges that can be incorporated in the end curves that you create are short-span trestles - which can be incorporated everywhere. It is not possible to add any kind of long-span bridge into the end-curves because they require straight track. You are actually eliminating possible bridge spots by doing what you suggest. Although there may be occasional exceptions, it is normally best to minimize the number of blobs in a layout design. It is not my intention to shoot you down. I hope this information is useful to you and any others who may read it.

[@aussiefrenchman-hobbytable9960]

Great layout, and in my area to,down the road 1000km south just a quick drive on a Sunday 👍👍👍👍

[@giulius7176]

Very nice design.....Like the idea of extending the ethanol track...

[@ickhamroad9635]

Wow, that is amazing layout plans. With a very use friendly layout. So impressed.

[@markarnold8160]

With the UK devoid of decent basements, this would be a barn filling exercise for me. I like the thinking behind a crew lounge - too often we don't provide them as it's a man cave and wives aren't welcome!

[@chazzyb8660]

What a wonderful excuse to visit Sydney at sometime in the future. I hope Peter T (below) lets you out of the basement occasionally to enjoy his beautiful city! I wonder if this has affected the way you are approaching your own layout, assuming you can find the time now to ever actually get on with it!

[@mpeterll]

Yes, that will be a blast. I especially want to go and see an Aussie rules football game while I am there.

[@PeterTillman3]

Most definitely- I will arrange the installation to coincide with a Sydney Swans game.

[@michaellee9975]

@@mpeterll Aussie rules is a bit overrated. If you come to the Eastern Seaboard you would have more of a thrill going to watch a rugby league game.

[@bertoverweel6588]

What a space ,I have 2,20 x 2,40 meters for my narrow gauge layout , great plan !!!

[@coxsj]

Very nice. If you think of it next time, would appreciate zooming in as you describe the various sections of the plan so the track arrangement is more visible. Many thanks!!

[@mhbpodnk]

Would be neat to watch this being and the final result after done and installed

[@mpeterll]

You are in luck, because this layout will be built in my shops and then installed in the customer's basement. The whole process will be recorded for my viewers.

[@mhbpodnk]

mpeterll looking forward to the series you layouts are constructed with excellence

[@riff2072]

@@mpeterll As we say up in Boston... wicked cool.

[@txag007]

Great video! I general what is your depth philosophy for levels? I am fairly new to tryout a non-table top layout and trying to get a handle on how deep is too deep say for a lower level versus upper level. I am in N scale but still interested in HO thoughts as well. Keep up the great work and giving us a glimpse into the design world.

[@rjl110919581]

Thank you for other detail detail video as all good watching every time thank you for share other

[@Nathan5Chime]

This is almost as great as the layout you were going to make for the lady in the custom designed barn that you showed in your April 1st video.

[@jasonweir6345]

Fantastic design. If I might make a suggestion that would enhance operations.. you already have the grade separation between the branch main and the lead/interchange track that ducks under the bridge, and you did mention the option of extending said track to the helix to stage a complete train. My suggestion is: why not tie that track into the helix and give the option for operational interchange. Perhaps a second rail provider that has access to "Westport"

[@mike59317]

Very interesting, enjoyed your talk through and reasoning's .

[@steamfan007]

Fascinating insight into your design process that I will try to apply to my new layout. What do you believe to be the minimum vertical separation between decks to allow easy access and viewing? Thanks for sharing - will plan a trip to Oz when it's done (hopefully Peter will let me in!).

[@PeterTillman3]

Awesome

[@riff2072]

The lower leave could be rural Australia. What ever kind of farm area they have in rural Austria. With some older engines.

[@geoffreyknoll]

Wow!! Will be an incredible layout. Two things I must have missed are what scale is he modeling? The other is what is the actual size of the space this will go in? I saw and heard some numbers mentioned, but couldn't figure out if that was original space or this new space.

[@mpeterll]

I did mention both during the video. I guess you now have an excuse to re-watch it :)

[@jeffhallford5284]

Peter, this is by far one of the nicest track plans that I have seen. I really like the layout. You are a masterful designer. I would be interested to know from just a hardware stand point (bench work, track, scenery, wiring and controls) what a layout of this magnitude would cost approximately. I understand if you cannot provide that, just curious. I need to know what to budget for eventually.

[@mpeterll]

Jeff, That’s a simple question, but one with a very complex answer. You may as well ask how much a 2000 square-foot house costs. New-York or Mississippi? City center or in the middle of nowhere? Ready to move in or in need of major work? Marble tile or dirt floors? Gated community or slum? The same applies to a professionally built model railroad. How much of the layout is to be done professionally? What level of finish? Does it include room preparation, or a lighting valance, or trains, or ongoing maintenance? What type of control system? Signaling system? Provision for nighttime operation? How many structures? Scratch-built or plastic kits? Plastic 25c trees or hand-crafted $10 trees? Where is it to be located? These considerations and hundreds of other factors will affect the cost. It’s no good just specifying “average” this and “typical” that, because one person’s idea of “average” or “typical” may be vastly different from another’s. Furthermore, one builder may bid four or five times as much as another if given an identical set of specs. That’s because some will do a much better job than others; some think their time is worth more than others; and some will deliberately low-ball the initial estimate in an underhanded attempt to get the job. If you are in the market for a professionally-built layout, you may need to come up with a budget and then ask what that will buy. It’s exactly the same when buying a house - the very first thing a realtor will ask you is “what’s your budget?” I hope this doesn't come off as crass or offensive. If you are considering hiring someone to build you a custom model railroad, please contact me privately because a public forum like this is not the place for discussing finances. superiormodelrailroads.com [e-mail]

[@PeterTillman3]

I can say, having searched around for the right person/company to design, build and install my layout, that you will find no better value than with Peter given his experience, commitment, attention to detail and overall quality of workmanship which is, by the way, made available for all to see on KZbin. Unfortunately I do not have the skill to design or build a layout other than perhaps nailing some track to a piece of board, so finding a professional builder was my only option and I am very glad to have found Peter. I highly recommend him to anyone who is looking to do something which is beyond their own capabilities or even to take what they already have to the next level.

[@jeffhallford5284]

@@mpeterll Sorry, I thought that you might have dollar per linear foot rule of thumb that would be a reasonable guess. I see your side completely. Sorry, to take so much of your time.

[@mpeterll]

@@jeffhallford5284 No need to apologize. I get asked that a lot. Some builders will happily give a price per square foot without even knowing what the customer wants. I'd have to advise steering clear of any builder who works like that. Almost invariably, that price barely covers a basic layout while the customer has visions of a completed masterpiece. This situation can only lead to a frustrated builder and an unhappy customer. The only part of a layout build that can reasonably be estimated as a price per linear foot is bare benchwork, but even that is hit and miss because a layout with lots of complex levels and corners will cost significantly more than a basic rectangle of the same size. Trackwork cost is typically based on the number of turnouts, but even then there's a wide range depending on the desired control options. Scenery can only ever sensibly be done on a time and materials basis as it is very subjective as to what constitutes a finished job. Structure are best estimated on an individual basis. As a rule of thumb, the going rate for assembling a basis plastic or laser-cut wood kit with no alterations or embellishment is around 4x the MSRP for the kit (although I usually end up somewhat lower than that). I hope this helps.

[@peggyandthegreenfamily5469]

Wow could fit this in my space 6ft 6 x 3ft 6 he he what a stunning layout all that track wow? Are going to build it and ship it over or just the plains for the customer or go to Aussy and build the layout? great work by the way what is the minimum gap or space between two oo gauge tracks running side by side??? I purchased some just waiting for delivery? again your a genius with layouts ......best wishes Ken and Christine ps ( I am scared to leave the wife's name off she will beat me) he he he

[@garthjunor3027]

Can you reverse the stairs?

[@shockwave9422]

what scale were you modeling?

[@Thomas1980]

WOW!!! NIce👍👍👍

[@jasonwiglesworth5408]

I need help to design a new layout

[@trainmantn1928]

Is this in HO or O?

[@VinylLounge]

Where are you based?

[@mpeterll]

I'm based in Tennessee, although I travel around quite a lot.

[@VinylLounge]

@@mpeterll Ok, I'm in Sydney. I'll send you an email.

[@craigsummers131]

:( makes my layout look pretty lame , none the less another awesome design video , may be i will do better on my next layout.