D-16 - Product of the System | Transformers One

[@DeltaTrion]

Two quick notes: 1) I pride myself on the visuals of my videos, but, because the film is not yet released on Digital, this video has a lot of slowed down footage and freeze frames from the trailers. Ideally, I would have loved to have footage for each scene talked about, but thats just not possible until the film is available outside of theaters. 2) Whoops, I called them the Elite High Guard at one point, my TF Animated side is showing

[@beckhornig7910]

We could make the High guard for Decepticons and Elite Guard for Autobots in future iterations. Like one is made to protect while the other to kill.

[@thaddaeuswong3574]

The Decepticon in this film was derived from Megatron having seen the lies building the system on Iacon. He’s angered by those lies and wants it, Sentinel, and everyone unwittingly following him torn down. He won’t be deceived by false leaders and false prophets again. He even labels Optimus an enemy holding up the deception, while also being ignorant of his own lies.

[@LockeLynx]

This movie won't get the planned sequel if it doesn't do well at the box office. As great of a movie as TF One is, its future projects are nothing without financial backing.

[@Cable3386]

TFA is awesome, can’t blame ya

[@AlexsTheCat]

This Orion Pax was basically Hot Rod :/

[@dracodracarys2339]

I think the really sad part was how when he shoots Orion, there's clearly remorse on his face. He even still tries to save him after that, completely incapable of comprehending why his best friend would take the bullet for their worst enemy. And the bit that really hurt was the way his hand lingers even AFTER he drops Orion. It's simultaneously a moment of "What have I done?" but also "I did what I had to do." And the cherry on top of the angst cake is the way he says, at the end, "This isn't over, Prime." Because at that point, that's all he sees. A Prime, who continued to uphold the oppressive system he tried to fight against. He doesn't see his friend, his brother who stood by him in thick and thin, in Optimus anymore. And the way he says it seems almost hurt, as if some lingering D-16 deep inside regrets what happened but knows it's too late to turn back. What makes this Megatron more tragic, but at the same time more dangerous, than other Megatrons in the past, is that he isn't motivated by greed, hatred, or a lust for power. He's motivated by a twisted yearning for justice. If anything, he completely lacks self-awareness: in his eyes, he is the hero, and he just can't understand why Optimus/Orion did what he did, and he can only process it as a personal betrayal on his part.

[@Memelord1117]

He also looked like he felt bad when optimus said he even betrayed him. And his optics dulled a bit when he was banished.

[@WorthlessDeadEnd]

​@@Memelord1117I noticed that, too.

[@WorthlessDeadEnd]

The scene where D-16 held Orion Pax's hand was a callback to earlier in the movie when Pax lifted D up during the Iacon 5000.

[@MOCskoden]

This only makes their rivalry that much greater 😮

[@jackmack4181]

That scene has to my “one villainous scene” because D-16 face shows so many emotions. Regret Rage Denial A disturbed Retrospection Pride Ego Then finally he looks away and makes his own decision

[@abloodcorpse3318]

Another thing that confirms Sentinel planned for the duo to disappear is that he tells the other miners that Orion had died in the race. If it was just Dreadwing getting revenge, Sentinel wouldn't have had any reason to cover for Dreadwing rather than just grab the two.

[@DeltaTrion]

Great point! Even after 3 viewings I forgot that!

[@superxavxii421]

I was thinking about that as soon as Sentinel said that too. That dude is truly a POS

[@supernova9361]

I read that as Sentinel finding out what Dreadwing did and going "Oh well, better turn them into a tragedy. Like I did with the Primes."

[@rexlumontad5644]

@@supernova9361 Darkwing, his name is Darkwing.

[@rexlumontad5644]

@@DeltaTrion His name is Darkwing by the way.

[@spencerfoote6977]

What’s ironic is the two end up on completely opposite sides from when they originally started. Megatron who would follow orders and not get in trouble will never listen to a leader again, while Optimus who wouldn’t listen to anyone completely believes in the primes. Both characters did a complete 180 and I’m impressed because it wasn’t forced and was natural.

[@Jacobe2of4]

Orion needed more time to be fleshed out. His arc was the weakest part of the film. An extra thirty minutes would have really helped the film

[@EveryCarpet]

@@Jacobe2of4 If they cut half the jokes they would have had the time necessary to do so. The movie was not poorly written, but the tone was not what it should have been. If you want to appeal to kids, make the product for whom the kids admire-- their older siblings and parents. This film would've been a cultural phenomenon if the tone was different.

[@BeyondTrash-xe1vs]

​@Jacobe2of4 I don't really agree, Orion's character isn't even opposite of his initial character, it's fully realized. He sees the value in everyone, including the miners, and in the end he gets to put this in practice with his return. The first people he sees are the miners, and he takes a knee and meets them eye to eye, requesting their help.

[@lewdleaf4975]

​@@Jacobe2of4agreed thank you Keegan for being an obnoxious mother-fucker

[@Perdix64]

@@BeyondTrash-xe1vs and when they have doubts, he’s the one that tells them that it doesn’t matter so long as they have the strength to stand up and fight.

[@jaytenfilms6903]

I believe that Megatron renaming the high guard Decepticons at the end of the film had something to do with his monologue about Sentinel’s betrayal. He said it himself, “We will not be blinded by his deception”. I think the Decepticon moniker symbolizes their liberation and them taking an oath that they will never be deceived or taken for granted by anyone ever again.

[@DeltaTrion]

@@jaytenfilms6903 great thought here. Being freed from deception is such a great way to use the Decepticon moniker.

[@ClasherG1416]

@@DeltaTrionthat’s basically what megatron says in tfp when Optimus has amnesia.

[@SuperFroakie82]

He basically says exactly this in the post credits scene

[@thespianuzumaki5452]

It made me think about what Megatron says to Optimus(who lost his memory at the time) in Transformers Prime: If speaking the truth is deception, then we are gladly guilty. (Which was the hardest line in the show)

[@Mandalorianof501st]

In IDW the name decepticon came from Megatrons manifesto “you are being deceived” when they were a political movement and later a terrorist army.

[@pajamapantsjack5874]

I think it was genuinely brilliant that he ripped sentinel in half. It felt like an intentional homage to bay’s megatron’s scrapping of jazz, which was for many of us myself included , the first time we’ve seen an autobot die on screen.

[@mckenzie.latham91]

It's also a great metaphor for ripping up the system

[@pajamapantsjack5874]

@@mckenzie.latham91 yeah, the old system is literally in pieces on the ground lol

[@Perdix64]

@@pajamapantsjack5874 it’s heart ripped out and placed into a new dictator.

[@pajamapantsjack5874]

@@Perdix64 THATS ALSO REALLY GOOD SYMBOLISM

[@Perdix64]

@@pajamapantsjack5874 he became the thing he swore to kill.

[@kiryuthedragonwarrior2746]

I think what's the most impactful thing is what D - 16 went through A lot of people say his turn into Megatron was fast but I disagree His whole life he believed he was helping his race. He was okay with mining Energon because his people needed it, and Sentinel was looking for the Maitrix to restore the lands. To him, he was doing what was necessary for the greater good. He didn't like it, but it was fine as things would get better. He was born without a choice as he believed. D-16 believed he was too powerless to do anything about it Only to learn it was all a lie The role he told himself that it was okay, that he was born this way, and that this must be done to save his people,e was a lie. D-16 wasn't saving his people but causing their oppression, causing his own. The people he looked up to forced him into slave labor, everything he knew was a lie. That he did have a choice D-16s anger was more than justiyed. And as he fought the drones and got his transformation, he felt power. That's a BIG thing that for the first time, he felt he was in control, and he wasn't about anyone to take it. As we saw him fight Pax over the map. He wouldn't even let his BF have anything over him. And as D fought Starscream, the bells rang their tune as the High guard cheered him on. Seeing that he was powerful, seeing that they respected him for his power. He was no longer a helpless miner but a bot who could fight back. I see his turn as natural, where once he had control he was never going back. He believed he couldn't trust anyone else. And Pax tried to save the man who stole his freedom, the man who made D powerless. He snapped as it looked like an act of betrayal that Pax tried to save Sential rather than kill him. D decided to become Megatron to lead a new Cybertron. One where he had control for once he was in control no one could betray him again It's such a meaningful and rich story to see a kinder individual fall from grace because of a string of lies

[@WorthlessDeadEnd]

Thank you for explaining that. I honestly thought that D's sudden mistrust of Pax was unwarranted, but what you said shines a whole new light on it.

[@Jacobe2of4]

Pax was kind of a fucking idiot the entire movie. He didn't even try to negotiate with Megatron before deciding to banish him. Which pretty much guaranteed a civil war with the only people on Cybertron who had military training. He did this while knowing full well they were low on natural resources and up to their ears in quintessons. Pax also acted under no authority. Yes he had the matrix. The primes, whose poor judgement that nearly doomed cybertron decided to give him that. But he was not an acknowledged leader, unlike megatron who earned his place. And then he fumbled the bag even further by promoting elita 1, who was perfectly fine with letting jazz die to further her career. Which completely explains why their were so many casualties in the cybertronian war

[@WorthlessDeadEnd]

@@Jacobe2of4 Wow, I had not considered that part about Elita 1 and Jazz, either. Very good point!

[@718jef]

I think the movie as a whole was too fast and too short, but those are small and minute problems compared to everything this movie gets right.

[@Jacobe2of4]

@@718jef They could have cut all of kegans speaking lines and add 10 minutes of Steve buscemi and it would made a lot more sense. Have him be the new friend that drives a wedge between prime and megatron

[@namelessrv8771]

As a victim of abuse, I understand Megatron's perspective perfectly. When you're powerless, your entire life and know only what those "above" you have told you, you start believing it. You start defending it until there is nothing more left, and that is what happened with Megatron. He tried to stick with the system, defend it and find ways to obey it, even though he knew how strict and unrelenting the system was. He and Orion were abused on a daily basis - verbally by their superiors, and were continuously oppressed. While Orion took that fact and became determined to strive for more, Megatron resigned and tried to reason with himself. "Cold logic" is a form of coping mechanism in of itself - you rationalise your situation, as twisted as it is, but when the breaking point arrives, it has a violent aftermath. Give the abused power, and three things can happen. Resentment, growth, or disbelief. Orion fell on the growth spectrum, but partly due to the fact that he hadn't tried to rationalise the system in any extensive way. He was always looking for escape. He used escapism as his own coping mechanism for the oppressive nature of the system, but Megatron used cold logic. When that broke, when nothing made sense anymore, it wasn't just betrayal. D-16 wasn't betrayed only by the system, he was betrayed by himself. He rationalised the oppression to the point he justified and defended it. When he learned the truth, he realised he had brainwashed himself. It wasn't just the system oppressing him, he did it to himself. And when such an individual gains power, they mostly grow resentful and distrustful. Resentful due to the abuse (oppression) and distrustful because they had been tricked to lie to themselves. In a way, D-16 is the perfect victim because he refused to acknowledge his own position as one. He rationalised it and believed the propaganda. Megatron is the perfect revolutionary because he knows the pain of having put on the chains on himself without knowing it, and knows that it is his duty to make others see that they have done the same. Oppression / abuse is a two-way system. The best way it works is when the victim does not even know it's happening. The best way it falls apart is when the victim realises that it is not them who are dependent on the system / abuser, but it's the other way around.

[@mckenzie.latham91]

Yeah it's made clear that D/Megatron Only views the entire endeavour in how it victimized him. He doesn't seem to care or even acknowledge others In fact when Orion says they will show everyone the truth Megatron rebukes him and says that no one will believe the truth because they worship Sentinel (like he did) And yet when they show sentinel's betrayal, most of the population calls sentinel as a traitor Yet megatrone continues to believe that people must still follow sentinel because he views everyone as himself, but he now sees them as no different an enemy than Sentinel.

[@Heartheartrecords]

well articulated bro... and this is what could have been put to screen to give us the audience more of a slap in the face of D-16's heartbreak..cause thats what it is essentially.. is not that different to being 10000% in love with another only to see them to fall in love with someone else after telling u ur the only one... any reasons for living is broken and all that u want in these moments is others to feel your pain.. not trusting any others wisdom or depth... how can u when others havent suffered the way u have.... this is the distortion that goes on when in such pain. So as you say, feeling betrayed not only by others but mainly from urself for trusting the feelings that were so strong... 1-2 minutes of showing such depth would of been the cherry on the top for sure imo.

[@isacgoncalves425]

​@mckenzie.latham91 just a minor correction,at first he say they wouldn't believe sentinel is traitor because they have nothing but words until pax recorded what sentinel said.

[@Rayshaddlife]

Yap

[@locknarius]

@@Rayshaddlife cornball

[@tea-sus8722]

Another thing about the cannon, and this is just my opinion, is how large and obtrusive it is. All the other cybertronian weapons fold away neatly, the fusion cannon distorts his silhouette like a massive tumour made of violence

[@Kededian]

His fusioncannon is his physical manifestion of his rage and hunger for revenge.

[@avacado4706]

that's actually really descriptive and a great choice of wording

[@vanzeralltheway8638]

"That big ahh cannon of yours is obstructive and overkill, why dont you just let go of it and use smaller firearms?" "No.. I liked it. Lets make it a feature"

[@exotictrash2234]

God I wish I could post that gif of the guy writing with a flaming pen under this

[@donnycorn3086]

Wasn't a big fan back then, but I remember watching the G1 animations. It was memorable seeing Megatron with a large cannon sticking out like that, but it hit so much harder emotionally when that same cannon shows up on the screen in TF One. A painful reminder to the fact that D-16, gradually turning into Megatron, swore with the cog that he would not stop, but kill Sentinel Prime

[@Ninjaforrver]

Gonna defend the pacing because it’s that lack of time that allows D-16 to fall. Orion never gets a chance to sit down and chat with him about what he’s been doing. D-16 leads the charge wordlessly like when he first takes the map and all but directly says “shut up Orion and follow me.” Later on it seems like Orion is finally getting to address D’s behavior but the high guard catch them. And before Orion can even address the giant gun manifesting Arachnid shows up and kidnaps D. When they reunite during the fight, D refuses to even acknowledge what sentinel did to him when Orion asks. We’re not allowed to sit with what’s happening because if we were, then Orion might’ve been able to stop it. The inability and even refusal of D-16 to process what’s happened to him, (or even the long term consequences of his actions like killing sentinel and letting go of Orion) instead wanting to just attack and destroy, to lash out while also demonstrating why it’s bad to lie and mess with him, are what birth megatron.

[@jadedsilverlining9427]

You know I initially thought the change was a little too quick but this really makes me think otherwise.

[@Perdix64]

@@Ninjaforrver I do think five more minutes with them before this would’ve been great, but I felt it would’ve bogged down the movie.

[@iceanqel]

Love this. i agree w you 💯%

[@Deceptisaur]

When watching the film the second time, I noticed there were little instances sprinkled throughout with D-16 that slowly saw his world view crack and change him subtlety in the film going forward. It was a recipe of steps building upon each other that transformed him from who he was decieved about being to the bot he always should have been. Letting go of Orion was the last shackle to the past he had to discard to embrace his new persona. For him, it wasn't a road to villiany but a sequence of hard choices necessary to cast off the institutional weakness forced upon him to become the strong leader Cybertron needs: Megatron.

[@Perdix64]

@@Deceptisaur you see it when he stomps on his ranking badge thing. You see it on him at the start, even when Orion knows the truth, he still keeps it on him.

[@Blue-585]

One thing about the D-16's eyes, is that when he's banned from Iacon by Optimus, not only they get a bit dimmer, but also become more orange, almost as if he is suprised and, to an extent saddened by his decision. This only lasts a second though, quickly becoming bright red again, as he leaves Prime and orders the high guard to follow him.

[@dragonman011]

tbh when D drops Orion into the core, I also initially thought that it was a sudden turn considering he was very regretful and panicked before he did so... but I realized that his sudden change of tune came right after a swift and silent moment of contemplation. He's realizing this is what he's always done. Sticking himself out for Orion. Being the one to clean up his messes. And this moment was no different. If he was gone, then no one would stand in his way and try to talk him down anymore. Hence "I'm done saving you". Definitely a bit quick-feeling the first time, but it sits a lot better when you consider all of their mishaps together leading up to this.

[@replsortech2012]

riko chan?

[@minezgamer0078]

A great film, honestly! In those last moments, Orion decides against him, furthering his feelings of distrust and betrayal.

[@superxavxii421]

As a TF fan I expected the turn, but damn was it so good. One line that D-16 says that stuck with me was when he said "NO I WANT TO KILL HIM". The voice work was great and while being a simple sentence the way it was delivered portrayed how torn D-16 was when the curtain was pulled

[@DeltaTrion]

That scene, as well as when Orion is dropped... my entire theater was SILENT

[@yolo6670]

​@@DeltaTrionomg

[@devinhamb6586]

I completely agree and what made the scene even more chilling to me was after he said that, he then says what he going to do to Sentinel with such venom and scorn that Elita and Bee start walking towards them (looking concerned) and Alpha Trion giving a subtle look towards D(as if something dark has been awakened).

[@mckenzie.latham91]

No one in my inax screening expected the "tearing in half" scene There was a collective gasp in the theatre when that played and you see Megatron ripping sentinel apart Also I love that they just have music for that scene, no dialogue or audio.

[@Perdix64]

@@mckenzie.latham91 my favorite part is what happened after it. The dubbing of Megatron and Optimus. D giving himself the name while yelling to everyone his name. Meanwhile Orion is quietly given the matrix of leadership and given the name Prime.

[@ZPaul_]

It’s interesting to see D-16 and Orion’s roles pretty much swap. At the beginning of the movie it was D-16 who was the cautious voice of reason and Orion who was the rebellious reckless one. I would to also like to give credit for how they did Megatron in this movie. He really stole the show. They turned a character who is usually depicted as pure evil and made him into pretty much a tragic villain. You really sympathize with him and understand why he did what he did. He was lied to his entire life, his entire existence has been a lie. And seeing him slowly turn into Megatron was really sad to see because of the relationship he had with Orion they were genuine friends (or brothers) and had each other’s backs no matter what happened. No matter what dangerous or stupid things Orion did D-16 was always by his side and had his back. When you have good intentions they can blind you to what you’re actually doing because you think what you’re doing is right when in actuality you’re becoming the thing you seek to destroy. Also he sounds like fucking Kratos and I love it!

[@juniorramirez2314]

Thank you finally sum one said this I literally saw this u see both swamp tellin each no dont like d-16 said to orion and orion saying no you dont. Holy shit I JUST TYPED THAT IN NOW REALZING IT BASICALLY SAID THE SAME THING HOLY SHI AND YEA MY FRIEND SAID OTHER PEOPLE SAYIN HE SOUND LIKE KRATOS. WHICH IS PRETTY RAD ASF!

[@WorthlessDeadEnd]

That flashback of when they first met was very emotional, too.

[@gabrielhermesson9926]

For me, what makes the roles swapping even more interesting is that their personal philosophies don’t change-for example: Orion keeps breaking into the archives because everyone (including himself) has the ability to find the clue that leads to the matrix; D-16’s hero was Megatronus because he was the biggest and most powerful of the Primes. Orion participates in the race because no one is less than another (and thus everyone should be allowed to participate), while D-16 initially doesn’t because access is based on power and ability. The thing that really changes is their trust in others and in each other.

[@Perdix64]

@@ZPaul_ I wouldn’t really say swap since Pax does hold trust in the Primes throughout the movie. He just knows the system is corrupt and that truth and strength must prevail.

[@Mandalorianof501st]

When both Orion and D got their T-cogs Orion started seeing himself in D. As in how his behaviour impacted those around him especially since he dragged D into most of his schemes that it shows how Orion had been a bad friend to D-16.

[@estebangutierrezmoreno9078]

If Megatron is the product of the system, Elita One represents those members of society with authentic talents and abilities, demonstrated because in the film she proves to be skilled and intelligent, but due to factors beyond their control, such as being born without gear of transformation, which for us would be like being born in a less privileged sector of society, since all miners were treated as inferior beings, does not have the opportunity that others less capable receive to progress.

[@DeltaTrion]

@@estebangutierrezmoreno9078 very true. Such as in our own world, natural talents do matter, but, your origins can have an impact on how those talents are used or unused

[@KanuKanu11]

Actually, they were all born with a T cog, but sentinel prime took them away before then went online.

[@estebangutierrezmoreno9078]

@@KanuKanu11 I know, but that's from the perspective of the viewers, for the characters in the movie, for the inhabitants of IACON, before Orion's return from the surface, the miners were Cybertronians who were born without T cog.

[@KanuKanu11]

@estebangutierrezmoreno9078 ohhh yeah, I knew that. I thought you were just talking about the movie. My bad 😅

[@estebangutierrezmoreno9078]

@@KanuKanu11 👍👍👍

[@MR.LMR1996]

"If speaking the truth is deception, then we are gladly guilty." Always loved the concept of the Decepticons being a revolutionary force that went way to far for Transformers lore. Makes their origins a lot more understandable, and stand in parrelel to the origins of many other tyrannical regimes that popped up in our world's history too.

[@abloodcorpse3318]

Honestly, I think not having enough time to take in D16's change, the pacing, and how quickly it happens works out very well. Because it works to represent two things, 1. How quickly someone can change as a result of their world falling apart and how hard it is to truly notice and 2. How overwhelming it all is on D16, as in under a day his entire world has crumbled around him in a way that is beyond his control, and he's desperate to regain any level of control as a result

[@predalien1413]

He showed just one last moment of the old D16 with that little quote of the “one bot he can trust”. I felt that in the good in him still reaching for connection and being able to reassemble himself.

[@PandAMonier]

​@@predalien1413I actually wasn't sure even after 2 viewings who D-16 was gonna mention - either himself or Orion. But if it's the latter, Orion's "betrayal" at saving Sentinel's life and calling D-16's cruelty out would make it hurt all the more for poor D...

[@soopstore2417]

This. I never had any issue much with how fast D-16's change was. It worked well with his character, who was initially someone who stuck to the rules and did the best he could, only to learn that he was serving an unfair system and looked up to someone who had been the reason him and others had to slave away. Orion being the reckless one and "feeling" something was wrong is also one of the main reasons why he didn't react the way D-16 did, he already saw the cracks showing, but D-16 didn't.

[@TransMascTrump]

Nah it's still weird could have given bit of a better reason why he would even turn on Orion so quickly like how Orion was always ordering him around and didn't give him a choice ya know? Could have gone more in depth and that's facts

[@StevenJG]

I found it rather ironic with D-16 calling Orion the selfish one. It's pretty clear that wasn't doing any of that for the good of the people. He was doing it cause he was angry. Because HE felt betrayed. Because HE wanted vengeance. Unlike Orion, he refused to see the bigger picture. Neither Sentinel or Megaton cared about the future of their fellow Cybertronians. In the end, the king is dead, long live the king.

[@alexisrafferty6988]

Who’s the king?

[@bradleyadams5252]

Sentinel. One tyrant fell, and another rose...

[@MuhammadYusufRamadhanUsman_TA]

,

[@mythosinfinite6736]

You've got it right. Good discernment. He was entirely right to feel betrayed, but his rage was entirely in pain for himself -- because he was lied to, and because the system he believed in crumbled. He was ready to give up and blame others until he got power, when he immediately B-lined for vengeance towards his abuser rather than a better life for everyone else. Vengeance can be sweet, but when it overrides justice, it can simply be continued tyranny.

[@StevenJG]

@@mythosinfinite6736 Freakin preach. I love D-16. I love Megatron. But far too often I’ve seen the ‘Megatron is right, Optimus is a dictator and all the Autobots are just elitist tyrants attacking the lower class’ argument and…I question whether we’ve watched and read the same media. Like what a reach. I’m glad that this incarnation at least placed Orion and D-16 on equal footing. Both being miners, coming from the lower class, with the rest of the Autobots, whilst the Decepticons have returned back to their military/security force origins from G1.

[@mudkip96]

Something that is very underlooked is how Starscream and the High Guard essentially enabled D16 to go further down his dark path. The High Guard's philosophy and cheering as D16 beat down Starscream encouraged a "Violence gets results" way of thinking that leads him to double down on his anger and ruthlessness.

[@sprout8426]

omg yes!

[@SpiderkillersInc]

One detail worth noting is his reaction to Sentinel’s having Megatronius T-Cog. Seeing the traitor who kept him down walking around with the T-Cog of his idol is such a personal slap in his face you can see his rage reaching its breaking point. I fully believe this scene was a major tipping in the scales to his decision to become Megatron.

[@Ares99999]

Megatronus would back Optimus.

[@Mikethekingboss]

D-16 really stole the show in transformers one for me! So I can’t wait for this video!

[@BigK13372]

He was honestly the character with the most development in the movie

[@justadonutidk]

​@@BigK13372it made me cry when he said "im done saving you"😭😭😭

[@nealsmall9316]

He really did Megatron is one of my favorites

[@nealsmall9316]

​@@BigK13372True do you think Megatron was looking sad and angry in the after credit scene?

[@Glider_Boi]

I was a bit skeptical abt Brian voicing D-16, but after watching the movie, I was shocked and impressed, a powerful performance for a powerful warlord...

[@DeltaTrion]

Same here. I was mostly unfamiliar with his previous work and only really knew him from that one Marvel movie he appeared in (idk which one I fell asleep to it). But man, he nailed this

[@thomasdeen2099]

Straight up, he sounds like Young Kratos especially when he christened himself as Megatron.

[@HaloThaGeek]

I swear I felt the same ”I. AM. MEGATRON.” I Instantly wanted more of him voicing the decepticon leader🔥🔥🔥

[@LegoEpicAnimator]

​​@@DeltaTrionHe's really good in ITSV and ATSV as Miles's Dad as well.

[@magma_fire_bagwan]

It's insane to me that Bernie from the Monsterverse films is the same guy who's now voicing MEGATRON. I'm fucking here for it though.

[@RicardoHellman05]

What I absolutely love about this movie is how it wasn't afraid of making you empathize this much with megatron. Truly the best Transformers movie so far

[@Oreon_Pix]

My interpretation with this version of the Decepticon name meaning is that it somehow means "Deception contradictors". Because in the final end credits scene, Megatron says "we will not be blinded by his deception" meaning, they are AGAINST deception; not using deception as a weapon

[@Raidoven]

Yeah, it's not the best branding imo though. It's like when ppl who are against child abusers call themselves pedo hunters. You gotta wait till the whole term is finished before you understand the context

[@vanzeralltheway8638]

​​@@RaidovenYeah, this exact example shows ambiguity, too. When they call themself "Pedo Hunters" were they "Hunting those Pedos" or were they "The Pedos who Hunts" ? Was decepticon "agaisnt deception", or were they "gladly deceipt" ? Honestly, tfp explanation made more sense since decepticon did indeed loves to lies.

[@ajh22895]

It's one of those strange elements as is the black and white ideology of the finish. We're supposed to root for the Autobots because they are the good side. But I find Orion/Optimus highly questionable as a character. His leadership mostly comes from manipulation, the biggest example being straight up scamming D16 into competing in the Iacon 5000. And in the finish, we are supposed to agree with him trying to remove D16's agency when he wants to kill Sentinel Prime. He then takes a shot for the tyrant and gets rewarded for it by receiving the Matrix of Leadership. A difficulty is that Cybertron is not Earth. Sentinel and his followers are evil beyond real world comparison. Sentinel personally created the system by which miners were oppressed. So, it is definitely sus when someone gives his life to protect such a being.

[@abdullahqavi1465]

Because of this movie, Optimus and Megatron addresing one another by their iconic names hits different cuz it implies how much theyve alienated.

[@donnguyen3795]

I think D-16/Megatron is a prime example of 'to see a man true color, give him power'

[@OwO377]

Simple and very effective

[@train4292]

HAH, “Prime”

[@vanzeralltheway8638]

​@@train4292Heh. Did he really think nobody would catch that?

[@arishemghoul9571]

lol he was a victim.

[@mtmoffical5278]

​@@arishemghoul9571 victim can become abuser

[@TEG_Barryz]

I would say that Megatron doesn’t value strength above the matrix of leadership so much as he doesn’t trust anyone who declares themself a prime. His entire point was to do away with the corrupt primes and now his best friend has just become one of them, which is what drives him to conflict. Great video as always though 💯

[@durrangodsgrief6503]

then hes basing his view off of one guy and ignoring the prime that helped them and the ones who he idolized

[@knucklesofficial9213]

Why are the primes corrupt though? The whole point was that sentinel was a false prime who betrayed them, optimus is a legitimate prime, matrix and all

[@marcusaaronliaogo9158]

@@knucklesofficial9213I guess d-16 views primes as either naive and inevitably get destroyed or traitors who are in power

[@grimey3480]

​@knucklesofficial9213 Because Megatron was so bitter about everything that he just wants to destroy anything even remotely related to Sentinel, including people that look up to him and the entire city that he took part in building up

[@vothbetilia4862]

​@@knucklesofficial9213 most likely due to the fact primes overshadow everyone and rule in such a way That everyone feels lesser than most. Therefore if there wasn't a prime, there wouldn't be such harsh lifestyles etc.

[@gentalrobots3988]

I had a similar situation showing my brother this movie, that you did with your wife. he didn't buy d-16's turn because it straight up makes you feel bad. It bothers you. but that's exactly why its so well done

[@robbiemason9113]

I feel like the timing actually helps Megatron’s fall. So much raw emotions and reveals happen at such a pace he becomes broken. It doesn’t give him time to ponder about what is right is wrong, all he feels is pain, and his vengeance consumes him. He is so angry and everything happens in a short period of time, it helps why his turn was so fast. When it’s all over he has the lingering pain of the “betrayal” of his brother. So it leaves him never truly healing and being left as the leader we know him as

[@mosisusasu9205]

I love that you mentioned the way they portray Megatron's gun, the way it came up to me almost felt like some sort of terrifying accident. Like they unintentionally created this weapon that corrupted the purity of an otherwise innocuous machine. The moment the transformers became machines of war and death.

[@BoisegangGaming]

I'm going to repost what I said in the short, but I do also want to expand on my previous statements. This is perhaps the most nuanced take we've seen for Megatron in a film so far. Both Orion and D-16 are driven by noble virtues: the desire to be something more than themselves, a sense of justice, and a dream of a better future. Where it goes wrong in Megatron's case is that he has been hurt and can only think to hurt the world back, not seeing or not caring that he has become just as bad as the one he despises. Though perhaps he does, and he externalizes and projects his self-hatred among everyone else. What I think is fascinating is why he seems to latch onto the idea of "might makes right": because his previous idea of what is right and just has been immediately and brutally shattered. If Megatron believes in anything as both D-16 and Megatron, it may be "the world is inherently just". But like people who have those beliefs of a "Just World", these are challenged by injustice, and he must rationalize why this injustice occurs. This cognitive dissonance is exemplified across the film as he scrambles to reconcile reality and his beliefs. "The thing i find fascinating about D-16/Megatron is that D-16 spends his whole existence idolizing Sentinel Prime and Megatronus Prime. He dedicates himself to the system because he believes it is just and correct. Then it turns out it is anything but. That his hero, Sentinel, is a false idol. That he and countless others had their bodies violated before their birth to ensure that they would live and die for the sake of holding up the rule of a liar. This, I think, is what broke him. If Orion Pax believes the best in people, D-16- through his trauma and his shattered world- can only see the worst. When he says to Sentinel "he has nothing to lose", that's an extremely sad moment: he really, truly, has nothing. It's his fault that he pushes aside Orion, but he can't see that because the only thing he can focus on is righting the wrong the only way he believes is correct: with vengeance. But it's hollow. His outburst against Orion in the Tomb of the Primes is telling: he blames Orion for everything, not taking responsibility for his own actions because he *can't*. Because he believes in the worst of everyone-- Sentinel, Orion, himself. D-16 really is, IMO, the most tragic origin for Megatron because he and Orion were nobodies. They weren't some chosen ones, or reincarnations. They were just some bots at the wrong place at the wrong time."

[@DeltaTrion]

Your section here about chosen ones… get ready for the end of the month, because I’ve got just the video for you…

[@justalurker13]

"D-16 really is, IMO, the most tragic origin for Megatron because he and Orion were nobodies. They weren't some chosen ones, or reincarnations. They were just some bots at the wrong place at the wrong time." I know this comment is old, but this exactly why Megatron fucking hits so bad. D-16 isn't some larger than life individual - heck, he's a common story, a victim of injustice. It just so happened he had power is why he's able to inflict the level of damage that he does. There's so many D-16s in real life, and it's sobering to have this self-awareness about ourselves - ANYONE can be D-16, therefore anyone can be Megatron too.

[@blasecascadeanimation4671]

I think your statement about Megatron seeing himself as the hero is important, because especially in idw it’s true. He views himself as the hero because he’s the hero in the eyes of his followers, he understands that he was the villain when he realizes that everyone else, both those he fought and those who were spectators, saw him as the villain

[@ankoku37]

One of my favorite moments was the brief period just after the main characters find out Sentinel is a traitor but before Alpha Trion gives them the cogs. D-16 gets mad at Orion for bringing them into this when they could have stayed oblivious and also gets frustrated with Orion trying to do something to fix it because he feels it's all too hopeless to do anything and that it would have been better for them all if they just didn't know. It's only for a like 1 minute, but that little detail really tells a lot because it sets up the difference in worldview between Orion/Optimus being, well, optimistic and always believing in doing the right thing no matter what while D-16/Megatron is a harsh cynic who will only see the worst parts of a situation while believing that he's the only one being realistic. It also reveals that his friendship and loyalty is conditional. It (along of course with the conclusion from it that he can't look up to or rely on anyone but himself) I think was a really really clever way of explaining exactly how the fun, likeable, joking, caring, regular guy that we had seen up until that point became the Megatron that we all know and hate.

[@rexlumontad5644]

It's a surprise that Megatronus Prime is *not* The Fallen this time in the TF One continuity and he went out as a hero. Plus his character design reminds me of Tarn from IDW Transformers comics. Sadly, his name and legacy would be tarnished by D-16 who had his T-Cog and renamed himself as Megatron.

[@larrytherustyboii7442]

Not just that, his face, his logo is now associated with the deceptions.

[@daderowley4514]

@@larrytherustyboii7442 imagine how his spirit feels knowing this

[@larrytherustyboii7442]

@@daderowley4514 I am 100% in belief that tarn will be a thing and he'll be like megatronus's acolyte or something trying to right what megatron wronged.

[@daderowley4514]

@@larrytherustyboii7442 That would be really cool. A more heroic take on Tarn maybe?

[@larrytherustyboii7442]

@@daderowley4514 yeeeeh

[@noirangel6416]

Orion began the story from believing the system was broken and should be fixed, to having to uphold the system, inspiring others their world could be fixed through unity, and replace it failed gov. as it leader through peace. Meanwhile D-16 began believing the system was fair, that everything would work out in the end, but became enraged seeing the hypocrisy that leads their world, and works them to death, and that the only solution to deal with their corrupt authority can be solved though violence.

[@AutobotSonicTheTelltaleGamer]

D-16 is ABSOLUTELY the best character in this movie! Thanks for such an incredible review/video essay!

[@DeltaTrion]

@@AutobotSonicTheTelltaleGamer thanks for watching as always!

[@sayansaha155]

Sentinel's first oopsy in that scene : Cutting off Orion when he was about to say that we are more than miners (or something similar). Second oopsy : Sentinel's sarcasm. Third oopsy : He told the miners that D and OP were dead from the race...

[@naufalmEZa]

Sentinel's comical cartoon villain with a spoonful of real world politicians. Nowhere near Megatron's violence for sure.

[@Hugabugahugabuga]

@@naufalmEZa nah enslaving a complete generation of transformers only for his gain, robbing them of a free will and stealing their core before their even activated. To then lie to everybody and imposing himself as a hero and how he searches for the matrix just to work under the greatest enemy from the transformers. Sentinel is on par with megaton because he causes the problem that because of him megaton comes to existence. If he didn’t betray the primes. Cybertron wouldn’t have get destroyed in the future

[@Fantallana]

@@naufalmEZaI can’t even see it as all that cartoony, when there’s people like JD Vance existing in real life. That guy’s like a 90s villain who’d be defeated by being pushed into a big vat of goo.

[@milkiassamuel780]

Brian Tyree Henry absolutely *KILLED IT* as Megatron. He's one of my favourite underrated actors with so much vocal range and talent in shows like Atlanta and movies like Bullet Train, Spiderverse and now Transformers: One. He truly made me sympathise with Megatron as a character and allowed me to see him from a whole new perspective as this tragic revolutionary turned villain. The scene where he said he wanted to kill Sentinel gave me *CHILLS!* This version of Megatron might be my favourite take on the character yet (and that's saying something since we've had great versions of the character before, like in Transformers: Prime, Transformers Animated or Transformers: Armada). What makes this Megatron more tragic but also more dangerous than other Megatrons in the past is that he isn't motivated by greed, hatred, or a lust for power...hes a victim, a product of a corrupt system. You can tell that after learning the dark truth about Sentinel's lies, D-16's entire world absolutely shatters as he was happy being a miner and with the life he was living, but now he sees how truly naive he was as he and his fellow miners worked themselves to death for a leader that murdered their true heroes and sold his own race out their greatest enemy. D-16 clearly feels betrayed and wants vengeance for all the pain, injustice, and death Sentinel has caused. He doubts that exposing the truth isn't enough for someone as powerful as him to be taken down. D wants to believe that there is a better way, but his rage and hate cloud his mind, and despite that rage, you can tell he still values Orion as his best friend, as he is the only person who treats D with genuine respect. He's motivated by a twisted yearning for justice. If anything, he ultimately lacks self-awareness: in his eyes, he is the hero, even though he wasn't the only one who was lied to; Orion, Elita, Bee and all of Iacon were lied to for generations, and many died just all because of Sentinels manipulation and when Orion took the black from D-16's fusion cannon, and D-16 holds him up why crying over the remorse of shooting his best friend he just can't understand why Optimus/Orion took the bullet. He can only process it as a personal betrayal on his part. Megatron was justified in his hatred and vengeance against Sentinel but lost sight of what he was fighting for and let his emotions consume him to the point of no return despite how much he knew Orion cared about him as a good friend, but couldn't fathom why he'd risk his life for a scumbag like Sentinel who took away their rights, their hope, their heroes and sold out his own people. Thus, he mentally snapped and had enough of covering Orion's back, and now D16 was dead, and only Megatron existed. What is truly sad is that Orion wasn't trying to save Sentinel...he was trying to save D-16 from making a terrible mistake, but sadly, D-16 was too far gone, and now only Megatron exists. The storytelling is truly captivating and downright Shakespearean for making us care about Megatron

[@ProtoAlpha]

He really did, of course I don't ever want to see him voice Megatron again😅 but He did amazingly. I hope he gets an award from this movie.

[@SwizzPrime]

we gotta have a trilogy to this movie man the writing is just too good for it to be one and done

[@DeltaTrion]

I sure do hope we get more of this. Truly a golden age for the fans.

[@user-mu6sk7ub9r]

i constantly get chills watching this movie, especially when megatron said "i am megatron"

[@in.zclouds]

Man, this vid gave me a whole new perspective! When I first watched TF One, I also thought D-16's transition was a little sudden, especially during the "I. Got. It." moment. But if u rlly pay attention, u can see lots of his pent up aggression coming out in certain things he says, like "I'll kill you" or "i'll smelt your face off." All of this pent up hate and smidges of aggression really pour out the moment he figures out his life has been a lie, and it continues to amplify when he realizes that he has the power to act on these aggressions. Plus, when he's actually congratulated and cheered by the elite guard for doing this, he sees his actions as justified and validated, becoming more confident that this path is correct. For a movie that wasn't even 2 hours, this backstory is on par with IDW Megatron's origin story, which was centered around multiple issues + flashbacks scattered around comics. I do hope we get a sequel, because I rlly wanna see this story continue!

[@Sizdothyx]

You forgot to mention how the Quintessons also set up Megatron's hatred for organics, as they pilfered the land of Energon for their own use--energon which, at the time, Megatron had to scrap and dig for--so it's reasonable to think that he would be extremely against the resources of his homeland being stripped by invaders ... and we also know that his method is to pay evil unto evil, which is how you get the galactic conquest stuff.

[@saberaihara9217]

Finally we get a mainstream depiction of Megs that isn't just a straight up villain. He's far more than just a power-hungry, ruthless tyrant that wants to rule the universe, he actually had a noble ambition and wanted to make Cybertron better, but anger got the better of him and he took it way too far.

[@ericm.8110]

I prefer him pure evil like in G1, Animated, the Bayverse and the Unicron Trilogy (especially in Transformers Cybertron). I don't like that new mainstream depiction of Megatron what we have since IDW. It is allways the same thing, and it annoys me. It become stale and boring.

[@saberaihara9217]

@ericm.8110 Sounds like you don't like characters with depth. I think it's boring to depict such an important character in the series as a 2-dimensional villain. Honestly I can't see him being anything less than a nuanced character because the depth makes him interesting. There's a reason people like him and I doubt it's (just) because he's evil. If you like simpler stories with very classic tropes then go ahead, go like G1 or different TF series that simplifies the plot but, like, I think your options are limited. If TF stayed super simple do you think it would be as popular as it is now? Anyways, this conversation is ridiculous. If you don't like complex antagonists why'd you bother to comment under a video about a complex antagonist?

[@ericm.8110]

@@saberaihara9217, I like charackters with depth. But we have in every new fiction villains who have a tragic backstory, or have good goals. Don't get me wrong, I like those villains. But at some point, it becomes stale. I know that the world is not black and white. But even in real life there are people who would do anything for power.

[@saberaihara9217]

@@ericm.8110 There are plenty of antagonists in TF that are pure "evil". Look at SENTINEL ffs. Shockwave?? DJD??? (The best examples I have are all in IDW it's just a really good source of information).

[@LineOfThy]

@@ericm.8110 so you think characters with depth are getting stale, but not characters consistently being pure evil?

[@Megamanlanprime]

It’s so fascinating that you can see where his ambition for power comes from - it comes from the fear that built into hatred. The fear that he’d fall for more lies and follow another “false prophet”… yet he hasn’t even noticed what he’s become. I feel like Armada Megatron’s line best describes D-16 in a sense and in a bigger scale most Megatron’s - “If you dare to have dreams of power, you will be consumed by them” The very ambition we saw built in this movie is the thing that will eventually be Megatron’s ultimate undoing, and it kinda adds to the tragedy to me as he can’t seem to realize that his anger, wrath, fear and ambition is what breaks his friendship, eventually brings about more of what he was trying to stop and ultimately will be his final end.

[@Frozen_Death_Knight]

In regards to Sentinel putting Orion and D-16 in sub-level 50, to me it is very clear that he was pretending to make them lower their guard just for Darkwing to come in and do the dirty work for him. 1) He has an image to uphold. If for some reason Orion and D-16 managed to use their over-ambition to escape and become suspicious of Sentinel, he easily has a cover story and can punish Darkwing for not following his commands, thus making him be seen as understanding and benevolent. 2) Sentinel clearly made an underhanded comment about him appreciating "bots that can think for themselves", which is the direct opposite of what is shown of him for the rest of the film. 3) He clearly does not want a worker uprising, which would ruin his bargain with the Quintessons that keep him in power. Empowering your workers to be able to make more demands in society is not something he wants when he just wants mindless drones to mine for Energon. Removing Orion and D-16 quickly and silently would make sure they don't become heroic symbols for the workers to rally under. 4) Sentinel has not yet been revealed as the true villain of the story, so the writers are using a bit of subtlety to convey that something is wrong about Sentinel's rule without just spelling things out. 5) He is later revealed in the film to have proclaimed Orion and D-16 as being dead from their injuries in the race. You wouldn't do that if you didn't want them gone. 6) Airachnid is Sentinel's surrveilance officer and she was the one who first entered the room to scan for any surrveilance equipment to make sure Sentinel's conversation wasn't leaked before he started his talk with Orion and D-16. 7) Orion and D-16 were put in the same super secret sub-level 50 as Bumblebee, another bot who Sentinel also "appreciated" for "thinking for himself". Bumblebee's part in the story is kind of fascinating when you realise that he knows a lot of trivia about stuff like the High Guard, the other secret sub-levels, escape routes out of the system, and more. He is also a giant blabber mouth, so naturally Sentinel would want him to be silenced just because Bumblebee is pretty much just as curious as Orion and would easily spill the beans about secrets that would hurt Sentinel's credibility. Besides, Sentinel is the one responsible for removing all the T-cogs from the workers, so he has for a long time had a system in place of vetting out the problematic bots to the regime and keep the useful ones that can be used to keep Sentinel's rule absolute such as Airachnid and Darkwing. When you really think about it there isn't much room for doubt when it comes to Sentinel wanting Orion and D-16 gone.

[@optimistprime3192]

Now that I think about it, Bee being such a blabber mouth is such a setup for Megatron doing such damage to his voicebox in this telling of the story. “You know... even back when I met you in Sublevel 50, I always wondered when you would just shut up... I can’t wait to see Prime’s face *when he learns I **_finally_** silenced you myself.”*

[@adora_was_taken]

personally I kind of thought he originally wanted to use Orion and D as propaganda tools (150% of the quota in half a shift is pretty good, plus he'd be able to keep them on a very short leash). but then Darkwing stepped in and tossed them to sublevel 50 and Sentinel figured that was a decent enough solution since they were out of the picture either way.

[@gabutman6144]

@@adora_was_taken same

[@ultragodzillafan]

Seeing how good friends Orion and D-16 were, I actually found myself not wanting Megatron to be born. But hearing the phrase "I'm done saving you." broke my heart. It felt like watching Anakin and Obi Wan fallout all over again...

[@MilkyMocha315]

A friend of mine on tumblr pointed out something that went right over my head the first time I saw this movie: Orion Pax and D-16’s initial personalities actually foreshadow their eventual motivations and ideologies as Optimus Prime and Megatron. Orion Pax being a rule-breaker and a free spirit foreshadows Optimus Prime’s creed that “freedom is the right of all sentient beings,” while D-16 being a stickler for the rules and a firm believer in the system foreshadows Megatron’s goal of “peace through tyranny.”

[@vullord666]

I think they did a really good job of showing the different paths taken. Orion ALWAYS believed they could be more and was constantly fighting for that. D-16 was very contempt with where he was and believed so strongly in Sentinel and the social chain of command built by him. When the truth was revealed, it didn't change much for Orion. He did what he always had done and continued to believe they had the power to be more and could build a better future. But for D-16, he just fell so hard. He believed so strongly in a system that wasn't just a lie, but was built specifically to exploit him and he became blinded by rage and all he wanted was to tear it all down. Burn and raze it to the ground and build something new. It was so sad when he said he couldn't trust anyone but himself when Orion had always been by his side, but he could no longer see that. This Megatron is really just someone drowned in despair who became deluded by power (cycle of abuse and what not). Its so sad. Even the name Megatron was taken by him based on his favorite prime and the symbol of the decepitcons as well. He saw himself as the hero forging his own destiny after learning it was ripped away from him by Sentinel, but he never realized that he let Sentinel turn him into the very same monster he (Sentinel) was.

[@rexlumontad5644]

*thumbnail* A small man can cast a very large shadow.

[@bradleyadams5252]

The wrong man in the right place can make all the difference. -entity referred to as G-man, Half-Life

[@vee-bee-a]

Reminded me of young Anakin's shadow in that one Phantom Menace promotional image.

[@nont18411]

Megatron is quite a big guy if you ask me

[@vee-bee-a]

@@nont18411 Not just for you, but for all of us. Was gonna reply with the classic Bane meme, but, yeah.

[@hiitsmoto]

Hmm, I would agree that we could have benefited from a little more time to sit with D-16's transformation--heck, even an extra minute could've really helped synthesize the change happening in the audience's mind in my opinion. That moment before the seekers were introduced, where D-16 and Orion were interrupted, I think they could've protracted that scene, dug into that discussion more to see the gap that was forming between the two. Otherwise I don't think it was rushed, like you said the changes were in the subtle, quiet moments--the signs were all there. And there's something to be said about how it was as much a rapid-fire rollercoaster for them as it was for us. We, and perhaps Optimus himself, will always be left wondering "what if he just had another moment to talk? Would that have made a difference?". From what I've read and seen so far, it also seems like The Long Overdue Chat is part of the lore of Optimus and Megatron in many of their iterations too haha... The whole "has t-cogs" vs "has-no-t-cog" is such an on-the-nose allegory to the way 'us' vs 'them', 'rich' vs 'poor' is systemically manufactured to keep oppressed people oppressed, that I really struggle not to wanna draw that parallel in TFO with real world racial and socio-economic discrimination, but I completely see that being off topic and why that's not a can of worms you would dig into in the video, but I appreciate you nonetheless gesturing to the subject matter by way of Brian Tyree Henry's discussion on villains and representation in media! Thank you again for a great video! I appreciate your insights as always.

[@DeltaTrion]

Thank you for your insights as well. When writing the video, I thought about discussing how possibly Henry might’ve been bringing some of his own life to Megatron’s story in the sense of being treated differently just because of being different and perhaps his struggles in life. I decided not too, until I found the interview where he brought that exact point up. It is 100% a topic that should be discussed, but, I am not the one to discuss it. Perhaps someone much smarter than I, like Emperor Kumquat will

[@SebastianAceFawkes]

Brian Tyree Henry was Better Than I Expected Him to be as Megatron. I still think Sam Witwer would've been a Great Choice, But Yeah Brian was Fantastic.

[@Jacobe2of4]

It's the contrast between D-16 before and after the drop that made his performance so impactful. He was deliberately trying to not sound like megatron while he was D-16 in order to build up to him in a natural progression. It was so jarring but clicked so good when he crossed that bridge. Brian Tyree Henry's megatron with David Kaye as Orion pax is my dream combination of the two

[@JEF_W]

Your opinion. To me, I’ve always wanted Troy Baker and Sam Witwer to voice Optimus and Megatron. In a separate project. That I wanna make

[@Jacobe2of4]

@@JEF_W it's difficult to place a good voice to a pre matrix prime who isn't in charge. David was able to channel a demoted, but capable and responsible prime who was arguably plagiarized heavily from his beast wars costar Garry Chalk. I just feel like it's the closest we have seen of Optimus in a diminished capacity without making him appear weak. We have never seen a natural progression from pax to prime like BTH did for megatron. Hemsworth did not pull it off but again, the shoes he had to fill were too large. Welker is megatron and half of the people in the scene talking to him but Brian Tyree Henry is D-16

[@JEF_W]

@@Jacobe2of4 For my Optimus and Megatron casting, it’s not in a origin sense. In a pre-established yet original story sense

[@Jacobe2of4]

@@JEF_W I feel like the type of story that you are trying to tell could be played by anyone as the template for the characters is there. But I agree that some talent shines more in that territory. I feel like Brian Tyree Henry molded out a new side of megatron that should be a permanent revision of the character. Building up from who they were before and fleshing out their upbringing is the challenge. Part of it is not entirely their fault. Kay pele is arguably one of the most experienced voice actors on staff in that movie. His Toad voice in Mario was the best voice in that movie. And they gave him the dumbest lines and relegated him to the comedy relief for the kids. Which made zero sense when he was cutting people in half at the end of the movie.

[@jaymhlurbaloyi7813]

D16 probably also started hating having to do things Orion way. Feeling like he had to follow him all the time but always got into things he did not want to do. Coupled with realising his whole life is a lie, and his hero was a fake. He decides to follow his own path, not do things the way Orion thinks is best. Wanting to lead instead of follow.

[@devofficialchannel]

Even when they were miners, it's clear that Orion and D-16's behaviours and beliefs end up reflecting their later turn to Optimus and Megatron. Orion was more rebellious and believed in freedom and doing the right things even if he has to break the rules, which reflects Optimus' drive to do the right thing even in dire situations as well as his "freedom is the right of all sentient beings" speech. D-16 was more strict and believed in order and trusting authority no matter how cruel they may be, which reflects Megatron's desire for power and to form a militant dictatorship in Cybertron to enforce order against "false idols" like Sentinel (ironically replacing Sentinel, despite him calling out Optimus for supposedly doing the same)

[@sshk1653]

In other words prime was democratic where d-16 is communist

[@ConfluenceChimera]

I think a really good line that sets in motion D's turn to a darker path is is "Bare witness! This is the last time I show mercy!" line, which he then has to live up to after he shoots Orion. Everyone, including the High Guard he just proved himself to, is watching, so going back on his word would make him look like a weak leader. As he's holding Orion's hand you can see the internal struggle he's going through; do I save my best friend or do I commit to the path I've chosen for myself?

[@matti.8465]

I think the pacing works BECAUSE of how fast everything goes after the Sentinel reveal. Orion can tell something is festering inside D-16 but he doesn't get to chance to stop and talk about it until his brother crossses the point of no return.

[@billionthguide8]

4:10 My interpretation is that Sentinel lied to them. My reasoning is, because later in the movie when Orion comes back with his T cog, to all the other miner Cybertronians. One of them said “Sentinel said that you died in the race.” And when both Orion and D-16 were thrown down there with Bee. I can’t remember if it was Darkwing or Bee that said, no one goes back up after they’ve been thrown down there. So, that being said, I assume they were never meant to go back to their mining crew.

[@Frostycrypton]

I had extremely similar thoughts as you did! Originally I thought D-16 dropping Orion seemed abrupt, but after reflecting a bit, I realized we were slowly seeing D's anger manifest in more serious ways throughout the film.

[@fr0gfairy]

It’s also interesting to note that in Orions own naïveté, he keeps pushing D-16’s clear boundaries and pushing him past what he can handle emotionally. The whole movie is blow after blow to his worldview and he’s never given the time to sit down and work through what he’s feeling in a healthy way. His eventual extremism is both a factor of the system he was manipulated through, but also Orion’s own negligence of D-16’s mental state.

[@tfgirl444]

You almost made me cry. D-16 is a great character and in my opinion his transformation into Megatron was very well handled. By the way, with my family we talked about how D said many times "I'm going to kill you" to Orion. He was always a bit iracsible. That's one of the reasons why it didn't seem too rushed or anything.

[@diaclona]

that interview with brian tyree henry makes me appreciate his performance even more. he gives such nuance and real emotion to D. i don’t think i’ve ever been more on megatron’s side than in this movie. and it’s nice to see someone else defending the pacing; on initial viewing it did feel a little abrupt, but it really does feel legitimate upon repeat viewings. everything he does makes sense for him as a character, and it’s executed brilliantly. fantastic video🔥

[@DeltaTrion]

I think, for myself and a lot of fans, the first viewing was a purely amazing overload of Transformers. Being so excited to see the film and see who you can find in the background and what not. Not until the second viewing, did I take the time to really contemplate the emotions on screen and the undertones of the film. Thats when I understood the pacing a lot better.

[@cblake4111]

I think a really impactful realization is that the reasoning for D-16's hatred for Sentinel. While Orion was aware they were not in the best place, D-16 recognized just HOW BAD their lot in life was. It was because of his trust in Sentinel that he DELIBERATELY kept himself in what he knew to be a bad situation. And the fact he could have taken charge of his life at any time added fuel to the fire.

[@StareachValcin]

This is a great retrospective look at D-16's transformation into Megatron, both physically and through his character development in Transformers One.

[@DragonStar524]

I just love how while both Orion and D-16 both seek change, they both do it in diametrically opposing ways. Orion seeks change through example and to change the system from within, and even shows compassion towards people who most would think don't deserve it. D-16, happy to stay in his lane initially, becomes disillusioned by the fact that working his way up naturally wouldnt have mattered. Purge the world by fire and start anew.

[@bushyboi_3768]

A bit of foreshadowing is when the group is looking over zeta prime, B, pax, and aletia go to the right into the sun and D-16 goes to the left into the darkness. Hinting at his true nature

[@ThatTravGuy]

fantastic breakdown. I look forward to seeing more from you :)

[@dolphinpower1107]

Something I considered while watching the film was how D16 turned independently of Orion, he had multiple scenes showing his ideology shifting and every time Orion attempts to reach him they're interrupted. I think this was showing how the situation could have been prevented or at least better. The two brothers never get to talk it out, their bond doesn't get to be reinforced instead pulled away and eventually torn apart. This was shown best when Megatrons only one bot I can trust comment is cut off or when the high guards base is attacked. These are both points that could lead to a meaningful heart to heart, but we are deprived of it, as if it happened Megatron would realised Orion has his back and he doesn't have to soley rely on might makes right. I don't know if this was intentional, but I did find it an interesting thing none the less.

[@madot09]

I am just happy as Transformers fans we got something to discuss in a positive way

[@rexlumontad5644]

I am a bit disappointed regarding the High Guard because it's comprised mostly of Starscream, Shockwave and Soundwave and the Seekers - all of them as future Decepticons. I was expecting the appearances of Aerialbots, Wreckers and Dinobots among the High Guard as they're militaristic Autobots with heavy firepower. Unlike Starscream and his forces, they would somewhat retain the idealism of the Thirteen Primes and have the strength to back that up. All while they have teeth-clenched teamwork with each other in their guerrilla war against Sentinel's regime. And when Orion Pax eventually ascended as Optimus Prime being the True Prime with the Matrix of Leadership, the Autobot half of the High Guard would side with him as their unyielding faith in the Primes had finally paid off. While the rest go with D-16, who renamed himself as Megatron, and became Decepticons.

[@oneklump]

Grimlock was one of the guards. They used his as his tank mode.

[@EmeralBookwise]

The thing I found confusing about the high guard was why they were even still following Megatron at the end of the movie. If their whole ideology was the strength of one bot over another, well... Megatron got his ass kicked by Optimus. I sorta of feel that if there was one mistake the movie made, it was devolving into a big bombastic fight scene. I think it might have worked better if after the resurrection, Optimus tried to extend a hand of forgiveness, only for Megatron to slap it away. if instead of being banished, Megatron took the high guard with him into voluntary exile, fully intent on building his own separate society up on the surface while leaving it to future squeals to show the two factions coming into conflict with each other.

[@durrangodsgrief6503]

yeah that would have been cool like you have the faithful and the fallen and when this prime arrises their like "Nah, we stand with the fourteenth prime"

[@BitrateBilly]

@@EmeralBookwise i think it makes sense when you consider the goal was to eliminate the false prime sentinel, to the high guard it seemed like orion betrayed them and took the "false prime" title for himself, they succeeded in eliminating sentinel but in the process they were banished permanently from iacon and thus in their eyes the status quo was returned, so it would make sense then that they'd be even MORE loyal to megatron in that despite him being banished and having his ass kicked, he's willing to do what he believe needs to be done.

[@EmeralBookwise]

@@BitrateBilly: Except the high guard never really cared all that much about taking Sentinel down before. They were just chilling up on the surface doing their own thing. independent of his regime. Heck, it was Orion Pax who gave the motivating speech that even got the survivors of Sentinel's raid to go on the offensive in the first place. And yet for some reason those same bots instead sided with Megatron by the end for some reason. It's not even like Optimus only kicked Megatron's ass either. The high guard tried ganging up on him and Optimus still came out on top. Overall, I just think the implementation of the high guard was inconsistent and not thought out very well. They feel like more of a tacked-on afterthought compared to what is otherwise a pretty tight movie.

[@featherguardian6023]

I love how they handled Megatron in this Version as he started as a Follow Up to the Rules type of guy that has some Dark Humor but by finding out the Truth, his beliefs shattered that embraces the Selfish Greedy Darkness that was inside all along and all it needed was a Push to unleash that Violent Rage and become a Bloodthirsty Control Tyrant that the only one he can truly trust is himself as he let himself transform into a Deadly Weapon that will exterminated anyone in his way and let himself become like Sentinel but more like a Deranged Loose Cannon.

[@mckenzie.latham91]

One of my favourite parts in the film is when D keeps standing up. In the throne room agaisnt Sentinel Every time he steps back up, the other high guard (who will become the Decepticon legion) All notice and pay attention when D/Megatron stands back up Showing how they follow the strongest and Megatron is showing his strength both physically and of will.

[@littlemisstfc]

I’ve picked up on this the first time I’ve watched the movie, which explains why he fell into the dark side quickly: How long has he been bottling up his anger and frustrations? Considering that he’s been keeping them in to cope with his lot in life, he must’ve had *years* worth of anger and frustration with the pain and suffering as a miner. There’s no therapists on Cybertron, so it’s inevitable that he gave into his deepest impulses that ultimately costed him everything…

[@paragarden881]

One thing that I’d also like to point out is that D-16 also comes off as very selfish. When he learns the truth about everything, he comments how he was lied to, not how sentinel had lied to everyone. And each and every time Orion comes up with another crazy idea, he objects to it until it ends up benefiting him in some way, like when he’s goaded into going up to the surface when Orion entices him with the idea of him handing the Matrix to Sentinel. He takes it much more personally than anyone else. And additionally, when he goes to kill him, it’s made clear that he was killing sentinel due to personal feelings, rather than doing it for the greater good.

[@stirmagpie]

Orion in some way was lucky because he already didn’t believe in the system. Orion is kind of “proven right”. He didn’t expect that but he hasn’t lost his place in the world. D-16 did, he had the utmost faith in it. The moment his only certainty crumbles in such a catastrophic way, he has lost everything.

[@Days-ru8jh]

I just love megatron man. The character of megatron is so cool. A super powerful tyrant kind of trope and I just love it. I feel like megatron is the pinnacle of it. I loved that scene of him ripping apart Sentinel because that brutality is exactly what I expect from megatron.

[@tyemaishu2961]

Just realising now that D-16's sticker is placed on his shoulder just like how the Autobot symbol is on Optimus Prime's G1 design but by the end D-16/Megatron then only has the decepticon symbol in the centre like his original G1 design too. Lovely analysis too 🙂

[@mysteriousvenus1410]

I absolutely loved the change in megatron, it really felt like he stewed on what sentinel did and is doing, especially with finally being able to experience what he took from him. I think the size change when they receive a cog could be viewed as growing up, before the cog megatron saw the world in black and white, meaning, he was inferior for being born wrong and sentinel was superior for being born right, then when he found out sentinel was tearing all the miners down, literally shown by the size difference he 'grew up' in a sense, now he's a teenager, he could see more but wasn't entirely certain, then when he decided to break his bond with optimus and take megatronus's cog he became an adult, he decide on his new world view and was fully invested in it, the more the movie goes the more violent he gets and the more he grows, first was the cog then the cannon and then the new cog.

[@w4rl0ck]

I noticed the longer the movie went on, the more D-16’s eyes turned more red. I think it was the way of showing his change

[@garrettviewegh9028]

It’s insane how closely Anakin and D-16s fall from grace mirror each other. D was no chosen one, but they both were betrayed by a system and people they trusted, were manipulated, defaced, and were corrupted by hate. Becoming the thing they swore to destroy. Anakin, a Sith that would butcher many. And Megatron, once the weak oppressed by the strong, he became the strong that oppressed the weak.

[@seabunnyproductions]

Love it. Great to see another interpretation of this so called “simple” character, and I can’t stop thinking about the tragic beauty and wonderful relatability that D-16 displays. Thanks for the vid Delta! :)

[@Draftsman_MC1300]

The one thing that keeps me from seeing this Megatron as a villain is the fact that I genuinely believe he’d fight any other Megatron but being just another Tyrant.

[@Youtuber24683]

"Orion does something he shouldn't..." 2:26 Nice timing on that, mate. :D

[@jeremytung1632]

I thought it was really interesting that Megatronus wasn’t the fallen in this continuity, he was just as much a member of the primes as the rest, but now that Megatron is using his, Megatronus’, face as the symbol of his violent militant group he’s probably going to be demonized and his history getting rewritten, like how the “German work party” corrupted the swastika and now it’s original meaning is forever changed.

[@soulkibble1466]

I've seen several reviews criticize D-16's turn to Megatron to be to quick, but after watching it I think it makes perfect sense. Unlike Orion who always had his doubts about the system, D-16 wanted to believe the system was just. And having the truth revealed to someone like that, of course they would want to lash out in anger.

[@kacinema96]

Brian Tyree Henry’s performance alone is an argument for why there should be best voice actor and actress Oscars.

[@solivagen435]

*"I will lead us all into the future."* THAT was Megatron right there.

[@jackmack4181]

D-16 fall/rise to megatron to me was perfect because of how the movie handled his growth, for it followed the cycle of abuse In the beginning anytime he was asked if he felt there was something more, he refused the call and accepted his place. He even reasoned he was in the wrong for doing practically nothing but talking back. Even when he learned about Sentenals lies he was furious because everything he knew was a lie and because (at that moment) he couldn’t do anything about it since he was a cogless miner. Then everything changed once he got his cog. Because in his mind he has been placed in a new lane of traffic. I mean that scene when Orion was trying to warn D16 of being careful with the evidence, D16 responded with a glare for all his life the strong has prayed on the weak. Then came the elite guard, further increasing the mentality of strength = power. Finally came the point of megs lowest point, in front of sentinel, shackled, being told a fails truth. Here megs attempts one last moment of resistance against sentinel and gets punished through branding. This to me made D-16 into Megatron, for he was brought to his lowest point and the only way out he could think of was through the thing that kept him down his entire life Violence

[@danyglen5270]

I busted out a tear when megatron had his big moment in the end. It was almost heroic

[@OwO377]

"what is a hero?"

[@johngolles342]

0:52 it was the pits of Kaon, not Iacon

[@DeltaTrion]

Whoops! You’re right

[@christinajessica787]

I'm so grateful for this movie that leaves a lot of the characterization to expressions and silences and let's the story breathe instead of hand feeding you explanations. My biggest surprise was making Orion from a middle class origin (cop, librarian) into a miner as well, and to me it was a genius move from the writers to give them the same background. By giving them the same experiences it invites a deeper discussion to their reactions of the events, instead of Megatron having a slightly bigger point by default for his lower class status, and the writers knew in today's political landscape Optimus couldn't have a more privilaged place than Megatron that would give his moral superiority any credibility. I loved this movie a lot and loved your review, entirely spot on. I'm praying we'll get more sequels and explore this new POV.

[@dksl9899]

This makes a beautiful arc with the end of TF:Prime, where Megatron, freed of Unicron's control, says he now understands the true meaning of Oppression, and thus loses his taste for inflicting it.

[@Pues_Chocos]

Absolute beautiful break down, when me and my brother went to watch this movie we were speachless, watching this video leaves me speachless agian about this movie especially 8:59

[@frankyanish4833]

Megatron is not a tragic villain. He is a tragic protagonist, but not a tragic villain. He revels in violence. He believes that the strongest, the one capable of beating up the most others, should lead. This is basically the same philosophy that Sentinel has, though Sentinel’s qualifier was the cleverest. Another similarity between Megatron and Sentinel is that they change their interpretation of past events to suit their own ego.

[@ArsxnIV]

One of the best things about the movie, in my opinion, was how Megatron's birth was shown visually, piece by piece. Every "part" of Megatron that D-16 gains - from the bloodlust, to the cannon, to the army, to the insignia and finally the red eyes - fills you with excitement to see the legendary villain, but also dread as D-16 loses himself piece by piece.

[@AHnthHoneYA]

I think Megatron gets a bad wrap. Sentinel deserved the death penalty at that point. He’s a literal murderer of all the primes and traitor. It was so extra for Optimus to jump in front of Megatrons Justice. And to tear down everything that liar built was a rightful thing to do

[@theisegai56]

It wasn't justice, it was vengeance.

[@SixArmedSweater]

@@theisegai56It was both.

[@vanzeralltheway8638]

​@@SixArmedSweater If your own "justice" is absolute, then human race will always kill each other, everyday, over the most petty of reason. Even if megatron is right, that "Sentinel deserve death" the way he is doing it is wrong. He is selfishly unleashing all his hatred. Even if his anger is justified, his "justice" is not a good base for the society in a long term. If "Might makes right", he would one day be usurped by opressed society, just like what he did.

[@theisegai56]

@@SixArmedSweater No it isn't.

[@SixArmedSweater]

@@theisegai56 Insightful commentary. 9_9

[@stu729]

In that moment that D-16 is still holding on to Orion's hand, I imagine he's running the situation and the future through his head. Very much how Cameron from Ferris Beuller's Day Off was sitting in the car saying "He'll keep calling, and calling, and calling," D was thinking "Orion will keep trying, and trying, and trying to stop me, and expecting me to save him when his foolishness catches up to him. Just like it did now. Even here, he's expecting me to save him. No more." And that's when he comes to that decision. Instead of Cameron giving in to Ferris, D decides he's done with his friend that has held him back, that has needed him to save him time and time again. *Megatron* has no time for such weakness, especially not when Sentinel needs to die. Primus I loved this movie and it's honestly one of, if not the best of any Transformers movie ever.

[@JoshuaDrmr]

You can tell people love hearing like minded thoughts, I really really liked how you expanded on these plot points, awesome video! I especially liked the evolution of deceptions (those who con deception? Like that from sentinel?) and autonomous-bots, this part really stood out to me as I hadn’t seen a proper explanation of their roles before I think its a funny choice they only showed the high guard leaving with Megatron, as I think there are ulterior motives in Starscream following immediately with the banished brother. I’m hoping they build on this like like WFC and FOC did with his dethroning attempts, but this does miss out on his relationship with jetfire…

[@DeltaTrion]

100%. As I said to my buddy, while I do miss some major players like Jetfire, its obvious that this movie is focused on Orion and D, and that adding in too many others would probably have weighed it down in a bad way. They can always expand on the ideas though. Would love to see some stories of other bots!

[@JoshuaDrmr]

@@DeltaTrion Definitely agree, its already a lot to digest for new fans and another 30 mins of more stuff would turn them away. 5 more of the two would absolutely work in the main point’s favor, as you said!

[@DeltaTrion]

It's very easy for people to forget how long 30 minutes is hahah, which is why I brought this point up!

[@loonflam8910]

I noticed when listening to the soundtrack that the moment D drops Orion, the score "The Fall" plays, which is both literal (Orion falling through the layers of Cybertron) and metaphorical (D murdering Sentinel and proclaiming himself as Megatron). Yet another reason for me to cry over this movie

[@FengTheSlayer]

coinsidence that this video was recomended to me after recently watched Transformers One. You nailed the analysis of D-16's character arc very well

[@wreckitralphfan0017]

This take on megatron, in my opinion, was PHENOMENAL! the perspectives on power, the acting by Brian Tyree Henry, even the relationships notably changing throughout! Absolutely loved this film and fingers crossed for a sequel

[@leegofilms]

Did Orion and D-16 want the same thing? It seemed to me like D wanted justice, and attention, but never a better world for their people. Even the Matrix quest was to please Sentinel. And he often talks about how *he* was wronged.

[@DeltaTrion]

Great point. While Megatron’s motives are much more selfish, he does mention building a better world AFTER he tears down Sentinel’s

[@angle188]

Exactly. Orion always is constantly talking about “Us”, “We”, and “Together.”. For him, it’s never about him or any other single bot, it’s about EVERY Cybertronian. Every single bot around them all working together, united as one towards building a better future. From beginning to end, he’s constantly showcasing his purity, his genuine hope in a better future for their people and home, how they *all* could be so much more then what others would have them believe, how he refused to leave behind D-16 during the Iacon race despite the fact that he actually would’ve been able to come in first place if he ran ahead. Or how he didn’t hesitate for a second to risk his skin in order to save Jazz’s life despite the likely consequences he’d face, or the fact that, again, he could’ve died himself. Or, one of my favorite scenes of Orion/Optimus, where he rallies up the Miners and motivates them to stand up for themselves, to fight, to *choose* their own destinies. Not for Sentinel, not for the bots with cogs, not even for HIM, but for themselves, for their freedom and their right to live as autonomous beings. Orion Pax/Optimus Prime is motivated by Justice, Hope, and Freedom for all of those around him. D-16 was motivated by his rage, his want for vengeance, and a drive for power to oppress and slaughter all of those who had in turn oppressed him. Along with any who would ever dare stand in his way. We see during the period after he nearly *executes* Starscream for just dueling him, he basically is encouraging and perfectly in line with the philosophy of “might makes right.” He didn’t care about giving the people of Cybertron their own choice, he thought it was meaningless even. The only thing that mattered to him was getting his vengeance, and anyone who stood in his way, even the one who’d he call his brother in arms, would suffer the same fate. And afterwards, he wanted to torch everything to the ground, destroy everything and slaughter everybody who represented Sentinel’s broken and corrupt society, killing literally everyone in the process. And thus dooming Cybertron to an era that would’ve been even worse than Sentinel’s, one where Megatron was the bloodthirsty megalomaniac, the one who ruled with an iron fist and stood at the top, because Megatron refused to ever be under the heel of *anyone* ever again. Sorry that this is so long. I love this movie and I couldn’t think of any other way to shorten what I wanted to say in particular without cutting a few things out lol.

[@leegofilms]

@@angle188 Really well said. Though, one thing I would love to see expanded upon in a future @DeltaTrion video, is how messy Prime’s and Meg’s fallout is. I’ll be watching the movie again soon, but I remember distinctly leaving the theater thinking this could have been prevented. There are several moments where I felt Prime and Megs could’ve saved their friendship and each other. The one that comes to mind most is when Pax compares D-16 to Sentinel. You see the pain on D’s face, then it turns to anger, and he declares he won’t let anyone in his way. I believe-in that moment-Pax meant D was matching Sentinel’s cruelty, but D-16 heard it as Pax calling D a fraud like Sentinel. Yes, there’s that ideological difference they have, but their friendship falling apart is what condemned that rift. The fact some potentially healing moments were prevented by circumstances (like a moment interrupted by an attack), or bridges burned by choices (Prime choosing to exile Megs, D-16 dropping Pax), it really gives everything a tragic feel.

[@WorthlessDeadEnd]

​@leegofilms It just goes 5o show how dangerous and ultimately disastrous making personal vows so that we will never allow ourselves to be vulnerable again can be.

[@sssarc]

I think that it was the abruptness of the transition from D-16 to Megatron that actually facilitated the emotional impact of this movie in a more intense fashion. We go from seeing a character that seems grounded and reasonable to one that is rash and hateful. That quick transition made it feel like a slap in the face, aiding in making this movie have the impact that it did in the final moments.