David Lynch's Dune (1984) | VFX Notes Podcast Ep 9

[@aldoaldana191]

This is the best podcast talking about VFX and just want to say thank you for all the effort in this podcast, after Cinefex passed away I think this is the best source of VFX also I will be waiting for the podcast of Jodorowsky, I believe is going to be a madness. Also, I would like to listen to your opinion about the strike in the USA in the film industry, do you think could be a good option to have a union in the VFX because we are the only department without a union and is weird how the directors they don't give enough credit to us, when I watch the interviews they just talk about the script and the awards looks like the same. Ok, lets to give this award to these kids who do something on the computer sorry if I extend a little bit but I am curious about this topic and maybe a podcast about this for me will be great thanks, guys :-)

[@daniiltabacari]

Marvelous episode, since it’s one of the most influential films for me, I had a great time with you guys! Thank you. Laughed a lot towards the end, ahaha, thank you, great episode!

[@HugosDesk]

Thanks so much for watching. I still remember watching Dune when I was very young! It had a huge impact on me at the time! It was amazing at the time! I love it to!

[@cheddarcheese7928]

The sadness when speaking of ur cat touched me..I love my cats as well.True members of the family..Hope ur heart heals

[@HugosDesk]

Thanks so much for your words. It is very sad to lose a loved one like that after 16 years. Thank you

[@falconvisuals3357]

I think some props and stuff from the movie were forgotten in churubusco studios, and someone made a movie with the lost material called "Dos Nacos en el Planeta de las Mujeres"

[@HugosDesk]

OMG! I need to watch that film! Thanks so much! I had no idea! Is the film good?

[@falconvisuals3357]

@@HugosDesk No problem!! I don't know I haven't watched it yet lol, i'ts in spanish tho, the director is Alberto Rojas

[@HugosDesk]

Need to find it to watch it!

[@danielmiller1826]

I am now on a mission to watch this movie!

[@Wazulon]

I listened to the podcast last night and just realised you have the video version up on the YT. I'm old enough to have gone to see Dune in theatres when it came out. I hadn't read the book, couldn't really tell what was going on and thought some of the effects looked awful even at that time. But at the same time. The costumes and sets were amazing, the shields were awesome. Mr Guild Navigator was like some weird sexual thing gone wrong and the still suits were rad. All in all I have a very soft spot for this movie. And I wish we could somehow smooosh the new one and the old one together and take the best of both to make "Ultimate Dune" PS. I thought the Sandworms in the original were pretty rad... Thanks for the awesome content chaps. Waz in Brisbane.

[@HugosDesk]

Thanks so much for watching the video version. We try our best to add as much BTS footage as we can to these podcasts. Glad you enjoyed it. I also agree, there is something special about this film that was missing on the new one, in my opinion. A hybrid would have been amazing. I think it’s the weirdness of Lynch that made it be so different.

[@EricPoulsen]

WRT the shield effects: I actually did see this in the theater in it's initial release, and I was indeed blown away by the shield effects.

[@TonyBraun]

I really enjoy listening to you guys chat.......a talk on Jadorowsky's Dune would be great.

[@HugosDesk]

Thanks so much. Don’t worry! It’s happening! Have you see the documentary? I wish Taschen would publish that book he has at his house!

[@TonyBraun]

@@HugosDesk Yes, I've seen the documentary, and loved the artwork......I think the will and the talent existed, at the time...... but not the technology to pull it off. Stories like Dune can't be reduced to a 2 hour movie, it needs to be a series.....or at least a trilogy.

[@HugosDesk]

Hopefully WB green lights part 2 so Denis Villeneuve can make this story justice!

[@daniiltabacari]

I was curious what’s wrong with a first movie, you were mentioning it from the start, at 20th minute I finally get it. Recent movie tells a story in a much better way for sure. It’s much clearer now, and I am happy that a broader audience can get familiar with this universe.

[@serjkirchano1931]

awesome podcast, you, guys!

[@HugosDesk]

Thanks so much

[@Reticuli]

2010 is a great film. The Spicedriver version of Dune is pretty good, though I miss the rain at the end. Lynch's Dune is like the old timers who built the Saturn V and landed us on the moon, versus the kids at Space X. People also forget what was filmed: the guns were resin, wood, copper, brass. The sets were hardwood, marble, real metal, rock, gold leaf. The costumes for the principals were linen, silk, leather, etc. This film would have been insanely expensive, except that the studio didn't pay many of the craftsmen or materials vendors, and skipped out of town. Production was stopped, post was stopped (including anymore 'rotoscoping' mattes of the eyes on the footage that was left on the cutting room floor), and the already finished footage was cut into something they could release. I wonder if when they asked Lynch to shorten the water of life scene if that's the point he negotiated full control over his next project. As for the worms, they could have gotten away with showing less of them and fewer long shots, in the same way we didn't see much of the shark in Jaws because it was tough to pull off. Showing just parts would have been better. That and the fight scenes' not entirely lucid editing, though, you can blame on those who cut the film. They did have a lot of shots of the worms already done, so it makes sense they made use of it.

[@michaelcooney9368]

The optical and VFX on old DUNE I kinda had a peeve with since they had bigger budget than Return of the Jedi, which still has good effects. But Emile Ruiz's forced perspective trick shots, I mean, that stuff was amazing looking, almost flawless even today.

[@trashpandaqc]

That was a really good point about how CG ends up being less experimental in modern movies - I think it's totally possible to mess around and find an unexpected composition with any medium, but it seems like having a giant team and planning and previsualizing everything must kill the chances of that. Would love to see a newer Dune (or any sci fi) from some small outsider team of Blender/Unreal users rather than a studio.

[@HugosDesk]

I would love that too my friend

[@hooley1174]

Love watching this!

[@HugosDesk]

Thanks so much, we love doing it! I can’t wait to see the new Dune in a few days. Have you seen it?

[@ogabrielcasanova]

That was such an awesome video. That's exactly what i needed for my day, two guys gushing and geeking out about a movie i LOVE. I'm aware of the flaws but i can't help but love this movie!! Also, btw, i would love more eps on dune :)) Since you guys know about VFX stuff, i have a question. Green screen effects on dune always appeared for me to have kind of a thick black outline around them (i think you can see most of those when the fremen start jumping on the giant sandworm). Was this a general 80s thing or was it because of the way they made the film? I remember watching Star Wars and Flash Gordon and not noticing as much. Now a question for Hugo: Was this movie, in your eyes, a tiny little bit more popular in portugal? I know the movie was generally better recieved in europe but you're like the fourth portuguese person that i see being a fan of the movie since as a kid. I wonder if it had some better publicity in portugal?: )

[@HugosDesk]

Thanks so for your kind words. Glad you enjoyed it. That’s a lot of questions but going to try to reply to all! First one: the black edges are a sub product of optical compositing. This means that compositing back on these days was made in large machines that could re-photograph the plates. Difficult to explain in a short way but they had to use physical masks and cover sections of the frame to composite another layer! So they would expose the negative a second time to ‘comp’ another layer. They would also use blue screens and use optical compositing to ‘key’ the blue out using chemical photography processes just like a dark room in traditional photography. Here’s a nice link about optical printers: en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Optical_printer

[@HugosDesk]

Regarding Dune’s popularity, yes Portugal has a huge European tradition and culture with French new vague and Western European movies. We do watch a lot of, what people consider ‘art movies’ and yes Portugal was a fan of David Lynch so it was normal that people went to see Dune because of Elephant Man and Eraser Head. The Dune novels are also very popular in Portugal for some reason!

[@ogabrielcasanova]

@@HugosDesk Thank you so much for the kind and thought out answers! Really glad to learn more about optical effects and Portugal! Grew up with CGI so it's always very interesting for me to learn about them.

[@BlauwFilms]

best vfx podcast hahaha

[@HugosDesk]

You are too kind! Thank you so much, my friend!

[@thierry-VFX]

Because of the technical issues at that time and the director's vision, Jodorowsky's version would have been a magnificent disaster :)

[@HugosDesk]

Yes it would but I would still love to watch it! I hope they release that book he shows on the doc!

[@thierry-VFX]

@@HugosDesk Me too !

[@Thebrainymonkey]

I have a few different versions of this on DVD/Bluray. I much prefer it to Villeneuve's version, which for me, despite excellent VFX is very dull. Lynch's version despite it's faults is full of colour, melodrama and is very compelling. I also have a soft spot for the TV series from the millennium, which I think was made in the Czech Republic.

[@daniiltabacari]

Why you pronounce June ?

[@HugosDesk]

What are you talking about? I say Dune!

[@daniiltabacari]

it’s Ian. :) ^^ . All the love guys!

[@HugosDesk]

Haha, well get a Portuguese and a Australian talking and accents will prevail! 😆

[@danielmiller1826]

I was taken to see this movie in the cinema, I was 8 and it was a pretty mindblowing. I disagree with Lynch being "the wrong director", maybe Laurentis was the wrong producer. Lynch capture the weirdness of a world of mentats, Spice, giant worms and mutated navigators. I had no trouble following the main story anymore than Star Wars. Also worth remembering that at this time there were so many bad imitations of Star Wars trying and Dune was doubly plagued by this risk as Star Wars had taken so many of its ideas and got them on the big screen first. I love the different aesthetics for different planets - even different countries on Earth have very different feels, how much more so for planets light-years apart. Having just watched the new film I felt that I was feeling the gaps using the book and so I really didn't feel that it was a clearer telling despite having more running time to breath. I did like that the new Dune established the prophecies and Bene Gesserit meddling rather than true revelations. Lastly I love the fact the 1984 film has colours, I really can't abide teak and teal and would have loved to see the new film with a more naturalistic grade.

[@smithdream]

DUNE 1984 is more visually akin to BARBARELLA & FLASH GORDON.

[@HugosDesk]

Well, that is because films had a certain look at that time! Mostly because of the current technology! Not everyone was ILM back then! They were ahead of the curve!

[@smithdream]

@@HugosDesk I meant the interesting costumes, props, costumes and designs. They have a more far out and Cult vibe than mainstream Sci-Fi films. Maybe more European looking than American. DUNE 1984 is a classic late night Cult film. BARBARELLA and FLASH GORDON were more jokey and camp. GALAXINA also has similar Cult designs in it. I've always batched these four Cult Sci-Fi films together for their style.

[@daniiltabacari]

Yeah, shield in a new movies is not as impressive, punchy or grungy as in a first movie.

[@HugosDesk]

Absolutely! I would love to see a new version of this shield! Like the Loki portal type VFX!

[@walt_man]

thought this was about Dune and not vaccination rates!? You a Doctor or Immunologist? Weird.. just weird.

[@HugosDesk]

What are you talking about man?

[@walt_man]

Not hating on YOU, just vax comments have aged badly for EVERYONE. As for the Dune podcast, this one is great. Learning even more about one of my favorite underrated films. The studios and reviewers dog piled on this film, and it didn't deserve it. It deserved praise and a sequel.. For example, the Baron fly's so perfectly, you never even question to how it's done. It's just done.

[@walt_man]

@@HugosDesk at @2:24 - I thought the guy on the right was Hugo. Sorry bout that.

[@dragonflixchannel]

There are so many mistakes in this. Come on guys, if you are going to discuss a film please your facts right.

[@HugosDesk]

I will make sure to ‘please’ my facts next time! Thanks