DAY 11: Exploring 6 Old Houses in Crete, Greece - Are They Worth Renovating?

[@Sunpire]

Are old houses worth renovating/restoring?🤔 Please press the 👍🏻 Thank you!🙏💙

[@menelpro]

@@Sunpire expect at least 1000eu/sqm and a lot of trouble with the technicians

[@Hope_Boat]

I bought and renovated an old stone village house in the Cyclades a few years ago. My advice, found one you can "camp" in during the works. Don't ever expect the workers come at the expected dates. Do as much as you can yourself if you have the knowhow. In the long term old village houses with thick walls, small windows are better for summertime because they usually don't need air conditioning. They are tricky to heat in the winter but winters are short in southern Greece. (Not in the mountainous areas thought). It was the best investment in my life but it I bought in the middle of the Greek crisis. Prices are crazy expensive nowadays.

[@Sunpire]

thank you very much for watching us and for your advice 💙🤍💙🤍. If we buy something, we will try to do everything by ourself .

[@Kevin-zz9nc]

I love following your story with you and your lovely wife. You VERY lucky man!!!

[@Sunpire]

Thank you, my friend!🙏 we really appreciate it!😊

[@Rachelgpuentes]

VAMOS (in Spanish) means LET'S GO! I'm Mexican American and that's what it translates to in our language. I love to watch your house hunting adventure videos. Keep looking and don't give up. You will find the right one!!

[@Sunpire]

I knew this isn't a greek word 😅. Thank you for watching and for your support 🙏 💙 I'm glad you enjoy our series.😊 We'll still be looking!

[@geogeo2299]

Hola!

[@ΔημητρηςΓεωργακακος]

Buying a house in that state, especially on an island, is a classic "looking for trouble" case!

[@Sunpire]

Interesting 🤔 why is that? Would love to hear some more information!

[@johnmax5652]

most exp is to remove a wreck house than to build on empty space... Cheers !!!

[@Sunpire]

Interesting!🤔 I was thinking it's an additional cost if you have to demolish. Maybe it's worth it if it can be restored without demolition. Thanks for watching 🙏

[@arostos258]

As a local residence in chania i would like to inform you that the whole chania perfecture has a huge problem of housing ! even the locals cannot find a house to rent or buy! especialy in apokoronas region the last 30 years huge investments were made in real estate and the prices where skyrocketed due to high demand . in particular vamos , kalyves , almyrida ,plaka ,kefalas are the villages with the most expensive houses new or renovated . The majority of those renovated villas are now luxurius turist accomodation ! also in the closeby villages to vamos are full of expats who bought the land or the old house in cheap or at least reasonable prices whithin the past 30 years . Nowadays is very difficult to renovate an old house because the prices are extremely high and the cost of materials and workers is increased

[@geogeo2299]

Seriously 115 k for a ruin, that place looks like it's abandoned since at least the 1980s.

[@Sunpire]

How about that one with 410 000€ ? What do you think about that?

[@bwana-ma-coo-bah425]

Firstly let me say I love Crete. Mainland Greece, some places are nice. The high prices are not only in Crete, but all through out Greece. The Greek government has lied to get into the EU and this is only one example. Let me give you an example. Lets say for the point of this exercise you have a large piece of land and it is a water front property. You go to the bank (EU) and want a loan to build a hotel. The bank says to you okay. Here is 5 million euro. You can have the money, interest free, however after 10 years we want our money back. Ten years have past, you have not built the hotel and have spent the money. The bank says, we want our money. You say I have no money. Now you have a problem. The reason Germans for example are buying up Greece is because the Greek government is giving them tax breaks and reducing their debt. The reason many Greeks can't afford to buy is because they are liars, lazy, thieves and believe the world owes them a living. Why is it that Albanians in Greece can afford to buy property but Greeks can not? In todays world it does not make sense to have a war. It makes sense to starve the people, put up the prices and move them out leaving all the housing and infrastructure in place. This is what is known as a silent war. What the Greek government should be doing is not allowing foreigners to buy in Greece. The other issue is. Greeks are taking advantage of selling at high prices. Please don't take my comment as a personal attack.

[@Sunpire]

We did notice that! You can't really find anything affordable close to Chania. And Apokoronas area...I don't get it at all. Why does everyone want to live there?

[@geogeo2299]

@@bwana-ma-coo-bah425 I'll tell you why Albanians can buy property, It's because Greece cancelled its borders and let them in since 1990, so that they could flood the employmenty market with cheap unregistered labor and boom the country's unemployment rate up from 6% in 1990 to 12% in 1999. Essentially it was Greece that bore the full brunt for Albanians sporting a Maoist regime for 50 years and then collapsing, and escaping Albania shoe-less.

[@SomewhatRetired]

Oh 😮 Arriving there Sunday!

[@Sunpire]

In Vamos?

[@SomewhatRetired]

Yes!

[@Sunpire]

Have a lovely time! 💙

[@Hill_Master]

They say that the Greek language sounds a little like Spanish because both have many words that end with the letter "s" that's why "Vamos" sounds Spanish to you but to Greeks it doesn't sound foreign

[@Sunpire]

Does Vamos mean something in the greek language?

[@Hill_Master]

@@Sunpire no, nothing specific

[@mannins79]

Don't worry guys, you will find your dream house ❤

[@Sunpire]

Thank you!🙏🤗 hopefully, we'll find something 😅

[@menelpro]

The house you entered it's a nice property despite it looks in ruins. The walls look very good hence the stones. It is in Vamos, a place many expats live since 30 years now. So it must be reasons none Englishman or Jew with a large wallet hasn't bought it. Maybe inheritance issues, who knows. Did you check the awesome house across the street? With the green large metal door. It's so beautiful.

[@Sunpire]

Yes, the walls were in great condition, and it would be easier to renovate. Why do you think expats prefer that area? I don't really get it🤔 We inly checked the ones we showed in the video.😊

[@menelpro]

@@Sunpire first off all, in my opinion, and many others as it seems, Apokoronas is the most beautiful part of Chania and Crete in general. The combination of mountain and sea views are unmatched. You will see it for yourself after the snow fall on the White mountains in a couple of months. Another very beautiful area imo is Marathi. Also because of the rainfalls this region is very green. Gavalohori is slightly more beautiful than Vamos for me but both villages are by far more beautiful than the other Chania villages. Unfortunately prices are crazy BUT if you have some cash you can make an offer to the owner and see what he will say. Don't go through a real estate agency they look at you as a moving euro note.

[@Sunpire]

Thank you for all the advice!🙏 really appreciate it! It is very beautiful indeed!💙

[@vtecroar6196]

It's not like that if you have house from stone in Greece you will eventualy have to demolish it due tro the eartquakes ? I heard they only aprove buildings from concrete nowdays.

[@DAK-fm8wd]

Hello, love your videos!! totally of topic what brand are the man's sunglasses?? Love them! Thank you!

[@Sunpire]

Hi!💙 thank you for watching! I'm glad you're enjoying our videos!🙏 the blue lenses ones are from River Island (shop in UK) and the reat of them probably TKMAX, different brands, he has so many😂

[@DAK-fm8wd]

@@Sunpire Thank you ❤🙏

[@dkib2006]

Old houses are like that because usually they have multiple owners that can't agree on what to do with the property. It is a mine field.

[@Sunpire]

I guess there are a lot of things that can make an old house hard to sell...

[@tedn6855]

Good for you I am glad you say it as it is. The real estate market is completely broken in greece. Most of those properties would be 1 dollar houses in italy. Because of the lack of a centralized real estate board no one knows what the prices should be. This is hurting sellers more than buyers as they are given false hope someone would buy their garbage. The truth is nothing is selling and most of these properties will either remain abandoned or on auction. Everyday hundreds if not thousands of properties are being auctioned in greece. Me and my wife have been looking and it's hard to find a good property without a house that has been left to rot. The additional cost makes the asking price too high. If people were either realistic or took care of their properties this problem wouldn't exist.

[@Sunpire]

It is difficult to find something affordable for sure. There is too much demand, I think. Unfortunately, prices will only increase. As you say, there are properties that have been on the market for a really long time. Usually, those are not a good deal and will probably stay there until they are willing to negotiate or someone willing to pay. But we have to be optimistic. It's never easy to find a good deal. Good luck with your search!😊

[@tedn6855]

@Sunpire I actually don't think there is demand or the properties wouldn't sit. There is an upswing I. Athens from the lows of the crisis and that is hitting a limit as the locals are now priced out. But the hype of foreigners coming is just that. There are Israelis going now but not in places I would be interested in. I know you don't want to get involved in auctions as it might leave a bad taste especially if you have to live with locals. But there are far too many properties going to auction now to ignore.

[@Sunpire]

@tedn6855 What website is this one with auctions? Is it a legit one from the government, or is it private? And how does it work?

[@tedn6855]

@Sunpire I can't vouch for them as I am not set up. I don't have my taxisnet yet. But propserty I'd the company I believe runs I auction. They said for 248 euros they will guide you through 3 auctions. All auctions are on government site but they have their own platform for you to take part.

[@tedn6855]

I have to be honest I am looking outside this process still but once I move to greece I will use for investment property. You can't view homes. So you need to do some detective work which requires you te be in greece

[@Jojo-bm4tb]

listen to the old folks about ghost hauntings before anything else.

[@Sunpire]

What about ghost hauntings?😅

[@Jojo-bm4tb]

@@Sunpire old houses have a lotta history. some unsavory, some are not. 😁

[@TintesanDarius]

😮❤

[@Sunpire]

💙

[@vlakas3354]

The only reason of high prices is demand from foreigners and rental investemnts. In any other circumstances these abandoned houses wouldn't even be worth 20.000. Ask locals about owners and if they have contacts or someone that knows, maybe that way you can find someone that agrees at the real lower price. Agencies know who they target and they inflate the prices. Do research across many villages and you will spot how the price range changes based on how known the village is to foreigners.

[@Sunpire]

You're right! Thank you for the advice. 🙏This is what we're trying to do. Hopefully we'll find something 😊

[@tedn6855]

The prices of those selling isn't high. Finding. Buyer or seller is hard as the real estate market is broken. The realtors should all be fired. I have been looking and no realtor will show me. Property they don't list. There is no central board hence no data. You don't even get comparables. In one village I had to book with 6 different realtors.

[@fredkarenclark4551]

Sent you a message, sorry we missed you....back to Heraklion

[@Sunpire]

Where did you send us a message?

[@fredkarenclark4551]

@@Sunpire I replied to the message you sent previously on KZbin

[@Sunpire]

Sometimes KZbin doesn't show us the new replies in the comments. It's difficult to track them. Some of them even get deleted. The best way is to contact us by email. 🙏

[@fredkarenclark4551]

@@Sunpire what is your email?

[@Sunpire]

[e-mail]

[@Stelios.Posantzis]

I had typed a long comment which, as usual with long comments, got randomly deleted by KZbin and I don't have the patience to re-type it. Basically I align myself with those who advise you to build a new house. Reasons, briefly are: a) building a new house is far simpler than restoring, both legally, and technically b) Greece is earthquake prone c) new buildings are more energy efficient and have more space etc. d) rules, regulations, local know-how of how things get done and what constraints there are are complicated and extremely time consuming -- anything involving the state is -- but, unluckily, in the countryside, getting things built is strangely even more frustrating and takes longer (might not apply to your particular location -- just generalising here) and it takes time to learn, accept, digest and make use of all this new information e) old houses range in amount of rebuilding required -- there are always hidden problems, by that I mean structural f) anything bar a perfectly preserved old house with intact roof, doors and windows (i.e. one that just requires some freshening up) is a money trap: essentially a civil engineer will tell you to erect a concrete frame inside the four walls and basically just build a new house inside a stone wall shell --- that won't save you that much money as it may seem, it will just mean more restrictions as far as the house design You are a young couple and have plenty of energy. Whether you want to test your patience and mental resilience by embarking on an old stone house restoration or re-building is ultimately a decision you will take. Building a new house might take longer or might not. It all depends. Build your knowledge, get advice, find a civil engineer or an architect to ask all the questions you can think of. Ask around a lot. Then ask again. Remember some people are not reliable, those that are can be hard to find and not everyone gives reliable information, whether you pay them a lot for it or nothing at all. Selecting the right people to work with is paramount.

[@Stelios.Posantzis]

One last thing: if you buy an old house which does not have external stone walls, this means you'll still get an old house with many issues and in addition you'll have no insulation so summers and winters will be unbearable (you'll be spending a lot on heating or air-conditioning which is far from ideal).

[@Sunpire]

Thank you so much for taking the time to write this, twice! We really appreciate it! 🙏 We noticed this issue with KZbin. Some people emailed us that they can’t comment at all.😔 There's so much valuable information here, I hope everyone watching the video is reading this! We're still doing research and ask around as you say. Before buying anything, we'll definitely ask for some advice from an engineer. We thought we'd save some time and money if we don't have to get a building permit. From what we understood in this area, it can take a really long time (2-3 years) to get it, and the renovation/restoration permit would be easier to obtain, faster, and cheaper. Thank you for all the advice, again! We'll definitely think about it and try to get some more information.

[@shahar664]

You guys you could find a beautiful piece of land of up to one acre for €50 to €60 thousand euros and build a lovely house for about €100.000 (about €1000 per m2).

[@Sunpire]

That would be great, but unfortunately, we don't have that kind of resources for the job 😕 😞

[@shahar664]

@@Sunpire …also, try your search on the mainland. West cost (around Parga) east cost (the cost of Pelion) or the north cost just outside Thessaloniki. These are beautiful places note too touristy and prices can be lower. Also they would be closer to amenities such as, god forbid, hospitals and the such. Good luck anyway! I’ll be checking in on you.

[@Sunpire]

Thank you! We appreciate the support!🙏💙

[@samury_0]

Just curious... Have y'all learned any Greek words yet?

[@Sunpire]

We learned some words, but it's still a really long way to go

[@ChamberlainOlympic]

Run .... before the bills and taxes come... Absolutely a nightmare.. I renovate an old traditional home in Romania and I am happy with the gov... You will not be with the Greek one.. Καλά κουράγια βρε παιδιά . Να είστε καλά και να βρείτε ότι αγαπάτε.

[@geogeo2299]

Wht the deal here with GR and RO, are we exchanging populations or something.

[@Sunpire]

@@geogeo2299 🤣🤣🤣 we are apparently, there are other greeks from Romania that watch our videos

[@Sunpire]

What taxes do you need to pay after you own a house in Greece?

[@bwana-ma-coo-bah425]

@@Sunpire Not even the Greek government knows. They make it up as they go along.

[@ChamberlainOlympic]

@@Sunpire Depends on many many many parameters. Its complicated just to tell you a number. In general its start from 2 euro to 12 euro /sqm . But this is very general. To buy and transfer a home to your name you need 3% of the price of the home based on the taxes list.

[@horror11]

just dont. all this houses are just on the plot to allow the new owner to just build a new one without much hassle , because they can just "rennovate" the house, but they dont they build new ones but make it formally as if they rennovate and no one cares afterwards. ppl who rly do renovate, mostly expats, are going to have alot of trouble and its just not worth, unless u plan to make ur next years of videos about how u rennovate ur house and how losing ur braincells with the trouble. how u even know that u will stay here in 10 years? so many things change and most things in greece change to the worse. perhaps when u are 40 or 50 and decide this will be ur house to retire but then again u should buy a big plot outside of a village and not on a mainroad. good luck

[@Sunpire]

Thank you! The reason why we thought about renovating an old house is because as you say, you don't have to apply for a building permit. There are advantages and disadvantages to it of course. With our budget it''s complicated😅 Thanks for the advice!😊

[@horror11]

@@Sunpire the thing is the ppl who DO renovate are doing this mostly by themselves over years, thats the only way u can do this with low costs. unless u ppl are professionals who know how to do this, u will pay just as much or even more than just build a new cheap house. thats why the owners of the plots dont demolish this houses, so that the greek who buy this plots can easily build a new house without the need for all the formalities bcause the "house" is already there and just gets "renovated" but they demolish it and at the same day the put most likely a prefab on it and declare it as "renovated". its an illegal way but thats why the greek do it. i see zero chance for u to save any money (most likely u would pay alot more) unless the workers will work for free. i mean how do u think u can "rennovate" a total ruin without roof and isolation and so on without entirey rebuilding the entire house and use maybe here and there some structures for notalgic reasons? rly its just a h loophole they use to place a new house on a plot with a ruin without having the bureucracy. there is no way a regular person who cannot build by himself like 80% of it at least in a professionell way to ever get this done with a low budget its impossible.

[@giwrgosv]

Don't believe anything you read on the internet. Especially on legal matters. If you want to buy a property pay a lawyer to examine the papers of the property to assure that the seller actually owns the property he is selling you.

[@Sunpire]

Of course! We will definitely do that when we find something we consider buying. Thank you for watching and for the advice! 🙏💙We really appreciate it! Any tips you have, send them our way😊

[@bwana-ma-coo-bah425]

Save your sanity and your bank account. Buy a block of land and build a new house. It will be cheaper and you will build what you want and not what some one else wants to give you. To quote Eminem. "The moment, you own it, you better never let it go (Go) You only get one shot, do not miss your chance." The years will go quickly, you will be 50 years old before you know it and the prices will keep rising and not be able to buy. Don't forget to name your first child after me.😉

[@Sunpire]

The thing with building here is that it takes ages to get a permit. We asked around, and there are people waiting for 2-3 years. That's crazy!🙈 That's for sure, the prices are rising everywhere. We haven't forgot about that🤣🤣

[@bwana-ma-coo-bah425]

@@Sunpire Buy some land now, put a caravan or similar on it. Save your money living in the caravan, until you get a permit. I was in the building industry. So I am happy to supply you a design. I would not build with traditional building styles of Greece. Build a timber framed house. And also make sure it is a minimum of 1200mm off the ground for ventilation. 1800 is ideal for parking your car underneath. And use a Hebel type product (this can be found on the internet)to clad the exterior. Hebel will go up quickly and has far more superior thermal qualities. Instead of it being a 12 month build, it will only be a 6 months build. Then render the exterior walls what ever colour you like. It will look like a traditional Greek house too. I would stay away from a tiled roof and use a metal roof. This will not allow vermin to enter and also it will last you a life time and you will never have to replace broken tiles. Use your house as a model to help others build one similar and you both can act as a project manager for people who want to build something similar in the future and make money doing so..

[@Sunpire]

You always have very interesting ideas! Keep them coming!💙 We are constantly thinking about different options, trying to find the best solution in our situation. It helps a lot to see different perspectives and ideas. One thing we noticed is timber and wood in general is very expensive here. Probably because there's not much here, so they have to import it. Also, there aren't many wooden builds here. Could that be a fire hazard if it's a wooden structure?🤔 Initially, we thought about building the structure from timber and OSB panels because it's easier, and there is a lot of information out there on how to do it. But living here, it seems like it would be way more expensive than we thought and maybe not as safe. Anyways, we'll do some more research and see. Thanks again for all your help and support! 🙏 We'll send you our Photoshop house plan for feedback when we get there 🤣

[@Hope_Boat]

@@bwana-ma-coo-bah425 being in my 50s I confirm I didn't saw it flaw by. Enjoy every minute.

[@bwana-ma-coo-bah425]

@@Hope_Boat do you mean, time will go quickly?