Dear Evan Hansen has some great songs but a horrible message

[@seinesalz]

I think if, at some point, Evan read an actual letter from the real Connor or his diary or something, really processed that he'd built up this fantasy on a person he never truly knew, and THEN came clean on his own volition, it could have done so much more for his character. I also wish they'd really shown how Connor's family felt after Evan coming clean without Evan involved. Just the family and their processing to really hit home that this really isn't about Evan, but about the family he hurt.

[@TheWeekIReview]

Quite!

[@captaincbt]

I honestly am in love with Dear Evan Hansen but can agree with you as someone who has struggled with suicidal thoughts myself it hurts that they use Connor’s death as a device to further the plot or just a prop and it hurts to see it

[@thebroadwaygeekishere2051]

The book explains it a lot more in depth and I am kind of disappointed that the musical just used it as a plot but I understand time is a thing to work by but I’m glad that they wrote the book afterwards to help its followers

[@christopherjimenez4578]

@@thebroadwaygeekishere2051 just like in your comment, you shouldn't have to read a book to understand the project it's based on.

[@catalinadog157]

I don’t really know if he was being used as a “prop” in the eyes of “that’s what suicide is.” My interpretation of it is that we’re seeing the musical unfold through evan’s eyes & his thoughts, which make him create this huge fantasy of a never existing friendship, making Connor appear as a prop, but in reality, this is simply how Evan is viewing it. Evan’s character is extremely manipulative and he tends to not know when to stop in order to make everyone happy; it seems as if this was just the musical itself and how the story unfolded rather than how the producers actually intended it to be

[@catalinadog157]

@Sebastian Alan ah I see. I’ve heard this perspective on the musical before but I couldn’t really grasp it. I’ve struggled with my fair share of suicidal thoughts & attempts, and I’ve never been able to see the point the commenter nor the video was trying to say. I guess it’s really up to interpretation at this point

[@catalinadog157]

@Sebastian Alan I’m doing fine now. Those thoughts clouded my mind right before quarantine. Im happier than I was then. I’ve gotten the right treatment for it and it doesn’t bother me anymore. I appreciate you checking in, very nice of you Sebastian. It confused me too, hence why I left the comment under OP’s comment

[@Iquey]

"this show is bleak as hell and it genuinely doesn't seem to know that." YES, THAT'S WHY THE UPBEAT MUSIC PISSES ME OFF. It's like they killed Connor TWICE. Real Connor commits suicide. Then his person is killed by a creation of an imaginary Connor.

[@_phong.huynh_]

*Upbeat catchy song intensifies*

[@JediJuniper92]

I legit thought the show was becoming a freaking American Psycho narrative when “Sincerely, Me” began in the theater, like I truly thought the movie was just embracing the sociopathic in Evan and running gleefully with it

[@lilia3944]

Upbeat music itself isn't really the issue in my opinion, bc a) cheerful melodies with dark lyrics can be really chilling, and b) yeah, Connor DOES get killed twice. It took me an embarassing long amount of time after watching the show to realize we're supposed to LIKE Evan - if they just made him the villain, or at least aknowledged all the damage he has done more, the show could be great because of how upbeat it seems to be.

[@gumixxxxx]

Firstly, great video in general. Secondly, I'm SO relieved to hear someone else say it, I thought I was missing something huge. DEH is not only poor representation of mental illness, but Evan is totally unlikeable aside from maybe some relatable anxiety. He lies to grieving parents because it's easier, he plays along because he likes the attention, he's honestly kinda predatory towards Zoe (Lies to her about all the things Connor loved about her and right after that super vulnerable exchange kisses her. Also getting that close with her with such a huge lie involved is just creepy), he plays up his lies for MORE attention, and he acts completely selfishly and impulsively. In the end he didn't even face any real consequences or really learn anything. The last scene just made me feel so bad for Zoe who had to pick up the broken pieces of her family, re process her bad relationship with Connor, and keep up a lie. I was honestly also very disappointed that we were never taught more about the real Connor. It's barely acknowledged that Evan's fantasy of him is completely made up based on projection and snap judgement. Honestly I was hoping the story would go something like [[[Connor commits suicide > Evan lies for attention like normal > real information about Connor is revealed to audience/Evan > Evan realizes how messed up his actions are and is forced to face his own issues and thoughts of suicide > Evan realizes that no one, not even Connor would wish that on him and that he still has the chance to be happy as long as he's alive > YAY moral of the story is one fucked up guy's death teaches another fucked up guy that suicide really isn't the answer and also some self reflection on mental health issues.]]] But yeah.... honestly it's such a relief to hear I'm not the only one disturbed by the message (or lack thereof) of DEH

[@TheWeekIReview]

Quite! It's such a strange series of creative decisions that all come down to a fundamental disinterest in actual people at the expense of the concept of humanity. It's like, "Isn't forgiveness good?!" without accounting for the human toll that can come with it, etc.

[@bornlazyyesterday6102]

OH MY GOD YOU SAID EVERYTHING, THANK YOU!

[@hillarymcguire817]

in a way i see where evan is coming from. he doesn't lie because its easier, he lies because he's terrified. as someone with social anxiety, i do sometimes lie to people instinctually because im scared to upset them or have anything bad happen from telling the truth. obviously this is never as extreme as evan, but still. and the point still stands because once hes dug into that lie out of fear (and in many ways because jared, one of his only influences , tells him to) he's even MORE scared and terrified as to what will happen if he comes out of it, and ive always seen that as the main reason he stayed in it and not because of the attention. although in words fail he does talk about how it was the family he always wanted, i think that was more of a reason why he was scared because there were these "connections" and he felt like it would only make things worse for everyone to tell the truth. NOT because of atttention. Because he had dug himself to far and he was too fucking scared (i will admit that zoe and evan's relationship isn't my favorite, however.)

[@samanthagingrich7185]

Truly, I’ve mulled over this for years now. Everyone I know that was super into this musical act like Evan is some relatable anti-hero or something, but even the most basic plot points are gigantic red flags about who Evan is. I have tried to like it but it always leaves me feeling gross. Good music, very uncomfortable story, and the die-hard fans make it kind of worse.

[@meaimae]

I have only listened to the show and your version is how I thought it played out. Knowing it's not like that at all makes it so weird!

[@roccer90]

I googled “dear Evan Hansen storyline is bad” to see if anyone else felt the same. The was the first video on google. Totally agree with everything you said. Music is phenomenal, message is pretty bad.

[@TheWeekIReview]

Love that.

[@heartsmyfaceforever8140]

The darkest thing I noted is that the parents thought it appropriate to give a friggen apparent suicide note to a 17 year old kid without consulting his parents first and the school was okay with this. Then the show spread a message of inspiration from and erased the actual message of the kid that died so he was never heard in the end anyway.

[@heather.chandler.musicals]

all i’m gonna say: evan hansen is just a “blah” character

[@moneybag908]

omg, watching your video was so hard for me because I love DEH so so much. Me taking things personally, I thought I was being attacked for how highly I praise DEH for being a great musical. Although I felt really opposed to your ideas, you had really great points about the musical and it's shortcomings. It really made me stop and rethink how I viewed DEH, so I thank you for sharing your thoughts and giving a different perspective. Also, nice vid. I like the little to no editing. Your opinions felt very real and genuine.

[@rhyss.3689]

100% yes! This musical has always sat so uncomfortably with me. It’s “uplifting” message is bitter on the tongue when you know that that message is built on a lie. It’s almost as if half way through the show, Dear Evan Hansen started believing Evan’s lie and does everything to make us believe it too. Or at least make us feel that it was all ok. I hated the romance with Zoe, and Evan seemed more than a little cowardly and manipulative throughout the whole thing - which on its own is not bad but when the framing of the show not only gives no consequences to a protagonists mistakes and tries to thematically insist that it was all for the best, that’s not great. And yet Requiem is one of my favourite broadway numbers from the last couple years and I feel staggered that its nuanced take on trying to grieve an abuser who’s seen to have been redeemed by their death is from a show that is so dumb in every other way. Milquetoast is definitely the word to describe its “stance” on issues. But when I hear that bridge and the lines “When the villain falls, the kingdom never weeps; no one lights a candle to remember, no, no one mourns at all as they lay them down to sleep; so don’t tell me that I didn’t have it right; don’t tell me that it wasn’t black and white. After all you put me through. Don’t say it wasn’t true. That you were not the monster...that I knew.” I will weep every time and feel so conflicted. After this and your Joker review you have most definitely earned a sub from me. Keep up the awesome work. Edit: tw suicidal ideation on a more personal note. I have both been close to being Connor and Evan. Especially in high school. I have found myself cowardly and manipulative because facing the consequences was just too hard, overwhelmed by my spiral of anxiety. I have also stood on the top floor of my school building and wondered if I would actually die or would it be useless and just hurt me in a way that would make my pain worse. I have seen myself in my worst self lashing out at those around me. I don’t want to be Connor. I don’t want to be Evan. And I don’t want to see media where our “mental health representation” is a boy who kills himself and his true voice is never heard except in heresay, and a cowardly liar who gets everything he wants. And I don’t want that media to be praised. Thank you so much.

[@TheWeekIReview]

I appreciate you opening up in that edit. Shit's hard. The way mental illness is treated in our pop culture is getting better, but there's still just so much garbage that gets all kinds of acclaim, and it's extremely frustrating. But it seems to me like the kind of willful ignorance thing. People just want to enjoy Requiem even though it's predicated on a lie; people just want to think Joker is really good because Joaquin Phoenix is a shockingly effective dancer. And I don't think either one is made by people who are actively anti-mentally-ill people; it doesn't seem as malicious as that. But intent ultimately doesn't matter here. The folks behind Dear Evan Hansen made a show that sends a terrible message and that's the reality of it.

[@fightingfaerie]

Its like you pulled my thoughts out of my head and explained it in a coherent way. The "uplifting" messages just feel like a double negative seeing how they are based on total untruths and bold faced lies.

[@g.t.3186]

The book gave a whole new insight into Zoey's part in Requiem. As kids, she and Connor got along amazingly well, teenagehood was when Connor changed for the worst. Her not being sure if she should or shouldnt mourn is much more impacful when you know this; she both loved and hated her brother, while she's glad that he's gone, she misses him too, and Evan lying made it much worse. Her whole situation is really sad.

[@HouseMDaddict]

Requiem was meant to be sarcastic and bitter for the most part. The book dear Evan Hansen was based on a true story from the high school days of one of the writers. I remember when a kid (years older than I was) committed suicide in my high school before it was a really common thing like it is nowadays and everyone was like "omg" for a week and then no one talked about it again. I didn't even really know the kid and I only remember it because it was the first time I'd even heard about someone committing suicide that I vaguely knew of. The book describes it a lot better than the musical, but Evan is not supposed to be a hero or even likeable by the end. Does Evan really get what he wants in the end? Not really. He's excommunicated, he tries to commit suicide a second time after coming clean, and he has the guilt of destroying an entire family on his conscience. Connor was the example of a kid no one knew or tried to know (except for Evan who kind of put together bits and pieces and could relate to the wanting to commit suicide and being misunderstood and ignored) and the reality that those kids often commit suicide and no one pays attention or remembers them. I never saw dear Evan Hansen as meant to be uplifting. It seemed meant to be like a look into how dark things can get when you go too far, how an opportunity to have everything you want can easily turn into manipulation and go very bad very quickly, how desperation and being enabled (either through friends allowing or absentee parent) to do whatever the hell you want is toxic.

[@thelittleredhairedgirlfrom6527]

@@HouseMDaddict the book is very different from the musical, and the musical is definitely trying to come across as uplifting.

[@cowboykelly]

in the book, Connor states that his suicide was really just an impulse decision, because Evan's letter had thrown him and his 'friend' Miguel (whom he had been very close to, but then drifted apart from) left him on read.

[@nobody_cares_jasmine5332]

Yeah, but I shouldn’t have to read a novel to enjoy or even understand the single most important moment that is the catalyst to everything in the musical. Especially a book written after the musical had already come out. it’s frustrating that we learn almost nothing about Conner and he’s just a plot device for the other characters. Knowing nothing about Conner makes it harder to understand the Murphy’s reactions in contrast to Evan and the general public. Especially when the people who know him the best are his Mom and Zoe and they have such a different opinion on him it makes hard to know who he is especially when we get Evan pushing a narrative that we see the most when he knows nothing about him and when the characters who actually know him also end up believing it makes it really hard to get through.

[@manuelorozco7760]

@@nobody_cares_jasmine5332 I was going to read the novel but I’m actually good now. And you do bring up good points. And knowing the real Connor before his Suicide would have made the story a little better

[@Syd_queen]

@@nobody_cares_jasmine5332 I understand that with a whole lot of people the don't wanna read the book that is usually always made before the musical but with the books it gives a lot more perspective etc etc. For musicals sadly they can't always fit certain things into the musical because it makes it to long or it gets cut blah blah blah. It definitely is weird knowing that Evan is lying to this family about Connor and its crazy how that's the plot of the story, but keep in mind that its not bad but its also conflicting because me as someone that has had suicidal thoughts its kinda weird reading/watching Dear Evan Hansen knowing that its based on Connors death buuuuuut its also intresting in a...intresting (idk) way

[@joghissing4634]

That hurted me so much

[@peblezQ]

I think people forgot that you can tell a story about suicide without anyone actually dying. In fact, I think it's better to tell stories of those who survive. I can see they kinda tried to go with that with Evan, but Connor's character deserved that as well.

[@BlasphemyBaby]

I agree with you, for pretty much all the reasons you vocalized. I love the music (Requiem is one of my favorite songs ever), and I do appreciate how, as someone with social anxiety, a lot of the music does really reflect the experience of living with social anxiety. But the story itself makes me cringe. I already detest "Snowball Lie" type stories (I find little more offputting in a character than when one lets a lie get to the point of hurting people and still doesn't fess up... why? Pride? How is that worth lying to this family about their dead son? No, I won't even accept social anxiety for that one, because I sure as shit wouldn't do that). But as someone who's also struggled with depression and suicide, "Disappear" and "You Will Be Found" give me ALL the mixed feelings. Sometimes, it's just what I need to hear to pull me out of a slump and I end up in tears, but other times, the context of the show creeps in and I'm like "Why should I find this at all inspiration when, in context, it's based on a massive, reprehensible lie?!" I'm so frustrated by this show. I want to love it, but I hate the plot SO MUCH.

[@TheWeekIReview]

Right?! I've never been so conflicted about a piece of theatre before. When I get ads for that group recording of You Will Be Found, I pretty much always play it from beginning to end because I just love it but I have to do so cognitively dissonant.

[@ethancarter5814]

I feel like... the music itself is a great way to support depression and suicide survivors, but the way it got there was so unfortunate. The only good thing is that a community came from Connor's death, even if it was based on a lie, because even though it is wrong to erase someone and forget about them and replace them with a fictional character, it's good to have a space where people feel comfortable to say some of their stories and find people online who feel like them, but it hurts so many people. It makes Zoey feel like she was really wrong, and it undermines her trauma. I don't know, I guess it's the kind of thing where, under different circumstances, creating a community like that is a very good thing. The way it was created was deeply flawed. I guess it's selfish but I would be glad that a community like that was made even if it was built on lies, because if it had grown strong enough, and Michael had finally released the truth or Evan himself had confessed it, then the family would see the truth of it and The community might be able to hold itself together without the original founder, ya know? But that's only in a potential situation and thinking way farther down the line. The plot line as it stands is crap and I hate it but I can see the light side of it too. Tldr: I agree and go through my thought process to that decision.

[@annolog]

I'm a bit late, but as stated in 'words fail' Evan didn't confess, because it's the life he dreamt of. A stereotypical family was all he ever wanted and it was right there.

[@BlasphemyBaby]

@@annolog Yep. You've identified the plot all right, especially as it pertains to the character motivation. That's certainly how this character is written. But I continue to disagree that this case is in any way sufficient to excuse the fallout. Again, as someone who experiences many of the same conditions Evan does, I am HORRIFIED that his struggles are used to excuse such awful behavior. I absolutely understand WHY the writers think he does what he does... I just don't accept that those actions were worthy of a sympathetic protagonist. Especially one who represents many of my struggles, as someone who also deals with social anxiety. :/

[@joseystrife8780]

@@ethancarter5814 when has anything based on a lie worked out for the better

[@peter_pansexual6243]

Read the book it's written with both Evan's and Connor's views it gives Connor way more depths

[@unusiplier5288]

Yes yes yes!!!! 1000 percent agree

[@alegria1813]

We shouldn't have to read the book, this should be in the musical

[@unusiplier5288]

@@alegria1813 they can't fit all the stuff from the book into the musical

[@collinkilloran5721]

Mozambitch yes yes yes

[@collinkilloran5721]

SXNSHlNE that’s not an excuse

[@FrancisFabricates]

As someone who was on the ‘suicide list’ at my high school, I totally agree. Things like this and 13 reasons just makes me so angry. They have made suicide into a circus and it makes me so angry. As of yet I don’t think anyone’s worked out how to get this to make sense. Broadway is so uplifting with how the music works that it’s very hard to make something this heavy actually stick the landing. It’s much easier to take angst and make it into something for everyone but the people who are suffering. It’s why bury your gays is such an issue. Why the abuse of POC is used to gain awards by who’re people who then get patted on the back for it. It’s a complex issue but it’s also quite simple. We need to spend time thinking about what happens to those who have had to survive this and the ones who didn’t and how the media we make will effect them or their legacy. Who does it help if it helps anyone at all. When things like this are made they work to smooth down the edges of issues that need to be shown for how harsh they are not made more palatable. Sending you love. Thank you for your honesty 💚.

[@TheWeekIReview]

Quite right! The only Broadway show I can think of that did it in a way that worked for me was Fun Home, in large part because it's really centered around that experience and trying to understand who and what and how and why and it uses "fun" numbers to make a point about escapism rather than distract you from how deeply fucked up the narrative is. I'm definitely drawing a blank on anything else.

[@FrancisFabricates]

@@TheWeekIReview totally agree actually. Because the story wasn’t about suicide. It’s just something that was a part of it, if that makes sense?

[@salad72057]

Whole not about suicide, I feel like Next to Normal works at least at showing how mental illness hurts the person and their loved ones

[@origamigirl11RK]

I just saw dear even hansen and your video is so validating. My sister took me to the play and told me id love it but the entire time I could help asking myself what the f?? Your video really validates aloy of my feelings.

[@miriamwilson3561]

I’ve never seen Dear Evan Hansen but Requiem hit me hard. I related to Zoe on an insane level. When my abusive brother died my family compared him to marvel heroes when I saw him as the clear villain. This musical sucks but at least I got some good out of it.

[@TheWeekIReview]

I'm sorry that you were subject to that, but it is good to hear that you got something out of it.

[@Bingewatchingmediacontent]

People just can’t come to terms with sometimes bad people die, and it’s ok to acknowledge that people are complicated, and even Saints aren’t actually perfect. But are treated as such upon death. I’m sorry that your brother was abusive to you. It sounds like your entire family is kind of abusive. I also have abusive family members, and I think that if you have one sibling that’s abusive, it means that the parents are also neglectful. And this family abuse usually continues into adulthood with all of the denial and lies, and gaslighting. Which makes it all so much worse as one tries to live a healthy normal adult life, while the abuse continues. Anyway, just wanted to say that I relate. And that lots of movies and books trigger me. So that’s fun 🤩

[@miriamwilson3561]

@@Bingewatchingmediacontent My mom and grandpa were the main culprits. My mom is emotionally abusive (though I only really figured that out when I started going to therapy) it’s always nice to hear from people in similar situations

[@EndlessVox]

My older brother committed suicide when I was in highschool and he was in college. He never left a note and to this day, over twenty years later, I still don't know why. And to make things worse, we had our own Evan Hansen latch onto us, her name was Katie. Katie showed up several days before my brother's funeral with a whole scrapbook of letters and postcards from my brother. It made us feel a little better and getting to know more about him, because he shut us out after moving away. Then, a month after the funeral my brother's bestfriend and asked who the girl was that was standing with us at the receiving and I explained that she was his girlfriend from college and all of the letters she showed us. The best friend immediately called my parents to let them know Katie was NOT his girlfriend and no one knew who she was. When confronted about it she became hysterical, but after my Dad told her that he was going to get the police involved, she calmed down and immediately started apologizing and making excuses for her actions. (She was in foster care wanted a real family she didn't mean to hurt us ect.) She left and we never saw her again. Asking around it turns out Katie attatches herself to grieving families of suicides, under different names, for attention. But because she has never done anything technically illegal the most we could do is get a restraining order. But the fall out..destroyed us. We couldn't read through the letters anymore taking solace that at least he wasn't alone, we couldn't read the poetry he "wrote" her and feel happy that he was actually creative. We had nothing. And the guilt of losing her son and feeling like she failed him, drove my mother to drinking. Eventually she died in a drunk driving accident. My father became super religious, remarried, and wants nothing to do with his old life and acting like neither of his old children existed. Now, at 35, I'm the only person who remembers or talks about my brother. And I will never forgive or forget Katie for that. The fact that Evan Hansen does the exact same thing to Conner's family, knows what he is doing is wrong, and doesn't receive any backlash when found out, makes me furious. They could have shown him becoming even more isolated than before. Being denied a job, him being denied entrance to college, people recognizing him and moving away from in disgust. Showing some tangible consequences for his actions, instead he's just back to square one. And the story ends on a high note about persevering through the bad times. Completely ignoring the long lasting damage his actions have caused the family.

[@nabilkhan9530]

Hey man, I see your views and accept them. I believe that all of them are true but in a personal manner I do disagree. Dear Evan Hansen, in my opinion, is beautiful. Here is my reasoning: 1. Even though this show is all built up on Evan’s lies and makes him seem like the bad guy, he isn’t. Every time the note was acknowledged at the beginning (by the Murphys) Evan tried to explain that it wasn’t a suicide note. He tried to explain that him and Connor weren’t friends. But he couldn’t because of his social anxiety, he can’t talk to people. 2. If you really think about it, Jared is partly to blame. It was Jared’s idea to write fake emails, and told Evan to keep lying. Since Jared is Evan’s only friend, Evan doesn’t really have any other influence. 3. When Disappear happens, it is indeed Evan’s inner-self. But the thing is that Evan has a genuine moment of not letting Connor be forgotten. He relates to Connor. Evan climbed a tree and let go, in an attempt to kill himself. He understands what Connor could’ve possibly been feeling. And everyone gets forgotten about eventually, it’s inevitable. Connor was erasing, and even though Evan lied, he was faithfully committed to helping out the Murphys by keeping Connors memory alive. I wish you the best, I’m hope you can understand where I’m coming from.

[@TheWeekIReview]

The show absolutely doesn't make Evan seem like the bad guy (which is part of my issue) and Jared's role isn't nothing, but neither of those actually matters in the bigger picture re: the show's treatment of Connor. The fundamental misunderstanding I think I'm having with basically everyone who disagrees (and I appreciate your doing it respectfully) is what it actually means to keep a person's memory alive. You are saying that remembering that he was a person is enough, regardless of whether or not anything you think you know about him is true. And that's a valid perspective, but it's one I vehemently reject. Everything Evan says about Connor is a lie. Every story that is told about Connor is a lie. Every memory of him is false. I don't see that as keeping someone's memory alive just because it's being done in the deceased's name. I see it as exactly the opposite.

[@nabilkhan9530]

The Week I Review Okay, now I get what your point is. The fact that keeping someone’s memory alive whether it’s true or false is debatable. The thing is that Connor was a closed off person. He never had interest in interacting with other people, which is what we know. And this show doesn’t really feature Connor because it’s Dear EVAN HANSEN. It’s all mostly revolves around Evan and his story. Connor’s story is important, and yes there needs to be more input of it within the show. Regardless, from everyone other than Connor’s perspective, no one knows what happened. And that’s real life, so it makes sense to not know why Connor killed himself. And no one was friends with Connor, but I’m sure the question of why Connor’s death happened had to come in somewhere, even though it’s not explicitly stated. It’s a natural question to ask, so with context, you can assume that someone asked that down the line. I hope that clears up why Connor’s involvement in this production is the way it is.

[@TheWeekIReview]

You're giving the storytellers a lot of credit that I don't think they deserve. Connor is not a real person, nor is Evan or anyone. Every single thing that happens was an active choice on their part. They chose to close him off, and then they chose to erase him while pretending to celebrate him or whatever. Nothing you're saying is new to me. I understand what they did and why they did it, but that doesn't mean I have to agree with, accept, or respect it. And I don't, because they made a show that is about the death of a character and then said "Fuck that guy. We're gonna tell this other person's story instead."

[@sheetalchopra6582]

There is a book which sorta explains it all btw, to y'all Edit: also Connor perspective chapter where u find out why he did it

[@ShapeKiwi]

Nabil Khan also in Sincerely Me, Evan explicitly says that he wants "to make it seem like we were actually friends." he isnt being told to make the emails believable or to write more than one. maybe Evan is socially impaired, but he still actively wants to lie to these grieving parents about a fake relationship he had with their son.

[@ellikasan]

I think it was intentional that they were making this dark and messed up thing as something "good". It's forked up, BIG TIME, but at the same time, kinda the point. GREAT VIDEO, BTW. DEAR EVAN HANSEN IS ONE OF MY FAVORITE, IF NOT MY FAVORITE, SHOW!! GLAD TO SEE HOW YOU ANALIZED IT. But on a more serious note, romanticised mental illness like this is really bad for people who actually struggle with them because it can really affect them in a negative way. Moreover, the vagueness of the message of this show doesn't help it. But at least this was one of the less romanticised ones.

[@TheWeekIReview]

Thank you! The fundamental difference in opinion here is that I really don't think it was intentional. There's nothing in the show itself that leads me to think the creators understood how fucked up the message they're sending is. As I see it, the show is way too "Ra Ra empowerment! Ultimately, Evan, what you did was a good thing for all of us" for that. If you disagree, though, that's fair enough. The music is soooo good though. And on that level I understand wanting to give it the benefit of the doubt, because I gave it that until I was done writing this script and was like "Well shoot... I don't think there's any other conclusion I can come to sad face."

[@bamafan73191]

If it was intentional then the writers would have at least made a mention of why Connor actually committed suicide and then show people discounting that for self gratification. When even the writers leave out why Conner did what he did it tells me that even they didn't care about Connor either.

[@rudolph_ci]

@@bamafan73191 Please read the book if you haven't by now :)

[@Coffee__Head]

I actually use your video as a way to explain to people why the musical is problematic as you put it better than I ever could

[@TheWeekIReview]

Well that's pretty gosh darn cool!

[@tifnod]

Felt exactly the same way. We walked out at intermission. People seem to love the music, which is good, but the messenger of the words are just as important.

[@cdcasey]

I almost walked out too, although I stayed partly to stay with my group and partly because I thought there might be some pay-off toward the end. I was disappointed. More than one of the people I was with felt the same way.

[@nxt_tim]

What? What's the purpose of walking out at intermission? It's only 45 more minutes and many musicals get better towards the end. Plus, you already paid for it anyway and musical tickets can be quite pricey. Don't get it. :/

[@tifnod]

@@nxt_tim I walked out because I did not want to see the last 45 mins. I am a season ticket holder so the price I pay is of no concern. Overall I am confused why anyone would like this play, but then again a lot of people know nothing of mental health so they think this is a good protrayal.

[@nxt_tim]

@@tifnod Was it really that bad? Haven't watched it yet. I feel like it's hard to portray mental health good in a 90 minute musical. My favorite TV show Crazy Ex-Girlfriend which, according to most people with the same BPD as the main character, portrays the mental health issues quite well, probably wouldn't be able to do that without the context of the show which obviously has a lot more room to tell stories. I think I'm going to give the musical a try anyway, if it plays this year. Hopefully I won't regret it as much as you. 😅

[@tifnod]

It is really that bad. Evan is just a terrible character who suffers from nothing, but being awkward and shy. While Connor, who is the character suffering from mental health is barely in the play. Connor kills himself then Evan makes up a fake relationship with Connor to get friends and a girl. He gaslights Zoe by telling him her abusive brother was actually a really sensative soul who loved her. He takes advantage of people during their griefing process so he can become popular. I hope you do see it and don't just listen to the nice music and actually watch what the characters are doing to each other. This show is an added bonus with our 2020-21 season tickets and that is a hard pass for me.

[@veniaminf5105]

I actually agree with most of your points and think that Dear Evan Hansen is extremely messed up but I also think that it was intentional and helps to bring up some important points through this kind of depiction. Not so long time ago I was diagnosed with anxiety and depression myself even though I started having mental health issues way back in high school. I am no longer a high school student but Dear Evan Hansen songs and narrative actually managed to help me realize that I am truly not alone and seek professional counseling as a result because they portrayed anxiety and depression in a way I could relate to. Sometimes it is still really hard to listen to some of these songs because of the underlying lies in it which might worsen the state you are already in but there were also a lot of times those songs and lyrics made me go through the day without feeling so miserable. That’s why I appreciate Dear Evan Hansen, because it helped me to improve my life in a way I could not possibly describe fully in one KZbin comment. Don’t mean to start a debate though. Just wanted to say that Dear Evan Hansen’s message might also help someone (it worked for me at least and I am so thankful for that). Still your video is really great and it is so refreshing to see someone criticizing this show with some solid arguments. Keep up the good work, stay healthy and good luck to you with everything you do!

[@angelkitten2334]

I would recommend reading the book. It gives more depth on Connor (real Connor, not the Connor Evan came up with) and it explains Evan more too.

[@atheaternerd8833]

*I'm holding back..*

[@TheWeekIReview]

I'm very proud of you.

[@JediJuniper92]

I’ve avoided reviews for DEH until I could see the movie this weekend so I could develop my own opinions on it but I felt everything you said here when I saw it. The “best” part for me was “Sincerely, Me” because it was just pure sociopathic manic glee, and I was legit excited for the rest of the film because I thought we were literally going there - a super dark but complicated character study on sociopathy, victim culture, mental illness, etc. but nope. It just jumps from song to song (GREAT songs, but just songs nonetheless). I was honestly curious we might be getting a musical take on a “Talented Mr. Ridley” type character during that song, but alas that did not happen. When I got to “You Will Be Found” it felt so empty and pointless because the entire message was built on absolute lies. It’s all Evan’s terrifying fantasy. No, there’s nothing wrong with wanting to feel heard and safe, but at what cost to those around you, and in a way, yourself? The movie doesn’t even explore that idea of maybe creating a fantasy in order to emotionally survive that it leans on for the entirety of its narration. I think DEH is one of the best examples of a message taking such precedent over anything else including its actual story and characters. It’s honestly an oddly fascinating character study of someone whose journey of pain ultimately ONLY leads him to recognize, “Oh, well maybe I shouldn’t do that again,” instead of anything self-aware or indicative of substantial growth. I truly loathed “If I Could Tell Her” where Evan deliberately lies to Zoe about what he’s always wanted to say to her but presents it as things her abusive brother said. It’s such an odd gaslighting (is gaslighting the right word for this?) experience, and as someone who’s had multiple people work very hard to rewrite my own experience with a former abuser to the point of literally creating lies to tell me, it hit hard. Again, if that had been something that had been explored, this idea of lying to abuse victims and why that happens, that could have been deep, but no. Just another idea introduced and then left to die at the end of the song. It’s such an odd experience for sure. I don’t hate Dear Evan Hansen, and I know for a fact the music is why, but damn, it’s a mess for sure. Thanks for sharing your thoughts like always!

[@hfmackay]

Thank you for putting into words why Dear Evan Hansen's plot was made me feel unsettled. Apparently, when it was first being written it was originally supposed to be a piece with more of a satirical tone. Criticizing vial videos and social media. I think that satirical tone was whitewashed with the emotional/feel-good music and that has produced the schism that you feel in listening to the cast recording and seeing the show. With all the talk on producing the movie lately, I am really nervous of what they will do. I am insulted by the book shoe-horning "Conner's story" of his closeted relationship. The writers slipping that cliche when they didn't have any LGBTQ+ representation in the musical which in a show set in a modern high school is a really big miss-step. So I think the movie will try to put the Conner subplot in the movie.

[@flyingfuzzies4908]

Well at least someone said it (Yes I do love Dear Evan Hansen but this has always bothered me) Edit: Ok I just got into this channel and this video is really well made. No jumpcuts, no crazy extreme jokes, it's still easy to digest and the argument itself is backed up and really put together. Love your content dude, keep making it, you've earned a sub

[@TheWeekIReview]

Went from a thumbs up to a heart on that one. Thank you very much!

[@bamafan73191]

why do you love DEH and agree with him?? Seems like the two cant coexist...

[@theblurredlights]

Thank you for your courage in sharing your experiences. It helped me understand why you found DEH lacking in the way they dealth with mental health and the topic of suicide. I also want to thank you because your opinions made me realize that sometime between 2017 and now--I went from thinking Evan Hansen is an asshole and regretting the $220 I spent to watch the show, to genuinely appreciating the musical's message. (Jury's still out on the character of Evan himself, though.) But we're coming from different perspectives. I wasn't a Connor Murphy, growing up. I wasn't an Evan Hansen either. I was Alaina. I was Jared. I was Connor's parents. I'm the guy who lived. The guy who carried survivors' guilt. I was Mr. "Thoughts and Prayers." I was Mr. "You Will Be Found." Of course, I realize now that "thoughts and prayers" and "you will be found" are empty platitudes designed to make those who continue to live feel better. To assuage our guilt. Which is why I think the real Connor being erased in the context of the story is important. Because the survivors are taking ownership of him without knowing who he really was. "Requiem" coming after "Sincerely, Me" underlined the fact that Evan's version of Connor was complete fiction. And then you have "You Will Be Found" ending with Evan's mother's reaction? I now realize its poetry: the message was never "we shouldn't be afraid to ask for help" nor "we should be more mindful of others." It was "don't make other people's tragedies about you." Edited to add: Also, Waitress should've won the Best Musical Tony instead of DEH. Just wanted to add that. :))

[@TheWeekIReview]

I like this a lot, though I will say that I think you're finding a deeper meaning in the show than the writers put. This is a really legit way of thinking about it, though.

[@theirmajesty8787]

I’m sorry but I fucking needed the last five minutes of this video Not even just what you said but the look in your eyes. I feel known. Thank you for uploading this and sharing

[@LMF1716]

With the upcoming movie I think this really deserves some more attention. Your perspective here is put together very well and I honestly agree. I've personally seen and dealt with many situations where saying nothing is better than saying something harmful. Media outlets need to have a higher standard especially when it comes to those kinds of messages

[@pippa856]

the part at 6:30 is so true and hits so much harder after the movie has come out. the fact that we're supposed to sympathize with evan after he spent the whole time stringing a grieving family into his lies is weird and messed up.

[@anonymouslystupid5857]

I LOVE dear evan hansen (we even share the same last name (; ) but he makes a good point if the show wanted to be about mental illness they should have made that more clear in the show i read the novel and it goes more into detail you should defedently read it (sorry im bad at spelling)

[@ashleyburks4639]

It's okay, luv. Not a prob at all, I have ADHD sooo spelling is just one of the things I'm bad at.

[@anonymouslystupid5857]

@@ashleyburks4639 I have ADHD too and dyslexia lol

[@ericalevinson213]

The musical started getting big when I was going through a deep depression. I never listened to the music or watched videos until much later and I really am I glad that I did. If I had watched/listened when I was in a bad place, I really don’t think DEH would have helped.

[@lindsayb1329]

Ok so I just saw the preview and really wanted to see it. After watching your review of it, so many lightbulbs went off in my head. You are so spot on! Most things in the media are sensationalized. This movie is disturbing when you think about the message it's sharing.

[@VickyIsAHufflepuff]

Never have I been so conflicted by a piece of theatre before - I listened to the OBCR when it first came out and LOVED the music. Living in England, I had to wait to see a bootleg of the broadway show when one became available. When I watched it I was so shocked by the story as I didn't get any of that from just listening to it. Had a bit of a love-hate relationship with the show over the years and finally saw the London production just last week. I was glad to get to see it, but went in there with complicated feelings surrounding the plot. At times it was enjoyable/ moving, I cried at Disappear and the dad's reaction in You Will Be Found. But even though I got emotional, I couldn't help but hear a voice in the back of my mind saying how weird the context is. I don't think it will ever stop making me uncomfortable and it is such a shame because I believe the show has so much potential to be actually good. The message is awful and none of it feels sincere in the slightest.

[@Ganychan]

When I finally saw the movie I was shocked that there was no real resolution or balance reached. I kept wondering what was the point, since the end is an even worse situation than the beginning. But then I thought that You Will Be Found is actually the only real positive and hopeful aspect of the story because kids out there watch the speech, feel seen and it leads to a portion of them reaching out from their depression or mental issues. Maybe it saved some people. Maybe it saved some in the real audience of the show. So, even though Connor suffered, and his family didn't know how to deal with their grief and Evan latched on to them because he was lonely and suicidal himself, maybe other people got the help they needed. In all other aspects, the show is depressing, bleak, maddening and contains very little hope, unfortunately. That's also why even though Ben Platt is incredible, I prefer the performers that play Evan a bit more hesitant and broken. I feel like someone with social anxiety and depression shouldn't belt.

[@mrwoolyvr]

This is so incredibly well said. Thank you for being real with this.

[@forestyoung3252]

I do love this musical as it got me through some hard times with songs focusing on the mom. But I do still acknowledge that is used Connor's suicide to propel Evan's story. Evan was also suicidal, and the story is focused on his point of view, and he makes problematic choices. I feel that the musical was not intended to be so bleak. But if they took their current concept and put more focus on the negative effects of Evan, maybe more than just 2 songs. It would capture a grim story that has happened to many people in real life. Where someone close to them was lost, and they are suffering from random strangers capitalizing off the death of their loved one. This musical is problematic, it's also important. Suicide is a weighty subject, and I hope the next production with similar themes is handled much better.

[@user-hb4cs8vy6l]

The ending really bothered me. I hated that the Murphys kept the lie a secret and that Zoe THANKED Evan for “helping” her family. By doing so, they’re screwing over all the people who donated money to the Connor Project, they’re putting themselves in a position where everyone hates them because they believe that they were responsible for Connor’s suicide, and they’re fine with the fact that they spent all this emotional energy on a bunch of lies. At the end of they day, they have to face the truth about their son, whether it makes them feel good or not. A more honest and better ending would be if the Murphys didn’t forgive him and made the lies public, but Evan still tries his best to atone his actions. I also didn’t like how nothing was resolved with Alana and Jared.

[@manuelorozco7760]

I didn’t like the lack of resolve between Jared and Alana either. But actually I do forgive the fact that the Murphy’s forgave Evan. I wish things turned out differently for him though.

[@user-hb4cs8vy6l]

Manuel Orozco Evan deserved to be exposed. He was a liar, a manipulator, a scammer, a con man, and a gas lighter. However, I think once justice has been served, then they can forgive him.

[@manuelorozco7760]

Yeeeterson I’m sorry you made it sound like it would have been better with a downer ending.

[@user-hb4cs8vy6l]

Manuel Orozco it’s not necessarily a “downer”, it’s a just ending. In the second stage production of DEH, Evan was exposed, but he was able to fight through it and he knew it deserved it.

[@manuelorozco7760]

Yeeeterson Now that makes sense. But still wish things turned out better for Evan

[@thebroadwaygeekishere2051]

Have you read the book? It explains a lot about what he’s thinking

[@insertmemenamehere8206]

You shouldn't have to read a book to understand the musical (or vice versa) each version of a certain piece of media should be able to stand on it's own.

[@lucario719]

the musical came first so you should not have to read a book to cover the mistakes of the source material.

[@waterfallart7372]

It’s not canon

[@aidzy5643]

The book is the worst one I’ve ever read

[@englishatheart]

@@insertmemenamehere8206 its* own.

[@darkwarlord]

As someone who has only heard the music, and never seen the story unfold on-stage, I could see elements if the deception that Evan ran with, and I may have liked the songs at first, but something always bothered me, and it had to be the fact that only got half of the story from the album, I was lied to as well. And now that I know, I will be viewing it all from a different lense

[@morosenberg5571]

thank you so much. I thought I was the only one who cared about those things. I needed that

[@NmMindstorm]

I personally feel that contrast you're noticing between the optimistic songs and the dark plot is quite intentional, and not a mistake. What Evan did was horrible, and the musical knows it; Evan didn't know it. That's his arc, I mean, he learns why it was wrong. The message of this musical is that you shouldn't live in a lie, as beautiful as that lie may seem, it isn't real. That's why Words Fail exists.

[@blackalien6873]

I am here from the future to tell you, your message has been validated.

[@lindsay1724]

I really respect your breakdown here. I never saw the play, and honestly felt that paying alot of money to watch something with such a triggering subject(for me) wouldn't be smart(again for me). Through all the popularity of it, I sat here, today, still wondering what the heck it was about. You explained it perfectly. My mind is like a Rubik's cube with a different color on every tiny square, but also the obsessed person knowing this, and still trying to match all the colors together. So it's hard for me to understand or focus on breakdowns and such. But I did with your video! Like you said, the songs alone, are beautiful but the story they're telling was never accurate. I think the most I'll do is play the soundtrack and stay beautifully oblivious to nonsense they're trying to convey. You for sure get a sub from me. Thank you!

[@monroerosant4619]

It was hard to swallow this pill in the beginning but I understand and I totally agree

[@scoobycool9]

I don't disagree with you on any of your points, it can get really dark. It's interesting however to pick up two things that give a better context than the show. The screenplay script has this line right after so big so small. " Life goes on. Hearts break and mend and break once more. Time does its work". That line makes it darker. As for important Connor representation, that comes in a different form. The Dear Evan Hansen novel has a whole section just dedicated to Connor and why he killed himself. But here's the problem with that. It means both of those things were afterthoughts and that is truly the saddest things, but yeah, the music is great.

[@TheWeekIReview]

That's really interesting! I had no idea there were even other versions of it. Thank you for explaining all that, and yes, I fully agree with your stated implications!

[@mauricey4569]

I remember being so excited at DEH when I first arrived at NYC. I wanted to watch this so badly because the description of Evan Hansen seems so much like who I am. But halfway through the show I suddenly felt this repulse/disgust that everyone around me were so into Evan as sort of a coming-of-age character that no one remembers who Connor was as a person. And what makes it worse is how the plot is based off of using Connor's death to further Evan's story. (okay but DEH is my fav musical I cry every time Ben Platt sings... sigh... idk how I feel lel)

[@manuelorozco7760]

I felt the same way about going to see the show for Evan. I have autism which is a little different from being socially awkward

[@meaimae]

Man that was hard to watch, I struggled to keep it together just watching you keeping it together! I, like any musical OCR listener have thoroughly enjoyed singing along to the big numbers in Dear Evan Hansen, only knowing that Connor is dead, having never seen the show. Now knowing how they portrayed it, hits so much differently and I don't know how I'll take listening to in now!

[@TheWeekIReview]

Going through the rough ones, huh? In & Of Itself is the peak there.

[@Btone1018]

I genuinely don’t understand how people can claim “certain aspects of the show are unhealthy and not good for the audience” yet literally claim in the same sentence “it’s my favorite show”. Reality is that it is messed up and, though it tries, doesn’t get any of its points across. Literally just saw the show a couple of hours ago and I knew it was bad enough knowing he lied about stuff (from listening to the soundtrack) but my god there’s so much more messed up shit Evan does and, yet, suffers no consequences. Everyone who knows keeps the lies and the secrets and everything is built on exactly that. Lies and deception but everyone still gets their happy ending. I was really hoping that Evan would come out with the truth to everyone that way it would at the very least justify his speech in the finally about actually being himself and that it is okay and enough. Saying no more lies and hiding when that’s literally what he still does by the end of the show. I agree that the music itself is good but honestly even then, knowing the contexts of the material, songs like “Sincerely Me” and “If I Could Tell Her” are completely messed up. It baffles me that so many people praise this musical and Evan himself. It’s truly shocking.

[@manuelorozco7760]

In my defense, I do forgive that The Murphy’s and Evans mom never told anyone the truth about the note and that Evan really wrote it.

[@gabrielmcmahon9391]

With Connor's part in Disapear, I always interpreted that as Evan just making excuses for himself to keep up this whole charade and keeping Connor's memory alive is just an excuse.

[@TheWeekIReview]

That's true within the story, but I don't think that's true for the play itself, because the play literally does "disappear" Connor in the process.

[@SEGASister]

@@TheWeekIReview Well, guess which is one of four songs being cut from the film adaptation.

[@Drowningindisappointment]

As someone who struggles with mental health I do not think they miss represented in the slightest, the show hit all the right notes with me and helped me find a way to talk to people about how I was feeling. I understand how it doesn’t work for some people but I feel that everyone has different interpretations. I never saw anything Evan did as good, but I understand why he did it, and that’s the most human thing about this play

[@rickyricardo9710]

your last sentence knocks it out of the park for me. That's exactly what I appreciate about the show, that it makes it very clear what Evan is doing is wrong but makes you sympathize with what pushed him to do it. I think people either lack the empathy for that or are too quick to judge and can't accept a story that is messy and not squeaky clean.

[@Drowningindisappointment]

@@rickyricardo9710 Yes, Exactly! Some people just can't get comfortable with the fact that the most relatable character is doing things that are morally wrong. It also shows that just because you are doing something that is wrong does not make you a bad person, it means you made mistakes

[@pikloo4631]

Mhm! DEH never shows mental illness in a good light, because it doesn't need to be. And the fact that people don't like how Connor's character wasn't really shown or developed. This is from mostly Evan's pov, and from what I remember Evan didn't even know Connor that well. Sure, Evan didn't get much of a punishment. Anxiety shouldn't be an excuse for his actions. That i can see a problem with.

[@Maria_Xiao]

Yup. That last sentence. 100%.

[@manuelorozco7760]

@@rickyricardo9710 I felt sympathy for him and it took long to process why he lied

[@BeyondBaito]

This is why I honestly think Great Comet was a better over all story and was upset it didn't get the Tony it deserved.

[@jonahsahn]

This was my walking down the street fb status update (spoiler: I'm in full agreement with you). Dear Evan Hansen.... Think about the energy that folks conjure up to make excuse and justification for mass shooters, saying they're mentally ill. Harness THAT energy and redirect it into a musical not at all about mass shootings and you have this show. A boy terrorizes a family, an entire community, by lying about his relationship to another boy who took his own life, created social buzz around that boy's death; a buzz that culminated in the fulfillment of a fifty thousand dollar go fund me campaign and when shit hits the fan... It's all ok because he, too, once tried to take his own life and meant well with the lies(?) No accountability for his actions because he was disturbed and this whole experience helped him find himself(?) Am I the only person seeing this? This show won best musical in 2017 and continually sells out. It has a huge fanbase and celebrities use songs from this story about a liar who basically gets away with it. I don't get it... Or do I see it clearly.

[@bamafan73191]

SAMEEEE!!! The fact so many people flock to this with its terrible message and shitty protagonists tells me that most people just want a show with a catchy tune and feels important, regardless of whether or not it actually is, because DEH is actually much more harmful than helpful.

[@qsings8674]

Both of y’all need to relax

[@anothercub6958]

The music is great, but the message and underlying tones in it seriously detract from whatever they planned to say about mental health.

[@JaredTVW]

Yeah, I have watched so many videos on this musical and the movie adaptation and yeah, the biggest thing you noted directly that most don’t is that literally everyone is erasing the true victim of this story, Evan Is, Connors family, the kids at school who flip flop, even the advertisement has a hashtag on the cast rather than Connors name. It’s a really disgusting thing to celebrate, honestly, people should largely be leaving this musical feeling dirty, but the fact that younger kids are obsessed with it in a positive way shows me they are missing the true essence. Edit: Also I posted this before I got to your very open and honest moment of transparency. I just wanted to say that I hope you are doing well these days and I know words cannot fix things, but I hear you. I never seriously contemplated taking my own life, but I have certainly been to lows in my life where the idea did present itself. All I can say is that my life experiences have not always been good or easy, but I believe they all helped to build me into the person I am today and I am very comfortable with who that is. Anyone reading this, hope that this message finds you well and I hope the best happens. And if you are in a troubling or difficult position, I hope you know how truly important you are and that I believe in you. Nothing but kind thoughts sent your way.

[@kdee15]

Thank you for so eloquently stating every opinion I have on this show that I haven't been able to put into words myself. Very concerned about the upcoming film and how the masses will interpret it.

[@clarejennings5049]

What the fuck As a person with suicidal thoughts almost every day, this is awful...

[@melissafeliz5955]

I'm not gonna lie Dear Evan Hansen has to be one of my favorite musicals, but you stated obvious facts, even as I would watch the show and listen to the music in context I realized that it was a story of people who made a person's death a gateway to connect with people, inevitablely making it all about themselves. I also didn't like how they used his death a prop. Not only that, it doesn't give the resolve of Conner's parents learning they could have done better by Conner and choosing to do so with Zoe. It was said by the cast and writers that it shows parents that you need to forgive yourselves for the shortcomings and failures, while important, it should also mean to be, and choose to be better in the long run. As someone who has been through depression and suicidal thoughts it pains me to see things like 13 reasons why and the like romanticizing suicide instead of doing what it was made for and REMOVING stigma instead of adding on to it. I agreed with you whole heatedly in this video, God bless♥️

[@manuelorozco7760]

You got a point there with the Murphy’s since their fate after Evan told the truth was only shown offstage.

[@camilascatonebedin3002]

About the Murphy's, the way Zoe said they went to the orchard all the time for picnics made it seem like they were reconnecting as a family, though.

[@Donotdo4044]

Befoee I knew what DEH was, Sincerely Me was the first song I heard from it and I have always loved it, but then years later I learned the context to it, and I now feel very off about it. It's still one of my favorite songs from the musical, but I sometimes feel wrong for liking it.

[@gigigalaxy1395]

Why wasn't the high school in the movie doing anything about a creepy, 40 year-old man pretending to be a student?

[@TheWeekIReview]

It's very weird that Ben Platt is younger than me but somehow looks much older.

[@danielclark653]

I KNOW RIGHT!!!! He does things that would be fine for a young awkward teenager would do but he is so clearly not so he just comes off as creepy as hell

[@j.d.t.5761]

He is 28, but still.

[@wilhelmpaulm]

Imagine losing a son and then this guy just flat out lies to you for no valid reason

[@eatsbyaidah1462]

I been putting off watching this for a while because I didn't want this musical to be cheesy. Not sure if I want to watch it now.

[@kevintravers3988]

I knew out the gate when I heard the premise that this show/story was absolute shit and rubbed me the wrong way. Being on the autism spectrum I felt this really painted people on mental illness in the wrong light and I really felt like this show is sending a nasty message. Feel free to enjoy the songs but the whole story is absolute shit.

[@Skypupgirl]

When I read and heard the song no one deserves to be forgotten I pictured it more as a guilty conscience of Evan but even then what he was doing was fucked up as he kept the lies going to a grieving family who had just lost Connor It was like they were clinging to his death while forgetting who he was The mother in the book seemed like she was well intentioned but she was clinging to someone who was already gone or more like someone who never existed as all she believed was Evans false hope

[@AveryCrane]

Thank you for sharing 🧡 glad you are still here

[@rileyhusain]

I know this comment is just me rambling to myself but I never thought of Dear Evan Hansen as about remembering people like Connor who ended their lives. The message I see more clearly is that things change whether we like it or not. This isn't necessarily conveyed in every song but most themes aren't. In Requiem we watch mostly Zoe question her viewpoints as things change when she's given new information, even if that information is inaccurate. In So Big/So Small Heidi talks about things changing when Evan's dad left, but also about how it all ended out okay with the last chorus about how she'll be there for Evan. Then, the best example of this is in the last scene and the finally where we just a few years in time to find that Zoe and Evan have both moved on and that things ended up being okay. As someone with both depression and social anxiety I found it very reassuring to see that kind of message presented in such a real and genuine way. Also, Connor being a voice inside Evan's head was a way to show that Evan was projecting himself onto the version of Connor he created. That means that the so called "lies" Evan was telling weren't totally lies. Most of them were true, but for him and not Connor. So even if that was the main message, it still holds up pretty well if you think about it.

[@TheWeekIReview]

Hard disagree.

[@c17sam90]

One thing that I always found interesting is Worlds Greatest Dad had a similar idea and played it for dark creepy comedy so it can work.

[@patrickd7988]

Hey man I just stumbled into your video here and am quite surprised with your take on the story. I just wanna share my opinion if that's okay. I don't entirely agree with you though I can't really take down any of the points you made. I think they are valid and yes Connor and his situation is not treated with the respect it deserved. What I disagree with though is that this necessarily destroys the message. I loved seeing the musical and loved the message. But it seemed that the message I found in the story is different than the one you described. Let me try to explain: From the start of the show we see that Evan is the main character. There are different ways for interpreting a story, but in my opinion this story is best enjoyable and is most beautiful if you see the story from a first-person perspective. This to me keeps being reinforced thoughout the story, including the fact that we don't actually dive into what Connor was like. Because to Evan, the real connor is not really important. What is important is the version of connor that gives Evan what he wants: attention, connection and love. I think we can all agree that this line of thinking is definately dysfunctional and incorrect. But to Evan it's reality: he believes this will make him happy. Maybe if he's important, people will notice him and value him. It maybe started off as a safety measure not to interrupt the Murphy's belief, but he kept it in place when he saw that it served him a purpose too. But this is where for me the story gains its beautiful storyline and message: They start off Evan as a person with faulty beliefs about how to be happy and loved. By chance he gets stuck in a situation which gives him what he think he wants/needs. He does some immoral things because he thinks that is what serves him best. But in the third act of the story things start to fall apart because of the things he did. He had to realize that the things he believed would make him happy, weren't true. And he was confronted by that every step of the way: his mother started to confront him, Alana and Jared didn't want anything to do with him anymore, and the Murphy's were really hurt when they heard him confess, breaking contact with him. He wanted to be accepted, but the actions he took to get it actually took that chance away from him. The story ends with him coming to terms with the real way to find the acceptance: from himself. He had to learn that the acceptance he sought after couldn't be found by becoming friends with others, becoming important or popular, but from accepting yourself who you actually are. I feel like the show supports this viewpoint by focusing the music not on what is actually right or wrong, but reflecting Evan's experiences. The "you will be found speech" is inherently meaningless because none of it really happened and the image of connor wasn't real. But it was meaningful to Evan: he felt that he got what he wanted. He just didn't know it wasn't really wat he was looking for yet. Additionally the Connor in "disappear" is not the real Connor, but the Connor in Evan's imagination. I've personally dealt with social anxiety, depression and addiction so I relate to Evan and Connor's situation. And for me the process Evan goes through is a deeply personal one, because I've lived the same thing. I didn't learn it as fast as Evan did unfortunately, but it's been a real meaningful life lesson to me. I agree it's a bummer we don't get more insight in Connor, because of the reasons you explain (which I totally agree with). I just think that wasn't the message or story the storywriters wanted to tell. To be honest I prefer they did it this way, rather than putting it in half-baked and then dropping it to prioritize the self-acceptance storyline. If you've stuck with me until this part of my comment, then I'm impressed :). Sorry that it is such a long post, but I didn't know how to write it any more compact. On a final note I want to do a little disclaimer: I think DEH has a lot of flaws, like any show. I feel like if you want to find them, you will (and you definately did ^^). I feel like looking it this way makes the experience a better and more meaningful one. Secondly: please don't take this comment as me stating everyone should think this way. We all lived through different things. Therefore we focus on different things, find different things meaningful and enjoyable. I wanted to express how I perceived this musical, in the hopes that I could add to an already magnificent discussion. Have a good 24 hours guys!

[@TheWeekIReview]

I saw that a long comment had come in yesterday while going for a walk, and I read about three sentences of the explanation before turning to my girlfriend and saying, "I know why I disagree with this person, but I'll read the whole thing later because he seems to be engaging in good faith so will give it a shot. "One of the things that I find interesting about the response to that video is how personally people seem to take the criticisms, and on some level I get it: if it spoke to them and they got something meaningful out of it, that's totally valid. I'm not trying to take away from their experiences or say that they were wrong for feeling a certain way about the thing. My point is that whatever they're reading into it just isn't actually there in the show. But it doesn't need to be." And then I came back, read the whole thing, and do indeed disagree with you for the reason I thought. Because what you seem to be missing (as do most of the comments here) is that I completely understand that this show is from Evan's perspective: that's the whole problem with the show. Evan sucks. Like, a lot. He's a coward who lies to the world, committing pretty serious fraud, but ultimately receives no punishment other than that the girl he lied to in a way that completely destroyed the way she looked at her relationship with her family won't date him... and I'm supposed to feel any kind of emotion other than disgust towards him? Absolutely not. The message of the show isn't just "You just need to accept yourself." It's "... and if you destroy some lives in the process? Well, you'll still get to be the protagonist in a Broadway musical." Again: if you only got the first part and were content with that, that's good. I think that's what the creators were going for when they made it... but the way they went about it diminished one person's experience and elevated another's in a way that doesn't feel justified. I've said before and will say again: a person's reaction to art and entertainment tends to say more about them than the work itself. I'm glad that the show did something positive for you. I appreciate the comment.

[@asaltyem0826]

Thank god some people acknowledge this. I love the music itself because it’s just well made and fun but the message because of the lying makes me bitter and angry. The message makes gives me a bitter taste because it’s all lying! What is the point.. the songs feel meaningless and the message feels useless to me. Perhaps I’m just extra sensitive to this stuff but it makes me just sad. I hate the musical itself... I hate it. It makes me feel angry. This is exactly the thoughts that run though my head when I hear it now I wish it wasn’t but I can’t stand the lying. Like Conner and the suicide are just a prop not like it actually matters or that he mattered or anyone wants to even remember him for who he is

[@rickyricardo9710]

The point is to show Evan's character. You will be found, for example, isn't meant to be an uplifting message that, well, you will be found, it's meant to be a portrayal of how bad Evan, and anyone struggling similarly, wishes they could be found. To me that makes it more meaningful because it's not just a blind platitude it's genuine recognition.

[@asaltyem0826]

@@rickyricardo9710 the music is great and believe me I understand evan. I really do.. I just don’t like it either. It’s sad to see no one in the musical actually remembering conner. For who he is not who evan says he was. I cry to these songs but I don’t like the story.

[@marleymarss]

I did listen a bit to the soundtrack a while back, but couldn't finish it because I felt the same way like you were explaining. People keeping saying "read the book to fully understand the context" is honestly an lazy excuse to fix or add something not there at the start and is already a little too late kind of thing. That's like saying "read The Rise of Skywalker to fully understand" to understand this character or that character and so forth. "Reading" the book feels like an insult and comes across as dumbing you down. Audiences shouldn't have to read (also meaning pay twice) a book for us to understand the "in-betweens", the intent, their message or themes that wasn't there in it's original format. That's the musical job to provide something for the audience to experience and for us to be able to use our minds to figure out. Therefore discussions are made among each other. At least in all my opinions though.

[@wiibrockster]

I'll be honest,this musical seems like it had good intentions but it probably got derailed at some point.

[@manuelorozco7760]

How so derailed?

[@kumkwat3555]

Personally I dont think DEH had an intention to give optimistic message, it's a show about a kid who made a messed up plan that cannot be justified by kid's life experience and even if something good happened because of this plan, it's corrupted and disturbing, so no good at all.

[@pumpkinspice2456]

Great job! You've got me to consider whether I want to watch the film that is coming out soon. I struggled with the issues within the story of this musical personally, as well. However, more on the side of Evan Hansen's perspective of loneliness and the aid of unproductive therapy, with occasional suicidal thoughts. I would be upset if I watched something that undermined, or misrepresented my experience (common though it may be). The teaser reminded me of Robin William's movie "World's Greatest Dad", a movie which I loved. Based on your critique, though, it's probably not as honest.

[@mystii8134]

I don't like Evan Hansen, my old tutor made me sing one of it's songs and it made me so uncomfortable, I hated the musical. Then I discovered Natasha, Pierre and The Great Comet of 1812, and I hated Dear Even Hansen even more, nothing about it is better than Great Comet, Great Comet is 100 times better!!

[@kaibaiarrio1299]

Im gonna be honest, im watching this as someone who, when i discovered the musical, it really helped me comprehend and understand my own emotional issues and helped me through some dark shit. I still hold a spot in my heart for it due to how, even if songs like "you will be found" dont have any deeper meaning in the context of the show itself it really helped me want to keep living. I fully acknowledge the issues with the show, and am still realizing how fucked up it all is, but god damn i cant get myself to let it go because of how much of an impact it had on me back when i was 15/16, struggling to even speak, wanting so desperately to be seen. It made me feel seen. It made me feel understood. And i hate it because of how morally fucked up it is.

[@kaibaiarrio1299]

I just wanted to add, i 100% agree with you op. This entire thing is fucked up in ways that need to be talked about. I also want to openly admit that at some points in my life, i was a similar kind of person evan was. I still struggle with it too. Never EVER to that kind of level, but i have done some of the same shit evan has done. And thats kind of why i find some kind of comfort in his character. If this was a better written story, and if it had more of the REAL connor, i think it could have been so much more powerful. If the story had evan actually realize what he was doing was fucked up earlier on in the story and had the final acts depict him taking accountability and owing up to his actions, i think it would make the story a lot stronger because instead of just ignoring what hes done to push a fake positive narrative it could have evan, and to an extent ALL the characters, actually realize that no matter how you try to explain and excuse your actions, at the end of the day you are in control of what you do, and that its normal to fuck up! Just take accountability, work on FIXING what you have done, and move on

[@TheWeekIReview]

Here's the way I think about things: If you got something out of the show/etc., if it helped you in some way, that is awesome and I'm happy it has that meaning for you. It doesn't make the thing "good" or fix its problems, but that's a separate issue. So yeah, I'm glad that you came out the other side with a little more hope and desire to keep going. That's great.

[@sweetchocolatesecret]

I just watched (admittedly illegal) video of the musical and I was feeling the same way throughout! I felt a bit disjointed and wondered why they made these beautiful songs feel so empty with the context of everything being a lie. Both Evan and Connor would definitely need more context to their mental issues. The cheerfulness felt really empty...for some reason.

[@valeale8851]

YES I started listening to the music and loved it and when I started to get context for the songs and became horrified and then never watched it because I knew it was potentially triggering and infuriating

[@manuelorozco7760]

I only heard three songs before buying tickets and listened to the rest before seeing the show.

[@kevinmiz225]

Anyone watching this after watching the movie? Because the movie makes it even more clear how morally bankrupt the story is lmao

[@JayNSG0]

My man that is EXACTLY what I thought when I saw the trailer and yet knew nothing about it, now knowing what I know it's not only morally bankrupt and emotionally manipulative but absolutely disgusting and something I will never watch.

[@kevinmiz225]

@@JayNSG0 Yeah it’s unbearable. I still recommend the songs themselves as they’re really good and a lot of fun, just most enjoyable separate from the source material.

[@Masonio]

This was nice. I just watched the movie and while I liked it something felt off and I wasn't completely sure how I felt about it. I'm still gonna go see it again to fully cement my feelings on it but this helped me to wrap my head around it a bit more.

[@shinohidanzetsu]

And then the movie came out and for some reason decided to take all the issues outlined here and make them worse. It's so bizarre.

[@RobKruss]

I appreciate your video and agree with many of your points. I think the turning point is that near the end we see clearly that Connor and Evan are two sides of a similar coin. We learn (granted it goes fast and is easy to miss) that Evan didn't fall from the tree. He jumped. His desperation to say I am here was nearly suicidal. Conner and Evan's lives turn on a knife's edge. After admitting this Evan's cone clean song Words Fail is one devastating piece of theatre. Keep the faith and the great work.

[@manuelorozco7760]

I think of it as the turning point too

[@brubs4901]

I recommend the novel, I highly do, it isn't "canon" let it said, because it was written by a fan, but it has the approval of DEH creators, Connor original actor even act in the audiobook. In the book we have actual chapter of Connor, the real one, that became a ghost after his death and is seen this whole shit going, we heard him talk about his own life, things and rumors that other characters tell about him are debunked or given his own perceive. Other thing that is discovered, Connor is bisexual in this version and the only person he thought that actual care and understood him was his boyfriend Miguel, which make the line of Sincerely Me: "the only man that I love is my dad", more infuriating and erasing Connor, erasing the love between him and Miguel.

[@medeaworbs6970]

I only listened to DEH twice, but I read the book, and... I kinda really did not love it. There is one, just one character I like, and that is Connor. The dead guy is the only character I like. And I really hate Evan. Yes, I get that he has anxiety and struggles with mental problems - but so does my brother Daniel. He has extreme social anxiety and is working through trauma, but still he wouldn't do what Evan does. Which he told me quite vehemently after reading the book as well. He said, and I will try to quote as directly as I can: _Evan may be anxious as hell, but he didn't try much. He tried telling the truth like once, but then not again. He instead created this whole scharade that he knew would hurt people with it on the long run. Lies have short legs, the truth always comes back out._ Daniel and I agreed that Connor is not much more than a plot device for Evans storyline, which basically makes him meaningless, a chess figure in a game other people play, and Evan is a horrible human, and not the best representation for teenagers (or people in general) with anxiety disorders.

[@diegopalafox5076]

I've never thought of it that way, but it's true. I always thought that the story is really quite fragile, the most tiny changes in the formula, could tell a completely different story. A much, more dark story. Great review as always, and thanks for telling your story. Hope you're doing well during this crazy times. Much respect for your job!

[@erinfain3667]

I think Dear Evan Hansen depends somewhat on how you approach it. You made some points I actually agree with! But to me that is what actually impressed me about it. My biggest pet peeve was the ending where Zoe just seems to be actually ok with what Evan did which felt odd to me. It’s because so many of the songs are built on lies that makes the musical so tragic. Even Sincerely, Me which comes off as comedic is just inherently dark when you know the actual story. I think weirdly enough their focus was made to be on the people around Connor rather than Connor himself. Sometimes people like Connor are depressed and at the same time also the villain to people like Zoe. That doesn’t mean they should kill themselves and I appreciated the complex grief reactions in Requiem. Anyways my thoughts were all over the place but I love DEH and also agree with a lot of your points lol

[@manuelorozco7760]

It didn’t feel too odd to me.

[@penpendoggo]

why do so many of these comments sound so similar wth??? A lot of them seem to have the same writing style...

[@penpendoggo]

@@peggy3095 I was just saying it's so odd. There are so many people relating to the video and writing long comments that sound the same with just little variations. It's just so weird??? It's like they are all written by the same person? Also, it doesn't really matter right now (I posted that comment half a year ago and who cares?)

[@peggy3095]

@Wrett I realized I was being a toxic bitch and deleted my reply. Sorry for giving you trouble

[@infin-ite]

Finally someone who puts my messy thoughts about this musical into something that makes sense

[@igelmithut6320]

I can only agree. It misses the tone so hard and is weirdly optimistic and hopeful while being full of lies. I thought the same but in a weird way I really enjoy it? It feels like the unintentional representation of something we (Sometimes) live through. It's not helpful or anything but the thought that even if this ISNT the intended meaning it still represents reality. ESPECIALLY in perspective of someone who didn't struggle through this shit? It's validating ... somehow. But does it make me feel good? No. I think it's a great place to analyse how people like to think how they could solve those problems. I like to analyse my past feelings by comparing them to the musical and thus interact with them in a more detached way of thinking.

[@chaosgremlin]

never watched DEH, but after watching the movie trailer, I was confused - was this really the show all my friends were raving about? glad to know I'm not the only one concerned 😆😆

[@1951michaelw]

I totally agree! The fact that Evan is elevated in the narrative to the level of a hero by essentially LYING about his relationship to a suicidal classmate to both the boy's parents and subsequently to the world, then FORGING e-mails supposedly FROM said suicide is a rotten message to send out to ANYONE, but especially kids of this age. He has a girlfriend who actually BELIEVES in and of his connection to this by, plus a male friend who is actually COMPLICIT in both the lie AND the forgeries. Evan may be a "hero" to people the world over, but to me he's headed to HELL....and I'm not even religious, but there should BE a Hell created by the Universe with his name all over it. Great score, but the message it supports SUCKS!

[@oscarchavezavellan2738]

Just saw the trailer, before that I didn't know this play existed. The background music (that now I know is the song you will be found) was amazing, so much in fact that I had to look it up and I freaking cried when I listened to the whole thing. Going back a bit, when I was watching the trailer it seemed to be about a weird kid dealing with social anxiety and I was like "If done well this can be really helpful for kids", like the perks of being a wallflower, but when I saw that the whole premise was about the protagonist lying to the victim's parents and then making a speech about somebody he didn't know, I thought "wait wait wait, this is problematic". I still had my hopes high that in the end he would pay for his actions and learn that your mental issues are no excuse for taking advantage of a person's death, but now by watching your video and reading all these comments I realized that will never be the case unfortunetely. It's a shame this had potential to teach a new kind of message for younger audiences, that your mental problems are no excuse for bad actions.

[@manuelorozco7760]

They’ll explore the consequences a bit more in the movie. Evan won’t be going scotch free like in the stage version

[@renn8827]

My sister killed herself and if someone had done all of this and put us through that I would have hated them and hated myself for believing them and felt like I was a failure for not knowing the truth. I loved some of the soundtrack particularly the anonymous ones and the song the sited sang about her brother being the villain that one made me tear up a bit. But the only part of that movie that felt real was when there was a clip uncovered that was of Connor playing the guitar. It was one of the few times I felt like I could actually see Connor in the movie. In the beginning of the movie I had mixed feelings in a way he was helping the family grieve they were remembering the good and the bad but then it stopped being about the family and Connor and started to become about Evan. They treated Connor as an imaginary friend to help Evan build a life and deal with his own trama rather than acknowledge that Connor was a person too not a prop. Personally if I was the family I would have been traumatized after being reassured in believing that they didn’t know there own son and brother and fed lies then abruptly when the letter was released they became at fault for his death before finding out everything they were told after his death was a lie and that they had as many answers as they had started with. Pretty lies sound great at first hell if it would have been left at that I could have appreciated it because I know what it’s like to be the family but it wasn’t it was turned into him getting what he wanted from the suicide that was used as a facade to give his actions meaning.

[@TheWeekIReview]

I'm very sorry that happened to you. It's interesting that the movie added pieces of the actual Connor, since there's none of that in the play.

[@renn8827]

@@TheWeekIReview I personally haven’t seen the play I just appreciated the pieces of him because when you lose someone that’s all you want I have been trying to gather pieces of my sister anywhere I could find them. I contacted strangers to hear stories about her. I read the report on her body when they found her. I can tell you her body was 41 degrees and the level of decomposition meant she was out there for roughly 2 days . I dug through a box of photo albums in my house. Went through every social media of hers and screenshot everything that felt real. Everything with a genuine smile. One thing I couldn’t find was a video of her I have life photos but I don’t have a video. Maybe that’s why my heart stopped when suddenly in the movie there was something real because that would have been the final piece I needed to feel like I had found everything she left behind

[@joannadziedzinska1337]

Omg, someone finally said that. The whole "Project Connor" thing was the creepiest shit ever. Characters literally took someone's suicide as an opportunity to talk about themselves and make some sharing circle - but they didn't care at all. Evan would be the last person concerned about "Connor being forgotten", if Connor didn't take his letter. It reminds me "Shine a Light" from Heathers, but Heathers creators were aware that their characters are singing bullshit. To be even more bizzarre, in book Alana literally says that she did all this project because it makes her feel less lonely. Jared, in other hand, treats it like some kind of prank AND opportunity to earn some cash. It's as dark as Heathers, but less honest with its own darkness.

[@M0CC3R]

Will you be doing a review on the movie now that it has come out? I would really love to see your view in it.

[@TheWeekIReview]

I'm trying to decide that myself, to be honest! I'm like 50/50. I think it depends on when I'm actually able to go, because I've got a lot of stuff happening over the next week or so...

[@sandraleach5848]

Him: Requiem is just Connor’s family not caring about him Me: it’s time you freaking meet Cynthia Murphy

[@TheWeekIReview]

It's always really interesting that people refer to me in the third person in these comments. Like, who are you talking to?

[@sandraleach5848]

@@TheWeekIReview I’m talking to you. I meant this as a half joke. Just, Cynthia is underrated a lot

[@Drag_on_king]

I had the same problem as you with the musical. I just Constantly wished something would come up from the original Connor. Something that blandly shows Evans lies. For me, the Musical presents the bleakest possibility. It's a warning that you should have to reach out in order to be found. I am learning at the moment how to reach out, but it's hard because I get shoved down and down again. I'm not jet finished fighting but I am not a fighter, I can't keep this up forever. I am listening to the audiobook at the moment and I already learned one thing about Conner that Evan learns in the book. Conner liked to read. So since Evan knows that and we know that he doesn't disappear in my mind.

[@kendallc2234]

yes! this is exactly what ive been trying to say. yes the music is good, but what’s the point if it’s all built on a lie. this has bothered me ever since i learned the storyline.

[@aanonymousamanda1711]

Interesting perspective. Thank you for sharing your personal experiences. 🙏 I am happy you are still here and happy that most days 5 is possible 😊

[@galehunter2519]

Sincerely Me and Disappear were basically the 2 worst things Evan did in the play, and I wish that they would’ve focused on how those two events really impacted Connor’s legacy, and have Evan realize his mistake that way, instead of focusing more on his family’s issues. Maybe have Connor’s actor portray the real Connor as a ghost, and he could be the one to call Evan out, instead of Jared, Alana, and his mom. That would’ve been much more powerful.

[@albaorgon]

The movie just got realased and I must say... It got worse. The movie adaptation decided to take off the only song that criticised Evan Hansen, which is literarlly the best song in the whole musical (Good For You). So yeah... They really mischevied the way to send a good message and ended up with a horrible one.

[@TheWeekIReview]

That's wild

[@Juliebel177]

As someone who lived a two-month old lie of a love triangle with my former boyfriend and a new boy who I would eventually marry, dating both of them at the same time, where the boyfriend knew and the new boy didn't. If you aren't brave enough to pick a side, the lie I made came falling apart, and the idea of losing this new man, was enough to tell my high school sweetheart that, no matter what happens between me and new guy, I'm breaking up with you, for good. That was one of the hardest things I had ever done. A part of me wishes that I could have dropped both of them, and start from scratch with my non-codependant self. But I love my man, and all's well that ends well.

[@ashleyburks4639]

Oh my goodness gracious of all heaven's. Lols