"Death and Taxes" A Robin Hood Discussion - Altered TCG

[@k1ttyfurball]

I don’t think nerfing RH itself solves the issue since it just shifts the goal towards getting other tax cards (looks at 4/4 quetz/magistrate) The biggest question is why they thought printing such uniques was okay to begin with. Other factions have limits on other cards getting “special” abilities - eg you won’t see a red or bladedancer with gigantic + seasoned.. so why was this overlooked for me ordis? Think one way we can solve this is to erata the ability entirely.. players should be only able to activate it once per tax card played. So more like -> the next card your opponent plays costs one more (much like the discount version of this). They still get a big advantage that turn, but my cards don’t cost 3 more for the rest of the game…..

[@tirionpendragon]

I don't know if Robin Hood is the only problem of Waru's deck, i played only once against a Waru and the first thing i noticed is actually what an insane card advantage can get really easily and really fast in the game. I don't remember what is the name of the Burocrat that has this effect: "If my spedition don't go ahead this turn you draw one card", that card looked pretty insane to be honest because it's a guaranteed +1 (since Waru can put her to sleep) and then it actually guarantees you either a +2 or a +1 and an expedition progression, because the only way to counter the second card draw is to let her expedition win, what a dumb mechanic for such a low cost card. I think that Robin Hood is annoying but is not necessarily the true win condition of the deck, with a much lower card draw engine in Waru even finding double or triple Robin Hood could be good but also bad at the same time, since he has really poor stats compared to his cost and is actually beatable on board often even playing a taxed card. Edit: i'm talking about the Attorney, especially the rare version. 2 cost draw 2 with board presence and can also proc Waru's token summon for even higher board presence; for me it's too much especially if you compare it with an already good card Baba Yaga, she just draws one card and has less stats than the Attorney by a lot if you compare in terms of stats efficiency, and this is by default without even considering Waru's synergy.

[@tirionpendragon]

In fact i'm a believer that the true reason why Waru is so much stronger than other decks is its unmatched consistency, and i think the Attorneys plays a huge role in that, they are the true broken cards of the deck in my opinion.

[@tirionpendragon]

If they decide to keep Robin Hood and the Attorney as they are and they instead look to balance Waru himself i think that a good nerf could be to just remove the part of his effect that summons a token at noon if you control a burocrat, since thaf part of the effect actually just creates a better Sisismar that can hold burocrats effects for 2 rounds. If they remove that part of the effect the deck will actually become balanced in my opinion.

[@tirionpendragon]

If they decide to balance Waru himself i think that a good nerf could be to just remove the part of his effect that summons a token at noon if you control a burocrat, since that part of the effect actually just creates a better Sigismar that can hold burocrats effects for 2 rounds. If they remove that part of the effect the deck will actually become balanced in my opinion.

[@Hidetoshi88]

Or they could limit Waru's ability to give sleep to only 1 bureaucrat per afternoon once tapped.

[@jotacatalan]

Waru will still be strong because he still has a great core with cards like ordis attorney and quetzalcoatl to use in its main strategy.

[@MrZeyami]

If you ban rb, it will just be until a new strong tax is printed that waru isn't a problem. Effects that create asymmetrical taxes, particularly synergistic effects, have a high tendency towards being problematic.

[@gavkenny]

I think the problem is that Robin just gives free wins for Waru and Mack. Removing Robin will still make the deck fine, but its win percentage will go down. Trickster has been testing Waru without Robin in it and says that its not unplayable.

[@pauldestefano8469]

I certainly respect the skill that it takes to play Waru. However I agree with the comment that Robin Hood creates an unpleasant experience for a casual player as myself. In fact, from my experience consuming KZbin videos and listening to the three different English podcasts, the only players that enjoy playing Waru are other Waru players. This game offers a special opportunity for the Equinox team through Board Game Arena to try a temporary fix before any permanent errata. For instance they could announce a week or two when Robin Hood loses the Bureaucrat subtype and see the reaction of the community. Given that the most competitive Waru players have already purchased their three copies, I don't believe that this moratorium would negatively affect sales of Altered.

[@kinilas]

I think waru is still good without Robinhood, but not broken. My friend has a waru deck and the way the game goes, it's usually if he draws Robinhood it stays on the board for 3 turns and he wins the game. If he doesn't draw Robinhood, it is a lot closer. Just the other day I went 2-1 against him and the game I won had no Robinhood but he was only 1 expedition behind me. The game I lost he played Robinhood going first on turn 3 (for all 4 mana), slept it, and then the next turn played sadman to sleep it again, and kept this routine going for 4 turns while I was struggling to draw into any removal spells

[@hunsonabadeer7945]

Where exactly did they say they would do something to robin ? Last I heard they just acknowledged the meta of the last tournaments without taking any commitment. And that's the right move, doing nothing for now. Altered officially released less than 2 months ago, and has only one set. This is a TCG, sometimes the meta is heavily leaning on a few cards, next sets will address that. And we're talking about what, 2 or 3 tournaments ? Waaaaaay too early to be sure. For instance a lot of high level players and playtesters are saying Teija and Kojo have a lot of potential against Waru, the community just hasn't yet settled on the top decks for their faction. Give it time. Modifying/banning cards so soon would send a terrible message for the rest of the game's life. Look what just happened in Magic Commander. Terrible idea really

[@aguytrying]

kzbin.info6YTNFgAzcBk?si=aaW9tn48irlLrvvL&t=157 They answered a question about Robin Hood during a Live Q&A about 4 weeks ago that is linked above. They basically say what I summarized initially, that the game designers believe he was a design mistake, and it's not necessarily to do with power levels but the fact that Robin Hood makes the game less fun for players. They've already said that they plan to make a change to Robin Hood, but haven't announced exactly what yet. I agree that we are still in a developing meta, but the info is based on a little over a dozen tournaments with many high level players competing in them, the smallest being a 51 person tournament.

[@hunsonabadeer7945]

​@@aguytrying Thanks for the link and for your answer. Still sounds like a knee jerk reaction to me. A dozen tournaments is a small sample size. I agree the data is leaning toward this conclusion, but there's also other large tournaments with non-waru winners. Also the answer Regis gave in that video is kinda paradoxical. Is the problem the balance or the fun of the game ? Because the example solution he mentions is to remove bureaucrat attribute, which will only affect balance. And if the problem is fun then casual players shouldn't worry too much about one rare card... Just to be clear, I don't like Waru and Robin. But I play Kojo and find it manageable. Treyst, on the other hand, I find more annoying to play against for example (and I'm not the only one, Kaleb a french caster of the games says the same thing). But I think changing cards implies heavy consequences for the game and the time and money people are ready to invest in it. It's way worse than banning, it's modifying and forcing to reprint stuff. I know that will deter me from diving deeper if I learn that cards I bought get modified 2 months after realease over a dozen tournaments results. And I'm saying that even though I don't own a single robin. I'd wait at the very least until 2 or more sets are released. Most of the current heroes don't even have the cards to be played yet (Arjun, Rin, Nevenka, Atsadi, Lindiwe), and the game is new so meta will change

[@SeanRussell87]

I love the game. Robin Hood needs a nerf.

[@Trulli9]

remove burocrat trait