Death of a Game: City of Heroes

Finding the super-hero MMOs kryptonite.
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Thanks to Altaranalt for his footage in City of Heroes. His channel is located here. / altaranalt
Many of my data comes from cityofheroes.wikia.com/ or paragonwiki.com/
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#DOAG

[@nerdSlayerstudioss]

www.reddit.com/r/Cityofheroes/comments/bf462j/a_guide_for_preparing_to_join_the_public_server/

[@SignoftheMagi]

Folks, this is an Alpha. It is unstable, janky and has issues. But it DOES work. And it feels like the team is trying their best to make this work. If you do load this, remember this is a bit of a grey legal area, so there is a risk. But since when do real heroes care about risks? Get your damned cape on and FIGHT!

[@Beachtrader0007]

It lives!

[@2003lxp]

Joined last night. Can’t believe it. I’m home.

[@Redbrover]

Was just coming here to post this. It feels so good to be home again. I am thankful to the people who made this possible and I hope they can continues the work!

[@Zufield]

It's dead, Jim.

[@CatAtomic99]

This game is still my favorite MMO. It was worth logging in just to go see a costume contest. People were so creative.

[@SylemGistoe]

man, i remember winning a few costume contests back in the day. The creativity and love of the community was second to none there, that they would do stuff like that all the time. damn... this episode hurt me in the feels. The decade old feels! crap this game was my childhood- i need a private server or something!

[@bigmoe5187]

Captain Oblivious can still go on the game with paragon chat, remake your character and whatnot. sometimes lots of people are on doing costume and role play stuff.

[@snarkotron1035]

Captain Oblivious I never won a costume contest, but I remember how glad I felt when waiting for a team to assemble someone would send me a private message complimenting my costume. Such a great community and it was part of what made the game so great.

[@dreammirrorbrony1240]

Snarko Tron I won the October Halloween one 2010. Was 1 of 3 winners for it (I was surprised). Character: Weapon X-23 on the Victory server. That was a lot of fun seeing all the outfits!

[@lordtimothymichel8677]

@@SylemGistoe childhood hell. I was a 33 year old cop. I miss this game to this day.

[@belazarius727]

"...cryptic sold City of Heroes to it's developer NCSOFT" and you can stop there. That was how the game failed.

[@mikehill6124]

guillaume leclercq I cannot like this comment enough! You cannot get more right!

[@trinityangel666]

You are so correct. The Superhero genre is more a western thing of course Korea isn't gonna like it much. I tried Aion & Guildwars which are also NCSoft and popular but I just couldn't get into them after playing for a few months.

[@gingerwiezc6536]

I liked GW but GW 2 was like Wow +GW plus Grind from Hades. And I stopped all NC gameplay at suset. I cancelled my GW2 after my Beta

[@DmdShiva]

@@trinityangel666 The Asian MMO is, at its base, fundamentally different in gameplay than Western MMOs. When the first MMOs appeared in Asia, the average home computer didn't have the graphics capability to run them, so the publishers made deals with the 'bangs' (internet cafes) to supply computers if they would install their games. So the MMO experience in Asia was getting together with your friends, going down to the bang, and playing together as a group on adjacent machines, and the MMOs were -- once you got out of the starter area -- fundamentally group-centric, with the vast majority of the content _requiring_ a group to complete. The Western MMO experience, in contrast, was going home, signing into the MMO, and either playing solo, meeting your friends in the game, who might not live anywhere near you, or teaming up with random individuals; the play was much more centered around individual gameplay. City of Heroes was a prime example of this style, and when Paragon Studios released City of Heroes in Korea (Korean doesn't have explicit plurals, so the literal translation of the game's name was 'City of Hero'), the playstyle for the game wasn't what the Korean players expected from an MMO, and they stayed away from it in droves. This, combined with the incompatibility of CoH with the way that NCsoft monetized their MMOs -- most being free-to-play, with a steady stream of microtransactions from players buying items in the cash shop -- meant that CoH was the odd man out in their MMO lineup. And when NCsoft handed an undisclosed development project to Paragon Studios, the overhead of that project meant that Paragon Studios, as a whole, was running at a loss, giving NCsoft management a justification for shutting the studio (and CoH) down, even though CoH was turning a profit, and without the drain from this undisclosed project development Paragon Studios would have been, too.

[@TheXev]

I really don't understand the misnomer of CoH turning a profit as an F2P. When CoH went F2P, literally all of my friends dropped subscription within a month (and that was at least 12 people) and we had been playing it for YEARS. There was no reason to be subbed, as a large chunk of CoH's player base were RPers and the F2P provided all of the RP we wanted at zero cost. CoH going F2P may have increased the population, but I know no one that was paying anything to play after F2P. We all hoped for the best and ultimately expected the failure from CoH, and it did fail and rather quickly.

[@erich1998]

The COH community was, by far, one of the best gaming communities I ever had the privilege to be a part of. The way they helped each other was infectious. I found myself doing the exact same for new players when they joined. That is the legacy of the community.

[@ZION73082]

And the real world heros all the community charity events and name another mmo community that so many people got married irl while logged into the game that paragon studies released a wedding cosmetic pack just wow 😲🤯🙏

[@jasonsmith3537]

This game was a big deal for me as I got home from deployment (wounded) and out of the Army in 2004. I got home in July of 2004 and while spending my last 2 weeks processing out, I had stopped at the Wal-Mart there in town outside of post and saw the big City of Heroes box and was like "wow, open world huh? Wonder what that's like?". It barely ran on my old computer I had in the barracks but I still had some money left on my STAR card lmao..and upgraded from my AMD 128mb Radeon card (still have it) and got a 256mb. Literally on August 4th of 2004 I was officially a civvie again and headed home. 10 days after I got home a company picked me up (I was an 11B so no real skills other than the war stuff). The job had me traveling and working solo 11 months a year....and this game is what kept me out of bars and running around. I eventually paid for 4 accounts ($60 a month) and bought myself 3 more laptops lol...and I quad boxed them when CoV came out. I had so much fun with the AWESOME community in-game and still to this day, 18yrs later have 2 of those friend I met on the game. One I visited in Jersey when I was on that side of the country and her and I would play over at her place when I had time. The other friend was clear across the country in San Diego and I used to visit him when out that way. I played hard core from just a couple months after the game released until 2012 on that last day in Pocket D. Now, of course I play it in a different way and am so happy for that. I did love how the Devs literally got on the game as the signature characters and interacted with us players. We even had the guy who played Synapse come in and run a SF with us when Cimerora and the ITF came out. I do miss the old ways of the game though...where you had to earn your capes and auras... no travel powers until lvl14 etc. I also loved that the game had not been corrupted by micro-transactions and all the loot box BS you see now in games. It died just before the greed took over and people's wallets started getting attacked for content. Although they played with the Free 2 Play towards the end, the game was still solid at $15/mo and you DID have to buy the Rogue expansion (which I still have the DVD). I have most of the box sets still..posters, figurines, etc. The CoX franchise was one of the LAST truly dev-dedicated games I have played. Where content was king and the game was made for you...the devs listened and responded on the official boards and I remember being personally asked about a few things when the recipe system came out in private messages. These guys were on top of any bugs as well.... This game has so many little details that show just how passionate they were about the content in this game... and all for $15 a month. I had some great memories and met some great people through this game...and it was..and still is..a big part of my life as far as being there as I adjusted to the new life and being something I looked forward to after working 100hr weeks or driving through snow storms to get to work in some mountain range somewhere in some state... When I got to my hotel rooms, this game was booting up before I was settled in. The music in the game (especially Aeon City and The Forge locations) still trigger that nostalgia as CoX was the first really big MMORPG I had fallen into aside from my old days of EQ. For some, this was just another game in the books for the era....for others, like me, it had a much bigger impact..and with PTSD being bad early on being home...I had bad moments if I went and found a bar in whatever town I was in....this game actually had me so hooked that it kept me from going out and getting drunk and having the chance to have an episode...and instead kept me engaged..sometimes I had to check out late bc I had stayed up all night.

[@ob0n3zo55]

It’s back

[@mr.dunavich9482]

City of Heroes, in all its glory, came back as original and as untouched as the day they took the servers online. NCSoft recently gave them the licenses, they are adding new content, etc.

[@mattkozak3937]

City of heroes was a community. it was like hoping online and meeting up with your family to work toward a common goal.

[@UnknownXV]

My favorite memories from this game were costume contests. No other MMO came close to a feeling of community like that, where player organized contests were popular and meaningful. Damn I miss it.

[@luketfer]

ah I remember that, seeing people all lined up under the Atlas statue, you'd sometimes see new players asking what was going on, be told and then join the line *sigh*ah memories...

[@TubeNotMe]

OH yes, that was part of the Community thing I haven't found elsewhere. There were other things people would do for fun, too, like playing Hide and Seek or freefalling from buildings and seeing who could turn on Hover or Flight last without hitting the ground. OH, and Pocket D -- how many games have a place like that? Or just hanging out under Atlas, chatting about whatever...

[@danielporter1233]

heh heh,no doubt. and the player that orginised the costume contest would reward the winner out of their own pockets. thats the community i miss

[@midassnap9028]

I remember walking up wondering why all these characters were lined up, someone told me it was a costume contest so I got in line. I ended up winning and received 3 million from the guy who organized it.

[@tinnitusthenight5545]

Got invited to judge one my first day!! god I miss this game so much!

[@MrDEMarq]

Cryptic's BIGGEST mistake was selling their I.P. to NCSoft.

[@macrondo5852]

MrDEMarq oh man that must hurt for then

[@FatalFist]

Cryptic originally wanted to use the Champions IP (A pen and paper game based on superheroes - that's why Statesman looks very similar to Defender from Champions). But the creators of Champions weren't willing to sell the rights so Cryptic made City of Heroes instead. When Marvel's Online title flopped, the creators of Champions saw the potential of a visceral super hero MMO - DC Online was becoming a thing so naturally they sold their rights for Cryptic to utilize. It was more or less Cryptic wanting to actually build a game they wanted to see but unfortunately, Champions Online flopped. While Champions is still playable today - it just didn't feel right at all.

[@cercieshaia9498]

@@FatalFist Unfortunately I never got to play CoH myself. I came into the superhero mmo genre with DCUO but it felt very poorly done. I found Champions Online soon after and ended up liking it a lot more. I made friends who were refugees from CoH and they'd often say how great it was. I could only imagine because at the time Champions was pretty great to me with all the options it had over DCUO. Though I was there when Cryptic was aquired by PWI and saw a lot of the bad decisions that inevitably put the game on life support. Still even now, after so many years and little happening in CO, I find my friends still finding stuff to do and rp to have fun with. Unlike any of the other games I play where if you take a break, everyone you know has stopped playing. So I figure those die hard CO people are likely as close as I'll come to knowing the CoH community. I just wish more communities were as outgoing as the video described them to be. Community pretty much makes or breaks a game for me.

[@jacksonhazen8104]

@@cercieshaia9498. The CoH community was the best. There were a few Ass holes but for the most part people really helped newbies out! I still feel sick to my stomach thinking about the ending of the game. Particularly around Halloween and winter. They had seasonal events. During Halloween you could go trick or treating. You walk up to any door knock on it and you would get a treat of powerups or temporary costumes. Or it would say trick and the door would open and 3 or 4 werewolves witches and pumpkin headed plants would attack you. The winter event area was a ski resort and you could do a mission to rescue baby new year. Plus a bunch of other stuff! Now I'm gonna go curl up in the fetal position and cry. I miss that game! 😢😭😭😭😭

[@AmazingKevinWClark]

Take champions and make it more dynamic in the gameplay and that was city of heros. The graphics were obviously worst but when the game was replaced nothing came close to being as good. I do like the nemesis system in Champions but the character creation was far better in city of heros.

[@PerceptionIsReality9]

To me, the most under-appreciated thing about CoH/V was that you didn't have to live vicariously through someone else's creation. No Batman, Captain America, Superman, Spiderman, et al. Your creation was yours and yours alone (excepting the game as a whole, of course). You could (at least I know I did) create characters that became part of the grand tapestry of the city. Many of the community were regular gamers that would acknowledge you and treat everyone with respect. Camaraderie, not contempt. Starting a character from your imagination and taking them through the trials and tribulations of the leveling process; doing missions and story arcs that ultimately became part of your history was a simple pleasure. No two characters would have the same experiences along the way (though you could certainly flavor your experience with your favorite missions/arcs/task forces). The lack of interest of NCSoft to sell the game shows an amazing short-sightedness and lack of good business sense on their part. A game so rich in content deserved a much better fate. So, to all my heroes (GoldenBullet, Captain Evil Bob, Hellsgate Guardian, and all the rest) I say, 'Forever rest in peace my friends, you've earned your respite.' :'-(

[@FatalFist]

Going Rogue further expanded on this too with red and blue choices that made missions feel similar to your Mass Effect experiences. I loved it.

[@cercieshaia9498]

The community sounded great. Wonder where they all went. :/

[@jacksonhazen8104]

@@cercieshaia9498. They are out there playing other games but still wishing they were in Paragon City jumping, flying, or tellaporting to the top of the Atlas statue. I know I am. There has been no other game that has even come close to the customizability of your characters and the camaraderie of the CoH community.

[@TheLastGarou]

I'm still running one of my old CoH heroes in a weekend GURPS game. You have it exactly right: Our character *were* us. They were the Heroes we wanted to be.

[@Illesdan]

@@cercieshaia9498 Some of us went to Secret World Legends. Some of us even use our names from CoH.

[@Tayzorr]

CoH was a canvas you could fill with anything you wanted. You could make your character exactly how you wanted, make them do what you wanted, and decide how they would behave and why. CoH never messed with that or tried to force a personality or narrative onto the events, because it knew that was your job. That was why my friends and I played consistently for seven years, and why we still talk about it all the time with fondness. The mechanics were solid, the progression was satisfying, and we never even came close to running out of all the ideas for character builds, or stories we could tell, or bizarre synergies we could test and then justify with any kind of story we wanted. City of Heroes was the equivalent of a classroom with a whiteboard and markers of every colour imaginable, left to the mercy of a classroom full of bored and creative art students. NCSoft wiped the board clean, and replaced it with generic fantasy MMO #2000. "More ambitious projects", my ass.

[@stankfanger1366]

I want to reach out and physically hug your post. I teared up, thank you.

[@grassygnoll3345]

I had two characters with identical power sets but because they looked so different and had been invested with different personalities they felt different to play. That's a sign of good character creation.

[@Blakkrazor69]

Played for 5 years, Khronus-Alpha, bubbles and gravity 'troller. It was the best mmo I have ever played with a wonderful community of players. R.I.P.

[@aoescool]

not only that.. in the power sets you can get powers for one and take other powers for the other.. essentially two of your own toons with the same power types could play way different.. and then on top of that enhancing .. and on top of that how you enhanced and what type of incarnate you were.. no two toons were alike even if i showed you my build you can still come out with a different toon.. this game was the best

[@ZION73082]

@@aoescool it brings me painful tears from my heart that you called them toons 😭🤗 the memories

[@Mlow44]

Oh jeez I was one of the people asking for this but now that it's here I don't know if I can take it. Just the first 10 seconds, seeing that old trailer start up, is kicking me right in the nostalgia feels.

[@BlackIce3190]

Mlow44 I feel you, man. Started getting my gut twisted.

[@DoctorKandosii]

It feels like a kick in the bollocks.

[@luketfer]

I know man, it hits me too...

[@Zectifin]

I've been playing a bunch of WoW recently and it's been taking me on a nostalgia trip wanting CoH back. I think I'm driving my gf crazy rambling about how "WoW is great, but I wish they had this feature like CoH."

[@BlackIce3190]

Zectifin I've been making due with DCUO. Its good, but it ain't the same.

[@TimothyWhiteowl]

ncsoft intentionally murdered a legend because they refused to sell the IP. They were fully capable of maintaining an unsupported server.

[@ronpetersen2317]

I believe they did that because they didn't want to compete against it's own creation with future games.

[@FatalFist]

@@ronpetersen2317 Which is retarded logic since they'd be generating profit from two or more sources than a limited number.

[@Erythnull]

All because not popular in Korea logic. Hindsight with Aion not doing well they could have brought it back to have their MMO in the west but that would mean NCSoft saying they were wrong.

[@Cessate]

CoH/CoV was the best time I've ever had in the MMO world. I played Asherons Call, EQ, EQ2, Anarchy Online, DAOC, Shadowbane, and WoW... But none of these games had the appeal or heart that CoH did. I was part of the Alpha and Beta tests for both Heroes and Villains, and stayed with the game until it died. It was truly an amazing almost decade. Also, can we please acknowledge how great they were to their fans? For over a year they mailed out actual comic books to their subscribers, for free, with stories based on current events happening in game. I still have ever issue to this day. Eventually they moved to digital comics, but it was still a great treat.

[@BOYVIRGO666]

I played beta for both releases(alpha in CoH) and yeah it was the greatest mmo of all time.

[@PrinceSilvermane]

As a player of CoH, I honestly couldn't really pinpoint a particular point where it 'failed'. I never had any complaints as a long time player. Even at it's death the game was still profitable enough and was never in the red. Just goes to show that you can do everything right and still fail.

[@Voodooray007]

And that's a damn shame.

[@UncensoredRhett]

Probably the worst incident was the enhancement changes they made early on. Some people clung to the idea of 'muh 6 damage enhancements' but overall it was for the better though. The only other time I heard 'game is dying' was when freemium started but I think we all knew it wasn't going to last much longer after that but we were hoping for a source code leak or paragon buying the IP back etc. Little did we know NCSoft was a shitty company.

[@marks2807]

The Game failed the min. that Cryptic gave full control over to NCSoft, and started working on (Marvel Online) Champions Online. Being it was not a Korean game NCSoft did not place it as important to them as the games in their market.

[@KianaWolf]

I don't know about the moment it "failed", but I clearly remember the moment it died, to me. When I logged in for the first time after the free to play switch, the server was so empty. There used to be dozens of people congregating, talking, roleplaying, chat was always alive and people were always running around before, but that day I had to look high and low to see a handful of people. It went from a game where I could log in and find a group for almost any content in a matter of minutes, to a game where I couldn't get more than three people to join me for anything.

[@Postulio71]

Marvel MMO amounted to Marvel saying "You need to pay us extreme amounts of money for marvel licensing." And then Microsoft said they wouldn't pay that much (it was going to be on xbox360 too). So they both walked away and left Cryptic with an engine and no content. That's when Champions stepped in partnered up, now we have Champions Online. Still no CoX though. I doubt CoT will ever see the light of day. It seems like they have too few people working on it.

[@TrigansFunGames]

Well done video! City of Heroes still stands as my favorite MMO. I have yet to find another MMO that can fill it's shoes.

[@DustMonkey92]

Lord Trigan's Fun & Games - Daily Videos it's so hard to find an MMO that holds a light to CoH. They just aren't as immersive or fun

[@TrigansFunGames]

+DustMonkey92 You said it.

[@kazekamiha]

Agreed. I play Champions Online on and off to try and recapture the lightning... But it just... can't.

[@princetselemel4340]

The secret of why COH was so great because it was a mmorpg that didn't limit the player to a cookie cutter build, you really got to be anything you could imagine in creating names, and building power sets and costumes. You were who you wanted to be and not settling for the limitations of who the producers and designers generally say you have to be. Even our biography/backstorys were original, we were our characters' through and through and that made the Game an extension of our own reality. Coh2 or a true successor on a great engine would make billions, it's no secret COH had the most loyal fan base and gaming community of any mmorpg to date. I await the rebirth of COH in any form, I'm sure many feel the same way even if it's not through ncsoft. Cheers guys. Great video man.

[@jhonnoilcringeincarnato8593]

Prince Tselemel true nowadays most of the mmorpg are more like tower defense rather than mmorpg and they always have this fantasy/sci-fi ambientation that is always the same and they are always full of microtransation.the mmorpg is surely a dying genre with little to no hope of reborn

[@ronpetersen2317]

It did add a lot of options. But there were limitations. I always wanted a stretchy character option, or a green lantern style character.

[@jacksonhazen8104]

I agree completely! I would literally spend 2 or 3 hours just creating a hero or villain and then sometimes at least another hour coming up with a background story.

[@Rawen1982]

Wait no longer, it's back :D

[@theheartsstory]

@@Rawen1982 ahh I know! I can finally enjoy this gym of an mmo again

[@unforgivn81]

Don't know if I missed it, but I don't remember hearing the sidekicking system mentioned, and that was what put CoH head-and-shoulders above every MMO in my book.

[@TheLastGarou]

I've only seen one game *EVER* that had something similar. Path of Exile from Grinding Gear Games just implemented a level adjusting system that you can turn on and off in the party options that automatically sets your level to the mob level of a zone when you join a lower leveled party. One of the most immersive parts of CoX, and it takes nearly a decade for anyone else to even manage a half-assed equivalent. :'(

[@matthewbrandenburg922]

Everquest 2 had it as well, but it clearly was a borrowed idea. @@TheLastGarou

[@Redem10]

I knew this would come......but it is still quite painful to me * crawl up in a ball and cry*

[@nerdSlayerstudioss]

Unfortunately, they spent 6 years developing Wildstar. Think about it, it was in development as late as 2009-2010...they put so much time and money into that game, at this point I think they are just trying to break even.

[@Acesahn]

You knew this would come? Its one of the few MMORGP's to die die that Im aware of! The other one being that awesome Star Wars one.

[@DarkCT]

*sigh* some really good memories there...

[@AhmadSammy]

Acesahn almost every single MMORPG that was ever made is dead or on its way to die except for WoW and a few others..I would say almost 80 to 90% of MMORPGs even made failed, especially after WoW

[@Acesahn]

Well you can still play most of them. Everquest and Everquest 2 are still available for goodness sakes.

[@TheArtofUTube]

I miss taking my lvl 50 tanker into the sewers in Atlas Park for new players and taunt enemies and helping power level people to level 10.

[@philwarblood]

I used to take my level 50 healer into the sewers to help new characters too (MJ Thriller).

[@Dsanchz68]

I remember a glitch were youd save a citizen and they try to thank you but if you were flying they would follow you untill you landed. This led to having hoards of citizens following you unroll you landed. People would bring them to atlas for fun.

[@jacksonhazen8104]

@@Dsanchz68. That was so funny! Dragging 15 or so citizens over to atlas. Lol

[@RingTheBella]

Why does this describe my exact experience tho

[@Angell_Lee]

@@philwarblood I loved helping struggling new player too, saving their life before they died made me feel like a real hero.

[@dg8708]

I loved teleporting new toons just zoning into Atlas Park to the top of the globe so they could get "Top Dog" on their first day. Pass off some Infl, cancel team, apply all emp def buffs, and just let the little scamp ravage the NPCs. It always felt like a worthy intro , to a place where heroes live.

[@mogiloraine7892]

I still to this day miss watching my lil sis and dad have TP wars XD

[@boocha9959]

I have looked through hundreds of comments on this video and haven't found one typical "KZbin comment" or troll. This shows exactly how amazing this game was and how much it is missed. I played 7-8 years, made hundreds of characters and It felt fresh as the day I first logged on. From the first day my friend got me to buy it where we saw someone fall from the sky as their fly power was turned off and splat on the ground between us, through Winter Lord farming, Fire/Fire tanks (sigh), all radiation or kinetics or any power multiplier teams, to trolling people in pvp with a spines/nin stalker, this was by far my favorite game of all time. Nothing even comes close to it in terms of MMO's. If City of Titans ever launches, I'll be there punching/zapping/torching baddies with a huge smile on my face. Thanks for the albeit sad memories. Boocha out.

[@Illesdan]

I was in on Beta, and had every veteran badge until the game went down. I couldn't force myself to log in for the last two days, it just hurt too much knowing it wasn't going to be around. Had 7 legit lvl 50 toons with an 8th in the making. Three and a half pages of characters in all. It still is painful to think of all the time, money and effort I personally spent on that game. But, if it came back tomorrow, I'd ditch Secret Wold Legends in a heartbeat and be there to do it all over again.

[@zeppelin1851]

Its back :) private server

[@tynao2029]

nice man, what was some of your favorite classes you made and what was their offensive/defensive specs

[@Nightenstaff]

This video just *inflamed my hatred* for NCsoft again. Miss CoH so much.

[@irllcd13]

There were 2 superhero MMOs in development but I haven't heard anything about either of them in a long time. I really liked the crabspider, that was a super fun AT.

[@savecityofheroessavecityof5838]

YEP I AGREE! NCSOFT HATES AMERICA SO MUCH GOT TO SUPPORT ASIAN MARKET ONLY. RACIST HATE AS EXCUSE

[@GeneralErlend]

@savecityofheroes savecityofheroes The majority of people live in Asia. Why would they cater to Europe or the US if they can get more money by catering to the Asian market? Understand that gaming is usually a business first and foremost to companies.

[@wosh2nd68]

Yeah, company of heroes is good

[@Ston247]

Fuck NCSoft and Korea.

[@Protocurity]

I'm a refugee of CoH myself. I don't know if that's the official term, but every other CoH refugee agrees with the term. The worst part is, the game was murdered on the uptick. Meaningful and fun releases were coming out on a regular basis, and the next couple of slated updates were going to be the best thing ever. The game wasn't "floundering" like most dying games were. The game was rising higher, shinning brighter than it ever had before. City of Heroes didn't just die; it was murdered.

[@sattymike0155]

Agree. I’ve not found any game since that has hit the same marks. Nowhere near. Creating characters and my own story content was a blast. I solo’d a ton, but still thrived as a member of the community. It really was immersive and there were times in this game I felt actually heroic. It also fit my life in being able to pop in briefly and have enjoyable gaming experience if I couldn’t dedicate the hours needed for task forces etc. I miss it still.

[@Talendale]

Darn skippy. It was a game that was destroyed not by it's failure, but the failure of the companies that ran it. Very few MMORPGs die as long as they maintain a big community, but CoX was the most obvious exception.

[@ronpetersen2317]

I have heard the term myself ... it is official as far as I Am concerned.

[@ricktafoya2716]

That term seems perfect. I've moved from MMO to MMO since then. I've really enjoyed some, but it was never the same. I'm a superhero without a home :( Especially being primarily a Controller or Mastermind, there flat out is no MMO that comes close to filling those roles the same way. I've tried other pet and control classes and they make me want to vomit when I read "stun for 1.5 seconds" or I summon a single pet that just does whatever it wants until it dies. I mostly pass my time in Warframe now. It's not truly an MMO but still an amazing game in its own right.

[@mikepare1967]

Psych nurse says hello

[@DCV-gt9hu]

Lvl 1 lft, looking for sewers! I still remember the first time I played as a robotics mastermind. I had made my character a robot overlord, akin to the ingame cogs. When I hit the second travel power. Getting group fly. Turning it on and seeing all my robots kick on their rocket boots. My god. It was one of the coolest moments in all of my MMO gaming experience.

[@matth8381]

Oh man. My villain was a robotics mastermind as well. Dr. Zorbo. A steampunk inspired crazed inventor. Now I am getting the feels.

[@Trewq79]

@@matth8381 If it's any comfort, as of 30 minutes ago I found out the game has been mostly resurrected through the a data leak. Look up City of Heroes Homecoming, it's a group of people who uploaded the game and made a few servers. Was created in 2019, but from what I hear it's still pretty popular. KZbin has a bunch of videos on it too if you want to check those before downloading. Best of luck mate!

[@matth8381]

John Smith Thanks! It was easily the most memorable MMO I had ever played. Such a shame what went down. I am looking it up now!

[@Trewq79]

@@matth8381 Best of luck man. I learned about it yesterday and downloaded it SO FAST haha. Definitely a lot of nostalgia the moment I ran the game again.

[@goaway5297]

To think this game had a secret private server using a backup from the original game for the past six years.

[@Malinkadink]

I was mad at first when i learned about that, but to be honest they had a few dozen people playing, and with that population the game is pointless. Any MMORPG without people is no fun at all. Now that its out in the wild and theres several hundred people per server it can be played as it was in 2012.

[@ryanmussell739]

Toxic Anonymity - I think it got shut down. From what I remembered I think they had over 1,000 members.

[@ramaset1]

@@ryanmussell739 very not shut down

[@willaien9849]

@Toxic Anonymity cohhc.gg, it's open to everyone and still popular

[@theiran]

@@ryanmussell739 It's still playable. You should check it out.

[@WintersArcher]

CoH/CoV Best Super hero/villain mmo ever. I still miss this game. Thanks for uploading this.

[@grassygnoll3345]

Best MMO ever.

[@hexen203]

Don't know man... when I tried it the game felt clunky and very outdated even for World of Warcraft standards.

[@Zectifin]

Wilion109 it had a slower pace to the combat. the graphics were shit, but you had more time to think in combat.

[@Slitheringpeanut]

It was the community that made the game.

[@hexen203]

A veeery slow pace yeah. With stiff animations and odd-looking visual effects. I wasn't a fan.

[@Zectifin]

i didn't care about the immersion. if i wanted that I'd play champions. I loved city of heroes because of the large amount of scalable instances with adjustable difficulty, a dedicated control class, and the fact that you could have your support character not be a healer.

[@Acesahn]

Well by immersion, he doesnt mean just character creator, he means how the enemies, the good npc factions, the world around you, looks, feels and plays in a way that feels... well immersive. Fighting those mutants under the sewers at low lvls for instance, only to find out in higher lvl ranges that the reason they are psychic and have weird junky lazer guns is because the Rikti were experimenting on homeless people! Stuff like that made it feel immersive

[@TorqueBacklash]

I loved the story plot threads. fighting and exploring to eventually see the true leaders of the Hellions. Discovering the true darkness behind the Lost or the fate of Hero 1. The clash of the Council and and Fifth Column was real fun for me. The council felt boring to fight compared to the nazi Column.

[@Zectifin]

Oh I loved the setting and everything, he just at one point said that's what everyone's favorite thing about the game was, when mine was the features I said originally.

[@Acesahn]

But there's always that awesome super mission (I forgot what their story driven "dungeons" were called...) where Nazi's invaded Ancient Rome/Greece to make themselves REALLY the chosen descendants of the Roman empire XD

[@Zectifin]

The 5th column was my favorite enemy faction. I really hated when they ruined them for the European release by making them the council.

[@4dmind]

Also, the animation and kinetics was over the top. I haven't seen anything with that level of fluidity. The fact that the models were low poly was fine because the animations were all mocap. When you hit an enemy it felt like you hit someone. It felt like a moving comic book. For my personal tastes, it was the best MMO of all time.

[@andyt1313]

Yep. Absolutely. In most mmo's today I feel detached from my character. In Coh although you were playing third-person it still had a visceral first-person feel when you used your powers. I miss CoH soo much. Superhero movies have taken over TV and Film but a game of heroes died. How ironic and sad.

[@theoko0707]

Yup. Satisfying thuds. Soooo simple, soooo basic, soo fundamental...and just about unheard of. I've played multiple games where I don't even realize I'm hitting or being hit because they can't design that kind of tactile connection CoX had.

[@FatalFist]

It definitely need a graphics overhaul towards the end but man was it fun.

[@izuela7677]

Bouncing 5th column all over the floors, walls and ceiling with my first character, an energy/energy blaster named Ultra Violette, was what hooked me and my hubby on the game. Another later character I made also had a lot of kick to her. Ms Glory, a martial arts/regen scrapper (and supergirl lookalike) who was crazy powerful. She carried so many weaker team mates, desperate for a build do over, through the Terra Volta re-spec mission. She would send villains flying and dropping with her kicks (and the 2hand punch from the fly pool). Knock backs and knock downs actually worked in this game.

[@chadwaters5894]

I feel like I am towing a line between helpful and pest (because I am spamming the comments), but Google City of Heroes: Homecoming if you don't know about it already

[@caseykendall5506]

It's back. City of Heroes: Homecoming. And NCSoft are 100% allowing it to go ahead--they've been in talks with the HC devs to let it be here to stay, so no risk of C&D shutdowns, either!

[@MrAdamske]

thx, just jumped back in after all these years :)

[@diallo1347]

Thank you. By far my most played MMO. I played for 7 years and had several heroes and villians. So many fond memories of playing with my friends

[@brentblack6178]

To this day I refuse to play NCsoft games. Cause I loved this game far to much.

[@tenyearsinthejoint1]

Brent Black I've never touched any of their games ever since they discontinued CoH. They could've passed it to another publisher....but they didn't. they didn't care about their fanbase. they outright abandoned them. shut their fans out just to keep dishing out new titles that they think would make them for cash. it's sad that's why I've already lost all my respect to them. and I'd love to see them go bankrupt....Ncsoft can go to hell for what they did to their devoted fans. but in the end they're all just some greedy business men.....sigh

[@ironeleven]

I gave them another chance with Blade and Soul. That was a mistake.

[@hexen203]

NCSoft is clearly in such a need for players huh. Sarcasm aside, atitudes like those won't really change NCSoft's way of thinking and operating.

[@TimeSlayer3]

Never bought NCSoft after the sunset and never will again. I sincerely hope they crash and burn for what they've done to CoX...

[@CorporalHicks8]

NCSoft is actually struggling at least in the west. Wildstar and Guild Wars 2 both have dwindling player bases and have both gone free to play.

[@CoyoteSeven]

I will never subscribe to another MMO again. Getting the rug pulled out from under us like that was a dick move.

[@chubbubdreamer6904]

J.M. Luna Unfortunately that's one of the risks of playing an mmo. Games that last as long as say, World of Warcraft are fairly rare, and even that will die eventually. The more you get attached to it, the more it hurts when it's gone.

[@12pandemon]

Few? The private server community for wow is massive. Hell, Elysium easily beats out vanilla and BC wow's numbers. I think WoW could go strong even 10 years after it's shutdown.

[@Furluge]

Yeah well Blizz is not suing each and every private server like NCsoft does either.

[@justkidingman1938]

24:00 The game is back. Just a 7 years break

[@Surfermario]

Just goes to show that heroes and villains never truly die.

[@mr.popper9759]

Tis but a blip!

[@Exarch_Of_Justice]

One little bit about the "community" aspect of this video. Back in Virtue the server I was in there was a player made. " Taxi Bot" guild wich was players hanging out in low level "hazard" zones wich were huge and full of mobs and stood at the entrances providing to " Taxi" service for low level players who didint have theyre travel power yet with the Teleport Power to get em back at the entrance fast able to sell the junk they accumulated at the vendor or just exit the zone to go level up at the trainer in Atlas Park. TO THIS DAY I have not been in a single MMO ever despite playing over 2 dozen of em over the years who had such a helpful community. LOTRO being the closest thing iv seen.

[@marianneminshall4352]

Tony V one of the best known community members from City of Heroes was the backbone of Taxibots and i joined him and his group to provide passage to places but it was much much more...we taught how to build up your character and showed players where all the buttons and plaques were...helped get players badges...i was already helping the community on Champion Server but Tony took me to all servers...Thanks for bringing up the Taxibots Exarch...There has never been a better community than the one on City of Heroes! Check out Paragon Chat...Codewalker and Leandro Pardini are awesome...This is Felicia Divine (The Dark Defender) leader of the interdimentional supergroup ALL-OUT-WAR! (Champion Server) aka R4P4 (Taxibot) KEEP THE TORCH BURNING!!!

[@ToBoGoN]

Just one example out of many.... in what is probably at this point more than 20 years of gaming I have never run across a more helpful community. It is the gold standard.

[@woodrax]

THIS! I used to have an Ill/Kin build, and would take new groups into the Sewers, and grant them super speed and healing while controlling groups of enemies so they could take them down more easily. It was awesome to take them from one end to the other, watching their levels rise, and seeing all of the comments as they played the part of a true Super Hero Group, taking down baddies in a huge maze. I have never seen the like since, and really miss CoH/CoV.

[@azraelle6232]

The only example I can think of off-hand would be the Fuel Rats in Elite: Dangerous.

[@Riceball01]

I never experienced taxi bots when I played but I do remember players, and myself, randomly buffing and healing other players for no other reason than because we could. No teaming, no looking for payment, just buff or heal then move on. I loved that aspect of the game's community.

[@CyberDragonEX13]

If City of Heroes was still around I'd still be playing it.

[@donstrutz750]

If this game came back, I would play in a second.

[@ValCronin]

SAMEEEEEEEEEEE

[@SlocumJoe7740]

Same

[@airkarcap]

I would even pay full retail price for the game again! No extra content and pay the monthly fee, hell raise the fee and i would pay it, to have my COH/COV back

[@Rainz_Storm]

SAME

[@Nihontopride]

I'd pay full retail again and play it with a premium subscription but ONLY if it wasn't owned by NCSoft. NCSoft can go straight to hell. Not sure which is greater, my love for CoX or my hatred of NCSoft.

[@jonathanrios8316]

this is my favorite MMO and one of my favorite games ever. ive played MANY MMOs some im in the process in but city of heroes was the only one i found myself having 3, 4 or 5 sittings playing. i couldn't create enough, customization was freaking amazing and combat was simple franticand tons of fun. this game will truley be missed. RIP city of heroes

[@jrytacct]

RIP? CoH Homecoming has been up for years. I'm playing CoH *right now* while listening to this video.

[@jonathanrios8316]

@@jrytacct I wrote that comment literally years ago. I have been playing homecoming for as long as it's been out. Thanks

[@AspieMemoires]

God I miss this game. I remember when they introduced Villains and it just immediately blew WoW out of the water for me. Hideout customization, class customization, I mean just everything about this game was gold.

[@jrytacct]

You do know it's been back for years? Homecoming has been up for quite some time now.

[@AspieMemoires]

@@jrytacct You do realize this comment is 2 years old right? Lmfao 😂 like bro, it’s like telling someone “You know World War 2 ended a while ago right?” And you’re speaking to a holocaust survivor.

[@AspieMemoires]

@@jrytacct Way to revive a dead comment for no reason whatsoever.

[@dbear6148]

COH has a special place in my heart. At the time it released I was playing Everquest but was completely fed up with the game. I had read good things about COH so I quit EQ and joined COH on the third day it was out. I never went back to EQ. It is quite sad how this game was killed eventually. It had an incredible playerbase, a very unique feel to the game, and it actually encouraged roleplaying by it's very design. I've never seen people get so into the design and backstory of their characters in any other MMO. Just running around the city and seeing someone in trouble, and stopping to help them, was a common occurrence. This video makes me miss the game so much.

[@terradraca]

The shutdown of the game was clearly a Nemesis plot. Who remembers Nemesis? Best villain ever!

[@RockMacDonald23]

Lord Hawkeye so fucking cool dude ugghh I miss CoH SO MUCH

[@CrazyTasteyPi]

Oh man do I miss hearing that line. Really though, I don't think even Nemesis would have devised a plot that involved destroying the whole world. He wasn't crazy. ;p

[@1stPCFerret]

*Nemesis Plot* became a meme.

[@irllcd13]

*Nemesis plot intensifies*

[@SomeSchmuck1]

I never did ge-LORD NEMESIS IS WATCHING YOU, LORD HAWKEYE-t those TPS reports.

[@DiscipleToki]

They canceled a game people would still be playing in respectable numbers today for a bunch of games that flopped. Well done NCSoft. Remaster and bring it back, I am fairly convinced that CoH is one of the few games that would still be standing with wow and eve.

[@SISTEMAQ]

Gw2 and blade and soul aren't flops

[@FatalFist]

Going Rogue even had a lot of promise moving forward with its moral system. The ability to change directions of missions (quests) via red or blue choices made it feel similar to Mass Effect. With proper dedication and more investment, we could have very well seen a Warframe-like universe where you played as super heroes because they were evolving the universe we all occupied. It was a true let down when NCSoft chose to terminate Paragon Studios. This video doesn't do the inter workings justice.

[@cercieshaia9498]

@@K3vyB I'm pretty sure NcSoft wouldn't be keeping them around if they were not making money.

[@jacksonhazen8104]

I agree. Even if they would have stopped any further development I think it had the fan base that it would still be going strong. I guarantee myself and the friends of mine that played it would still be playing it.

[@JeremyB8419]

Companies over there seem like they make a great game, then make half a dozen other games that are all crap and the company flops.

[@PatrickStewarts]

Oh man I miss this game so badly. It was my first MMO and still the most fun I think I've ever had playing a game.

[@ShiftTheMatrixGaming]

You can play it again from what I heard.

[@alm4926]

@@ShiftTheMatrixGaming You sure can. I'm currently playing CoH while watching this vid.

[@HeShoeTooBig]

City of Heroes worked because it rewarded the player base for teaming up. That's it. Think about it. 99% of MMOs reward you for being anti-social and playing like its a single player game. City of Heroes gave you bonus exp for teaming with people and actually changed the missions based on how many people you had in your team.

[@crimsonstar108]

Jinxxed0 AND buffs and debuffs stacked if they came from different toons! That meant you could steamroll through missions if you had multiple people stacking the same buffs/debuffs. It was awesome, and focused more on fun and diversity rather than min/maxing because mobs needed to be carefully planned for the way most MMOs approach level design.

[@boocha9959]

I totally miss full /rad teams or /kinetics. The power multipliers were what made this game unending fun.

[@grassygnoll3345]

i spent hours in a team were I was the sole blaster in a team of defenders, it was sooooo much fun. Total power trip that leveled the whole team stupid fast. No MMO has made teaming so easy, rewarding and worthwhile than COH/V did 11 years ago. Add the sidekick system they had and it was perfect.

[@Gwynarth]

Not only that. The game was just too good.

[@FatalFist]

My favorite experience was running a full Stalker Squad for the Cimerora TF. It showed just how good you were at a character when you played your best and concurred the trial.

[@TimHisk]

The main take away from this is never support NCSoft.

[@electrickflame353]

Tim Hisk well said Tim! I hope Ship of Heroes is super succesful when it comes out next year!

[@loganblack1502]

i completely agree with that statement

[@arrhythmicjones4069]

Haven't spent a penny on an NCSoft product sense the shutdown. And I always make sure folks asking about games realize the possible dangers of NCSoft. Always suspected that not wanting to admit a mistake, and lose face had a lot to do with them not allowing the CoH to continue.

[@gdroff]

So of the 3 main successors which has the best character options? What are your favorites?

[@daudl5011]

Theres a lot of good ppl at NCSOFT, but i maybe biased since i did an internship there. Its mainly the business side, not the dev or art team.

[@techpappee]

Wow, the memories you brought back. Long time CoH player, started with issue 3 until close. You didn't cover the Incarnate system (50+) progression but regardless covered a lot. I'm one of those that still has hopes CoT will deliver. While not as sure as before I still have hope. Great Video!!

[@Fourtytwo4242]

I know this is old but the game is back For how long who knows.

[@marianneminshall4352]

Tony V one of the best known community members from City of Heroes was the backbone of Taxibots and i joined him and his group to provide passage to places but it was much much more...we taught how to build up your character and showed players where all the buttons and plaques were...helped get players badges...i was already helping the community on Champion Server but Tony took me to all servers...Thanks for bringing up the Taxibots ExarchofJustice...There has never been a better community than the one on City of Heroes! Check out Paragon Chat...Codewalker and Leandro Pardini are awesome...This is Felicia Divine (The Dark Defender) leader of the interdimentional supergroup ALL-OUT-WAR! (Champion Server) aka R4P4 (Taxibot) KEEP THE TORCH BURNING!!! Thank you NerdSlayer for putting this video together and remiding us of what was, why this happened and what may yet be :)

[@TalkingAboutYooh]

The community was the best part of CoH.

[@doublec413]

Shane Brannon yes I have met so many people on CoH

[@seanmalloy7249]

The single best commentary about the CoH community was seeing parents commenting in-game that CoH was the _only_ online game that they had no qualms about letting their kids play unsupervised, because they knew that there wouldn't be abusive players focusing on them. I think the youngest player I knew I was playing with was five, and while they may not have been the most focused player in the team, they kept up with the rest of the team and was a fully contributing team member, and nobody dumped on them for making mistakes or just not doing everything exactly right (I've seen other games where you'd get yelled at or kicked from a team for being off a couple tenths of a second in a rotation or not having optimized gear).

[@silverfiste]

I played with a family that was n once a week. They were spread all over the world with their jobs, used CoH as family game night.

[@cercieshaia9498]

@@seanmalloy7249 So sad there's no communities left like that. People these days think it's uncool to respect each other.

[@marks2807]

So we lost the best Super Hero mmo of all time for Boobs and Soul, and GW 2

[@TubeNotMe]

Yep, something truly unique given up for more of the same old, same old (with fancy improved graphics! Oh boy!), because "it's what the public wants."

[@Cfuson001]

nah we lost it for wildstar, i still have the emails from them telling me i would get free stuff in wildstar if i continued supporting them their.

[@DanielBMS]

We are losing too many positive games. Uncreative content is made for StepMania and Soul Calibur 5 is the last fighting game with great character customization.

[@NokoFace]

We lost CoH to WildStar. WildStar is an OKAY game, but there's a reason why it went F2P within half a year of it's conception. CoH was still making them a decent profit, but because they wanted players to play their new baby, they axed the game people liked and tried to dangle a carrot over WildStar. It didn't work.

[@129das]

Wildstar is karma for shutting down CoH just think about it that way.

[@nopewmopan]

It didn't fail. It was killed. No mmo has been able to live up to the standard they set for me.

[@ronpetersen2317]

Same here. Every single one I think to COH and think how the game I Am playing now is lacking until I get bored of it repeating the same crap missions over and over

[@troodon1096]

Would be more accurate to say it died of old age.

[@kennethcook9406]

@@troodon1096 No, it would NOT be more accurate to say that; and here's why: World of Warcraft. Still going after being released the same year as City of Heroes.

[@LordMaxwellx]

This game was Barren for years, it most certainly died. It only had a few hold out people still playing. I'd say the worst thing going for it was its age

[@Slasha00]

@@kennethcook9406 Nah... It would be more accurate. WoW is special. Because it is special it is not super useful to compare against the average MMO. No other MMO has lasted as long as WoW. 99% of all other MMOs die, and not always because the game sucked; it just became outdated over time. Not many MMO companies have the kind of fuck-off money that Blizzard has to keep WoW alive. Even so, some would say WoW has been effectively on life-support for years now.

[@kangaroo4024]

I was never into the super hero genre, never owned any comic books, but this game... was so much fun I had it subbed for over 5 years. Mad fun!

[@OmegaFox09]

Kanga Roo I can attest to this. I don’t like the super hero genre' especially in today’s world. I don’t like marvel or dc at ALL. But this....this game was epic. Possibly the BEST mmo I’ve ever had. I never had so much fun with it.

[@throgdarthebrute2688]

man... so many years later and this is still painful... I regret not being there when 10's of thousands of players across all servers stood by the Atlas Statue in Paragon City doing a Salute as the game shut down... :(

[@jgullifer123]

Cool. I played for a couple years. Then I took a few years off. I didn't know it was shutting down and I decided to hop back in as my old character to see the place again. I flew around all over the city and there wasn't 1 person in the whole game but me. I had the whole game to myself. I thought "Where is everyone?" then I read soon after that it was shutting down. It was sad.

[@mikos5066]

I was one of those at the Atlas Statue when the servers shut down. Very sad day.

[@AoOaoOao]

Mikos I've had few sadder.

[@portugaltheman6]

i could cry... i really really could right now. to this day i am still upset about this, and badly want to go back and play again. it just sucks cause it is completely gone forever. a friend died, and i miss that friend so much...

[@Galeden]

You can revisit it, make new characters, go throughout the world (Granted a husk of what it once was), talk to old fans, paragon chat is wonderful

[@jpzombie3390]

This game will always hold a special place in my heart for the simple fact that it truly felt like a living and breathing world, the story arcs were epic, and the community was wonderful. I remember the many times I helped and was helped by other players such as flying around on my patrol and seeing a low level player being overwhelmed and dropping down from the sky and destroying his opponents and giving him a revive. I honestly felt like a Hero of sorts. Playing a villain was great too. The sheer amount of power, origins, and customizations meant you could never run into anyone who looked alike and was celebrated with costume contests run by players and guilds. Just a fantastic game.

[@doxxi5319]

ncsoft seems like the EA of mmos

[@turtleanton6539]

Sure are

[@astralaris8712]

NcSoft and Nexon probably :D

[@astralaris8712]

​@metalfaust19 NcSoft is the EA of MMORPGs, EA may have killed Ultima but the private server are still blooming, Warhammer that point you can have and Anthem isnt an MMO in the first place, its a Looter Shooter or should be such one at least, idk if it counts as MMO though, the rules according to waht is an MMO and what isnt kind of go seperate ways depending on who you ask :D

[@starropenisthe4th786]

Chasind there’s a coh private server btw u can join there are also other private servers for the game that are adding their own content btw

[@ubiquitouspanda4466]

@@astralaris8712 anthem is as much an mmo as destiny or warframe, so if theyre counted as mmos to you, then anthem definitely was :D

[@Crowley9]

Another logical reason for not selling the rights: They would be creating more competition against themselves. Every minute someone plays an MMO game from another publisher is a minute lost that they could be playing theirs. Of course in reality it is much more complex than that, but when you have companies claiming that every pirated copy equals one lost legitimate sale...

[@edd8914]

And CoH was actually a very good game so they didn't want that kind of competition against them. Fuckers

[@loverofchitown]

CoH is and always will be legendary R.I.P

[@Lagzlot]

This one hurt the most because it didn't die peacefully of old age or poison itself with its own bad habits. Instead it was assassinated on stage during the first show of its comeback tour.

[@CIkler]

I never even got close to max level, but it still broke my heart to see this game close down. I spent so many hours just in character creation. I wish there was an EMU for this, I'd play it every day.

[@latue87]

There are community servers now. You can make new characters!

[@BKPrice]

Made me very sad to watch, but I'm glad you analyzed this. God I miss that game!

[@Mathadar]

Agreed, even though I asked for it. Mostly because I remember the days when the clock was counting down. I still have cape radio on my bookmarks from back when they used to DJ all the time. They still operate, but now City of Heroes is gone, its not the same. www.thecaperadio.com/ At least most of the staff are back for events :)

[@aka-47k]

thx for reminder of cape radio, lol they even host event of the game i changed to after coh, sto! lol

[@xSkwintz]

Wait, wasn’t this game extremely popular and pretty successful for what it was? I thought the main reason they killed it was because NCSoft REALLY wanted to push GW2 and didn’t want to really want to spend time publishing CoH anymore

[@charlesruffing5606]

GW2 eats peanuts out of donkey shit.

[@FatalFist]

NCSoft just wanted to focus their investment on other titles like GW2, Aion, and Blade and Soul so yeah - City of Heroes wasn't making a whole lot but it was still making a profit towards the end of its life cycle which is what pissed the community off. It wasn't failing. Although I hated Freedom and I got screwed over by it - the game itself was on the path to doing well.

[@micahjohnsonboxing6409]

Yeah I thought the intro calling this game a failure was off, all the computer kids at my school loved this game.

[@BOYVIRGO666]

I come back to this video and i keep being forced to remember growing up playing city of heroes. I am the reason why several supergroups needed to make rules about how serious your RP backstories needed to be. The painful amounts of sarcasm were hilarious.

[@johnk7178]

I so miss this game. I still have the box, cd envelope and map of Paragon City. Was just a great game. Go. Hunt. Kill Skullz!

[@calvinsilvestri3057]

@@johnk7178 Might have some good news for you if you haven't heard, but CoH is pretty much back now. the Homecomeing server got an official license from NC soft.

[@BlackburnBigdragon]

Having City of Heroes torn from me was the reason that I swore off of MMO's and redefined my thinking about the games I purchase in general. I put so much work into those characters and into those bases, and made so many friends only to have them ripped away from me. I vowed never to go through that again with a game company. From now on, I play no games with "Online only DRM" or any MMO's at all. I take no chances that some stupid game company, out of greed or mismanagement, or any other reason, can take my game that I forked over my hard earned cash for, away from me.

[@Lavos2007]

Online Only DRM isnt as bad as you make it out to be, people complained about it with games like Starcraft 2 or Diablo 3 from Blizzard but eventually realized it wasnt worth complainin about MMOs by nature HAVE to be online because thats how they work, so thats not "online only DRM" but for non-MMO games with online-only, i can understand some level of frustration but theres nothing wrong with it, it helps prevent alot of miscreants from ruining games by making it more easy and efficient to target and ban them i mean, Diablo 3 on Consoles is a good example, on PC its got Online Only, on Consoles it doesnt, but on Consoles its rife with hackers and other shady types...on PC it isnt, and theres only one difference: PC is online-only

[@t20kdc]

​@@Lavos2007 Frankly, your argument doesn't make any sense. You are right about MMOs having to be online-only because, indeed, that's how they work. Can't be massively multiplayer without being online. But being online-only does not make a game immune from cheaters - actually quite the opposite. You don't have to worry about cheaters if you're not playing a game with other people, after all, and the only possible benefit of online-only is multiplayer features. If I had to take a guess at what would be causing cheating issues on console Diablo 3, it would be that game developers automatically assume that a console is magically secure. This, of course, is not the case, so the moment that such a game is multiplayer, cheating can happen. In single-player games, the only reason to make a game online-only is as a form of DRM. Mix in a server shutdown and suddenly having bought a game is no longer a guarantee that game is playable. This is why people hate certain DRM technologies that require an online connection to a server whose existence is not guaranteed - it results in the age-old tale of a pirate who receives a better experience than a legitimate player because of the developer and/or publisher's interference.

[@Christopher_Gibbons]

I have to disagree about the game's ultimate strengths. The world was really just a big waiting room for the games main appeal: Infinitely variable procedurally generated content. They could have let the game run for a thousand years without a single update and it would still feel fresh, because in 7 years of playing I can count on 2 hands the number of times I repeated a quest (BABAGE!!). Besides that it had utterly unique mechanics that no other game has ever duplicated. Sure other games have pets, but nobody else gave you a hoard of minions that you could individually control. The sidekick system meant that there was always a team to join, because people didn't care what level you were. And it was the only game of it's day where you could not just make niche roles work, but thrive. Go try to queue for a raid in WOW as a shockadin and people will laugh at you. In COH you could take down AVs without a single tank or healer to be seen. Other games like champions have the same world development, and customization, but they all fall short, because it was the one of a kind game mechanics that made the game really shine, and shaped the community into a more friendly fun-loving group than any other fan base. 5 years later I am still searching for a game that can reproduce even one of these qualities. I don't think i will ever love a game the way I did City of Heroes.

[@Christopher_Gibbons]

P.S. COH died the same year as my father, and honestly, loosing the game hurt more.

[@niallreid7664]

Christopher Gibbons I laughed and then felt really bad...

[@someone-ji2zb]

Paragon studios made two mistakes: The first was to not have a good end game goal for people who prefer enhancing a main character in the form of power progression of some kind (enhancements were laughable). The second was expecting people to pay 15 bucks a month to partake in costume contests every day and make countless alts. The studio themselves admitted the game was barely hanging on in regards to profit. They were even scrambling to release content in the near future in hopes to rekindle the game for as many people as possible... but they acted too late. NCSoft is a corrupt company, but cryptic and then paragon studios screwed up by taking the easy way out by focusing on pure cosmetic aspects rather than gameplay ones.

[@matthewhudson7883]

I would pay fifty bucks a month to partake in costume contests and make countless alts if NCsoft put CoH back online and allowed people to play it again. I paid a sub when I could have played for free because the experience was that good. - Damn I miss that game. : (

[@Reiknar]

Damn straight.

[@-The-Stranger-]

Recent information posted on reddit, about how Paragon Studio was practically begging NCSoft to let them make a sequel tends to corroborate the information here quite a bit. According to a developer, NCSoft was wanting them to make the sequel with a more Korean audience in mind, with a big emphasis on PvP and player griefing. When the devs at Paragon tried to explain to NCSoft that this kind of systems wouldn't "fly" in America, they were met with negativity and genuine confusion (from the sounds of it). It would seem NCSoft wanted a game that would appeal to their Korean market first, and then if they made some cash off of America, great...if not, then no big loss to them. When Paragon Studios seemed rebellious to the idea, they canned the studio, and their game. Which as stated in this video, wasn't a big money maker for them in the first place, and they had several new games coming out that were anticipated to be. I hate for anyone to lose their job, and WildStar was certainly a good game at it's core and was an easily fixable problem, but some might say it's lack of success and closure could be considered karma...

[@klinewolf4254]

wow, I had no idea. Talk about crazy levels of.. I don't know what it is. Xenophobia? Nation-centered ness? Something, anyone, from NCSoft. Was that info posted by Back Alley Brawler? I remember he used to post to Reddit often back when.

[@-The-Stranger-]

+Kline Wolf I'm not sure which one it was. Do you remember his account name on reddit. Btw It's still on the CoH reddit, fairly easy to find if you wanna go take a look and get back to me.

[@bigbay1159]

@@klinewolf4254 Talk about delusional...A company based in Korea, making a vast majority of its income from that company (which keeps it afloat) is obviously going to want the game to cater to its audience. It's okay when American games do it but lord forbid another one tries to ensure it's core fanbase gets included in a game they are pushing out...fuck, the video explained this in great detail

[@sambonz]

Great video, @nerdSlayer. So many memories. And wow it's great to see footage from @Altaranalt ! Alt was a special guest on many of my Let's Plays for Guild Wars. /wave!

[@BIasterXD]

If they brought it back today with the same graphics, I would still log in and make a Rad/ill Blaster or ill/rad controller.

[@MikeTheGamer77]

Sonics for me.

[@dreammirrorbrony1240]

Tasty144 scrapper/regen/duel katanas here. :)

[@IzzyLovesRock]

Tasty144 Ice/Energy Tank or Illusion/Storm Controller. Really fun builds.

[@irllcd13]

I loved my dark/dark corruptor and a rad/rad corrupter The Duke of Nukem. I had a energy rifle/energy blaster. And... a lot of other alts. Crab Spider was actually really fun.

[@IzzyLovesRock]

irllcd13 I once ran a Rad/Dual Pistol too once. She was loads of fun. Not sure why I deleted her. Also, Spiders were great but I tended to favor Widows.

[@applepie231]

I played this MMO from day 1 release until the day the servers shut down. Even though I probably put far more time into WoW than City of Heroes, this remains, to this day my favorite MMO of all time. I remember getting my first character to max level by paying for boosts from the money I made at the community held costume contests in Atlas Park! Made some great friends and was simply a joy to play. Except getting lost in the forests of Perez Park. Fuck that place. Felt like 8 square miles of a labyrinth!

[@Gravitythief]

Yeah, but I'd gladly get lost in Perez Park now - just to be back there.

[@irllcd13]

I still go to the wiki to play the short music pieces from time to time just for nostalgiagasm. Copper District :(

[@rafaelvargas3259]

Extremely well done! You're correct it does bring back nostalgic feelings and sentiment. And you hit the nail on the head and so many points. Thanks for posting.

[@chenlee9835]

I loved City of Heroes. I had maxed out the rewards that they had at the time. My main toon was Stoned Dwarf (Tanker - Magic - Stone Armor/Stone Melee).

[@alden2085]

I just stumbled on this video randomly, and it was like finding a photo album full of pictures of a family member who passed away. Before I go sit down and have myself a nostalgic grief cry, I just wanted to say this video is really well done, and thank you for giving me something concise I can show people when they ask why I loved this game so much.

[@krank23]

This is why I don't play NCsoft games anymore. They killed my favorite MMO despite it being profitable. Despite having people willing to buy the IP and the servers to continue its legacy. Champions may have similar mechanics, but I really don't care for the more cartoony design and I also feel like the story arcs are less interesting and not as well-written. The feeling I get is of comic book stories written by someone who simply doesn't take superheroes seriously. Yes, Foxbat arc, I'm looking at you. CoH had a much more interesting, deeper mythos and while it was colorful it never lacked darkness.

[@askashik]

Rikti Ship Raids, Sewer Runs to quickly level up, Having fun with Katie Hannon, and all the friends I have met. Damn I miss this game so much. It's still my all time favorite MMO. BTW: Pinnacle Server checking in and I was known has Bucephalus.

[@smacker261]

City of Heroes had a special place in my heart. My Grandma got me into it, she let me create a character on Pinnacle on her account (I was like 10 at the time) Before that, I remember watching her play her Defender over her shoulder, it looked amazing so, when I finally got the chance to start my own hero on her account, I was ecstatic! My uncle (hlwho got her into the game) would run around on his Electric/Invuln Brute, Lord Bly. Watching him run into groups of baddies and make them ragdoll across the room, he made it look awesome. Unfortunately, my grandma passed 1 year before the game shut down. But! Now that the game is back in some form, I'm experiencing all of my old memories and learning how to play again. The incarnate system confused me when I was younger but now it feels like it's much easier to understand.

[@DeathSentryCoH]

My first MMO..so immersive..still remember my first day...miss this game

[@Necrikus]

Wow, I did not think I'd be going on a nostalgia trip today. City of Villains was my second MMO and it was quite amazing how much I loved to play it even when the computer I had when I first got it was too weak to actually play the game past around level 10 without becoming a laggy mess. I don't think I ever had as much fun building characters for a video game quite as much as I did for CoH/V. It's such a shame that it was shut down the way it did.

[@jeremymount795]

I loved this game so much. If I had a time machine, I would go back just to play it again in it's glory days.

[@jeremymount795]

My main was an Ice/Storm controller with the teleport travel power. It gave me such a rush to be able to lock down and slow the attacks of massive groups of mobs, virtually incapacitating them so the damage dealers could mop them up. No other MMO offers that kind of experience.

[@Irraptured]

I would give anything to try this game and Star Wars Galaxies back when they came out. I never got a chance to play either and this makes me super sad. And there is no big Superhero mmo coming out soon, just two indie ones. Awesome comments.

[@redknight808]

City of Heroes: Rebirth of a Game This video seriously needs to be revised. I've been playing on Homecoming for years with NSoft's quiet permission. These days, with the legal shift to an official server, the Homecoming Excelsior server is red every day and it's other shards are yellow. Supes have returned in force! Loving this revival.

[@Malidictus]

Having seen the video, there's a fundamental underlying issue NC always had with City of Heroes - it wasn't Lineage. They had constant clashes with Cryptic and Paragon Studios developers, insisting on introducing more elements from their Korean-centric MMO design philosophy. The introduction of the Incarnate system (which you glossed over entirely) brought with it a costume set called Ascension. These costume pieces were very heavily tied into the new "end game raid" currency as a direct mandate from NC, despite poor Matt Miller having to defend the decision as though he agreed with it. It's been my impression that NC saw City of Heroes as "too fair" and kept trying to inject elitism and strife into it. As far back as 2004 with Issue 2, the game introduced capes and costume auras, but tied them into level-based unlocks. Later they kept introducing costume sets tied to either badges (achievements) or special currencies. NC were trying really hard to create a "class divide," giving nice shiny cosmetics to some people with the idea of making others jealous and motivating player retention that way. In my personal opinion, NC simply didn't like the way City of Heroes was being developed. The whole design philosophy behind it was entirely too alien to their own view of MMO design. The low-ish revenue numbers simply reinforced that idea in the minds of the bean-counters in Korea. If you look at NC's library, the majority of its MMOs still alive today have fairly similar monetisation and player retention models. The majority of their dead MMOs, on the other hand, are wildly different from that norm. City of Heroes survived longer than things like Auto Assault or Tabula Rasa (the latter of which ended in a fraud lawsuit), but I don't think NC really ever agreed with it to any great extent. They did give the game a number of chances - Launch, City of Villain, NC NorCal, City of Heroes: Freedom - but seemed to pull back support very quickly afterwards. It's easy to vilify NC over City of Heroes and to a large extent I feel there's truth to that. We obviously don't know for a fact given how little they ever said on the matter. From the perspective of someone who played City of Heroes for the full eight years, though, I got the feeling of constant meddling from NC and possibly a number of inter-personal issues mixed into the matter.

[@onigames7309]

City of Heroes would be super successful(Heh) today due to the popularity in Superheroes.

[@crimsonstar108]

Christian Arroyo I'm honestly shocked that no other Superhero MMO has arisen to try to capitalize on that fact. DCUO is a very short "Theme Park," MMO (although CoH was also guilty of this). Champions by all accounts is a watered down CoH. Marvel's rumored MMO never happened for some reason even while their movies are international box office hits. if Valiant of City of Titans ever open they will get all of CoH's old player base with twice as much loyalty because players will know how much is on the line and feel good about spending their cash to actually keep the game alive. Most embarrassing of all will be that their founding principle will be, "Screw NCSoft."

[@UncommonSituations]

crimsonstar108 dcuo is so shitty

[@Sekijuann]

crimsonstar108 Not to mention, DCUO's community is 95% cancer. Everyone out for self, no one wants to really help, scammers everywhere, you have to be in a league/guild to get any real kind of help for progression Skill point progression is far more tedious than it should be Some feats are damn near impossible without proper communication and a knowledgeable team Casuals everywhere It's just a bad time

[@Sekijuann]

crimsonstar108 over the course of 4 years on and off, I dumped at least $500-600 into that shit excuse of an MMO that I'll never get back. They released new content and a new power, but even that wasn't enough to bring me back The company running the game doesn't listen to its player base, the powers are unbalanced, even if you have the best gear and 300 skill points, you're still looked at as a scrub because you use a "weaker" power DCUO is cancer all the way around

[@bosola6]

I enjoyed your video very much. I'm not an avid gamer, but I was addicted to COH. After the recent news of the secret COH server I've been bopping around the net for videos to be nostalgic about. Thanks.

[@jeffrapier947]

I miss this game so much. Still have the comics you got for being a subscriber way back in the day.

[@Dorelaxen]

The very last MMO I ever played. Still remember having my entire group farming Shivan shards so we could easily take down Dr. Vahzilok.

[@irllcd13]

We did the same thing for the villain respec trial. Those vines were real bastards. Still though, dropping 8 shivans at once was a sight to behold. A repeatable 5 use summonable elite boss was OP, I loved it but it really should have been nerfed. At least make it a standard boss.

[@Zylo82]

I was a 7year vet. grand total of 1337bagdes and I freaken miss this MMO. I mostly made just Brutes and they were all named Zylo in diffrent ways. its sad to see that CoH/V is gone while WoW is still up and running.

[@deviousdifference2314]

1v1 ne 1?

[@lebouffi38]

City of Heroes : Homecoming is up and running as of 11th of June 2021 !!!

[@BigFrakkinOgre]

I miss Durflopo. He deserved to have a chance to stop his world from being "sunsetted"

[@danpettersson4671]

It had some other things that even now isn't all that common. It provided a good interface for playing with friends, such that people got their level either adjusted up or down to the team leader's level, and it worked a level 50 and a level 1 could play together and both could do things. The team size was eight, not four or five which make quite a bit of difference if you have a weekly thing in your guild. The badge system, that allowed us to feel like we achieve things. *sigh* Oh how I miss you.

[@TarotMage]

I have not, nor will I ever purchase another NCSoft game since they pulled the plug on City of Heroes. I even tweet @NCSOFT_Games from time to time and tell them so. I hope "City of Titans" makes good on its promise to capture the spirit of CoH.

[@MissingWorldsMedia]

We will labor until it is done, because heroes never give up.

[@SlocumJoe7740]

Even if it is successful and I hope they are, it will never be city of heroes....that is the sad part.

[@tonyknighton4019]

Wow. Thanks for the vote of Confidence

[@someone-ji2zb]

Well, NCSoft is smarter than you'd like them to be. Every game they publish is essentially free to play.. which sucks people in and entices enough people to buy the store crap. No matter how badly you want them to fail, or how many products you pass up on, their business style is working.

[@BrawndoQC]

Just discovered your channel. Excellent video and on point. I was drunk when I watched this last night and almost cried. Damn I miss this game so much.

[@plixie1]

My first mmo. Hours and hours. Glad i can still play when nostalgia hits.

[@sergiomorales8810]

After all these years without CoH/CoV i still sit down in front my PC and watch gameplay videos over and over just to listen RV music or Atlas Park starting music. I miss my toons so bad, my SG friends, our TF runs together, Hami Raids, etc. Even i went to WoW after CoX shut down never felt the same way to a game like i did with CoX. NCSoft gutted some part of our spirit when they closed out this game... something that for me and many is still unforgettable. Never ever i will play any NCSoft game andi hope many others do the same.

[@rosskwolfe]

Man... this was the only MMO I ever enjoyed playing. To this day I still consider the CoH/CoV community to be one of the best in all of gaming.

[@FarelForever]

Just came from the Champions Online video. Your production quality has improved by a ton, heh

[@tinnitusthenight5545]

This was the video that brought me to this channel as a massive CoH fan! Now that its back maybe you could do a Rebirth of a Game!? I don't know if it really fits the model of the show but it would be amazing to explore how the fans could do what the developer couldn't. Another game I love Paragon is also about to come back thanks to the fan community so maybe their could be a future to this idea, just a suggestion though. Thanks for all your great work!

[@syco579]

Got into this game right before it shut down, was pretty bummed out when that happened.

[@chubbubdreamer6904]

syco579 Yeah, so did I. But then I realized it's NCsoft. Can't expect a non American country to care as much here as much as their own region.

[@thanksfernuthin]

That must SUCK!!! So many characters to create. So many powers to try out. I played from beginning to end and I never got tired of leveling different characters up and playing all that content.

[@Goujiin]

I was looking forward to making Plant Danger Ranger again with the new Natural healing class. It essentially had very little damage, but the close-knit healing capabilities were better than the Empathy class. I still loved my Nebula Danger Ranger and my Longbow26 Rad/Rad character who was capable of running alongside the group's Tanker. My first powerful Healer perfected. Never got to do it again.

[@kazbeast1608]

Ah Christ. Thank you for making this video. It shed some light on questions I've had for years. But... I knew this was going to hurt to watch, the moment I saw the link in the COH Survivors group on FB. And I was right, Lord was I right. Years later, and I still miss this game like a piece of myself was taken. Great times, great memories, great friends made. #Virtureverseforever

[@SquadraCorse]

Crazy that the Homecoming private/free server group just got an official license for CoH/CoV from NCSoft. Last night there were 2100 concurrent players on the Excelsior server. You should make another video telling the story of how the game came back.

[@geordiejones5618]

Watching this makes me want to see a future Venture Bros MMO that's inspired by this game. Combining that whacky but brutal universe with CoH game design might just make for one of the greatest games ever. I think it would be an immediate blockbuster.

[@Dharien]

It's interesting to see a neutral breakdown of the whole game and the eventual shutdown, especially with the NCSoft's situation taken into account. For me Coh/v was one of a kind, a lot of the things just clicked and made the game enjoyable. The game was one of those games that I could always login and find something to do when I couldn't think of anything else to play. I mostly played villains, but some of my definitive highlights were: -The sidekick system so that I could play with my low level friends -The combat system. While the tab-targetting was pretty archaic there was something satisfying about the combat and how you activate your each individual attack and power. To me it felt like I had more control over my character and that combined with the sound design and the physics engine (ragdoll and object physics) made the combat really fun for me. Not to mention you were usually outnumbered and put against numerous enemies at the same time which at times really made me feel like superhero/villain. It was just so satisfying to barge into a mob of enemies and annihilate them all within seconds. -The customization of characters, weapons, powers, missions and mission NPCs. -Making friends and speeding through some of the bigger tasks and always shooting for a better time. Not to mention you could complete a lot of the content with a smaller team, so 8 man team was not required for everything. I was not fan of some of the "Free2Play"-stuff and how the game moved towards more "raid"-like content where team sizes rose from 8 to 40. That and some of the graphical issues with newer maps and content. That said, I seriously doubt there ever will be a game that can replicate the magic of CoV or CoH.

[@TurjanStarstone]

A most interesting (and affectionate) video! I would take issue with one point though, and also note an omission. First, the omission :- at the time of CoH's closure, NCSoft was in merger talks with rival games giant Nexon. Nexon's plan was to try a hostile takeover, but that attempt ultimately failed (they admitted as much in 2015 and sold their shares in NCSoft). The fact that CoH was closed during the initial Nexon/NCSoft talks is clearly not a coincidence. NCSoft were (in their own words) "realigning their company focus", which basically meant withdrawing from foreign endeavours to focus on (as is obvious to us now at this point in history) what they knew would be a survival battle at home against Nexon further down the road. Which brings me to my second issue : I simply can't agree with your use of the word 'fail'. CoH did NOT fail, it was SHUTDOWN - there's a big difference. When a game is in decline and is losing both players and money, then yes, the word 'fail' would be apt. But CoH was still successful at the time of its closure. If anything, it was still gaining players rather than losing them. The fact that it was shutdown does not mean the game itself failed...just that it was NCSoft who actually failed the game.

[@tarrker]

Could not agree more. I wanted to play for so long and when I finally got a computer that could run City of Heroes, I found the game had be closed. Much anger ensued.

[@KryptonianAI]

Another point the commentator misrepresented was at 32:20 when he said NCSoft only saw the game lasting 8 years in the first place. If that were true, why were the developers working on the upcoming issues when sunset was announced? Issues that would be rolled out over the next 2 years? It really feels like this guy chose a topic he didn’t expect to have questioned by passionate players. He should have interviewed developers and players. Matt Miller is a good example of a developer that worked on the game and is still around and accessible through his journalism in game magazines. If I didn’t know better, this video sounds like a school assignment that was chosen for its limited falsifiability. 😱

[@MrGilfred]

Since this is no doubt true then why didn't ncsoft decide to revive CoH after the Nexon attempted takeover ended. After it was a great game that even had a new content patch that was being worked on before the closure was announced.

[@HBHaga]

Because by that time they had dismantled everything, Paragon Studios was no more so it would be like starting over, and to simply restart a game they had shut down for no well articulated reason would make them look bad. They've used some of the IP in other games, pulling in Statesman and Ghost Widow in one of them as I recall, but that's all they've done since.

[@jetex1911]

Plus as soon as it died they started using the servers that used to host CoH for Guild Wars 2 instead, so whatever was there that could have been used is long gone now.

[@protohope]

Thank you so much for the deep-dive. My partner played CoH religiously back when it was popular, but I never did. The stories she's told me of the games' heyday have been impressive to say the least, but like I said, I never had the experience. It was really incredible to absorb a documentary-style retelling of the game's history that simultaneously explained why the community of CoH was so awesome. Keep up the good work!

[@phillipschmidt6295]

I loved this game so much. I played from the very beginning to the awful end. And I still really miss it. Thank you very much for making this. By the way. I am still friends with members of my super group. We even all met up for gen con one year. The game helped me create friendships I still have and love. And those that I remember and wish I still knew.