Here Is Why The Horten 229 Is Garbage In Air RB

[@TheAmazingCowpig]

Yeah, but still, nothing beats the experience of me having one of my first matches in the P-51H a few years ago, when I flew past a Ho 229 going the opposite direction, not really thinking much about it except for "it's a jet, I can get away before he turns around", immediately looked behind me to see where the 229 went, and he was already turned around and shot me down. Absolutely shocked, it's stuck with me to this day.

[@skittlesbutwithchocolatein2274]

thats funny

[@braedynhoward3644]

I had a similar experience when I got my first jet. lol

[@eklhaft4531]

If you have some GE you can buy P-59 A and really shit on those props at 5.3 or even 4.3.

[@sgthop]

@@eklhaft4531 P-59 isn't a GE premium, it's an event vehicle. And a very expensive one, at about $175.

[@eklhaft4531]

@@sgthop ah my bad

[@Sliphantom]

Hmm, this seems familiar... Some commenter on my Horten video straight up tried to tell me its a good energy fighter. It took me every ounce of my self-control to not tell them they're insane.

[@MausOfTheHouse]

100K subscribers and not a CC?

[@darktemplardelta268]

Whoa didn't expect to see you here slip

[@WigglyWings]

It used to be an insane energy fighter, & now it's crap.

[@acnHaze]

Yes, yes...very familiar.

[@mchalllldfjlfkj]

I saw your stream the other day getting pissed about the horten and resorting to playing the wellington which didn't end too well :') I think you'll enjoy the Kikka a lot even after it got moved up to 7.3. Now that plane is an actual energy monster at that BR. :D

[@picklejarofdeath]

As someone with 1332 matches and 1504 kills in the Ho 229 with 1331 of those matches and 1502 of those kills pre patch 1.91, I can say with utmost certainty that when 1.91 dropped, the Ho 229 became the most painful aircraft in the game both to fly and to think about. They nerfed the already barely usable roll rate, and the maneuvering and vertical energy retention that patch. However, this change was never announced in the patch notes. Towards the end of my time with that aircraft I started getting regular aces and 6-7 kill matches with a notable handful of 8 kill matches in air RB. I really loved that plane. It was the reason I started playing War Thunder in the first place. The last match I played in that thing was day 1 of patch 1.91, being September 11, 2019, on the Normandy air map starting from the west spawn. I got my last 2 kills in it being an F8F-1B and an F-89, and decided I was done with the Ho 229. That was when I decided to start investing more time into more worthwhile aircraft like the He 162 and Ki-83. Two and a half years later, I am still waiting for them to make the Ho 229 fully usable again. If they can make negative changes to the Ho 229 without substantiating their decisions and citing sources, they can make positive changes without substantiating their decisions and citing sources. One can hope.

[@bananomet4052]

The most sad thing about it is that He162 used to be garbage and Ho229 was extremely good. The roles now are reversed and I find myself enjoying the He162 as much as I did the Ho229 back in the day.

[@reinbeers5322]

People enjoy the 162? I hated that thing when I unlocked it. Constant spam of F2Gs that can keep up with you a lot of the time ruins it.

[@picklejarofdeath]

@@reinbeers5322 with the br of 6.0 you can face some really easy targets now and it's basically a turkey shoot at this point. The F2G is annoying but was never something that I felt like I couldn't handle. I can offer a few quick tips though. Go to interface options and turn on IAS+TAS if you haven't already. The He 162's optimal climb speed is 500 km/h IAS unlike most jets which should be whatever number by TAS. Turn off hold throttle for WEP in your controls (might be in options don't remember). That allows you to set throttle to values between 100% and 108%. Typically you want to set throttle to 104% but 105% is good for cold maps and 102-103% is good for hotter maps. If you can side climb, you can use your dive speed (rips at 1040 km/h) and high speed handling to your advantage. If you ever feel like picking up the 162 again feel free to check out my guide. It's a bit old but it has some decent info still. kzbin.info/www/bejne/aGWXh4N_rcajmMU

[@MZIH]

The thing that stuck out in ur whole comment was the date September 11 😂

[@DerArbeitsloseHaiderXII]

1332 matches with 1500ish kills yet regular aces +6-7 ans handfull 8 kill matches? Idk doesnt rly match imo; or were you the worst best ho player that is a total hit or miss?

[@bezimienny_andzej6425]

Well, the best thing is when you actually manage to hit and all you land is "incendiary", which basically is armor piercing, because at longer ranges it does absolutely no damage and doesn't explode like a shell filled to the brim with incendiary-explosive (yes, Barium Nitrate 50/50 with Al-Mg does explode with quite some power when you set it off in an enclosed container).

[@HRCSJSUAMMAS]

That’s basically flash powder and enclosed yes, it’s not friendly stuff.

[@sule.A]

Only Russian IT works

[@bezimienny_andzej6425]

@@sule.A Isn't russian IT actually FIT, which means it's just super good HE (6g of TNT rips wings off, LOL) under a weird name?

[@_Despair]

Ground RB ruined this plane, It was too damn good at killing from top down and pulling out. Back then it had a full belt of HVAP ammo, and the guns had no spread to them. I think over the course of a year in 2016/17, every update made the plane worse and worse, from 1/2 hvap and added spread to like 1/4 hvap belts and shotgun spread

[@mrcroob8563]

@@DàDūdūxD I mean what other metric would you use?

[@Eclipse-lw4vf]

yeah like what lmao, tf else u suppose to go by?@@mrcroob8563

[@dominuslogik484]

"ground RB ruined this plane" no this plane ruined ground RB and got punished for it. I feel like ground RB should use a different BR for the planes than they use for Air RB.

[@RageAgainstTheDyingOfTheLight7]

​@@dominuslogik484yeah but gaijin will never do so

[@dominuslogik484]

@GreasePotato the nuke bombers aren't actually that much of a problem but you also can play aircraft in ground RB so that AAA vehicles have a purpose outside of trying to side shot tanks. if you are even remotely good at aiming a 37mm or 40mm auto cannon you can snipe heavy bombers from insane distances long before they get to drop a bomb.

[@TransportSupremo]

He ammo just doesn't do enough damage to planes. It makes no sense that armour piercing ammo in a lot of cases is better than belts which are specifically designed to fight planes

[@skittlesbutwithchocolatein2274]

its like anyother thing in this game if enough players cry about something it gets nerfed

[@MarshalBeard]

I personally use the stealth belts with the 229, the API rounds absolutely shred pilots and engines, and for some reason will snap a wing off in a single hit like the HE shell should. Even the HVAP belt does better, but the incindiary round in the belt is useless so i prefer the stealth.

[@calvinhell4006]

the problem with the ho you always have to contend with/ compensate for is that it cannot retain any energy when you put it into a normal bank and turn maneuver. Having played this plane for a quite a while and gotten ace qualification for free with it, this flaw will kill you 90% of the time(the other 10% being having no roll rate). I feel like the best way to use this plane is actually to almost never turn in it, despite how good of a turn it has on paper. B&Z all day and when the shit hits the fan hit the panic button and out-turn everything. None of this will help with the guns being ass though :P

[@jakeb6703]

tap down elevator when its not critical to turn at full rate, i do this with every plane but stuff that bleeds energy like this thing its essential

[@berg699]

Don't max out the elevators and it's fine.

[@calvinhell4006]

@@jakeb6703 yep, you got it :)

[@acnHaze]

People know this thing dumps all it's speed the second you commit to full turns, yet still do. Lots of impatience, going from 800kph to 400kph to try to get a kill in the first loop instead of waiting a bit. The 229 reminds me of the 162. It isn't intuitive to fly, and if you do fly it intuitively then you'll end up having a hard time.

[@bezimienny_andzej6425]

@@acnHaze He-162 will always give you a hard time if the enemy is competent and responds to running with climbing and dodges properly.

[@EdibleRockingChair]

This is one of the coolest looking planes I've ever seen

[@homiewitagun]

The 229 is a beast in sim. It flies perfectly normal when the instructor is out of the equation. Same thing with the P-51s.

[@martijn9568]

Then it is probably modelled wrong

[@mikhb3d30]

Ill guess that it is because "instructor" uses for too much the rudder wich is simply an airbrake on 229

[@bjboss1119]

@@mikhb3d30 Yeah it's why I recommend binging pitch to WS as the instructor continually tries to use rudder istead of roll in situations where you don't have the time to correct it.

[@DanksDynasty]

It’s not a sim issue it’s a easy mode controls issue lol ppl don’t get that instructor controls is different than the true capabilities

[@alderontyran]

My experience with this plane got infintely better when I just stuck to turning off Instructor. Normally I fly with a joystick and pedals, and with this plane I just ignore the pedals and usually don't run into energy issues. I think @mikhb3d30 is right in pointing out that the "rudders" are just airbreaks...

[@Sigil_Firebrand]

My favourite maneuver kill in WT was I had about 6 people chasing my 229 in an air AB match, I flew straight towards a mountain, waited to the last second, pulled a 32G turn, two people saw it coming and turned away, and the other 4 flew face first into the mountain. One of the funniest things I have ever seen.

[@amm0gamm0]

I NEED to see this play, absolutely legendary bait

[@CoolLink-Zelda]

That is just godly style

[@felipedimas3551]

I was a Ho229 main at 7.0 when i still played Air RB and i must agree with everything said in this video, yes it can out turn almost everything at its BR, it can out accelerate quite some planes when zooming out, its cannon do quite a punch when it hit something, the thing is, for everything said before and more, you have to think 2, sometimes 3 steps ahead of your enemy when, with other plane, you would just react to him, just because you dont have a rudder, i can somewhat ignore the low rate of fire of this thing because when it hits something right it is reduced to ashes, but the lack of rudder is really a pain. Nowadays i just use it to have some fun because it is unique, it is my Maus at air combat, except it is not outside of the main tree yet.

[@bananomet4052]

I loved it in AIR AB too, it used to pull 29G (2016-2018) and I was just laughing the whole time flying it.

[@felipedimas3551]

@@bananomet4052 That was quite hilarious indeed, i remember turn fighting two Meteors because they thought they were the kings at turning as a jet, one was shot down by an allied player, the other went to oblivion when my Mk103 hit his wing. But there was a time Gaijin nerfed its G pull to hell, above 7-8G your wings was just snapped out of the air frame, then they buffed it again to 12G

[@merf5549]

its still a blast in sim tho - you can easily fuck most people up with it

[@Flayrr872]

I initially had big problems with the roll-rate of the Typhoon Mk1b/L, and it took a fair while before my noob self understood a workaround. But GOOOOOLLLLLY am I never gonna play the Ho 229 with THAT roll-rate

[@suilui17]

If you want to get your guns on target with the Horton after your first turn you have to absolutely predict your enemy and roll there before he gets there, it's incredibly hard and requires a lot of practice and a bit of luck but it's doable because most of players do the same maneuvers over and over again . And the low rate of fire an inaccuracie is something you can get used to but till then it's absolutely painful.

[@Pouzdraken]

I remember seeing videos back in like 2014-2016 about just how insane this thing was. About half ago I decided to play Germany again and get the Ho229 expecting that insanity still, especially being that i was still fresh from a long break from the game. I just thought i was bad at flying this thing lmao also i think they recently nerfed the pen on its cannons so that thew me off for when i use it as cas

[@bananomet4052]

In 2016 I used to 1v5 in it with one hand on my mouse and the other in my pants all day long. The Ho229 used to be pretty OP apart from ripping wings above 550kmh in full aileron deflection. Now it's the complete opposite. I hope Gaijin would revert all the nerfs and just hide it for new players like the Maus.

[@pedrotrivelatoferreira2776]

I would like to mention that, according to the protection analysis, half of your shots (tracerless HE iirc) have a muzzle velocity on the 500s m/s I thought this could be just a wrong number but I did some long range shooting in the test flight and I think it is actually correct And thats on top of it having the spread of a shotgun and being impossible to aim due to the lack of a rudder

[@samuellatta6774]

Nope, the MK103 does go about 900 m/s both for AP and HE, the MK108 os the one with the 540m/s

[@basicarl5645]

oh god and i thought the russian 37 mils had shit velocity (690 m/s)

[@bakercat9897]

​@@samuellatta6774 It should be that way, but gaijin messed up and 30mm HEI of mk103 has the same velocity of mk108's (525m/s)

[@cqpp]

@@basicarl5645 indeed, and it gets even better when you find out the accuracy of the HO-229 puts me on suicide watch. I might aswell use a shotgun lmao. I better stick to the mig-9l and f-89 for my sanity

[@bezimienny_andzej6425]

I have my doubts. I know it's in the weapon data file, but I don't see a big shift in pount of impact or time to target between tracer and non-tracer rounds. But I may be wrong. The bigger problem is, all HE shells disappear after travelling 1600m, so you basically can't snipe at anything running away that's further than 850m in case of jets and around 1200m in case of props - the only shell with reasonable range is incendiary, that does no damage at longer range.

[@flvffette]

the title should be "pain pantsu"

[@manofbias8113]

6:55 that maneuver was pretty cool not gonna lie how much of a difference would having even a small rudder/vertical stabilizer have on the aircraft's top speed, if they really wanted it to be as fast as possible they probably would have also given it less wing area too, i dont know much about the ho229 outside of war thunder, but i always thought that the plane would be significantly better if they put a small rudder in between the engines and then clipped the wings a bit

[@mirado8738]

The designer was a bit crazy and build this plane in his garage without official funding. The reason for the weird wheels is that they came from a crashed bomber for example. Only after the no engine test did he get the 2 engines from the state. Just when the war ended. So don't expect to much optimisation here 😅

[@bezimienny_andzej6425]

Well, they'd end up with basically twin-engine Me-163 Komet, and it may have actually worked.

[@manofbias8113]

@@bezimienny_andzej6425 a jet powered komet sounds like it would have been a good idea

[@manofbias8113]

@@mirado8738 its an impressive aircraft despite its short coming's, especially for something built in a barn lmao

[@andrewyoung4473]

It wasn’t built for speed only, a big part of it was high efficiency. Flying wings are the most efficient type of airplane because of their low drag.

[@certaindeath7776]

can totally relate to your review... spaded this thing in air rb, but it was frustrating. i really tried to like the plane, as it looks awesome, its a beautiful plane. but the rudder nerf from gaijin put this thing in trash tier for air superiority. you also cant hunt bombers, u are a massive target, which is hard to miss, and when ur wing gets damage, your flight control is basically trashed, as you suddenly have a strong rudder which always steers in one direction^^. the funny thing to know: the original had smaller airbrakes in the wings, that should work as rudder, but gaijin has not modelled them. i also can not feel the rudder, when trying, so i guess they forgot about it^^ i then tried to use it in ground rb, as the gun offer some penetration, and the thing can make circles over the battlefield. that works kind of. but as u are a massive target, and u get slow fast, when doing that. if u get an only semi decent AA driver on the enemy team, u are basically doomed... after those experiments i never took it out again, but i still think the model looks adorable, really nice design from mr. horten. and i also got a learning out from the horten, i really had to work on my alignment of my wings to the enemies flight path, which made me a less sloppy pilot in other aircrafts as well

[@airmanfpv964]

You can easily take out bombers in an ho-229 if you have patience and time, just speed up past them and go verticle, then drop down on them.

[@j.k6943]

Smaller airbrakes? Any sources?

[@Dynamite___Harry]

I actually quite enjoy the Horten 229, even back when it could face 8.3 sabres and Mig-15's. Idk why, but I did.

[@derkaiser9881]

I'd love to see this thing with the same all-HVAP belts it had when first added. It'd at least make it better for ground RB lol

[@anthonyrivera1727]

I'd be interested in you flying a P-47N.... For me its the most frustrating thunderbolt

[@athiftsabit1208]

Yeah, i don't know why but it's the worst p47 for me

[@sparkling925]

@@athiftsabit1208 because its like a ton heavier than the d28 for almost no upside

[@AverageRock1]

Don't insult my flying dorito like that.

[@WalvisYT]

I bought a talisman for the HO-229 when just before it got moved to 7.3 (I think this happened 2 years ago?). Back then I loved this, now I hate it.

[@kommandantkillcode]

If I’m not mistaken, it’s flight model got changed while it was 7.3, and now it’s back at 7.0.

[@WalvisYT]

@@kommandantkillcode That makes a lot of sense. It was so much fun before the flight model change.

[@BoopSnoot]

"Please shove it in right now." - DEFYN

[@davidmarkwort9711]

The design of this fighter was solely based upon speed, the actual design was to be used for the „America Bomber“ project which would have had 6 BMW turbo jets, and was to carry a nuclear bomb and deliver it on New York. The fighter version was to have been given different weapons and there was the night fighter version with 2 crew members, all planned but never built

[@Jamal-gy5lu]

I found your channel yesterday and wondered why there was no Horten video, now there is a Horten video. Simulation moment.

[@MZIH]

Flying wings in general have great potential but it doesn’t work out due to the details it has to work around.

[@geostorm2860]

Have you ever played the MB.5, it's decent once it has alt but it's sometimes just plain painful to play it's supposed to be a "fighter"

[@usainvanrudisha1649]

The Ho-229 used to be a hidden gem for a player that knew how to play it circa 2018/2019. I felt invincible in it, I knew I could outfly anything and I would only die if a made a mistake, and even if I did make a mistake there was a high chance I could get out of it. I could even get used to the guns, I was damn good with them even. Then it’s flight model changed, and they introduced that premium American jet with the rockets. I don’t play it anymore, it is garbage now.

[@AlexVanChezlaw]

hidden gem in 2018? It was back in 2016 man

[@usainvanrudisha1649]

@@AlexVanChezlaw well it may have been in 2016, but I didn’t play then so I’m definitely remembering 2018, as that’s when I started.

[@DEFYN]

Untill like 2019 it was really good to the point i called it broken. Then they fucked the low speed retention and added some new planes to the matchmaker and the plane turned into a pathetic husk of what it was

[@bananomet4052]

@@DEFYN It probably shat on the SU11 too much and the ruskie wallet warriors were crying about it.

[@_GODSFIGHTER]

Sad to hear how much its fallen but glad to see you made a video on this boomerang at least, more content to watch

[@nikolanojic6861]

I have maybe about 10H on Ho 229 but easily one of best statistics that i have with planes in WT , Tho it is extremly slow i would like for it to recive a slight and only a slight boost to it's engines and it's going to be perfect ! Guns are not an issue for me now u just get just to it and they absolutely decimate everything they touch and never sparks

[@Asesna]

That last fight at the end made my soul hurt

[@chrisdiehl5903]

I wouldn't mind an updated version of this to come out. Updated engines, upgraded material used, ect. Bet it would do pretty well.

[@sparkling925]

sure just go back in time and build one so they can add it

[@leeham6230]

This thing is the most badass-looking jet of all time.

[@furinick]

i sort of wish some rich guys just decide to rebuild these ww2 aircraft that the germans made late war in a manner that it would be like the projects had enough resources and time to be what they were actually supposed to be instead of some wood and whatever engine they could have grabbed

[@ollimoore]

If the aircraft was designed from the outset to be made from wood and fitted with engines which were available at the time, then building it from something other than wood and fitting it with different engines wouldn’t really be the same design anymore IMO. I certainly don’t think you could say that’s what they were “supposed to be”, the designs are a product of the time and the circumstances, if the designers had access to totally different resources they’d probably have drawn a different design altogether. Building a historically accurate best case scenario replica - for example made from wood (if the design in question was intended to be) but done well unlike what the wartime factory would likely have produced - would be super interesting to see what these things could potentially have done though.

[@darthrevan454]

@@ollimoore same design different materials

[@ollimoore]

@@darthrevan454 externally, sure. But you aren’t just going to replicate each component in a completely different material than that component was designed for, so in reality “different materials” = a structural redesign of the airframe.

[@sillylittleowlguy2392]

Don’t give the wehraboos more BS reasons to say “if Germany had (insert resource/technology), the stuff they made would have won the war!”

[@jjamo1225]

​@@sillylittleowlguy2392can't win with no fuel.

[@hughmungus2295]

The last fight I almost break my keyboard and I'm not even playing 229

[@jordithefox2786]

"oh wow! What a cool looking plane. Im going to research it right away!"-me before i flew this plane

[@ethanspaziani1070]

Thank you for making this video I agree on all points this thing needs to go down in br or have some balancing tweaks to make it playable by people who aren't reincarnations of Ace combat pilots

[@yummiestfern2316]

The first jet i wanted to unlock was the Ho-229.once i had got the jet i immediately went into a game and seen how the turn, and thr lack of being able to propely aim made it hard to use. However i kept playing the 229, ans to this day i am able to hold my own against a few top tier jets (if they dont carry missles). She is a animal when you learn how to use her for what she good for. Piece og advice go for bombers first, then dive hard.

[@fabmax41]

Yes, she is a tuff horse to ride, but once you got it, she will serve you well.

[@13deadghosts]

Personally what i hate the most about the Ho-229 is the artifically bad dispersion. Like yeah, you finally maged to get your nose on that Su-11 and then nothing happens because your rounds miss. From 200m. Like seriously guys, try to fly it with stock guns, it is a pain. But just in general, german ww2 jets are trash since you face mostly cold war jets that are 200-300km/h faster, and can have fucking Air to Air guided missiles. Now i just grinded the F-86 and club 262's. That is just alot more fun than flying 262's.

[@liewyuhao116]

Sad 262 that get club by you, it have a shit shotgun shit engine shit BR shit performance all around

[@cqpp]

Indeed, german jets like the me-262's and me-163's are worse than their contemporaries since ethyl fight much better and newer jets, ontop of being worse they also have a much higher repair cost in general like the me-163b0, me-262 c2b, me-262 jabo etc. Then you even have the German sabres which are overtiered and have a high repair cost. I find it much more fun to just stick to the Mig-9late, SU-9, Kikka and F-84's aswell as the F-89 premium.

[@Xiphactinus]

@@cqpp German Sabres aren't overtiered, it's just that 9.0-10.3 is BR compression city.

[@dixievfd55]

The technology to accomplish what the Horton brothers were going for in this jet just wasn't there yet.

[@Weezerfy]

Intro, ideal situation and then straight pain

[@ElderWillows]

"I know I say this all the time but I found my new most hated plane" Defyn. My spirit animal, speaking my truths. I also keep finding planes I fucking hate, and having to go back to my only loves.

[@vgames1543]

I remember dogfighting some Mig with it, some russian jet. We flew spirals and loopings around each other, corkscrewing upwards through the clouds. Finally I beat him, but he fell down into me. This angelic dance is something I will never forget.

[@690_5]

I'd like to see what you think of the F3D. SeekerHead straight up said it was garbo, but I value your opinion on low tier jets more than his, mostly because he claims it's ass.

[@gurde3596]

Like the part when Defyn says "guns are very inaccurate" and then guns all over the place

[@A10goBrrrrrrrrrt]

I would just keep it in my lineup just to say “hey, I have a flying wing”

[@Jaeger_89]

I can deal with the speed bleed and finnicky guns...but that roll and lack of rudder just ruins the plane x_x

[@alphagamer1802]

As I have flown this Dorito plane a lot back then, I know your pain

[@Julio_Tortillia]

The Ho-229 is actually a really good ground attack plane in groun RB. Because it has a low rate of fire and 90 mm penetration with its 30 mms, it can be used against basically any target, and you have almost endless ammo. And if a fighter spawns, theyre usually a prop so its really easy to kill them.

[@Odibio.Skins.]

Not having a rudder is the most painful thing .

[@zachnar0125]

This thing requires skill and a lot of familiarity.

[@menphisjulien7256]

its surprisingly op if you only turn as much as you need to and seperate your fight or stall after one long enough to regain energy

[@Spikeydelic]

See joe all nekst week!! :D haha brilliante videos maat.. :>

[@basicarl5645]

Haha good to hear me struggling with the su9 isn't that uncommon, thank god i have it spaded already and can enjoy the LUDICROUS SPEED of the La-200. Also La-200 video when, it's honestly very overlooked from what I've seen

[@Cramblit]

What a surprise, Gaijin shitting on anything German, giving them fake negative modifiers like dispersion, unrealistic, and unfair over tiered match making, and removal of ammunition types cuz why not...

[@TomasGaspar-b4g]

All that matters is that you have fun in it if it's fun it's a good vehicle

[@fareazy3239]

When i see horten in air rb: Hey, this is not Ground RB🤣

[@nuka.]

😹😹😹😹

[@devildawgpryde4764]

OMG, I disagree with your assessment. it just flies differently, and you don't reduce your throttle in tight turns. It would improve your turn rate by 40%, at least. Throttle down and throttle up with flaps engaged during up close dogfights.

[@emmata98]

1:55 yes, mouse control in War Thunder is extremely rudder dependant, which this plane basically lacks

[@simethigsomethingidfk]

The ho229 isnt great. But it is far more fun then the 262. You really just need to side climb and play as a support. Its guns are really really hard to aim yes but after 50 games with it I started to actually be able to aim them well and ended with a 2.5 k/d in it by the time I got the Gr 91

[@stash_of_g]

Wow it's so rare that I see Defyn complaint so much, a shame really how the plane performs, I'm still a low tier pilot and was hoping to grind the german TT but now I fell a bit bummed. Nevertheless still great content man, i love it. Edit: My horrendous typos.

[@SwissCowboy87]

you have basically to skip anything from 5.7 to 8.7 if you want to save your sanity

[@from_space]

@@SwissCowboy87 It was quite a time ago that I played it, but the second Arado used to be an insanely good BnZ aircraft.

[@MeA-aSchwalbe]

@@from_space 234 C-3 is still the only good early German jet, it locks up at ~800kph though.

[@zktwo]

Would love to see a Ki-83 video. I'm about to finish the grind on it and your take on the plane would be awesome :)

[@eklhaft4531]

I used to fly the Ho229 before the F89 D was introduced. It was good then. But one day I came and the sky was black because there were 8x F89 D constantly spamming their proxy rockets everywhere. Then the spam died off but some other cold war jets were downtiered and it just stopped being fun.

[@liewyuhao116]

Same here but it still better use ho229 to fight F89D than use 262 to fight F89D, atless ho229 can out turn the F89D

[@eklhaft4531]

@@liewyuhao116 Well I once killed it with Arado B2. The thing about F89D it that it is a bus and has low rip speed. If you somehow manage to dodge the rocket spam you can just dive down and if he follows you his wings will fall of at around 900km/h. You can sometimes BnZ them because they don't want to be to high to engage people and their engines work best on the deck.

[@maxshell9465]

I recently got a talisman for the F-80A-5 to grind out my jets and holy crap 7.0 USA teams are bad. All A2D-1's that don't know how to use it properly and B29's now that the repair cost was reduced. It's just loss after loss, so frustrating.

[@jeffyoung60]

I wouldn't go so far as to claim the historical Gotha Ho 229 was garbage. After all, it was still unproven, having crashed on its third test flight. What we do know from the first prototype's short life, was that it appeared to be underpowered. The Reimar Brothers counted upon utilizing the upcoming Heinkel 003S turbojet, which promised 3,000-lbs thrust. But the Heinkel turbojet continued to display technical development bugs and so the Reimar Brothers had to settle for the Junkers Jumo 004A turbojet, which provided only 1,980-lbs thrust. This was far less than what the Ho 229 design called for. Nonetheless, the Reimar Brothers, as it turned out were lucky to just even get their hands on a pair of the Jumo 004A turbojets. During the third test flight, as test pilot, Lieutenant Ziller brought his Ho 229 down for the landing, one of the 004A turbojets cut out. Normally this is dangerous for any twin-engine aircraft. If the aircraft has powerful engines an experienced pilot will pour on the thrust for the remaining engine and attempt the landing or go around for another landing pass. In LT Ziller's case, the wing of the Ho 229 dipped precipitously. This was a clear sign the aircraft was underpowered. The Ho 229 stalled and crashed. In the early days of turbojets, advancing the throttle had to be done slowly, to prevent burn-out. Ziller was out of options and out of luck. The entire prototype was lost along with LT Ziller. Had the Ho 229 been equipped with the two, promised Heinkel turbojet engines, providing a total 6,000-lbs thrust, the outcome might have been far different than the two Jumo 004A turbojets providing only some 4,000-lbs thrust, a huge difference. And with one 004A cut out, the Ho 229 couldn't fly on a mere 1,980-lbs thrust, which was probably lower as Ziller had to reduce thrust on both engines for the landing descent. In 20/20 hindsight, the underpowered Ho 229 prototype was a disaster waiting to happen, which it did.

[@lavamerkaENG]

The reason why I came to War Thunder is the moment when I saw horten 229

[@empiricobeats]

He says that the plane is bad and yet he makes such tremendous professional moves that anyone forgets what he says and runs out to buy it xD

[@InvalidHuman0099]

Maybe it could be said that I enjoy getting in shitty situation in warthunder but I must say the horten 229 is by far my favorite vehicle in warthunder. side note love the channel.

[@Ppeshku]

You are right on people not playing br around 7. Currently I am grinding the Ho 229 just to add it to unlocked planes. My goal is to get top tier jets. I am only playing around 5.7 to 6.0 br tops, because having stock me262 vs other jets in battles with around 6 people is not fun. Also the repairs are expensive. I much rather prefer to play around 6.0 br or ideally just use my 4.3 bf 109s to grind xp and sealclub than be stomped in high tier battle by some premium in my stock plane.

[@xxlumi5663]

Wooo thanks for doing the Horton video!

[@jacobdoolan4978]

IVE BEEN WAITING FOR THIS VIDEO. And now I’m really ducking sad

[@SliceofLife7777]

Had this plane actually entered combat, it would have been used for recon, and ground attack. That it can almost dogfight is a bonus.

[@diogofidalgo2202]

i migth be wrong but i think this was the long rangw bomber that was going to bomb NY city.

[@SliceofLife7777]

@@diogofidalgo2202 Look up the proposed ME-264, or the HE- 177. Early jet aircraft had a huge appetite for jet fuel. Germany didn't recognize the need for strategic bombers, Goring wanted numbers more than range. His strategy worked well in mainland Europe, but failed across the English Channel.

[@diogofidalgo2202]

@@SliceofLife7777 i remember seeing one plane on tv that was designed to reach NY. It looked like that one. It was designed by two brothers and it had no rudder. However the design was changed alots (by other designers) and it never went in production. 😅

[@diogofidalgo2202]

@@SliceofLife7777 kzbin.info/www/bejne/gYqVeqiCpbWohJo Im not wrong after all. This plane was designed to bomb NY city but never went into production. Thats why it sucks at turning.

[@alanm1121]

@@diogofidalgo2202 You're referring to the Horten 18 Amerika Bomber proposal.

[@Watermelon-nh4sp]

Huh, I guess I’m just insane because this has got to be one of my favourite air rb planes to play.

[@captin-crane3324]

I will say this. You’re pretty much on the money. Thing is that plane never got out of prototype stage. With Germany on the back foot and losing all of their infrastructure they couldn’t supply the necessary materials to make the plane to the specs the Horgan brothers wanted. So they used what they had. The Hortan was designed to carry a single bomb (the nuke) and have extreme distances. The tailless design reduced drag and fuel consumption, and the light weight also reduced strain on the engines to extend their life span. The engines they used were akin to the 262, with a very short life span for their engines. So they tried to remedy the problem with light weight and low drag. The plane would be laiden with its payload and take off, climbing to a stupid high altitude above the B17 bombers, were no aircraft could chase it, and using the winds from the stratosphere- glide to its target which reduced its fuel intake even further. But even then it’s a crazy stretch going from Germany to America, London, or Moscow. So the brothers built it to one job and one job only and that was to deliver something to the US but I’m sure they didn’t know about what they were talking. Just that it needed to be fast, carry X amount of weight, and have a very good chance to not get intercepted. Solution- fly higher than any fighter or flak could reach (at the time) and delivery its payload and leave. Now entirely sure if the real thing had guns or not

[@crudecloud6483]

A bunch of mistakes buddy. It was part of the 3x1000 fighter program which required a design that could carry 1000kgs of bombs a distance of 1000km at a speed of 1000km/h. It was never intended to carry nukes. It was not intended for long range bombing, especially not transatlantic raids to the USA. You may be confusing it with the Horten H18. And yes the prototypes had space for the intended armament of 30mm mk103 or mk108 cannons, but the prototype that got delievered to the USA had no weapons installed.

[@captin-crane3324]

@@crudecloud6483 I think I was. Thanks for the correction

[@andre232323]

Finally the best rolling plane! G 91-R1 the Needle Shooter is even worse. I call it the assist killing machine.

[@fewyearsbehind9333]

Switching to mouse joystick and using roll and rudder on the same X axis helps at high speed.

[@mr__coyote3061]

NAAAAH, it's not so bad. Just played my first match in 2 years with it (after watching this video) and I almost got 4 kills - sadly my team was dead, so I got swarmed from behind just before the 4-th. How it works for me : - I go for the attackers at the start (at about 500m) rather than climb, thus drawing some enemies and forcing them to turn with me on the deck level. I've dealt with up to 3 guys jumping on me - multiple times. This was my first jet and I even used to play it with the stealth belts somehow. Still love it :D I play the G.91 almost the same way, but with a shallow 8 degree climb from the start for more energy, and trying not to solo more than one enemy like in the 229.

[@epiccreeper6943]

3:30 caught me off guard😂

[@kastriot3017]

bro this is one of the best planes at this br. yes, you lose a lot of speed but you literally have bi plane turn rate and you can sometime win a 1v3 if you manoeuvre correctly

[@DEFYN]

̶"̶i̶f̶ ̶y̶o̶u̶ ̶m̶a̶n̶o̶e̶u̶v̶r̶e̶ ̶c̶o̶r̶r̶e̶c̶t̶l̶y̶"̶ ̶ If they manoeuvre incorrectly* The plane only works in a 1v1 and ARB isn't one

[@mariofan1ish]

So it isn't very fast, it doesn't climb very well, it's inaccurate, doesn't have great guns and is made of paper, but it does turn pretty good? So it's a jet version of the A6M?

[@rudyvasquez9343]

That thing looks like a flying stingray!!

[@crudecloud6483]

The ho 229s guns have been fixed now. What do you think of it now

[@samuellatta6774]

Want to fly a good horten? Fly the vampire.

[@XSpamDragonX]

This thing would be fun if the guns had functioning barrels

[@celica825]

Playing Germany at 7.0 is painful. If you get downtiered you get a team full of Ju 288s, and if you get uptiered you're facing F-89s with a team full of squadron 262s piloted by level 11s. Most of my matches in the 262 end in me attempting (and failing) to 1v6 against a bunch of Su-11s, F-84s, and F-89s

[@liewyuhao116]

Even down tier I don't think it easy to aim the MK 108 shotgun, it slow it spread and finally it shooting rate fast like hell, 340round will gone in 30sec

[@keremalikochan]

This man is terrifying. Imagine an opponent kills you like your math teacher solve problems on lesson. :DDD

[@Rototornik]

IIRC the guns and ammo were nerfed ~3 years ago due to incessant whining of RB tankers I mean let's be real, the whole game is utter garbage at this point

[@stormjet814]

What would you recommend as a grinder for early German jets? Are any of the tt options up to the mig 15 bis even worth considering?

[@WoofyMcDoodle]

nah all of them suck. You can make the ME 262 work, but rather wait till you get the Mig 15 or the G91

[@deadinside1921]

162 is good

[@uisce_]

Stick with the arados and 162

[@zUnderscore]

@@deadinside1921 @Dead__Inside

[@marcofrancioni1155]

Played with joystick it is piece of cake, you can choose the amount of energy bleeded

[@mgfails9274]

It doesn't have a rudder. That's the issue with it.

[@nuka.]

12:41 insane drift

[@ZeroKey92]

Funny, after starting out with jets in the 262 I was like "How does anybody have fun in the this pile of garbage?" Then I got the 229 and I was actually having fun. Sure, the lack of rudder is immensely annoying but the instantaneous pull and ability to pretty much flip around in place is really fun. With the 262 and the low velocity guns I have a hard time getting a gun solution because it just lacks the AOA. With the 229 AOA isn't an issue. With the 262 I feel like I'm always at a disadvantage because it just doesn't pull, the velocity of the guns is so shit that I have to lead so much that I run into AOA limit and the acceleration is pretty much not there. The 229 has far better acceleration than the 262, better climb and higher velocity guns. Over all I had way more fun in the 229 than in any 262, that includes the 262-C1 and 262-C2b, which are the same 7.0 shit brick just with more thrust at higher BR. Gah, fuck the 262 I have so much dislike for that flying boat.

[@appa609]

7.0 is German WW2 planes fighting everyone else's postwar planes.

[@siiialsd]

hi i have a question about the premium draken the 9.7 one in u vid it looked lie u had tracers in ur belts which i do not have. im having a real hard time trying to learn how to aim

[@DEFYN]

they removed the tracers last patch :(

[@siiialsd]

@@DEFYN oww ok i see thats a rip :D

[@the23rdradiotower41]

I wonder if it would’ve been better if it was fighting aircraft around when it was built?

[@Cheeseinhaler500]

babe wake up new defyn video

[@marekmazurek98]

The lack of rudder is the problem of this plane, they could have easily slapped a double rudder on both sides and this plane would have been able to contest with 50s jets no wonder America based their bomber design on this plane

[@KekusMagnus]

This plane was stupidly good in ground RB around 2017 so they nerfed the crap out of its guns for no reason and now it been a pain to play ever since

[@Bruno-cb5gk]

I really hope they fix this thing one day, but they probably won't just because of the HVAP.