Demon the Fallen Lore: The History of the Fallen

A video on the history of the Fallen, from one of the last game lines of the original World of Darkness, Demon: The Fallen.
Is it really better to reign in Hell than serve in Heaven?

[@nono9543]

This is some of the most creative takes on biblical lore that I can recall. I wish fictional lore added stuff like this to world studied it like this, it makes for a much more interesting and detailed world.

[@lazarofstygia2241]

Demon never really got a chance to grow into its potential.

[@ryanwalters7344]

Fiction has always silently instructed us. It doesn't feel the need to wave it's credentials of authority to gain attention. It is a resource for those who keep their own council. I still find myself looking for some label of authority to trust the source and sometimes have to remind myself that it's my authority to determine with now. Lol. Few feel a need or desire to argue or dispute fiction, making it a in-plain-view hiding place to preserve truths as though man and time were never exposed to it at all.

[@StevenMichaelCunningham]

1.) You have pen, paper & a single D6 dice. A story as well as a space for karma, sanity & luck as evil is unnatural hence it being impossible to be insane permanently. 2.) Though legendary there is no divine energy or arcane. This for the sake of safety & security universally. There is ritual & ceremony where magic is possible due to one's zodiac & the zodiac of those involved in the casting directly or not being known & the time & space to perform any ceremony or ritual each. The apex of the time & space of each sign of the zodiac being when divine intervention or interception as well as aid is possible. 3.) This world exists on the fringe of paradise. Amidst ruins & primordial environments. Paradise ever visible on the horizon as the closer one is to the cosmic tree the better their karma, sanity & luck surely is. 🌉

[@Hellheart]

@@StevenMichaelCunningham wow... That is some weird ass doublespeak there, guy... 😳

[@HalfTangible]

Elohim: "How could good intentions ever lead to bad outcomes?" Also the Elohim: "The good/innocent intentions of Adam and Eve will lead to destruction and horror!"

[@marialarionova8414]

Good point 💢 made there! You got it.

[@Hellheart]

I love how Caine is the sire of all the Kindred. The Book of Nod is damn good, too. Ties in well with this lore.

[@EloquentTroll]

That something was the 6th Great Maelstrom caused by Technocracy trying to nuke the Shadowlands reflection of the city of Enoch. The Technocratic Union accidentally cracked the binding of the abyss in which the Demons were held in their attempt to neutralize the most ancient vampiric entities, and they did a better at the Sabbat's self appointed duty than they do, but the cost was the 6th Great Maelstrom and the Avatar Storm that really messed up their operations.

[@marialarionova8414]

How do you know all this?

[@EloquentTroll]

@@marialarionova8414 I'm autistic and World of Darkness is one of my special interests

[@elatomala1976]

What you wrote sounds very interesting.

[@colinbradley8204]

@@marialarionova8414 It's in the Week of Nightmares material

[@EloquentTroll]

@@Hellheart that was the first part of the turbulence, along with three Kuie Jin Bodhisattvas falling, the nuke detonated in the Shadowlands kicked the situation into the sun.

[@chrisg5219]

What I would give to have an rpg based on Demon: The Fallen just like they did with Masquerade: Bloodlines

[@willbosley7413]

If I’m not mistaken there is a GameCube game..or maybe that’s Hunter the Reckoning, not sure.

[@TrinaryAdept]

@@willbosley7413 it's hunter the reckoning and it's awful

[@heathenbreathinfire]

Yeah, I was always hoping for that. Pity that horrid Activision ruined and gutted Troika (just like they did later on with Blizzard) before anything could be made of it. CCP with Eve did the same and now it would seem even Bloodlines 2 is vaporware (most likely due to the sexual harassment allegations via feminazism being used to drive out all the og devs of it during early development).

[@Hellheart]

Werewolf: The Apocalypse has a video game that came out last year. It's not terrible. It's not mind-blowing, either. But, if you're a fan, it's definitely worth playing. And, it's classic WoD. It's NOT the new Werewolf game from Chronicles of Darkness.

[@derrickhaggard]

Same.

[@benjaminfenn3700]

*Gestures dismissively at The Almighty* "And lo, gaze upon him... Emotional!"

[@Eshanas]

That was beautiful. A great recap of an intriguing game.

[@lazarofstygia2241]

Thanks.

[@jupiterrising887]

I've always enjoyed DtF's portrayal of Lucifer. He's the ultimate self-righteous demagogue. It doesn't matter how much suffering has happened since he chose to act and set all this in motion. It's not his fault. It doesn't matter Paradise is gone. He acted out of love. It doesn't matter all those who followed him fell in torment and suffer endlessly. He still knows better. Even if all of Creation unravels, he will wrap himself in the warm, comfy cloak of martyrdom and say he acted nobly and none can fault him. And yet all the while, his arrogance is what set in motion all of this darkness and suffering.

[@brentwitmer1144]

Ah! I agree my friend, however he was not with the other fallen..So I ask this question, what if he begged the almighty for forgiveness? And was granted it?

[@jupiterrising887]

@@brentwitmer1144 It's open to Storyteller interpretation exactly what happened to Lucifer. My personal view is that he was basically released from captivity by the Host and permitted to wander the earth to do whatever he was going to do, because he still had a purpose to serve, whether he liked it or not. The suspicion as to why he was simply let go has always secretly gnawed at him.

[@zacharyhawley1693]

@@jupiterrising887 Personally, I don't think WOD's Lucifer truly fell. While he screwed up, He's staunchly against the earthbound and has done his best to make it right with humanity.

[@jupiterrising887]

@@zacharyhawley1693 I'm sure that's the Luciferan party line. But is it really true? Deep in his heart? I doubt it. He knew what attempting to countermand God's word would mean, he was the only one in a position to truly know...and he did it anyway. Just because he's against the Earthbound doesn't necessarily mean Lucifer is a good guy, or has the best interest of humanity at heart. I think it's probably far more fun (and in theme with the World of Darkness) to paint the Adversary as a being who dazzles, awes and sways others...but, deep down, is infinitely prideful, selfish and spiteful.

[@zacharyhawley1693]

@@jupiterrising887 you can argue that. Just as I can argue lucifer never truly fell because humanity was his charge and unlike the rest of the fallen.luci's crime was attempting to uplift humanity before they were ready and while he did cause the problems he also did his best to fix what he broke.Time of judgement prove us both right. Yes Lucifer is prideful but he's also superbly aware of humanity's true potential and his decision to rebel was not selfishly motivated. Hence the not fallen part.

[@muadibadder3345]

man, I really love how DTF made their own version of the biblical/abrahamic myths. And how dey made lucifer a sort of anti - hero, instead of a cliched big devil villain guy. Its giving real SMT vibes 💯

[@dsrrecordsent]

What game is this? This is deep!

[@justachannel8600]

@@dsrrecordsent Demon: the Fallen as the title says. :)

[@zanchito]

I just discovered this channel, coming from Primogen and Mosh Pit, and I'm greatly enjoying these lore videos and the small thoughts at the end. Thank you!

[@lazarofstygia2241]

You're quite welcome.

[@ahmadag1820]

@@lazarofstygia2241 you should di D&D with your dry humour and southern mix it would be fun

[@lazarofstygia2241]

@@ahmadag1820 Maybe. But D&D is pretty well-covered on KZbin. I'm not sure what I can add to the mix that's different.

[@ahmad3652]

@@lazarofstygia2241 your dry humour is pretty good and solid coverage,say if utelised to cover say orcs ogres hill giants and thayans for example

[@Hellheart]

@@lazarofstygia2241 I agree. D&D is done to death. Stick with the Classic World of Darkness. You have great insight on this topic. You got a new subscriber today.

[@Markis2bi4]

Makes one wonder why The Infinite went out of their way to make Man, only to keep them in perpetual ignorance and innocence.

[@KageMinowara]

My interpretation isn't that The Almighty meant to keep Mankind in perpetual ignorance and innocence forever. That His intention was to let them develop slowly. Adam and Eve would gradually discover the knowledge of Good and Evil over a long period of time rather than all at once which would be traumatizing and destabilizing. That's why none of the angels who asked God too be able to perceive Creation as He did came back. The sudden imbibing of total knowledge of the Universe was too much and it destroyed them. God wanted Mankind to slowly acclimatize to total knowledge of the Universe so that it would not unbalance them and destroy them as it destroyed the seeking angels.

[@kierwen]

⁠​⁠​⁠@@KageMinowaragood explanation. I agree with you, this is how I see it as well. Consider it as a parent, when your children are young… you want them to embrace the childlike wonder… we don’t want them to lose their innocence too soon. In time, it will be stripped away as it is inevitable…however until then, I love their innocence and ignorance. It is pure, beautiful bliss. I imagine the divine sees it in a similar manner.

[@samuelrodriguez9801]

I would be a reconciler. "I'm sorry! Please love me dad! I've been a bad boy!"

[@marialarionova8414]

GS!

[@treacherousjslither6920]

Nah gotta go with the Faustians. Make humanity great again despite the curse of heaven.

[@samuelrodriguez9801]

@@treacherousjslither6920 I thought the Faustians just wanted to use humans as weapons?

[@treacherousjslither6920]

@@samuelrodriguez9801 Some do certainly

[@coolmanbritt]

Do you think you could go over the Nephilim in the context of demon the fallen? I always found them fascinating especially since although most of them were evil and killed, at least a few were not evil and were more or less good. At least as much as you could be with the body of a nightmare giving flesh, the powers of an angel, and the soul of a human.

[@lazarofstygia2241]

It's possible.

[@wolfsbanealphas617]

So like the titans and God’s

[@AverageAmerican]

@@wolfsbanealphas617 like aliens

[@honkeykong4049]

I've probably listened to this more times than I should have.

[@lachielvaher9168]

I really enjoyed this telling of the History of Demon the Fallen. I have never played this game. though I have often used it's predecessor ( Demon the Descent and The God machine ) as a basis for my own games ( often run using a PBTA ruleset ) Kudos on a fantastic presentation, you make me want to play DtF at some point.

[@Shamino1]

Just a point of order- Demon the Descent came out 12 years after The Fallen, so Descent cannot be its predecessor.

[@OpenBiolabsGuy]

Demon: the Descent is the successor, not the predecessor. Successor is the word you’re looking for.

[@francescofranchino7097]

Demon the Fallen was/is excellent. I purchased the core books on day one of their release, studied them for a week and then began a 6 person game that ran once a week for 178 weeks straight. The different houses were so elegantly made, as detailed and varied as the Werewolf or Vampire clans. Read the handbook for it. It reads like a story for a lot of it. The power and ability of each demon house are awesome. I loved the Scourges and the Devils.

[@Hellheart]

2 others already pointed out what I came here to say. Demon: The Descent came out over a decade after The Fallen. It's not even part of the same game line. This is Classic World of Darkness. The Descent is Chronicles of Darkness.

[@francescofranchino7097]

@@Hellheart I never played The Descent. How did it stack up to Fallen? I noticed that when White Wolf released Vampire and Werewolf they had slimmed the story and clans down a lot. More was left to the imagination, less explained.

[@Eldagusto]

A great primer for new players and a refresher for storytellers like myself who forgot which Legions where what in the war of Wrath hoho.

[@paulwaterman1322]

I greatly enjoyed your summation and analysis at the conclusion of your video, however brief. Your videos are wonderful and I'm glad I found your channel! I am only cursorily familiar with WoD games and lore but I think I've found the right place to learn.

[@lazarofstygia2241]

Thanks for that!

[@nickdeagle1155]

bloody great video im a bit new to white wolf settings but ive always know about them your videos are a major boon to a lore hound like me thank you very much.

[@lazarofstygia2241]

You're welcome.

[@gearcog22]

Dude this is amazing, thank you for putting out such a great video.

[@WildWolfGod]

I know this video is 2 years old, but I need to know what song Lazar used in the background. It's actually driving me insane that I can't listen to it on my own.

[@WhispersOfWind]

Love your channel. Interesting stuff. I was curious about Gnosticism and through games (Steam or Valve's Vampire the Masquerade but also Baldur's Gate series) and movies became curious about Vampires but did not pursue these things actively in essence though through Vampires or Vampiric lore I get to deepen myself more in both and through more detail that is exposed, where fantasy meets fiction, or Religious 'fact' (agnosticism) depending on one's outlook on life makes the whole even more enjoyable to at least in this instance to listen to. It all kind of blends well together. Again I didn't even realize this as a whole was very interesting and well worth deepening oneself into, but after being recommended through KZbin and starting to listen to these types of channels I really am glad that I did make that choice. Your personality and voice are nice or comfortable or comforting to listen to. All the best.

[@Hellheart]

This is a tabletop roleplaying game from White Wolf Publishing. Vampire: The Masquerade is also part of this game series. It's called old World of Darkness.

[@BonjourMonAmi11]

This is amazing, this is so fleshed out, I can see every bit in my mind as I’m listening. If this is how it could have went down if it did, I can see why God and the other angels basically slurred Lucifer’s name to make every hate him instead of appreciating him for loving them

[@spiceweasel8972]

Utterly fantastic. Thank you for your presentation!!

[@edwardbell5138]

Thanks so much for creating this video!

[@MrHalberdanger]

‘In Absentia Lucis, Tenebrae Vincunt’

[@lazarofstygia2241]

Et lux in tenebris lucet et tenebrae eam non conprehendrunt.

[@marialarionova8414]

Lucifer morningstar also Jesus Christ morningstar?

[@bigollameo]

Man, you did an amazing job on this narration. Thank you!

[@lazarofstygia2241]

Glad you enjoyed it!

[@OpenBiolabsGuy]

Since this venue exists in the same universe as Werewolf: the Apocalypse, Kindred of the East, Hunter: the Reckoning, and, apparently, Exalted, I’d like to know how they tie into one another. Seriously, what is the relation between the Almighty and entities such as the Wild, the Weaver, the Worm, the Ebon Dragon, and the Scarlet Empress? The creation stories involving all of these characters seem mutually exclusive. Like if one of these three creation stories happened, then it precludes the other two from happening. Yet they all exist in the same universe, so what is the connecting thread?

[@thesmilinggun-knight9646]

There no real answer to this question because it’s never been explained properly either because the writers never got round to it or they thought leaving it all Mysterious and letting the fans theorise would be better.

[@lazarofstygia2241]

They are mutually exclusive, but they creatures relaying these creation myths are not necessarily reliable narrators.

[@nigelhirth2181]

Prior to Demon, the abrahamic God was a Celestine representing the Patriarch facet of The Machine. From the top down though, none of the various factions or groups in the OWOD have the full truth of howbthings shook down. The closest are probably the Fera, since they can talk to spirits they could literally just go ask (assuming the spirits in question are reliable). The Fallen are unreliable narrators, just as much as any other group though, as they knew God, but no longer have a connection after the 6th maelstrom. You really want to muddy the water? Way back in the day, Exalted was initially intended to be a prequel to the OWOD. All the various myths of the modern supernaturals were attempts to make sense after the restructuring of the world post-wonderwork. That didnt last very long though, iirc. Exalted pretty quickly spun off into a seperate IP. But the crumbs are there.

[@colinbradley8204]

I always headcanonned it as that when the Halaku and their angelic counterparts stopped doing their jobs of recycling excess faith/quintessence/chi/whatever, all of that spiritual detritus took form and was shaped by various human wills and dreams into the umbral realms, their spirits, and the Dreaming that we know and love in the final nights.

[@Hellheart]

@@colinbradley8204 I like that. That's a good thought. If I ever run a oWoD game again, I'm gonna use that as the premise if I allow any PC-type. Instead of just running a single type. I did it once before. But, I mainly focused on the impending end-of-the-world and glossed over the past.

[@skiobaldo]

Amazing work! Thanks a lot! wow!!!

[@TheKagar]

Thank you for upload :)

[@lazarofstygia2241]

You're welcome.

[@TheGreenScout]

Man there really is no way of telling this story that doesn't make god look like a massive asshole, is there? "Oops my creations are rebelling (which I apparently made possible/viable), better do nothing then punish the ever loving shit out of literally all of creation for eternity".

[@mysmartphonechannel]

Well, some people believe the correct way to read the bible is that God just is and people damn themselves through their actions. Lucifer's rebellion didn't lead to the desired outcome. So he rebelled again. And again. It's basically the story of humanity and we will eventually end in a virtual prison run by the Robodevil. So God's punishment is basically doing nothing to stop you.

[@cb2291]

Thanks for this content🙏🏼

[@hircenedaelen]

I do wonder how Demon lore is meant to interact with werewolf lore

[@b3rz3rk3r9]

Something like Banes most likely, since Demons are inherently disruptive to Order itself; such is similar to the corrupted Wyrm.

[@hircenedaelen]

@@b3rz3rk3r9 I meant more along the lines of the obvious creationism of Demon contrasted with stuff like the mokole

[@mirromarnicco3162]

Here's the neat part: it doesn't

[@jamiekirkpatrick3634]

Only ever played the card game jyhad but liked the lore so much I bought quite a few of their rpg books

[@Hellheart]

Old World of Darkness or Chronicles of Darkness?

[@jamiekirkpatrick3634]

@@Hellheart copyright is 97 so I'm guessing Old

[@Hellheart]

@@jamiekirkpatrick3634 good. That's the superior version in my opinion.

[@everettbrooks-shroyer3963]

what is the song in the background? it sounds great

[@biaragould2075]

PLEASE i need to know what music is playing, its driving me mad.

[@getbbudded23]

It’s crazy that this is a game it’s just a biblical story that’s cool your Narration killed it dude really well done

[@Hellheart]

These games are great. The whole game line is known as the old World of Darkness. It's the "old" one, because there is a newer game line that is kinda trash. I have all the corebooks for the old line. I, also, own many of the supplements for Vampire, Werewolf, Demon, and anything that is crossover. I'd definitely recommend checking them out. Don't dive into supplements for a game until you've read it's corebooke first. Otherwise, you won't understand what you're reading. The games are: Vampire: The Masquerade (by far the most popular, and easiest to find. It has the most books. It also has 2 video games. Both are PC games, originally. The older one is trash. The newer one is really good, and it might be downloadable on console. There was also a TV show in the 90's called Kindred: The Embraced). Werewolf: The Apocalypse (my personal favorite. A video game of it came out last year. It's pretty good. The tabletop game is the most action-oriented of all the old World of Darkness games). Wraith: The Oblivion (the rarest game. They didn't print it for very long. You play a ghost. It's really deep. I dunno how old you are. But, you won't be able to play this game properly without a depth of maturity). Mage: The Ascension (hard to find. But super good. This is one of the "link" games that connect to many others) Changeling: The Dreaming (hard to find. Very interesting game. You play a human with a Faerie's soul. Hard to run. Needs a good Storyteller to run properly. Pretty rare, too). Demon: The Fallen (this was the last game printed for the old World of Darkness. This is the one that broke the links. But, it's still good. And, if you read all the corebooks, you can make them work together). Hunter: The Reckoning (the other action-packed game. Has 2 video games. Both are kinda garbage. The tabletop is fun, though. Last link game). Mummy: The Resurrection (rare book. Kinda expensive. Links to many games, and directly to Vampire). Kindred of the East (link game, specifically. You play a Kuei-Jin, an Asian undead being). These games are fantastic, and I'd highly recommend looking in to them.

[@knightowl1985]

I was wondering if you can do some videos getting into greater detail about the Houses and Factions of the Fallen. I am going to be playing the game soon and I am doing a Devil Reconciler. I always wanted to do my own version of Ghost Rider and this seems perfect for that.

[@marialarionova8414]

Gr8 💡

[@treacherousjslither6920]

That actually sounds pretty cool

[@derrickhaggard]

I actually played as a female Devil Reconciler back when I played and concerning the faction rivalry we managed to have the party be together and not kill each other using the fact Reconcilers trust Cryptics, and will work with Luciferans, and Faustians if necessary plus we had common enemies with the Earthbound, minor villainous Demons/Fallen, various other supernatural threats, and various human threats including Mages trying to force us into slavery via their spells, and extremist Demon Hunters meaning we had to stick together in order to survive. And we went with the idea that the ST in our group had that our characters where due to their Elohim/Demon nature were "technically siblings" and lived together. It was a fun at hilarious group.

[@Anamnesis010]

Awesome.

[@Demolitiondude]

Are you going to cover the Fenrir wars in the vampire lore?

[@lazarofstygia2241]

Maybe. I am reserving very Clan-specific events for later videos.

[@____________838]

The Whot?

[@MrFantocan]

Awesome!

[@lordkelvin666]

Demon: The Fallen & Kindred of the East (Kuei-Jin) have a similar history from my perspective. Kindred of the East or Kuei-Jin are Eastern Vampires (Opposite of the Western Kindred), yet they were punished for trying to conquer their territories and the gluttony of Chi Energy. Some Kuei-Jin want to be independent of the Yama Kings and the Akumas. The Yama Kings are to me, want revenge on the Kuei-Jin for being independent and free from slavery. Their Hun & Po Natures are the Yin/Yang of the Nature of the Kuei-Jin & much more. Demon: The Fallen is the story I find fascinating because I like “The Fallen” better than the Almighty because he (You know who) desires us (Humans) to be ignorant and stupid. The Demons or the “Fallen” & Lucifer are the antiheroes in my opinion. The Devils are the beings in “Demon: The Fallen,” I find intriguing & more interesting. Humanity & some Humans is better off to understand their own potential and know their individual natures. I prefer to be Awakened than still sleeping. Kindred of the East & Demon: The Fallen have Eastern & Western mythologies, yet I love the true rebels of the Kuei-Jin & the “Fallen” and their Dark Natures are a part of human nature. “It is better to reign in Hell, than to serve in Heaven.”~John Milton’s Paradise Lost Great Infernal Video. P.S. Please do the “Infernalists” in the future. I know you did Clan Baali already, but “Infernalists” was a book I had years ago, but I can’t find it. Sigh. I just might buy a new book. Adieu & Arigatou. Merci.

[@lazarofstygia2241]

Infernalism is a broad topic that crosses multiple game lines (since there are a variety of entities willing to trade mere power for the low price of your immortal soul). It will end up as a series to give all of the slaves of True Evil their due.

[@BlackIce3190]

Gotta wonder what it’s be like for werewolves to meet a Rabisu.

[@emmanuelwolfmusic410]

Truly 👏 work

[@Sorko__]

I love your detailed explanation of DtF but I don't think Lucifer was in the wrong at any point personally, especially after getting back into WoD again as a parent. Idk keeping the ones you love in the dark and holding their true potential back just feels wrong, even knowing the things they could do with the knowledge keeping your progeny in the dark is not right. But mind you I mostly know WoD through the eyes of changelings and fera. With the other deific figures I have deep knowledge of in the setting being the Wyld, Weaver, and Wyrm Lucifer is caring and loving unlike the primordial forces of the triat

[@jm7781]

I think the problem is that Lucifer was trying to speed up the process.

[@qatestbrian1]

Hi. I have not had the pleasure of playing in the White Wolf table top world but have many of the books including this one. I understand the World of Darkness editions knit Vampire, Werewolf, Mage and Changeling into one playable world. I was wondering if the previous books, Vampire: The Masquerade, Werewolf: The Apocalypse, Changeling: The Dreaming, Demon: The Fallen can all be played together if the Storyteller wanted to do so or if each book really only works as an individual system?

[@lazarofstygia2241]

Can they be? Yes. Is it a good idea? Absolutely not. To even attempt it would require exceptional players and an exceptional ST who can synthesize game rules, if need be, on the fly.

[@marialarionova8414]

@@lazarofstygia2241 I concur.

[@Hellheart]

Dude.... I've done it. As long as you either; 1) have players who are cool with being vastly unequal in how effective their combat powers are, or 2) take the time to rebalance each character-types powers and make them more comparable to each other. I wouldn't try it with your first time as storyteller. I had run full stories for Vampire, Werewolf, Mage, Changeling, Wraith and Hunter before I decided to go crazy and allow any character-type. I ended up with 2 Vampires, a Demon, a Mage, and a Changeling. My biggest concern before we started was reconciling Vampires and Werewolves rolling together. Thankfully, no one played a Garou. Lazar is right, though. You need to be intimately familiar with the rules for each game you want to allow characters for.

[@qatestbrian1]

@@Hellheart Thanks @Ricky Ray, this is a clear and concise answer that helps me understand the WoD and the character types in it.

[@Hellheart]

@@qatestbrian1 yeah, no problem. If you end up doing it, I'd be interested to know how it goes. Good luck. 👍🏻✌🏻

[@ajki9833]

Lazar please I’m begging you to stop gatekeeping the music in this video, I’ve read so many comments trying to find it

[@WildWolfGod]

I love the music but I CAN'T FUCKING FIND IT ANYWHERE. 😭

[@louiemercado5595]

Good job on the History of the Fallen/Demons my friend. Demons have been in our imagination since the dawn of time. Whether we like, hate, or become one of them because the only thing we fear or hate: Is ourselves alone. We've desire power, money, war against one another etc. In popular culture, Some demons can be potrayed protagonists like Diablo from How Not to Summon a Demon Lord? Rimuru Tempest from That Time I reincarnated as a Slime. Anos Voldigoad from The Misfit of Demon King Academy. Rias Gremory from Highschool DXD (Which we all very love). And some can be portrayed as main antagonists like the Four Dark Gods of Chaos of Warhammer franchise, The Demon Lords and Archdevils from D&D (Dungeons and Dragons) and many more. Especially the role playing video game Disgaea. Whether they're beautiful and more human, or monstrously ugly, beastly and feared by all, demons will always be as figures of our imagination. And angels too. Hope you like the comment and opinion too.

[@lazarofstygia2241]

Thanks.

[@louiemercado5595]

You're welcome @@lazarofstygia2241.

[@marialarionova8414]

I believe they're so much more than just a figment of our imaginations... They're older than homo sapiens, and real and powerful. They can't and don't lie. They can actually be very friendly... To your 😈 demise

[@AverageAmerican]

Most Humans I know, hate war.

[@Hellheart]

@@marialarionova8414 Do you understand that this video was about a tabletop roleplaying game called Demon: The Fallen? This wasn't some arbitrary video about the Judeo-Christian mythology. It's about a series of RPG books by White Wolf Publishing.

[@Zeitgeist2000]

" "i might spring a little latin on you" i dont know why, but i felt insulted.

[@jeremiah1059]

This is superlative lore! I'm very impressed by its depth and articulation.

[@thesonofmalice1999]

Me, a Warhammer 40,000 nerd: "Oh, The Fallen. Must be some Dark Angels stuff"

[@Hellheart]

I'm a 40k nerd myself. But, I am also a huge fan of the old World of Darkness games/lore.

[@user-fv7xq7rz3p]

Could we please, PLEASE have the transcription of this episode? I would like to give it to my players...

[@kingloads]

awesome thx

[@theoriginalnestor]

We do not change for others nor do we change others , only CHANGE.

[@JohnDowson100]

I really love the Fallen lore. But I always wondered.. if Cain was the 3rd human and the first human child, born after the fall of men, how did humans multiplied before that? Who was the human tribe that asked God forgiveness and went with the host? 🤔

[@Jamhael1]

In DtF, it is said that when Adam and Eve received the "fruit" of Knowledge from Lucifer, they "multiplied" into various copies of themselves that represented their potential, and from them Humanity as a whole descended.

[@ryanwalters7344]

Everything grows and evolves. Perhaps something in our evolution hadn't taken place at that point. Honestly we can't even assume they had the material bodies as we know them. They could have had more fluid or gas like manifestations of form. And maybe after the 'flood' everything hardened and solidified. Assuming all conditions were as we experience today might cause us to miss a expanding universe of insights. For those are all we have to peer into the unknown with.

[@marialarionova8414]

@@ryanwalters7344 through the looking glass

[@Hellheart]

@@ryanwalters7344 This has absolutely nothing to do with reality or religion. This is a tabletop roleplaying game called Demon: The Fallen by White Wolf Publishing.

[@ryanwalters7344]

@@Hellheartwhile I am well aware it's not reality as you would call it and not religion as you would call it. This lore or story appeals to us through a function of archetypes. I'd call it psychology drawn from the active imagination. Whatever archetype in the human psyche that led to the Bible and it's ultimate religion, is the same archetype that provided the creative inspiration for the work. To me that holds as much information and meaning as reality or religion.

[@fallskjermjeger.]

I wonder what the Cainites are up to in these crazy times

[@BundleOSticks]

Probably laughing their asses off

[@christinemiller1946]

Running our government

[@wolfsbanealphas617]

In Enoch

[@Hellheart]

They didn't exist yet.

[@zeevdrifter2707]

I'd love to know what piano piece was used in this video?

[@WildWolfGod]

I've been looking for it myself but I genuinely can't find it.

[@ananousous]

What is this song's name?

[@motherreaper7287]

This was both incredibly silly in its warping of mythology, and absolutely fascinating.

[@Hellheart]

This is a game, fool. It's a tabletop roleplaying game from White Wolf Publishing. It's part of a whole game line called the old World of Darkness. It is fictional. I mean... Religion is fiction, too. But, still, this is even less real.

[@TheGreenScout]

Hell of a lot more sensical than the original mythologies are, honestly. The Abrahamic religions can't even seem to decide if Satan exist, fell, or why. More of a convenient boogeyman than cohesive character.

[@thomaslancaster4223]

This channel is going to be fucking big. Keep this up, Man. If you nail it White Wolf might hire you... seriously. If you need help tell me, reach out to me. Thanks for making it click (dont let the a***oles get you down)

[@thomaslancaster4223]

bump

[@thomaslancaster4223]

bump

[@thomaslancaster4223]

bump

[@marialarionova8414]

Bumping bumping kryashawn

[@anilin6353]

Do you plan on doing Demon the decent ?

[@Sara3346]

So is mlcheal meant to be the most evil in this story?

[@markbenand]

What I don't like here is how, while prideful, Lucifer here is genuinely motivated by love and the desire to see their creations grow but God doesn't try to help them beyond explaining which is sus because anyone who asks is never heard from again. He's actually more like Aule than Morgoth in this version of the fall making the dwarfs out of a desire to teach and have companions not the orcs to have beings to dominate.

[@serpentbearer6649]

What is the exact title of this writing? Is it just the history of the fallen? I'd like to order a copy of this

[@lazarofstygia2241]

It comes from several Demon the Fallen gamebooks.

[@derrickhaggard]

This is an awesome game.

[@whoree]

I hate that every single person but me can actually pay attention to videos like these that cover games that I wanna learn 😭 it cannot keep my attention no matter how much I beg myself ... Brb I'm gonna go fall face first into some concrete

[@flair4crafts894]

Interesting, just curious where do I read more about this, where do you get this perspective. I have always been interested in knowing Luci's side of the story...I think there is something about him that has not been told to us

[@treacherousjslither6920]

There's a trilogy of books that you can find in a bookstore or order online. Very good imo. I've read them multiple times. The Wreckage Of Paradise is the first in the series I believe.

[@AverageAmerican]

This narrator is talking about a game. However, this perspective is taught by Luciferians. From their teaching, the Creator is the bad guy that wants to keep Humans stupid, and Lucifer is an enlightener that wants to help humanity see their full potential and become gods. That's the gist of it...

[@treacherousjslither6920]

@@AverageAmerican Similar to the story of Prometheus

[@flair4crafts894]

@@AverageAmerican According to Kabbalah, oops I just noticed Kab and alah. Anyway, they said Satan/ the snake is the instructor. I am wondering if he is an instructor of the soul, how can that be so evil?

[@AverageAmerican]

@@flair4crafts894 Right. I think whether something is good or evil probably has to do with intent. Maybe Satan isn't as evil as the intent to deceive in order to cause harm.

[@robertevans1662]

You should do beast the primordial

[@lazarofstygia2241]

I'm not sure I could do that and edit out all of my laughter.

[@BStenlund]

Easily my favorit rpg = D

[@coolmanbritt]

So since the angels wanted the humans to be better that meant that they didn't really love them? Only what they wanted them to become?

[@lazarofstygia2241]

The Rebels wanted to glorify themselves through 'service' to Adam and Eve. Vanity disguised as love.

[@renegadusunidos6151]

@@lazarofstygia2241 thats how i see it too.. as lucifer said in a movie "vanity is my favourite sin"

[@wolfsbanealphas617]

@@lazarofstygia2241 like the Greek gods

[@dsrrecordsent]

@@lazarofstygia2241 You are wise what is your history of theology?

[@Hellheart]

@@dsrrecordsent This is all from a tabletop roleplaying game called Demon: The Fallen by White Wolf Publishing. It's not theology. It has absolutely nothing to do with reality or religion.

[@deeppurple883]

I like someone to tell me why are we used as pawns. We suffer in this reality, why. All I hear are word's, We still suffer. Good and bad it's all the same we still suffer. ☘️

[@marialarionova8414]

Truly

[@Hellheart]

Oh, what the fuck!!?? This is the background story for a tabletop roleplaying game. This has nothing to do with reality or religion. It's a game called Demon: The Fallen by White Wolf Publishing. The writers just used biblical apocrypha for inspiration. It's goddamn ridiculous how many of you people are confused about this!

[@thomaslancaster4223]

(I really feel like I've heard your voice before)

[@morecringe89]

so they fought Heaven, they became demons and went to hell. Somehow they came back to earth looking redemption fighting with Heaven...so how to get redemption? lol

[@marialarionova8414]

Interesting, I thought Jesus came to redeem... Or don't we redeem ourselves through each others experience and love given?

[@dennisvanaerde1393]

All sounds alike daily intrigue and politics. As Above So Below? Thank you very Much for sharing knowledge ❤️😇🙏

[@Hellheart]

Oh, what the fuck!!?? This is the background story for a tabletop roleplaying game. This has nothing to do with reality or religion. It's a game called Demon: The Fallen by White Wolf Publishing. The writers just used biblical apocrypha for inspiration. It's goddamn ridiculous how many of you people are confused about this!

[@dennisvanaerde1393]

@@Hellheart Politics and religion are from the same people who want a New World Order. They own the media. Sorry to burst your bubble, mate.

[@justachannel8600]

​@@HellheartIn the words of Shakespeare all the world is a stage and all the people are just larping. So why be boring and larp as a politician? Why shouldn't you larp as an angel and singscream geometrically? I'll tell you why: Because birds will attack you.

[@Hellheart]

@@justachannel8600 what the fuck are you talking about? That Shakespeare paraphrase is funny as hell, though. 😂

[@tombirmingham7033]

these guys areally channeled some great stuff. The Mage ithe Ascension stuff is a great metaphor for what really happened. Also, there are several different potential futures and we're at a nexus event right now. irl John Dee, the first 007, had some angels dictate to him a secret book for the end of the world. The Liber Loagaeth. It was so well coded no one could break it and it fell into obscurity. I am having it decoded. I need you all to know the word of God. We've gotta do a reset here? Should I not do this? Should i just let Aleksandr Dugin win? No, i'm a creation of this new world. I know that we can all improve. I'm a good example of that, i think? I must try and awaken humanity and then we're going to have to deliver ourselves back to ignorance? oh Lord, the learned and good will find good things. Oh am I good? I love you all, if the choice is wrong let it be on my head. I put my faith in God and the divine plan. Prometheus's flame burns in me. I shall blow upon that ember till it is a roaring flame. a single candle of light in an infinite darkness.

[@marialarionova8414]

Scary!!

[@AverageAmerican]

So many potential futures except only one has been written.

[@Hellheart]

Dude, you know the things he talks about are a series of tabletop roleplaying games? This shit is absolutely not real. I can't believe how gullible people are. It's honestly scary.

[@tombirmingham7033]

@@Hellheart dude I spoke to the creator of the game he confirmed it. He was talking about real groups. As to the aspects of the concepts of demons I don't necessarily believe that they are real but you really should go and read the five mysteries of John dee. Like this is all sorts of secret Masonic stuff into the world that kind of thing have fun bye

[@Hellheart]

@@tombirmingham7033 Hahahaha! I don't believe that you "spoke to the creator" for a fucking second. Lying ass weirdo. Demon was written by multiple people. Not one guy. Also, John Dee wasn't the "first 007", jackass. He was a court magician in the 1500's. You fuckin deluded, lying, moron. 007 James Bond was written by Ian Fleming after WW2. He's based on multiple spies that Fleming knew. Stop with the bullshit you small, pathetic, attention seeking, child.

[@BacKYarDsky]

Reminds me of Mr.Mythos

[@jaejohnson6112]

Its Cathar gnostical style. There will come a time when truly courageous, intelligent and logical people will opt out... zapp, gone into nothingness... peace. Eternity is the most suffocating thought.. I still find it amazing that people love this place.. disgusting.

[@Loriddian]

To hell with this life

[@marialarionova8414]

:(

[@jaejohnson6112]

@@marialarionova8414 Ikr

[@Hellheart]

Oh, what the fuck!!?? This is the background story for a tabletop roleplaying game. This has nothing to do with reality or religion. It's a game called Demon: The Fallen by White Wolf Publishing. The writers just used biblical apocrypha for inspiration. It's goddamn ridiculous how many of you people are confused about this!

[@jaejohnson6112]

@@Hellheart I suppose it really is too hard a pill to swallow. yes religion and its followers can be annoying and frustrating. BUT, believe it or not , there are some religious fanatics that are downright dangerous... they will torture and kill you. My little fellow.

[@paulvigil103]

That wasn't Lucifer that was asazel the archons. Lucifer is an Eon

[@marialarionova8414]

Azazel? What's the Archons vs Eon

[@trishthedishluna]

Why does the beginning sound like the building of a computer?

[@lazarofstygia2241]

Because that's how the universe was built. By the God-Machine.

[@trishthedishluna]

@@lazarofstygia2241 touche

[@StevenMichaelCunningham]

Be it demon, daemonic, aberrant, abyssal, devilish or abomination it chose to kill or molest at all for that matter thus forfeited any authority they could ever have or had infinitely. Absolute power can only be through choice after all. Solitude being the solution to those evil due to their being void of authority for the remainder a generalized population or confinement only causes further molestation just as solitude guarantees peace had solely as they are by their SELF for the remainder. To heal & be healed. 🔮

[@Templarsama]

but what happened to Lucifer?

[@lazarofstygia2241]

He's still bopping around somewhere, possibly Los Angeles, avoiding Belial.

[@wolfsbanealphas617]

@@lazarofstygia2241 where he started his own show

[@marialarionova8414]

Sin city

[@fallskjermjeger.]

The end sounds like my outgoing wife

[@leanderlrdag9367]

Where is thi s game

[@Hellheart]

It's a tabletop roleplaying game. Like Dungeons and Dragons. You gotta buy the books.

[@h.m.mcgreevy7787]

Lucy!

[@marialarionova8414]

In the sky with diamonds

[@jakesgenuineanarchy5955]

00:00

[@Joshua1Babs]

Interesting lore but it feels like a lot of heresy and blasphemy to me.

[@lazarofstygia2241]

What is open revolt against God, if not blasphemy?

[@TrinaryAdept]

@@lazarofstygia2241 but what if God no longer believes in himself is that blasphemy also?

[@lazarofstygia2241]

@@TrinaryAdept No. Blasphemy requires some particular act of sacrilege, either by word or deed. As for belief, God does not believe; he knows. Belief covers gaps resulting from imperfect knowledge. Since god has perfect knowledge he had no gaps that require such coverage. That may be why the Angels who questioned God about his plan disappeared after accepting God's offer to show them: either god bestowed perfect knowledge on them, which destroyed them, or by becoming perfect they became one with god and were absorbed into whatever existence god is.

[@geraldpoole274]

The gnostics had it correct.

[@kieththornton7737]

I read that after the fall of Adam that's when he could no longer see the Angels but into fall he was able to see them. And what good is in the horror Channel movies?

[@Crizzly122]

Bro your mic is too good I can hear every drop of saliva in your mouth

[@tarugardiner4287]

The fallen have lost , it's a matter of time , Unfortuantly inocent will suffer greatly because of the fallen and their servants , now it's just a last act of selfishness and suicide ,

[@Hellheart]

This is the background story for a tabletop roleplaying game. This has nothing to do with reality or religion. It's a game called Demon: The Fallen by White Wolf Publishing.

[@renatogomezfaundez8019]

i always hate how human can never be truly free when god is put on the equation as the desire to stop being inocent and strat maturing is always the first sin that brings them into sufering, so it always a choice between numb slavery or cognitive suffering

[@richardmetcalfe920]

Great reading. Never really liked Demon: The Fallen though, far to Christian. Much prefer the abstract cosmology of The Wyld, Wyrm and Weaver presented in Werewolf the Apocalypse and/or the subjective reality of Mage the Ascension

[@lazarofstygia2241]

Everybody has their preference.

[@H240909]

Too Christian? The World of Darkness has always taken inspiration from Christian mythology. The first vampire was literally Caine himself. Besides, the Wyld, Wyrm, and Weaver all still exist in this cosmology. All the games' mythos are meant to overlap with each other.

[@richardmetcalfe920]

@@H240909 thing is, all the others have subjective ties to Christianity. It's less hard facts and more accepted versions of the what and the why. For example, the werewolf version of vampire origin has Cain as the bloody man. He who drank the blood of the Wyrm and was corrupted by it. Demon is the only line that straight out says that its all judeo-christian.

[@H240909]

@@richardmetcalfe920 And yet True Faith is a thing even for non-Christian beliefs. So obviously Christianity is not the be all and end all of the World of Darkness. Plus, this is told from the demons' perspective and they don't exactly have the best memories after millennia of imprisonment.

[@richardmetcalfe920]

@@H240909 yeah, that the other thing that irks me about Demon cos like you say, non judeo-christians can have true faith so yeah. As for Demons having unreliable memory, it doesn't read that way to me. Personally I think Demons should just be Malfeans or Wyrmish Banes and leave it there but hey ho, I'm not white wolf.

[@kieththornton7737]

What about Lilith and Kaine and the Book of Nod???😅😅😅😫🤣 the fallen ones got yall lost

[@Hellheart]

It's Caine. With a "C." Kain is from the Legacy of Kain series. No ending "e", though. But, I still agree with you. What y'all know about Zillah, Irad and Enoch? What y'all know about the Antediluvians? Not a damn thing. Hahahah.... 😂 😆

[@geraldpoole274]

Yet they saved us, taught us , and contrary to your false God's will, we survived do to them.

[@Hellheart]

Bro, this isn't real!! It's the background story for a tabletop roleplaying game called Demon: The Fallen by White Wolf Publishing. It has nothing to do with reality or religion. It's just a game.

[@mirromarnicco3162]

​@@HellheartDude, we know. Stop spamming this comment everywhere.

[@beverlyaustin924]

This story sounds similar to the Gnostics beliefs.

[@vinniecasqer840]

The Gnostics believe our creator was a mistake creation by Sophia. A crazy blind god that had to be contained, banished or destroyed.

[@marialarionova8414]

@@vinniecasqer840 Sophia was an AI

[@Hellheart]

This is the background story for a tabletop roleplaying game called Demon: The Fallen. The writers took inspiration from all types of apocrypha.

[@tonled6960]

Anunnaki doesn't mean "The Malefactors", it means "Those who from Heaven came to Earth"...at least that's what I've always heard....

[@Hellheart]

This is the background story for a tabletop roleplaying game called Demon: The Fallen by White Wolf Publishing. It's a game like Dungeons and Dragons. This has absolutely nothing to do with reality or religion.

[@reubenforthekingdomofheave9437]

@Lazar are you a freemason?

[@lazarofstygia2241]

Even if I were, would I admit it?

[@reubenforthekingdomofheave9437]

@Lazar of Stygia if you are your choosing to forfeit your ability to be a judge for unnecessary pain see my first video on my page!

[@kevinmichaelbergman8276]

Invaded not fallen Bud

[@Hellheart]

Oh, what the fuck!!?? This is the background story for a tabletop roleplaying game. This has nothing to do with reality or religion. It's a game called Demon: The Fallen by White Wolf Publishing. The writers just used biblical apocrypha for inspiration. It's goddamn ridiculous how many of you people are confused about this!

[@kevinmichaelbergman8276]

@@Hellheart Not Confused about it they are the actual actors they are giving updates go wipe the Shit off your Face.

[@rhondablack7842]

First of all Lilith was the first woman who was made of the Earth and equal to Adam

[@marialarionova8414]

Truly

[@Hellheart]

This is the background story for a tabletop roleplaying game. This has nothing to do with reality or religion. It's a game called Demon: The Fallen by White Wolf Publishing. The writers just used biblical apocrypha for inspiration. But, they do use Lilith in the games, too. Caine killed Able and god cursed him to be the 1st Vampire. He wandered and eventually met Lilith. She actually taught him the powers that Vampires have in these games. There is a whole bunch in this game line. Vampire: The Masquerade, Werewolf: The Apocalypse, Mage: The Ascension, Wraith: The Oblivion, Changeling: The Dreaming, Mummy: The Resurrection, Demon: The Fallen, Hunter: The Reckoning and Kindred of the East. With each book, you can play as one of those kinds of beings.

[@brotherhix]

Yo dude there's a big difference between Fallen Angels and Demons

[@marialarionova8414]

How so?

[@brotherhix]

@@marialarionova8414 well first of all angels are actually physical they have physical bodies, demons do not they are strictly spiritual they can inhabit a physical body but it's not theirs

[@Hellheart]

@@brotherhix Oh, what the fuck!!?? This is the background story for a tabletop roleplaying game. This has nothing to do with reality or religion. It's a game called Demon: The Fallen by White Wolf Publishing. The writers just used biblical apocrypha for inspiration. It's goddamn ridiculous how many of you people are confused about this!

[@brotherhix]

@@Hellheart and your point is? I mean I'm not wrong.

[@Hellheart]

@@brotherhixyes, you are wrong

[@warrenradcliff123]

Why the obsession of power? Religion always has these stories of power over this, that or about worshiping. Just wake up and breathe the air and enjoy the now moment of your existence.

[@Hellheart]

This is the background story of a tabletop roleplaying game. This has nothing to do with reality or religion. It's from a game. They just used biblical apocrypha for inspiration. It is called Demon: The Fallen. By White Wolf Publishing. Their are vampires and werewolves and mages and faeries in the game, too.