Designing AI Allies - How Games Create Great Party Members and Companions ~ Design Doc

[@opfor_8876]

If playerrunspeed == 20 and playerwalkspeed == 10 NPCspeed = 15;

[@Sunrise0222]

why is this so true

[@ヌル-m7l]

*Assassin's Creed flashbacks*

[@Feuerhamster]

Begone, Satan

[@FunkyJeff22]

@@Sunrise0222 yeah, itd be better if the NPC speed were higher than the player run speed or lower than the player walk speed. /s there's a reason why that's the optimal speed for NPCs

[@justcallmexen]

Isn't that basically what was said during the half life 2 episode 1 developer commentary?

[@respectblindfolds7411]

Imma stop you right there chief. Persona 3 does not use the press turn system. In fact, none of the persona games use the press turn system, they use the once more system. The main difference between the two is that you can theoretically gain infinite turns by knocking down enemies, while the press turn system has a defined limit. Also in the press turn system, the turn passes over to the next party member up, while the once more system gives another turn to the one who scored the knock down. I just wanted to clear up any confusion, as I'm sure this would make.

[@DesignDoc]

Dang it, you're right. The rest of the segment still applies though, luckily.

[@tppcrpg6311]

"while the press turn system has a defined limit" Unless you are the AI and decide to spam Beast Eye

[@TheElderTwin]

@@DesignDoc I think it should be mentioned that the party AI is granted perfect knowledge of the enemies' strengths and weaknesses once you scan it (even against mid-bosses whose scans reveal no meaningful information to the player). This perfect knowledge also includes what status alignments they're immune to and what ones they're fatally weak to (which cuts pointless Marin Karins down to zero). The main issue here is that this fact is never told to the player, and once a player has scanned a mid-boss only to find no meaningful information, they aren't likely to scan them again in the future, leaving the AI swinging randomly against these opponents.

[@linkisntpink5897]

Was gonna say this fuck

[@thesandvitchman1234]

@@tppcrpg6311 fuck mot

[@caiopatric]

Love the mention of Final Fantasy 12, as a kid that game made me understand the first steps of programming an AI and its great. it's literally baby's first programming lesson. fantastic game to boot.

[@imveryangryitsnotbutter]

While I like the idea behind FFXII's gambit system, I think it's not nearly robust enough to work with the combat system. For example, there are certain low-power weapons that confer status buffs; you can smack an ally with one to cast Protect or Regen on them for free. But there's no gambit condition for "if a character does not have such-and-such status", so the best AI you can make around these weapons is one which constantly deals scratch damage to one ally while leaving the rest unbuffed. Stealing is also a pain to automate; there's no condition for "if enemy has already been successfully stolen from", so you have to use HP threshold conditions to limit their steal attempts, but you can't completely remove the issue of them aborting steal attempts before they succeed or continuing stealing after they've gotten an item.

[@caiopatric]

you're absolutely right, there's some options missing that would bring a lot of quality of life improvements to the system, but i still think it works damn well for what it is. Like i would usually just turn the stealing gambit to only work when enemies are above a certain threshold of health so that after a hit or two, the thief character would go back to fighting the enemy regularly, more often than not having already easily stolen the item. it may not have all the options you need, but there's some creative workarounds you can use.

[@caiopatric]

oh sorry i missed the end of your comment where you explained the steal mechanic. but yeah you gotta make do sometimes. a manual steal here and there doesnt really hurt too badly.

[@quillarmike6947]

Yeah I think if they added one more slot per gambit for logic elements like NOT, OR, AND, etc., even if they didn't give them to you until later in the game, it would have been so much better.

[@caiopatric]

@Michael Pauciolo yeah, they could have added a few more situational gambits it in the remastered version for sure. but you know what for a 2006 ps2 game i still think it does a great job. i can cut it some slack.

[@XenoflareBahamut]

ThIs MiGhT Be A GoOd SpOt To FiNd SoMe InGrEdIeNtS

[@imveryangryitsnotbutter]

I'vE cOmE uP wItH a NeW rEcIpE

[@icarue993]

HaRPieS!

[@niroe82]

Goddammit I can't escape it

[@Chaos2Frozen]

Wolves hunt in packs!

[@crazymanwerido4522]

They're masterworks,all. You can't go wrong.

[@Inari_the_Fox]

P3 was fine if you set then all to "knock down" If you do that then they're wayyyyyyyyy less annoying. But yeah. If they act freely, they're incredibly stupid.

[@OverZaEast]

Older Persona 3 version Mitsuru : MIND CHARGE Mitsuru : MARIN KARIN FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF

[@Amarganeitor]

Nice meme from 12 years ago.

[@BlackMetalVayu]

@@OverZaEast or the good old: zio *enemy reflects* mazio. FUCK

[@akesan2374]

MC:Help Mitsuru: *Marin ******* *Karin* MC: *ded* MC's ghost :Mitsuru,you're stupid.

[@TheKewlPerson]

But then if an enemy exploits your weakness so you miss a turn and you’re getting low on hp, none of your allies will heal you, so it’s best to have at least one to heal/support or act freely unless you know you can win. Also they only use physical attacks if they don’t have any effective elemental moves, even if the elemental moves would be stronger.

[@AwsmChimera]

As someone who's never touched a Monster Hunter game until _World_ I gotta say, the Palico is one of my favorite buddies from a game in a long while. I love you, Almond Milk. Thanks for hitting the monster with a stick.

[@tugsuumovies1999]

I still wont forget that the handler is where my palico went to first, like this damn cat just ignored me to get a hug from this virtual stranger rather than me, its companion for years b4 the game even takes place. Like Wtf, man🤦‍♂️

[@nidohime6233]

Nice nickname for a Palico

[@maxamillion3437]

@@tugsuumovies1999 NGl that's still the only beef I got with the hander, and to this day I still bear the hate that it gave me.

[@mads_in_zero]

As others have pointed out, Persona uses the Once More system, not the Press Turn system. Different games in the wider SMT umbrella use different systems... Someday, I wanna make a joke game that combines as many of them as possible. The One More Extra Press Boost Turn System, if you will.

[@shadyacr]

Well I certainly won't.

[@funninoriginal6054]

I just imagine an companion hitting an enemy's weakness and then suddently becoming an fucking super saiyan for an turn

[@r.d.drowned9332]

Let's make it better, *One More Extra Press Boost Turn Co-op System*

[@BartholomewMahershalalhashbaz]

Don't forget sessions from Tokyo Mirage Sessions #FE

[@skylordguy6861]

One More Extra Press Boost Turn Co-op Session System

[@zimbampow]

You could have also mentioned Snake during the final segments of MGS2. He is far more efficient than Raiden at actually taking down enemies backing up the narrative through gameplay, showing how much more experienced he is when compared to Raiden.

[@Reydriel]

Dude, use commas XD

[@scapheap]

Actually, Snake AI changes with the difficulties. Easy? He fires a lot and take cover so you can basically ignore him. Hard? He will eat a lot of bullets and fire from time to time so you have to babysit him or lose.

[@-maki446]

scapheap take alot of damage so snake switches weapon

[@flashbaxx]

@@scapheap iirc if you enter the Tengu fight with low health, Snake will swap to an assault rifle instead of the pistol, and he'll sweep the floor in the elevator scene. I learned this from watching the latest AGDQ MGS2 speedrun.

[@PolarPhantom]

Man, that final section? A gosh darn masterclass.

[@sanjiisagee8481]

*Marin karin has entered the chat*

[@Amarganeitor]

**TACTICS MENU HAS SHARED ITS LOCATION WITH YOU**

[@sizedoesntmeaneverything4157]

*Ice break and Tentarafoo are typing furiously*

[@achmadfajar6845]

*GASP* Mitsuru-senpai!

[@5trangelove]

Mitsuru please heal me Im dying

[@ヌル-m7l]

Mitsuru... don't heal the enemy... don't do that! DON'T! NOOOO AAAAAAAAARGGG

[@DorkAndFriends]

I'm surprised you didn't mention Dragon's Dogma, a game who gives you a pawn that you can train and that will instinctively learn your traits and your style, then attune themselves to that specific style. DD is the PEAK of player/AI cooperative progression. If you train your pawn well, they'll be useful. Neglect them, they will suck and you'll have to wipe their memory and start from scratch.

[@ヌル-m7l]

Oddly enough, I never understood the Pawn system on Dragon's Dogma. In fact, I didn't even knew it worked like that. No wonder I never got past the 4th hour of the gameplay

[@NightmareBlade10]

Exactly! DD is the only game other than Bioshock Infinite that I think did companions perfectly! Both are awesome games by the way.

[@chetawanung-adjmagool9967]

Agreed. Dragon's Dogma is universally underrated. It's Pawn system truly is a gem of AI design abd mechanics.

[@alexa_digitalart]

I LOVED Dragon's Dogma for exactly this when I first played. It has the most enjoyable AI companion system that I had played since Kingdom Hearts.

[@loled123]

Dogma is a weird game because if you don't understand that the pawn copies your behavior, the pawn will be dead weight. The pawn might learn from you summoning other pawns with better habits, but you might do the mistake of playing as a martial class while having 3 sets of mage pawns, trying to roll trough the game. There is also a huge difference between the base game, and Everfall or Dark Arisen. In the expansion there is a lot more aggressive enemies, where you NEED your pawns to not kill themselves trying to do stupid shit in melee range. I.e if you never perfect block anything, your fighter pawn is useless. If you don't stagger or jump on enemies off balance, pawns won't learn how to. Elemental weaknesses are easy to learn, but not how to knock down flying dragons, parry wind pressure, counter Eliminator stomps, climb, or many of the really useful things. Its the kind of game where you can train pawns to pick up enemies and throw them off cliffs. Or how to use the explosive barrels that is left everywhere. Or you could just give them taunt/channeling skills, and then watch as they spam that and are unable to leave your side due using the wrong AI drugs from the postgame merchant.

[@alexa_digitalart]

Can't spell "liability" without AI.

[@pokerang007]

I can't tell if this is a joke or not.

[@LazyLoonz]

"IA" ah yes

[@no-better-name]

@@LazyLoonz seen a few games refer to AI as IA I think E.Y.E. does that, so does Half-Life: Sand of the Death (a mod for HL). There was also a Sven Co-op map that warned of spawning enemies with something along the lines of "IA incoming"

[@goopers1638]

Futaba Sakura from Persona 5 (even though I'm sure you know her) is a great example of a helper AI. She cannot be controlled, but she will do her job just well. If you are at low HP, she'll focus on healing you. [Insert obligatory "I need healing" joke] And the way she interferes in battle is rather smooth; a glitching animation and her showing up in her Persona, giving you a feeling of amusement. That's all I have to say, so thank you for reading!

[@oi_bruv]

She either "Super move: Ultra Charge!!" or *heals you when your party is at full hp*

[@funninoriginal6054]

Untill you lvl up her confidant and she gets the totally balanced ultra charge

[@mat8791]

She also gives you SP when party members are lacking it. She also gives random bonuses in fights such as charging, bonuses to defense. And if there 's an attack that kills mostly everyone, Final guard. Its like a RNG multi use oracle abillity. *Except if it was actually good*

[@papieverett]

Persona 3 “Invoking Oracle!” *Party members health drops to 1*

[@LoreofMars]

*Persona 3 is mentioned* Yay! Finally we aren't talking about Persona 5!! *sees segment* Oh....

[@corruptedteka]

@singularon1 Yeah, I was a little disappointed, especially since I really like the gameplay mechanics of P3...

[@abdelali9279]

Yeah but at least he should have mentioned that in P3 Portable they let control all you party members, yeah it defeats the repurpose of AI controlled allies that is the focus of this video, but it also leaves a bad impression of P3.

[@spec7923]

@Retendo FES > Portable >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> vanilla

[@captawesome42]

well yeah. the ally AI control in P3 wasn't good...so..

[@boiwifeyasmr4U]

@@corruptedteka Me too. There's a real depth t it's A.I. party control system that really differences it from the other Personas.

[@OuterRing]

FF12's Gambit system, one of the greatest inventions in gaming. In a Perfect world every game with party AI would have something like the Gambit system. If only . . . .

[@takezokimura2571]

Something I love is when there's a lot of random NPC soldiers fighting and they can hold their own at least for a time. Even if they do just a tiny bit of damage and just work to distract the enemy. It makes you feel like you´re not alone. One example is Spartan: Total Warrior. The other spartan can actually kill enemies, but it takes a while.

[@Spearra]

I remember a part in Castle Crashers where you fight alongside the King and his army. They put in the work but didn't play the game for you either. It felt great having an actual ally army that does something rather than just be a mess.

[@maizen1403]

Samurai Warrior 2 Allies also pretty competent. I remember let our Allies fight in spartan total warrior, its really make you don't feel alone

[@_Jankster]

I always felt that the shitty AI in Persona 3 was a good part of the experience. As opposed to the other entries in the series the team in P3 is pretty rag-tag and for most of the game, there's a fair amount of disdain & issues between party members. As the main character/leader, it feels like you're this neutral party that glues everyone together and has to wrangle all these party members into getting the job done. Changing the character's AI strategy always felt like yelling in the middle of a battle at a character to do something, maybe they'll get what you mean, maybe they'll decide that they want to Marin Karin because this time surely it will work. If there's ever a remake I would totally understand having party members being under direct control, but I still like how it is in FES.

[@Call0045]

AI in FES is like 10 times better than P3 and P3P. It works fine for the most time for me at least.

[@cururinoir]

@@Call0045 At least in PSP, we could control the members ourselves though...

[@Call0045]

@@cururinoir Yeah, but now there's a patch (that works for Custom Firmware PS2 and PS3 as well) for P3FES that allows you to play with all the other members. We still have the female protagonist and Vincent's cameo in P3P tho. :)

[@professionalfangster1510]

Well, it doesn't make sense for Mitsuru or Akihiko. It's not every day you see Japanese students speaking French, so you know that they're smart. Mitsuru especially shouldn't be falling to her emotions as you described.

[@_Jankster]

@@professionalfangster1510 I mean I'll give you Mitsuru because according to the game she's been at it since she was like 10 so she really should know better. But if we're bringing knowledge into it, sure she knows french, but if you saw her social links she's got like no street smarts whatsoever. I also think she's more emotional than she lets on, she just tries to emulate her dad's stone-cold, uncaring, logical act; but that's a pretty subjective take. As for Akihiko, the dude can box but he definitely needs a leader for team combat, it's a totally different world from a one on one bout in the ring with rules in place. Mitsuru constantly talks about how he gets hurt because he doesn't take it seriously enough throughout the game.

[@loginatorvgaming9885]

Miitopia makes a whole game centered around what you mentioned in persona 3 and I love the game.

[@dovahkiin53839]

The key there I think is that the focus and expectations are different- it's not about difficult combat, it's about watching your miis get into silly shenanigans, and that style works perfectly for that.

[@hheecckk526]

I swear people who play persona 3 dont remember that the game explicity tells you to scan enemies to learn their moves and weaknesses. Yes it takes 3 turns per enemy which sucks but the thing is that people forget it exists and just expects the tactics menu to take care of everything which it doesnt. Im not saying you in particular didnt scan enemies but when you do scan them the allies will respond by attacking weaknesses and avoiding resistances. This is the main mechanic in the jotun of grief fight which is a boss near the endgame that absorbs everything except pierce type damage. If you scan that boss the allies will literally just stand there doing nothing(despite showing the player none of his stats when scanned)which shows the player that you need to use a different party or change your tactics to win.

[@timothymclean]

Player: "Guys, this enemy is weak to ice." AI: _uses wind attack_ Player: "It's obviously weak to ice. Guys." AI: _uses fire attack_ Player: "It's made of fire, why did you think that would work?" AI: _uses ice attack_ Player: "There you go! Now that you've figured out-" AI: _uses fire attack_ Player: _"Argh!"_

[@hheecckk526]

@@timothymclean to be fair how can you expect your ai companions to attack the ice weakness when only 1 party member actually uses ice. This is the point of my comment. If you use the tactics and scanning your ai team will do what you want. If you scan and have them set to auto they wont attack the boss with an element that they absorb(they will however attack even if the enemy resists because auto just tells them to do some random move that wont actively heal the enemy or reflect back at themselves)

[@ChiefMedicPururu]

They don't want to make them smarter.

[@tofuteh2348]

@@hheecckk526 wait, are you arguing that this is actually good game design?

[@JayAreAitch]

Brandon Tea It is. It's different but it's not necessarily bad.

[@HARpgT]

Me: Paralyzed, asleep, or stunned Felyne: Starts making a song for my eventual cart.

[@MProductionsGAMING]

Great video! Wished you mentioned the A.I dog companion in the Capcom horror game Haunting Grounds. You can control how the dog behaves in gameplay, without the need for any menus. The dog will usually attack enemies only if you can't handle them on you're own and/or are in the process of being grabbed or attacked by them. The way you treat your dog companion also determines how obedient/useful of an ally he'll be to you throughout the game. For example, if you scold your dog too much/for no reason, frequently attack him, or constantly feed him things that'll hurt him (i.e. chocolate) the dog will resent you, and be less likely to help you if you're being chased or attacked by an enemy (even if you directly command the dog to attack, he still won't help you). The dog may sometimes even attack you if you make him hate you enough. Even more interesting is that your relationship with your A.I. dog is one of the factors that determine which ending you'll receive in the game.

[@crazymanwerido4522]

Aww i wish you mentioned the pawns from Dragon's Dogma. They learn more about enemies the more they fight that enemy and eventually can become better than you. You can also completely customize your main pawn.

[@Ramash440]

It's quite funny what they did in AC7. In AC6 you could pretty much give out orders for you AI allies to destroy stuff, in AC5 you kinda control your own squadron, ACZ has you give Pixy orders on what to focus, and even in AC4, where the Mobius Squadron is you and only you, you can actually see your AI companions shoot down stuff all the time. Now, in AC7, whenever you see them fire a missile, it's guaranteed to almost always miss. Side note : AI issues or not, P3 is still the best Persona out of the first 4. Fight me.

[@aroseydragon2873]

I love that you included the palicos! They're probably my favorite AI to date! I am a little sad though to see a clip of Trico from The Last Guardian but not get any insight on that. It took 7 years to get things like his AI down cause they wanted him to feel and behave like a real animal. It brought joy to some players and frustration to others. I'd love to see that concept explored further!

[@eriochromeblackt3021]

Me: Mitsuru, I need healing!!! Mitsuru: *uses Marin Karin* Me: *Surprised Pikachu Face*

[@bayazitkarabulov178]

Akihiko: Ive been waiting for this

[@SenhorKoringa]

Then set her to Heal/Support. Everyone who complains about the AI party members never learned to use the Tactics Menu

[@EDK-San51912]

@@SenhorKoringa you can’t be constantly healing for all fightins you kinda neeed her ice powers that way your not over using the main characters powers just to have your ai heal slave

[@EDK-San51912]

Also again she does already randomly heal without other commands and her Marin Karin thing shouldn’t be happening so often even when their is a clear advantage using ice moves other a status move it just seems like the ai is stupid so instead of fixing it the game asks you to do the work for it. Which would work better if they just made it manually control which atlus can do for ps1 games but not ps 2 games. Even tho other rpgs at the time we’re doing that

[@sofaris576]

I gotta say I also like scripted allies. Prime example being Palutena. She stays in Skyworld and supports you from there but its all scripted. The power of flight, when she drops healing Items your way ore when she opens a path fore Pit. But I like it. It might be all scripted but I still appreciate here help. She is also an awesome Character to have around.

[@malikoniousjoe]

Sofaris In all fairness, this video was more focused on AI Allies. I love Kid Icarus, but the better example here would have been Dark Pit

[@SOMERANDOMPERSONNPC]

-Devs gave you the worst A.I in the game -Entire studio deemed you as best character in your game. Power of Marin Karin folks

[@SuperShesh2]

Persona 3 wanted you to feel like a team leader with the orders instead of micromanaging. Especially as high school students giving broader orders there

[@EDK-San51912]

It was shit choice in the first place fir ai like why couldn’t they just give you the choice in whether or not it was Manuel instead of forcing it on to you. The first 3 games person 1 and both persona 2 games let you play manually making it easier for you strategies and plan things out instead of just leaving it to an ai to choose everything else for you.

[@Niiue]

11:15 especially at the final boss.. *shivers....* *moonless gown.....*

[@creeperwithstyle]

I really don't get why the AI wouldn't just wait instead of attack when Moonless Gown was activated.

[@Niiue]

creeperwithstyle somebody said that you’re the only one who can see it, the party members couldn’t idk myself.

[@lizzy532]

I get PTSD everytime I see a Tarot Deck

[@SenhorKoringa]

@@creeperwithstyle They don’t know what it does so set them all to standby

[@ZerrethTV]

I'm also in the camp where I think Persona 3 was given an unfair assessment. It was very obvious that locking your other party members behind an AI was a deliberate choice. While I believe P3 was sometimes TOO random, P3 FES noticeably improved the AI and exaggerated their story personality into their AI. Junpei almost exclusively used physical attacks and rarely used magic, and when he did, it was almost always the strongest and flashiest possible one in his repertoire. Mitsuru only healed effectively if Yukari wasn't in your party, otherwise she had a balance of magic and physical attacks and Yukari primarily defaulted to magic and had surprising control over it and only used normal attacks if she could guarantee knockdowns. Akihiko's AI was one of the best as it felt like he would default to normal attacking if it was entirely unsure of the enemy but balanced magic and physical very well once weaknesses were revealed. There was the occasional mazio slip up but it really played to his "senior" character. In order to keep them from being too powerful, it seems that there was an RNG table that they rely on to occasionally cast "whimsical" actions that are uncharacteristic of them, and the variance seemed to differ per character. In addition, the AI guidance was very strict and prioritized what you asked for above their own programming. Only if it was impossible to accomplish (Strategy set to knockdown but no enemies scanned, therefore the ai having no guaranteed knockdown strategy) would the AI then revert to their default settings. I think the AI tweak for FES greatly enhanced the game and left a better impression of their in-story character and enhanced dialogue and cutscenes as how they fought (along with flavorful stats such as Akihiko being weak to ice, and Mitsuru being the ice user) was now an extension of the type of character that was written for them. The upgrade was also most definitely necessary as The Answer portion of the game was locked on hard difficulty and all bosses had a very specific strategy required to beat them, which meant the AI could not be TOO random.

[@Lambdadelta77]

I'm a simple man, I see Aigis from Persona 3, I click on it.

[@fanboy4142]

Best toaster ❤️

[@bens5093]

Let us commence with an All-Out Attack!

[@louswrecktum8787]

@@bens5093 Let us strike while the iron's hot!

[@AaronTheAxel]

Mood

[@dave7886]

Haven't gotten that far in the story. Picked up P4 on vita and can't stop. (Was playing P3P, but it'll have to wait)

[@Melruu]

My palico Peanut and the boyband in XV are the bestest friends I've ever had

[@robonerd125]

The Boyband, i love it. Daddy Gladdy and the Boys.

[@justrcd]

palico... peanut... *I've come up with a new recipe*

[@ToObserve923]

I actually really liked P3s combat. It can seem as if theres more risk involved than security, especially when compared to P4 and P5, however its all in the commands. With comands, battles they are surprisingly more in your control. Instead of planning out each individual characters move, I would have to plan out an entire turn. I would usually try to figure out how to get the most profit out of a situation while setting up a backup plan in case they either missed or couldnt finish the job. Which in the end, is like any typical rpg. (Also, I would usually never have them on act freely). I ended up dying the most in P3 than any other Persona game but that was mostly due to mudo/hama spells. All in all, I would perfer to choose individual command, but the strategy going into P3s combat appealed to me

[@seporokey]

If you like players to script allies themselves, Mabinogi and its pet system are very interesting. When the system was first released, it was really useful, (not useful anymore because of power creep, and now pets are only useful for their summon effects). You can get pretty specific with commands like: If enemy is running, and enemy skill is loaded, then load defense skill. You could also share pet AI with other players. Dragon Age: Origins also gets an honorable mention for fun player scripting of AI characters.

[@horizon92lee]

The interactions with Elizabeth in bioshock infinite are some of my fav from a gameplay/story/interaction point. I hate having to stop what I’m doing mid fight to make sure my ally isn’t bugging out and dying

[@kristianutomotobing9719]

"You have full control of what they do on their turn" Persona 3, Mitsuru proceeds to use Marin Karin

[@roberto9396]

I have to say that in P3P I never controles my allies, I would put them on act freely and Yukari on Heal/support and it somehow worked

[@spydersoup8447]

Well, every Persona game since has AI allies as an optional thing.

[@xa447]

I personally love the p3 AI, it fits well with the themes of the game and most of the time the MC does 90% of the work anyway because they get every spells

[@thekaiseriswiser4451]

The EDF series has had some great AI. In their games the EDF soldiers will at best be able to win the mission by themselves and at worse either make meatshields or get blown up by your weapons. There is also some scripted scenes where artillery and air strikes are called to assist, but the normal EDF AI between the Fencers, Rangers, Wing Divers and Tankers are helpful. It's also nice that they talk and banter about when it comes to talking about the most random of things or even singing.

[@braybruin3075]

Unforgettable allies? I know someone who’s kinda unBEARable.

[@alicemargatroid6758]

"I've lived here for a BEARY long time!" ~Teddie 2011

[@ilhama3214]

@@alicemargatroid6758 still one of the best qoutes over the past decades

[@kylekatayamadaisuke]

Stfu

[@Sunaki1000]

Hey Listen!

[@IkarimTheCreature]

Yes the Handler in Monster Hunter: World is unbearable ;)

[@BJGvideos]

I like how you use Aigis, an actual AI character, in the thumbnail

[@rebeccaconlon9743]

8:10 you can get to a point where the character's gambits are self sustaining and auto killing/targeting mobs

[@noboty4168]

I liked that you brought up expectations playing a big role in whether players put up with poor A.I. In games like God Eater, an A.I's behavior is directly tied to their personality. For example, Kanon's personality revolves around her being clumsy and prone to friendly fire, the latter of which she has a big reputation of doing. Sure enough, if you look through her persona list of skills, there is a unique skill named after her that intentionally makes her more likely to hit her allies. To make matters worse, she wields a grenade launcher, one of most disruptive weapons. I myself have been knocked around by her by her countless times, but I always found it really cool that she her personality is on full display. Another example, Alisa from the same game has a crush on the main character. Thus, her personal skill makes it so she always keeps a spare healing item to use just for you. Soma, likewise, is a loner, and so, he and all the other loners go off on their own and do their own thing during missions (unless you call to them). Heck, Tatsumi and Brendan are squad mates and friends, so if you bring them along for a mission, they will go off together to flank and double-team! Point is, I really like it when developers do that. Makes the A.I's seem more real people. That said, sometimes enjoy having total control. FF12 was the perfect example of that. Having your party set up just right is so satisfying! I will never forget how my party killed the Hell Wyrm (the second toughest boss in the game) while I was sleeping. One moment, I was just get started, the next it was morning and my party is just standing in an empty room and I am wondering where the boss went. Also, regarding Persona 3, the developers grew a brain and allowed you total control of your party members in the portable version of Persona 3. So, you don't need to tell them to skip Persona 3 entirely. That all aside, great video!

[@koficoncubus6255]

Saw Aigis, clicked. Fucking love P3. The AI in that game was wonderful and it wasn't bad at all to me.

[@SenhorKoringa]

THANK YOU FFS People who talked shit about P3 combat are morons who try putting the square peg in the round hole. USE THE DAMN TACTICS

[@Wachalpharoh]

I love how Monster Hunter and Dragons Dogma do AI, sometimes dumb, most times useful, you feel like you have a worthy traveling companion that works with you and your style of play, and that is key for me.

[@LifeIsABeach3210]

I clicked for Bioshock infinite.. really enjoyed those three seconds

[@seekertosecrets]

0:28 A nod for mentioning Drachma from SOA. Love that game! Miss that game!

[@HBDiniz10]

Atreus is actually a great companion, you do control him so he feels more as an abillity

[@Ortex313]

Glad you shouted out FF12! I feel like a lot of people were disappointed with its combat, but I feel like the gambit system was one of the best designed JRPG combat system in years. A lot of times, story and/or completion are the only reasons to replay an FF game, but I replayed FF12 just as much for the combat.

[@Msatk342s]

I have to whole heartedly disagree with you on Persona 3. The lack of control over the characters was a deliberate choice by the team, made in order to coincide with the themes of the story as well as making sure every character in Persona 3 felt like they were themselves. It helped show off how everyone in the game is their own individual with their own story, something which the rest of the game makes heavy use of. There was a lot of arguing between the director and the publishers surrounding the feature, and in the end the director won out. It has led to frustration at certain times in combat, however i think it really adds to Persona 3 as an experience, and i'm always happy to see the creative teams win in those kinds of disputes. Persona 3 is by far the most thought out experince in the franchise due to such things. Persona 4 and 5 never utilize their side characters to the same extent or with the same professionalism that 3 does, and the themes explored in 3 are not only vastly more interesting than the more cliché themes of later games, but are also thouroughly explored in most aspects of the game, for example said ai decisions. I understant the complaint, but i think certain franchises really end up suffering from "cleaning up" aspects of their gameplay, another example being the Souls series, which at first sought to provide a deeply interesting world with unique systems and experiences, and later on just ended up being a "tough-as-nails" boss rush with a focus on flashiness and patterns instead of more interesting scenarios.

[@Msatk342s]

@@yesham0 I'm not trying to say that the A.I. system in Persona 3 is the best A.I. decision, and i am absolutely not saying that it should be implemented in every rpg imaginable. My point is just that Persona 3 didn't push a self-controlling A.I. without purpose. Most of the RPGs i've played has been with total player control, and they've still led to some of my favourite characters. Showing personality through statistics is just as viable, all be it, i do consider it kind of cheap. It's easy to design a knucklehead with lots of strength and not a lot of magic, but an entirely different task to make him seem as rash or jealous as Junpei when you can still just decide every action he takes. SMT demons in particular are also an unfair comparison, because the design of them can always relate to their backgrounds, or creating a striking image, where a human character still has to look human at the end of the day. The ways of portraying characters should be used for different situations, as they fit for different tasks. In conclusion i don't entirely disagree with you, but think we should always seek to see the advantage of different game design decisions. Nobody actively designs their game to be non-sensical, and if they did, there would be a reason to it (at least in most cases).

[@oi_bruv]

I like this argument but Marin Karin

[@ventusse]

@@oi_bruv This argument wholly implies that Mitsuru's personality revolves around her enticing each and every person/monster/shadow that she meets..

[@wileecoyotegenius5955]

You know I really want to play P3 but it makes me want to play it a whole hell of a lot less when every piece of praise for the game is phrased as criticism towards P4 which I love. Can't you just raise up the game you like without tearing down the others?

[@oi_bruv]

@@ventusse nah, I just mean she spams the move so often

[@agentorangecb1]

My 1st Design Docs vid: This is well thought out, well produced content... 2nd vid: Drakma gets a mention in the first few minutes. Imma subscribe

[@AnemoneMeer]

I feel one of the best teammate AI's I've seen is Mass Effect 2's. The AI is kinda dumb in that it doesn't adequately judge its durability and distance to next cover, so it absolutely doesn't win fights on its own and can even become a liability, but offensively it's very VERY good at the core combat. They have special callouts for kills and how they get them, and wreck if used right. Most importantly, the weaknesses they have are effortless to correct via player input. Simply telling them where you want them is enough to correct all their flaws. Because the flaws can be corrected in the moment with a singular input, their issues when left to their own devices never really present themselves, provided the player is giving orders. Their suicidal nature without player commands on Hardcore/Insanity is counterbalanced by their effectiveness at obeying player commands and their strength when following them, and allows players to strategize around them.

[@mistressminerva3382]

I loved the Gambit System from Final Fantasy 12 becuase you can tweek it near perfectly for challanging Bossfights. Also i like Persona 3 Portable more then Persona 3 or Persona 3 Fes not just because you can control all Partymembers but for a good number of other reasons that have nothing to do with the A.I.

[@tomlynmathewsjr7514]

"AI making games to easy." Whistles innocently in Quiet.

[@wanaan]

I recall Star Ocean3 have you able to teach the AI to do things. That was very useful, and eventually gamebreaking (I taught my allies to spam team heal at any given moment, making the party entirely unkillable)

[@Messiah_Abel]

Perfect timing since i'm just about to finish P3 :) Edit: After watching the section on P3, i can attest that _occasionally_ the AI makes absolute horrid decisions, but if you use tactics such as Knock Down after analyzing a target or having them focus on a certain Shadow, the AI does great. When i first got the game, i was anticipating a game with trashy party AI, but for a game released in the early 2000s, the AI is spectacular if you instruct them properly.

[@gaiuszeno1331]

That gambit system looks awesome. In so many games I have wished I could just write a small script to have my AI allies react.

[@SpringDavid]

Player: * starts pressing the calling button like a idiot * NPC: *_CAN YOU STOP DOING THIS, I ALREADY SAID I'M COMING GODDAMIT_*

[@goblinboy1830]

Something that’s also nice about the palicos in monster hunter is that crafting armor and weapons for them doesn’t take much materials so you don’t have to worry about having enough for you and your palico

[@Cooper941]

In the P3 part you skipped over the tactics menu where you can set the party members attack types and behavior. It's bare bones but it really remedy's the mitsuru Marin Karin bs

[@Theredjay5]

He mentions it at 11:08. And yeah the tactics menu really solves the Marin Karin problem that many players seem to have. Although I never ran into it during any of my playthroughs so I had a hard time understanding why the complaint came about.

[@Zelkiiro]

Simpler solution: Fuck Mitsuru. Aigis/Koromaru/Akihiko are the only team I need!

[@mads_in_zero]

@@Zelkiiro Simplest Solution: Play Portable and assume direct control of your party members. Goodbye Metis.

[@szymps]

I never played Persona 3, so I don't know if they made party AI better, but in both Persona 4 and 5 I always play with "Act freely" command for allies and they almost always do what I need them to do

[@myyoutubeaccount4167]

The AI in Persona 3 FES is better than the AI in Persona 5 and ESPECIALLY in Persona 4, as you are given much more tactics to work with and the AI is more adamant to stick to those tactics than in the latter games. (It is worth noting the AI in P5 are surprisingly competent in most battles though…) However, success with this system (in P3) is dependent on you as the player having the navigator characters scan every enemy (as it is the navigator’s job to convey to the party members what the enemy’s weaknesses and resistances are, and without this information they tend to make worse decisions in combat), and it is on you as the player to set the party members to the appropriate tactic, before even being able to perform your own actions. Act Freely is usually a good tactic to use in Persona 3 (mostly), but depending on solely this tactic isn’t optimal. I’m sure you’ve seen all the comments saying that Mitsuru spams Marin Karin too much, and that’s because it is within this tactic that she’s most likely to use it, and this problem can be further amplified by not scanning all enemies, as she is more likely to Marin Karin an enemy she doesn’t have the information to, at least in my experience.

[@M4ruta]

* Your daily reminder that somewhere, Lydia is blocking a doorway. *

[@victorribera5796]

Since the beggining I was thinking in FF XII, the hability to change your teammates behaviour to the limit is awesome, and as you said it is completelty well merged with the game, i may spent half an hour managing gambits after a boss destroyed me to get another chance

[@shikitohnoreal7199]

I don't know if this entirely true,cause I haven't played the Portable version,but I've heard being able to control your Party members in Persona 3 makes the game easy.I guess that would make sense as some of the challenge in the game comes from not being able to control your party

[@DesignDoc]

The thing about P3 at least on the normal difficulty is that it's mostly an easy game with a few difficulty spikes in some of the Tartarus boss fights and at the very very end of the Final Boss. It's also a game where you can just get extremely unlucky like getting ambushed by a mob that hits you with the wrong spell. Things can get out of your control very fast and for some, it's extremely frustrating even if it doesn't happen all that often.

[@matts9308]

Rando P3 on the same level of Nocturne... are we talking about the same games? Because nocturne is most definitely much more challenging

[@estekel2]

@Rando I know I can't say much since I didn't play Nocturne, but I don't think P3 is just as hard from what I've heard about Nocturne. Whenever you get stuck in P3 you just need to level up and make stronger personas and you're good to go lol

[@Spearra]

Star Wars Republic Commander in my heart will always be one of the best allies you could ever hope to fight along side in a video game. Those 3 were beasts! For once, your squad actually felt like they were all "elite" and carried their own weight. It really felt like a squad. You put in your work, they put in theirs. They didn't play the game for you, but will be badasses throughout the entire game. Scripted or not.

[@greco-romano9852]

Everyone is going on about Mitsuru casting Marin Karin instead of heal, in life-or-death siuations... *Then you have me over here, playing Persona 3 Portable.*

[@darrylaz3570]

Thank god for adding direct commands for Portable. I can't imagine how much frustration I will had if there's no direct command, especially for the FIRST Persona game I've ever play right now

[@Brumskin.]

*Laughs in controllable party mod for fes*

[@Prince-bt3qs]

Ah yes a fellow intellectual

[@idk-ov9oh]

Yukari:HMMM the mc is dying and junpei is dying, WhAt I GoTtA dO? *heals junpei*

[@yakov9903]

Tales of Xillia would also be a good example of well programmed AI, as you can link your character with another so that you may fight in tandem.

[@sciverzero8197]

I actually had the absolute inverse experience with Persona 3's AI party members. They were usually quite competent if I wasn't incompetent with giving them the right battle plans to begin with. I actually felt like being able to control them in the remake was to the detriment of the game overall. I will always recommend P3 as the very first choice for trying to introduce someone to the franchise.

[@JayAreAitch]

It's almost like most of the people complaining about P3's AI just refused to learn how Tactics work.

[@Yurikon3]

The worst which could happen is that healers get charmed. When that issue is nullified, even unoptimal tactics work.

[@okami_kamkam]

I know of a great AI ally in a game. That being Malroth for Dragon Quest Builders 2. I hear a lot of people complaining that he sucks because hey can’t build stuff like the other NPCS but his role is a bodyguard to the player not a worker. He will help the player in many ways, like teaching new skills, collect certain resources that the player is collecting and will guard the player if attacked by an enemy in his line of sight. People will think he babysits the player or he shouldn’t be the main companion but the reason is all tied to the story which I won’t spoil as it’s a great game that deserves more love and attention among the other builder games.

[@davidgonzalezfernandez6656]

I like how everyone cry about "Mitsuru Marin karin bla bla bla" and noone took the time to select the attack order in the command seccion for her or even turn on the keep commands after battle. Or even worst, ppl didnt scan enemies because they figured a weakness and asume that the squad would know. The game literally has an only support command to use with any of the two healers you are given and still ppl expect the dps guys to use an unreliable diarama instead of a diarahan or mediarahan, if you are not running a healer you must have a persona ready to cover that issue, the fact that someone learns dia/diarama doesnt make it the person in charge of the healing or support. Everyone has roll base on their stats and abilities, not only an element e.g Junpei physical unit (even tho he learns agi moves, he is not meant to deal damage in that way, if you want him to use them is your responsability to select the know down option) Yukari support, Akihiko starts as a hybrid but on endgame becomes special attacker/debuffer and yet ppl doesnt give a crap about team building, runs Mitsuru, Akihiko, Koromaru and then wonders why noone heals the mc

[@ChiefMedicPururu]

People just want the CPU to do all the work.

[@RyanStansberry]

I think the AI is pretty solid! It threw me for a loop when I started playing. I didn't like it at first, because I was used to controlling everyone in the party in typical RPG fashion. I stuck with it though, and figured out how to set things up to get good results I think the people that harp on it the most are the people that just want to micromanage every move they make, because they assume that the AI isn't as efficient as they could be if they had control of everyone

[@pknesstorm2250]

So I have been struggling to play P3 and I'm about 10 hours in, even when Yukari is set to heal and the enemy is scanned, what do I do if she just doesnt heal me and tries to kill an enemy instead? I've had more game overs in this game so far than in my entire playthrough of Nocturne because of her garbage AI

[@davidgonzalezfernandez6656]

@@pknesstorm2250 There are some rules that help to understand the actions to make in P3, 1-the IA Will go for the kill if they have a chance, this can be bad with Yukari as the bow has low hit rate and can cost you a game over 2- The IA will not heal you if you are over a certain percentage that increases as you continue playing, at end game they'll heal anyone that is bellow 65% as hits at this point can be lethal even at 100% 3- speed running to the limit of the month is not a good strat, your first nights on tartarus should be no more than 4 floors (killing everything) and then proceed with caution (BTW you can heal outside battle by checking your abilities or talking with someone with a healing ability, it will cost them sp but characters as Yukari do not spend a lot at the start

[@ashluckhurst2840]

I love the Drachma joke at the part. And so did Skies of Arcadia, clearly, once it gets to the point that the text starts to read "Drachma joined the party...again."

[@MudkipnTreecko]

i'd definitely recommend playing p3 fes on an emulator with the party control mod it's great for people going back from p4 or p5 to play p3 who don't wanna deal with the graphical compromises made in p3p

[@ChiefMedicPururu]

Does this work in The Answer mode too?

[@MudkipnTreecko]

@@ChiefMedicPururu haven't tried it out on the answer yet but it should most likely work

[@CrokeyHigati]

This video reminds me of my play through of Miitopia. You control your main Mii while the rest are just AI controlled. It was kinda annoying at first since some attacks have chances to hit allies or just have a negative effect on allies. All of which can cause them to feud with one another. But the relationship mechanic was an interesting wrinkle to it all. The game is pretty easy to compensate all these random actions but I really wanted the final boss to he so tough all my party members came together and let me controller them for one battle. Heck I would have been happy with a super move that let me control one or more of them. It seems like wasted potential. What better way to show teamwork between friends than having them work together perfectly! Miitopia is a charming Rpg with some surprisingly great music if you ever get the chance to play it. And thanks for the great video guys!

[@feefington]

0:23 This entire sentence hurts me

[@Wrenchy247]

Never have I expected you to talk about Persona and Star Fox in the same video!

[@Ace-tg7ic]

Yo, if you wanna recommend people to P3 but are hesitating based on the AI, you can always try to go for P3 Portable on the PSP. It doesn't have the cutscenes - which are replaced with visual novel-esque dialogue - along with not being able to move around in 3D in the social life part, but it's still v good and you get the bonus of FeMC!

[@JayAreAitch]

Or just tell them to git gud

[@gilagal777]

Nice 'Hip Shop' theme at the end! ;)

[@Inari_the_Fox]

I'm surprised he didn't mention the "tales of" series which has differing ai systems

[@Kalleosini]

It wasn't mentioned in your video but in certain game genres you can take the enemy AI and apply it on your players companion. your players companion will abide by the same rules as the enemies, and will react similarly to them. this way they will have as much impact on combat as an enemy would, and the player should be able to predict its actions as it should be consistent with enemy actions. it is a simple and easy way to ensure that your companion isn't useless while also not outshining your player. but it wont work for any game, so consider if this method conflicts with the vision of your game.

[@EmilXOM]

All I need is my boy Reyn, baby!

[@weshverified]

“Now it’s Reyn Time!”

[@filthyshrek101bc2]

You think you kinda've glossed over Donald and Goofy in kh2, the limits shreds through certain bosses and trinity limit opens it's own strategic benefits like using the Goofy blow attack while in trinity will move enemies caught in a magnet spell and deal huge damage to them. They are pretty customizable in kh2fm which let's the player decide what they think is useful and is a nice feature to have either way. Also if they are provided the correct equipment can survive longer but will still die pretty quickly on higher difficulties. There is also the party switch command which allows you to switch out a party member if you need an extra damage sponge or want to go into something like master form if you are fighting a group of aerial enemies. I just wanted to elaborate on the possibilities with the party members in kh2fm, though since the topic has to do with the ai itself I understand why this wasn't discussed in this great video.

[@DizzyTipsy]

I only clicked on this because I saw my favourite toaster.

[@Brroccoli]

I don't see it mentionned so I'll do it myself. Tales of Vesperia (only one I played but I think the other games too) has THE best A.I I've ever seen, they're extrmely customizable to optimize what their role is, with a few problems like Estelle accidentally clicking the healer job when she actually wanted to be a fighter. But other than that the A.I even recognized some skills like the taunt one, which increases what's basically your limit break gauge which literally makes auto grinding possible. Truly, amazing work

[@-mazio-9440]

lEgo STaR wArS aLLieS

[@yoshifan2334]

Sux0rz 66345 they literally can’t deal damage

[@jdufau2561]

Quite literally the shittiest allies to ever exist.

[@vr8652]

Don't remind me

[@AAhmou]

Screw them... They stand in your way, they can stop you from reaching places, they don't deal damage and at times you can't even find them to switch characters.

[@carprincess]

That FF12 example was interesting. I never played a main line series FF game, but micromanaging your party members with commands seems like such an interesting system.

[@ValterTH10]

Never had any problems with the AI on my 3 playtroughs of P3FES. Specially after unlocking the Knock Down tactic. Made the game a pushover.

[@jp754]

If P3 will ever have a remake then they should keep the AI controlled party members and have an option to directly control a member when you reach a certain level in their social link. I think this makes sense since a member would most likely put more trust in a good friend than a blue-haired emo boi with zero self-preservation(and would give more incentive to max social stats)

[@JayAreAitch]

Actually a pretty interesting compromise, but of course there's the issue that party member S links don't exist like they do in P4 and 5.

[@DarkNoremaC]

I feel like the Persona 3 part could have been handled better; it seems like you just threw the game under the bus needlessly in an already good video, it doesn't service your discussion and it seems like you just brought it in as an example of bad design just because you seemingly didn't understand it and attributed the defeats as just bad design. P3 has as much control over the party members as any other games, it's just the means by which you control them is very indirect but fairly intuitive, more intuitive than the KH examples and better utilised to boot. And that's the weirdest part, KHs party members and P3s have such similar design yet one is praised and one is scrutinised for very similar reasons, like not letting the player control them or for getting a game over when the main character dies? In fact P3 does the same idea several times better with the ability to change party settings mid battle and gets much better milage and rewards from every party member pulling their weight, you're right that you can't change settings when you get knocked down, but that's not on the game; that's on you getting knocked down in the first place and functions as an appropriate reasonable punishment (of course a team would fall apart or can't adapt properly if their Leader gets put down). That and there are abilities characters can learn that can help your character up again (ideally before your turn cycle appears) and your party using that move depends on what you set them to do(can even play into getting knocked down or set someone to help you up just incase). So there are options here and ways to work around this, where as KH doesn't let you change the party settings mid-combat at all, but then you never need to; which is a problem of the design itself. P3 calls for you to explore the AI functionality and settings because the player can't win every battle with their basic options, KH3 and other KH games rarely need to call for party support as you don't need them, you can beat the game by never giving your party any items or changing their AI settings and that's what makes KHs party feel less like a functioning team and more like a single hyper competent dude and some guys who can't do anything by themselves short of give you items at vague unspecific moments mid battle. P3 gives you the true responsibilities of being a party leader as well as all the consequences of failing to lead your team, which manifests as these seemingly uncontrollable circumstances that just looks like bad design when really the player just needed to account for or approach differently. Any leader can just blame it all on their team mates when something goes wrong and I feel that working through P3 and its systems helps build a more responsible character that i've seen no game ask of their player. P3 asks you to learn the systems and more about your party members systems and mechanical functions, I distinctly remember a party member told me about one of their commands when I talked to them in the dorm early on and really that seemed like such a simple and real way to learn about a function and fitting considering what the game wanted from me, which was to learn how to be a leader and meant getting to know my team mates among other things. Similarly more information about the games mechanics are littered through the early game dormitories dialogue you can initiate... that or you can just test the options and figure out their in game utility. "Knock down" settings is probably the best setting in the game in that regard; along with "heal/support" and "standby" if you look into the turn order; there's a video about defeating the reaper in P3 which has the player loop the boss indefinitely and illustrates that strong effective control of the AI and the systems that this video rather lazily claims P3 lacks. Atlus and many fans recognise this and the developers have made sure to include the option to choose command based AI controls, granted those games do even less to teach you about the system and don't utilise those AI features as well as P3 did.

[@badcar33]

I really appreciate this comment honestly. I feel a lot of people give P3 an unnecessarily bad rap for this when I'm kinda prefer it. I prefer feeling like I'm leading a team rather than mid controlling my whole team

[@dococarneiro3250]

This ^. Ty for this comment

[@giant9289]

I love Persona 3 but objectively not controlling your party(along with the repetetive level design of Tartarus) is by far the biggest flaw of the game, and it's unexcusable considering that Nocturne e DDS came before it and had a full controllable party. Even if it had a perfect AI(and it hasn't) it would still remain a huge limit for combat of the game.

[@DarkNoremaC]

@@giant9289 This doesn't seem to have much to do with my own case; you're better off making this a stand alone comment. I've already made my case that you infact do have control over your party objectively with the tactics menu and scanning. You might mean you want manual control over your party which is more a preference thing, as Objectively plenty of games like KH or FFXII function just fine with AI support that are notably well praised within this video. FFXII is actually relevant to the preference thing since the Design Doc guy only really references the gambit/Ai system of that game instead of the manual control options that are present in the game. I originally took this to mean that manual wasn't optimal but then the video is about AI party members in games. So all these comments about P3 being inferior for having AI instead of manual inputs in general seems irrelevant when the video brings up examples of strong use of AI party members and P3 is no exception. The discussion of wether you prefer AI party members of P3 or manual control of P3P is one of preference and is somewhat irrelevant. P3's level design has nothing to do with this video or discussion, I for one like the Level design as it reminded me of big RPG challenges like the 100 floor mountain in Pokemon Colosseum; in fact its better than that since the levels are different every time even on retreads, have midbosses and several special stages and opponents. I've played through P3 6 times all on the hardest difficulty, twice on PS2 and 4 times on PSP and never once had a problem with Tartarus given how well paced and structured its difficulty is; as it's pretty easy to over level in tartarus segments. It's also good to have all the grind and progression of the game limited to a single area as I never got confused as to where I needed to go like I could in P1 or 2 as I just needed to go up tartarus as much as I could to keep up to the expected level range and I liked not having to wonder if I was strong enough to face the next boss, say what you will about Tartarus, but it's a brilliant way to pace and regulate the players progression/experience and level. Your comment reads more like an opinion piece even when you say things like objectively. I mean that's all my comments ever were for more ambiguous things like "making you feel like a leader" but even within my empty statements and opinions I felt I had a reason to think that. I don't see why you think P3 is bad because its party control scheme is unconventional(when its really not) or why you think the environment repetition in P3 is bad, maybe if you were talking about P5s Mementos then i'd agree with you about the repetition and disengaging progression/challenge through it. Pretty sure all RPGs have some degree of repetition involved.

[@doorprince3760]

Literally only clicked on this video to make sure this opinion was expressed *somewhere* in here. Very good comment, might start linking this as my go-to defense on P3’s AI.

[@CardCaptorDeadpool]

I'm not sure if you've ever played it but the fourth Ratchet and Clank game: Ratchet Deadlocked heavily featured two companion robots you took with you throughout the game and they were fairly handy. There was a weird design choice where you could upgrade them periodically and the upgrades improved their AI functionality. Basically gave them more scripts to act off of and made them more responsive towards enemy AIs. In terms of how they integrated with gameplay and became effective. Initially they were supposed to have legs and run around with you but they wound up getting in the way, died too much and got caught in walls. This was changed in the final version. Aesthetically to work against this, the AI robots were designed to not have legs and have rockets for lower abdomens instead. The idea was to give them extra verticality, make it harder for them to hit, and if they hit off walls they'd just fly up them and it wouldn't look too weird. As companions they have minimal features at first, they die easily and they only have one laser gun. But by the end of the game they get a lot more effective, are able to dynamically decide between mid, short, and long range attacks. Do solid chip damage. Listen to player commands via D pad inputs (they really only have 3 that actually do anything but they're good to have) and have good audio and visual feedback. They light up and make mechanical noises as an acknowledgement they listened to a D pad command. They light up and telegraph if they're being shoot, close to death, or wholly become inoperable.

[@catthefanatic5551]

I see my toaster wife,,,, ✨👏👏👏

[@seasaltsky]

I'm straight up wondering if you were joking when you said KH1 party members didn't deal enough damage later on, cause Goofy's Tornado ability is fucking ridiculous, to the point that when watching a KH1 Randomizer video, the dude didn't equip MP Gift on Goofy 'cause he wanted him to use all his MP on Tornado, which did more damage than Sora despite having Ars Arcanum and a 19 strength weapon. Also, one time during Hades cup, I was looking at my phone and forgot to pause the game, and Donald just casted Thundaga and everything in front of me was dead.

[@SianaGearz]

But if you have great powerful AI allies, how do you make a game that doesn't essentially play itself without or with minimal input?

[@icarue993]

One idea is to have a lot of enemies. That way you can hack away anyway (this can work in shooters and hacknslash). Or have enemies resistant to the strong AI elements while weak to yours (if it doesn't go against the narrative).

[@hockeater]

Increase enemy danger such that you NEED or at least appreciate the help. If you're giving me helpers, make them real, and the situation something I wouldn't want to do alone.

[@DecimusYna]

hockeater Can't say it better myself. Thank you! :)

[@stevethepocket]

A good example of making support characters important by just ramping up the enemy count, consider the _Left 4 Dead_ games. They're designed to need three or four players alive and competent to get through the huge mobs of zombies, and "single player" mode just replaces all three of the others with bots. They can shoot their way through the horde and target miniboss zombies just fine, maybe even better than a human, but can't use grenades or activate the noisy doors and gates because those are strategic decisions and should be left up to the player. Both to keep the player from feeling like just a foot soldier, and also because the AI probably wasn't advanced enough to make those choices effectively.

[@DaSquareful]

The NPCs in EDF are really nice as they dont do enough damage to take out many enemies but enough to thin them out, they support you and have large enough health pools to spread out the enemy attack pattern other wise it becomes a big struggle to not be overrun.

[@ShirakoriMio]

Tales of Series is a masterclass in how to customize AI and make good party members. Early on, they're helpful, and later on, you can either turn them off or remove them completely to keep them from interfering with huge combos.

[@JakobLogan]

The party leader fainting being a lose condition is one of the reasons I dont like the persona series. If other chars can be revived with spells and items during combat then the lose condition should ONLY be when all party members are knocked out.

[@rekamanton430]

Dammit, I've been watching this at work while doing some menial stuff because you're interesting and entertaining without making me laugh out loud like a lot of other content I consume does, but I giggled when you played the "this might be a good spot to find some ingredients" line xD

[@roccosmos1913]

persona 3 portable gets rid of everything stupid battle mechanic in p3 console versions. you can control your allies, getting knockdown once doesnt gets rid of your turn and so on. also you can play as a female protaginest it doesnt have "the answer" proper sequal to the original story in persona 3 fes... it surely doesnt needed to has... i just recommend watch it over internet... because playing it can lead to ruin up your games effect on you...

[@jr5715]

But the games bosses were somewhat designrd around uncontrollable allies so some parts of the game a extrimly easy with certain charcters

[@dragonpencil4131]

This is a nice and interesting video. There is also an old game where one of the five allies is an IA controlled character in a turned based RPG. Lunar Eternal Blue. It's kinda like Persona 3, but there is a few differences. *Probably some spoilers* I think it works better in this game compared to Persona 3 since the AI is only on one of the five teammates you make in the game, he has no limit of MP and her behavior evolve during the story. She is not very useful at the beginning of the game since she will often choose to ran away from the fight, stand away from the enemies and only attack if they are close to her. Later on, she is much more proactive in the game. She will also focus more her healing spells on the main characters because of their relationship they develop during the story.

[@IanThunderbolt]

You just need to get better at Persona 3, The PS2 release is really not that hard. Portable is much easier on the same difficulties because the encounters were designed around AI control and the Manual control option makes the game a lot easier than intended

[@Amarganeitor]

Too easy IMO, I wouldn't recommend playing P3P because of that reason AND all the butchering that was donde to the game in exchange for manual control and FeMC. That's why P3FES is so far the best P3 release, again IMO.

[@danwithaplan3742]

With Media Molecule's Dreams releasing sometime this year (barring any unforeseen delays) this video is a perfect quick guide to A.I. that will help people get a general idea of what needs to be considered in programming autonomous entities, be they ally or foe

[@XenoflareBahamut]

Persona 3 Portable exists and you can control your party members

[@ichlalsulbulqiah1974]

But for me because of that the game become too easy even at maniac mode, at least for me :\ but if people really hate about AI in P3 Original, P3P can be a solution

[@justascarecrow6988]

Yeah, your Buddy-Aces in Ace Combat 7 really are just decoration. At least they are not getting in your way though. Think of them as flying radios, delivering you lore and banter while sometimes making crucial callouts.