Destination Europe: Can Migration be Controlled? | To The Point

Migration to Europe is once again surging. EU authorities reported 133,000 irregular border crossings last year - the highest number since 2016. Most of those fleeing seek to come by sea.
Two recent shipwrecks in the Mediterranean attest to the peril they face. The deaths have provoked harsh criticism of Europe’s broken policy - yet some leaders want to crackdown harder.
The UK, for example, will pay France more than half a billion Euros to stop illegal crossing of the English Channel. Yet at the same time, countries facing urgent labor shortages - like Germany - want to create more legal pathways for skilled migrants.
Chapters:
00:00 Intro
01:30 What’s driving migrants to make the perilous crossing to Europe?
03:00 Is Russia using migrants as weapons to undermine Europe?
04:00 Could this become a crisis similar to the mass influx of 2015?
06:00 The contradictory faces of EU migration
07:50 Open door for Ukrainians, closed gates for the rest: is racism the reason?
10:50 Can Europe slow down the growing influx of refugees?
12:10 Does the rise of right-wing governments make solutions tougher?
13:30 Do countries of origin have an obligation to hold back migrants?
16:00 Long term solutions for short term pressures?
18:00 Is the UK -France deal a solution?
19:10 A better plan for French-British cooperation
20:30 Would more deportation change the situation in Europe
22:40 A shift in policy toward skilled migration
24:00 Can Europe control migration without betraying its values?
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[@johnlesoudeur3653]

Here we go again about using the term Far Right. Racism is now a term directed at people who want to live and work with people who share a similar culture predominantly.

[@janiekcarney5482]

It’s the large numbers of immigrants that is the problem. Countries can care for a few people at a time but not thousands in one year.

[@larsthorwald3338]

It's a classic "tragedy of the commons" situation; if you don't limit immigration, you risk losing the very things that make European states attractive to immigrants.

[@MaTara01]

Europe and Europeans have to address honestly the fact that their prosperity is built on centuries of colonisation and exploitation of non - Europeans all around the world. They went all over the world looting, pillaging, raping, killing and destroying native peoples, cultures and habitats. It's perverse of Europeans to either talk about restricting immigration to the EU or about safeguarding either human rights or environmental rights.

[@rizkyadiyanto7922]

@@relaxhere97 back then they imported slaves. now the slaves are coming to them in their own will.

[@Western_Decline]

I found the inbred Whyyte racists

[@xr2kid]

Actually this isn't a tragedy of the commons situation because Europe is getting Older and dying off. You need immigrants in some sort of a mass immigration or you go into an Eastern Europe/Japan death spiral. Tragedy of the Commons would be more app for a nation like Mali where women have almost 7 kids and imagine a country like Mali receiving 1 million immigrants in one year while the natural population is exploding. That's a Tragedy of the Commons situation.

[@focast1825]

@@rizkyadiyanto7922 😅

[@parkgumstef5206]

Answer: Yes, ask australia, new zealand, japan, south korea or china about it. We should promote more students, worker visa and tell them to not come ilegalll cuz they will be deported inmediately

[@Mandingobull]

Those countries you mentioned are all islands, excluding communist China. Of course immigration is controlled in an island 😂

[@YSColin]

Or Trump America..

[@pauljohnson1664]

@@YSColin Or your cult.

[@blueocean9884]

@@asap_krypto what makes them "great"?

[@vladnickul]

@@blueocean9884 being the opposite of China :) Not having reeducation centers is a thing... elections is another.

[@ursulenes7465]

The question on why EU members have had a different approach to those 5 millions Ukrainians that fled their country has a very simple answer. For hundreds of years, we (the European nations) have shared (more or less) the same geographical space, roots, history, myths, beliefs and values with the Ukrainians. For us the Ukrainians (as any other European nation) are the neighbors from the next door or from down the street. You say hello to them, exchange a recipe, borrow or lend a ladder, watch the kids playing together, talk about weather or last film seen on Netflix, agree with them that our street association could have done better on whatever it does and that's it. But, when their house is on fire you don't just look.. you rush out of your house and help them. In the end, good or bad he is you neighbor from you street not just a stranger from far away. People from Africa or Middle East (as a whole) are so far and so different than what is "normal" for us that our social brain doesn't know how to "get" them. It's not xenophobia or racism, it's just how it is.

[@garethbuckeridge6910]

There is another reality too. In the case of Ukraine, the men have stopped behind to fight while the women & children have seeked refuge in neighbouring countries. In the case of the middle east, the men say that they are fleeing war (rather than stopping behind to fight) while leaving their women & children behind.

[@theongray8313]

@@garethbuckeridge6910 There is another reality too , the west provides weapons to terrorist in the middle east. They arm rebels in Africans countries and these rebels with the weapons of the west consequently kill civilians. Then a vicious cycle of killing goes on and on rebels versus other civilian groups etc. etc. This is why France didn't solve any problems in countries like MALI but made issues worse. Every action has consequences. Also not all men stayed in Ukraine to fight some left the country. and not every Europeans is happy about this. some of them would rather peace than war and for Ukrainians to return to their homeland.

[@alekdemj]

@@theongray8313 The same is happening with Ukraine now - the west provides weapons to terrorist Ukrainian government and normal Ukrainian civilians are dying and those who can fleet to west. The war was started back in 2014 when Ukrainian government was captured by ultra nationalist junta.

[@CHMichael]

It's your neighbor asking to use your phone or some guy you have never seen before.

[@jerloxcool6671]

Also its not some abstrakt civil conflict in middle of Africa is war with Russia. This has deep historic roots acros whole Europe.

[@christopheklinger3217]

Too much people, too big cities, too many cars, to much concrete, too much pollution, Europe is FULL

[@chalgoode6449]

STOP.INVADING.POOR.COUNTRIES.

[@thesixth2330]

The BIAS of this conversation is insane. DW, you never cease to Amaze me... Maybe one time, just once, have a difference of opinion. It really makes things much better than trying to indoctrinate your viewers with your own political beliefs.

[@Jasnogorodskij]

There's a clear demographic pattern regarding immigrant influx coming from the global south: Young, mostly undereducated men. Why is nobody mentioning this? Are they somehow more affected by hunger, war and climate change than women and elderly?

[@chalgoode6449]

Europe is at a crux. Either Europe stops invading the "global south" and stealing from it, or continue to be flooded by the victims of European encroachment/"dominance". Its simple

[@janiekcarney5482]

There are a lot of countries in the World. Why pick on the EU?? Go somewhere else.

[@janiekcarney5482]

Each Country should be able to decide on a certain number of people they can help. After that, they need to be flown to another country at the tip of Africa. That will make them think twice about getting into a boat.

[@wilhelmvanbabbenburg8443]

"does it boils down to racism?" "that is too simplistic... But yes" basically. The question is, why would highly qualified people would want to come to Europe?

[@Crashed131963]

To avoid the Russian draft.

[@janesmy6267]

They’re happy to pay cuts because the cost of living is lower in Europe and there are employee rights

[@wilhelmvanbabbenburg8443]

@@kreight_ depends... Life as a foreigner in Europe is not easy. Life in other countries, although not rich, can be easier because, as a well qualified person, you have access to services that make life much nicer, albeit maybe not soooo save as in Europe.

[@sadoka]

“It’s not racism, they are like us!” The very definition of racism 😂… And this irony was not lost on the rest of the world. Shows how the Westerners see the rest of the world. The whole of Europe is suddenly swallowing Victor Orban’s line of reasoning today and acts like it is normal. While only a few years ago, they all were convinced that he was racist to the bone with this reasoning…

[@juniorrokudevelopertutoria3734]

Culture and race are different things.

[@janiekcarney5482]

I think Australia has exactly the right solution.

[@thesixth2330]

And DW claims that Ukrainians were racist to African students was also bogus. Turns out when your filling trains wit children. mothers, and the elderly, young men and women of good health enrolled in college aren't the first priority for trains leaving a war zone. But I get it, the world should revolve around anyone DW says it should at that moment. LOL

[@janiekcarney5482]

The only thing this one man can say is “that won’t work.” He wants the World to fix these poor countries. That’s not possible!!!

[@narkelnaru2710]

Gerald Knaus prove himself to be the most knowledgeable and effective guest. _IF WHAT HE SAYS IS TRUE_ then I'm afraid everybody else is missing the point on how to solve the problem. I hope those in decision-making positions will pay heed to his opinions and address the present situation using his methods. An excellent discussion. Thank you. (I always look forward to this programme every week. It is one of the best on KZbin.)

[@jta2b]

This was a fantastic conversation! We look forward to more. Thank you!

[@cinpeace353]

Less intervention to other countries, create a stable environment for growth. Peace and common prosperity is the way to go.

[@WaveRider1989]

Corruption is also an issue. That can be solved by intervention. African nations don't have good leaders

[@narkelnaru2710]

​@@WaveRider1989 Don't forget the corruption in the advanced nations that causes the leaders in Africa to become corrupt in the first place. Yes, China is a new entrant in the game of corruption. But Westerners have been the leaders in providing the incentive and avenues for others to become corrupt.

[@MaTara01]

@@WaveRider1989 You think European countries have good leaders? You think there isn't any corruption in European institutions or companies?

[@Western_Decline]

@@WaveRider1989 the West doesn’t have good leaders

[@Thomas.Deverell]

Regardless of everything that has been discussed I'll just say that there is nothing more cruel and inhumane than not giving asylum to LGBTQ people, who are the most vulnerable and persecuted minoritiy.

[@caravanstuff2827]

No migration is good migration!!.♥️🇬🇧

[@Nehas949]

Saying Britisher who live freely india for 200yrs loots all our wealth artifect jewellery and destroy our country 😂😂😂cry about those who go paying for visa other stuff.

[@drvian5660]

"Can Migration be Controlled?" (c) I have two words for you: *North Korea*

[@nothingisthatsimple]

"These are people like us"

[@pauljsm]

Yes! Can she listen to herself?

[@user-zz8lb6bd7p]

Let's hope it can be controlled before the Europeans loose faith about the positives in immigration and the backlash brings us back to 1940s...

[@soloperformer5598]

Don't knock the 40s, someone had it right.

[@robertoalex4245]

What are the positives of migration ? So far we see surges of rape, theft and murder

[@ianvandyke3996]

I can't wait

[@MaTara01]

The entitled Europeans have forgotten that every civilisation comes to an end. Demographic decline, the barbarian hordes from poor countries and ruthless competition from emerging global South countries will make sure that European dominance is over for good in the coming decades.

[@globalpropertyinvestment]

@@MaTara01 you sound happy at that prospect, of course you do as you all hate us yet want to live in our nations and enjoy our inventions - don't gloat too soon - without Europe the World will be a darker place.

[@adrienwtz9908]

Why don't they go to UAE or Dubai? They are wealthy than EU and share similar culture with this immigrants. I agree for EU to strictly control their border.

[@adrianosousamendes2948]

How DW does a debate: put everybody from extreme left together to debate how to find a solution... It is a joke...

[@janiekcarney5482]

Of course they want to go to the richest countries!!! They don’t stop once they are safe. They keep going to richest country.

[@janiekcarney5482]

I agree with Italy and Greece. They are over run with people who can not care for themselves. The other countries in the EU are not helping their share.

[@martins3885]

Start doing pushbacks like we do in Poland and Baltic states.

[@juniorrokudevelopertutoria3734]

In 2014-15 nobody gave asylum to Ukrainians. We had to get working visas in Poland and Latvia. Make Africa do the same.

[@Crashed131963]

Had to shut off when they call them *Irregular Immigrants* Like calling a home burglar a irregular house guess.

[@soloperformer5598]

With the options open to the UK there is no such thing as "good immigration".

[@narkelnaru2710]

Did you hear what Gerald Knaus and the lady from The Economist said ? If they are right, then you are wrong.

[@soloperformer5598]

@@narkelnaru2710 Maybe they're not right.

[@torturedsoul8066]

What is the purpose of allowing migration? For the nation to become overpopulated? My point is that if you allow migration to the E.U. they need to rotate back out at some point or it will collapse the economy like we see in the middle east. To many people and not enough jobs overloads the system of government until they simply cant do it anymore. Someone has to work to support the social programs. So if you allow people in the train the to support themselves by giving them a job skill they can use when they are sent back. A butcher, baker and candlestick maker (electricians). Train them in proper building techniques so they can rebuild their own countries. The best way to help them is to give them the ability to help themselves.

[@kicksomeup6998]

Actually, immigrants create more jobs cause they buy more stuff, work for those businesses and also found new businesses. Every single study from there has shown that, even the recent one from right-wing Heritage foundation. More legal, skilled immigration is something both left and right-wingers agree on. As far as overcrowding and the damage to the environment is concerned, yes that is a legitimate concern. But the idea is if one focuses on quality over quantity that too, can be minimized. That's why nations prefer high-value, high-income, highly-educated immigrants to get the best bang for their proverbial 'buck'(ie, space in their country).

[@AizenIsKubo]

Thats a misleading comment. Uncontrolled migration doesn't lead to that. This is dangerous.

[@drmodestoesq]

@@kicksomeup6998 High skilled immigrants impact the salaries of native born high skilled employees. Why pay an American citizen 100k year when you can replace him with two high skilled immigrants for 50k a year?

[@WaveRider1989]

​@drmodestoesq high skill immigrants will demand money too because cost of living is the same. Like IT professionals from India make good money in the US. US didn't have enough IT professionals to fill the positions.

[@contemplatinggod2791]

Until the world decides to make everywhere livable whereever they are. Migration has only just began. All the extortions and allowing governments across the world to be corrupt by indulging them one way or another will haunt everybody in the end.

[@janiekcarney5482]

They have no right to come without permission. They are not welcome.

[@adrianosousamendes2948]

What drives the people? The expectation of receiving free money and free housing. In Africa, 400 dollars is equivalente a one year of work...

[@Stickleback]

build sea forts along the channel with patrol boats on the ready to divert unwanted long stay guests on boats. about 6 in a line about 1 mile apart going through the English Channel, might help stop them.

[@nick00176]

Illegally immigration in EU coming through turkey or Greece

[@jta2b]

@Rishe Sunak, are your parents not immigrants to the UK? This deal with France is not the solution.

[@donnabeuth3193]

Also, no continent can absorb another,poorer continent. It's just not possible. And being poor, while awful and humans are living in unimaginable poverty, it's down to their corrupt governments, not other governments although the UK w EU give billions in aid. They must be tackled. It's also about population and culture. Why have 8 kids who will live in misery when you can't feed yourself?

[@thomasthomasphilp4393]

If there were no British colonization and migration, Rishi Sunak will not become PM of UK. This is Karma

[@Nehas949]

He didn't do what Churchill bigo@# was doing,Britisher facing starvation hunger he building warm swimming Pool atleast he using own money not stealing from Britisher as tax😂😂

[@aaronsingh8823]

did the first dude say pressure or pleasure?

[@zhaoxiaomin8387]

It's pressure, use your brain - hes speaking about a hardship.

[@FilipChilyan]

@@zhaoxiaomin8387 he asked a simple question, no need to diss him like that.

[@janiekcarney5482]

We need to change the laws. They are outdated

[@Nehas949]

I don't think indian likely to go Europe,it English speaking countries bcz 6-7 time more salary bcz doller rate different. Uk australia Canada usa is not Europe.

[@hughfranklin4002]

We don't have any friends across the channel. We should sink the small boats, we wouldn't have to sink many before they stop.

[@bobrobertson9547]

Why does everyone want to come to Europe? We know why. A better life, I get that. The problem is religion and cultural integration.

[@phoenixhenson3689]

Classic Europe! ALWAYS divided

[@adrianosousamendes2948]

Rwanda is a beautiful and safe country. I spend my vacations there and love it. Great people, great food...

[@janiekcarney5482]

France and Germany have more land than the UK.

[@ionagibbons9906]

I think the mistake has been to constantly see the destabilisation of home countries as too complex to fix too difficult to make a meaningful change. If the global leadership don’t believe they are capable of making meaningful change then they have to accept the next outcome which is mass global population displacement. If you are kicking aside the hard stuff into the long grass ie climate change war famine regime change then the consequences of doing that is dealing with the effects of population increases to other countries. But if you don’t priorités population movement as a top global emergency priority that issue is only going to increase population movement so it cannot come as a surprise to Europe that the movement of people across the globe will rise every year. Equally the birth rate in Europe is dropping as a trend and the amount of people in the workforce who are over 50 years old in the U.K. and low work force numbers in Germany and France and USA as a Western population change trend means opportunities for new people to be part of the work force is available. Again this needs global leaders coming together to manage population trends and movements and enable safe routes and work visas and manage community integration. The Chancellor of Germany has recognised that immigration is needed economically in their country and they have adjusted residence parameters to facilitate a full employment workforce population. However, the planet cannot be allowed to be split into two sides where one half is allowed to become war and famine ravaged and allowed to sink into poverty and brokenness while increased wealth exists in the other side of the planet. This is not recognising that we exist as a specie on the same one earth and need to invest in our one earth with as much single mindedness as we do when we want to create business. But the business for now and the future needs to be peace and stabilisation as all trends including economic forces in the West are trending towards volatility. Preserving peace and safe global movement and trade routes is something that requires a mind set of harmonisation this can only be realised by our global leadership.

[@mariatsarmpou6267]

Well presented 👏

[@analyticalmindset]

China is the only leader even attempting social Harmony

[@basedbavarian338]

just CLOSE THE BORDERS!

[@drmodestoesq]

That would take political will. And that is in short supply.

[@user-zz8lb6bd7p]

Merkels decision in 2014 is what tipped the scale on the Brexit vote. Did she do it on purpose or why did she go in alone to get rid of a vocal competitor?

[@vladnickul]

We can. if we decide in what countries in the union to receive them. And by that I mean every country will receive the same number of people, and the people will not decide in what country they will go. It is racist not to want for neighbors criminals? Not to want to pay for people that do not want to be europeans?

[@martins3885]

No forced quotas!!!!!!

[@vladnickul]

@@martins3885 Think of them as shared responsibilities my racist friend.

[@jta2b]

It is not too simplistic. It is racism.

[@nefertitib4313]

“People like us” 😂 at least she is honest!

[@AizenIsKubo]

I support the Ukranians but even they should be going back after the war.

[@MaTara01]

They won't be going back. Ukraine is pretty much finished for the next two decades.

[@janiekcarney5482]

If you court the skilled people, than that country will only have unskilled people left.

[@venatorclass9334]

This is what happens with Diversity Especially from poor countries Our politicians want easy votes Isn't that why the democrats let people in from Mexico ?

[@ellojallowjallow1734]

Migration started from creation, so I don't think nobody can stop what started when you're not burn

[@israeldegaga371]

since being created human life full of migration today modern periods too

[@user-ry2qs7xf9k]

Solution1:Europeans have to become poor. Solution2:Europeans should help poor nations to develop their economies.

[@thomasthomasphilp4393]

Namibians must also have asked why there were Germans in their country. It applies to most former colonies of Europa

[@thatlittlevoice6354]

Good migration?

[@CHMichael]

Any male between 18 and 35 get a rifle and a bus ticket to Ukraine

[@gijane2cantwaittoseeyou203]

Thats why Europe is failing. To much immigration talks and less on innovation.

[@gmanonDominicana]

Anti-colonization sentiments are not anti-European. People do like Europeans as people, but not as masters. What people reject is the discrimination people face even within their own land. Europeans had seen natural to own other people's land, laws and even people' bodies and many still refuse to recognize it and instead keep sounding alarms of persecution towards themselves.

[@sandorszuts3471]

Good luck Germans! 40% of the children in your schools are foreign and an interpreter is needed for parent-teacher conferences. What do you expect in 20 years?

[@MaTara01]

Inshallah the Germans will be speaking Arabic!

[@pauljohnson1664]

Civil war will come to Europe. It,s going to be a blood bath. It will start in France.

[@MaTara01]

@@relaxhere97 thanks!

[@thomasthomasphilp4393]

People in former British empire whose forefathers went to colonize and exploit former colonies, are complaining about immigration. 😂

[@youtindia]

Lost it at "They are people like us" 😂

[@DanielVen-fy7or]

You know what she meant stop exaggeration ,you knew that she meant the similarity between cultures....

[@youtindia]

@@DanielVen-fy7or She literally pointed to her face

[@MaTara01]

It is best if Europeans decide to see the writing on the wall - take a haircut viz a viz, your incomes, pensions and lifestyles, i. e., become poorer, because ever - increasing prosperity, without any negative consequences is a total myth. Europe becomes poor, nobody will come to Europe, rather there might be the lovely prospect of Europeans seeking refuge in affluent Saudi Arabia or Kuwait!

[@user-ou5et3fo3z]

I coming 🛶🛶

[@connorsamler3207]

Prpoganda

[@Ivan-fs7go]

I can explain you the issue. You are buying a kilo of tomato let’s say in a store for 3 eur. You bought those from Morocco for 0.10 euro. Now the producers are coming for the difference. You exploit people they exploit you system in exchange.

[@MaTara01]

Brilliant!

[@voyd1507]

The best option is: "Herzlich Willkommen" to Germany

[@user-mg5hu7qm2k]

你聽見人民痛苦的哀嚎嗎 18%中國青年人沒工作沒收入嗎?

[@kaushikchoudhary1512]

Its about time that europian countries face the consequences of causing trouble in other countries.

[@warbler1984]

As an Irish person I note that we were colonised and did not have an empire. Yet we have the same problems

[@nevashgabber8683]

Germany refused to hold the Fencing World Cup because of Russia

[@juanpedro4517]

Fick Israel vara med och fäktas?

[@ripplingeffect9339]

"These are people like us" 6:40 Yet, she denies racism in European immigration policies

[@MaTara01]

I agree. As an Indian woman, let me be openly racist and say that I feel more at home with people who look like me, eat like me, live like me and pray like me.

[@hoti47]

It's not racism being comfortable with people sharing the same values and traditions.

[@MaTara01]

@@hoti47 what is it then?

[@hoti47]

@@MaTara01 I think it's human nature. People are always cautious about new and unknown stuff. New things, whether good or bad, can take us out of the comfort zone, and make us to not feel comfortable. What do you think about it?

[@RoadstersRegistry]

She said it THEY'RE LIKE US

[@williamsonyekachi8583]

is a big resize

[@EA00000]

Germany can take all a!

[@MaTara01]

And then think of a final solution for everyone after three decades.