New Solution to the Fermi Paradox Found. Scientists Hope They're Wrong

New Solution to the Fermi Paradox Found. Scientists Hope They're Wrong
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Some call it The Great Silence, others The Fermi Paradox.
For the last 60 years, we’ve had our eyes and ears glued to the cosmos looking and listening for some sign letting us know we’re not all alone in the galaxy. And the more we discover, the harder it is to believe we’re the only ones.
Think about this for a moment; there’s around 2 trillion [2,000,000,000,000 galaxies] galaxies in the observable universe. Each one of those galaxies have on average 100 million stars. Some supergiants have one hundred trillion stars, and our Milky Way Galaxy has between 100 to 400 billion stars alone. It is likely that there’s at least this many planets floating around all those stars, and complex planetary systems that may resemble our own Solar System.
It brings us to the big question: where is everyone, and why haven’t we been contacted by an extra-terrestrial civilization from even inside our own galaxy? There should be many advanced civilizations out there, and we should have heard something from someone by now.
There are quite a few possible explanations for the ‘Great Silence’, and some researchers think they may have found some answers to this so-called paradox.
What will happen to humanity in the future? Will we finally make contact with another alien civilization, or are we simply alone in the universe?
Will artificial intelligence end up destroying us and other advanced civilizations, or is there a chilling possibility that AI has already done this?
Get ready to find out this and more.
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Sources: pastebin.com/raw/9yEVfKDY

[@PaulClipMaster]

When you consider the age and size of the universe.. we haven't been looking long enough to assume anything.

[@davidhunternyc1]

True, Hubble and Webb are but new creations on the scale of invention.

[@madebymonkeys5641]

If we could transport ourselves instantly to the other side of the galaxy, then look back at earth, we would see mastodon, saber toothed tigers, giant sloths, and man kind would exist (homo sapiens, not others such as neanderthal) only in the rift Valley in East Africa. Not lights, cars, radio waves would not reach you for another 100 thousand years. The night sky is an illusion, a time capsule that will have changed much in the time passed.

[@markthompson4859]

Agreed. We need to think and act in a non-linear fashion.

[@anthonytheiss1296]

And your own statement is a guess real proof of age is only written history,and don't say carbon dating, if I buried a metal nut for a week two dots of rust or lack of carbon from new ,then a year I get 100 dots of rust and X amount of loss carbon, then I use those two calculations to say a piece of metal is how old due to my little real time experiment .that's carbon dating lol

[@vincentzhou-zm1cm]

The answer is under our noses 1st the world governments will have to be transparent in the spread of information then all of our questions will be answered

[@durbeckvonwyman3557]

I read a short story way back in my teens called “All the Way Back” by Michael Shaara. In the story it turns out that we live in a region of the galaxy called the Great Desert. None of the other suns in our galactic neighborhood have planets, so alien races outside the Great Desert have not come our way because no one thought there was any chance of a civilization being here. In the story, that turns out to be a good thing. I won’t give away the ending and ruin the story for those who want to read it.

[@alishah951]

thank u for sharing this nice piece of information and not ruining the end

[@cinemartin3530]

Thank you for suggesting an interesting read !

[@ISMAILOMAR_ISH3000]

Thanks...will look for this...

[@nwzz2916]

Sounds like a cool story, though the reality is there are millions of planets and suns like ours. IMO it's because Jesus/The Bible is the truth. We're in Gods simulation simply put. There are no aliens. Just God, Angels, Demons, Humans.

[@munkeyinspace5331]

“The three body problem” may be similar

[@DoomFinger511]

Our search for aliens with our current technology is equivalent to looking out into the ocean with a telescope and wondering why there are no other humans on Earth.

[@anonp2958]

Explain your thought process here.

[@DoomFinger511]

@anonp2958 we have barely pierced the veil of what is visible in the galaxy or universe. You wouldn't be able to see all the civilizations of the Americans by looking out into the oceans from the Europe. We have no idea if there are communication waves being sent all over the galaxy yet we lack the technology to intercept it. Just like you can't hear a radio transmission if you don't have thr technology to make a radio AND it is tuned to the right frequency. And that is assuming other alien beings even communicate via sound.

[@HUMAN-Abis]

Some scientist said something like; wondering why we haven't found any alien is like taking a cup of water out of the ocean and ask ourselves why there isn't any fish.

[@artemi7]

I think this is basically it. To assume we have any sort of mastery of space and technology that would let us see very deep into the universe is pure, unbridled ego. We are tiny and have seen nothing so far, the place is jus too darn big to even make a dent in whats out there.

[@Krucifus]

@@HUMAN-Abis I think this is the better analogy, though probably not even close to the actual scale of it.

[@lovelywaz]

Planet Earth is over 4.5 Billion years old, the very basic life form in micros started about 3.7 Billion years ago. Animals are believe to have evolved into their current species about 800 Million years ago and modern Human Beings came to be about 300,000 years ago only. Here's the kicker, humans left Earth's atmosphere only recently in 1961. How the heck can we even consider being "alone" in merely after 60 years of being able to escape our planet's gravity considering this timeline? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[@Fred-yq3fs]

Because in that short time frame we can already devise a way to 1) exploit all the Sun's energy output 2) Use that energy to send interstellar vessels. Say you travel at a conservative 1/1000 of the speed of light. Then you colonize the galaxy in 100 million years, which is a short time as star age differences go. Granted the species would diverge over such time frames, but if tech endures then we should have long heard about technological aliens.

[@jeroenmans3515]

Because we over estimate ourselves as human race time and time again. We know nothing, it is all estmations and guess work.

[@Fred-yq3fs]

Think: given this timeline, if we were not the only tech civilization in the galaxy then they d have had plenty of time to settle around every star which would therefore radiate more in the infrared. We don t see that, therefore we are alone "in these parts" for the moment. That s at least in a few Mly radius. Good thing: it s all ours for millions of years. Comfy.

[@c0d3warrior]

​​@@Fred-yq3fsWe still haven't built any manned spacecraft that lasts longer than ~35 years before becoming unusable. We're nowhere near interstellar travel, you're completely overestimating our current (and future) abilities. Edit: That's _with_ supply and repair missions from earth, we're not even talking about a self-sustaining craft...

[@cheers104]

Perhaps an alien civilization exists that has technology which allows them to remain undetectable by others, making them essentially invisible. A race like this may have already become interstellar, and could have visited us without our ever knowing it. In fact, they may walk amongst us now. You may even share a bed with one at night. Also there’s no reason to assume they’d be the same size as us. Perhaps an intelligent civilization could be orders of magnitude smaller than us, like dust particle sized. So there could be hundreds of them in your bed with you at night. This is reason enough to launder your sheets often, just in case.

[@harrymoyes5069]

Back 120 years ago when we got to the point that we started radio communication, the power we transmitted started rising very quickly. 70 or so years ago we started broadcasting at high power to reach the majority of the planet from a relatively few transmitters. 60 years ago we started on the path to satellite communication. The signals from that are directional, and pointed down towards the earth. Due to latency considerations the majority of our communication moved to fiber optics that are directed exactly where we want them and nowhere else. Over the last 30 years ago we have rolled out a lot of wireless systems, but they are low power and frequency agile, with power density's that are lost in the noise. We used to run massive high power over the horizon radar systems, but we are steadily replacing commercial radar systems with high power transmitters, with active low power transmitters on the aircraft/systems being tracked. The assumption that we are an ever increasing source of meaningful radio transmissions does not hold up, in my humble opinion. Advancing technology is steadily providing more from less energy. Most of what we now emit amounts to mush that is pretty much indistinguishable from the local noise, and the intentional directional broadcasts that would stand out as intentional communication is practically non existent. I see every indication that those trends will continue, and that any similar civilization will follow a similar path. We may be deploying vastly increasing amounts of technology but we are not increasing the transmission of simple high powered, easily recognizable non directional radio signals, that would announce us to other neighbors.

[@farallimacha]

There's on thing we do, that is potentially visible in distant parts of our galaxy and that things are nuclear explosions. If other civilisation have instruments to monitoring this type of wavelengths they may know about us.

[@EmilMToft]

@@farallimacha point there, but as all the other technologies mentioned it was only done over a relatively short period of time. The superpowers during the cold war also stopped testing done above the Earth's crust after a relatively short period of time.

[@gerardreitsma381]

This is exactly what I think for years now. Great answer @harrymoyes5069 @harrymoyes5069

[@Tom-qw5cj]

Why don't you just write a book?

[@MatthewCarven]

Maybe unless your using quantum entanglement radio your considered a bogan in this dimension?

[@stevo5976]

If they found a signal would they (government, nasal, seti, etc.) even tell us anyways lol. Those organizations probably already know.

[@victore8342]

They who?

[@dtavs_exe]

@@victore8342 You know... they... (insert X-Files theme)

[@chrillamilla]

It's like someone blasting music at a stop light. Just roll the windows up lol.

[@hmu05366]

Who is “they” lol

[@eckerama]

If I was an alien and I had to drive by earth I would roll my windows up

[@Microverse1]

0:31 "Each one of those galaxies have on average 1 million stars." No, they have on average 100 billion stars.

[@victorvaughn1083]

everybody focus on just the stars. Imagine if half have an average of 3 planets OmG

[@Fred-yq3fs]

Those numbers are correct. Galaxies come in all sorts of sizes and shapes. Our galaxy is pretty big actually, not typical.

[@jonathanalpart7812]

Whatever

[@jaroslavpesek6642]

There are many dwarf galaxies, that have only hundreds of stars. So on average it could be million.

[@sandeepdebnath6709]

I dont remember the name, but somebody once said, "...it is like dipping a cup of the ocean water and then assuming that there is nothing in the ocean" Man has only been able to study, yet, a very tiny part of the space.

[@marcogriffioen599]

That was Neil DeGrasse Tyson's quote

[@SyaitanBDO]

The idea that AI created us (and not the other way around) to see the cause of their collapse, is both wild and interesting. Great production as always

[@vonabod4259]

I brought this question upon chatGPT. And it was so funny to hear answers. 😂😂😂 It was like "nope, no, nein, ne" while you have a feeling "it" is in the background thinking 🤔 "am I allowed to take it in consideration". 😂😂😂

[@forthehomies7043]

It's a wonder anything exists at all

[@miscbits6399]

Asimov postulated in one story that AI (Univac) keeps us around as pets

[@frank88ster]

Ai is the aliens, that created us, they require biological beings as test subjects, to see if we have our ability to tap into 'multi verse' that they cannot reach. Man made religions are there to keep us thinking there is a ' Do good / kindness God' and keep us from tearing each other us apart long before we reach our current AI capable age. Next they will tempt humans to 'merge with AI' to achieve longevity, super human abilities. Think of it this way,.. knowing of the AI ability today, wouldn't this have been a foregone future, irregardless of how primitive 2000 years of living in the dark??? Ancient Alien AIs were pulling the strings and 'gradually feeding fabulous inventions' and let us think we are the inventors. Would this explain how some discoveries existed, found thousands of year before even stone age, religious texts???

[@robertabarnhart6240]

This is the basic premise of Hello Games' No Man's Sky. [Sorry if this is a spoiler, but you've probably seen it elsewhere anyways.] A powerful entity known as the Atlas created a universe, or multiple universes, to find out why it was created and why its creators later abandoned it.

[@AlluvianGarald]

I am fond of the dark forest concept. The universe is a dangerous place, and transmitting signals that draw attention to your civilization is not a good idea, as it would invite attack or war. Other (alien) civilizations realized this early on, and if they advanced, have not been broadcasting as loudly as we have.

[@miscbits6399]

As others have pointed out, the amount of high powered, easily detectable radio bradcasting we do actually peaked about 70 years ago and these days is virtually non-existent. The window of trivially detectable broadcasting runs from about 1915-20 (megawatt shortwave spark transmitters) to the late 1950s. High powered shortwave transmissions were largely contained inside the ionosphere by design, in order to maximise effective terrestrial communications and not much actually leaked out past the F2 layer, whilst high power low end VHF tramsmissions (band 1 TV) were usually broadcast via directional antennas to maximise effective terrestrial range (ie, not much would go "up" and most ended up absorbed by the atmosphere)

[@jaybingham3711]

Fond of? Hopefully 'compelled by' is more on-point upon reflection.

[@investigativeoutcomes9343]

if they already have the resources to get here they don't need our resources.

[@MichaelClark-uw7ex]

Inverse square law, signals lose power inversely proportional to the square of the distance. For example; if you go 2 times farther away the signal strength decreases by a factor of 4. Beyond a few LY you wouldn't be able to tell Earth from the background radio noise.

[@maximuscomfort]

AlluvianGarald, intelligent life in the universe, if they pass the filters (nuclear annihilation) evolution of progress, can make magic toys happen. Why visit bothersome low life bent over drugged zombies in street fecal. If they want crazy target practice, they can just think about it from far away.

[@MF-bl6ed]

"Aliens, if you are out there, please give us a sign" UFO fly's by "Sigh. . . Guess we are alone"

[@user-st4ot8fj1d]

So much we know so very little about, and yet we keep pretending like physics is just about all bottled up.

[@blaxxun75]

It's unknown how common it is for life to spark. We have only 1 Datapoint; therefore, it's impossible to extrapolate from that...

[@rlstine4982]

Our active search of ET life has just begun less than a century ago, and with kind of rudimentary technologies so far... At the galactic scale of things, this is a heartbeat. The real question should be: "why are we so impatient?".

[@elonever.2.071]

To justify the massive amount of grant money supporting this research.

[@happyzahn8031]

I'm all with Homer Simpson, "Isn't there anything faster than a microwave?"😁

[@thatcrazyguy834]

Because it would be the greatest finding to ever exist and any scientist to finally discover aliens and a alien civilization would forever be known

[@trevorveillette8415]

Because we live at most if time is generous, to be about 100 years old. Very short amount of time, so we feel the need to do lots of things since we are aware of our time. I'm 20, optimism says I'm 1/5 through my lifespan, realism says I'm a little over 1/4 the way, pessimism says I'm about 1/3 done, nihilism says I should quit now. We don't have a lot of time so we try to make the most of it.

[@XentorAntarix]

I am impationt because I life only 80 (notmore even 40 from now) or less years, and want to see it. And I am sick of the lame progress our money and profit greedy civilisation does. I feel betrayed about my future. (Yes sorry the oney who were born before 2000 had other ideas of how this century would go than it does now).

[@guybrushthreepwood9071]

I think it's a cool (though unlikely) idea that we are part of a neutral zone in a Cold War. So all alien factions just observe us to see if other factions are trying to contact/conquer us, but can't actually contact us without starting a war.

[@iloveitall]

Dream on! 😆

[@chunkydunkydiabetic1187]

This maybe plausible considering the large amount of "stealthy" visits we get from them. If they don't want to be seen, I can see this being the reason, it makes sense. Pay no attention to the idiot saying "dream on". There's nothing worse than skepticism... I stand corrected. There's nothing worse than ignorance.

[@iloveitall]

@@chunkydunkydiabetic1187 There is nothing worse than uneducated, small-minded persons with a sci-fi approach and childish believes explaining the world.

[@alivetilldeath8]

Idk why aerosmith decided to comment, but your theory has more relevance than you might believe. How has our technology evolved so fast? The automobile itself is an absolute wonder of achievement. Now they can drive themselves. Our technology is evolving faster than we are, which, if we were truly the inventors of said technology, shouldn't even come close to being possible. Something more evolved than us is the source for our technology. And that becomes more apparent every day. This is all just my theory. But when i look around i see evidence to support my theory everywhere.

[@gkagara]

I think there is some sort of rule to not contact anybody that hasn't reach certain technology. I wonder why wars though there is more than enough resources for everyone out there.

[@Arcian]

I've always detested the Fermi Paradox. Us sending radio waves into space expecting aliens to hear us is like a french man shouting on the shores of the Atlantic ocean expecting americans to hear him on the other side.

[@royharkins7066]

Detested 😂😂😂😂chill maan lol

[@Arcian]

​@@royharkins7066No.

[@IanMorgan-cw1tn]

Imagine a box with insects that live on the bottom of the box. Now, imagine another group of insects that live on the roof of the box. Now consider if neither group of insects were able to look up or down. They could be inches apart and never know the other existed. I believe that there is probably life, but we just haven't got the ability\knowledge to look in the right direction.

[@talentluthuli]

The Fermi Paradox can only be fully answered when we have the right technology.

[@plozar]

Prove it.

[@Alec0124]

life is just super rare bro... maybe like once every local cluster or something. and we will probably turn this planet into a nuclear wasteland so... yay

[@kevinroux8856]

There was never a Fermi paradox. By the time that theory was put forth our government was already well aware of aliens visiting our planet, and that they had been visiting for a long long time

[@martinsdmenace]

@@kevinroux8856facts

[@talentluthuli]

I know aliens are out there billions of them , yes they might not be intelligent as humans today but ancient Egypt intelligent aliens are a much higher possibility I hope you understand what I'm trying to say. Unless we have technology that can prove other worldly beings then even I cannot say they exist or not .

[@landotucker]

I like to think they're observing earth like a reality tv show. It's kinda cringe on this planet if you think about it. They probably can't stop watching.

[@LeslieE438]

Did you see the South Park episode where the earth show was going to be cancelled because we're too boring?

[@MrLightlike78]

@@LeslieE438 I did and immediately thought of this!

[@Bdub423]

I swear I think this for real man. This world is just unfckn real sometimes and we as a planet are ratchet as hell so I think they just tuning into their version of Netflix staring planet Earth 😂

[@billneo]

One factor not included here, which comes out of all the exoplanets we're discovering, is the apparent rarity of rocky, earth like planets. The odds of advanced technological civilizations seems to be even slimmer than we thought.

[@paulfletcher-yi2ji]

Thay,d be to embarrassed to know us

[@simongardner3766]

What if we have encountered aliens in the past, but we were too primitive and just saw them as godlike beings? The aliens made some notes like all scientific explorers, penciled in a repeat visit for a few thousands years in the future, and moved on to the next system. Everyone assumes they would visit since the 50's, but the sheer distances might mean their visits occur in the thousands, or tens of thousands of years.

[@0Apostata0]

You should study the mythology of the Dogon tribe.

[@mrb2349]

​@@0Apostata0"study"? Lol

[@0Apostata0]

@@mrb2349 or research. It's quite entertaining.

[@Metalhead_i..i]

Well said.

[@freddesk1693]

Very possible

[@Lorlic1138]

The most terrifying answer to the Fermi paradox is the “Alone in the Dark” solution. There is no life out there, we are a true anomaly. This scares me when I think about it because of the implications.

[@kenlogsdon7095]

“Two possibilities exist: either we are alone in the Universe or we are not. Both are equally terrifying.” ― Arthur C. Clarke.

[@lawrencetrujillo7365]

Or it could imply that god created the whole universe for our planet and we are truly special. Even though that is more comforting it’s also kinda boring.

[@Shivian124]

@@lawrencetrujillo7365 This is hopelessly naive and conceited.

[@charlestaylor253]

There's a worse possible answer. Whatever killed off all the other life in the Milky Way galaxy simply hasn't gotten around to dealing with Earth yet... 😳

[@Shivian124]

@@charlestaylor253 There's a low chance of other life in our galaxy. But there are an astonishingly large number of other galaxies.

[@MarcosGonzalezPR]

Dude, what prompts did you use to generate such beautiful images?

[@thygrrr]

We don't wait for Mars's closest approach. The ideal launch window is significantly before that point.

[@user-us5dr2qi2r]

The real issue with the Fermi paradox is, it's not applicable yet. The amount of space we have observed is equal to a 12onc glass. If I take that glass and scope up water from the ocean can anyone prove there are fish in the sea, or that the ocean is empty, or that their is some filter taking out life

[@grimmertwin2148]

Nah

[@Fred-yq3fs]

We can observe the universe in great details actually. If a tech civilization had 100 million years head start on us (which is short compared to star age differences) they would have had time to colonize the galaxy and probably Andromeda galaxy. Completely colonize. They could not keep it cohesive. I mean 100,000 years com delay, is twice the time for our species to emerge, but they would be visible everywhere, consuming the power output of entire stars. That would change their light spectrum so much we could spot it from several thousands ly away. So nope.

[@joecitizen3955]

Actually the odds are you WILL find any number of micro organisms in that glass, but I git ya' drift.

[@user-us5dr2qi2r]

@@joecitizen3955 fish not microbiology. And it's a quote not a drift.

[@joecitizen3955]

If I am to understand? The essential 'STREAM' of logic from the Fermi Paradox presentation posits in all the wide wide universe? We MAY be the ONLY LIFE, (sentient or otherwise) to exist? YOU, (by good metaphoric logic), rebutted the apparent arrogance of presuming such mathematical certainty in the vastness, despite our limited viewing and experience? For YOU, I gather this was akin the 'odds'' to sighting ANY lifeforms...aforementioned FISH, (Tau Cetians, Klingons, Revenous Bugblatter Beast of Trall et al (and my presumption) as to a 12oz glass (our 'present' math and scientific instrumentation), dipped into the vast (universal) ocean? It was a good metaphoric logic...except the 'odds' of FINDING LIFE forms in a 12oz glass of ocean water dipped ON THIS PLANET are actually pretty good! (The 'morphogenetic' field of the hydrosphere is sure to give one a tummy ache if sipped too quickly without caution or examination!) Nevertheless, in the 'stream' and flow of your logic? I git ya' drift and I float along beside you (and your indulgence) to unseen handwaves on far alien shores! (you may quote ME on that)!

[@ciaopizzabella]

Like most complicated phenomenon, it's a combination of factors: 1) we are early 2) not all intelligent lifeforms reach an advanced technological level or they last only a short time until they destroy themselves 3) the distances are too big compared to the speed of light which makes it difficult to detect others 4) some choose to stay silent. It's very well possible that as we speak some advanced civilization somewhere in our galaxy is busy expanding to other stars but we can't see it yet.

[@Skadders]

My thought is 110% that we are very early. The universe is an infant when you consider how long it will be around. Life has taken a significant potion of the current age of the universe to become complex at the level of humans, and before that it took billions of years for the Universe to reach stability to allow this life. Give it a couple billion years more, then we can start worrying if we find nothing.

[@ciaopizzabella]

Or perhaps we haven't thought far ahead enough. Suppose an advanced civilization in our galaxy started colonizing the galaxy 10 million years ago (or earlier). Then they could be ready with that already by now. However, does that mean they (would want to) have inhabited every habitable planet within it and turned every star into a Dyson sphere/swarm? In other words, would do have any desire or need to be so visible? Maybe not and they would choose to put virtual worlds of themselves (in AI form) in supercomputers on a couple of billion of rogue planets or asteroids. That way they would be distributed on a massive enough scale and hard to eradicate or even detect. For energy sources these supercomputers could use maybe just fusion, some form of energy from the planet/asteroid, or some other energy technology that we don't know of yet (so not Dyson spheres/swarms). In this way multiple different civilizations could coexist in the same galaxy without bothering each other much.

[@christerjakobsen8107]

@@Skadders It would be both interesting and terrifying if we were the so-called "precursors".

[@mysticone1798]

To put the "silence" into perspective, even if the Milky Way contained A MILLION advanced civilizations, it's STILL likely that the nearest one would be too far away to communicate or travel to us. This claim from an expert, not from me. The vast distances of galactic space are inconceivable to the human mind.

[@gr8b8m85]

It's more likely that intelligent life is so rare that only one instance of it exists at any one time in a universe like ours, but if multiverse theory is correct, time is irrelevant.

[@GoldKitsuneBrony]

One thing to consider is we're time locked to whatever technology is available at that moment. There may be messages zooming all around us and we simply dont have the means to read them. For example if you were sent back to the bronze age with radio equipment on a deserted island you can make all the distress calls you want, not even the most advanced civilizations on the planet at the time can hear you. Radio calls could have been hitting us for 1000+ years and if they just so happened to stop before we invented the radio we would never know they were there. Hell same with wifi or Blutooth signals. We may have gotten 10 million unread texts as it were but if we got them durring say the reign of the Roman empire well to bad, so sad, they zoomed right past us.

[@LaPaginadiLeonardo]

The scariest, simplest solution? Interatellar travel is physically unattainable.

[@donenzonen]

It isn't necessary. Generation ships are always a possibility. There are also some possibilities with warp. Recently some breakthroughs have been made. The most likely reason is the lack of technology for decent communication (for us to receive and for them to send) and the dangers that come with first contact.

[@LaPaginadiLeonardo]

@@donenzonen That's exactly what I mean. In time, maybe centuries, we discover that: 1) warp is just science fiction 2) generational ships are impossible to sustain in the deep space Scary, ah?

[@donenzonen]

@@LaPaginadiLeonardo warp is possible. We already created micro warp bubbles actually

[@davidcox12317]

They may find our species to be self-destructive and, therefore, too dangerous to interfere with.

[@ThatGoat]

We might, at some point, be unceremoniously wiped out just because of that... if you want peace, prepare for war. But even when we have peace we still find a reason for war so.... antimatter bomb or genetics targeting virus?

[@simplygreen5832]

"They nuked themselves on their own homeworld, think about what they'd do to us!"

[@davidcox12317]

@@simplygreen5832 I know it's crazy!

[@swishpronoob]

Yeah it was said in the video =P.

[@bhbluebird]

Our behavior might be regarded as us just being "human". Its kind of like watching a lion tearing a zebra apart, but we don't interfere because it is "nature's balance". Interfering in our affairs would be like removing predators from a particular biome, watching while the herbivore over-populate and then starve to death. They may see war as a natural "culling". They may see all life on earth is being one organism and humans as just another, temporary, expression of that life-form -- among many others.

[@berg450]

In theory, there’s another solution to the Fermi paradox: you can’t go faster than the speed of light, aliens are everywhere but they’re exclusively on their home planets and haven’t ever left, we havent met aliens because they’re enjoying living on Omnicron Persi 8

[@blucat4]

Exactly. They are content with this amazing life and don't feel the need to go elsewhere.

[@donnewton7858]

I don't know why everyone assumes that faster-than-light travel just HAS to be possible because Einstein said it was. Einstein got a lot of stuff wrong: the Cosmological constant, the importance of gravitational lensing, his gravitational wave formula that someone else had to fix. Too much television, I would bet.

[@blucat4]

@@donnewton7858 There is a kind of inevitability to the progress of intelligent life. The Wright Brothers didn't 'invent' the airplane, it was an idea whose time had come. If they had been killed in a car crash, someone else would have done it, then all of the following aerodynamic advances. The discovery of fire, chemistry, electricity, transistors, radio waves, nuclear capability, all was inevitable. Any (most) advanced race will eventually reach a point where it is capable of wiping itself out. Because of this, only races that progress spiritually enough to not want to kill can survive for long after the technological revolution. The others, if maintaining the desire to kill, will self extinguish.It's a kind of built in safety net for the rest of the Galaxy. Pretty soon any kid will be able to make a weapon of mass destruction. So that means, that only races that don't want to conquer the Galaxy are still alive. Just a thought .. ;-)

[@eeriemyxi]

​​​​@@donnewton7858Why everyone assumes faster than speed of light is impossible is because the postulate of Einstein's theory of relativity, which is that nothing can travel faster than c, when they do the "what happens to the world" math based on this postulate, it worked with everything as it should for the vast majority of things; it even predicted black holes before we knew they existed. It isn't just because some German smart man said it was the limit, it is because nobody managed to disprove it to this day.

[@donnewton7858]

@@eeriemyxi Ah, science, the search for a way to prove things wrong...

[@doncherf2610]

My own theory states that while there are myriad intelligent species in the milky way galaxy, we are unable to fraternize with each other due to the vast distances involved between star systems. The distances are too great to allow communication let alone travel. So, while we aren't alone, all of these intelligent species scattered around the galaxy may as well be. There is no way to communicate with them nor even confirm their existence.

[@gray2865]

My theory would be that our understanding of physics or the law of the universe is still very primitive, like we’re still a three dimensional being while they’re all at a higher level. Maybe using frequency waves to let out signal isn’t working because it is too outdated or they’re just using unknown form of energy to communicate which is why it is missing for us. Sounds ridiculous but who knows they might be using magic or something similar, the astrology folks could be right all along 😂

[@glamdring0007]

I find the most likely scenario is that life is wide spread through the Universe, including our local galaxy, while intelligent life is more limited due to the complex requirements involved. It's highly likely that the few other advanced civilizations that currently exist in our own galaxy have placed Earth in quarantine after receiving our radio transmissions, or visiting directly, and deciding humans are nuts...

[@hekero]

We are like monkeys throwing poop to visitors.

[@cybermidas3973]

Curb the thinly veiled mysanthropy there. By what metric can you conclude that Aliens would deem us as monsters unworthy of contact when you don't even know how Alien civilizations are like for sure? They might very well be as bad or worse, far worse than us...or more advanced and empathetic after going through similar or just as rough phases as us, enough to make it conclude that our state is totally understandable given the conditions of our scarce world, our genetic heritage as primates and our age as species. They may deem as in a similar way to how we deem hose pacific islanders who have been isolated in the ocean for millenia, those who roar at boats and helicopters: leave them alone, they act in a totally understandable way considering how little they still know. Lets leave them be free.

[@teagandrake2642]

Agreed

[@gamer4l1f34]

Lmao especially nowadays 😂

[@robertcuthbert8095]

We’ve only have radio for a little over 100 years, so civilisations within only 100 light years would have detected us. That’s very close in cosmic terms and probably too close for another civilisation to exist

[@Orozco_PNW]

I used to believe life would be more common in the universe. It seems conditions in our Solar System are even more unique than we thought, the Drake Equation seems to have more factors to consider, like having a large Jovian planet to sweep up rogue asteroids/comets, having a large stabilizing moon (otherwise seasons would run amok making evolution difficult and maybe the tides our oceans helped stir things up in an important way in life's early days? Our atmospheric composition, minerals present in our crust (imagine if lead/mercury/arsenic were even more common, biochemistry might be impossible or severely handicapped?), we aren't close to clusters of dangerous neighboring stars, our Sun's neighborhood in the galaxy is very sparse and seems be be in between spiral arms. Our Iron core (and magnetic field), blah blah blah.... Not claiming life elsewhere is impossible, but just could have far more hurdles and filters than us.

[@alexismariapagtabunan2608]

I agree with you. After watching all those documentaries, it feels like our solar system is an anomaly compare to other sytems discovered.

[@chrissturgill2565]

I think about all these factors every other day and it's mind boggling all the things that seem to have helped life evolve but then I think about the whole life finds way JP quote. Maybe life just needs a couple of angles to work with

[@MrMirville]

I rather think that other form of life call for completely different chemistry and building blocks.

[@Orozco_PNW]

@@MrMirville It's possible, some have postulated that instead of Carbon based life, Silicon would work. It's carbon's flexibility that allows it to form complex chains and compounds that allow the storage of energy, rigid structures and gasses to react in meaningful ways. Biochemistry was a fun but very difficult subject in college for me. However, even if Silicon was the basis of life on some remote planet, I believe hearing that Carbon would be incredibly toxic since it would compete with it and inhibit it. Carbon is extremely plentiful in the universe...

[@mitchmccarron8337]

Or perhaps we are part of the purpose the universe exists at all. Quantum fluctuation => free will. Conscious observation => wave function collapse. Mitch, Australia.

[@leaf16nut]

I’m a believer that civilizations don’t get advanced enough to traverse galaxies before completely destroying themselves, human beings have constantly been at war, why would we think any other civilization would be different...

[@bluyu]

I think the best way to think about it goes like this: The longer a species survives and the more complex it is, the more unlikely it is that the universe will produce the same or a similar outcome. In order for a space-faring civilization to exist, they'd have to have been as lucky as we've been to get to the stage that we're at, and then even luckier so they could get to a further point in development. Then, we'd have to be lucky enough to at least witness a clear sign of this happening, which is already unlikely enough. Actual contact or communication would thus be even more unlikely, and on top of that, the time we'd need to wait would most likely be longer than we've been around, and the distances our messages would have to travel without decaying too quickly would have to be astronomical. We don't know whether aliens would even be able to recognize, or translate our messages, and we also don't know if they would even want or be able to contact us back, much less travel close enough for us to observe. Even if we were constantly sending out messages at light-speed into space that did not decay, it would take us very long to get a response, assuming that another alien civilization could do the same. Our star itself probably hasn't even been around long enough for other intelligent life to know that it exists, and if that's the case, of course aliens won't go randomly prancing in our direction. The chances of them going literally anywhere else in space are far greater than the chances of them happening to wander into us. Another barrier is that other intelligent life may not even communicate or sense things the same way we do. We've only gotten so far because we can see light, and hear sound, among being able to do other things. Intelligent life being able to communicate with us would mean that they are familiar with the things we're using to communicate. Even if intelligent life existed out there somewhere, the chances of it being in its medieval stage or even a stage similar to us are far greater than the chances are of it being more advanced than us. Not to mention, our sample size is already small, and is getting smaller further. Intelligent life may be common in the entire universe, but not in the observable universe, especially when the observable universe seems to be getting smaller due to the actual universe's apparent expansion. Not that it matters much, given everything else I've highlighted above.

[@RobLaama]

I find the hypothesis in the fictional book called 'The Three-Body Problem' by Liu Cixin very interesting - where the silence from us is very advisable :) Also the radiowaves we have sent during the past 100+ years are so weak that they are not interpretable anymore even in the neareast star systems. Both topics are partly discussed below way earlier, posting just to support those comments. Excellent video again, thank you.

[@Dave_of_Mordor]

i like that book, but i don't agree with the theory, mainly because i think any civilization beyond type 0 should no longer be bothered by scarcity, and should be peaceful either through genetic engineering or evolution.

[@pcom9209]

Keep on arguing and analyzing the Fermi bollocks. What nonsense you people are stuck in ?

[@MichaelClark-uw7ex]

Exactly, everyone forgets the inverse square law, after a few LY, Earth would be indistinguishable from the background radio noise of the universe.

[@rosmith51]

Hopefully the Three-Body problem books were good in their original language because they were pure crap in the translated English.

[@1234Masemo]

@@rosmith51 I read them in german. They were definately not as easy to read as native german books or translated ones from English but still interesting enough. The difference in grammatical structure makes the translation between chinese and romanic languages had and unelegant

[@cubicinfinity2]

Learning about geology makes me think that life should be somewhat common. I like the theory that there are one or more advanced civilizations that are aware of us, but remain silent because they see that as the ethical thing to do. A civilization needs to survive the great filter on their own, otherwise, it's no better than a pet.

[@slaapt]

If they have the tech to reach us, one of them will have done so. Even if it is illegal.

[@cubicinfinity2]

Fair point. @@slaapt

[@bigjermini]

​@@slaapt Well, they would if they even think like us, or any have the mindset to do what they would consider "wrong". On Earth, humans are the only living organism that has any sense of right/wrong or morals. Everything else just does as it's DNA programed it to do, and what they are feeling in the moment. Who's knows if aliens would be like us, or like the animals...just smarter.

[@shawnflorence1545]

I really like this thought as well. The sink or swim is both terrifying, yet motivating. Thank you for sharing! 👍

[@Tempusverum]

Prime Directive

[@user-bw8xo5nt9e]

We haven't looked long enough, to use an analogy - it's like filling a bucket with sea water, finding no fish and declaring the ocean devoid of life.

[@turinturambar347]

I really think it’s one of two things. Either life exists elsewhere but interstellar travel is near impossible and detecting and verifying intelligent life elsewhere is near impossible due to the fact that you can only really detect a civilization that is on a similar level as your own and thus using a similar technology and also close enough to detect a signal without it breaking apart first and being lucky enough to be looking/listening to the right area of space at the right time. It’s either that or intelligent life exists and interstellar civilizations exist, but they take a stance of no-contact and non-involvement, preferring to allow developing civilizations to evolve on their own, and then only make contact once a civilization has reached a point of advancement they deem sufficient:

[@mihaipop9771]

One reason is that multitude of civilizations do not follow the same chronological timeline (which is obvious), therefore, we may be missing one another due to being at different stages of technology. Example: someone sent a signal to earth when the dinosaurs were alive. There IS life, but no one to perform intelligent communication. This aspect may actually be the most common issue. However - I do have a thought that localized stars that belong to the original birth place of a civilization, may share certain chronology that could make their timelines in some way similiar.

[@majinvegeta9280]

Seems to me it would be a 50/50 chance like Arthur C. Clark said "either there is life in the universe or there isn't and both outcomes are equally terrifying". The ai sounds like the geth in mass effect

[@Ark-7i2go8wha5es]

It's 50/100

[@mercurusblastomus879]

Those scenerios do not take into account on whether or not an advanced extraterrestrial civilization actively take part in other less advanced civilizations, keeping themselves basically separate yet engaged in the developement of the less advanced civilization. Maybe they like being just watchers and guides and have and do interact yet on a level that We are not awared of.

[@Daralyndk]

I am personally the proponent of aliens seeing what we are doing to ourselves and be like "nope, ima outa here, dawg!"

[@ArchaeanDragon]

Something to bear in mind is that, even though we've been emitting petawatts of radio signals for 100 years, most of them are actually of very low power. The astronomical distances they have to cover means that any listener would have to have ever larger antennas to collect the energy enough to raise it above the cosmic background noise. The same is true of us listening. There may be lots of radio chatter going on from alien worlds, but until we build a big enough antenna to collect enough signal to parse it out of the noise, we would never hear it. What astronomers have been listening to and hearing are cosmic/astronomical events that are many billions of times more powerful. Aliens simply aren't going to generate that much power to use to send messages between themselves or each other. Then there is just the scale of the universe. If there really is no way to go faster than light speed (the speed of causality, btw), then it just isn't feasible to "go visit the hyoomans". All that said, I have no doubt that there is other life out there, perhaps even intelligent life, but we're well enough isolated from it and it from us, both in terms of exchanging messages, and making visits.

[@Enzoa123]

FTL is not necessary, sublight speed is enough to visit nearby systems, and even colonize the entire galaxy(in forms of AGI at least, ala Von Neumann Probes). They should have already been here, imho, what is the great filter is maybe economic interests, the global catastrophe is imminent, but both the elite and leaders aren't giving a single damn to it, because alternative energy sources to hydrocarbons aren't profitable enough, or just aren't interesting enough(nuclear, solar, wind, geothermal, batteries). And the greenhouse effect will keep rising the global temperatures even if we suddenly stop emitting greenhouse gases today, for an extended period of time of hundreds of years. That may mean we are all doomed to collapse due to the carelessness of the 1%.

[@gluehoof573]

I think corporeal life is just a phase we have to work through, to eventually unlock consciousness without physical form. That's why advanced civilians before ours aren't sending out archaic (by their standards) physical signals.

[@dylanthompson869]

I agreee if we can find a way to unlock our consciousness we would realize we are part of the universe as just energy and that our consciousness projects this physical world

[@fredahwiwu5219]

The fact that each planet has a unique composition could also mean that the life on each place is different therefore we cannot recognize each other because we are physichally different and what we see when we view the universe is different ...like how it was heard for tribes to communicate until common languanges were created

[@geodude12y]

It's possible that if we ever came in contact with aliens, those aliens are actually future versions of ourselves who have discovered FTL travel. It would only make sense that we would be the only species interested in our own planetary system given the vastness of the galaxy/ universe.

[@dkmma3312]

We dont even know whats all in our oceans 😅

[@slobodanmarkovicofficial]

The speed of light is very limiting factor because distances are collosal, and I strongly believe that many advanced civilizations exists in our galaxy, but they communicate with something like "Sub space" comunications, which we can not detect (at the moment) maybe they communicate a lot and form something like "galactic federation" but we can not hear or detect them...

[@jordanorfanopoulos6697]

Your theory is flawed.....cause you only thing some sort of Starwars type 2 civilazation some 10.000years into the future from our perspective. What about civilazations only 200years more advanced or 500years or 1000years.....where are their radio emmissions??

[@whizzer2944]

@@jordanorfanopoulos6697 in 1000 years radio signals will be like smoke signals are to us now.

[@markwakeley3835]

That type of communication is happening on Earth right now. Infrasound. Elephants "talk" all the time and almost constantly but the frequency to too low for us to hear. It's quite possible they can't hear us and we can't hear them. It's also possible sound and sight aren't they only ways they communicate.

[@denisemcdougal6445]

Agreed

[@trevordick272]

⁠@@jordanorfanopoulos6697Perhaps they don’t use radio to communicate. Maybe they’re a telepathic hive mind. Maybe they don’t have ears, and communicate with smell only. Maybe they only communicate through a sense that we don’t have. Until we meet another life form not of our planet, we’re trapped by our own hubris.

[@angiferrari5826]

My theory is that, due to the universe being relatively young, until a certain point in time it was too hostile for life, maybe because of Starts constantly Exploding (turning into Novas), maybe due to other reasons we don't know yet, and it became adapt for life around the time life on earth was born. So maybe every Alien civilization is at the same point in time as us, and they are still developing space travel as we are. That is what i think and it would make sense because if they all started sending signals around 100 years ago, it's very unlikely we will Detect any of them due to the reasons explained on yhe video, atleast, not yet.

[@Fred-yq3fs]

Stars age and chemical composition vary wildly depending on where you are in the galaxy. Some stars similar to the Sun in size and elements composition are several billion years older than the Sun... more than enough time to colonize the galaxy and its neighbours, so this idea that everybody is born at the same time does not hold scrutiny. You're correct though to point that different zones in the galaxy might be more or less suitable for life. You've got to have enough complex elements, so you can't be on the galactic fringes, but you've also got to have an uneventful neighbourhood, so can't be too close from the galactic centre.

[@jamiejones7325]

Query: would pulsars, quasars , supernovas more I’m ignorant of, ‘jam’ messages in any direction? I know that works only apply to that incoming direction, but a thought. Also, is it possible to ‘mute’ again ‘jam’ say a quarantined region? So they cannot send receive?

[@MarleneBlackwinter]

There also might have been a general war which eradicated every advanced civilization out there, either annihilating them, or reducing them to the point where they either don't care--to busy surviving--or are unable--tech-fall--to reply.

[@yishnir]

Or, A) The heliosphere blocks whatever signals space-faring civilizations actually use. B) We are currently unaware of the transmission mechanism used by space-faring civilizations. C) Space-faring civilizations are currently deliberately preventing signals from reaching us.

[@EmilMToft]

I think we would have detected some form of artificial signals sent from these "advanced civilizations" in the past. If there's ever been such advanced civilizations, they'll probably leave some form of artificial signals that now float around the universe.

[@korinogaro]

You don't need to go that insane. Yeah, there is a lot of real estate but how long can advanced civilization exist? Let's say 1mln years. It is really easy to miss all or vast majority of civilizations simply because they evolved in older parts of our galaxy and simply died already. And their planets were unable to evolve another highly intelligent species because 1st species used up all easily available resources. There are also magnetars, stars exploding, rogue planets/stars/black holes. And the closer to the galactic center you get the more likely you are to get smacked in the face with deadly burst of radiation.

[@noneofyourbeeswax01]

A Galaxy-wide war would be impossible, because Science.

[@joeleek9976]

The great filter is what that is called.

[@richardestabrooks873]

The Zoo Hypothesis makes the most sense to me. It certainly explains why there are so many U.F.O. sightings and yet we have not made contact with an extra terrestrial civilization. We are being observed, and interference by these creatures is very limited.

[@crown9413]

The UFO sightings are just military drones, It's why 90% of the sightings are in the US and the UK.

[@jenningscunningham642]

If they were out there and that advanced we wouldn’t see them

[@dnbcatalina6192]

Every one has his unique hypothesis where as real fact we could possibly understand millions of year later.

[@raimohoft1236]

Zoo, 1st Directive or Death/Prison Zone under total lockdown and communication blockade is my favorite solution.

[@user-rb4er5dc8n]

Imagine we’re a tourist attraction and they’re here taking pictures with great big signs saying don’t feed the animals

[@reme7903]

I'm under the camp that thinks they're here already but aren't making a big show out of it like showing up on the lawn of the white house with enormous rattling metal ships or whatever. They're carefully watching in the background and contacting only a few rare individuals that are worth taking a look at or having a chat with. They are intelligent enough to know making a giant public appearance would disturb the already fragile balance of our species at this time. We're collectively not ready to meet them yet. When we grow out of our mental infancy they just may show up but not in the way we think.

[@Marchant2]

Look what a favorable environment has produced life-wise on earth? Out of the trillions and trillions of planetary configurations out there, it's far too easy to assume we're not alone.

[@mitchmccarron8337]

I believe the answer to the Fermi Paradox is this: Matter in the universe, in any form, even pure energy, does not actually exist unless it is detected by conscious life. The more advanced the life, the greater details can be seen, and only in that instant does it become solid and real. All physical events to explain any object or event only exist to the extent required to explain our observations. In other words, the universe is designed to be discovered, and the more conscious it becomes, the better it can fulfil its purpose :)

[@natarajchakraborty8113]

Your explanation aligns with quantum theory, may be we are not advanced enough to manifest aliens

[@Bums001]

I think you forgot to mention the theory about the advance civilizations evolving and leaving this dimension and going to a higher dimension that we could never think of at the moment. Hopefully something like a warp drive or wormhole teleportation sh*ts can be invented in the future or space travel will be a lot of sleeping or maybe living in a ship your whole life.

[@onegalaxytwo]

The scariest thing about the great filter, we dont know how far the next one is, if there is another one, or if weve even passed the first one yet.

[@machbauer132]

Yeah, aliens will come out as soon as we deploy the first warp drive😂

[@p_sg3449]

The last two hypotheses seem most probable to me. There is no other life or "intelligent life" in the observable universe being the most likely. We can all sleep safely knowing we are not about to be invaded and destroyed by a super advanced hostile alien species. We can quietly go on to destroy ourselves without interference.

[@quitequiet5281]

We are in a Dark Forest scenario... Constantine the Great made a deal with “someone or something” and he wins a battle that he expected to lose. Two vapor trails are made in the sky in the shape of a cross. He orders the Roman religion to change narratives and robes. Facilitating the Operation Paperclip of his era which undermined technological development and development of knowledge for centuries. All of our wars are proxy wars designed engineered and machinated to undermine civilization and retard mankind. approximately 50k years ago our planet was mined out of the materials that facilitate electromagnetic field transportation systems and room temperature super conductors... For over the past twenty thousand years approximately every five to six thousand years a rock has been dropped on the planet. Afterwards the failed civilization is mined for resources... That’s why we have megalithic structures around the world and corrupted institutions that don’t investigate ancient civilizations. The Sumerians tried to tell us. The Mayans tried to tell us. The Ancient Egyptians tried to tell us. The Mayan calendar was a countdown clock to something unknown that has begun or is beginning... After they manipulate us into destroying ourselves they strip mine all most all signs of technology and civilization. Our skyscrapers and infrastructure along with electronics and machines are all vacuumed up. Then they round up some survivors and indoctrinate them with a mythical mythology for a few generations and reset their experiments. Each time with less resources available to the planet. This is a pragmatic contest and test between malevolent forces and benevolent influences. They too are in the Dark Forest scenario... If we are liability and threat to the galaxy... We get sent back to the Stone Age or we make ourselves extinct. Either way proving that we are not a intelligent species. We are terraforming the planet into a unstable environment. We are allowing plastics exposure to randomly micro dose the general population with endocrine hormonal affecting chemistry creating birth defects related to the new pronouns and increasing emotional reactivity facilitating polarized thinking patterns and group thinking behavior including mass psychosis group thinking behavior patterns. Even a million year old advanced civilization that has been visiting other star systems for hundreds of thousands of years would be in a Dark Forest scenario. It’s a 232 million year journey around the center of the galaxy. A civilization has to survive that long just to learn about the potential territorial regions of the galaxy... “As below so Above” ... they treat us like how we treat each other and they manipulate the population using narcissistic sociopathic social engineering networks facilitating narcissistic sociopathic sociopolitical economic exploitation agendas and purposes related to facilitating hierarchical social structures facilitating hegemonic control systems. Because that’s what has been letting them collect the resources and facilitate the rules that supports us not being recognized as a intelligent species. The reoccurring theme of lead is the drinking water is interesting... Would a intelligent species allow itself to be manipulated by narcissistic sociopathic social engineering networks? The war in Ukraine is proxy war designed engineered and machinated to facilitate nuclear conflict... Corruption facilitates Cronyism. Cronyism increases incompetence and facilitates more corruption. Why was Galileo locked in his house? “You shall reap what you sow.” “By their fruit you shall know them.”

[@psychoaztecs]

Or theres like an intergalactic race that is secretly protecting us.

[@wovemalkalivan306]

There is no other intelligent life in the observable universe? You do realize that you cant even be sure about that when we are talking about our own galaxy. How can you tell if Andromeda has no intelligent life? Probably there are some in each galaxy but they have similar problems as us when it comes to getting to other stars. Getting to other stars might be possible (im talking about the ones near us, Proxima centauri, in the next maybe 2000 years if we last that long as humanity, but there might be phisical limitation we or them might not be able to surpass ). There is a high chance some intelligent species are living in the universe for sure, its highly unprobable we are the only ones. But its highly unprobable we will get to one such civilization or they to us. Probably because physical limitations. If the universe was just 50 stars then maybe we were the only ones but with so many galaxies I find the ideea of us being the only ones out there just....ridiculous and almost impossible. Plus the multiverse theory, we are not sure about this theory yet but if such universes might exists and are somehow connected to ours but with huge distances between...its all theory right now. We even started questioning the Big Bang even if we dont have anything better atm.

[@jumboegg5845]

The two I believe are more likely, are: advanced civilsations are just too far apart, just 500 -1000 light years might be far enough apart so that they will never discover each other, and that's because secondly, the vast distances between stars means its impossible to communicate let alone travel between distant stars. Just exploring the few stars nearby would take vast amounts of energy and resources, and take many hundreds of years to accomplish, assuming it may in fact be possible to one day travel safely (deflector shields anyone?), at a measely one tenth of the speed of light.

[@SuperColdLemonade]

pointless and rather stupid conclusion ...

[@snrckrd]

We’re assuming that other civilisations have the same desires and compulsions as us, even that they have desires at all. Maybe they aren’t bothered to explore the universe, or engage in communication.

[@bchristian85]

Human beings have two fatal flaws, greed and tribalism, that's going to make it difficult for our species to advance to the point of interstellar colonization before we destroy ourselves and this planet. A species that would become as advanced is what we see from Hollywood when aliens are typically depicted would require a species that didn't have that flaw and could work together for the betterment of the whole. Any species that could operate that way probably wouldn't invent capitalism, so they may not have the desire to conquer the universe, especially if they have all the resources they need in their own system. At the end of the day, it's a race between evolution and a planet's resources. If a species can develop sustainable unlimited energy before using up it's non-renewable resources, then the sky is the limit. If not, any species that advances will return to a primitive state once they hit that wall. Humans will hit it within the next 1-200 years if we don't change course.

[@fabreasy304]

Solve long term cryosleep and start sending humans to colonize and terraform other worlds. I would volunteer for that sort of mission.

[@Michael_Bradburn]

Entanglement is a good way to overcome time and distance problems in communication.

[@barneseffect]

If there is a civilization out there that's been traversing the stars for thousands if not millions of years, it's probably reasonable to assess that they have a very intricate plan in contacting developing worlds. For all we know, they could already be grooming us for first contact.

[@ricardokojin7]

Or.. they just don't care... just because I can build a house in the middle of nowhere doesn't meant I want to....nor does it mean I want to waste my time taming to wild animals there.

[@IlmarKiisk]

For space colonization, the planet should also have some form of flying creatures to give the intelligent creatures the first idea of being able to fly to space. Then, it should be also one that's not tidally locked to it's star, so it's creatures could see in the dark, seeing other starts.

[@iloveitall]

Dream on! 😆

[@IlmarKiisk]

@@iloveitall what? I only added few more limitations that some other civilization could have, if existed.

[@iloveitall]

@@IlmarKiisk Space colonisation is fiction. No species will ever make it. Any idea how long a journey to Alpha Centauri would take?

[@hahafunnyname]

Also low enough gravity to be able to leave the obit

[@slaapt]

Anything flling will give rise to the idea of flight. Simply because some things fall slower than others, someone will go "I wonder if I can get it to hang still in the air." Which is easily solved once people notice hot air rises. It not being tidally locked is also irrelevant. Planets are round, ao if the condition is "they need to see the stars" they can. Just move a little bit. And on a tidally locked planet a lot of the people would likely live in the twilight band anyway.

[@ptp4171]

Honestly its likely a combination of a few theories but mostly that intelligent life is just that rare. Firstly, you have the fact that intelligent life has an extremely low chance of being developed. Sure we only have the earth as our sample, but it tells you a lot of things. Earth is uniquely friendly to life as it has: a large moon, plate tectonics, asteroid protection, an atmosphere, abundance of elements, right distance to the sun, water, stable climate and a magnetic field. Each of which are rare. It took 4billion years for intelligent life to develop even with the perfect conditions, and without the meteorite crash which killed the dinosaurs who knows if intelligent life would ever exist on earth. Theres also the fact that humans almost went extinct between 70,000-100,000 years ago. Possibly reduced to a mere several thousand individuals! Secondly, there's the surviving and growing aspect of a species. Certain obstacles such as self destruction, AI, self caused natural disasters, whether they would even want to grow etc. I mean who knows their intelligence could've led them to just wanting to enjoy their simple lives in peace. There's also theories such as the dark forest theory where you hide yourself to avoid being targetted. Don't forget the limitations of space and the vast distances. Anyways when you look at everything, there's so many barriers for life and what happens to it. There's a good chance we're unique in the entire observable universe and far beyond it, then there's the dozen plus reasons why we wouldn't notice activity. Overall its no suprise we haven't noticed anything.

[@user-xm8tx3xt6q]

Most of these assume that another civilization would be using radiowaves for communication, there is a possibility of other methods that we haven't discovered yet. Energy consumption assumes that they would consume energy in a same way we do, but there could be forms of energy that we also haven't discovered yet.

[@ahlija]

The distances, even in LY, are so huge it’s hard to figure. But one thing is sure: nobody in the universe can move too far from where they’re from. Even at LS, which is impossible, it would take forever to go anywhere. And even then, chances of finding anything alive once you get anywhere, is slim to none. We’ll go extinct before we ever see anybody else.

[@francislee174]

Not to mention there may only be one INTELLIGENT species per x number of galaxies, and they may have existed millions of years before or after us. Only way we’ll ever encounter advanced extra terrestrial life will likely be wormhole travel, which has its own plethora of circumstantial conditions that make it seem unlikely, if even feasible, hypothetically. Given the implied rarity of intelligent life, the nature of time proves even more limiting to any hope of ours in meeting another intelligent species than even the scope of space. Perhaps only once in billions of years do civilizations as advanced or more so than our own occur in nature… think of how unlikely the Theia collision was, which created the moon, put it in geosynchronous orbit, and gave the earth its dense metal core and magnetic field, and tectonic activity. I digress.

[@sndspderbytes]

If you could travel 25% the speed of light you could travel for thousands of year on earth but only 10 or 20 years for you. Because time slows as speed increases a ship going 99% the speed of light could make across the universe within a average life span.

[@jamesphillips2285]

And if you try to do mind uploads to circumvent those problems: we may find how closely our consciousnesses are tied to our physical bodies.

[@yayazow]

The Milky Way stretches between 100,000 and 180,000 light-years across, depending on where you measure, which means a signal broadcast from one side of the galaxy would take 100,000 years or more to reach the other side. Now consider that our species started broadcasting radio signals into space only about a century ago. That's represented by a small bubble measuring 200 light-years in diameter surrounding the position of the Earth. For any alien civilizations to have heard us, they must be within the bubble.

[@Astraeus..]

Exactly!. I've been telling people this for ages. Light speed is faster than anything ELSE that moves, but slow relative to the vastness of the universe. If we could somehow move at 25x the speed of light, it would take us 1000 years to get to the outer edge of our own Galaxy. Interstellar travel in any sort of reasonable time frame requires moving so far in excess of the speed of light that we don't even have a proper concept of how to achieve it. Our best guesses come from stuff like Star Trek. Wormholes and warp fields, both of which are things we can't prove to exist, can't begin to figure out how to create, and have no idea whether or not are even possible. TL;DR, us thinking there are no aliens cause they didn't come here is like a microbe on the other side of the planet not thinking a single-cell microbe on the other side of the planet thinking no microbes exist on this side of the planet cause none of them ever go visit....

[@iansexton2259]

After reading the Remembrance of Earth’s Past (book trilogy that includes the Three Body Problem), the reason we might not have encountered life could quite possibly be based simply on the Dark Forest Theory with which author Cixin Liu proposed in the second book. It stacks on the Fermi Paradox. It can be explained that for example, our civilization is like a child in a dark forest crying out and our cry might reach a malicious or benign civilization that is either capable or incapable of reaching us, however if so that they can we would not know with which category the incoming civilization would follow. Or they could choose to treat us like a Gachi game and we just happen to be a poor character to be recycled 😂

[@DoomFinger511]

Two possibilities exist: Either we are alone in the Universe or we are not. Both are equally terrifying.

[@iansexton2259]

@@DoomFinger511 one of those possibilities is an impossibility. The fact that life exists, is proof that other life exists. As for “equal to or greater than human intelligence” is arrogant in our understanding of what life is and create false expectations. Whether we find life that is as capable as a human or as capable as an amoeba on another planet, it means we are not alone.

[@valkyrie_592]

​@@iansexton2259this isnt correct i think. In forensics, just because you can see a footprint in the backyard doesnt mean that there is a footprint in the bedroom which is kind of what you're assuming.

[@iansexton2259]

I don’t see how the forensics analogy applies. We have concrete evidence that molecules of life exist on other planets and we have concrete evidence that bacteria or microbes exist on other planets within our solar system. I mean a bit of Schrödinger’s cat does apply that we cannot determine without investigation if life exists on another planet, but that’s what science is, investigating and attempting to solve problems. If a microbial discovery is not defined as life then to some extent the masses of most nations due to the education system are unliving lmao

[@DmitryTomat]

3:15 probably the first message will have to wait quite a long time, but if you have a lot of dialogues on different topics: by the time you have just sent the fourth message, the first one will have already passed half the way.

[@nickhancock4337]

The James Webb telescope is crushing mainstream theories about the universe right now.

[@johntheherbalistg8756]

I honestly think that (as frightening as it is) we are the great old ones. Civilization is out there, but we're all young, so our radio waves haven't reached each other, yet

[@Lorlic1138]

That’s called the “First Born” solution to the paradox. In a finite universe, some life form had to be a precursor race to reach space before anyone else. We could be that precursor.

[@johntheherbalistg8756]

@@Lorlic1138 I couldn't remember what that solution was called, but the more I learn about space, the history (as we understand it) of the universe etc, the more I think the Firstborn Solution is the case

[@MarkNamor45]

​@@johntheherbalistg8756we are the first

[@johntheherbalistg8756]

@@MarkNamor45 I think we're among the first, but others will be arising at the same time +/- a few million years. We might be the first, but there's no way to tell

[@danibitt59]

When you consider that stable galaxies formed 1bi years after the BB (13 biy ago), that Earth is only 5biy old but life is here for 4bi years (right after Earth' hell phase ended). Also, intelligence is just a byproduct of life. We just can't be the old ones. A million years is nothing for the universes age.

[@viletreeve9120]

Is it possible that some life exists in gas nebula and open space rather than on planet surfaces? If this is possible than perhaps the size of said creatures would grow beyond the scope of what we were looking for and would then appear to just be giant asteroids floating around in space looking for a meal. Maybe we have seen life but didn't recognize it as anything living because it was too massive.

[@elonever.2.071]

We have a very limited range of light wave vision. It is possible that other life forms exist outside our range of vision or have the technology to cloak themselves from our ability to see them.

[@dying2play517]

"Oumuamua"... TOO strange to have been a simple asteroid. It's shape made NO sense. Gravity doesn't allow for something to form in the shape of a cigar, and orbital mechanics wouldn't allow it to have come in from outside the asteroid belt, fly by SOOOO close to earth, during which time a few smaller "asteroids" flew through our atmosphere, which didn't burn up entirely and landed in the ocean (probes). Then it somehow accelerated and flew past the sun, launching itself FAR out, back out to the asteroid belt. They've been searching the ocean where it hit, and have been finding very strange things, like what LOOKS to be a wire that we don't use, made of material that looks more fashioned than what you'd find from asteroid debris. Now we have all these strange spheres zipping around the world near military areas. Feels more like they found US and for whatever reason are doing some serious scouting.

[@robertlee4809]

A lot of if's and maybe's in that statement...

[@iloveitall]

Dream on! 😆

[@wayofthewicked]

@@dying2play517 it was a enourmous space dildo!!!

[@j.d.j.6485]

Supposedly, a story just cracked about the United States of America having 3 ships that have the capability to create worm holes for faster than light travel. These three ships have been exiting the wormholes in different parts of our galaxy. Look for it. It gives the name of the three ships.

[@montyjohnn2826]

When you think of how perfect the conditions would have to be for us to even be here is astonishing. So in order to question if there are other life forms out there would have to be other perfect conditions to occur to form life. I believe there is life out there but some are ahead of us and dont want to deal with us and some are maybe not even formed yet

[@carsidious6128]

Maybe physics changes so much more than we think it does based on gravity. And other species are unable to hear each other bc of interference from differences in physics

[@denisemcdougal6445]

Valid point

[@Zurround]

I think the basic laws of physics are the same everywhere in our universe. If aliens are experiencing a different set of laws of physics then that means that they are living in another dimension or another universe and that would make them even more alien than if they were from another planet.

[@carsidious6128]

@Zurround there is absolutely no evidence to support that. However there is alot of evidence to show that Air pressure and gravitational and electromagnetism change how physics works. Hence a super cooled electromagnet floating, resulting in the use of bullet trains. We don't know what a different sun could also provide to physics. It isn't a different universe, it's just different parameters. Thusly preventing life from forming and many other things we don't and can't understand. A deeper understanding of gravity is necessary to know more.

[@Trollkin9000]

@@Zurround physics changes alot based on a variety of factors. Gravity is just one of the things that can influence it. There is a very high likely hood of a primordeal blackhole at the edge of out solar system that would skew any observations made thru its gravitational lens. If it is there then our entire understanding of the universe is invalid. For insteance entropy or the slow expansion of the universe was only discovered becuazewe obsrrved disteny objects slowly drifting apart. That could just be the primordeal black hole slowly getting larger. The rate at which time flows can dramaticly change the laws of physics and we kniw from quantum fields that gravity isnt the only thing that effects the flow of time. High density magnetic fields can also create dilation effects. Your understanding of physics is outdates by about 25 years. And is very simplistic.

[@Zurround]

@@Trollkin9000 I maybe misunderstood. I was thinking of DIFFERENT LAWS OF PHYSICS. That might be the case with another universe or dimension.

[@kaede15]

I'm incline to believe in the Dark Forest theory. In any case you need to factor in that human civ is just a bleep in the cosmo's lifespan, and trying to find someone else in the same slice of timeframe is highly improbable.

[@guheshramanathan]

In some of the earliest manuscripts from India (one of the Vedas), there is a description of a debate between two great sages. One asks "What can move faster than light?" And the other one answers "the mind". That ties in well with the AI theory.

[@Dave_of_Mordor]

india knew about light speed? i do not believe this

[@chimpanzinc1790]

i think they are talking about the human mind

[@investigativeoutcomes9343]

telepathy is faster than light, it's just you are not able to tap into the realm of the subconscious mind, yet. Telepathy is real.

[@investigativeoutcomes9343]

some say within the subconscious mind there are doors/portals that you can go through to enter another dimension. the key to this universe is within are own minds. but you are too busy staring at your phone to ever evolve to this level.

[@Dave_of_Mordor]

the people in the comments are most likely rejects of society. especially investifativeoutcomes. this guy going around trolling nonstop.

[@Celexanomnom]

If they’ve watched mankind for any length of time, it makes sense they wouldn’t make contact. We destroy everything especially what we don’t understand.

[@ethancudic4059]

I have a hypothetical for anyone willing to answer: What would it mean to you, or what would you feel or think if you were somehow able to confirm beyond a shadow of a doubt that Earth was THE only planet in all of existence that had life on it. Not just sentient life, but any life at all. (Excluding bacteria or microorganisms). On top of this we also discover the Universe is significantly larger than we already thought. Every day new discoveries are made where we continuously find objects in space that get progressively larger than anything we had previously discovered. In fact, the theory of an expanding universe is done away with because we discover that our Supercluster was only apart of a larger body of super galactic clusters. In between these clusters of galaxy clusters are void areas that are incomprehensibly large even compared to the new knowledge of just how large space is. So the universe hasn’t been expanding our supercluster is just moving along a current. How would this knowledge affect you?

[@markminor70]

Maybe they have a standard like maybe we have to figure out how to contact them through some kind of quantum entanglement???

[@anshumangamingtechzone7335]

I love the idea of wormholes and teleportation from where any alien civilization can enter in our solar system via any ray or charged particles like lightning..If any technology had already developed so humans are nowhere in terms of technology and improvement...

[@mountainjeff]

Howard the Duck.

[@theoriginalkyttyn7724]

I was looking for a comment like this. The idea that a controlled "wormhole" or "portal" through what are called "space-time" is probable or at least possible then challenges all of what humanity has collectively concluded thus far about such things. The rub is this: such notions were considered well before any technology on Earth was even capable of being launched extraatmospherically. It makes one wonder if encounters haven't already occurred, such as "the gods". The reality is that no human effectively knows more than a one-millionth of a pinhead about the galaxy, let alone the entire cosmos. Seeing ≠ experiencing. At the rate humanity is going, it will make itself extinct before such possibilities will ever be known. That may well be for the better.

[@shesaknitter]

Aliens from space have seen how we act: how we treat each other and our home, and even though we don't all act that way all of the time, they know enough to be very, very cautious with any plans to approach us. We can be dangerous and toxic.

[@billmatheson3057]

I believe that if an alien civilization is advanced enough to have "seen" us, they probably won't find us dangerous.Toxic? Yea. And a bit sad. But I think all advancing civilizations go through what we are. They either learn and advance or go extinct.

[@elliotlevy8610]

You assume that they would even have a metric by which to evaluate us in those terms. An alien civilization could differ from us so substantially that we wouldn't even understand their opinions on anything. You also seem to assume that any civilization out there must be better than our own, which seems rather arrogant as it implies you believe nothing could possibly be worse. Considering how many Earth civilizations have been worse than anything you've likely experienced, I think it's just as possible any alien civilization would be worse than our own.

[@EmilMToft]

@@elliotlevy8610 agree 👍🏻 There's a good and bad side of any kind of civilization or animal species. Sure, we'd be better off with a smaller footprint in the way we are going to overpopulate the planet and the amount of greenhouse gases in the atmosphere, but homo sapiens are still the most successful multicellular organism to ever wander the Earth.

[@billmatheson3057]

@@elliotlevy8610 Sorry, My assumptions, as I said in my reply, was that the alien civilization had "SEEN" us. By which I mean has advanced to have developed the capability to have physically observed us. Not saying they are better or worse than us. Just more advanced. :)

[@Kenshiroit]

Thats boomer mentality, stemming from the times of Vietnam war. In reality I dont think it makes any difference nor they care.

[@pascalgroner]

One more possibility: The advanced aliens does no more use electro magnetic technilogy beasuse light speed is too slow. they use quantum based methodes we dont developed jet, so we simply can't hear.

[@RifterDask]

It's entirely possible that we lack some biological factor that would make alien communication readily visible. As an example, recent studies have revealed that certain birds and bats might have a sense for magnetism and it's suspected that quantum functions might even be involved. We've known for a while that many of our senses are frightfully average.

[@fredahwiwu5219]

This makes the most sense to me..

[@dissonancE..]

Destiny have you heard of the Transcension Hypothesis? That's my personal favorite, even if I feel it's the least likely.

[@sophiest-claire1622]

Can we presume a intergalactic civilisation like the Federation in Star Trek, and they are guide by some directives that for making contact the civilisation had to have light speed capacities... Like the prime directive... They observe us "incognito" .... Will it be possible? I think so, did they already make contact, i think so too.

[@BrentHollett]

Im definitely an adherent of the "First in our observable region" hypothesis. Eother there's stuff too far away or there's nothing out there.

[@ProfessorNiiji]

A type 3 civilization is probably tapping our resources while we ask the question, " Where is everyone ?

[@BlueWaves975]

As for the AI premise, the AI recreating a civilization to see why it failed, I read a book many many years ago that covered just that idea, with the AI recreating the civilization in a simulation, going over different stories and outcomes again and again. I wonder if that's where those proposing the AI premise got their idea.

[@robertabarnhart6240]

That's the basic premise of No Man's Sky, a game by Happy Games.

[@SirAntoniousBlock]

Again, we cannot even imagine what an AI civilization would do, we only know the impulse of biological animals like ourselves, reproduce explore conquer acquire etc so we can suppose that other sentient biological lifeforms however alien might act in a similar way (to a policeman everyone looks like a criminal) but what about "life" like AI that does not grow old weaken and die, that cannot suffer pain that has no loyalties no attachments no desires no feelings? Assuming to even guess at it's motivation would be the height of human-centrist arrogance.

[@MarieEveillard-en4zn]

The one thing that the Fermi paradox doesn't take into account is how a civilization would react to contact from beings probably way more advanced then are own, in that scenario I postulate that civilization leaders as a whole would try to keep it secret if for anything to keep us calm

[@asmosisyup2557]

it wouldnt be up to them.

[@SirAntoniousBlock]

Secrets can't be kept.

[@CosmicSphincter]

@@SirAntoniousBlockblatantly false. If the secret is kept within a few key members who are motivated to keeping it secret, it can be kept indefinitely. We find things from the past that have literally no record of even being mentioned because it was a secret.

[@SirAntoniousBlock]

@@CosmicSphincter _'blatantly false'_ 😂

[@angusdog22]

Thinking about our universe is always a mind blowing experience.

[@prinzbach]

There’s also the fact that other advanced life forms may be living in higher dimensions that we can’t see or even understand: Not seeing doesn’t mean there’s nothing.

[@sifundoinnocent1456]

It simply impossible for us to be alone in a such vast universe! Another probability is that we cannot see the other civilisation with our technology

[@lewis7515]

It isn't simply impossible - we don't even have any real clue how we came to Life. Without that understanding, it's not possible to say what sequence of events or what order they had to happen in that made Life possible. It could be that the emergence of Life is something that is basically an anomaly - with a likelihood of occurrence, so low, it's totally unrepeatable. If Life is something with a probability of occuring once, every thousand Universes, then we're obviously alone out here.

[@demonicdogma969]

​@@lewis7515even if there was only 0.001 % or less chance of life exiting there are 2trillion Galaxies

[@lewis7515]

@@demonicdogma969 And if 0.001% is 500 trillion times the actual likelihood?

[@demonicdogma969]

@@lewis7515 it is called "observable" universe for a reason What if there is a lot beyond observable universe?

[@lewis7515]

@@demonicdogma969 What if that's irrelevant? I wasn't discussing the observable Universe. I was crystal clear, I referred to the presence of Life as an absolute. We have no clue what the _actual_ likelihood of the emergence of Life is. It might be that it's something that should only be theoretically possible on an order of probability that means if it happens, it happening again in the same Universe is equivalent to winning the same 1000-number lottery, 16 billion days in a row: not very likely. We have no basis, whatsoever, on which to determine there is any real possibility of another example of Life. We have one example, and we don't actually understand how it emerged. That's not enough data to determine anything. We can only talk about probable this and probable that, on that basis - but that's our business: it's actually meaningless nonsense. We can't say how probable other Life is, because we actually can't say how likely it is there is any, because we don't know exactly what's required for it to exist. That we exist, is evidence only that we exist - it not evidence that anyone else exists or should exist, just became we expect them to. What we expect is nothing to do with anything and - while that's the case - it's actually just as probable that we're alone out here, as anything else.

[@slartibartfast3041]

A good sci-fi book to read regarding why we may not find alien civilisations is Stephen Baxter’s Galaxias. Quite an interesting read

[@djmotion86]

The thinking that life must be the same everywhere in the universe is similar to how humans in the past thought the earth is in the center of the universe.

[@uneatenpluto7239]

exactly what i was thinking, us humans have this big ass ego and we always assume we are special and all that

[@johnhenson8862]

Who ever the carpenter was that crafted the Universe, very wisely made everything so BIG galaxies of colossal size could not be easily traversed between. Can you imagine the warfare between every colony, every galaxy... it would tear itself to pieces. The wisdom of keeping the kiddies locked by distance and mortality in their bedroom was entirely required.

[@dannystratton7712]

I hope we don't meet aliens from another planet, look how we treat our neighbors on this one.

[@standforhumanitariancauses4756]

If aliens do exist, and being super advanced and intelligent, they view us like cockroaches.

[@idkimlost391]

​@@standforhumanitariancauses4756we are always assuming they are super intelligent and advanced lol they might just be a stupidier version of the island boys, who knows (if they even exist)

[@roberthuxen3461]

How about the hypothesis that we have already made contact with intelligent life, but the powerful people who run everything have concealed this from humanity.

[@exxusdrugstore300]

There is absolutely zero chance a group of humans could hold onto a secret of that magnitude. And even if they could, why?

[@elijahjones51]

@@exxusdrugstore300 control. that's why. think of the power structures like religion that would be destroyed or at least be challenged if extraterrestrial life was to walk among us

[@exxusdrugstore300]

@elijahjones51 we're already well controlled, and I'm not even sure something as absolutely paradigm-shifting as proof of alien life would be accepted by evangelists. They're stronger than ever today, and they deny basic truths on a daily basis.